Let me play with friends

We are 3 friends that want to play spvp together and get pips for the rewards. Thanks to this beautiful ranked system we can't cause we are 3.

We don't care about rank, just a number to us, we just want to have fun in pvp AND have the rewards that are not the reward tracks (seriously most of em pretty much sucks considering the time invested into pvp).My suggestions:

1) Add the pip system to the unranked arena (even with reduced gain maybe?), so the guys that want to go for the glory and honor of ranked still can and they still can get their pips while we are able to play together and have some actually decent reward. Maybe increase by a great margin the pips gained if you contribute to the match (to try to limit afk farmers)OR2) Make us queue ranked with a party of more than 2 persons (excluding 4 man parties like in DOTA2). I mean in the end the "risk" of someone getting carried by his friends will not be such an absurd deal as hacking and wintrading is right now. With the current system people can still be boosted (you give your account to the booster, it's quite common in game like LoL and Dota and there is no way to go around it) so in the end it won't even increase by that much the cases of boosted people.

In the end it won't make a real big deal. Right now people are still botting in AT's, multiboxing to farm rewards, wintrading and cheating so how much worse it can get ? At least we can have ways to limit toxicity by playing with people we know!

I mean a big company like anet could think of something better to let us play with friends and get decent rewards than "if you are more than 2 suck it".

PS. At's don't work for us for various reasons:1) We are not 52) We would lose the first match or second match and we will have to wait the next tournament in 1-2 hours, some of us have a limited playtime, it means that after two matches we would be done for. It just sucks

Why would you need specifically the spvp pip rewards? All loot can be obtained from other game modes. All you are missing out is some random bad skins.

1. Pip rewards in unranked would lower the playerbase and remove the incentives of ranked even more.
2. Duo and teamq has been voted down heavily so many times. The overwhelming majority queues solo and supports even matches, but there are a thousand threads already.

The 'absurd deal of hacking and wintrading' is an urban legend. And even if it wasn't, it would not justify ruining the game mode even more.

@"rank eleven monk.9502" said:Why would you need specifically the spvp pip rewards? All loot can be obtained from other game modes. All you are missing out is some random bad skins.

1. Pip rewards in unranked would lower the playerbase and remove the incentives of ranked even more.
2. Duo and teamq has been voted down heavily so many times. The overwhelming majority queues solo and supports even matches, but there are a thousand threads already.

The 'absurd deal of hacking and wintrading' is an urban legend. And even if it wasn't, it would not justify ruining the game mode even more.

Because we want to play that game mode and get the rewards. I mean this is a MMO not an only pvp game. (I also play other game modes)

Let's also face it that in games with a real competitive scene and that are only pvp (like dota or LoL) the system of people queieing ranked in parties of more than 2 people has worked pretty much fine for a long time. I don't get why it should not in this game.

I don't really get why the game mode would be ruined, can you explain it to me ? I only see upsides and in my original post i was trying to adress some problems that some people claim would come out (like the boosting factor). In the end you cant match parties against parties. We would not care if we have to wait 10 mins to find a match as 10 mins is still lower than 1 hour for an AT. (So no imbalancing)

Answering to your first point: Why is it so bad ? So people that want to tryhard can tryhard without people that are not in the same mindset. I honestly queue ranked just for the pips and because i like the game mode. I don't have a really competitive mindset, and while i actively try to win i don't "tryhard" like people that are really interested in ranked. It sucks because you have to deal with the toxicity of such persons (that i can understand to a limit). So i am basically ruining your precious game mode because i am playing it the way i like it, and that's not against the TOS.I don't like the game mode enough to play it while not getting the rewards. This is an MMO, we all want the golds for that cool skin/weapons while playing that's the whole point of it. If i wanted a pure pvp game i would be playing DOTA and that's not what i am looking for and this is not what an MMO is

@polvere.2805 said:

@"rank eleven monk.9502" said:Why would you need specifically the spvp pip rewards? All loot can be obtained from other game modes. All you are missing out is some random bad skins.

1. Pip rewards in unranked would lower the playerbase and remove the incentives of ranked even more.
2. Duo and teamq has been voted down heavily so many times. The overwhelming majority queues solo and supports even matches, but there are a thousand threads already.

