An Eye on the Deadeye - Page 14 — Guild Wars 2 Forums

An Eye on the Deadeye

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  • Miatela.5047Miatela.5047 Member ✭✭✭

    This is a major flaw of the Deadeye rework. Your build diversity is very limited if you take stealth utilities and traits.

    Absolutely and it is clear that Silent Scope granting stealth on dodge was supposed to be the solution but the ability is buggy, is limited to Rifle, introduces time where the Deadeye can't DPS (and Death's Judgement / 3RB are not strong enough to make up for that) and punishes a profession that is already immobile by limiting dodges as a mobility option.

    The issues are so obvious in hindsight as well.

  • Bramymond.7689Bramymond.7689 Member ✭✭
    edited May 19, 2018

    You are both making excellent arguments. I would appreciate some of that input on my discussion thread here: https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/40213/constructiv-discussion-about-core-thief-and-daredevil-in-the-wake-of-the-deadeye-rework#latest

    I can’t help but realize that some part of this discussion also stems heavily from the distorted view of pure benchmarking.

  • Specialka.7290Specialka.7290 Member ✭✭✭

    I do not think a F3 ability would work out. It would be too easy to access stealth that way.

    Unless they want thief to get an easy access, they should increase damage or DE Rifle, especially TRB and auto attack.

  • Zedek.8932Zedek.8932 Member ✭✭✭

    @Miatela.5047 said:

    @Volrath.1473 said:
    Hate to say it but it is official...

    I have reactivate my wow account and with the expansion coming up in August... I'll come back next year to see how things are.

    Until then gl and hf.

    /Out

    Ironically, I got back into GW2 during 2015 because the class I was playing in another game felt gutted by a rework and the new play style didn't sit well with me and I started trying out older games I had drifted away from.

    Same here. I just waited 1 week to settle and lurked, but it's official. RIOT disables champions, aNet does this, which is exactly the same.
    It took me not even a day until I've spent 52€ on the instant for re-activating my FF14 account (Game time; HW and SB). The very. Same. Day.
    It's unbelievably sad that this day really ruined a franchise* I've enjoyed to be at, really loved to put up everywhere (wallpapers, mentioning in talk with colleagues, pure enjoyment when busy - e.g. looking forward to play). Deadeye was beautiful. Really. Since beta week 2. It's the 2nd profession aNet destroys for no reason while Mesmer and others to a lesser extend run rampage. And then we get a clunky, immersion-killing (I just love this, so I am gonna repeat: A class designed around aim and firearms gets a smokescreen that destroys bullets), bugged, nerfed, unwanted and since over 10 days unfixed failure of a rework, it's too much to bare. I will not support this level of incompetence (no playtesting, no real player survey, no intention to fix bugs or evident problems since minute 1). I bought PoF for that profession. I feel somewhat betrayed.

    @Miatela.5047 said:
    I'll admit to being in a similar spot. Despite playing Guild Wars 2 pretty much exclusively since mid 2015, I've now started to dabble with Warframe, recently reactivated WoW and I'm thinking of downloading FFXIV again.

    But, man, my Blackmage still plays the same since September, 21st of 2013....(Also 60fps+ and high polygone count is very refreshing) :-)

    Excelsior, my name is Zedexx; Asuran Deadeye and assassin.
    The Hunter / 2x Darksteel Pistols / 2x Whisper's Secret Daggers and my Springer. That's all I need and trust.
    "We [Asura] are the concentrated magnificence!"

  • Miatela.5047Miatela.5047 Member ✭✭✭

    @Bramymond.7689 said:

    You are both making excellent arguments. I would appreciate some of that input on my discussion thread here: https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/40213/constructiv-discussion-about-core-thief-and-daredevil-in-the-wake-of-the-deadeye-rework#latest

    I can’t help but realize that some part of this discussion also stems heavily from the distorted view of pure benchmarking.

    It absolutely does, which is why I'll always prefer to reference GW2Raidar logs and the numbers within them where possible. While we don't yet have a good enough sample size with the current patch, it is still informative to see the relative performance of Thief in the previous patch (Feb to May) when Thief was in a better relative position but was so underplayed that the total number of Thief logs (from Condition Daredevil to both Power builds through to Support Core Thief totaled about 10,000) was about a third of the number of Dragonhunter logs (which was close to 29,000).

