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5 man queue season 11 trial


Crab Fear.1624

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Dear Anet,

I may have missed the post season poll about whether or not to keep solo/duo queue only.

If I did not that would mean that I and others are still waiting to see that poll.

How about you do a trial of 5-man queue for season 11?

(Fellow players)

choose yes or no. maybe is pretty much a yes.

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5 man is only desired by an extremely vocal minority. But the truth is the only real reason to have 5 man ranked is largely so you can be carried and pubstomp randos. Of course, the 5 man crowd will never admit this so instead they have to perform mental gymnastics and conjure up psuedointellectual excuses about how the lack of 5 man is somehow killing the game despite the fact that 99.999% of the GW2 population could care less.

Here is the truth: We already have 5 man.

  1. You can already do 5 man in unranked
  2. We already have 5 man automated tournaments
  3. We already have 5 man custom arenas for scrims

So the actual gameplay of 5 man is absolutely not missing from the game at all. Right now, if you want, you can hop on discord with your friends and setup a scrim. There is no lack of 5 man in GW2. The only thing that doesn't exist is a version of 5 man that can carry your ranking - and THAT's what most people don't care for, because it's absolutely unnecessary. 5 man ironically ends up decreasing the value of rank because it brings with it the possibility that an average player simply got carried.

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I don't get that people still bring the thoroughly debunked pub stomping argument up about 5 man queues even tough A-net offically confirmed that the winrate of 5 mans in ranked was lower cause they actually fight stronger solo players.

once again automated tournaments is not an option. It's just going to be a farmfest amongst a few pro's stomping the shit out of everybody. Heck even top 100 plat players can't do shit generally speaking. And 5 man automated tournaments is only at specific times.

Unranked is a complete random queu. and offers no incentive for teams to grow. no prestige, no ranking nothing. I do however agree that 5 man ques on a leaderboard give a skewed understanding of one's actual skill level cause playing with 5 man and a mic vs solos is an big advantage. Honestly at this point I'm for an entirely new game mode that is 5 man queue only. if the game mode is appealing enough we might actually get 5 mans or some shit like that.

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I remember back when people complained endlessly about getting stomped by 5 man queues.

A few things:1) people can still matchfix with 5 man queues2) the same people who win ATs every day will play ranked together and will probably have a 95%+ win rate3) 5 man queue will probably increase boosting

Tldr you won't have more fun

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I voted Yes but maybe could be better. We need more game modes tuned to the number of people playing together. Mixing pemade (any from 2-5) with solo will always result in some kind of inability to measure MMR. We basically need to pair teams with same numbers. Which leads to 2:2, 3:3, 4:4 and 5:5 game modes.

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No, no, no, no, and still no. Pretty much every player from top 100 could just get a grp with a half decent setup from his fl and shit on the whole ladder once he feels like it, even without discord/TS. Organized teams have a completely different (superior) combat dynamic than random pugs, and teamplay, rotations, splits etc mean A LOT in this game.

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@"Kheldorn.5123" said:

@Ioras Dagnir.3927 said:look at all those evil people who don't want people play to in ranked with their friends, shame on you.

I think you confused friendship with farming pugs.

this has been disproven multiple times with anets own statistics. Please come up with a new argument to regurgitate for the next 6 months, this one is old and dead.

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@Ioras Dagnir.3927 said:

@"Kheldorn.5123" said:

@Ioras Dagnir.3927 said:look at all those evil people who don't want people play to in ranked with their friends, shame on you.

I think you confused friendship with farming pugs.

this has been disproven multiple times with anets own statistics. Please come up with a new argument to regurgitate for the next 6 months, this one is old and dead.

5 man queue fanclub haven't provided anything new to this discussion aswell. Reasons for removing team queues is the same as they were 2 years ago. It feels like now it's even more accurate as pvp crowd isn't big enough to justify splitting players.

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@"Kheldorn.5123" I think we've done a lot more to argue how much healthier teamQ is for the community as a whole then those who stubbornly just want to avoid premades simply because it might endanger their rank. Queue times were not the reason we were voted out and we all know it, it was the fallacy of farming pugs. Which was coincidentally your first go to when quoting my comment. Like even this poll is only asking for a trial to see if we can bring new life into the game mode but you'd rather not try it not even just to see if it works? Says to me you care more about your ego than the game or the community.

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I don't get the friends argument. Just play Unranked or ATs. All my friends enjoy unranked in 5-mans

Think of Ranked as a job. What's the difference between Ranked and Unranked? Does that difference support 5 man? No.

It works in games like Overwatch because those games are tremendous. Meta events in PVE work because there are people to play with. Thing is you can't nerf players unlike nerfing meta events so the only option is to leave them out.

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Bring back duoq. Absolutely not 5 man, for arguments that were repeated enough and those who won’t listen will still not listen.

Smh for all dem plebs who want to get carried in rank via teams, most of the time probably going to win simply by a superior composition alone.

If you actually are willing to listen to arguments, watch this, from when solo/duo was first offered and the ingame systems were 5 man:

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@"BeLZedaR.4790"

Do you have any idea how much is wrong with quoting this? Again, it's an example of ideas & theory craft on a subject BEFORE seeing the aftermath of something actually happening. Posting this is about as effective as posting some Britain praising quote from George Washington in his early 20s and then trying to convince us all that he supported the crown. Why do you think all of the players like Helseth left to begin with? It wasn't just because Guild Wars 2 left the ESL. Many of them stuck around for awhile but when it went solo/duo only, 3/4ths of them split. When it went solo only above 1600, they all left. All of them.

