Please fix: underpopulated unlinked closed Server — Guild Wars 2 Forums

Please fix: underpopulated unlinked closed Server

Dayra.7405Dayra.7405 Member ✭✭✭
edited April 14, 2018 in WvW

Problem:

The current Link-System really harms 3 server namely Elona Reach, Kodash and Riverside very badly.
All three are not linked since ever and will most likely not linked till the alliance system comes live.
Maybe Drakkar Lake wil loose it' link, and one of them get this link, but this only changes a name not the situation, still 3 server are harmed by the system.

The harm is:
They are the only "Link" that cannot get new people (since month, for month), every other "Link" in EU can get new people,
even if their Link already have more people. E.g. Elona may have more player(-hours) than Desolation, but for sure it
has much less than Deso+WSR.

But that is what they have to fight against: Links with many more player(-hours), not only other single server's.

I don't know your timing for the alliance system, but I am in doubt that it comes early enough to avoid further damage on the WvW-player base (on these servers, but every person lost on any server is a loss for WvW and GW2).

Elona, Kodash and Riverside are not the Blackgate's of EU, they aren't as overstacked to dominate the links. They shrink and are now reached all three the last places in EU (all 3 in T5 now).

Solution Proposals:

  1. For unlinked server, compute the "Full"-Status not in relation to other (linked) server, but in relation to other Links. i.e. set them to full if they reach 95% of the player-hours of the other links (compare it to Deso+WSR not with Deso). This still hinders them to become an EU-Blackgate, but doesn't doom them to have much lower player(-hours) than their opponents.

or

  1. Create 3 new empty german server, such you can link them, i.e. Riverside+New1, Kodash+New2, Elona+New3. This way linking of all german server can be easily improved, over time, till we finally get the alliance system. (End of this year?, Next Year?)

Elona Reach, Kodash and Riverside aren't Blackgate

Reset is the most important time of the match for all german servers, the 4hours of the match where they are able to mobilize most player, especially this week where we are fighting each other (but this more fair match only happens every 2 weeks ...), still today at 22:00 CEST (2h after reset) there is a lot of space for more player:

Elona: https://i.imgur.com/uwbvJ61.png
Kodash: https://i.imgur.com/mOjOEsm.jpg
Riverside: http://bilder-upload.eu/show.php?file=e344a7-1523652575.jpg

Comments

  • Blackarps.1974Blackarps.1974 Member ✭✭✭

    Didn't Anet already say they don't like linking servers that have their own language? If they are all German, they should just be linked together but apparently that would make them too strong or else Anet would have done it by now.

  • Dayra.7405Dayra.7405 Member ✭✭✭
    edited April 13, 2018

    I still refuse to believe that they doom us, because they don't like us ;) (but some stated that believe already in the german forum)

    But yes, we aren't linked together, because that would be to strong. But solo we are to weak, My proposals would fix that.
    It's currently like you need to pay 2 times 150 and only have 3 times 100 coins

  • get the lowest link server to join BG kek.

    look at all these crybabies.... can't beat x server, gonna cry in forum and discord BOOOOOHHHHOOOOOOOHOOOOOOO lmao

  • Hexinx.1872Hexinx.1872 Member ✭✭

    Well we found where the 1583 accounts came out from. (j/k)

  • Why would ANet spend any extra energy adjusting the current system when they are planning to overhaul the entire thing? Sure, the interim might be annoying (as it has been for the time before today). All the same, don't we want ANet devoting all possible resources into making the Restructuring successful? Its goal is to help prevent issues such as described by the OP, issues that aren't currently easily solved.

    "With great power comes not-so-great utility bills."

  • Dawdler.8521Dawdler.8521 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Dayra.7405 said:
    underpolutaled

    Gesundheit!

    Secondly, this is what the WvW restructure will solve (there will be no german servers), so I fail to see why you are seeking alternate solutions for a problem Anet is already intending to fix.

  • Dayra.7405Dayra.7405 Member ✭✭✭
    edited April 14, 2018

    @Dawdler.8521 said:
    so I fail to see why you are seeking alternate solutions for a problem Anet is already intending to fix.

    Yes sometimes it will be fixed by the alliance system. But when will that be? Will there be someone left when it goes live?