    That clearly points to a pretty endemic problem with Thief in instanced PvE. Benchmarking has a place, but it will obscure the issues. Benchmarking will have you believe that Thief is only 11 - 14% behind competing choices such as Spellbreakers but masks the poor variety of Thief utility (like Stealth which isn't applicable to current instanced PvE beyond skipping in Fractals where the challenge is typically CM difficulty bosses), the weakness of the additional tools we bring (done better elsewhere by professions that bring more DPS / healing / support) and the issues with our damage patterns which has led to Thief being the least played PvE profession by GW2Raidar logs.

  • Have they mentioned anywhere when these changes will come? Almost have my thief to 80 and leaning towards DD but these changes could sway me. I know it’s possible to unlock both but the PoF HPs so much easier than HoT unless you get a train :D

  • Miatela.5047Miatela.5047 Member ✭✭✭

    @ZeroSkitzo.5403 said:
    Have they mentioned anywhere when these changes will come? Almost have my thief to 80 and leaning towards DD but these changes could sway me. I know it’s possible to unlock both but the PoF HPs so much easier than HoT unless you get a train :D

    We were told about a week ago that fixing the Silent Scope bug would take a few weeks. Depending on what Arenanet has planned in the way of content patches, that likely means anytime from this Tuesday (22/05) to the 5th of June.

    We've had no comments on improving rifle Deadeye DPS or improving the gameplay flow of dagger/dagger. No comments on the rework leaving us without a real support option that is viable in a range of content.

    There have been no comments or responses on resolving the longstanding issue of Thief performing poorly in DPS and utility compared with other options which has been stirred up by this rework.

    Unless you are planning to gear the character with Ascended gear and tackle the more challenging PvE content (CM Fractals or Raids) you are fine to play pretty much anything. If you are thinking more seriously, you might want to consider another profession as things stand. I can't speak for PvP with any real current experience but Daredevil seems fine there. Hopefully someone will chime in with useful advice for that area of the game (and WvW!).

  • @Miatela.5047 said:

    @ZeroSkitzo.5403 said:
    Have they mentioned anywhere when these changes will come? Almost have my thief to 80 and leaning towards DD but these changes could sway me. I know it’s possible to unlock both but the PoF HPs so much easier than HoT unless you get a train :D

    We were told about a week ago that fixing the Silent Scope bug would take a few weeks. Depending on what Arenanet has planned in the way of content patches, that likely means anytime from this Tuesday (22/05) to the 5th of June.

    We've had no comments on improving rifle Deadeye DPS or improving the gameplay flow of dagger/dagger. No comments on the rework leaving us without a real support option that is viable in a range of content.

    There have been no comments or responses on resolving the longstanding issue of Thief performing poorly in DPS and utility compared with other options which has been stirred up by this rework.

    Unless you are planning to gear the character with Ascended gear and tackle the more challenging PvE content (CM Fractals or Raids) you are fine to play pretty much anything. If you are thinking more seriously, you might want to consider another profession as things stand. I can't speak for PvP with any real current experience but Daredevil seems fine there. Hopefully someone will chime in with useful advice for that area of the game (and WvW!).

    Thanks for the info. I’ve got a warrior with both specs now that I enjoy but gets boring. I’m no hardcore player so I’m sure either will work, just depends on the gameplay. I like the aoe that daredevil offers which I don’t think deadeye can match in open world pve?

  • Armaelus.6120Armaelus.6120 Member ✭✭

    I'm tired... tired to see how dev' cannot stop in destroying a thief's gameplay. Moreover, I don't understand why there were no discussion, no announcements on this changes before the patch. I have the impression that, every time they creat something good for the thief, they destroy it systematically.

    Thief/Sniper was the last class I used to play, but now, I don't know where we go. I was enjoying to play the sniper before this changes. Today, I'm thinking to delete this game. I'll watch for dev's reacts on next days. Honestly, I think that they don't care about players who use the sniper. This is frustrating !