I'll guarantee you that if players like Helseth where still around, they would vouch for bringing back 5 man ques after seeing the aftermath of what happened, because they are intelligent and observative.

For those who want to read well defined points on this topic, don't forget about this thread -> https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/31128/bring-back-5-man-ranked-que-needs-to-happen-at-this-point-solo-duo-failed/p1

Oh and if we want to use old pro player quotes as swords for this argument, how about we get some recent up to date opinions from them? Let's try that, let's see how that turns out.

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@Master Ketsu.4569 said:5 man is only desired by an extremely vocal minority. But the truth is the only real reason to have 5 man ranked is largely so you can be carried and pubstomp randos. Of course, the 5 man crowd will never admit this so instead they have to perform mental gymnastics and conjure up psuedointellectual excuses about how the lack of 5 man is somehow killing the game despite the fact that 99.999% of the GW2 population could care less.

Here is the truth: We already have 5 man.

  1. You can already do 5 man in unranked
  2. We already have 5 man automated tournaments
  3. We already have 5 man custom arenas for scrims

So the actual gameplay of 5 man is absolutely not missing from the game at all. Right now, if you want, you can hop on discord with your friends and setup a scrim. There is no lack of 5 man in GW2. The only thing that doesn't exist is a version of 5 man that can carry your ranking - and THAT's what most people don't care for, because it's absolutely unnecessary. 5 man ironically ends up decreasing the value of rank because it brings with it the possibility that an average player simply got carried.

I think 43% yes and 50% no is not extreme minority and that such large frequent argued topic is not 99% of people not caring.

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Lol Trevor back again with this 5 man non issue. We have already been through this 5 man queue debate. I wasted my time telling you everything that happened. @BeLZedaR.4790 actually found the video of one of the best players in Gw2 history talking at length against the idea. Many many threads have been created about this topic already resulting in 70% of the community choosing to remove 5 man queues . Yet you still think your opinion matters more than 70% of pvp community including the top players.

Would be nice if we just get a mod to lock anymore threads like this but free speech i guess.

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@Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

@"BeLZedaR.4790" said:Bring back duoq. Absolutely not 5 man, for arguments that were repeated enough and those who won’t listen will still not listen.

Smh for all dem plebs who want to get carried in rank via teams, most of the time probably going to win simply by a superior composition alone.

If you actually are willing to listen to arguments, watch this, from when solo/duo was first offered and the ingame systems were 5 man:

Do you have any idea how much is wrong with quoting this? Again, it's an example of ideas & theory craft on a subject BEFORE seeing the aftermath of something actually happening. Posting this is about as effective as posting some Britain praising quote from George Washington in his early 20s and then trying to convince us all that he supported the crown. Why do you think all of the players like Helseth left to begin with? It wasn't just because Guild Wars 2 left the ESL. Many of them stuck around for awhile but when it went solo/duo only, 3/4ths of them split. When it went solo only above 1600, they all left. All of them.

I'll guarantee you that if players like Helseth where still around, they would vouch for bringing back 5 man ques after seeing the aftermath of what happened, because they are intelligent and observative.

For those who want to read well defined points on this topic, don't forget about this thread ->

Oh and if we want to use old pro player quotes as swords for this argument, how about we get some recent up to date opinions from them? Let's try that, let's see how that turns out.

Hell, you're not one of those that are willing to listen to arguments anyway, so why am I bothering. But since I already did:

Well all points against it in this vid are still valid,and are to illustrate what it looked like with 5 man taking place. Obviously you're biased as fuck since you're exactly one of those people thinking they'll be God of PvP when they can farm pugs with a team. You will be top 100 atleast when that happens due to lack of teams, and teams being OP, I'll give you that, and you know it.

Again, people failing to understand the circumstances that led to the leaving of pro players.Anet was holding them tight by the balls with 0 information as to when the next tournament is going to be ever since HoT where it killed the scene with bunker meta.If you were a pro at that time, you had a really hard time to stay committed to it instead of getting a normal job, knowing the next tournament might be never.Not even going to mention all the ddos that was going on by certain people, for when those tournaments eventually happened.Then when the ESL scene was officially over ofc many of them just left out of the frustration with arenanet's behaviour on this topic.

This has been repeated during the league seasons with no action on the wintraders and hackers, people not knowing when are they going to be able to legit compete again (Not as serious of stakes obviously, but it is what it is).

Obviously I agree as I mentioned that 1600+ soloq was imo a mistake. DuoQ is acceptable and still allows for people to make at least top100 solo. Even though duoq is still an advantage, and I'd give solo players extra rating and lose less (very slightly) to balance it out.

Players like helseth wouldn't vouch for 5 man for the exact reasons in the video, that it lowers the prestige of the leaderboards massively and it puts a barrier in front of players seeking to become competitive and find a team. (How will you prove that you're good so that a team takes you, if you need to have a team to prove that you're good?)

I've never heard any pro apart from those who already 5-manned during the time of the video (Car crashed, etc.) saying that 5 man should return.

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