This Game Desperately Needs An Item for Skipping Hearts!!! - Page 5 — Guild Wars 2 Forums
Home Guild Wars 2 Discussion

This Game Desperately Needs An Item for Skipping Hearts!!!

12357

Comments

  • @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Israel.7056 said:

    @kharmin.7683 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    Really, think on it. Do you actually want to play a game where your wallet plays the game for you instead of you doing the work yourself? Wouldn’t you rather play to earn the ingame rewards than buy them? It might be boring to do it repeatedly but buying progression like you and the OP are suggesting is not good for the game.

    That's the point. OP doesn't seem to want to play the game. OP seems to only want to make bank.

    The only reason people do map completion is to make gold selling legendaries. I have done the hearts a lot now and I hate them with every fiber of my being.

    That is untrue. People do content, including map completion, for many reasons. Don’t project your likes and dislikes across the whole player base or even assume your reason is the most common one.

    Edit: I’ve done full map completion 9 times so far and not to make Legendaries.

    How is gemstore heart unlock feature remove anything from your experience? Hearts are solo gameplay anyway.

    You can read my previous responses which answer your question, which is that it harms the game by causing decreases player retention.

    Core Tyria for a long time is not a source of player retention. Hearts weren't even considered a thing at the beginning of the game, but players were to stupid to play events. At this point, LW, new maps and new farms are there for player retention, not lame core tyria experience.

    Uh huh.

    Of course your opinion goes against the reason why the Devs of various games set up their game stores to sell fluff and cosmetics and not progression. I’m going to trust them and what they’ve leaned over the years and not someone who has to ask another player what the reasons are.

    Anet already set multiple precedences for selling progression items directly or indirectly. There's just no reason why they can't go even further with heart completion. Hearts are trash content anyway. They have all the bad parts of traditional questing without any of the good parts.

    I’m curious, what games do you know that sell progression in their store, and I’m not talking about leveling boosts or even waypoints, but the ability to buy completion of hours of ingame content.

    Be careful what you ask for
    ANet might give it to you.

    Forum Guides: Images. Text

  • Kheldorn.5123Kheldorn.5123 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Israel.7056 said:

    @kharmin.7683 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    Really, think on it. Do you actually want to play a game where your wallet plays the game for you instead of you doing the work yourself? Wouldn’t you rather play to earn the ingame rewards than buy them? It might be boring to do it repeatedly but buying progression like you and the OP are suggesting is not good for the game.

    That's the point. OP doesn't seem to want to play the game. OP seems to only want to make bank.

    The only reason people do map completion is to make gold selling legendaries. I have done the hearts a lot now and I hate them with every fiber of my being.

    That is untrue. People do content, including map completion, for many reasons. Don’t project your likes and dislikes across the whole player base or even assume your reason is the most common one.

    Edit: I’ve done full map completion 9 times so far and not to make Legendaries.

    How is gemstore heart unlock feature remove anything from your experience? Hearts are solo gameplay anyway.

    You can read my previous responses which answer your question, which is that it harms the game by causing decreases player retention.

    Core Tyria for a long time is not a source of player retention. Hearts weren't even considered a thing at the beginning of the game, but players were to stupid to play events. At this point, LW, new maps and new farms are there for player retention, not lame core tyria experience.

    Uh huh.

    Of course your opinion goes against the reason why the Devs of various games set up their game stores to sell fluff and cosmetics and not progression. I’m going to trust them and what they’ve leaned over the years and not someone who has to ask another player what the reasons are.

    Anet already set multiple precedences for selling progression items directly or indirectly. There's just no reason why they can't go even further with heart completion. Hearts are trash content anyway. They have all the bad parts of traditional questing without any of the good parts.

    I’m curious, what games do you know that sell progression in their store, and I’m not talking about leveling boosts or even waypoints, but the ability to buy completion of hours of ingame content.

    I'm talking about GW2 and GW2 only here. I never used "other games" argument, you do. And your response above is in no way in relation to the quoted post giving me the impression you are running away from admitting Anet is already selling gameplay skipping stuff.

  • Ashen.2907Ashen.2907 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 27, 2018

    @Israel.7056 said:

    @Ashen.2907 said:

    @Velran.1052 said:
    "OP doesn't want to play the game", Op wants to play the non-trash aspects of this game instead of doing terrible content that hasn't received updates in 5 years. Essentially playing the better parts of the game, like WvW/SPvP/Raids/Fractals, Instead of terribly boring and grindy content like hearts. And it literally doesn't matter why he wants to make the legendary. Stop the insane slippery slope arguments. You people sound like the people saying the people trying to deny gay marriage because "WHY NOT ALLOW PEDOPHILES DO MARRY CHILDREN TOO?!?".

    The OP can already skip the content he wishes to skip. He can already focus on the better parts of the game.

    What he wants is the ability to use his credit card to purchase gems so that he can convert the gems to gold. That option already exists as well.

    More than anything else what the OP is pushing for is an increased rate of gem to gold conversion for himself. That is not needed. If he wants lots of gold via real money transactions he can just buy more gems for conversion.

    I never use my credit card on this game personally. I haven't given them a dime in years except for the expansions and the odd purchase here and there. I almost always convert gold into gems.

    Even worse then.

    So you want the ability to convert gold into gems so that you can convert the gems back into gold at a profit.

    I really hope that Anet ignores this request. The gem/gold conversion is set up as it is, in part, to prevent or reduce that sort of flipping.

  • Kheldorn.5123Kheldorn.5123 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Ashen.2907 said:

    @Israel.7056 said:

    @Ashen.2907 said:

    @Velran.1052 said:
    "OP doesn't want to play the game", Op wants to play the non-trash aspects of this game instead of doing terrible content that hasn't received updates in 5 years. Essentially playing the better parts of the game, like WvW/SPvP/Raids/Fractals, Instead of terribly boring and grindy content like hearts. And it literally doesn't matter why he wants to make the legendary. Stop the insane slippery slope arguments. You people sound like the people saying the people trying to deny gay marriage because "WHY NOT ALLOW PEDOPHILES DO MARRY CHILDREN TOO?!?".

    The OP can already skip the content he wishes to skip. He can already focus on the better parts of the game.

    What he wants is the ability to use his credit card to purchase gems so that he can convert the gems to gold. That option already exists as well.

    More than anything else what the OP is pushing for is an increased rate of gem to gold conversion for himself. That is not needed. If he wants lots of gold via real money transactions he can just buy more gems for conversion.

    I never use my credit card on this game personally. I haven't given them a dime in years except for the expansions and the odd purchase here and there. I almost always convert gold into gems.

    Even worse then.

    So you want the ability to convert gold into gems so that you can convert the gems back into gold at a profit.

    I really hope that Anet ignores this request. The gem/gold conversion is set up as it is, in part, to prevent or reduce that sort of flipping.

    Currency vouchers from BLCs already allow you to do the same.

  • Just a flesh wound.3589Just a flesh wound.3589 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 27, 2018

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Israel.7056 said:

    @kharmin.7683 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    Really, think on it. Do you actually want to play a game where your wallet plays the game for you instead of you doing the work yourself? Wouldn’t you rather play to earn the ingame rewards than buy them? It might be boring to do it repeatedly but buying progression like you and the OP are suggesting is not good for the game.

    That's the point. OP doesn't seem to want to play the game. OP seems to only want to make bank.

    The only reason people do map completion is to make gold selling legendaries. I have done the hearts a lot now and I hate them with every fiber of my being.

    That is untrue. People do content, including map completion, for many reasons. Don’t project your likes and dislikes across the whole player base or even assume your reason is the most common one.

    Edit: I’ve done full map completion 9 times so far and not to make Legendaries.

    How is gemstore heart unlock feature remove anything from your experience? Hearts are solo gameplay anyway.

    You can read my previous responses which answer your question, which is that it harms the game by causing decreases player retention.

    Core Tyria for a long time is not a source of player retention. Hearts weren't even considered a thing at the beginning of the game, but players were to stupid to play events. At this point, LW, new maps and new farms are there for player retention, not lame core tyria experience.

    Uh huh.

    Of course your opinion goes against the reason why the Devs of various games set up their game stores to sell fluff and cosmetics and not progression. I’m going to trust them and what they’ve leaned over the years and not someone who has to ask another player what the reasons are.

    Anet already set multiple precedences for selling progression items directly or indirectly. There's just no reason why they can't go even further with heart completion. Hearts are trash content anyway. They have all the bad parts of traditional questing without any of the good parts.

    I’m curious, what games do you know that sell progression in their store, and I’m not talking about leveling boosts or even waypoints, but the ability to buy completion of hours of ingame content.

    I'm talking about GW2 and GW2 only here. I never used "other games" argument, you do. And your response above is in no way in relation to the quoted post giving me the impression you are running away from admitting Anet is already selling gameplay skipping stuff.

    No, I’m pointing out that other games (MMOs) don’t sell substantial chunks of ingame content completion in their store, no matter how profitable it might be.

    Why is that? Because it’s bad for the game. The Devs have learned that selling content completion like the OP is asking for hurts player retention. They might sell boosts. They might sell leveling aids. They might even sell convenience such as waypoint unlocks. But to sell hours of content completion with the opening of the wallet isn’t something they do.

    Edit: I’m not talking about games that sell pay to win items. They might so so because... they sell pay to win.

    Be careful what you ask for
    ANet might give it to you.

    Forum Guides: Images. Text

  • Israel.7056Israel.7056 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Menadena.7482 said:

    @Israel.7056 said:

    @Rasimir.6239 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:
    The game selling progression is bad. Players helping each other and trading amongst each other is good.

    Except they do, via BLC gamble. This is arbitrary decision why some things can be bought (or gambled for) and others don't. You lose nothing if they sell heart completion via TP, game loses nothing, Anet gains more money.

    Actually all of us are losing out if there are less people around playing the game. If you buy the gifts of exploration from another player (as in: pay another player to craft your legendary), then that player has spent a considerable number of hours in all the core Tyria maps, contributing to the background noise of making the game feel alive and well for others, joining in events, helping take down monsters, and generally making the world feel alive for other players.

    If on the other hand ANet sells the gift of exploration (or a considerable part of the play time associated with it) directly via the gemstore, then every sale is a loss of a player playing the game and keeping the maps lively. Unlocking all waypoints for world completion is negligible (I once timed it shortly before the release of HoT, on a brand-new ranger with only the equipment from leveling up it took less than 10 hours to unlock every single waypoint for world completion) compared to the time players spend in the open world to finish all the hearts for world completion.

    Every bit of convenience sold that keeps people from playing the game means less people out in the open to play with. I doubt ANet would consider this to be in the best interest for the game.

    And yet they're selling level 80 boosts which let people skip the levelling process entirely. Also tomes of knowledge are easy to get so no one levels alts even if they don't buy a level 80 boost. The only people doing the core maps are map completion sellers and they don't care if there are other people on the maps.