    It a bit like:
    Q: Help, the forest-fire reached our houses.
    A: Don’t panic next year we will have new fire-approved houses where the forest is today.
    Q: But can’t you send someone to fight the fire?
    A: No, all our resources are bound in the planning process of the new houses.

  • Dawdler.8521Dawdler.8521 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Dayra.7405 said:

    @Dawdler.8521 said:
    so I fail to see why you are seeking alternate solutions for a problem Anet is already intending to fix.

    Yes sometimes it will be fixed by the alliance system. But when will that be? Will there be someone left when it goes live?

    It a bit like:
    Q: Help, the forest-fire reached our houses.
    A: Don’t panic next year we will have new fire-approved houses where the forest is today.
    Q: But can’t you send someone to fight the fire?
    A: No, all our resources are bound in the planning process of the new houses.

    Before your idea become considered, I assure you.

    Also when there forrest fire has been burning for over a year, there is no need to fight the fire any more than it was last month.

  • Dayra.7405Dayra.7405 Member ✭✭✭
    edited April 14, 2018

    @Dawdler.8521 said:
    Also when there forrest fire has been burning for over a year, there is no need to fight the fire any more than it was last month.

    It was ok, as long as we had queue on all 4 maps during reset, and queue in primetime on 2-.3 maps (who gives a s*** on the placement in coverage-wars, as long as you can play on par in primetime), but that is gone now, they seem to constantly adjust "Full" downwards. Nowadays we are outnumbered and overrun in primetime and reset and still marked as full.

    We were full - with a short open for a week - (i.e. close to the borderline) when we had queue on all maps, now we are full - with a short open for a day - (i.e. still close to the borderline), when this queue on 4 maps shrinked to queue on 1 map.

    So if they find time to adjust the the full-border all the time downwards, they should find the time to do it in a fair way.

    I think I did not asked for very complicated changes. Baruch opened within a week after the forum-complain, that they cannot close the only Spanish-speaking server.

  • Your screenshots are from the beginning of the second skirmish. Queues on Drakkar Lake (linked, T2) at this time were even lower.

    You have the players, just not the coverage. And that is not something Anet can change.

    Average Vendetta [aV] - Guild Lead

  • Dayra.7405Dayra.7405 Member ✭✭✭
    edited April 14, 2018

    @Malfrador.3615 said:
    Your screenshots are from the beginning of the second skirmish. Queues on Drakkar Lake (linked, T2) at this time were even lower.

    Yes I said so 22:00 CEST (for me as old-school pre-skirmish player prime-time is 4h). I guess that's a speciality of this weeks matches. T5 was highly motivated to participate in the first fair (no one linked) fight since month.
    Whereas Drakkar this week against Vabbi has good strategic reasons to stay away from primetime and especially reset (where no stonewalls to place AC's behind exist): Every additional player online at Drakkar only scores more PPK for Vabbi ;)

  • @Malfrador.3615 said:
    Your screenshots are from the beginning of the second skirmish. Queues on Drakkar Lake (linked, T2) at this time were even lower.

    You have the players, just not the coverage. And that is not something Anet can change.

    As someone who plays on Kodasch and Eloan i can only say: Elona has less players than Kodasch, yet both servers are full.

    I would prefer to just close one german server and add another ESP server so that BB finally gets locked.

  • Lemoncurry.2345Lemoncurry.2345 Member ✭✭
    edited April 15, 2018

    I don't get it why the server-population-status seems to be calculated differently between linked and unliked-servers (with the exception of Baruch, which have to stay open as the sole Spanish speaking server).

    It is perfectly understandable, that servers which are dominating numbers-wise are declared full. Right now in the EU it is exactly the opposite. While servers at the top are open and linked, Elona, Riverside and Kodash sit locked at "full"-status and without a link at the bottom of the league. Neither of those servers ever got a link since the introduction of the linking system. They are also set "full" for quite some time, with just brief exceptions for a couple of days in the case of Elona and for Kodash due to the server blackout.

    On the other side we have servers like Desolation on "very high" and linked at #1, which a couple of weeks ago managed to win a MU without losing a single skirmish. All in all MUs in most tiers in the EU seem to be pretty lopsided at the moment with servers leading by large margins. Clearly, Anets attempt in balancing the MUs is not working as intended, be it because of the tendency of a lot of players to transfer after a relink has occurred every two month, be it that offtime-playhours (which are decisive for a victory) are more valuable than primetime playhours.

