Nerf Mesmer pull

As said above. It rlly gets out of hand. There are always mesmers that pull you from one side of the wall down on the other side. 600 range is just too much.We'll you could say necro pull is 1200 range. But you need LoS.You cannot pull someone from one edge of a wall over the whole wall down on the other side.

Mesmer can. Because no LoS required.That makes defending objectives pretty hard since people can be pulled out of their defending siege weapons pretty easily.

if using any siege would be a transformation, therefor when you use them you become one with the siege and only take damage to your real HP once the siege is down, like in golems basically. then you would not have that issue and you could man cannons / oil etc without that being a deathtrap.no need to nerf a profession skill becase of a siege issue.

Hehe, I could see how it could be a problem especially if there is few mes, fbrand, scourge there - two mes pull/continuum shift, keep pulling+gravity well, fbrand pull, scourge aoe - it's hard to stay on wall for sure. If siege shared hp like golem that might encourage more siege hump though, so maybe mes focus could take some tweaking.

Mesmer pull is fine. You have enough advantage if you are defending stuff. Just use a stunbreak or stability. Also I think the pull is quite visible. There is also not so much mesmers around and pull is one of their best tools for fights and siege.

Maybe you should start fighting with players instead of siege.

This week is probably one of the very rare cases I saw people building siege for only 2 people. It's getting disgusting.

@Garrus.7403 said:Mesmer pull is fine. You have enough advantage if you are defending stuff. Just use a stunbreak or stability. Also I think the pull is quite visible. There is also not so much mesmers around and pull is one of their best tools for fights and siege.

The pull is almost invisible to people on the wall. Because mesmers place it on the side of that wall. So you have to watch top of the wall, side of the wall and enemy?

It's pretty hard defending an objective with low man, because meteors and scourges torch 5.

Firebrand has only 240 radius on his pull with 3/4 seconds casttime (8seconds cd). That's ok and cannot pull people over the whole wall.

Mesmer has 600 radius with 1/4 seconds casttime (25 seconds cd)But with continuum split it's only 12.5 seconds ( as you can cast it 2 times) also mesmer can buff alacrity to lower the cd.

So I definetly think it needs a nerf.

@Garrus.7403 said:Mesmer pull is fine. You have enough advantage if you are defending stuff. Just use a stunbreak or stability. Also I think the pull is quite visible. There is also not so much mesmers around and pull is one of their best tools for fights and siege.

About the visibility, it can actually be hidden if aimed below the wall, the focus is not rendered on the other side but it still pulls - there is of course an audio cue when this happens though [the pull that is]. Here is an example - I am standing a few steps down in Bravost, operating an ac that is at the top of the inner wall lip. Being a few steps down [i use the wall as a buffer for any pull attacks, meaning I should only be pulled up against it, the inner wall face], I should not be able to be pulled [due to the wall stopping me] but what happens is you get dragged to the top of the stairs and towards the edge of the outer wall lip face. This is just with one mes. Whether it is op or not, that is debatable but the fact is the pull is far reaching/strong [requires no los, goes through structures]. Could we have the same pull for engi/thief/guardian/etc in that case?

@DemonSeed.3528 said:

@Garrus.7403 said:Mesmer pull is fine. You have enough advantage if you are defending stuff. Just use a stunbreak or stability. Also I think the pull is quite visible. There is also not so much mesmers around and pull is one of their best tools for fights and siege.

Two mesmers: one gravity well, one focus pull. Can lift you right over the wall lol.

@Strider Pj.2193 said:

@DemonSeed.3528 said:

@Garrus.7403 said:Mesmer pull is fine. You have enough advantage if you are defending stuff. Just use a stunbreak or stability. Also I think the pull is quite visible. There is also not so much mesmers around and pull is one of their best tools for fights and siege.

