The censoring

The censoring on these forums are absolutely ridiculous. Even if it isn’t something to another poster there’s a pretty high chance either nobody will comment and it will be a dead thread or you will get an infraction and the post removed.

The reddit threads see more dev posts than these forums and the moderation doesn’t seem to censor every non-praising thread or the slightest even remotely negative comment towards someone else.

I see far worse posts on these forums than the things I have been warned about so it must just be me which is a shame because I’m a very loyal customer that just happens to have a multitude of opinions.

HERE! HERE! GOOD SIR!

negative comment towards someone elseThen don’t make negative comments towards someone else. Restrict your comments towards the argument.

There are many non praising threads that don’t get censored. However threads about forum moderation will get censored, just like they will on any game’s forum.

Only time I ever had something I posted removed I kinda deserved it.

Posts that are rude towards or attack another member, single out another player for ridicule or that accuse someone of inappropriate behavior will be removed.

It’s clear enough there. All posts and comments should be directed towards the logic of the argument. Sarcastic remarks towards the other person, commenting about him, repeating his words in a way that shows you’re mocking him. None of these things are about the logic of his argument and the moderator will infract.

I’ve gotten plenty of infractions and each time I did it was for being sarcastic or rude (or for being off topic). If you post in irritation then you’re likely to say what you shouldn’t. Write it down, save the draft then go away for a while and reread your post. Is it sarcastic? Did you say something about the other person. If you did, then rewrite it. There’s no reason to post in haste when you know your emotions are engaged. You can wait a few minutes until you’ve had time to reconsider.

@"cptaylor.2670" said:The censoring on these forums are absolutely ridiculous. Even if it isn’t something to another poster there’s a pretty high chance either nobody will comment and it will be a dead thread or you will get an infraction and the post removed.

The reddit threads see more dev posts than these forums and the moderation doesn’t seem to censor every non-praising thread or the slightest even remotely negative comment towards someone else.

I see far worse posts on these forums than the things I have been warned about so it must just be me which is a shame because I’m a very loyal customer that just happens to have a multitude of opinions.

There's a good reason why Anet has to send all of their developers and employees over to Reddit to interact with the playerbase (And can't manage to keep any of that traffic on their own boards). Its embarrassing really.

Frick and Frack (4372, and 5907) seem to get a real surge of self-importance out of harrassing people with endless and meaningless infractions.

Once I got one for creating a post during the path of fire threads asking devs how they get about the classes. It wasn’t even a negative complaint thread about the classes as much it was asking what they learned from the demo period to get a feel for possible changes. I wasn’t really expecting a response but I sure as hell wasnt expecting a random infraction for “distracting” by addressing very broadly devs about their own game on their own forum.

I’m generally pretty reserved with my remarks on here even if there is a hint of sarcasm in what I say. But I guess favoritism goes a long way on these forums.

World of Warcraft forums were a cesspool and even they didn’t have the kind of moderation seen on these forums. And got more responses too.

I imagine this thread will be closed and deleted soon as well as my posting privellages but it’s nice to see that I’m not the only one who has this sentiment.

What I have observers: it appears as the comments do not get moderator attention unless reported.

Given this, I believe they err on the conservative side. In two cases (out of 5 for me) when I sent an email as a 'protest', the infractions were overturned. The other three weren't really something I cared to argue over.

If you feel it's overkill, appeal them. If you don't want to take the time to appeal, then it doesn't bother you enough.

Lastly, I do not believe the moderators are developers. That being said, in the two that were appealed, @McKenna Berdrow.2759 was involved in the review and overturned them.

My impression of the mods here are they are little better than a call center person who reads from a script but has no deductive ability. Doesn't make them a bad person, but being a good person doesn't mean you're good at your job.

Re sarcasm: I have been plenty sarcastic here. I've been infracted once, and deserved that. Sarcasm is not an excuse for rudeness.

I really encourage you to talk about your concerns via email. Gaile is really helpful and explains a lot about moderators' actions and rules. Also, if you are right about unjustified infraction, I guarantee you Gaile is going to help you. I've been there.

Personally, I find that the way things are more than fair on these forums.

Mostly because infractions expire quickly.

I really appreciate such a policy. I'm still perma-banned as a Founder on the official Warframe forums because I made, like, 3 "bad posts" of a total of over 15.000 spanning many, maaany years of being active on their forums. The infractions over there are are permanent so you're kinda inevitably gonna end up getting banned. if you keep using the forum. Ugh.

