WvW map concept - see image

Guild Wars 2 - New WvW map concept

 

Here is my concept for a new WvW map and the whole map has the Heart of Thorns vibe. The Lords and guards are Exalted, Mordrem & Pact Fleet. I really like the center of the Desert Borderlands map, but there is no reason to go there, but what if the entire map was Jungle.

Or it could based off of the next expansion. If Anet wants to create hype for the next expansion - release a new borderland map with that theme.

 

So I added all the other features as way to encourage smaller group participation and to make defending supply camps and holding ruin type stuff more of a valuable thing then the current blood lust mechanic. This also makes for many more objectives to contribute to the overall score.

I also wanted to give a separate area where ppl could be and hang out, but doesn't contribute to the map cap (the spawn zone w/ amenities - top of the image) until you enter the map, but you can hear/see all the maps chatter from there. The red and green spawn zones contribute to map cap and so does the blue attack position.

Plus, I wanted to give the home team the advantage.

 

The keeps and Garrison would have 3 ways to access:

1. large bridge that would point to the exterior of the map

2. a central tunnel with helix stair that would come up from the center underneath

3. a ramp that would start on the opposite side of the tunnel

 

Next the supply camps would automatically spawn bombers (think sorta like PvP - Battle of Champion's Dusk) to blow up the gates if the destination of the supply yaks was not the same color. Bomber can be killed just like yaks, plus they also get the little power buff like yaks if a player accompanies them. The bomber get upgraded like yaks with guards and such as the camp gets upgraded. However, the bombers won't be deployed if the destination and camp are the same color.

 

The Laser Tower with its light walls adds a new siege device to WvW. These walls/gates/doors can only be destroyed by a hand held battering ram - cost of 15 supply. You can drop these and pick them back up and can use the battering rams on standard gates, but will only do 1/2 to 1/3 the damage as a siege ram.

 

The Treb Tower when fully upgrade will also send out bombers, since it adds a basic supply camp (this camp can't be upgraded)

 

The Arena would add some more dynamics to the WvW maps. The 3 small circles would be color vs color and is part of the WvW environment. Anyone can run through and be attached. Courtesy would be to leave the fighter alone if they are in the circles, but you could still attack them.

The center circle is a free for all area (think guild hall arenas, but 3 times as big) and has arena chat so you can talk to the other players.

When you enter you are given 4 options with a limit of 30 players and this arena will have it's own queuing.

1. free for all - everyone vs everyone

2. red

3. blue

4. green

 

There is my idea for adding a new map to WvW. See image for further info on design.

 

BTW - it would be spread out more and there would be sentries along the roads, but these sentries would also upgrade to a max of 3 units.

@Rasp Sabreblade.5421 said:the whole map has the Heart of Thorns vibe.nope. nope nope nope.

Or it could based off of the next expansion. If Anet wants to create hype for the next expansion - release a new borderland map with that theme.anet already stated that there will be no new borderland anytime soon since they're focussing all their effort on the new world structuring (and probably because desert bl was a fiasco)

I also wanted to give a separate area where ppl could be and hang out, but doesn't contribute to the map cap (the spawn zone w/ amenities - top of the image) until you enter the map, but you can hear/see all the maps chatter from there.So, pretty much a WvW lobby? Somehing that has been overdue for a long time. Should however be a completely seperate map and not part of a bl.

Next the supply camps would automatically spawn bombers (think sorta like PvP - Battle of Champion's Dusk) to blow up the gates if the destination of the supply yaks was not the same color.Hell no. Reminds me an awful lot of the laser that used to be on desert bl. There's already too much automatism taking over in WvW (like objectives upgrading themselves etc.). One thing that should remain is that gates can only breached with players actually being present and contributing to it (like using a ram).

The Laser Tower with its light walls adds a new siege device to WvW. These walls/gates/doors can only be destroyed by a hand held battering ram - cost of 15 supply. You can drop these and pick them back up and can use the battering rams on standard gates, but will only do 1/2 to 1/3 the damage as a siege ram.Ah yes, I can already imagine a 60 man blob running around the map, every player holding a ram, destroying gates in seconds. Sounds fun <3

The Treb Tower when fully upgrade will also send out bombers, since it adds a basic supply camp (this camp can't be upgraded)Why add a camp that can't be upgraded...?

BTW - it would be spread out more

NO. Desert bl is already too big. Getting from one point to the other takes ages without waypoints/gimmicks like shrines. Don't make it worse.