    Somebody has a suggestion about an another MMO...? Otherwise, I believe that I am going to take Pillard of eternity 2...

  • Miatela.5047Miatela.5047 Member ✭✭✭

    @Zedek.8932 said:
    But, man, my Blackmage still plays the same since September, 21st of 2013....(Also 60fps+ and high polygone count is very refreshing) :-)

    Is that a dark themed Opera browser? Maybe there is a correlation between people playing underplayed classes and using a less popular browser? :p

  • Astyrah.4015Astyrah.4015 Member ✭✭✭

    @Miatela.5047 said:
    We've had no comments on improving rifle Deadeye DPS or improving the gameplay flow of dagger/dagger.

    @Miatela.5047 said:
    No comments on the rework leaving us without a real support option that is viable in a range of content.

    @Miatela.5047 said:
    There have been no comments or responses on resolving the longstanding issue of Thief performing poorly in DPS and utility compared with other options which has been stirred up by this rework.

    and when they do comment or reply, they would do so to posts that half-agree with them or are easy_to_answer_minor_concerns.

    they never really respond directly to all the bigger issues even if we lay out all the facts here in the forums

    even if they just gave a long consolidated response regarding everyone's concerns would be a step in the right direction.

    but no! we aren't getting any so far and i fear that a lot of our problems re: thief here are probably going to get overlooked or straight up ignored.

  • Uhm maybe we can spam support so they'll notice this more? I'm just a newbie and my thief is just lvl62. Am monitoring this thread and this just makes me wanna stop playing it till the devs finally fix it.

  • Jack Redline.5379Jack Redline.5379 Member ✭✭✭✭

    I can agree with most of these posts but what actually makes me feel worried is that since page 3 no Dev answered anything. I think they are really not satisfied with how we dislike their actions toward class. My point is THIS TREATMENT OF THIEF SUCKS and i hope if you read this you will take a time and read this thread dear devs i know you did a lot of job on DE but it really didnt work out as you expected. It sucks really bad and we need to get on a level of other classes or we are forced to play something we dont want those who dont want to wont do that and will leave. Thieves used to be cool and strong makes us cool and strong again. STRONG DOESNT MEEN WE WANT POWER BUILD FOCUSED TRAITS WE WANT OUR CONDI THIEVES STRONG AS WELL WE ARE THEIVES WE SHOULD POISON PPL ONLY BY STANDING NEAR BY WE ARE THE BAD GUYS kitten IT

  • Bramymond.7689Bramymond.7689 Member ✭✭
    edited May 19, 2018

    @jenosmaverick.8694 said:
    Uhm maybe we can spam support so they'll notice this more? I'm just a newbie and my thief is just lvl62. Am monitoring this thread and this just makes me wanna stop playing it till the devs finally fix it.

    You should never let the opinion of other people dictate what class you play. If you enjoy it, thats all the reason you need to keep going. Pls keep in mind, that thief overall isnt in a completely bad spot, people in the forums just tend to hyperbole and get very passionate about a lot of things. Deadeye rework left a lot to wish for, but it´s getting there. Thief is lacking behind the other classes a bit, but it´s still a nice class for beginners and still offers a high skill ceiling for mechanics and stuff that doesn´t directly correspond to more dps (like skipping, movement, stealth etc.). It´s also reliable, u can easily high on the dps-meters with the right build and enough skill/understanding of the bosses. Imho thief shines the most in fractals, especially aetherblade. You can blow peoples mind by skipping all the puzzles in the time they take to kill the 2nd trash group XD

  • DragonSlayer.1087DragonSlayer.1087 Member ✭✭✭

    Increase the range to 2000, make #4 kneel stealth, heal skill should give you stealth if you hit a mark target.

  • Jack Redline.5379Jack Redline.5379 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Bramymond.7689 said:

    You should never let the opinion of other people dictate what class you play. If you enjoy it, thats all the reason you need to keep going. Pls keep in mind, that thief overall isnt in a completely bad spot, people in the forums just tend to hyperbole and get very passionate about a lot of things. Deadeye rework left a lot to wish for, but it´s getting there. Thief is lacking behind the other classes a bit, but it´s still a nice class for beginners and still offers a high skill ceiling for mechanics and stuff that doesn´t directly correspond to more dps (like skipping, movement, stealth etc.). It´s also reliable, u can easily high on the dps-meters with the right build and enough skill/understanding of the bosses. Imho thief shines the most in fractals, especially aetherblade. You can blow peoples mind by skipping all the puzzles in the time they take to kill the 2nd trash group XD

    I want 20kg of what this dude is smoking. I pay in bitcoin.