Anet's moderating policy might seem a bit harsh (kitten to all those "non-constructive" warnings, LOL) but aside from the initial shock of the notifcation warning you, unless you continue breaking the rules within the same time-span you are highly unlikely to get permanently punished.

They have this policy where they're not allowed to edit posts, so if you quote someone, they'll delete your entire post if the quote is. It's pretty funny, since I've had it happen in the support forums a few times over the years when answering multiple people's problems at once.

Zedek.8932 said:This nothing was 1 infraction point. Great, isn't it?

Just because there's nothing there doesn't meant it was nothing. They could have simply forgot to quote it. Maybe it was your post on March 7th in how many accounts?

I sometimes have issues with the forums, both how its managed ( I still cant get over the old one being deleted, I come across posts all the time when searching for stuff from vanilla, that I can no longer read) and some of the people ( those who take it upon themselves to 'teach' those who are on a downer about some aspect of the game)

However Reddit can also be terrible for different reasons - when I ask for help in the forums I ALWAYS get help, Reddit though?, I signed up specifically about 18 months ago to ask about hero point runs in a run thread, I didn't understand how to pm the person in game because there was no game ID given, in the space of 2 hours all my queries were downvoted to around -15 each. I see that sort of attitude there all the time.

Pretty much what Gaile said. I've learned, long ago, not to engage with anyone obviously stewing for a fight. If needed, report and move on without a response. A lack of response usually kills any further drama. Responses to drama usually breeds more.

We use the forums to discuss topics germane to the game . . . not to discuss each other.

I make a "spoof post" where I used no curse words to invoke the filter or directed any negative comments at anyone, but typed in "kitten" and -- what should have also been the bald-faced and blatant give-away -- also typed in "puppy", "duckling", "piglet", "lamb", and "calf" as modifiers in sentences, alternating their use.I got an infraction, three whole points...The moderators here need to look at what happened with LoTRO -- a much better game at the time than GW2 has ever been -- when its forum moderation crew crossed the line into utter and extreme arrogance. The MMORPG was taking heat after its second expansion, only about half the size of the first (Moria), didn't meet players' expectations. A couple of moderators used phony accounts to complement their own, answering their own comments in the forums and writing long diatribes countering all players' criticisms -- very obviously the same individuals posting, given the language used and style of writing, not very well disguised -- and the environment got SO BAD that one female moderator whom we all adored quit, only to speak up later. Lots of players started quitting left and right and they cited that the forum moderation was one reason they quit.If the GW2 forum moderators want to be the cause of players leaving, then in their arrogance they need to consider that they're cutting their own throats... once too many players leave and the game is no longer economical to operate, It will be shut down and they'll be out of a job.So, kitten puppy duckling piglet lamb calf that. And, yes, I typed that in; I didn't use any curse words at all. So there...

The moderator team of this forum is probably the worse I've ever seen, if not the worst.Oh wait, now I will get an infraction for having an opinion! Ohhh wait again, somehow this is an insult, rude comment or worse!!!! infraction incoming for having an opinion! WAY to go MODs! :blush: :blush:

Everyone has a right to their own opinion.

You dont have a right to go onto someone else's property and express it in a manner inconsistent with the property owner's rules.

@"Gaile Gray.6029" said:Why should they remain? Why should anyone make a negative comment towards someone else? Explain to me what name-calling and insulting adds to the point of the forum, which is talking about the game.

The tl;dr version is that if you keep playing with kid gloves, then the kid never grows up. The long version...

After walking this Earth for decades, I have come to the unfortunate conclusion that debate is useless. The reason for this is simple: it is rare for somebody to come to a wrong idea due to a lack of information, while also being willing to defend this idea adamantly. Usually, if somebody has a lack of information, they can see this deficiency and either seek more info, or bow out of discussions on the matter due to a lack of confidence behind their words. Even if they are so bold as to step forward and make a claim, a "debate" usually doesn't last longer than a few exchanges, because any reasonable person is capable of seeing their lack of knowledge on the issue.

Then what causes all of these debates, you ask? Well, the answer is as simple as it is unfortunate: character flaw. They are unreasonable. Or as I like to say: I've never been in a protracted debate with somebody smarter than I am. Whether you want to quote God and say that mankind is sinful and has flawed reasoning, or Michael Shermer when he says that debate exists only to posture and establish dominance, the end conclusion is the same: people don't argue to uncover truth. People argue to fulfill a goal, created by the sum of their emotional baggage, personal deficiencies, and chips on their shoulder.