    The people who are really playing the game to do open world PvE are grinding metas in the HoT maps or Istan which is why they let new players skip the core zones and go straight to the fun stuff.

    No one would lose out with this.

    Anet has put all new content at 80, why is another topic but that is what they did. Given that I do not have as strong an objection to tomes and the like, just as long as people do not use them on their first character.

    The complaint about asking for this for hearts is that using xp boosts is a strawman and not equivalent at all. You and your ilk have admitted this is all about the benjamins so you can make legendaries to sell. So now you are trying to win people over to your side to be proxies to ask for something not in our interest? Do not expect any sympathy.

    It's not a strawman argument. I think I've been very careful to try to accurately represent the objections that've been made. I don't think I've misrepresented anyone else here.

    My core argument is that there's no logical difference between paying to skip waypoint unlocks or to skip hero challenges or to skip PoIs or Vistas or Hearts or to skip levelling entirely. In principle it amounts to paying to skip content tied to levelling and/or map completion in the core game. If one form is ok then they all must be ok as they're all part of the same map completion/levelling system. The hearts happen to perhaps take more time but other than that they're just another part of map completion and levelling in the core game. I just happen to hate the hearts more than any other part of map completion so I'm currently focused on hearts but that argument could be made for any or all parts of levelling and/or map completion.

    It doesn't matter what I plan to use the GoEs for that's a red herring. I could want them just to stack them in my bank and nothing about the core logic would change. It would be nice to get more people on board but that's not the main objective of this thread.

  • Ashen.2907Ashen.2907 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Ashen.2907 said:

    @Israel.7056 said:

    @Ashen.2907 said:

    @Velran.1052 said:
    "OP doesn't want to play the game", Op wants to play the non-trash aspects of this game instead of doing terrible content that hasn't received updates in 5 years. Essentially playing the better parts of the game, like WvW/SPvP/Raids/Fractals, Instead of terribly boring and grindy content like hearts. And it literally doesn't matter why he wants to make the legendary. Stop the insane slippery slope arguments. You people sound like the people saying the people trying to deny gay marriage because "WHY NOT ALLOW PEDOPHILES DO MARRY CHILDREN TOO?!?".

    The OP can already skip the content he wishes to skip. He can already focus on the better parts of the game.

    What he wants is the ability to use his credit card to purchase gems so that he can convert the gems to gold. That option already exists as well.

    More than anything else what the OP is pushing for is an increased rate of gem to gold conversion for himself. That is not needed. If he wants lots of gold via real money transactions he can just buy more gems for conversion.

    I never use my credit card on this game personally. I haven't given them a dime in years except for the expansions and the odd purchase here and there. I almost always convert gold into gems.

    Even worse then.

    So you want the ability to convert gold into gems so that you can convert the gems back into gold at a profit.

    I really hope that Anet ignores this request. The gem/gold conversion is set up as it is, in part, to prevent or reduce that sort of flipping.

    Currency vouchers from BLCs already allow you to do the same.

    To be honest I have not looked into currency vouchers so I do not know how they work.

    Are you saying that converting gold to gems, then to buy keys, then to open chests, getting these currency vouchers (I assume via RNG), to then be converted into gold, produces more gold than was originally spent on gems in the first place?

  • Israel.7056Israel.7056 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Ayrilana.1396 said:

    @Israel.7056 said:

    @Ashen.2907 said:

    @Velran.1052 said:
    "OP doesn't want to play the game", Op wants to play the non-trash aspects of this game instead of doing terrible content that hasn't received updates in 5 years. Essentially playing the better parts of the game, like WvW/SPvP/Raids/Fractals, Instead of terribly boring and grindy content like hearts. And it literally doesn't matter why he wants to make the legendary. Stop the insane slippery slope arguments. You people sound like the people saying the people trying to deny gay marriage because "WHY NOT ALLOW PEDOPHILES DO MARRY CHILDREN TOO?!?".

    The OP can already skip the content he wishes to skip. He can already focus on the better parts of the game.

    What he wants is the ability to use his credit card to purchase gems so that he can convert the gems to gold. That option already exists as well.

    More than anything else what the OP is pushing for is an increased rate of gem to gold conversion for himself. That is not needed. If he wants lots of gold via real money transactions he can just buy more gems for conversion.

    I never use my credit card on this game personally. I haven't given them a dime in years except for the expansions and the odd purchase here and there. I almost always convert gold into gems.

    Then you won’t care if the option to purchase world completion gifts never happens.

    As an FYI, purchasing the gift with gold through the exchange pretty much negates any profit that could be made if not resulting in a loss.

    I would just purchase them with gold. If I ultimately lose money on it then that's my problem.

  • Israel.7056Israel.7056 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 27, 2018

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Israel.7056 said:

    @kharmin.7683 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    Really, think on it. Do you actually want to play a game where your wallet plays the game for you instead of you doing the work yourself? Wouldn’t you rather play to earn the ingame rewards than buy them? It might be boring to do it repeatedly but buying progression like you and the OP are suggesting is not good for the game.

    That's the point. OP doesn't seem to want to play the game. OP seems to only want to make bank.

    The only reason people do map completion is to make gold selling legendaries. I have done the hearts a lot now and I hate them with every fiber of my being.

    That is untrue. People do content, including map completion, for many reasons. Don’t project your likes and dislikes across the whole player base or even assume your reason is the most common one.

    Edit: I’ve done full map completion 9 times so far and not to make Legendaries.

    How is gemstore heart unlock feature remove anything from your experience? Hearts are solo gameplay anyway.

    You can read my previous responses which answer your question, which is that it harms the game by causing decreases player retention.

    Core Tyria for a long time is not a source of player retention. Hearts weren't even considered a thing at the beginning of the game, but players were to stupid to play events. At this point, LW, new maps and new farms are there for player retention, not lame core tyria experience.

    Uh huh.

    Of course your opinion goes against the reason why the Devs of various games set up their game stores to sell fluff and cosmetics and not progression. I’m going to trust them and what they’ve leaned over the years and not someone who has to ask another player what the reasons are.

    Anet already set multiple precedences for selling progression items directly or indirectly. There's just no reason why they can't go even further with heart completion. Hearts are trash content anyway. They have all the bad parts of traditional questing without any of the good parts.

    I’m curious, what games do you know that sell progression in their store, and I’m not talking about leveling boosts or even waypoints, but the ability to buy completion of hours of ingame content.

    I'm talking about GW2 and GW2 only here. I never used "other games" argument, you do. And your response above is in no way in relation to the quoted post giving me the impression you are running away from admitting Anet is already selling gameplay skipping stuff.

    No, I’m pointing out that other games (MMOs) don’t sell substantial chunks of ingame content completion in their store, no matter how profitable it might be.

    Why is that? Because it’s bad for the game. The Devs have learned that selling content completion like the OP is asking for hurts player retention. They might sell boosts. They might sell leveling aids. They might even sell convenience such as waypoint unlocks. But to sell hours of content completion with the opening of the wallet isn’t something they do.

    Edit: I’m not talking about games that sell pay to win items. They might so so because... they sell pay to win.

    They already let us buy hero challenge auto completes with in game currency and they let us buy waypoint unlocks with gems. They are also letting people completely skip the levelling process with gems. Auto completing hearts is logically no different from any of those. They all amount to skipping content one way or another. I'd say the signals here are pretty clear. I think they might be very open to this suggestion now. Hence this thread.

  • Kheldorn.5123Kheldorn.5123 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Ashen.2907 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Ashen.2907 said:

    @Israel.7056 said:

    @Ashen.2907 said:

    @Velran.1052 said:
    "OP doesn't want to play the game", Op wants to play the non-trash aspects of this game instead of doing terrible content that hasn't received updates in 5 years. Essentially playing the better parts of the game, like WvW/SPvP/Raids/Fractals, Instead of terribly boring and grindy content like hearts. And it literally doesn't matter why he wants to make the legendary. Stop the insane slippery slope arguments. You people sound like the people saying the people trying to deny gay marriage because "WHY NOT ALLOW PEDOPHILES DO MARRY CHILDREN TOO?!?".

    The OP can already skip the content he wishes to skip. He can already focus on the better parts of the game.

    What he wants is the ability to use his credit card to purchase gems so that he can convert the gems to gold. That option already exists as well.

    More than anything else what the OP is pushing for is an increased rate of gem to gold conversion for himself. That is not needed. If he wants lots of gold via real money transactions he can just buy more gems for conversion.

    I never use my credit card on this game personally. I haven't given them a dime in years except for the expansions and the odd purchase here and there. I almost always convert gold into gems.

    Even worse then.

    So you want the ability to convert gold into gems so that you can convert the gems back into gold at a profit.

    I really hope that Anet ignores this request. The gem/gold conversion is set up as it is, in part, to prevent or reduce that sort of flipping.

    Currency vouchers from BLCs already allow you to do the same.

    To be honest I have not looked into currency vouchers so I do not know how they work.

    Are you saying that converting gold to gems, then to buy keys, then to open chests, getting these currency vouchers (I assume via RNG), to then be converted into gold, produces more gold than was originally spent on gems in the first place?

    You may buy other currencies for legendaries with them - like bandit crests or dungeon tokens. It's already the same.

  • Ayrilana.1396Ayrilana.1396 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Israel.7056 said:

    @Ayrilana.1396 said:

    @Israel.7056 said:

    @Ashen.2907 said:

    @Velran.1052 said:
    "OP doesn't want to play the game", Op wants to play the non-trash aspects of this game instead of doing terrible content that hasn't received updates in 5 years. Essentially playing the better parts of the game, like WvW/SPvP/Raids/Fractals, Instead of terribly boring and grindy content like hearts. And it literally doesn't matter why he wants to make the legendary. Stop the insane slippery slope arguments. You people sound like the people saying the people trying to deny gay marriage because "WHY NOT ALLOW PEDOPHILES DO MARRY CHILDREN TOO?!?".

    The OP can already skip the content he wishes to skip. He can already focus on the better parts of the game.

    What he wants is the ability to use his credit card to purchase gems so that he can convert the gems to gold. That option already exists as well.

    More than anything else what the OP is pushing for is an increased rate of gem to gold conversion for himself. That is not needed. If he wants lots of gold via real money transactions he can just buy more gems for conversion.

    I never use my credit card on this game personally. I haven't given them a dime in years except for the expansions and the odd purchase here and there. I almost always convert gold into gems.

    Then you won’t care if the option to purchase world completion gifts never happens.

    As an FYI, purchasing the gift with gold through the exchange pretty much negates any profit that could be made if not resulting in a loss.

    I would just purchase them with gold. If I ultimately lose money on it then that's my problem.

    Well then considering you’re better off just buying the legendaries with buy orders, just get them directly off the TP.