  • DemonSeed.3528DemonSeed.3528 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Jack Redline.5379 said:

    @Bramymond.7689 said:

    You should never let the opinion of other people dictate what class you play. If you enjoy it, thats all the reason you need to keep going. Pls keep in mind, that thief overall isnt in a completely bad spot, people in the forums just tend to hyperbole and get very passionate about a lot of things. Deadeye rework left a lot to wish for, but it´s getting there. Thief is lacking behind the other classes a bit, but it´s still a nice class for beginners and still offers a high skill ceiling for mechanics and stuff that doesn´t directly correspond to more dps (like skipping, movement, stealth etc.). It´s also reliable, u can easily high on the dps-meters with the right build and enough skill/understanding of the bosses. Imho thief shines the most in fractals, especially aetherblade. You can blow peoples mind by skipping all the puzzles in the time they take to kill the 2nd trash group XD

    I want 20kg of what this dude is smoking. I pay in bitcoin.

    you might never return if you'll be swallowin' the whole blue pill

  • Bramymond.7689Bramymond.7689 Member ✭✭
    edited May 21, 2018

    @Jack Redline.5379 said:

    @Bramymond.7689 said:

    You should never let the opinion of other people dictate what class you play. If you enjoy it, thats all the reason you need to keep going. Pls keep in mind, that thief overall isnt in a completely bad spot, people in the forums just tend to hyperbole and get very passionate about a lot of things. Deadeye rework left a lot to wish for, but it´s getting there. Thief is lacking behind the other classes a bit, but it´s still a nice class for beginners and still offers a high skill ceiling for mechanics and stuff that doesn´t directly correspond to more dps (like skipping, movement, stealth etc.). It´s also reliable, u can easily high on the dps-meters with the right build and enough skill/understanding of the bosses. Imho thief shines the most in fractals, especially aetherblade. You can blow peoples mind by skipping all the puzzles in the time they take to kill the 2nd trash group XD

    I want 20kg of what this dude is smoking. I pay in bitcoin.

    Funny enough, a colleague from work once said the same to me, when I came in for my shift at the crack of dawn with a big smile and an happy mood xD
    It’s called positive attitude, u should try it.

  • Armaelus.6120Armaelus.6120 Member ✭✭
    edited May 23, 2018

    I would like that Dev cancel the changes with the sniper and that they work properly what they want to do with this elite. I agree they have created a lot of issues that didn't exist before. I can't believe in 2018, it could be real...! I Wonder if they can realise there own mistake, tell the community it was nos intended and then, rollback the change in order to improve the futures changes.
    I think it'll be welcome !

  • Bern.9613Bern.9613 Member ✭✭

    Been playing around with DE for the past couple, three weeks, in wvw and pve. Soooo what's the point of malice, besides telegraphing to your target that you're "out 'n a boot" trying to kill him? And why, oh why, was condi removal taken from Death's retreat? Death's Retreat, pffffft. It should be renamed Get Outta Dodge (if you can) Get loaded up with every condi in the game by a mirage/memser or scourge/necro and you might as well lay down because they watch you burn. Good luck getting out of more then one stun or immob. And stealth on dodge... with rifle.... only. Really? I'm just not feeling the DE. It's sooo..... Dare i say it? Sigh. It's so rangerish.

  • babazhook.6805babazhook.6805 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Bern.9613 said:
    Been playing around with DE for the past couple, three weeks, in wvw and pve. Soooo what's the point of malice, besides telegraphing to your target that you're "out 'n a boot" trying to kill him? And why, oh why, was condi removal taken from Death's retreat? Death's Retreat, pffffft. It should be renamed Get Outta Dodge (if you can) Get loaded up with every condi in the game by a mirage/memser or scourge/necro and you might as well lay down because they watch you burn. Good luck getting out of more then one stun or immob. And stealth on dodge... with rifle.... only. Really? I'm just not feeling the DE. It's sooo..... Dare i say it? Sigh. It's so rangerish.

