Do you think Elementalist is overused, underused, or used proportionally?

I have been playing Ele as my starter and my main for 8 months now. Beat the main story, HoT, and Pof. All that stuff. (Pic related)But one question has been on my mind for a while.

What proportion of the playerbase has Ele as their main in PvP, PvE, and WvW.

I would like to hear more opinions on this.

You find a player/profession breakdown in this statistics page from gw2efficiency: https://gw2efficiency.com/account/player-statisticsIt says nothing of game part, but I guess gw2efficiency attracts more the PvE-related players.

for how good/bad it is, ele is used disproportionately more than other classes in pvp and pve

Hard to say without Anet giving statistics. But this class gives everything. Healing, damage, conditions, crowd control, and tons of survivability if you actually move and don't let enemies hit you. It's far and away one of the easiest classes in the game simply by the sheer amount of, not just utility, but everything it can give.

Also, you can do most of it at range.

Let's put it this way; I had less than half the deaths playing as a Condition Elemenatlist than I did with a regular Warrior. The ability to do competitive damage at even more than an arms length away (that most melee classes are limited to) makes it exponentially more survivable. In fact, it's my most survivable class in WvW simply because it's capable of doing killing damage without being in melee range, while having access to every kitten out button. It's one of the most annoying classes to down as well, since it has guaranteed mobility.

Needless to say, the only reason I think it's not the most popular is because the class carries the veneer of being more difficult than it actually is. It's really not. You just have to be mildly proactive about attunements and you're already better than most other classes. Once you know what your skills do, all you have to do is tap two buttons and you're already 600-1200 range away from the kill zone. Or dropping heals and condi cleanses like candy. However, for that reason it is also one of the most popular.

@Lyros.4673 said:Hard to say without Anet giving statistics. But this class gives everything. Healing, damage, conditions, crowd control, and tons of survivability if you actually move and don't let enemies hit you. It's far and away one of the easiest classes in the game simply by the sheer amount of, not just utility, but everything it can give.

Also, you can do most of it at range.

Right. Lets get into this shall we? You are NOT going to get all of that into a single build. Why? Because it all requires being built for. Unless you're going full cele at which point then maybe but you are then sacrificing all of the stats. You lose in every area. You become a okay at everything, great at nothing. Conditions? You mean the Burning and The Bleeding? Sure if you ignore what attunement they are in then you could get chills or what ever but at any one time. You might have access to 1 or 2 damaging conditions (ele only has 2...) and maybe the odd vul or something but nowhere near the level pretty much everyone else (except guardian...) has access to. Crowd control is also rather meh, high cool downs, requires specific attunements. Quite reasonable to count for most people that have played against an ele. Depending on their weaponset they will have access to maybe 1 or 2 at a time. All on high cool downs.

Ele is nowhere near the easiest class to play. Just no."most of it at range" ah, you mean mindless staff spamming? Because Ele gets WRECKED when they run staff. They need to be heavily protected. Scepter is mid range and basically spam the crap out of air lol you know what you are facing the moment you see them with a scepter, because its the only viable build lol

@Lyros.4673 said:Let's put it this way; I had less than half the deaths playing as a Condition Elemenatlist than I did with a regular Warrior. The ability to do competitive damage at even more than an arms length away (that most melee classes are limited to) makes it exponentially more survivable. In fact, it's my most survivable class in WvW simply because it's capable of doing killing damage without being in melee range, while having access to every kitten out button. It's one of the most annoying classes to down as well, since it has guaranteed mobility.

Lets put it this way; Your deaths, kills, wins, loses mean nothing from one class to the next. Unless of course you are facing the EXACT same people each time. They cant be compared. Condi ele is the WORST condi build in the game. Bar MAYBE Revenant...That says you played REALLY bad people that refuse to use a single condition removal. Also you mention not being in melee, you running Condi staff or scepter? Good luck against ANYONE that is semi skilled.