    One could argue that there is no point in changing the status quo with the advent of the alliance system. But the question is, how long will this take? For quite some time frustration on those three servers is pretty noticeable. Even if players don't care about their server's rank in the league, due to the 1up/1down system and sitting at the bottom of the league, MUs get boring and repetitive. A lot of German servers have pretty tight-knit communities, so transferring to leave behind the misery is not an option for some people. As a result they quit playing which is not a good thing considering the general drain of players in this aging gamemode.

    I for one would very much love to see an interim solution until the alliance system goes live.

  • ToPNoP.2493ToPNoP.2493 Member ✭✭✭
    edited April 15, 2018

    @Dayra.7405 said:
    I still refuse to believe that they doom us, because they don't like us ;) (but some stated that believe already in the german forum)

    But yes, we aren't linked together, because that would be to strong. But solo we are to weak, My proposals would fix that.
    It's currently like you need to pay 2 times 150 and only have 3 times 100 coins

    It would not be so bad if there were more points given to kills. High kdr servers should not fight low kdr servers. Getting beaten so badly lowers morality and erodes fair game play. If a server has 2.0kdr, then they have no reason to be fighting in that tier. Right now the kdr of a server my server is against is more than 3x more. So, for every 1 death given to my server, the other server gains 3. No tags are going to run in that long, no one is gonna follow a tag that just gets smashed as soon as they get 20 people. Zergs can not gain momentum, so people quit for the week, and some forget to return. Imagine a new player comming into a server that is getting beaten so bad that they are being spawn camped. They would leave and not return! The tier system is supposed to reflect tier strength. However, it does not.

    Yes I like comms, but sadly I'm allergic to them.

  • Dirdyy.1648Dirdyy.1648 Member ✭✭

    Still don t understand the algorithm behind it.

    Elona is now open since 2 days, Kodash and Riverside still closed but all 3 are so close this week with score (360k/374k/380k).

    i know the server status is based only on WvW ranks gained and hours played but this can`t be so different to score.

  • @Dirdyy.1648 said:
    Still don t understand the algorithm behind it.
    Elona is now open since 2 days, Kodash and Riverside still closed but all 3 are so close this week with score (360k/374k/380k).
    i know the server status is based only on WvW ranks gained and hours played but this can`t be so different to score.

    It can be quite different, because players playing at off-time hours are generating play hours which in effect are more worth victory-points-wise than prime-time-ones. Or in other words: During off-time you need comparatively fewer players / play-hours to win skirmishes than during prime-time.
    This means that not only the total play-hours are relevant for the VPs but the distribution of those play-hours during the day/night.

  • Kirnale.5914Kirnale.5914 Member ✭✭✭
    edited April 19, 2018

    To compare those three servers at our current MU:
    (I cannot guarantee that these Information I provide are 100% true, but they are from my experience)

    Coverage:
    1. Morning: Riverside>Elona>Kodash
    2. Earlier afternoon: Riverside>Elona>Kodash
    3. Late afternoon: Kodash>Riverside>Elona, sometimes Riverside=Elona
    4. Primetime till 10 pm: Kodash=Riverside=Elona; Actually hard to predict. All sides have at least one zerg. Heavily depends on the day.
    5. Late primetime till 0 am: Elona>Kodash=Riverside (first part of the week), Kodash>Elona>Riverside (Second part of the week)
    6. Earlier nightshift till 3 am: same as 5.)
    7. Late nightshift until 6 am: I actually don't know.

    Fighting power:
    1. Elona had the best reset blobs on friday
    2. Riverside usually runs the strongest blob during primetime. Kodash and Elona are a bit unpredictable. Sometimes Riverside have a really bad blob too.

    Why Riverside wins:
    1. Morning coverage is insane. The T3 stuff build up during this time will carry the earlier afternoon coverage. It takes a long time to destroy them. Meanwhile, they will keep the 1st place, even if Elona have more people during this time.
    2. Strong primetime.
    3. Lose only during night and late afternoon. They still manage to get 2nd place if they really wanted to.