    Condition removal was not taken away from Deaths Retreat.

  • Guys, Farcry 5 is pretty fun... jusayin.

  • Specialka.7290Specialka.7290 Member ✭✭✭

    @Khazik.8052 said:
    Guys, Farcry 5 is pretty fun... jusayin.

    If you have bad taste.

  • Specialka.7290Specialka.7290 Member ✭✭✭

    Just a dream and it is stupid to think it was better before. The rotation is much better now. Damage is not for sure, but they will tweak it eventually. They shoud also add some F3/F4/F5 skills as well. I would like to have Mercy as F3, Shadow Gust as F4 and binding shadow as F5. Thx very much.

  • MUDse.7623MUDse.7623 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 27, 2018

    @Hikarifuxi.4761 said:
    Fact is, I do see a lot Daredevil Thiefs now again. I haven't seen any since PoF tbh, but it seems many have changed the profession because of that and this, I think, tells more about an update than just "crying around in the forum"..

    probably depends on mode, in WvW in EU there were never many deadeyes for extended periods. after each patch you see alot of thieves try out the new changes but most drop it after few days. there was more daredevil and core thieves since PoF release here. deadeye is after the patch still nearly at the same point in WvW as it was before, people will say deadeye is weak and anyone playing it got 0 skill and if you happen to kill them its because you got carried by that weak build. there are few differences now to before the patch tho. good players you can now kill easier then before patch ( mainly cause MBackstab and stealth on dodge being uninterruptable), but fighting bad players in a large group is now harder, before you would just go for a oneshot in such a situation to not rise suspicion and with the suprise would have enough time for the stomp, now you either need to wait nearly 2min in wich anyone will realize the mark and most probably communicate or you need to attack before but that will cause his allies to get ready to ressurect.

    @Specialka.7290 said:
    Just a dream and it is stupid to think it was better before. The rotation is much better now. Damage is not for sure, but they will tweak it eventually. They shoud also add some F3/F4/F5 skills as well. I would like to have Mercy as F3, Shadow Gust as F4 and binding shadow as F5. Thx very much.

    what do we get as utilities instead then? i mean i have a few ideas here one example :
    scapegoat
    your marked target connects to up to 5 nearby other targets and takes 100% of the damage they recieve for 5 seconds. cooldown 25 seconds.
    this way deadeye can copy the cleave damage onto the main target for not having cleave damage on his own. putting that on a mesmer while killing the clones could be little OP, but hey everyone hates mesmers so its fine :D

  • Specialka.7290Specialka.7290 Member ✭✭✭

    @Hikarifuxi.4761 said:

    @Specialka.7290 said:
    Just a dream and it is stupid to think it was better before. The rotation is much better now. Damage is not for sure, but they will tweak it eventually. They shoud also add some F3/F4/F5 skills as well. I would like to have Mercy as F3, Shadow Gust as F4 and binding shadow as F5. Thx very much.

    It can't be that stupid if so many think it's a bad "update". Good for you though, that you think it is more "fun" now. At least one happy person among many that are not.

    Which so many? What about those that did not say anything at all? It is always the most negatives ppl that will speak up. Unless you have some source to back your claim up, it is just BS.

  • Asahi.1487Asahi.1487 Member ✭✭

    I play only wvw/spvp. In wvw the DE changes actually buffed d/x builds. I can 1 shot people running full defensive gear. For rifle, it's in between TTK went up, but unblockable DJ is fun. Rifle 4 is clunky and the utility skills can use some fixing. Overall all can still kill things just got to play it differently

  • babazhook.6805babazhook.6805 Member ✭✭✭✭

    It took a bit of getting used to , but I am finding DE plays better for me then before at least in WvW where I spend most of my time. The Rifle spec jus needs a few more tweaks and they need to do some work on the weaker traits along with looking at Malice gain on low precision builds.

  • Jumpel.3972Jumpel.3972 Member ✭✭

    There are some bug/issues with these news changes.