  • Kheldorn.5123Kheldorn.5123 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Israel.7056 said:

    @kharmin.7683 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    Really, think on it. Do you actually want to play a game where your wallet plays the game for you instead of you doing the work yourself? Wouldn’t you rather play to earn the ingame rewards than buy them? It might be boring to do it repeatedly but buying progression like you and the OP are suggesting is not good for the game.

    That's the point. OP doesn't seem to want to play the game. OP seems to only want to make bank.

    The only reason people do map completion is to make gold selling legendaries. I have done the hearts a lot now and I hate them with every fiber of my being.

    That is untrue. People do content, including map completion, for many reasons. Don’t project your likes and dislikes across the whole player base or even assume your reason is the most common one.

    Edit: I’ve done full map completion 9 times so far and not to make Legendaries.

    How is gemstore heart unlock feature remove anything from your experience? Hearts are solo gameplay anyway.

    You can read my previous responses which answer your question, which is that it harms the game by causing decreases player retention.

    Core Tyria for a long time is not a source of player retention. Hearts weren't even considered a thing at the beginning of the game, but players were to stupid to play events. At this point, LW, new maps and new farms are there for player retention, not lame core tyria experience.

    Uh huh.

    Of course your opinion goes against the reason why the Devs of various games set up their game stores to sell fluff and cosmetics and not progression. I’m going to trust them and what they’ve leaned over the years and not someone who has to ask another player what the reasons are.

    Anet already set multiple precedences for selling progression items directly or indirectly. There's just no reason why they can't go even further with heart completion. Hearts are trash content anyway. They have all the bad parts of traditional questing without any of the good parts.

    I’m curious, what games do you know that sell progression in their store, and I’m not talking about leveling boosts or even waypoints, but the ability to buy completion of hours of ingame content.

    I'm talking about GW2 and GW2 only here. I never used "other games" argument, you do. And your response above is in no way in relation to the quoted post giving me the impression you are running away from admitting Anet is already selling gameplay skipping stuff.

    No, I’m pointing out that other games (MMOs) don’t sell substantial chunks of ingame content completion in their store, no matter how profitable it might be.

    Why is that? Because it’s bad for the game. The Devs have learned that selling content completion like the OP is asking for hurts player retention. They might sell boosts. They might sell leveling aids. They might even sell convenience such as waypoint unlocks. But to sell hours of content completion with the opening of the wallet isn’t something they do.

    Edit: I’m not talking about games that sell pay to win items. They might so so because... they sell pay to win.

    How substantial are hearts for the game? Because exploration is much more than hearts. Hearts are just pausing actual exploration, they force you to stay in 1 location to grind heart related activity and move on. You can't even progress them with friends as progression is made individually. Hearts are gameplay breaks by design.

  • Israel.7056Israel.7056 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 27, 2018

    @Ayrilana.1396 said:

    @Israel.7056 said:

    @Ayrilana.1396 said:

    @Israel.7056 said:

    @Ashen.2907 said:

    @Velran.1052 said:
    "OP doesn't want to play the game", Op wants to play the non-trash aspects of this game instead of doing terrible content that hasn't received updates in 5 years. Essentially playing the better parts of the game, like WvW/SPvP/Raids/Fractals, Instead of terribly boring and grindy content like hearts. And it literally doesn't matter why he wants to make the legendary. Stop the insane slippery slope arguments. You people sound like the people saying the people trying to deny gay marriage because "WHY NOT ALLOW PEDOPHILES DO MARRY CHILDREN TOO?!?".

    The OP can already skip the content he wishes to skip. He can already focus on the better parts of the game.

    What he wants is the ability to use his credit card to purchase gems so that he can convert the gems to gold. That option already exists as well.

    More than anything else what the OP is pushing for is an increased rate of gem to gold conversion for himself. That is not needed. If he wants lots of gold via real money transactions he can just buy more gems for conversion.

    I never use my credit card on this game personally. I haven't given them a dime in years except for the expansions and the odd purchase here and there. I almost always convert gold into gems.

    Then you won’t care if the option to purchase world completion gifts never happens.

    As an FYI, purchasing the gift with gold through the exchange pretty much negates any profit that could be made if not resulting in a loss.

    I would just purchase them with gold. If I ultimately lose money on it then that's my problem.

    Well then considering you’re better off just buying the legendaries with buy orders, just get them directly off the TP.

    Alright but I still want to be able to pay to skip the hearts.

    I don't care if it's gems or in game currency. Makes no difference to me.

  • Ayrilana.1396Ayrilana.1396 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Israel.7056 said:

    @kharmin.7683 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    Really, think on it. Do you actually want to play a game where your wallet plays the game for you instead of you doing the work yourself? Wouldn’t you rather play to earn the ingame rewards than buy them? It might be boring to do it repeatedly but buying progression like you and the OP are suggesting is not good for the game.

    That's the point. OP doesn't seem to want to play the game. OP seems to only want to make bank.

    The only reason people do map completion is to make gold selling legendaries. I have done the hearts a lot now and I hate them with every fiber of my being.

    That is untrue. People do content, including map completion, for many reasons. Don’t project your likes and dislikes across the whole player base or even assume your reason is the most common one.

    Edit: I’ve done full map completion 9 times so far and not to make Legendaries.

    How is gemstore heart unlock feature remove anything from your experience? Hearts are solo gameplay anyway.

    You can read my previous responses which answer your question, which is that it harms the game by causing decreases player retention.

    Core Tyria for a long time is not a source of player retention. Hearts weren't even considered a thing at the beginning of the game, but players were to stupid to play events. At this point, LW, new maps and new farms are there for player retention, not lame core tyria experience.

    Uh huh.

    Of course your opinion goes against the reason why the Devs of various games set up their game stores to sell fluff and cosmetics and not progression. I’m going to trust them and what they’ve leaned over the years and not someone who has to ask another player what the reasons are.

    Anet already set multiple precedences for selling progression items directly or indirectly. There's just no reason why they can't go even further with heart completion. Hearts are trash content anyway. They have all the bad parts of traditional questing without any of the good parts.

    I’m curious, what games do you know that sell progression in their store, and I’m not talking about leveling boosts or even waypoints, but the ability to buy completion of hours of ingame content.

    I'm talking about GW2 and GW2 only here. I never used "other games" argument, you do. And your response above is in no way in relation to the quoted post giving me the impression you are running away from admitting Anet is already selling gameplay skipping stuff.

    No, I’m pointing out that other games (MMOs) don’t sell substantial chunks of ingame content completion in their store, no matter how profitable it might be.

    Why is that? Because it’s bad for the game. The Devs have learned that selling content completion like the OP is asking for hurts player retention. They might sell boosts. They might sell leveling aids. They might even sell convenience such as waypoint unlocks. But to sell hours of content completion with the opening of the wallet isn’t something they do.

    Edit: I’m not talking about games that sell pay to win items. They might so so because... they sell pay to win.

    How substantial are hearts for the game? Because exploration is much more than hearts. Hearts are just pausing actual exploration, they force you to stay in 1 location to grind heart related activity and move on. You can't even progress them with friends as progression is made individually. Hearts are gameplay breaks by design.

    Then don’t do them and explore. Hearts are not gameplay breaks because you’re still playing the game when you do them.

  • Just a flesh wound.3589Just a flesh wound.3589 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 27, 2018

    @Israel.7056 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Israel.7056 said:

    @kharmin.7683 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    Really, think on it. Do you actually want to play a game where your wallet plays the game for you instead of you doing the work yourself? Wouldn’t you rather play to earn the ingame rewards than buy them? It might be boring to do it repeatedly but buying progression like you and the OP are suggesting is not good for the game.

    That's the point. OP doesn't seem to want to play the game. OP seems to only want to make bank.

    The only reason people do map completion is to make gold selling legendaries. I have done the hearts a lot now and I hate them with every fiber of my being.

    That is untrue. People do content, including map completion, for many reasons. Don’t project your likes and dislikes across the whole player base or even assume your reason is the most common one.

    Edit: I’ve done full map completion 9 times so far and not to make Legendaries.

    How is gemstore heart unlock feature remove anything from your experience? Hearts are solo gameplay anyway.

    You can read my previous responses which answer your question, which is that it harms the game by causing decreases player retention.

    Core Tyria for a long time is not a source of player retention. Hearts weren't even considered a thing at the beginning of the game, but players were to stupid to play events. At this point, LW, new maps and new farms are there for player retention, not lame core tyria experience.

    Uh huh.

    Of course your opinion goes against the reason why the Devs of various games set up their game stores to sell fluff and cosmetics and not progression. I’m going to trust them and what they’ve leaned over the years and not someone who has to ask another player what the reasons are.

    Anet already set multiple precedences for selling progression items directly or indirectly. There's just no reason why they can't go even further with heart completion. Hearts are trash content anyway. They have all the bad parts of traditional questing without any of the good parts.

    I’m curious, what games do you know that sell progression in their store, and I’m not talking about leveling boosts or even waypoints, but the ability to buy completion of hours of ingame content.

    I'm talking about GW2 and GW2 only here. I never used "other games" argument, you do. And your response above is in no way in relation to the quoted post giving me the impression you are running away from admitting Anet is already selling gameplay skipping stuff.

    No, I’m pointing out that other games (MMOs) don’t sell substantial chunks of ingame content completion in their store, no matter how profitable it might be.

    Why is that? Because it’s bad for the game. The Devs have learned that selling content completion like the OP is asking for hurts player retention. They might sell boosts. They might sell leveling aids. They might even sell convenience such as waypoint unlocks. But to sell hours of content completion with the opening of the wallet isn’t something they do.

    Edit: I’m not talking about games that sell pay to win items. They might so so because... they sell pay to win.

    They already let us buy hero challenge auto completes with in game currency and they let us buy waypoint unlocks with gems. They are also letting people completely skip the levelling process with gems. Auto completing hearts is logically no different from any of those. They all amount to skipping content one way or another. I'd say the signals here are pretty clear. I think they might be very open to this suggestion now. Hence this thread.

    If you buy hero challenges you still had to do ingame content and you weren’t buying from the gemstore, so invalid argument
    The leveling process could be skipped from the very beginning of the game by using crafting and there was at least one player who did so in week one and many who did it after him, so weak argument.

    Buying auto complete of chunks of the game is different as it was not in the game previously in any way before this.


    I remember with the waypoint argument where people argued about the slippery slope. That the next thing that would be asked for is Heart completion. Those people said ohhh noooo. No one would ever ask for Heart completion. Never!! We just want waypoints unlocked so we can play on the maps with our alts.

    Well, here we are with people arguing that they want hearts unlocked and it’s ok, because waypoints are unlocked!

    The slippery slope is alive and well. If hearts are unlocked with purchase, what else will be asked for next? After all, there’s lots of old content that the game could sell to players to unlock without playing.

    Be careful what you ask for
    ANet might give it to you.

