Spite Towards Support?

TL;DR-- I like playing a outgoing "healer" in sPvP and being a team player but it's getting increasingly more difficult when Anet keeps taking away my healing stuff, while making it so much easier to do damage and it's making me kinda ANGERY

A little bit of my PvP background; Started playing GW2 at launch and jumped on the arena PvP scene back when Cele Eles we're near unkillable, Cele engineers we're just as much of a pain (gosh darn crowbar) and pro S/D Thieves were scary and could dodge almost everything you threw at them and "Nothing Personnel, Kid" you into the ground if you didn't have your mess together. So, basically vanilla..

Mid fights/1v1s lasted a little longer, and you had to worry more about bunkers than getting one shot. HoT comes out and you either get one shot over 9000 condis just by looking at a necro or warrior. (Quick Rant; it mad me so made that a warrior could run pure condi runes and amulet, but be almost as tanky as.. a tank spec) PoF comes out and it's like the power meta is returning--

ANYWAY, regardless of the Meta from before to now, I usually ran Support builds and perhaps builds TOO altruistic for their own good (God I miss Sigil of benevolence and transference in PvP), but it personally felt more 'fun' to me to help my team, take their condis, heal and go for resses in the heat of battle when people weren't really willing to run Support. But now it feels HELLA less viable, rewarding or fun for me to play that type of support. Either;1) People either get floodded with condis past the point of no return.2) Applying boons is like a double edged sword with corruption and boon stripping being easier to do.3) OR people get 1 shot before I can do anything.

Regardless of what class is doing this, I feel like they just have nerfed some of the viability and supportive capabilities in unranked/ranked PvP while progressively amping up the damage, conditions output and boon removing..

I guess one person could easily argue that Guild Wars 2 (EVEN MORE SO PvP ) isn't a place for pure healers, so I should stop trying to spec as one, but I mean it's the only bit of fun I have.. and with the current status of everything it's getting harder to enjoy it.

@"Rouien.5234" said:TL;DR-- I like playing a outgoing "healer" in sPvP and being a team player but it's getting increasingly more difficult when Anet keeps taking away my healing stuff, while making it so much easier to do damage and it's making me kinda ANGERY

A little bit of my PvP background; Started playing GW2 at launch and jumped on the arena PvP scene back when Cele Eles we're near unkillable, Cele engineers we're just as much of a pain (gosh darn crowbar) and pro S/D Thieves were scary and could dodge almost everything you threw at them and "Nothing Personnel, Kid" you into the ground if you didn't have your mess together. So, basically vanilla..

Mid fights/1v1s lasted a little longer, and you had to worry more about bunkers than getting one shot. HoT comes out and you either get one shot over 9000 condis just by looking at a necro or warrior. (Quick Rant; it mad me so made that a warrior could run pure condi runes and amulet, but be almost as tanky as.. a tank spec) PoF comes out and it's like the power meta is returning--

ANYWAY, regardless of the Meta from before to now, I usually ran Support builds and perhaps builds TOO altruistic for their own good (God I miss Sigil of benevolence and transference in PvP), but it personally felt more 'fun' to me to help my team, take their condis, heal and go for resses in the heat of battle when people weren't really willing to run Support. But now it feels HELLA less viable, rewarding or fun for me to play that type of support. Either;1) People either get floodded with condis past the point of no return.2) Applying boons is like a double edged sword with corruption and boon stripping being easier to do.3) OR people get 1 shot before I can do anything.

Regardless of what class is doing this, I feel like they just have nerfed some of the viability and supportive capabilities in unranked/ranked PvP while progressively amping up the damage, conditions output and boon removing..

I guess one person could easily argue that Guild Wars 2 (EVEN MORE SO PvP ) isn't a place for pure healers, so I should stop trying to spec as one, but I mean it's the only bit of fun I have.. and with the current status of everything it's getting harder to enjoy it.

The problem is (and always will be in my opinion) that CONQUEST ONLY design choice anet made 5 years ago. It's such a bad decision, I can't fully comprehend how they still haven't fixed it. But it really does not encourage different builds or gameplay. High mobility, high damage classes will always do well. And high support, bunker classes will always get neutered because they are too good at standing there stalling fights.