The most annoying to down? Has no stealth, limited stun breaks, reasonable mobility (it needs it, it dies otherwise...) I would say it says more about your skill on other classes than it does on how good ele is, because there are MANY other builds that are as strong, if not stronger in terms of staying alive.

@Lyros.4673 said:Needless to say, the only reason I think it's not the most popular is because the class carries the veneer of being more difficult than it actually is. It's really not. You just have to be mildly proactive about attunements and you're already better than most other classes. Once you know what your skills do, all you have to do is tap two buttons and you're already 600-1200 range away from the kill zone. Or dropping heals and condi cleanses like candy. However, for that reason it is also one of the most popular.

No. I would say its down to needing to remember you attunements, all your skill cool downs and everything else. A good ele is good. A bad ele is dreadful. you make mistakes as an ele. You die.

@reikken.4961 said:for how good/bad it is, ele is used disproportionately more than other classes in pvp and pve

Citation needed.

@"Silmar Alech.4305" said:You find a player/profession breakdown in this statistics page from gw2efficiency: https://gw2efficiency.com/account/player-statisticsIt says nothing of game part, but I guess gw2efficiency attracts more the PvE-related players.

The statistics seem legit.

Though I didn't expected the blessed child to be the most played profession. Revenant being last is obvious though, since they've been release 3 years laters than the other professions.

@Dadnir.5038 said:

@"Silmar Alech.4305" said:You find a player/profession breakdown in this statistics page from gw2efficiency:

https://gw2efficiency.com/account/player-statistics

It says nothing of game part, but I guess gw2efficiency attracts more the PvE-related players.

Looking at those stats... poor Engineer :( The class needs more love.

Elementalist is hard to play well. I think it gets lots of people trying it out, but getting discouraged.

@ArmageddonAsh.6430 said:

@Lyros.4673 said:Hard to say without Anet giving statistics. But this class gives everything. Healing, damage, conditions, crowd control, and tons of survivability if you actually move and don't let enemies hit you. It's far and away one of the easiest classes in the game simply by the sheer amount of, not just utility, but everything it can give.

Also, you can do most of it at range.

@Lyros.4673 said:Let's put it this way; I had less than half the deaths playing as a Condition Elemenatlist than I did with a regular Warrior. The ability to do competitive damage at even more than an arms length away (that most melee classes are limited to) makes it exponentially more survivable. In fact, it's my most survivable class in WvW simply because it's capable of doing killing damage without being in melee range, while having access to every kitten out button. It's one of the most annoying classes to down as well, since it has guaranteed mobility.

@Lyros.4673 said:Needless to say, the only reason I think it's not the most popular is because the class carries the veneer of being more difficult than it actually is. It's really not. You just have to be mildly proactive about attunements and you're already better than most other classes. Once you know what your skills do, all you have to do is tap two buttons and you're already 600-1200 range away from the kill zone. Or dropping heals and condi cleanses like candy. However, for that reason it is also one of the most popular.

Really? I can't think of a class that at will, has access to as many heals, controls, and AOEs at the same time. Sure there's a ton of nuance of player interaction with those various skills but it has at any point, access to 25 skills at any given time with attunements and the hilarious 5 slot ability bar. There is no comparison to the 12-15 that most other classes have. That 1300 HP heal with a water attunement at 0 healing power is better than having access to only a single heal skill that most other classes have, not to mention that most heals are AOE centric and can provide an extra touch that might tip the scales in your favor. In WvW and PvP I'm pretty sure celestial tempests/elementalists are strongly effective for that reason because even if they don't excel at any particular thing, they have access to everything they need at any moment. Your crowd control skills are just a single attunement away without the need of speccing into them or trading off a weapon that needs it. The class already has so much base damage on fire skills you pretty much just need to use that for damage.

Regarding the "at range" comment: the dagger has more range than most melee weapons depending on the attunement that's used. That alone gives it immense flexibility. You never have to get within damaging range of most melee classes once you cause them to exhaust their mobility. Honestly your call outs on attempting to lessen whatever "skill factor" that went into my experiences make no difference. It'll be an endless circle of saying "but in this scenario this effect can be mitigated if X was skilled enough."