    • DJ without be kneel sems to doesn't get the crit chance bonus from silent scope but the DJ tooltip and the trait silent scope say it the bonus should applie
    • When you stealth sometime the stealth attack launch him self for no reason, with the rifle it's end by an unwanted reavel...
    • In some configuration longbow ranger seems to bypass the new #4 on rifle (or maybe ranger have some skill/trait to make projectile unblockable that i don't know)
  • DemonSeed.3528DemonSeed.3528 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Jumpel.3972 said:
    There are some bug/issues with these news changes.

    • DJ without be kneel sems to doesn't get the crit chance bonus from silent scope but the DJ tooltip and the trait silent scope say it the bonus should applie
    • When you stealth sometime the stealth attack launch him self for no reason, with the rifle it's end by an unwanted reavel...
    • In some configuration longbow ranger seems to bypass the new #4 on rifle (or maybe ranger have some skill/trait to make projectile unblockable that i don't know)

    Aye they do have some unblockables

  • DeceiverX.8361DeceiverX.8361 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 29, 2018

    @Jumpel.3972 said:
    There are some bug/issues with these news changes.

    • DJ without be kneel sems to doesn't get the crit chance bonus from silent scope but the DJ tooltip and the trait silent scope say it the bonus should applie
    • When you stealth sometime the stealth attack launch him self for no reason, with the rifle it's end by an unwanted reavel...
    • In some configuration longbow ranger seems to bypass the new #4 on rifle (or maybe ranger have some skill/trait to make projectile unblockable that i don't know)

    Ranger has a lot of unblockable attack access now due to FB and mirage being unkillable with longbow otherwise. Depending on the build, it usually hovers between 6 to 12s.

    You sure that Sniper idea is as good as you thought it was gonna be?
    Because I think my original idea is better.
    Quit/Inactive. No, you can't have my stuff.

  • DragonSlayer.1087DragonSlayer.1087 Member ✭✭✭

    @Gatvin.6510 said:

    I don't think deadeye is a bad concept, but "interactive" and "sniper" ARE mutually opposed concepts. It will be tough to get them to work well together, but right now rifle is barely functional. I LOVE the tradeoff on kneel, but due to lack of other strengths, there's almost no right time to do it except right at the start of the fight, and Malice muddles a lot of that. I DON'T know if these will work, but potshots at some ways to smooth things out a bit:
    -Increase attack range to compensate for the lack of pets/ illusions. Like base 1500 at least/1800-2000 when kneeling
    -Give the rifle an aoe attack
    -Make Thief traps better

    https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/40822/more-crazy-ideas-for-deadeye-rework#latest

  • Scud.5067Scud.5067 Member ✭✭✭

    @Gatvin.6510 said:
    Now instead of bursting them down you need to not just attack them, but specifically burn your initiative building up malice on them. If you do that and your opponent turns on the defensive cooldowns, you've wasted your initiative, gained no malice, and probably did no damage.

    Good post, interesting read - thank you.

    Just on this: I played DE for a short while before the change, so now my experience is becoming mostly with post-change DE. With this is in mind, I've found that the current rifle-focused DE works very well as a skirmish brawler, where as you say, you have to attack then DJ as a finisher/pressure. This also lends itself to more resilient setups means DJ is dodged less, if at all, since the focus of play (or at least mine) is to force them to dodge before hitting them with a DJ. And if they don't dodge, then they're taking a chunk of everything else. And if that super-critical DJ was dodged? Chances are too much was riding on it - but good thing there's many a way to gain stealth to unleash another.

    Side note: This also ties in with my experience play a sharpshooter in another FPS game _(with platoons of players) - the role was about pressuring key targets from range for the finish, rather than bursting as quickly as possible. While the latter could be done, such players were typically relegated to lone wolf status and their kills factored little in the 'ole grand scheme of things._

  • Gatvin.6510Gatvin.6510 Member ✭✭

    It feels wierd, but I think its maybe correct to mostly ignore malice and just fire off DJ whenever you get the window for it ( in terms of having enough stealth abilities off cd that you'll have one to disengage if you need).