    Forum Guides: Images. Text

  • GDchiaScrub.3241GDchiaScrub.3241 Member ✭✭✭✭

    It is not the OP's fault that ANET has things to skip certain types of content. I hope no one is blaming him/her/plant for that. People have already pointed out such items already. Idc, so I am not against ANET adding such an item in for "hearts."

    At the end of the day...it's about the one resource we all share: time. While the OP may be motivated for profit (still I think this will saturate the market for legendaries if it's not linked to gems), that's irrelevant. Adding something to save time is a logical suggestion, and thus plausible for ANET since they already opened Pandora's Box for "convenience" features.

    Now it's whether or not the time spent doing hearts is equal (or less/more) than time spent doing waypoints/hero points. Furthermore, is that time spent of some quality like fun or boring? (OP feels time spent doing hearts is boring as near as I can gather). Time wasted on boring routines cannot be gained back, so the suggestion for convenience seems logical enough for me.

    I, however, do not think the game "needs" or is desperate for such features. This may be semantic. I can probably guess for ANET that...adding more gifts of exploration isn't integral to the game's survival which is true. Flooding the market with legendaries because of a convenience item would impact the economy...not necessarily impact its survival either. See how easy circular logic is? D:

    At the end of the day. It's on ANET.

    P.S. send me legendaries I don't do them, keke. and /thread pls pls pls

    Holy Warriors of [Kazo] following Kazo doctrine guided by, Our Lord and Commander, Zudo in the holy Trinity of Him and his two firm glutes.

  • Kheldorn.5123Kheldorn.5123 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Ayrilana.1396 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Israel.7056 said:

    @kharmin.7683 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    Really, think on it. Do you actually want to play a game where your wallet plays the game for you instead of you doing the work yourself? Wouldn’t you rather play to earn the ingame rewards than buy them? It might be boring to do it repeatedly but buying progression like you and the OP are suggesting is not good for the game.

    That's the point. OP doesn't seem to want to play the game. OP seems to only want to make bank.

    The only reason people do map completion is to make gold selling legendaries. I have done the hearts a lot now and I hate them with every fiber of my being.

    That is untrue. People do content, including map completion, for many reasons. Don’t project your likes and dislikes across the whole player base or even assume your reason is the most common one.

    Edit: I’ve done full map completion 9 times so far and not to make Legendaries.

    How is gemstore heart unlock feature remove anything from your experience? Hearts are solo gameplay anyway.

    You can read my previous responses which answer your question, which is that it harms the game by causing decreases player retention.

    Core Tyria for a long time is not a source of player retention. Hearts weren't even considered a thing at the beginning of the game, but players were to stupid to play events. At this point, LW, new maps and new farms are there for player retention, not lame core tyria experience.

    Uh huh.

    Of course your opinion goes against the reason why the Devs of various games set up their game stores to sell fluff and cosmetics and not progression. I’m going to trust them and what they’ve leaned over the years and not someone who has to ask another player what the reasons are.

    Anet already set multiple precedences for selling progression items directly or indirectly. There's just no reason why they can't go even further with heart completion. Hearts are trash content anyway. They have all the bad parts of traditional questing without any of the good parts.

    I’m curious, what games do you know that sell progression in their store, and I’m not talking about leveling boosts or even waypoints, but the ability to buy completion of hours of ingame content.

    I'm talking about GW2 and GW2 only here. I never used "other games" argument, you do. And your response above is in no way in relation to the quoted post giving me the impression you are running away from admitting Anet is already selling gameplay skipping stuff.

    No, I’m pointing out that other games (MMOs) don’t sell substantial chunks of ingame content completion in their store, no matter how profitable it might be.

    Why is that? Because it’s bad for the game. The Devs have learned that selling content completion like the OP is asking for hurts player retention. They might sell boosts. They might sell leveling aids. They might even sell convenience such as waypoint unlocks. But to sell hours of content completion with the opening of the wallet isn’t something they do.

    Edit: I’m not talking about games that sell pay to win items. They might so so because... they sell pay to win.

    How substantial are hearts for the game? Because exploration is much more than hearts. Hearts are just pausing actual exploration, they force you to stay in 1 location to grind heart related activity and move on. You can't even progress them with friends as progression is made individually. Hearts are gameplay breaks by design.

    Then don’t do them and explore. Hearts are not gameplay breaks because you’re still playing the game when you do them.

    People can already pay to skip dungeons, fractals, map events, leveling (learning) or waypoint unlocks. I see no reason why hearts can't be on this list.

  • Ashen.2907Ashen.2907 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 27, 2018

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Ashen.2907 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Ashen.2907 said:

    @Israel.7056 said:

    @Ashen.2907 said:

    @Velran.1052 said:
    "OP doesn't want to play the game", Op wants to play the non-trash aspects of this game instead of doing terrible content that hasn't received updates in 5 years. Essentially playing the better parts of the game, like WvW/SPvP/Raids/Fractals, Instead of terribly boring and grindy content like hearts. And it literally doesn't matter why he wants to make the legendary. Stop the insane slippery slope arguments. You people sound like the people saying the people trying to deny gay marriage because "WHY NOT ALLOW PEDOPHILES DO MARRY CHILDREN TOO?!?".

    The OP can already skip the content he wishes to skip. He can already focus on the better parts of the game.

    What he wants is the ability to use his credit card to purchase gems so that he can convert the gems to gold. That option already exists as well.

    More than anything else what the OP is pushing for is an increased rate of gem to gold conversion for himself. That is not needed. If he wants lots of gold via real money transactions he can just buy more gems for conversion.

    I never use my credit card on this game personally. I haven't given them a dime in years except for the expansions and the odd purchase here and there. I almost always convert gold into gems.

    Even worse then.

    So you want the ability to convert gold into gems so that you can convert the gems back into gold at a profit.

    I really hope that Anet ignores this request. The gem/gold conversion is set up as it is, in part, to prevent or reduce that sort of flipping.

    Currency vouchers from BLCs already allow you to do the same.

    To be honest I have not looked into currency vouchers so I do not know how they work.

    Are you saying that converting gold to gems, then to buy keys, then to open chests, getting these currency vouchers (I assume via RNG), to then be converted into gold, produces more gold than was originally spent on gems in the first place?

    You may buy other currencies for legendaries with them - like bandit crests or dungeon tokens. It's already the same.

    You didnt answer my question.

    The OP wants to be able to convert gold into gems and then convert the gems back into gold at a profit. You say that this can already be done via currency vouchers.

    Are you sure that buying gems with gold, using the gems to buy keys, using the keys to open chests, getting vouchers (via RNG?), and converting the vouchers into gold, produces more gold than was originally converted to gems? Are you positive?

    Because that is effectively what the op is asking for.

    If its already possible then there is no reason to implement his request for anet to help him flip the gem/gold conversion at a personal profit.

  • Just a flesh wound.3589Just a flesh wound.3589 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 27, 2018

    So tell me, you players who want this. What other content completion should ANet sell in the gemstore? Old raids? Mastery points? Full map completion? Because you know if they start selling content completion then there’s nothing to hold them back and nothing to stop other players from asking for completion purchase of whatever content they want to buy.

    Be careful what you ask for
    ANet might give it to you.

    Forum Guides: Images. Text

  • Ayrilana.1396Ayrilana.1396 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Ayrilana.1396 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Israel.7056 said:

    @kharmin.7683 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    Really, think on it. Do you actually want to play a game where your wallet plays the game for you instead of you doing the work yourself? Wouldn’t you rather play to earn the ingame rewards than buy them? It might be boring to do it repeatedly but buying progression like you and the OP are suggesting is not good for the game.

    That's the point. OP doesn't seem to want to play the game. OP seems to only want to make bank.

    The only reason people do map completion is to make gold selling legendaries. I have done the hearts a lot now and I hate them with every fiber of my being.

    That is untrue. People do content, including map completion, for many reasons. Don’t project your likes and dislikes across the whole player base or even assume your reason is the most common one.

    Edit: I’ve done full map completion 9 times so far and not to make Legendaries.

    How is gemstore heart unlock feature remove anything from your experience? Hearts are solo gameplay anyway.

    You can read my previous responses which answer your question, which is that it harms the game by causing decreases player retention.

    Core Tyria for a long time is not a source of player retention. Hearts weren't even considered a thing at the beginning of the game, but players were to stupid to play events. At this point, LW, new maps and new farms are there for player retention, not lame core tyria experience.

    Uh huh.

    Of course your opinion goes against the reason why the Devs of various games set up their game stores to sell fluff and cosmetics and not progression. I’m going to trust them and what they’ve leaned over the years and not someone who has to ask another player what the reasons are.

    Anet already set multiple precedences for selling progression items directly or indirectly. There's just no reason why they can't go even further with heart completion. Hearts are trash content anyway. They have all the bad parts of traditional questing without any of the good parts.

    I’m curious, what games do you know that sell progression in their store, and I’m not talking about leveling boosts or even waypoints, but the ability to buy completion of hours of ingame content.

    I'm talking about GW2 and GW2 only here. I never used "other games" argument, you do. And your response above is in no way in relation to the quoted post giving me the impression you are running away from admitting Anet is already selling gameplay skipping stuff.

    No, I’m pointing out that other games (MMOs) don’t sell substantial chunks of ingame content completion in their store, no matter how profitable it might be.

    Why is that? Because it’s bad for the game. The Devs have learned that selling content completion like the OP is asking for hurts player retention. They might sell boosts. They might sell leveling aids. They might even sell convenience such as waypoint unlocks. But to sell hours of content completion with the opening of the wallet isn’t something they do.

    Edit: I’m not talking about games that sell pay to win items. They might so so because... they sell pay to win.

    How substantial are hearts for the game? Because exploration is much more than hearts. Hearts are just pausing actual exploration, they force you to stay in 1 location to grind heart related activity and move on. You can't even progress them with friends as progression is made individually. Hearts are gameplay breaks by design.

    Then don’t do them and explore. Hearts are not gameplay breaks because you’re still playing the game when you do them.

    People can already pay to skip dungeons, fractals, map events, leveling (learning) or waypoint unlocks. I see no reason why hearts can't be on this list.

    Dungeons, fractals, and map events are not purchased through the gem store.

    The other two are examples of the slippery slope that I argued against. People will always ask for more. If Anet were to allow people to purchase heart completions, what would people ask for next using what Anet has already added as justification? Vistas, POI’s, achievements, collections, or more?

  • Kheldorn.5123Kheldorn.5123 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Ayrilana.1396 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Ayrilana.1396 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Israel.7056 said:

    @kharmin.7683 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    Really, think on it. Do you actually want to play a game where your wallet plays the game for you instead of you doing the work yourself? Wouldn’t you rather play to earn the ingame rewards than buy them? It might be boring to do it repeatedly but buying progression like you and the OP are suggesting is not good for the game.