In a mode that is designed around holding a spot by standing in circles, it's incredibly hard to balance pure support builds. It's not very fun to play against. If you are effective enough to support your team, you can probably bunker well too (which is also more difficult to balance because most "support" abilities are AoEs and not-targetable heals). On the other hand, they created the entire Scourge spec as if they forgot their own gamemodes, so I don't know.

The real problem is the game started with no support, then got it, then took it away..then gave it back, then took it away. Sorry sometime tropes are legit, time to introduce a real monk

The real problem is that Guild Wars 2 has a fundamental issue where if you increase your healing, you by definition increase your tankiness. In most games, the healers can be quite squishy and are often the target you prioritize the most. It's almost weird to think about, but other games like this it's the healer you almost always target first, not the damage. But Firebrand, Tempest, and Druid are incredibly resilient builds just because of how healing power increases their own capacity to survive and tank.

The end result is you design amulets like Magi's for support builds, which unfortunately allows Druids to run these super sustainy builds that let's them easy just goof on two players for the duration of a match.

What I'd really like to see is a Magi's equivalent except with Benevolence instead of Healing Power. Allow for powerful support without making them also the most resilient things in the game and see where things go from there.

The most fun I had with my healer build to-date was when scourge and Mesmer condi was at it's worst. I was using a support guardian at the time and running "Save Yourselves". I forgot that skill pulls in EVERYTHING.

I remember at on point I had 61 stacks of confusion, 50 stacks of torment and who knows what else. I would immediately go downed state and the other condis would finish me off.

But, I wish they would go ahead and just support the supports!! I've been 'spec'ing 'healer', taking people's condis and sprinkling green numbers on since day 1 of my PvP experience. I've tried out other classes and other builds but that's what feels more comfortable and fun to me and keeps me coming back.

Don't take this from me anet pls i just want to heal people and get yelled at for not using meta battle and doing damage

@mortrialus.3062 said:The real problem is that Guild Wars 2 has a fundamental issue where if you increase your healing, you by definition increase your tankiness. In most games, the healers can be quite squishy and are often the target you prioritize the most. It's almost weird to think about, but other games like this it's the healer you almost always target first, not the damage. But Firebrand, Tempest, and Druid are incredibly resilient builds just because of how healing power increases their own capacity to survive and tank.

The end result is you design amulets like Magi's for support builds, which unfortunately allows Druids to run these super sustainy builds that let's them easy just goof on two players for the duration of a match.

there are ways to solve such an issue.they could make it that (outside of your 6 skill) all healing has a 'self heal penalty' or something.i'm sure a professional who put time into this can come up with a better solution then me but it isn't a problem without a solution

Support bunker builds were fine for many years. Usually it was guardian or ele that filled the role. They started getting out of control with big surprise (not) the expansions.

@derd.6413 said:

@mortrialus.3062 said:The real problem is that Guild Wars 2 has a fundamental issue where if you increase your healing, you by definition increase your tankiness. In most games, the healers can be quite squishy and are often the target you prioritize the most. It's almost weird to think about, but other games like this it's the healer you almost always target first, not the damage. But Firebrand, Tempest, and Druid are incredibly resilient builds just because of how healing power increases their own capacity to survive and tank.

The end result is you design amulets like Magi's for support builds, which unfortunately allows Druids to run these super sustainy builds that let's them easy just goof on two players for the duration of a match.

I like the idea of an outgoing healing percent. Or a raw stat that increases your healing to other people rather than just yourself.

@Rouien.5234 said:

@derd.6413 said:

@mortrialus.3062 said:The real problem is that Guild Wars 2 has a fundamental issue where if you increase your healing, you by definition increase your tankiness. In most games, the healers can be quite squishy and are often the target you prioritize the most. It's almost weird to think about, but other games like this it's the healer you almost always target first, not the damage. But Firebrand, Tempest, and Druid are incredibly resilient builds just because of how healing power increases their own capacity to survive and tank.

The end result is you design amulets like Magi's for support builds, which unfortunately allows Druids to run these super sustainy builds that let's them easy just goof on two players for the duration of a match.