    Roaming:
    I would say it's pretty even on all three servers. I might be wrong though. At least all three had less than SFR or Underworld+link (IMO).

    Overall "manpower":
    Riverside>Kodash>Elona

    My impressions:
    Most balanced MU since release of linking, because there is no link in this MU! All three server loves to fight, and usually only avoid fighting when the zerg quality is really bad. Every single server have their own coverage power.
    Really fun MU to play, my thanks to Kodash and Riverside. And it seems the nice, sunny weather have drawn a lot of WvW player from all three server out of their rooms XD.

    Edit: That said, Kodash could still potentially win this MU. And Elona isn't too far from Kodash away too, so Elona can still get 2nd place.

  • Hello,

    I suppose Arenanet that deliberately suppress the national servers in the EU zone.

    Because how else is it to explain the full server specifically Gandara, wasteland, and distant Zittergipfel get a link partner. These servers are full and do not need any linking.
    The run from 13 noon with queues on all cards around.

    Will Arenanet still punish the German servers for World War II or what is this kitten

    This is done absolutely nothing against the hacker. Why are people blocked who fight it instead of blocking the hacker?

    Example: A Wastes player was online with 2 characters with only 1 account at the same time. Has this player been banned? No. But for who has complained about it.

    In this way I buy nothing more from this publisher.

  • MUDse.7623MUDse.7623 Member ✭✭✭✭

    ^ distant Zittergipfel = far shiverpeaks. wasteland = desolation.

    why would someone try to log in with 2 characters on 1 account, when many people got multiple accounts ? many reports of hackers are false and i guess if you spamm reports when you see no action is taken, anet might try to tell you to stop it.

    read this, become a better player now.

  • Dirdyy.1648Dirdyy.1648 Member ✭✭

    Piken now also marked as "full". Seem to be the new PPT-Hype Server.
    Will be interesting, if Piken loose his link and jump to stand alone server after relink this week.

  • ReaverKane.7598ReaverKane.7598 Member ✭✭✭✭

    There's no need to fix that since they'll end up fixing it with the new intended system.

  • Dayra.7405Dayra.7405 Member ✭✭✭

    @ReaverKane.7598 said:
    There's no need to fix that since they'll end up fixing it with the new intended system.

    That's clearly a matter of timing. We have no clue when the new alliance system goes live.
    This summer? This winter? Next year? Even later? Never (as it fails, would not be the first WvW-update that fails) Only ANet knows.

    On the other side, the situation on the unlinked closed server become worser and worser, and my 2 fix proposals take minimal effort.
    And there is no way to adequately resolve the problem in the current link-constellation.

    It only disappears, if many Germans and some others (such that the 7 D-Server can be linked into 4 Links instead of 5 and EU-T5 is closed) stop playing WvW. But is the further reduction of the player base the best resolution of the problem?

  • apharma.3741apharma.3741 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Certainly in the deso-WSR link a lot of people have bandwagoned over to WSR for the link with deso, when we get relinked almost over night everyone will leave WSR. Whoever is linked with WSR on Friday is going to get seriously shafted for 2 months so it’s not all great at the top OP.

    Besides can you imagine Riverside, Elona or Kodash with links? They would completely dominate but not the fun, lots of fights kind, it’d be the lame spike T3 with a Zerg, run if spotted and only fight with AC kind....except maybe Kodash, those guys are actually pretty fun mostly.

    I stand with Mo.

  • Dawdler.8521Dawdler.8521 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @MUDse.7623 said:
    ^ distant Zittergipfel = far shiverpeaks.

    Great, now I'm gonna be embarassed to fight germans knowing it sound so stupid.

  • LetoII.3782LetoII.3782 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited April 24, 2018

    Good ol Google translate.
    A fantastic job otherwise, considering.

    [HUNT] the predatory instinct

  • Inoki.6048Inoki.6048 Member ✭✭✭

    Saying they are underpopulated is bogus. All of the mentioned German servers dominate in terms of population. They always have huge blobs on all maps, which is why they not only do not need links, but should not get any either. And about them being in T5 despite their numbers... well....