    That's the point. OP doesn't seem to want to play the game. OP seems to only want to make bank.

    The only reason people do map completion is to make gold selling legendaries. I have done the hearts a lot now and I hate them with every fiber of my being.

    That is untrue. People do content, including map completion, for many reasons. Don’t project your likes and dislikes across the whole player base or even assume your reason is the most common one.

    Edit: I’ve done full map completion 9 times so far and not to make Legendaries.

    How is gemstore heart unlock feature remove anything from your experience? Hearts are solo gameplay anyway.

    You can read my previous responses which answer your question, which is that it harms the game by causing decreases player retention.

    Core Tyria for a long time is not a source of player retention. Hearts weren't even considered a thing at the beginning of the game, but players were to stupid to play events. At this point, LW, new maps and new farms are there for player retention, not lame core tyria experience.

    Uh huh.

    Of course your opinion goes against the reason why the Devs of various games set up their game stores to sell fluff and cosmetics and not progression. I’m going to trust them and what they’ve leaned over the years and not someone who has to ask another player what the reasons are.

    Anet already set multiple precedences for selling progression items directly or indirectly. There's just no reason why they can't go even further with heart completion. Hearts are trash content anyway. They have all the bad parts of traditional questing without any of the good parts.

    I’m curious, what games do you know that sell progression in their store, and I’m not talking about leveling boosts or even waypoints, but the ability to buy completion of hours of ingame content.

    I'm talking about GW2 and GW2 only here. I never used "other games" argument, you do. And your response above is in no way in relation to the quoted post giving me the impression you are running away from admitting Anet is already selling gameplay skipping stuff.

    No, I’m pointing out that other games (MMOs) don’t sell substantial chunks of ingame content completion in their store, no matter how profitable it might be.

    Why is that? Because it’s bad for the game. The Devs have learned that selling content completion like the OP is asking for hurts player retention. They might sell boosts. They might sell leveling aids. They might even sell convenience such as waypoint unlocks. But to sell hours of content completion with the opening of the wallet isn’t something they do.

    Edit: I’m not talking about games that sell pay to win items. They might so so because... they sell pay to win.

    How substantial are hearts for the game? Because exploration is much more than hearts. Hearts are just pausing actual exploration, they force you to stay in 1 location to grind heart related activity and move on. You can't even progress them with friends as progression is made individually. Hearts are gameplay breaks by design.

    Then don’t do them and explore. Hearts are not gameplay breaks because you’re still playing the game when you do them.

    People can already pay to skip dungeons, fractals, map events, leveling (learning) or waypoint unlocks. I see no reason why hearts can't be on this list.

    Dungeons, fractals, and map events are not purchased through the gem store.

    You can buy their currencies via BLC vouchers and therefore skip gameplay altogether.

  • Celsith.2753Celsith.2753 Member ✭✭✭

    @Rasimir.6239 said:

    Actually all of us are losing out if there are less people around playing the game. If you buy the gifts of exploration from another player (as in: pay another player to craft your legendary), then that player has spent a considerable number of hours in all the core Tyria maps, contributing to the background noise of making the game feel alive and well for others, joining in events, helping take down monsters, and generally making the world feel alive for other players.

    I hope you never meet me when I'm doing map completion because your bubble of happiness and cooperation will be totally burst. I rarely talk to anyone or stop to help with anything. 25+ hours of stupid stupid hearts means i'm not going to waste a second of my time helping someone else.

    1 million + WvW kills
    Diamond No Life
    [HUNT] Predatory Instinct

  • Kheldorn.5123Kheldorn.5123 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:
    So tell me, you players who want this. What other content completion should ANet sell in the gemstore? Old raids? Mastery points? Full map completion? Because you know if they start selling content completion then there’s nothing to hold them back and nothing to stop other players from asking for completion purchase of whatever content they want to buy.

    I think people already asked for map completion tickets on forums. I mean, after they decided to sell lvl 80 boosters and waypoint unlocks - why not everything? They already made three major steps. And raid completion can already be bought, not mentioning pvp tournaments - difference is you buy gems, convert to gold and pay players. At the end, anet makes money.

  • Kheldorn.5123Kheldorn.5123 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Ashen.2907 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Ashen.2907 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Ashen.2907 said:

    @Israel.7056 said:

    @Ashen.2907 said:

    @Velran.1052 said:
    "OP doesn't want to play the game", Op wants to play the non-trash aspects of this game instead of doing terrible content that hasn't received updates in 5 years. Essentially playing the better parts of the game, like WvW/SPvP/Raids/Fractals, Instead of terribly boring and grindy content like hearts. And it literally doesn't matter why he wants to make the legendary. Stop the insane slippery slope arguments. You people sound like the people saying the people trying to deny gay marriage because "WHY NOT ALLOW PEDOPHILES DO MARRY CHILDREN TOO?!?".

    The OP can already skip the content he wishes to skip. He can already focus on the better parts of the game.

    What he wants is the ability to use his credit card to purchase gems so that he can convert the gems to gold. That option already exists as well.

    More than anything else what the OP is pushing for is an increased rate of gem to gold conversion for himself. That is not needed. If he wants lots of gold via real money transactions he can just buy more gems for conversion.

    I never use my credit card on this game personally. I haven't given them a dime in years except for the expansions and the odd purchase here and there. I almost always convert gold into gems.

    Even worse then.

    So you want the ability to convert gold into gems so that you can convert the gems back into gold at a profit.

    I really hope that Anet ignores this request. The gem/gold conversion is set up as it is, in part, to prevent or reduce that sort of flipping.

    Currency vouchers from BLCs already allow you to do the same.

    To be honest I have not looked into currency vouchers so I do not know how they work.

    Are you saying that converting gold to gems, then to buy keys, then to open chests, getting these currency vouchers (I assume via RNG), to then be converted into gold, produces more gold than was originally spent on gems in the first place?

    You may buy other currencies for legendaries with them - like bandit crests or dungeon tokens. It's already the same.

    You didnt answer my question.

    The OP wants to be able to convert gold into gems and then convert the gems back into gold at a profit. You say that this can already be done via currency vouchers.

    Are you sure that buying gems with gold, using the gems to buy keys, using the keys to open chests, getting vouchers (via RNG?), and converting the vouchers into gold, produces more gold than was originally converted to gems? Are you positive?

    Because that is effectively what the op is asking for.

    If its already possible then there is no reason to implement his request for anet to help him flip the gem/gold conversion at a personal profit.

    I'm already making new legendary using dungeon tokens from my vouchers. And I didn't even need to buy keys, got some from free keys from the story.

    So yeah, it's already possible to profit on currency vouchers while skipping content.

  • Just a flesh wound.3589Just a flesh wound.3589 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 27, 2018

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:
    So tell me, you players who want this. What other content completion should ANet sell in the gemstore? Old raids? Mastery points? Full map completion? Because you know if they start selling content completion then there’s nothing to hold them back and nothing to stop other players from asking for completion purchase of whatever content they want to buy.

    I think people already asked for map completion tickets on forums. I mean, after they decided to sell lvl 80 boosters and waypoint unlocks - why not everything? They already made three major steps. And raid completion can already be bought, not mentioning pvp tournaments - difference is you buy gems, convert to gold and pay players. At the end, anet makes money.

    That’s still not buying from the gemstore but player to player interactions. Players cooperating together to help each other progress is allowed. They are still playing the game.

    So, what content should ANet sell next in their gemstore?

    Be careful what you ask for
    ANet might give it to you.

    Forum Guides: Images. Text

  • Kheldorn.5123Kheldorn.5123 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:
    So tell me, you players who want this. What other content completion should ANet sell in the gemstore? Old raids? Mastery points? Full map completion? Because you know if they start selling content completion then there’s nothing to hold them back and nothing to stop other players from asking for completion purchase of whatever content they want to buy.

    I think people already asked for map completion tickets on forums. I mean, after they decided to sell lvl 80 boosters and waypoint unlocks - why not everything? They already made three major steps. And raid completion can already be bought, not mentioning pvp tournaments - difference is you buy gems, convert to gold and pay players. At the end, anet makes money.

    That’s still not buying from the gemstore but player to player interactions. Players cooperating together to help each other progress to profit is allowed.

    I think we can both agree it's all based on greed, not good will when it comes to selling raids. You can't do the same for hearts as their progress isn't shared within parties so the only way would be to share account which is officially not allowed. This means the only option is to sell it via gemstore (just like they sell waypoints as you can't pay other players to unlock them for you).

  • @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:
    So tell me, you players who want this. What other content completion should ANet sell in the gemstore? Old raids? Mastery points? Full map completion? Because you know if they start selling content completion then there’s nothing to hold them back and nothing to stop other players from asking for completion purchase of whatever content they want to buy.

    I think people already asked for map completion tickets on forums. I mean, after they decided to sell lvl 80 boosters and waypoint unlocks - why not everything? They already made three major steps. And raid completion can already be bought, not mentioning pvp tournaments - difference is you buy gems, convert to gold and pay players. At the end, anet makes money.

    That’s still not buying from the gemstore but player to player interactions. Players cooperating together to help each other progress to profit is allowed.

    I think we can both agree it's all based on greed, not good will when it comes to selling raids. You can't do the same for hearts as their progress isn't shared within parties so the only way would be to share account which is officially not allowed. This means the only option is to sell it via gemstore (just like they sell waypoints as you can't pay other players to unlock them for you).

    No doubt. But you’re avoiding my question.

    If one type of hours of content completion can be purchased in the gemstore then what is the stopping point?

    I find raids boring but I want the rewards. Why can’t I buy autocomplete of raids?

    Be careful what you ask for
    ANet might give it to you.

    Forum Guides: Images. Text

  • Kheldorn.5123Kheldorn.5123 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 27, 2018

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:
    So tell me, you players who want this. What other content completion should ANet sell in the gemstore? Old raids? Mastery points? Full map completion? Because you know if they start selling content completion then there’s nothing to hold them back and nothing to stop other players from asking for completion purchase of whatever content they want to buy.

    I think people already asked for map completion tickets on forums. I mean, after they decided to sell lvl 80 boosters and waypoint unlocks - why not everything? They already made three major steps. And raid completion can already be bought, not mentioning pvp tournaments - difference is you buy gems, convert to gold and pay players. At the end, anet makes money.

    That’s still not buying from the gemstore but player to player interactions. Players cooperating together to help each other progress to profit is allowed.

    I think we can both agree it's all based on greed, not good will when it comes to selling raids. You can't do the same for hearts as their progress isn't shared within parties so the only way would be to share account which is officially not allowed. This means the only option is to sell it via gemstore (just like they sell waypoints as you can't pay other players to unlock them for you).

    No doubt. But you’re avoiding my question.

    If one type of hours of content completion can be purchased in the gemstore then what is the stopping point?