Sorry, but I hate to tell you that in my experience, people get silly and become easy to run around with Dagger's ~400 range in WvW. Not to mention that if you have a brain and a teammate or two, you can flank and catch people off guard nullifying their capabilities to engage a head on encounter. Rangers blow their physical damage invincibility while their condi clears are spent on my smaller earlier conditions before I unload the main conditions. And do it enough times, and people end up eating dirt. It's all attrition, and eventually someone breaks regardless of people "crying" about how X Build is better than Y build. The point is that these builds are good one way or another, but it all comes down to how you use it instead of the hypotheticals and spreadsheets people want to chalk the game up to. And elementalist has some great disengages, no matter what weapon you're using, barring Scepter/Focus maybe. Any real pursuer could catch up with me if they wanted to, but most people give up as soon as you drop back 1800 range, which isn't hard on an elementalist unless you're flying solo, which is far from ideal in any situation regarding PVP. Even then, you're going to have more fighting solo. Let's not forget that Elementalist does a fantastic combination of Power and condition damage at the same time. Maybe not as much as other classes when building conditions but the difference between a condi Zerker and a condi elementalist is quite honestly hilarious.

The only bad Elementalists are those that stand still and don't actually be proactive. That's the nuance of my statement you quoted. Anyone else who actually knows how to play the class, or even just attempts to make use of their abilities, even while fumbling, will be exponentially more effective and useful than the one guy who sits in the back of a zerg and mashes Staff Fire 1 for that no-effort AOE auto-attack at 1200 range. In min-max situations such as raids, there's no question in that Elementalist does have a more harrowing combination, but it's just memorization at that point in PVE. The key is that Elementalist has an incredibly dynamic set of skills that there is 0 comparison to other classes. You can play the Meta Elementalist DPS builds and still have more utility and sustain than any other class outside of hypothetical maximized scenarios. Other classes have to sacrifice everything else in order to attain their theoretical DPS. It is simultaneously the most capable, yet flexible class in the entire game. That's the point. You have options no matter what the scenario even if you don't have numbers that build up healing to be +5000000 HP in one millisecond.

Regarding staff and Eles getting wrecked. Yeah, no surprise there. It's a weapon meant to drop AOEs at range. You mean to tell me you don't swap weapons out of combat according to the scenario/situation? If you get caught in a zerg, all you have to do is swap to a staff and rain fire on enemies. Properly placed, two elementalists' AOES can break a moderate sized zerg, scenario depending. But as soon as you're done assisting a zerg and are back to roaming with your buddies after you pass by, you swap up to dagger/dagger or whatever other combination you have and charge right in.

I don't know why you're even bemoaning the situation, because frankly what I'm saying is that Elementalist is probably one of the best classes in the game and there's no point to make it harder than it actually looks. My only point of contention is that people think it's hard. Maybe I should put it more bluntly. It's not. As long as you actively make an effort to make use of everything Elementalist offers, even if you're clunky and slow at first, you're going to be exponentially more useful than most other builds to begin with. Once you know what skills you're comfortable with, you can easily make use of everything on your toolkit. Other classes do provide some level of competition against Elementalist, but unlike the other classes, Elementalist has to sacrifice the least in order to get the most of their effectiveness.

Tbh I feel like your entire post has been nitpicking at scenarios that Elementalist might suffer in. No class is perfect, but do we really want to argue that Elementalist doesn't have access to 25 skills at any given moment that can provide a wide array of abilities that you can use at any point to a degree of effectiveness if you have a brain and don't rely on a set build?

@Lyros.4673 said:

@ArmageddonAsh.6430 said:

@Lyros.4673 said:Hard to say without Anet giving statistics. But this class gives everything. Healing, damage, conditions, crowd control, and tons of survivability if you actually move and don't let enemies hit you. It's far and away one of the easiest classes in the game simply by the sheer amount of, not just utility, but everything it can give.

Also, you can do most of it at range.