Actually I saw this happen recently it was hilarious but the same time sad - 1st mesmer pull + continuum shift + gravity well, 2nd mes just needs to pull. The person actually did not even touch ground from after first pull and gravity well lol and they were standing on inner wall lip. I've been seeing a few more of them lately, it was either prolly being retaught in some guild or spreading around. It's not a new thing for sure but many mesmers are coordinating it now. The last time I saw coordinated pulls like this was back in 2k16, I suppose 2k17 it went out of style maybe and also pof came along with new stuff to test. I don't mind if they can pull from around halfway of top of wall, but not from the inside inner lip of wall, that is a little too much.

@MUDse.7623 said:if using any siege would be a transformation, therefor when you use them you become one with the siege and only take damage to your real HP once the siege is down, like in golems basically. then you would not have that issue and you could man cannons / oil etc without that being a deathtrap.no need to nerf a profession skill becase of a siege issue.

Its not a siege issue, more like a wall issue. The way LoS works on walls is completely one-sided in favour of the attacker, which is completely counter-intuitive.

A mesmer using the focus is sort of like asking a thief to use p/d instead of d/p.

Yes, it can pull. Thats all it can do.

Also in comparison, I've seen firebrands continously knock people off catas with near zero cd from the wall but apparently thats not a problem...

@steki.1478 said:Maybe you should start fighting with players instead of siege.

This week is probably one of the very rare cases I saw people building siege for only 2 people. It's getting disgusting.

Apparently you haven't been playing much since PoF launch, and the new, and not so improved, pirate ship-condi-aoe spam meta has taken over...

@Odinens.5920 said:

@steki.1478 said:Maybe you should start fighting with players instead of siege.

This week is probably one of the very rare cases I saw people building siege for only 2 people. It's getting disgusting.

Looks like you havent heard of ele, rev, mesmer, ranger or deadeye. All counters to condi aoe spam (which is only one class).

@Dawdler.8521 said:A mesmer using the focus is sort of like asking a thief to use p/d instead of d/p.

Yes, it can pull. Thats all it can do.

Also in comparison, I've seen firebrands continously knock people off catas with near zero cd from the wall but apparently thats not a problem...

True, but this is why they keep a focus in inventory. Firebrands are also another issue with this pull but due to the cd.

@steki.1478 said:

@Odinens.5920 said:

@steki.1478 said:Maybe you should start fighting with players instead of siege.

This week is probably one of the very rare cases I saw people building siege for only 2 people. It's getting disgusting.

I ONLY play staff weaver/power scourge in WvW zerg groups.......and hate that I almost have to play scourge, but whatev.

The mesmer pull (which I rarely see in WvW) is the least of the balance issues. We have DH's that can launch ppl up 10000 units in the air and killing them, able to pull through walls (not spear but the pull). Yes you have a pull as well thats a longer range (and with a chill), however theirs is short range, thus slightly higher risk.

This here is all a learn to play and situational awareness. You see a mes, prepare some stab. If you dont have any, that falls on the player build. Maybe look at tweaking the build you use. Maybe throw some fields down on them to make them back off or better position siege. Its all about strategy.

If you need practice in dealing with the mes pull, lemme know.

@Bigpapasmurf.5623 said:The mesmer pull (which I rarely see in WvW) is the least of the balance issues. We have DH's that can launch ppl up 10000 units in the air and killing them, able to pull through walls (not spear but the pull). Yes you have a pull as well thats a longer range (and with a chill), however theirs is short range, thus slightly higher risk.

This here is all a learn to play and situational awareness. You see a mes, prepare some stab. If you dont have any, that falls on the player build. Maybe look at tweaking the build you use. Maybe throw some fields down on them to make them back off or better position siege. Its all about strategy.

If you need practice in dealing with the mes pull, lemme know.

True, but it doesn't stop the pull from working behind the actual wall [which imo should not happen]. Also true it's not high priority on the list of things, but this is one of the many problems in the endless list of problems. I don't doubt that some of it could be l2p issue, but not when you are standing behind the wall where normal pulls should not be an issue. I've been able to pull people this way and stop them from repairing walls as well. It's just one of the many unhealthy and uneeded things, it's best to mention everything we can as they are brought up.