Thats not so much a map as it is circles aligned to circles... but either way, I see a glaringly obvious issue with that "center spawn". Once towers and keeps start getting capped and T3, players will start to move around them in the shortest ways they can, which happen to be past spawn. All this map will be is spawncamp heaven.

When the treb tower becomes a supply camp - that is when it is considered upgraded.

what I meant by spread out - I was talking about alpine borderlands size and I based everything off of equal distances. It would just be more of a form then a circle.

spawn camping - shouldn't be an issue as it doesn't seem to be an issue now. The center spawn location would be elevated and basically split similar to how the borderlands areas are now. I was trying to get more activity in the middle of the map, instead of the giant dead zones we currently have in the existing borderlands maps.

the home team will have the home advantage - they will have multiple ways to access the zone. one on the north and one in the center.

the reason I don't just want a wvw lobby is that you don't necessarily know what was going on. I wanted players to still be connected to their world without them being counted as a participant. This would also allow a player to jump back in quickly (unless the world was full) to help out to say stop a garrison attack.

ok - I see your point on the hand held battering rams. maybe they are only useful on the laser towers when they gain walls/gates.

I still think the bombers are a good idea. It makes players have to think about letting camps being capped and the repercussions of not watching you towers/keeps once that happens.

Plus one thing I didn't address in my post. Was something someone mentioned on a different post regarding a negative/positive penalty when you are in the lead. which would allow for groups to come from behind to win. so ppl just don't give up by Tuesday if they are behind.

That layout could be decently used if there was a city to capture inside a map, but maps on Gw2 are limited sized, maybe IF central map was a city similiar to DR in place of EBGStill spawning on center that is not a good choice, even for a home map, still if blue lost center or get home city conquered they would start at north on the amenities zone, would be interesting.

A big map could work decently with population spreaded into tasks/quest of defense and offense.

Btw DBL map failed as much EBG and ALPINE fails, they are all gimmick maps in a way or another.

Spawning in the middle is a terrible concept and easier to get spawn camped, and there doesn't seem to be two additional exits which is needed (although some people tend to ignore this and scream about spawn camping anyways). The lines don't really emphasize routes so maybe that's the problem with the concept, and all the circles just make it confusing as to what it's suppose to mean, elevation?Also why is blue spawning further away from their own garrison than the other two sides?The arena in the middle seems to be a separate thing anyways so even have it on that map, it's like just sticking a guild hall in the middle with a lobby you might as well do that for OS instead where it wouldn't bother the rest of the mechanics on the map.The rest of the stuff just sounds like it would be desert 2.0 with all the extra gimmicks.

@Aeolus.3615 said:Btw DBL map failed as much EBG and ALPINE fails, they are all gimmick maps in a way or another.

What type of map isn't going to have a gimmick? a grass savannah with a shallow straight river down the middle? (might as well get rid of underwater combat)EBG and Alpine work perfectly fine as they are. The use of space could be better like in the north areas in alpine, but the relation of the structures of those maps are just fine and work, SMC does a good job of providing combat often. EBG and Alpine are fine, eotm and desert went off the rails cause they cared more about the environment and aesthetics than actual game play on those maps.

If ANet wants to create hype for the next expansion - release anything revolutionary or totally new for WvW. Map, mechanics, new siege, more teams, something, anything!

@XenesisII.1540, not entirelly true about alpine and ebg, players just like it cause they can run inside closest, tower, it is easy to ktrain, and u can drop 5+ trebs from some structures to another, some even can be trebbed from 1 place inner and outter.Theres alot more in both maps that can be seen as gimick solutions, still m8 be at the limit of capability of what casuals and most gammers can do, if Anet improves WvW to much players m8 drop due effort needed to reach something and for that the alliance system will be a slap in the face of some players who dont wanna fight but wanna ktrain stuff on WvW.

DBL is bad cause game mode dont offers much besides drop siege n cap or run cause theres a zerg inc to you, and i agree that is more for asthetics show off than anythign else ;P

Every game or map has its gimmicks i know that.....but the current maps and current gameplay are a huge gimmick w/o any other option, a new map could be less gimmickly designed to be much less dependant from the ktrain cappign stuff and smallers server capping back wich is what creates the gameplay for WvW and avoids staleness.

@Tinnel.4369 if i reccal Anet stated that WvW and PvP stuff will be separeted from expantions.... those are pure pve.And in terms of new maps Anet might change a bit the Alpine to be DBL sized, and make a new map for the 3rd server, that's all the hype u can have after alliances system hit.