The effect exsists within the game, though it's not a tradition state. It's in that old form like Crit Damage used to be a percentage based state before it was converted to Ferocity. The effect is called Benevolence and you can find it on Sigil of Benevolence and Monk Runes. I'd really like to see an experimental stat set that's just like Main Stat Benevolence (Which is like 1.5x the healing power effectiveness as healing power except it's exclusively outgoing) offstat Vitality and Power and see how that goes.

@derd.6413 said:

@mortrialus.3062 said:The real problem is that Guild Wars 2 has a fundamental issue where if you increase your healing, you by definition increase your tankiness. In most games, the healers can be quite squishy and are often the target you prioritize the most. It's almost weird to think about, but other games like this it's the healer you almost always target first, not the damage. But Firebrand, Tempest, and Druid are incredibly resilient builds just because of how healing power increases their own capacity to survive and tank.

The end result is you design amulets like Magi's for support builds, which unfortunately allows Druids to run these super sustainy builds that let's them easy just goof on two players for the duration of a match.

But at the same time, it's rough because since GW2's healing isn't target focused. Anything that supports needs to be actively wading through the chaos of a fight since healing tends to be AoE focused or in Firebrand's case cone based. They can't sit back and kite around, run and hide like a scourge.

@mortrialus.3062 said:

@Rouien.5234 said:

@derd.6413 said:

@mortrialus.3062 said:The real problem is that Guild Wars 2 has a fundamental issue where if you increase your healing, you by definition increase your tankiness. In most games, the healers can be quite squishy and are often the target you prioritize the most. It's almost weird to think about, but other games like this it's the healer you almost always target first, not the damage. But Firebrand, Tempest, and Druid are incredibly resilient builds just because of how healing power increases their own capacity to survive and tank.

The end result is you design amulets like Magi's for support builds, which unfortunately allows Druids to run these super sustainy builds that let's them easy just goof on two players for the duration of a match.

@derd.6413 said:

@mortrialus.3062 said:The real problem is that Guild Wars 2 has a fundamental issue where if you increase your healing, you by definition increase your tankiness. In most games, the healers can be quite squishy and are often the target you prioritize the most. It's almost weird to think about, but other games like this it's the healer you almost always target first, not the damage. But Firebrand, Tempest, and Druid are incredibly resilient builds just because of how healing power increases their own capacity to survive and tank.

The end result is you design amulets like Magi's for support builds, which unfortunately allows Druids to run these super sustainy builds that let's them easy just goof on two players for the duration of a match.

COMPLETELY agree with that and understand what you mean. The Guardian healer (or any other 'healer') supports, gives boons by supporting themselves. So, yeah it would be a problem to just BUFF support without inadvertently giving people the option to be near unkillable.

I play a Mercy (Casual bragging of my 200+ hours mercy here) and do everything I can to help people healing-wise even if that means me accident over extending.. BUT I'm completely okay and used to healing others just for the sake of being helpful and PERSONALLY I would not mind if there were skills that were like "Ally only healing" or something mechanics that allows me to sacrifice skills/health/stats to support a friend/teammate. Again just MY idea of 'fun'.

I've done nothing but main healers in every single mmo. Being altruistic, even in the face of defeat or to the point of insanity is LITERALLY my hobby. People say I'm sadistic but i just wanna be helpful and supportive.

@"Rouien.5234" said:"Save Yourselves". I forgot that skill pulls in EVERYTHING.

:lol:

glad I'm not the only one who has slaughtered himself harder than a newborn Holo with that skill.

There. is. Spite. against. EVERYONE. and EVERY. BUILD. that is not . META.META.META.METAMETAUnfortunately the world is full of people that only follow trends, and talk down to anyone that tries a different path.and in turn that makes the game this way also.

Ignore the sheep. just play how you want.

@BABE.6384 said:There. is. Spite. against. EVERYONE. and EVERY. BUILD. that is not . META.META.META.METAMETAUnfortunately the world is full of people that only follow trends, and talk down to anyone that tries a different path.and in turn that makes the game this way also.

Ignore the sheep. just play how you want.

Of course, but it's just getting a little difficult to play how I when they keep taking away the stuff I liked to use. :(