The 'absurd deal of hacking and wintrading' is an urban legend. And even if it wasn't, it would not justify ruining the game mode even more.

The problem is that most of the pvp player base seems to queue solo (if we trust in Anets datas), but you are very handicapped as a solo player when you have to fight vs duo groups. The best would be to have a pure solo queue and a team queue (you can q with 1-5 player) as we had back then. But the playerbase is most likely not big enough for that anymore. Pure solo q is the fairest q under these conditions, in particular because you have unranked and ATs for teams.

@bravan.3876 said:

@polvere.2805 said:

@"rank eleven monk.9502" said:Why would you need specifically the spvp pip rewards? All loot can be obtained from other game modes. All you are missing out is some random bad skins.

1. Pip rewards in unranked would lower the playerbase and remove the incentives of ranked even more.
2. Duo and teamq has been voted down heavily so many times. The overwhelming majority queues solo and supports even matches, but there are a thousand threads already.

The 'absurd deal of hacking and wintrading' is an urban legend. And even if it wasn't, it would not justify ruining the game mode even more.

@"bravan.3876" said:The problem is that most of the pvp player base seems to queue solo (if we trust in Anets datas), but you are very handicapped as a solo player when you have to fight vs duo groups. The best would be to have a pure solo queue and a team queue (you can q with 1-5 player) as we had back then. But the playerbase is most likely not big enough for that anymore. Pure solo q is the fairest q under these conditions, in particular because you have unranked and ATs for teams.

I get what you are saying, is it really possible that the playerbase that want to queue in bigger parties is so low ? It seems so strange in a game that promotes playing together like a MMO!I know we have unranked, but as stated in my first post, it's not the rank that we care for but the rewards! Basically what it's coming out of this discussion by now is "if you want to have rewards and play with friends go play other game modes, you can't have that in pvp" am i wrong ? That is just so wrong in a modern MMO !!

In my opinion each game mode should get you to have almost the same rewards (maybe with different speeds) with a certain amout of unique per game mode rewards! And it should promote working toward them with friends! Not by yourself!!

.> @polvere.2805 said:

@"bravan.3876" said:The problem is that most of the pvp player base seems to queue solo (if we trust in Anets datas), but you are very handicapped as a solo player when you have to fight vs duo groups. The best would be to have a pure solo queue and a team queue (you can q with 1-5 player) as we had back then. But the playerbase is most likely not big enough for that anymore. Pure solo q is the fairest q under these conditions, in particular because you have unranked and ATs for teams.

There is one thing I don't get. Why in the world do people quote A-net statistics that say most people solo. but then always leave out the fact that 5 man teams have actually a lower winrate? Why do they forgot that 5 mans get matched up with higher solos?

I mean if most people are solo players then logically the emergence of teams is also lower. and in the case u do come across an 5 man the advantage is actually in your favour.

Bassically because 5 mans slightly inconvience u once in a time(rare occasion) u gotta remove the game mode, for the other group that u barely come across?

the only legit argument for not having teams in ranked is that it gives a potentially skewed view of ones individual skill rating and u can argue that even if thier winrate is lower. they have a lack of adapting in a solo que envrioment. But even then since team players are once again a small portion that portion with an potentially inflated rating would be smaller. And I could understand if atleast an attempt was made to either argue or find an solution other then hurr durr AT's get stomped by pros in the first and second round or do unranked without any fucking goal/reward or rating in mind. the solution is either to get put into the lions den or put into full casual mode.

But given the above reasonsn this is nothing but fucking selfishness. There is no other way to describe it by the fact that instead of encouraring larger groups. U kill an already small group because of an small inconvience, no actually u are inconviencing them by beating them. but U have this this skewed delusion that all these teams on discord/teamspeak are farming u and even with data u ignore that and just take away the ability to actually promote tackle ranked together with friends.

Honestly I'd say why not give 2 skill ratings? one for groups and one for solo's that way u don't have the ''potential 1200 rating players getting carried to 1650 rated matches''

Numbers say U win,Numbers say U won't meet them often.

And yet it isn't enough for u.Honestly I find people arguign for solo que only , it just pure selfishness really.