    I find raids boring but I want the rewards. Why can’t I buy autocomplete of raids?

    I see no reason for stopping points. Anet already started it and every decision to not implement any progression skipping feature via gemstore is arbitrary. So either remove everything or sell everything, there's no middle ground.

    Raid case you mention is great example. I bet if people could just grind SW and buy raid rewards with gold, raid LFG would be almost empty. Especially if you sell legendary armor outside of raids.

  • Israel.7056Israel.7056 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Israel.7056 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Israel.7056 said:

    @kharmin.7683 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    Really, think on it. Do you actually want to play a game where your wallet plays the game for you instead of you doing the work yourself? Wouldn’t you rather play to earn the ingame rewards than buy them? It might be boring to do it repeatedly but buying progression like you and the OP are suggesting is not good for the game.

    That's the point. OP doesn't seem to want to play the game. OP seems to only want to make bank.

    The only reason people do map completion is to make gold selling legendaries. I have done the hearts a lot now and I hate them with every fiber of my being.

    That is untrue. People do content, including map completion, for many reasons. Don’t project your likes and dislikes across the whole player base or even assume your reason is the most common one.

    Edit: I’ve done full map completion 9 times so far and not to make Legendaries.

    How is gemstore heart unlock feature remove anything from your experience? Hearts are solo gameplay anyway.

    You can read my previous responses which answer your question, which is that it harms the game by causing decreases player retention.

    Core Tyria for a long time is not a source of player retention. Hearts weren't even considered a thing at the beginning of the game, but players were to stupid to play events. At this point, LW, new maps and new farms are there for player retention, not lame core tyria experience.

    Uh huh.

    Of course your opinion goes against the reason why the Devs of various games set up their game stores to sell fluff and cosmetics and not progression. I’m going to trust them and what they’ve leaned over the years and not someone who has to ask another player what the reasons are.

    Anet already set multiple precedences for selling progression items directly or indirectly. There's just no reason why they can't go even further with heart completion. Hearts are trash content anyway. They have all the bad parts of traditional questing without any of the good parts.

    I’m curious, what games do you know that sell progression in their store, and I’m not talking about leveling boosts or even waypoints, but the ability to buy completion of hours of ingame content.

    I'm talking about GW2 and GW2 only here. I never used "other games" argument, you do. And your response above is in no way in relation to the quoted post giving me the impression you are running away from admitting Anet is already selling gameplay skipping stuff.

    No, I’m pointing out that other games (MMOs) don’t sell substantial chunks of ingame content completion in their store, no matter how profitable it might be.

    Why is that? Because it’s bad for the game. The Devs have learned that selling content completion like the OP is asking for hurts player retention. They might sell boosts. They might sell leveling aids. They might even sell convenience such as waypoint unlocks. But to sell hours of content completion with the opening of the wallet isn’t something they do.

    Edit: I’m not talking about games that sell pay to win items. They might so so because... they sell pay to win.

    They already let us buy hero challenge auto completes with in game currency and they let us buy waypoint unlocks with gems. They are also letting people completely skip the levelling process with gems. Auto completing hearts is logically no different from any of those. They all amount to skipping content one way or another. I'd say the signals here are pretty clear. I think they might be very open to this suggestion now. Hence this thread.

    If you buy hero challenges you still had to do ingame content and you weren’t buying from the gemstore, so invalid argument
    The leveling process could be skipped from the very beginning of the game by using crafting and there was at least one player who did so in week one and many who did it after him, so weak argument.

    Buying auto complete of chunks of the game is different as it was not in the game previously in any way before this.

    The hero challenges established that in principle they're not opposed to allowing players to skip content. The level 80 ticket and the waypoint unlocks show that in principle they're not opposed to selling progress and/or content bypasses in the gem store. Once we establish these two basic principles we can extrapolate them outwards to anything that bears the same characteristics; in this case hearts. Hearts are logically no different from hero challenges or waypoints as they're all just part of base game map completion and more generally the open world levelling format. They were there in the beginning to let people level up by actually questing and exploring rather than just crafting just like the waypoints and the hero challenges and the vistas etc. Whether they sell them for in game currency or with gems is up to ANET but it seems to me that they've clearly indicated that they're not principally opposed to either proposition.

    I believe we're arguing over a difference in degree rather than a difference in kind. This is why I've characterized your argument as a "this far but no farther" argument because it seems to me you're drawing an arbitrary line in the sand on hearts.

  • Celsith.2753Celsith.2753 Member ✭✭✭

    @Menadena.7482 said:
    Read the thread. The people that want this want the gifts of exploration so they can grind out legendaries to sell.

    You mean one person. I just don't want to have to show shineys to 40 skritts etc in order to make Frostfang. If they havent learned about chaotic material now they never will.
    I don't know why you're all so fixated on there being an item in the gemstore. I'd also happily buy heart completes from a vendor with other map currencies or buy an item from the tp which players were awarded on heart completion. Anything other than those hearts.

    You know hearts were put in as an afterthought right? We were meant to wander round and explore. Find the dynamic events and join in. Some players complained that this was too difficult and they needed a quest type system to point them where to go. So we got hearts. Badly designed mechanics, drudgery and all. Im delighted if your idea of fun is doing this content. I prefer more of a challenge and would rather not be bored out of my brain.

    As for the people saying I just want to buy progression or something, I have to ask, do you just own the base game or something? I've been busy with challenging maps in the two expansions. Learning new elite specs for every class. With the exception of side stories i've got almost all the ap possible from the base game so saying I want to skip content is laughable. I want to skip doing it AGAIN. Incidentally i've also made multiple Gen 2 legendaries. Their map completion is challenging with some areas being mob packed but you know what? I don't mind doing it. Because I have to think. Base hearts, not so much.

    1 million + WvW kills
    Diamond No Life
    [HUNT] Predatory Instinct

  • Velran.1052Velran.1052 Member ✭✭✭

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:
    So tell me, you players who want this. What other content completion should ANet sell in the gemstore? Old raids? Mastery points? Full map completion? Because you know if they start selling content completion then there’s nothing to hold them back and nothing to stop other players from asking for completion purchase of whatever content they want to buy.

    Literally all you do is spew slippery slope fallacies. Adds nothing to a conversation other than making you look dumb. OP wants to avoid bad, old, abandoned and frankly terrible content by allowing it to be bypassed with gold or even other currencies (pretty sure the never even specified which, you people just immediately assumed it was gems) that are acquired from the content that is still supported and regularly updated.

    And I don't even know what to tell you if you think he's trying to profit from this. All that will happen is he will end up spending more gold on making the legendary instead of doing hearts.

  • Neural.1824Neural.1824 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Celsith.2753 said:

    @Ardenwolfe.8590 said:

    @Israel.7056 said:
    To any ANET people reading this thread: I would buy gems for this item, that's how much it would be worth to me and I'm sure many others would buy gems for this as well.

    Translation: Dear ANet, I will gladly pay-to-win.

    Perhaps, it would benefit you and the community more if you asked for the Hearts to be more rewarding or worth your time instead?

    Having already done map completion at least 8x I support the option to buy heart completion even if its with gems. We can unlock the waypoints with gems so why not?

    Having done Map completion a lot, I do not think we need to have an instant-gratification method of completing hearts.

    They need to be far more rewarding, but we don't need a short cut. We already have a waypoint short cut. If Anet caves and gives people a renown heart shortcut, it would be less than a month before people were complaining about not having a POI short cut, and a hero point short cut, and a short cut to remove the map "fog".

    What next? Gift of Exploration for 4000gems?

    Soul-binding needs to be allowed to die gracefully. It has expired. It is long past it's time to become a footnote in the history of gaming.

  • Just a flesh wound.3589Just a flesh wound.3589 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 27, 2018

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:
    So tell me, you players who want this. What other content completion should ANet sell in the gemstore? Old raids? Mastery points? Full map completion? Because you know if they start selling content completion then there’s nothing to hold them back and nothing to stop other players from asking for completion purchase of whatever content they want to buy.

    I think people already asked for map completion tickets on forums. I mean, after they decided to sell lvl 80 boosters and waypoint unlocks - why not everything? They already made three major steps. And raid completion can already be bought, not mentioning pvp tournaments - difference is you buy gems, convert to gold and pay players. At the end, anet makes money.

    That’s still not buying from the gemstore but player to player interactions. Players cooperating together to help each other progress to profit is allowed.

    I think we can both agree it's all based on greed, not good will when it comes to selling raids. You can't do the same for hearts as their progress isn't shared within parties so the only way would be to share account which is officially not allowed. This means the only option is to sell it via gemstore (just like they sell waypoints as you can't pay other players to unlock them for you).

    No doubt. But you’re avoiding my question.

    If one type of hours of content completion can be purchased in the gemstore then what is the stopping point?

    I find raids boring but I want the rewards. Why can’t I buy autocomplete of raids?

    I see no reason for stopping points. Anet already started it and every decision to not implement any progression skipping feature via gemstore is arbitrary. So either remove everything or sell everything, there's no middle ground.

    Raid case you mention is great example. I bet if people could just grind SW and buy raid rewards with gold, raid LFG would be almost empty. Especially if you sell legendary armor outside of raids.

    Yep. And it’s amazing how you can’t see how people buying progression from the gemstore would empty out the game. And how that emptying out the game so that people can’t find others to play with and the consequent decrease in player retention would hurt the game.

    Thank you for making the point for those that can see the harm.

    Be careful what you ask for
    ANet might give it to you.

    Forum Guides: Images. Text

  • Kheldorn.5123Kheldorn.5123 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 27, 2018

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:
    So tell me, you players who want this. What other content completion should ANet sell in the gemstore? Old raids? Mastery points? Full map completion? Because you know if they start selling content completion then there’s nothing to hold them back and nothing to stop other players from asking for completion purchase of whatever content they want to buy.

    I think people already asked for map completion tickets on forums. I mean, after they decided to sell lvl 80 boosters and waypoint unlocks - why not everything? They already made three major steps. And raid completion can already be bought, not mentioning pvp tournaments - difference is you buy gems, convert to gold and pay players. At the end, anet makes money.

    That’s still not buying from the gemstore but player to player interactions. Players cooperating together to help each other progress to profit is allowed.

    I think we can both agree it's all based on greed, not good will when it comes to selling raids. You can't do the same for hearts as their progress isn't shared within parties so the only way would be to share account which is officially not allowed. This means the only option is to sell it via gemstore (just like they sell waypoints as you can't pay other players to unlock them for you).

    No doubt. But you’re avoiding my question.

    If one type of hours of content completion can be purchased in the gemstore then what is the stopping point?

    I find raids boring but I want the rewards. Why can’t I buy autocomplete of raids?

    I see no reason for stopping points. Anet already started it and every decision to not implement any progression skipping feature via gemstore is arbitrary. So either remove everything or sell everything, there's no middle ground.