Like I said you expecting a flat map with nothing? because every map is gonna have gimmicks, the question is whether or not they're useful or fun, shrines and bloodlust ruins aren't.Not sure what you mean by run inside closest tower, unless you want them to remove all structures, people are going to run when outnumbered or faced against op roaming specs.They're not easy to ktrain if you have players who give two kittens to defend and upgrade, that's on players.I don't see a problem with trebbing structures from another one, that forces players to counter or go after those structures, that forces fights, better than desert bl which is terrible and meaningless, what's the point of taking north towers? South towers were made for the waypoints but that was a terrible concept that made side keeps useless because they thought emergency waypoints were better there."Smaller servers" isn't really going to be a thing in the future.The game mode is about scoring points, so unless that changes, the need for structures isn't going to change. I'd prefer ebg type maps in the future.

so the thing with the arena - is that it is actually under the center spawn locations and at any given time anyone can run through it - even a zerg. I just thought having a designated location of 1v1 would be better then it is now. where you don't know if someone is trying to 1v1 someone or it just happens to be 2 ppl came across each other and the 1 person wonders why you aren't helping them kill the other player.So the center island is elevated. Thing of DBL and the size of the red teams spawn point - it currently has 2 means to exit. I was thinking more about 4 - 3 separate paths to the map and 1 through the arena, and not counting the lobby type area.yes, the home team would have 2 spawn locations, but the one to the north would also be like a lobby of sorts.

Also, what I presented is just a base layout. If I did a whole thing with terrain, it would have valleys, caves, plateaus, cliffs, water, elevation change, etc... I was trying to go for something a bit different than what we have in EBG. I wanted to make the layout such that it would somewhat discourage the 50+ zerg trains, because there would be way to many things to cover at once. I don't are if everyone is under 1 commander, bu the commander splitting ppl into groups and send this group to do that and this group to do something else, while the remainder of the group drops catas for taking a keep. I have also posted an idea of having bombers spawn when the color of the supply camp and the tower/keep to which the supply goes to doesn't match. These little guys can be killed, but that means someone needs to do so. This means you may also want to try and defend the camps or make sure you have a roamer killing them. And with the new alliance system, I think we all hope there will be better coverage for all hours of the day.

I guess I am just trying to promote more than single target objectives, and to make smaller objective just as meaningful as larger ones.

There should be something like diminishing returns for whatever color is in first place. Not sure how it would work, but something that helps keep the scores closer together at the end of the week, and allows for the under dog to come back and possible win. I hate logging in on Wednesday or Thursday and no one is playing because we are to far behind to catch up.

Anet should also implement a special reward. So for instance, when we originally got the mist forged weapon tickets based on your servers ranking. Make something like that again, either weapons, trinkets, bakpacks, or armor with swappable stats or a WvW glider skin. However, it needs to be something ppl really have to work for. So for instance, if your alliance comes in first every week for a year and you participated the entire time you would have enough tickets for maybe 2 of these amazing items, but the average would be 1 item. So this would have nothing to do with the pip system - this would be extra.

@XenesisII.1540 said:Like I said you expecting a flat map with nothing? because every map is gonna have gimmicks, the question is whether or not they're useful or fun, shrines and bloodlust ruins aren't.(....)

Why u keep assuming i want flat maps ????? that would be the most idiotic thing to want in a game.... i actually accept gimmicks if they were good designed.

What i was trying to say is having maps that only offer heavy gimmicks is a problem, wich is what the current maps are, they need to be improved to something more than hide in tower while humping 5+ trebs to take a wall down, well OP map layout on a city with a big castle on the central arena spot would work like ebg, i would not mind if each bl was actually an alliance city :) that could be fully conquered, upgraded etc...

And im ok with trebbing from structure to structure, but not how it is done atm, drop 10 trebs then go with blob and drop 10-15 sup catas and shield gens and ac's, wich is one thing that i like on DBL, players need to go open field if they want something, stil... map has alot of issues and lame places to build siege that make counter treb back impossible.EB needs a fresh design, red zone, they removed OW cause players could fly to defend, but yet u can still fly into veloka, OW become a easy tower to cap almost no one care about it atm (still that migh be me cause i always face 2x to 3x my server numbers....)

While Alpine is super outdated map, with alot of useless space still a new layout alone on that map would not help that much :\ IMO, since i find the game quite (extremelly) lackluster in terms of mechanics design that could be used in WvW.