People defending SoloQ are more than likely people that doesn't have friends that are PvPing.ArenaNet has stated that SoloQ groups beat full 5-mans with about a 72% over 28% winratio back during guild ladders. You obviously had the odd stand-out, one being Car Crashed which farmed as a five man with comps during off hours.Restricting to SoloQ only is nothing but selfishness, as already mentioned. Considering if you'd introduce DuoQ again, people still have the option to SoloQ.

I don't know how it's a surprise to people that more having more options is a good thing for a game that is made for being fun. Playing in a SoloQ scenario in an unbalanced environment with people ranging MMRs within 300-400 rating is not an enjoyable experience. You will obviously eventually climb if you're good enough to carry games consistently.

But at the end of the day. It's about taking options away from the people that WANTS to play together. While if you'd still introduce DuoQ back into the game, you'd still have the option to SoloQ if you would want that.

Yes to 2,3, man que but only against other 2,3 man teams (waiting time will obviously increase for everyone). It may be worth "testing" so check the that the matchmaking time is not increased to more than 5 mins, if it is, revert back to solo/duo que. My guess is that the population is not there to support this. Leave 5 man for ATs.

Pips for unranked - sure, why not, if it stops people complaining - 1 pip for win, 0 for loss obviously; capped to a maximum of 10 pips per day.

@"MarshallLaw.9260" said:Yes to 2,3, man que but only against other 2,3 man teams (waiting time will obviously increase for everyone). It may be worth "testing" so check the that the matchmaking time is not increased to more than 5 mins, if it is, revert back to solo/duo que. My guess is that the population is not there to support this. Leave 5 man for ATs.

Pips for unranked - sure, why not, if it stops people complaining - 1 pip for win, 0 for loss obviously; capped to a maximum of 10 pips per day.

Ok for 5 man for AT's you are right that doing ranked with 5 man team could cause some unbalance, i am fine with that. I would love if anet sooner or later would let us do the tests and see if it works.

The pips for unranked gained in such a low way would just make people still play ranked. It does not make sense to give you 2 ways of earning pips and one that is ridicolously faster than the other. Maybe make it in a way that if you play in unranked you gain the same pips with the ranked rules minus (3 or 2 by default + the number of people in your party), so 5 man teams are invited to play AT's (because they get fewer pips) and smaller teams can still get their pips in a lower amount but without having to tryhard!

Maybe let's add that you still get 1 pip minimum even if you lose!

@MarshallLaw.9260 said:Pips for unranked - sure, why not, if it stops people complaining - 1 pip for win, 0 for loss obviously; capped to a maximum of 10 pips per day.Actually this is a pretty neat idea. Maybe tweak the numbers a little bit, but it makes sense to have a severely reduced reward and capped, so there is no abuse.

@polvere.2805 said:

@MarshallLaw.9260 said:Yes to 2,3, man que but only against other 2,3 man teams (waiting time will obviously increase for everyone). It may be worth "testing" so check the that the matchmaking time is not increased to more than 5 mins, if it is, revert back to solo/duo que. My guess is that the population is not there to support this. Leave 5 man for ATs.

Pips for unranked - sure, why not, if it stops people complaining - 1 pip for win, 0 for loss obviously; capped to a maximum of 10 pips per day.

@MarshallLaw.9260 said:Pips for unranked - sure, why not, if it stops people complaining - 1 pip for win, 0 for loss obviously; capped to a maximum of 10 pips per day.Actually this is a pretty neat idea. Maybe tweak the numbers a little bit, but it makes sense to have a severely reduced reward and capped, so there is no abuse.

The aim is to encourage people to gain experience and go into ranked.Just like players can't justifiably ask for raid reward in fractals, unranked should be much lower % of pips than its ranked counterpart.The smaller the gap between rewards, the smaller the incentive to go ranked and this will negatively impact the population during seasons.I am all for players having choice and variety but given how many we can estimate play sPvP, it's important that the population isn't spread too thinly. If we had a huge playerbase in the mode, perhaps this would become more viable, but our limits have to be taken into consideration with the current state of PvP.

Just using some rough maths - here's why I think my previous numbers work.Current season is 56 days (3rd Apr- 29th May)Current league reward track consists of 670 pips(full complete, no repeats on Byzantium).If we say that unranked players can gain 10 pips per day(max) for their 10 wins that would mean that by day 56, the player using this method would not reach the end of the track. Therefore, they can choose to farm to this max in unranked but if they wish to complete Byzantium, they would have to go to ranked for at least 10 matches (max 11 pips per win, and assuming they are not in plat/leg tier).