@Lyros.4673 said:Let's put it this way; I had less than half the deaths playing as a Condition Elemenatlist than I did with a regular Warrior. The ability to do competitive damage at even more than an arms length away (that most melee classes are limited to) makes it exponentially more survivable. In fact, it's my most survivable class in WvW simply because it's capable of doing killing damage without being in melee range, while having access to every kitten out button. It's one of the most annoying classes to down as well, since it has guaranteed mobility.

@Lyros.4673 said:Needless to say, the only reason I think it's not the most popular is because the class carries the veneer of being more difficult than it actually is. It's really not. You just have to be mildly proactive about attunements and you're already better than most other classes. Once you know what your skills do, all you have to do is tap two buttons and you're already 600-1200 range away from the kill zone. Or dropping heals and condi cleanses like candy. However, for that reason it is also one of the most popular.

That’s why there is a ton of threads in forums complaining about how OP Elementalist is. You are literally the only one to think that Ele is op. Lmao.

Did come across some good ele(weavers) players, but only a few which I considered excellent (rampaging with their skills doing good damage). Then there's the other half, ele "users" and a number which no longer surprises me that have downed state as part of their "rotation".

@"Lyros.4673" said:Needless to say, the only reason I think it's not the most popular is because the class carries the veneer of being more difficult than it actually is.

It's not the most popular because it's not meta or as strong as you're making it out to be in any game modes except PvE raids. If you do PvP and WvW you'll notice that the most popular classes are always the "have-it-all's" like Spellbreaker, Chono/Mirage, and Druid (and Firebrand, Scourge, Holosmith before their recent nerfs) they are great at nearly everything: damage, sustain, mobility, support, etc. Just look at Necro and Engi, these classes were very unpopular not until the PoF elite specs were released, they suddenly got lots of love because of how strong/meta they are in PvP and WvW.

@MagicBoi.4160 said:Just look at Necro and Engi, these classes were very unpopular not until the PoF elite specs were releasedHaha lolwat?

Sure the engie was never all that popular even on scrappers but dc reaper was the condi meta that began the whole condi apocalypse in WvW. Scourge only carried on the legacy. Dc reaper was nerfed to the ground a week after PoF release, after only a mere 8 months or so of complaints that it ruined WvW.

@Imperadordf.2687 said:That’s why there is a ton of threads in forums complaining about how OP Elementalist is. You are literally the only one to think that Ele is op. Lmao.

Something tells me he lost to a ele running the mythical Fire/Air/Earth/Water/Tempest/Weaver. Ele really only has one build and requires staff. Ele is by FAR the lowest of people roaming. The part about ele being so easy to play gave me a chuckle. Staff and Scepter have single build options. You're not going to find many (if any...) trying to run Condi Scepter Dagger and Sword both weak for what they are - pure 100% melee with meh mid range options on a skill here and there.

I don't do pvp. but my experince in PvE is that it's underused, though that doesn't bother me cus as one of the hardest professions to use it means usually the ele is skilled....................usually.

@"schmots.6803" said:Elementalist is hard to play well. I think it gets lots of people trying it out, but getting discouraged.

The elementalist is the 3rd most played profession of the game, in hours, just behind guardian (the blessed child) and warrior. Numbers don't lie ;) .

Beside it's not "harder" to play elementalist than any other profession. The elementalist is one of the most flexible profession of the game and when you know what you do with it, it's extremly simple to perform well.

@"Dadnir.5038" said:The elementalist is the 3rd most played profession of the game, in hours, just behind guardian (the blessed child) and warrior. Numbers don't lie ;) .

Beside it's not "harder" to play elementalist than any other profession. The elementalist is one of the most flexible profession of the game and when you know what you do with it, it's extremly simple to perform well.

Hours played doesnt define skill. All the classes are easy to play, some are MUCH easier to play WELL and others are MUCH easier to play BADLY but still do well. It IS harder to play Ele WELL that is the difference, You can tell a good ele from a bad ele VERY easily, unlike Warrior for example where a BAD warrior can hide behind the class. A bad ele cant hide. A bad ele is an easy, easy kill (WvW, PvP) the same cant be said for all classes though.