    Raid case you mention is great example. I bet if people could just grind SW and buy raid rewards with gold, raid LFG would be almost empty. Especially if you sell legendary armor outside of raids.

    Yep. And it’s amazing how you can’t see how people buying progression from the gemstore would empty out the game. And how that emptying out the game so that people can’t find others to play with and the consequent decrease in player retention would hurt the game.

    Thank you for making the point for those that can see the harm.

    No. That's not what I said, please refrain from manipulating my words.

    When I said about no harm done to map population - I was referring to heart unlocks only. If you sell everything, it may hurt the game, obviously. Or not. Because if you make it expensive enough, players may choose what to skip and what to play (if they are annoyed by certain aspects of the game). At the end of the day, whales are minority.

  • @Velran.1052 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:
    So tell me, you players who want this. What other content completion should ANet sell in the gemstore? Old raids? Mastery points? Full map completion? Because you know if they start selling content completion then there’s nothing to hold them back and nothing to stop other players from asking for completion purchase of whatever content they want to buy.

    Literally all you do is spew slippery slope fallacies. Adds nothing to a conversation other than making you look dumb. OP wants to avoid bad, old, abandoned and frankly terrible content by allowing it to be bypassed with gold or even other currencies (pretty sure the never even specified which, you people just immediately assumed it was gems) that are acquired from the content that is still supported and regularly updated.

    And I don't even know what to tell you if you think he's trying to profit from this. All that will happen is he will end up spending more gold on making the legendary instead of doing hearts.

    So then tell me. If ANet does sell heart completion in the gemstore what would stop people from asking for the next set of content completion they want to buy? And what would stop ANet from selling more content completion?

    Be careful what you ask for
    ANet might give it to you.

    Forum Guides: Images. Text

  • Ayrilana.1396Ayrilana.1396 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Ayrilana.1396 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Ayrilana.1396 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Israel.7056 said:

    @kharmin.7683 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    Really, think on it. Do you actually want to play a game where your wallet plays the game for you instead of you doing the work yourself? Wouldn’t you rather play to earn the ingame rewards than buy them? It might be boring to do it repeatedly but buying progression like you and the OP are suggesting is not good for the game.

    That's the point. OP doesn't seem to want to play the game. OP seems to only want to make bank.

    The only reason people do map completion is to make gold selling legendaries. I have done the hearts a lot now and I hate them with every fiber of my being.

    That is untrue. People do content, including map completion, for many reasons. Don’t project your likes and dislikes across the whole player base or even assume your reason is the most common one.

    Edit: I’ve done full map completion 9 times so far and not to make Legendaries.

    How is gemstore heart unlock feature remove anything from your experience? Hearts are solo gameplay anyway.

    You can read my previous responses which answer your question, which is that it harms the game by causing decreases player retention.

    Core Tyria for a long time is not a source of player retention. Hearts weren't even considered a thing at the beginning of the game, but players were to stupid to play events. At this point, LW, new maps and new farms are there for player retention, not lame core tyria experience.

    Uh huh.

    Of course your opinion goes against the reason why the Devs of various games set up their game stores to sell fluff and cosmetics and not progression. I’m going to trust them and what they’ve leaned over the years and not someone who has to ask another player what the reasons are.

    Anet already set multiple precedences for selling progression items directly or indirectly. There's just no reason why they can't go even further with heart completion. Hearts are trash content anyway. They have all the bad parts of traditional questing without any of the good parts.

    I’m curious, what games do you know that sell progression in their store, and I’m not talking about leveling boosts or even waypoints, but the ability to buy completion of hours of ingame content.

    I'm talking about GW2 and GW2 only here. I never used "other games" argument, you do. And your response above is in no way in relation to the quoted post giving me the impression you are running away from admitting Anet is already selling gameplay skipping stuff.

    No, I’m pointing out that other games (MMOs) don’t sell substantial chunks of ingame content completion in their store, no matter how profitable it might be.

    Why is that? Because it’s bad for the game. The Devs have learned that selling content completion like the OP is asking for hurts player retention. They might sell boosts. They might sell leveling aids. They might even sell convenience such as waypoint unlocks. But to sell hours of content completion with the opening of the wallet isn’t something they do.

    Edit: I’m not talking about games that sell pay to win items. They might so so because... they sell pay to win.

    How substantial are hearts for the game? Because exploration is much more than hearts. Hearts are just pausing actual exploration, they force you to stay in 1 location to grind heart related activity and move on. You can't even progress them with friends as progression is made individually. Hearts are gameplay breaks by design.

    Then don’t do them and explore. Hearts are not gameplay breaks because you’re still playing the game when you do them.

    People can already pay to skip dungeons, fractals, map events, leveling (learning) or waypoint unlocks. I see no reason why hearts can't be on this list.

    Dungeons, fractals, and map events are not purchased through the gem store.

    You can buy their currencies via BLC vouchers and therefore skip gameplay altogether.

    Not the same as those vouchers are not guaranteed from the chests.

    Using your reasoning, Anet should just add an upgrade that completes all achievements, collections, wardrobe, and so on.

  • Kheldorn.5123Kheldorn.5123 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Velran.1052 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:
    So tell me, you players who want this. What other content completion should ANet sell in the gemstore? Old raids? Mastery points? Full map completion? Because you know if they start selling content completion then there’s nothing to hold them back and nothing to stop other players from asking for completion purchase of whatever content they want to buy.

    Literally all you do is spew slippery slope fallacies. Adds nothing to a conversation other than making you look dumb. OP wants to avoid bad, old, abandoned and frankly terrible content by allowing it to be bypassed with gold or even other currencies (pretty sure the never even specified which, you people just immediately assumed it was gems) that are acquired from the content that is still supported and regularly updated.

    And I don't even know what to tell you if you think he's trying to profit from this. All that will happen is he will end up spending more gold on making the legendary instead of doing hearts.

    So then tell me. If ANet does sell heart completion in the gemstore what would stop people from asking for the next set of content completion they want to buy? And what would stop ANet from selling more content completion?

    Nothing. As much as nothing stops them now. It's all arbitrary.

  • Kheldorn.5123Kheldorn.5123 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Ayrilana.1396 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Ayrilana.1396 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Ayrilana.1396 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Israel.7056 said:

    @kharmin.7683 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    Really, think on it. Do you actually want to play a game where your wallet plays the game for you instead of you doing the work yourself? Wouldn’t you rather play to earn the ingame rewards than buy them? It might be boring to do it repeatedly but buying progression like you and the OP are suggesting is not good for the game.

    That's the point. OP doesn't seem to want to play the game. OP seems to only want to make bank.

    The only reason people do map completion is to make gold selling legendaries. I have done the hearts a lot now and I hate them with every fiber of my being.

    That is untrue. People do content, including map completion, for many reasons. Don’t project your likes and dislikes across the whole player base or even assume your reason is the most common one.

    Edit: I’ve done full map completion 9 times so far and not to make Legendaries.

    How is gemstore heart unlock feature remove anything from your experience? Hearts are solo gameplay anyway.

    You can read my previous responses which answer your question, which is that it harms the game by causing decreases player retention.

    Core Tyria for a long time is not a source of player retention. Hearts weren't even considered a thing at the beginning of the game, but players were to stupid to play events. At this point, LW, new maps and new farms are there for player retention, not lame core tyria experience.

    Uh huh.

    Of course your opinion goes against the reason why the Devs of various games set up their game stores to sell fluff and cosmetics and not progression. I’m going to trust them and what they’ve leaned over the years and not someone who has to ask another player what the reasons are.

    Anet already set multiple precedences for selling progression items directly or indirectly. There's just no reason why they can't go even further with heart completion. Hearts are trash content anyway. They have all the bad parts of traditional questing without any of the good parts.

    I’m curious, what games do you know that sell progression in their store, and I’m not talking about leveling boosts or even waypoints, but the ability to buy completion of hours of ingame content.

    I'm talking about GW2 and GW2 only here. I never used "other games" argument, you do. And your response above is in no way in relation to the quoted post giving me the impression you are running away from admitting Anet is already selling gameplay skipping stuff.

    No, I’m pointing out that other games (MMOs) don’t sell substantial chunks of ingame content completion in their store, no matter how profitable it might be.

    Why is that? Because it’s bad for the game. The Devs have learned that selling content completion like the OP is asking for hurts player retention. They might sell boosts. They might sell leveling aids. They might even sell convenience such as waypoint unlocks. But to sell hours of content completion with the opening of the wallet isn’t something they do.

    Edit: I’m not talking about games that sell pay to win items. They might so so because... they sell pay to win.

    How substantial are hearts for the game? Because exploration is much more than hearts. Hearts are just pausing actual exploration, they force you to stay in 1 location to grind heart related activity and move on. You can't even progress them with friends as progression is made individually. Hearts are gameplay breaks by design.

    Then don’t do them and explore. Hearts are not gameplay breaks because you’re still playing the game when you do them.

    People can already pay to skip dungeons, fractals, map events, leveling (learning) or waypoint unlocks. I see no reason why hearts can't be on this list.

    Dungeons, fractals, and map events are not purchased through the gem store.

    You can buy their currencies via BLC vouchers and therefore skip gameplay altogether.

    Not the same as those vouchers are not guaranteed from the chests.

    Using your reasoning, Anet should just add an upgrade that completes all achievements, collections, wardrobe, and so on.

    Why not? They already started the trend and are happy to continue (currency vouchers added recently). If it's going to bring them money, more power to them. I'm in no way forced to pay for these. I got my vouchers for free and am already in the process of making another legendary for sale - buying dungeon gift without playing dungeons.

  • @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Velran.1052 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:
    So tell me, you players who want this. What other content completion should ANet sell in the gemstore? Old raids? Mastery points? Full map completion? Because you know if they start selling content completion then there’s nothing to hold them back and nothing to stop other players from asking for completion purchase of whatever content they want to buy.

    Literally all you do is spew slippery slope fallacies. Adds nothing to a conversation other than making you look dumb. OP wants to avoid bad, old, abandoned and frankly terrible content by allowing it to be bypassed with gold or even other currencies (pretty sure the never even specified which, you people just immediately assumed it was gems) that are acquired from the content that is still supported and regularly updated.

    And I don't even know what to tell you if you think he's trying to profit from this. All that will happen is he will end up spending more gold on making the legendary instead of doing hearts.

    So then tell me. If ANet does sell heart completion in the gemstore what would stop people from asking for the next set of content completion they want to buy? And what would stop ANet from selling more content completion?

    Nothing. As much as nothing stops them now. It's all arbitrary.

    You’re avoiding my question.

    Once ANet allows auto completion of chunks of the game what would stop people from asking for more and ANet allowing more?

    Be careful what you ask for
    ANet might give it to you.