Just a thought... Maybe get another friend and have two parties queing at the same time?

You can't have everything you want man. Having stacked teams in ranked would be cancer.

@"BMW.2951" said:Just a thought... Maybe get another friend and have two parties queing at the same time?

You can't have everything you want man. Having stacked teams in ranked would be cancer.

Ranked is cancer anyway, toxicity, trolls and afkers. I am asking for a way to not have to deal with such bullshit and still obtain what i want (and i think i am not the only one in this community). I know a lot of people that don't go in pvp because it's toxic, and they can't play with their friends. The popoulation of pvp would grow if they gave us the possibility to team queue AND get rewards.I mean, who the hell would do raid with all the toxicity around them if there were no rewards ? I don't understand this masochistic idea that it is fine to have such toxicity in name of a so called "balance" (that from what i see around the pvp forums has not been seen in years). Why the game has to stay in such a stupid state where in name of something that isn't there (balance) forces player to not have fun in a certain part of the game that could be REALLY fun? (The fun in a mmo is giving your character the coolest appearance and the coolest weapons by doing what you like in the game, i think we all agree on this point, otherwise no point in playing an mmo, other games offer better gameplay)I just don't understand why a game that should promote social interaction and social gameplay wants to cripple it so much.

(Reffering to finding more peeps) We do it sometimes, but i just don't get why i can't do the most natural thing. I mean EVERY other game that i play allows this and has a competitive scene that can be called like that. Gw2 is not even that competitive and the game screams casual from every hole, so why can't i play casually with friends doing what you do in mmo: working towards goal like the new weapon, the new armor, ecc. ecc.

@MarshallLaw.9260 said:The aim is to encourage people to gain experience and go into ranked.Just like players can't justifiably ask for raid reward in fractals, unranked should be much lower % of pips than its ranked counterpart.The smaller the gap between rewards, the smaller the incentive to go ranked and this will negatively impact the population during seasons.I am all for players having choice and variety but given how many we can estimate play sPvP, it's important that the population isn't spread too thinly. If we had a huge playerbase in the mode, perhaps this would become more viable, but our limits have to be taken into consideration with the current state of PvP.

Just using some rough maths - here's why I think my previous numbers work.Current season is 56 days (3rd Apr- 29th May)Current league reward track consists of 670 pips(full complete, no repeats on Byzantium).If we say that unranked players can gain 10 pips per day(max) for their 10 wins that would mean that by day 56, the player using this method would not reach the end of the track. Therefore, they can choose to farm to this max in unranked but if they wish to complete Byzantium, they would have to go to ranked for at least 10 matches (max 11 pips per win, and assuming they are not in plat/leg tier).

I don't want to go in ranked and deal with the toxicity, but i do want to play pvp and earn something DECENT in doing it. I can organize my party of non toxic players in raid environment and i can raid when i want to get the rewards i like. This is not happening in spvp. In spvp you have to play with your friends and earn almost nothing, or you have to deal with the BS that is the ranked community and not play with your friends

@polvere.2805 said:

@"BMW.2951" said:Just a thought... Maybe get another friend and have two parties queing at the same time?

You can't have everything you want man. Having stacked teams in ranked would be cancer.

@MarshallLaw.9260 said:The aim is to encourage people to gain experience and go into ranked.Just like players can't justifiably ask for raid reward in fractals, unranked should be much lower % of pips than its ranked counterpart.The smaller the gap between rewards, the smaller the incentive to go ranked and this will negatively impact the population during seasons.I am all for players having choice and variety but given how many we can estimate play sPvP, it's important that the population isn't spread too thinly. If we had a huge playerbase in the mode, perhaps this would become more viable, but our limits have to be taken into consideration with the current state of PvP.

Just using some rough maths - here's why I think my previous numbers work.Current season is 56 days (3rd Apr- 29th May)Current league reward track consists of 670 pips(full complete, no repeats on Byzantium).If we say that unranked players can gain 10 pips per day(max) for their 10 wins that would mean that by day 56, the player using this method would not reach the end of the track. Therefore, they can

choose

to farm to this max in unranked

but

if they wish to complete Byzantium, they would have to go to ranked for at least 10 matches (max 11 pips per win, and assuming they are not in plat/leg tier).