@ArmageddonAsh.6430 said:

@"Dadnir.5038" said:The elementalist is the 3rd most played profession of the game, in hours, just behind guardian (the blessed child) and warrior. Numbers don't lie ;) .

Beside it's not "harder" to play elementalist than any other profession. The elementalist is one of the most flexible profession of the game and when you know what you do with it, it's extremly simple to perform well.

And I never talked about skill. The thread ask about whether or not the elementalist is used. Fact is that the elementalist is the 3rd most used played pofession in the game.

Now, it is not "harder" to play elementalist, elementalist have plenty of active defense, passive defense and sustain that you have to use to survive, yes. But despite it's access to all this the elementalist also have access to plenty of damage skills. What's awesome with the profession is that most weapon kit grant both offense and defense. Now, sure, if players focus on theirs offensive skills and forget to use their defense and sustain skills, they might have a hard time surviving, but that's all. And warrior or all other profession curiously suffer the same fate if they forget to use their active defense.

Any "bad" something is easy to kill and the same way, any "good" something is hard to kill. Being bad at playing a profession doesn't mean that the profession is hard to play or less forgiving, it just mean that the player lack practice. Thinking that the elementalist is least played because it's "harder" to play is in itself wrong.

The elementalist is played and have been in a very good place in PvE since release. The elementalist is played in WvW and if he seem a bit down these day, he still is a good choice for roaming and/or zerg fight. The elementalist have been a key figure in PvP until PoF. Yes PvP player don't like to use the elementalist with a support build, still it was a thing. Was it hard to play tempest support? Nope, not at all. Did it changed nowaday? Nope the gameplay is still the same except that the counters are less forgiving nowaday. Is weaver hard to play? Nope, it just ask you a different mental routine.

Just cut the cries. There are fights that are harder to play as warrior than as ele, like there are fight that are easier as warrior than as elementalist. The game is designed like this. If you think that another professions is easier to play, just play it, maybe it's more suited for you, instead of forcing you to play something that you find "hard" to play. Except maybe if that make you feel proud of yourself to think that it's harder to play. It's okay, if you want to fool yourself, but just don't fool other by spreading this nonsense that some professions are harder to play than others. They are all the same, you know your skills and when you have to use them or you don't, nothing is hard in doing this.

@Dadnir.5038 said:

@ArmageddonAsh.6430 said:

@Dadnir.5038 said:The elementalist is the 3rd most played profession of the game, in hours, just behind guardian (the blessed child) and warrior. Numbers don't lie ;) .

Beside it's not "harder" to play elementalist than any other profession. The elementalist is one of the most flexible profession of the game and when you know what you do with it, it's extremly simple to perform well.

The issue with ele has never been pve, its pvp, and i think if you looked at it purely from a pvp point of view you would have a VERY different story. This is because ele has a fundamental flaw - low health and armor, and specs that require bruiser play, but without the damage to compensate, its pretty well known. with EQUALLY skilled players in 1v1 combat, the ele player is disadvantaged with his profession, because they have to spread stats across defense, offense, condy removal and constant healing to be able to sustain against an equally skilled player AND to compensate for weak base stats and lack of disengagement ability.

@Lyros.4673 said:

@ArmageddonAsh.6430 said:

@Lyros.4673 said:Hard to say without Anet giving statistics. But this class gives everything. Healing, damage, conditions, crowd control, and tons of survivability if you actually move and don't let enemies hit you. It's far and away one of the easiest classes in the game simply by the sheer amount of, not just utility, but everything it can give.

Also, you can do most of it at range.

@Lyros.4673 said:Let's put it this way; I had less than half the deaths playing as a Condition Elemenatlist than I did with a regular Warrior. The ability to do competitive damage at even more than an arms length away (that most melee classes are limited to) makes it exponentially more survivable. In fact, it's my most survivable class in WvW simply because it's capable of doing killing damage without being in melee range, while having access to every kitten out button. It's one of the most annoying classes to down as well, since it has guaranteed mobility.