Originally I had the strength to carry on endlessly, . But, with my pain growing and my health failing, I don't have the energy anymore to throw my wit down a bottomless pit. Any time I end up in verbal fisticuffs with somebody, after 2 exchanges I can see whether or not they're listening. Almost every time, they aren't listening. Instead, what is really going on is they have some sort of personal problem. They take issue with something I've said because it rubs their sore spots the wrong way, and they respond by engaging in an elaborate e-tantrum for an indefinite amount of time. In this time, they will commit all sorts of slights, dis-respects, manipulations, and lies, because their goal is not intellectual honesty or intellectual dignity. Their goal is to make other people act how they want, or feel bad for not doing so, and once they've said something their pride will never let them submit.

Trying to stick to "the issues" does nothing to solve their issues. At a certain point (roughly 2 exchanges), the debate clearly stops being about the trivial game-related front, and becomes about what each other person is doing. Arguing itself is an action, taken against another person. If I am to tackle the issue directly and make actual progress, I am going to have to confront their actions and their motives. Doing so, however, will say a litany of negative things about these people, because it is these negative things that are the real problem to begin with.

Harshness has a place. It is ultimately good for someone to have their sins called out, and their person to be meaningfully criticized. People learn from negative reinforcement, or at the very least they learn from aversion. If someone has their actions, motives, and honesty brought under scrutiny, they can reflect and learn from their mistakes, either to improve upon themselves or simply learn that their antics are not welcome anywhere in the grand width of the human community. Dancing around the problem with thousands of soft words has nary the impact of a truthful insult. It is a part of the journey to self-actualizing to learn that oneself is not only imperfect, but capable of grand evils at the slightest of causes. But somebody isn't going to learn this lesson, unless you take off the kid gloves.

I've had several over the years, but nothing really major. Most were due to misunderstandings due to my inimitable forum posting style, and mostly I've felt I was treated fairly. The funniest one was on the old forums. Someone had posted a thread titled 'Warriors!' and my post was "Come out and pla-ay." I think I just got a warning, I don't remember. But it was totally worth and I'd do it again! Uh. Ahem. Another kinda funny and more recent one was in a thread about the mount thing a while back, when I posted a picture of Master Blaster from the Mad Max movies -- it put me in mind of an asura riding a norn -- and really, what better mount is there for an asura? -- that had the word EMBARGO! on it. Which is what I planned to do in response to the mount thing. That is, not buy any gems for a while. I don't think that one was a full on infraction either, but I protested it anyway, because they said it was 'derailing' the thread and I felt it was so on the rails as to be the forum post equivalent of the Orange Blossom Special.

Overall, though, not displeased.

Their forum their rules. > @Blood Red Arachnid.2493 said:

@"Gaile Gray.6029" said:Why should they remain? Why should anyone make a negative comment towards someone else? Explain to me what name-calling and insulting adds

to the point of the forum, which is talking about

the game.

Really? It's been my experience with internet discussions that they are over before they begin once one of the parties starts to get insulting. In many discussions I have never once seen a person change their mind when they were "called out" An adult discussion has occasionally ended in a change of heart by one of the parties but not the ones you describe. Trying to teach strangers lessons, or get them to be more introspective online won't work, it didn't work before the internet and it certainly doesn't work with the anonymity of the internet now.

Now trying to teach people like you describe anything is a waste of time and energy.

I believe George Carlin said it best “Never argue with an idiot. They will only bring you down to their level and beat you with experience.”

I agree that the forum moderation is very strict. I argued with them over several infractions on the old forum. I won on a couple and lost the rest but I feel I’ve learned a lot about how to argue from posting here. Refraining from my normally rather sarcastic and caustic responses to make posts that are more objective is a constant struggle and a type of self education that I feel is worthwhile. Of course when I get an infraction the first thing I feel is definitely not gratitude but after I cool off I can see where I broke the rules.

The moderators squashing even mild insults is one of the reasons why this forum is able to discuss topics that people feel strongly about without the discussion getting sidetracked on personalities or getting sidetracked with off topic posts (another one of my more frequent infractions). You can read other forums with poor moderation and you see how fast they descend to ‘Ur mom’ ‘ No, Ur mom’ posts with nothing productive being said.

So as they say, if the mods give you some lemons then make lemonade by actually considering what they’re telling you and and learn how to argue a point constructively without ad hominem attacks, which is something you can use in the other parts of your life.