Guess what? Even if ANet made it so you can play with 3 friends, it would still make it not fun for you guys. Think of all the good people that would team up together to completely destroy your 3 man premade. It wouldn't be fun man, not at all. Facing 2 people that is teamed together is enough.

@polvere.2805 said:

@"BMW.2951" said:Just a thought... Maybe get another friend and have two parties queing at the same time?

You can't have everything you want man. Having stacked teams in ranked would be cancer.

@"MarshallLaw.9260" said:The aim is to encourage people to gain experience and go into ranked.Just like players can't justifiably ask for raid reward in fractals, unranked should be much lower % of pips than its ranked counterpart.The smaller the gap between rewards, the smaller the incentive to go ranked and this will negatively impact the population during seasons.I am all for players having choice and variety but given how many we can estimate play sPvP, it's important that the population isn't spread too thinly. If we had a huge playerbase in the mode, perhaps this would become more viable, but our limits have to be taken into consideration with the current state of PvP.

Just using some rough maths - here's why I think my previous numbers work.Current season is 56 days (3rd Apr- 29th May)Current league reward track consists of 670 pips(full complete, no repeats on Byzantium).If we say that unranked players can gain 10 pips per day(max) for their 10 wins that would mean that by day 56, the player using this method would not reach the end of the track. Therefore, they can

choose

to farm to this max in unranked

but

if they wish to complete Byzantium, they would have to go to ranked for at least 10 matches (max 11 pips per win, and assuming they are not in plat/leg tier).

League rewards belong in ranked just like raid rewards belong in raids. I was simply suggesting the biggest compromise I would be OK with. If you don't like the route to the reward, then unfortunately you have to choose to either slog through it or not have that reward. I already mentioned that 2or3 man que is a good idea as long as it doesnt kill the population by massively increasing waiting times. 5 man teams already have ATs.

Also toxicity is only an issue if you choose to take it personally. My advice - if somebody is "mean" to you, just don't listen to them, don't engage in a conversation if you suspect it will be unproductive and end in abusive language. Yes, sure, there will always be players who are toxic, but ask yourself - do you really care about the opinions of some random person? would you care in real life? why care online if you receive non-constructive negative feedback?

@BMW.2951 said:

Guess what? Even if ANet made it so you can play with 3 friends, it would still make it not fun for you guys. Think of all the good people that would team up together to completely destroy your 3 man premade. It wouldn't be fun man, not at all. Facing 2 people that is teamed together is enough.

I actually have fun if i can just play and have a laugh about the bad players in my team with friends on discord. We are not all angry beasts that go on a rampage if you have a player in your team that is less skilled than you. Don't dump us all in the same trashcan of the tryhard kids :)

I never get angry when i play ranked and have to deal with toxicity. I just find it not fun. Game are meant to be fun, what's the point otherwise ? You are just wasting time if you don't have fun in a game.

@"MarshallLaw.9260" said:

League rewards belong in ranked just like raid rewards belong in raids. I was simply suggesting the biggest compromise I would be OK with. If you don't like the route to the reward, then unfortunately you have to choose to either slog through it or not have that reward. I already mentioned that 2or3 man que is a good idea as long as it doesnt kill the population by massively increasing waiting times. 5 man teams already have ATs.

Also toxicity is only an issue if you choose to take it personally. My advice - if somebody is "mean" to you, just don't listen to them, don't engage in a conversation if you suspect it will be unproductive and end in abusive language. Yes, sure, there will always be players who are toxic, but ask yourself - do you really care about the opinions of some random person? would you care in real life? why care online if you receive non-constructive negative feedback?

Yeah and i got you man, we have different opinions and i am fine with that. I am just trying to suggest something that would make gw2 far more enjoyable to me, i am not saying "hurr durr do like this or game is trash".I would love to do some testing with multiple man queues and see if it goes well. If we see that it sucks then remove it. I just don't get why some people don't want to try it. (They are the same people that claim that a class is destroyed even before the patch hits the live game imho):

I never take toxicity personally but honestly if you go into a game would you like to talk about a tactics to try to win or staying there watching someone scream "Your mom is so fat, skibbidy doo suck my bartledoo" the whole game in chat ?Since i am not their father i have no interest in trying to tell them to not be toxic. I just want to have a game.