@Lyros.4673 said:Needless to say, the only reason I think it's not the most popular is because the class carries the veneer of being more difficult than it actually is. It's really not. You just have to be mildly proactive about attunements and you're already better than most other classes. Once you know what your skills do, all you have to do is tap two buttons and you're already 600-1200 range away from the kill zone. Or dropping heals and condi cleanses like candy. However, for that reason it is also one of the most popular.

This. This so much. Post of the year. Too early? IDC but someone finally touched on everything about ELEMENTALIST with proper respect to PvE/PvP. Now if we could maybe get them nerfed to a reasonable DPS since competeing with them DPS wise is really silly. Especially outside of raids.

Ele is severely underused, due to its complexity of play and its rather clunky mechanics courtesy of weaver. It’s a great class but it requires several of the current S tier specs to be nerfed for it to actually show what its true potential. I have a free character slot reserved for when Ele in any or all of its forms is ready to shine once again.P.S. It’s an extremely fun class to play, coming from a non Ele main.

@vesica tempestas.1563 said:

@Dadnir.5038 said:

@ArmageddonAsh.6430 said:

@Dadnir.5038 said:The elementalist is the 3rd most played profession of the game, in hours, just behind guardian (the blessed child) and warrior. Numbers don't lie ;) .

Beside it's not "harder" to play elementalist than any other profession. The elementalist is one of the most flexible profession of the game and when you know what you do with it, it's extremly simple to perform well.

And I'm pretty sure that if you look objectively at PvP you'd know that the elementalist is a beast in this game mode as long as you use it with a defensive/support build. An equally skilled player that face a defensive elementalist will never be able to kill this elementalist unless it's build specifically counter the elementalist's build.

What elementalist players in PvP hope to have is a fonctionnal DPS build that is pretty forgiving. I understand this will and I hope that one day it will be possible but, fact is that the elementalist is not "difficult" to play and if you build defensively, you can just laugh at equally "skilled" players. Even weaver is a beast when built defensively. PvP match are not only for glass canon, in fact PvP match also rely on your ability to keep points, not being content about the fact that an elementalist can do this in a 1v2 or 1v3 setting just because most elementalist players would want to be able to decap and nothing else, is a totally different thing.

It's important to know the limit of one's profession but it's also important to take into account it's strength. The elementalist is the easiest profession to build to an "extrem". You can be extremly glassy and deal tons of damage or extremly tanky and deal few damages. In PvP it just happen that you need to be tanky because the pro of being tanky overwhelm the pro of being glassy for the elementalist in this game mode.

@Arlette.9684 said:Ele is severely underused, due to its complexity of play and its rather clunky mechanics courtesy of weaver. It’s a great class but it requires several of the current S tier specs to be nerfed for it to actually show what its true potential. I have a free character slot reserved for when Ele in any or all of its forms is ready to shine once again.P.S. It’s an extremely fun class to play, coming from a non Ele main.

You must be talking about PvP right there, but according to GW2Efficiency stats Elementalist is the 2nd most created and 3rd most played class.

@Dadnir.5038 said:

@vesica tempestas.1563 said:

@Dadnir.5038 said:

@ArmageddonAsh.6430 said:

@Dadnir.5038 said:The elementalist is the 3rd most played profession of the game, in hours, just behind guardian (the blessed child) and warrior. Numbers don't lie ;) .

Beside it's not "harder" to play elementalist than any other profession. The elementalist is one of the most flexible profession of the game and when you know what you do with it, it's extremly simple to perform well.

well first of all, eles do not 'hope to have is a functional DPS build that is pretty forgiving' just like every other player including yourself i'm sure, what eles players actually want is the satisfying complexity of the ele skills set +COMPETITIVENESS. None of the current builds are competitive appart from the weak FA builds that rely in a burst gimmick. Playing defensively does not win pvp, never has and never will because it does not advance the team position. being a punchbag with no teeth is as dull as it sounds ultimately.