  • TheQuickFox.3826TheQuickFox.3826 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Blackarps.1974 said:
    Didn't Anet already say they don't like linking servers that have their own language? If they are all German, they should just be linked together but apparently that would make them too strong or else Anet would have done it by now.

    Don't make Ze Germans too strong plz. They still have to return my grandpas bicycle from the last time they were overpowered.

    Ascalon Will Prevail!

    GW Wiki user page | GW2 Wiki user page

  • @Inoki.6048 said:
    Saying they are underpopulated is bogus. All of the mentioned German servers dominate in terms of population. They always have huge blobs on all maps, which is why they not only do not need links, but should not get any either. And about them being in T5 despite their numbers... well....

    bruh, sometimes we are lucky to get more than 2 Commanders on reset, 1hr after reset all queues are gone, we certainly dont have huge blobs on all maps

  • ReaverKane.7598ReaverKane.7598 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Dayra.7405 said:

    @ReaverKane.7598 said:
    There's no need to fix that since they'll end up fixing it with the new intended system.

    That's clearly a matter of timing. We have no clue when the new alliance system goes live.
    This summer? This winter? Next year? Even later? Never (as it fails, would not be the first WvW-update that fails) Only ANet knows.

    On the other side, the situation on the unlinked closed server become worser and worser, and my 2 fix proposals take minimal effort.
    And there is no way to adequately resolve the problem in the current link-constellation.

    It only disappears, if many Germans and some others (such that the 7 D-Server can be linked into 4 Links instead of 5 and EU-T5 is closed) stop playing WvW. But is the further reduction of the player base the best resolution of the problem?

    The issue is, why would they spend resources fixing this system now (to end up fixing it in a just as obscure time table as the predicted system) if they already have the plans for a solution to fix the problem anyway.
    It's like buying a new motherboard for your old PC when you've already ordered the parts for a new build.

  • Dayra.7405Dayra.7405 Member ✭✭✭
    edited April 24, 2018

    @ReaverKane.7598 said:
    It's like buying a new motherboard for your old PC when you've already ordered the parts for a new build.

    Is it really buying a new motherboard? it more like puting a bit oil on the fen as is makes noise.

    Originally when Linking was introduced, unlinked server limit was 125% of linked server limit (then sometimes they changed it to 100%). Baruch get opened with a few days after protest. So it's probably less then 15min per server to fix it. And do you know when your new motherboard will be delivered (we get the alliance system)?
    I don't, but I don't expect is before winter this year.

    1h fix effort for several month development ahead, I would consider it worth doing it.

    Concerning the strength of german solo server: they are all already at the bottom of the ranking (T5). What is the sense of shrinking them even further by keeping them closed?

  • XenesisII.1540XenesisII.1540 Member ✭✭✭✭

    They're not going to create 3 brand new servers when they have a bigger solution in the pipeline already.
    Language seems to be the biggest problem for linking of the eu servers. But... their upcoming solution is going to have player populations randomly mixed anyways (I'm sure language will still be a big factor for the eu world creations), so why let that continue to be the excuse not to link servers properly right now?

    Another derailing post. ^^
    EBG North Keep: One of the village residents will now flee if their home is destroyed!
    Maguuma: Free ppt, come and get it!

  • ReaverKane.7598ReaverKane.7598 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @XenesisII.1540 said:
    They're not going to create 3 brand new servers when they have a bigger solution in the pipeline already.
    Language seems to be the biggest problem for linking of the eu servers. But... their upcoming solution is going to have player populations randomly mixed anyways (I'm sure language will still be a big factor for the eu world creations), so why let that continue to be the excuse not to link servers properly right now?

    They will make worlds with language in mind for the upcoming solution. It's one of the determining factors for where you get placed, along with guild/alliance.

  • @apharma.3741 said:

    Besides can you imagine Riverside, Elona or Kodash with links? They would completely dominate but not the fun, lots of fights kind, it’d be the lame spike T3 with a Zerg, run if spotted and only fight with AC kind....except maybe Kodash, those guys are actually pretty fun mostly.

    lol. Just look at Riversides KD during the latest matchups. Not every german server is like Drakkar Lake.
    Besides that, you just can't keep unlinked servers full for months when they're obviously not overstacked. How are we supposed to get new players? It wouldn't be such a problem if population on other servers weren't that fluctuating.

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