@"polvere.2805" said:I never take toxicity personally but honestly if you go into a game would you like to talk about a tactics to try to win or staying there watching someone scream "Your mom is so fat, skibbidy doo suck my bartledoo" the whole game in chat ?

This is just the default greeting message on the system my dude, some people don't know how to change it.On a serious note, chat com is at an all time low I feel, maybe others will agree. The majority of the time chat is minimal and often ignored. Take your average pug fractal - if you think you have a good party comp - you don't say anything; if you think everything is going smoothly - you don't say anything. The only time people post in chat is if they are not 100% sure which tactic is being implemented or things are going wrong. Likewise in PvP, the most people put in chat is clarification of where they are starting (e.g. home/far) and about half the time somebody calls they are capping home, another player will ignore the message and follow them to the same node anyway (this is definitely in the top10 most aggravating things about GW2).

@"polvere.2805" said:We are 3 friends that want to play spvp together and get pips for the rewards. Thanks to this beautiful ranked system we can't cause we are 3.

We don't care about rank, just a number to us, we just want to have fun in pvp AND have the rewards that are not the reward tracks (seriously most of em pretty much sucks considering the time invested into pvp).My suggestions:

1) Add the pip system to the unranked arena (even with reduced gain maybe?), so the guys that want to go for the glory and honor of ranked still can and they still can get their pips while we are able to play together and have some actually decent reward. Maybe increase by a great margin the pips gained if you contribute to the match (to try to limit afk farmers)OR2) Make us queue ranked with a party of more than 2 persons (excluding 4 man parties like in DOTA2). I mean in the end the "risk" of someone getting carried by his friends will not be such an absurd deal as hacking and wintrading is right now. With the current system people can still be boosted (you give your account to the booster, it's quite common in game like LoL and Dota and there is no way to go around it) so in the end it won't even increase by that much the cases of boosted people.

In the end it won't make a real big deal. Right now people are still botting in AT's, multiboxing to farm rewards, wintrading and cheating so how much worse it can get ? At least we can have ways to limit toxicity by playing with people we know!

I mean a big company like anet could think of something better to let us play with friends and get decent rewards than "if you are more than 2 suck it".

PS. At's don't work for us for various reasons:1) We are not 52) We would lose the first match or second match and we will have to wait the next tournament in 1-2 hours, some of us have a limited playtime, it means that after two matches we would be done for. It just sucks

The problem is with power creep, 3 of anything op is too much. Also, it would not take 3 great players long to become platinum, separate, and throw matches that have players who could be a threat, or if their team mate is on the other team. It would be too easy and players can not be trusted to abide the rules, so I vote no teams at all. Because this is player vs player, not team vs team. And, anet investigated and banned for a few seasons prominent youtubers last season for doing this sort of thing.

Just do ATs. They give morr.

I fully support OP.

The whole change was idiotic, Anet's just deconstructing what's left of the community and holding back growth.

@polvere.2805 said:2) Make us queue ranked with a party of more than 2 persons (excluding 4 man parties like in DOTA2).

You can't compare games like DOTA/LOL they are in a very different situation.

They have massive playerbases, so even if these games were exactly the same, they would still have far better matchmaking, simply on the basis that have a far, far bigger pool of players to pull from, so when you play ranked in these games and you get say a 2+3 on a team, that is very often mirrored on the other side and with all players at comparable MMRs, GW2 on the other hand has often failed miserably in that regard due to a small player pool vs queue times issue.

Then even with those massive pools of players, they still have much stricter match making, so back when I played DOTA 2 for example if you wanted to queue with other people (in ranked) the player with the lowest MMR in the group had to have an MMR within 2000 (if I remember correctly) of the highest, again GW2 on the other hand...

@Sylosi.6503 said:

@polvere.2805 said:2) Make us queue ranked with a party of more than 2 persons (excluding 4 man parties like in DOTA2).

I agree with the idea represented in your last sentence completely. I feel that it is worth researching whether it would be better to only allow teams within a certain point range from each other, and for them to be matched within a range of the highest scored player in the team. It is an interesting idea, and I have no clue if it would work to eliminate instances like that cheating that happened last pvp season.