    Forum Guides: Images. Text

  • Ashen.2907Ashen.2907 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Velran.1052 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:
    So tell me, you players who want this. What other content completion should ANet sell in the gemstore? Old raids? Mastery points? Full map completion? Because you know if they start selling content completion then there’s nothing to hold them back and nothing to stop other players from asking for completion purchase of whatever content they want to buy.

    Literally all you do is spew slippery slope fallacies. Adds nothing to a conversation other than making you look dumb. OP wants to avoid bad, old, abandoned and frankly terrible content by allowing it to be bypassed with gold or even other currencies (pretty sure the never even specified which, you people just immediately assumed it was gems) that are acquired from the content that is still supported and regularly updated.

    And I don't even know what to tell you if you think he's trying to profit from this. All that will happen is he will end up spending more gold on making the legendary instead of doing hearts.

    So then tell me. If ANet does sell heart completion in the gemstore what would stop people from asking for the next set of content completion they want to buy? And what would stop ANet from selling more content completion?

    Nothing. As much as nothing stops them now. It's all arbitrary.

    You’re avoiding my question.

    Once ANet allows auto completion of chunks of the game what would stop people from asking for more and ANet allowing more?

    To be fair, he answered your question.

    You asked what would stop them, he answered, "nothing."

  • @Ashen.2907 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Velran.1052 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:
    So tell me, you players who want this. What other content completion should ANet sell in the gemstore? Old raids? Mastery points? Full map completion? Because you know if they start selling content completion then there’s nothing to hold them back and nothing to stop other players from asking for completion purchase of whatever content they want to buy.

    Literally all you do is spew slippery slope fallacies. Adds nothing to a conversation other than making you look dumb. OP wants to avoid bad, old, abandoned and frankly terrible content by allowing it to be bypassed with gold or even other currencies (pretty sure the never even specified which, you people just immediately assumed it was gems) that are acquired from the content that is still supported and regularly updated.

    And I don't even know what to tell you if you think he's trying to profit from this. All that will happen is he will end up spending more gold on making the legendary instead of doing hearts.

    So then tell me. If ANet does sell heart completion in the gemstore what would stop people from asking for the next set of content completion they want to buy? And what would stop ANet from selling more content completion?

    Nothing. As much as nothing stops them now. It's all arbitrary.

    You’re avoiding my question.

    Once ANet allows auto completion of chunks of the game what would stop people from asking for more and ANet allowing more?

    To be fair, he answered your question.

    You asked what would stop them, he answered, "nothing."

    That’s true. He confirmed that if auto Heart completion is allowed then nothing stops any further auto content completion, and that the slippery slope is alive and well.

    Be careful what you ask for
    ANet might give it to you.

    Forum Guides: Images. Text

  • Ashen.2907Ashen.2907 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Ashen.2907 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Velran.1052 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:
    So tell me, you players who want this. What other content completion should ANet sell in the gemstore? Old raids? Mastery points? Full map completion? Because you know if they start selling content completion then there’s nothing to hold them back and nothing to stop other players from asking for completion purchase of whatever content they want to buy.

    Literally all you do is spew slippery slope fallacies. Adds nothing to a conversation other than making you look dumb. OP wants to avoid bad, old, abandoned and frankly terrible content by allowing it to be bypassed with gold or even other currencies (pretty sure the never even specified which, you people just immediately assumed it was gems) that are acquired from the content that is still supported and regularly updated.

    And I don't even know what to tell you if you think he's trying to profit from this. All that will happen is he will end up spending more gold on making the legendary instead of doing hearts.

    So then tell me. If ANet does sell heart completion in the gemstore what would stop people from asking for the next set of content completion they want to buy? And what would stop ANet from selling more content completion?

    Nothing. As much as nothing stops them now. It's all arbitrary.

    You’re avoiding my question.

    Once ANet allows auto completion of chunks of the game what would stop people from asking for more and ANet allowing more?

    To be fair, he answered your question.

    You asked what would stop them, he answered, "nothing."

    That’s true. He confirmed that if auto Heart completion is allowed then nothing stops any further auto content completion, and that the slippery slope is alive and well.

    And, again to be fair, there is nothing to stop anet from selling other content completion in the gemstore even if heart completion isnt sold.

  • @Ashen.2907 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Ashen.2907 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Velran.1052 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:
    So tell me, you players who want this. What other content completion should ANet sell in the gemstore? Old raids? Mastery points? Full map completion? Because you know if they start selling content completion then there’s nothing to hold them back and nothing to stop other players from asking for completion purchase of whatever content they want to buy.

    Literally all you do is spew slippery slope fallacies. Adds nothing to a conversation other than making you look dumb. OP wants to avoid bad, old, abandoned and frankly terrible content by allowing it to be bypassed with gold or even other currencies (pretty sure the never even specified which, you people just immediately assumed it was gems) that are acquired from the content that is still supported and regularly updated.

    And I don't even know what to tell you if you think he's trying to profit from this. All that will happen is he will end up spending more gold on making the legendary instead of doing hearts.

    So then tell me. If ANet does sell heart completion in the gemstore what would stop people from asking for the next set of content completion they want to buy? And what would stop ANet from selling more content completion?

    Nothing. As much as nothing stops them now. It's all arbitrary.

    You’re avoiding my question.

    Once ANet allows auto completion of chunks of the game what would stop people from asking for more and ANet allowing more?

    To be fair, he answered your question.

    You asked what would stop them, he answered, "nothing."

    That’s true. He confirmed that if auto Heart completion is allowed then nothing stops any further auto content completion, and that the slippery slope is alive and well.

    And, again to be fair, there is nothing to stop anet from selling other content completion in the gemstore even if heart completion isnt sold.

    True, but but they have to start selling auto complete of content first and so far they haven’t.

    Be careful what you ask for
    ANet might give it to you.

    Forum Guides: Images. Text

  • Velran.1052Velran.1052 Member ✭✭✭

    Literally nothing stops them now and nothing will stop them even if they allow this. You point is completely arbitrary. And you're comparing content that's being newely released, supported through updates and bug fixes, to content that was made 5 years ago and hasn't received any changes or updates since. Which content do you think is more worthy of being allowed to bypass? Especially when one is grindy, repetitive and unchallenging.

  • Israel.7056Israel.7056 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 27, 2018

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Velran.1052 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:
    So tell me, you players who want this. What other content completion should ANet sell in the gemstore? Old raids? Mastery points? Full map completion? Because you know if they start selling content completion then there’s nothing to hold them back and nothing to stop other players from asking for completion purchase of whatever content they want to buy.

    Literally all you do is spew slippery slope fallacies. Adds nothing to a conversation other than making you look dumb. OP wants to avoid bad, old, abandoned and frankly terrible content by allowing it to be bypassed with gold or even other currencies (pretty sure the never even specified which, you people just immediately assumed it was gems) that are acquired from the content that is still supported and regularly updated.

    And I don't even know what to tell you if you think he's trying to profit from this. All that will happen is he will end up spending more gold on making the legendary instead of doing hearts.

    So then tell me. If ANet does sell heart completion in the gemstore what would stop people from asking for the next set of content completion they want to buy? And what would stop ANet from selling more content completion?

    Nothing. As much as nothing stops them now. It's all arbitrary.

    You’re avoiding my question.

    Once ANet allows auto completion of chunks of the game what would stop people from asking for more and ANet allowing more?

    Nothing logically speaking.

    But we're already at that point.

  • No doubt. I'd at least like something in the gem store that completes all the hearts in the core game for you. Even if it's the same price as those fancy mounts.

  • Menadena.7482Menadena.7482 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:

    @Just a flesh wound.3589 said:
    So tell me, you players who want this. What other content completion should ANet sell in the gemstore? Old raids? Mastery points? Full map completion? Because you know if they start selling content completion then there’s nothing to hold them back and nothing to stop other players from asking for completion purchase of whatever content they want to buy.

    I think people already asked for map completion tickets on forums. I mean, after they decided to sell lvl 80 boosters and waypoint unlocks - why not everything? They already made three major steps. And raid completion can already be bought, not mentioning pvp tournaments - difference is you buy gems, convert to gold and pay players. At the end, anet makes money.

    That’s still not buying from the gemstore but player to player interactions. Players cooperating together to help each other progress to profit is allowed.

    I think we can both agree it's all based on greed, not good will when it comes to selling raids. You can't do the same for hearts as their progress isn't shared within parties so the only way would be to share account which is officially not allowed. This means the only option is to sell it via gemstore (just like they sell waypoints as you can't pay other players to unlock them for you).

    No doubt. But you’re avoiding my question.

    If one type of hours of content completion can be purchased in the gemstore then what is the stopping point?

    I find raids boring but I want the rewards. Why can’t I buy autocomplete of raids?

    I see no reason for stopping points. Anet already started it and every decision to not implement any progression skipping feature via gemstore is arbitrary. So either remove everything or sell everything, there's no middle ground.

    Raid case you mention is great example. I bet if people could just grind SW and buy raid rewards with gold, raid LFG would be almost empty. Especially if you sell legendary armor outside of raids.

    Yep. And it’s amazing how you can’t see how people buying progression from the gemstore would empty out the game. And how that emptying out the game so that people can’t find others to play with and the consequent decrease in player retention would hurt the game.

    Thank you for making the point for those that can see the harm.

    No. That's not what I said, please refrain from manipulating my words.

    When I said about no harm done to map population - I was referring to heart unlocks only. If you sell everything, it may hurt the game, obviously. Or not. Because if you make it expensive enough, players may choose what to skip and what to play (if they are annoyed by certain aspects of the game). At the end of the day, whales are minority.

    Yes, we are talking about Heart unlocks in the gemstore.

    But once that’s allowed what stops further content completion in the gemstore. I find raids boring but I want the rewards. Can I ask for raid completion in the gem store and why not? What’s the stopping point once auto content completion is allowed?

    As all the people selling raids scream in unison ...... :)

    New to the game? Feel free to give a yell if you need PVE help.

  • Menadena.7482Menadena.7482 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Velran.1052 said:
    Literally nothing stops them now and nothing will stop them even if they allow this.

    BZZT.

    A very huge thing. Their rep. Do you not think many people would drop GW2 in droves if they did that?

    New to the game? Feel free to give a yell if you need PVE help.

  • Kheldorn.5123Kheldorn.5123 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Menadena.7482 said:

    @Velran.1052 said:
    Literally nothing stops them now and nothing will stop them even if they allow this.

    BZZT.

    A very huge thing. Their rep. Do you not think many people would drop GW2 in droves if they did that?

    No, I don't think so. People always talk big about any gemstore/BLC change but at the end of the day you can see BLC skins and mounts everywhere. Forum warriors are irrelevant. People pay for waypoints, people would pay for hearts. Some people. And some others will complain but never buy those items. And after about a week or two everything goes quiet and game lives on like nothing happened.

    GW2 survived a lot of such dramas and literally nobody cares.