    Its a fair point that Rifle can be, in its own way, good zone control by putting on pressure. I wasn't thinking about that as much because its not directly rewarded, but it is definitely real, especially in pvp matches. My experience is (if they know how to fight) after one or two dodges are burned, they throw up anti missle defenses or just anti-damage defenses, and then you can't build any malice on them to get off a good DJ. They DO usually go down, but its not because I hit them, its because I burned their cooldowns and my team killed them. If they REALLY know what they're doing they just sit outside your attack range and punch your team. And while Rifle can pressure a single target, its important to remember that if you go Shortbow, you have great single AND multi target pressure.

    For world vs. world this is particularly important for getting rewards/participation. You might take a couple of key scourges out of a 20-30 man zerg, but you'll only really get credit for two or three hard-earned kills, while the ranger, the dragonhunter, the scourge, the mesmer and the elementalist will be racking up kill credit just rolling their face on the keyboard.

  • babazhook.6805babazhook.6805 Member ✭✭✭✭

    It feels wierd, but I think its maybe correct to mostly ignore malice and just fire off DJ whenever you get the window for it ( in terms of having enough stealth abilities off cd that you'll have one to disengage if you need).

    One reason I use RS in my build with Rifle is because DJ can benefit even when there no malice. DJ hits hard in its own right and very often you do not need the extra damage as something dead or near dead via regular attacks. DJ is still unblockable without malice as well so the way I look at it boon theft+unblockable+very decent attack for no ini after a dodge is well worth it. If you happen to have malice up it just better.

    As to traps. Needle trap is premium. 5 poison 3 bleed and an Immob is significant in a Condition build and the lesser trap via respite even gets another poison stack. The only downside is the small area it covers.

    Shadowtrap is also a very good trap WHEN it works. If they address the pathing issues with the port I would put this up there against any trap mark or well for effectivness and utility. It can be quite sweet pre-setting a shadowtrap then moving to range using rifle and porting in for a backstab when the enemy heads your way and trips it . I will use this a lot in WvW. I find it very useful in 1vX fights as well as an escape if things go bad. It just hard trying to ensure the port will work when it needs to work.

    The larger issue with traps is just as with venoms there just not a lot of space to trait more then one. There too much other stuff (stealth/stunbreak cleanses) that are needed.

    Tripwire and ambush need some work.

  • Delweyn.1309Delweyn.1309 Member ✭✭✭

    sniper's cover : one of the most useless skill created. No one use it.

  • DragonSlayer.1087DragonSlayer.1087 Member ✭✭✭

    @Delweyn.1309 said:
    sniper's cover : one of the most useless skill created. No one use it.

    Yup. I tried using it on WvW, it's so clunky. They tried putting it as some kind of combo field skill for Death's Retreat (stealth) and Projectile (blind) but sometime's it doesn't even work, like it's bugged.

  • Turk.5460Turk.5460 Member ✭✭✭✭

    I wish they would give us Unforgiving back. It was extremely useful against mobile professions.

    Fort Aspenwood
    Jekkies

  • I don't know if I am in the right place, if not hope some one can put this in the right spot.

    I must say I never come down here to see ppl nag so much about change in gw2, but I really wanted to see for my self what ppl think about DE, seam ppl talk a lot about how sniper cover I think they call it, it a bad thing,
    I have played DE about a month after it came out and ever since, it pretty good, but about 90% useless most part but still great, and I like it very much, sad really how thing has change for worst for most ppl and a little bad for me, but for what I am here,

    it seem they need to change how sniper cover work, @specialka.7290 had some thing going there with f3/f4/f5, but it seem likely that it not going to happen, but it some thing to think about, just a few though, why not throw sniper cover up to those f3/f4/f5, or some thing and add some new skill or some thing to the weapons skill it currently is now, but then we still have the problem that you can't run away or move from a AOE field, unless you press some thing again and so on,

    but then I said to my self, why not just get rid of sniper cover in a small way, still there but not a motion problem, why not make it so that went you have a rifle on, and your not moving your character would automatically go in sniper cover, and went you start running or walking , you would be no longer in sniper cover, there plenty of space were they can put cool down anyway like there is now in place, for sniper cover or stealth trait thing that ppl seam to like very much, it would stop ppl from nagging that sniper cover is useless .
    some one may are ready of come up with this, but I don't spend my time here so sorry if it already bin toll, any way it just a though, may be some one can improve on the thing I have said, rather then nag some more.