Actually this post gave me an ideia how a siege game would work well with ground combat and tactica usage of capturing buildings >_> using the OP's layout, with just some adition of simple new mechanics to the game(mostly change some that already exist to something else...), with some enphasis on more tactical placement/movement than actually the current gameplay of full blob drop siege and extpect enemy zerg wont apear...

You don't like the current maps, you don't like gimmicks, and you don't like structures, what else is there to assume.

@XenesisII.1540 said:You don't like the current maps, you don't like gimmicks, and you don't like structures, what else is there to assume.

Still not likign the current lameness does not mean i want flat maps :P, i actually want them to become good...

I see where some of the issue with my map layout is.
The treb towers are special capture/hold points that are further away than a normal trebs can reach - so think of the ruin location near southeast tower in Alpine Borderlands. Anyone can run up there, but it will be placed further away then a normal treb can reach. Also, you don't need to hold the 2 adjacent treb towers, just any 2 on the map.

@Rasp Sabreblade.5421 what about make it more similiar to ebg with a big castle on the midle where those towers can hit it???

Like, north garri becomes a keep, the promenade/arena get a garri in it's place, whe home BL server spawns when it own the structure, if they loose they will be pushed to north spwan, maybe some minimal tower with treb options between garri and keep?

Oh btw i liked that hybrid system of "watch tower with supply" thing, feels like an military siege acampment lol, but i would trade the laser for stronger trebs.

@Aeolus.3615 The reason for having the spawn in the middle it to give the map a different feel then Alpine.
IMHO I think mooshing things around in DBL and adding a Stonemist Castle with a Exalted flair to it in the middle, like Tarir, the forgotten city would be a much better option. Then pull everything towards the center and create a new path around the outside with a few extra camps and smaller towers that adds something to game play - instead of the ruins and blood lust.

Another idea for a borderlands map would be constructing it in a trapezoid/triangle type zone (think Helms Deep from Lord of the Rings), but everyone starts on the wide side and is forced into each other at the far end were the objective is. There would still be towers, keeps, camps, etc... However, the main castle/garrison would have to have some type of degradation mechanic that over time walls/gates would get weaker and weaker until they crumble, which then requires you to repair them. I am not talking instantly, but something to the effect if one group has had it for 1-2 hours then the degradation kicks in and it might take another 1hr before it fails. I think this type of map would help motivate the 2 groups outside the castle to work together until the walls come crumbling down. I am not saying they are side by side, but probably/maybe within view. This map would be more based for zerg play - I have a concept for this, but have not put it to paper yet.

@Rasp Sabreblade.5421 so basicly put on what happens arround SMC has the main objective of the map, just like servers tend to push over the server who owns SMC, if they have players for it, that actually feels something like what should be dome while atackign enemy home map :) dont stop until their hall is gone or capped. wich ur circular design would help both havok and guild groups i think.

I think it would not need to be a trapezoid for a home bl, that would cut alot of map unless Anet made it horizontal :\, but the side towers/castles would become way to much "off site".

If i have time today i might use some WvW map and "merge"ur circular design on it to explain better what i ment.

@Aeolus.3615 said:@Rasp Sabreblade.5421 so basicly put on what happens arround SMC has the main objective of the map, just like servers tend to push over the server who owns SMC, if they have players for it, that actually feels something like what should be dome while atackign enemy home map :) dont stop until their hall is gone or capped. wich ur circular design would help both havok and guild groups i think.

I think it would not need to be a trapezoid for a home bl, that would cut alot of map unless Anet made it horizontal :\, but the side towers/castles would become way to much "off site".

If i have time today i might use some WvW map and "merge"ur circular design on it to explain better what i ment.

that would be interesting to see - I look forward to it.

@"Rasp Sabreblade.5421Im waiting on a queue... i had time to cut&copy some pics lol...

Since every one love the EBG crack house...Blue lines are gatesGreen line are destroyable wallsTreb are a better and improved treb that could be used by any server, needs to be fixed or builted with supply.Red light, are spawns if green looses Palace at center of citadel they could use the starting spawn at north.Yellow lights are upgradable waypoints.

I like the flat land idea better.

@"Eramonster.2718" said:I like the flat land idea better.

Wait for the spvp GvG map that Anet stated they m8 try, most "GvG wanabes" will probably cry s since it isnt stack n spam like a noob behing a sheep screaming with WvW stats....

U need objectives and several tasks to know how good ur group actually is, stack is not the only thing that need to happen in a gvg match.... that just happen cause players want to be carried with, and dont know trully how to play, and game has no support for guild pvp wich is the 1st reason why everything is just stacking.