    I also think that deadeye is useless for most part in the game, since it had very little AOE skill at all, but if you take the AOE skill out of the equation, then deadeye is a great class to play and why I like it lot, unless lots of mobs come along then one would like to have staff on daredevil and just get rid of those fruit cake :D any how I hope ppl can come up with some thing better then me, or improve on the little I have said, and not the rest of the babble lol.
    good day/night folks and always have fun out there.

  • Miatela.5047Miatela.5047 Member ✭✭✭
    edited June 8, 2018

    In a hope to keep this thread alive and to try to keep Anet's attention on the fact we need more work now than before the rework (and because I'm super irritating and want an off-meta viable support option for Deadeye in PvE), here's a response I made about support Deadeye to a thread on reddit. For what it is worth, we've had two changes impacting Thief in the the last month - a bug fix and the removal of permanent revealed on Deimos which, while a buff for Deadeye which was struggling on the boss, is an indirect nerf to power Daredevil which still does some of the worst damage out of the "meta" builds. At this stage, changes like this need to be compensated with baseline buffs to Thief builds.

    Might in raids and instanced PvE beyond speed-run fractals (which most people are unlikely to be attempting) is provided by a Druid. As it stands, one Druid can easily cover a full 10 person raid with 25 Might continuously by losing a small amount of healing by running Grace of the Land over Lingering Light and using some Harrier gear - possibly with sigil of concentration. As the game stands currently, there really aren't any encounters which stress healing output and management so it any healing lost by running a Might share Druid is easily soaked up by the secondary healer which can now, in most cases, be a Firebrand, Scourge, Tempest, Renegade, Druid or Scrapper. This means a raid group doesn't have much of an opportunity cost to bring a Might share Druid.

    Running Might share Deadeye does, however, carry a considerable penalty. Thief doesn't really have much utility but Deadeye is able to stand relatively well against most other DPS options so long as the fight favours power and doesn't have a large hitbox for Weaver to exploit. However, running Might share Deadeye is a difference of about 12k benchmark DPS and the rotational use of multiple cantrips to gain Stolen Skills, further reducing both the damage and utility of a Deadeye. Unlike healing, which can be mopped up easily by the secondary healing, there is no new magical source of DPS from the Deadeye running Might share.

    Warrior illustrates this point well. Despite banners and spirits in their current unique passive state being a detriment to game balance and ensuring we've had a Chrono/ Druid / Warrior hegemony for the past three years, the numerical balancing of the different warrior builds is very good and should be a model on which support Deadeye balance is based.

    A warrior loses about 4 - 6k DPS on a small hitbox by running banners. This is far, far less than the approximately 12k lost by Might share Deadeye. Since I hope Arenanet will be reworking the Deadeye rework, I'd propose making sure that Deadeye can hit about 34 - 35k DPS with a low cleave, single target rotation with either Be Quick or Be Killed or Maleficent Seven but doesn't pay such an opportunity cost to provide Might. Ideally, Might share Deadeye shouldn't have to run more than Deadeye 3 - 3 - 3 and a couple of cantrips to maintain full Might. This would necessitate a change for Fire for Effect which could be split for PvE only. A PvE Fire for Effect that applies 10 Might for 18 seconds on the use of a Stolen Skill would be ideal along with a support Deadeye bringing 30k benchmark dps.

    This would allow Might and Fury share Deadeye to be viable in some off-meta compositions and would also further increase the relatively poor support diversity of GW2 PvE. With a Deadeye bringing full Might to a raid and not giving up so much DPS and utility, there would be the option to run compositions that do not include a Druid at all in both raids and fractals. I'd personally love to see how combinations like Deadeye, Tempest and Scourge would do in raids.

  • Turk.5460Turk.5460 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Casting Sniper's Cover while a smoke line is already up seems to lose the projectile-block for a moment. A bit frustrating, though using that skill in general seems to be frustrating to many.

    Fort Aspenwood
    Jekkies

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