@DemonSeed.3528 said:

@Bigpapasmurf.5623 said:The mesmer pull (which I rarely see in WvW) is the least of the balance issues. We have DH's that can launch ppl up 10000 units in the air and killing them, able to pull through walls (not spear but the pull). Yes you have a pull as well thats a longer range (and with a chill), however theirs is short range, thus slightly higher risk.

This here is all a learn to play and situational awareness. You see a mes, prepare some stab. If you dont have any, that falls on the player build. Maybe look at tweaking the build you use. Maybe throw some fields down on them to make them back off or better position siege. Its all about strategy.

If you need practice in dealing with the mes pull, lemme know.

The mention of learn to play was due to the fact that its been around for as long as I can remember, thus it is expected and generally accepted. It wasnt mentioned as a bug or exploit as it working as intended. It adds to an attacking teams counterplay to being seiged from the walls (ive never used it, however its been used on me and when I am AC'ing their group, it def works as a form of counterplay).

@DemonSeed.3528 said:

@Bigpapasmurf.5623 said:The mesmer pull (which I rarely see in WvW) is the least of the balance issues. We have DH's that can launch ppl up 10000 units in the air and killing them, able to pull through walls (not spear but the pull). Yes you have a pull as well thats a longer range (and with a chill), however theirs is short range, thus slightly higher risk.

This here is all a learn to play and situational awareness. You see a mes, prepare some stab. If you dont have any, that falls on the player build. Maybe look at tweaking the build you use. Maybe throw some fields down on them to make them back off or better position siege. Its all about strategy.

If you need practice in dealing with the mes pull, lemme know.

Well I suppose we could make it a fair trade if you also removed the ability for AoEs like meteorshower or shades to hit beyond the direct LoS of the caster, such as across walls.

@Dawdler.8521 said:

@DemonSeed.3528 said:

@Bigpapasmurf.5623 said:The mesmer pull (which I rarely see in WvW) is the least of the balance issues. We have DH's that can launch ppl up 10000 units in the air and killing them, able to pull through walls (not spear but the pull). Yes you have a pull as well thats a longer range (and with a chill), however theirs is short range, thus slightly higher risk.

This here is all a learn to play and situational awareness. You see a mes, prepare some stab. If you dont have any, that falls on the player build. Maybe look at tweaking the build you use. Maybe throw some fields down on them to make them back off or better position siege. Its all about strategy.

If you need practice in dealing with the mes pull, lemme know.

If that happens, I would be able to hear the anger and screaming of all WvW necros and eles everythere. :p

Skills like Temporal Curtain are necessary for WvW. Its a unique play maker to briefly disrupt people on siege or make them explode in other allies' aoe.

If you are on the wall and see a bunch of marks you should probably anticipate having to negate a temporal curtain pull (into the void). It has a 1 second delay and makes an obnoxious noise. Yes, I actually know the name of the roll-over skill for Temporal Curtain. Its called learning.

I don't think any prof should be able to pull a defender off a wall. I get the CC of it as above pulling someone off siege, but the mesmer one in particular is just over the top, pulling you off the wall and insta killing you.

You are already risking getting insta downed from damage alone defending a wall, but you then worry can you get back in if you get pulled. Really, defending is not fun. It used to be if something was under attack people showed up and defended it, but now, people leave it go and recap it. I really wish they would tilt a little more reward to defending and remove wall pulls.

As i dont like been pulled from wall to zerg and destroyed in seconds, its nice part of game, and option how to beat ppl hiding on wall and doing whatever.

@Justine.6351 said:Skills like Temporal Curtain are necessary for WvW. Its a unique play maker to briefly disrupt people on siege or make them explode in other allies' aoe.

If you are on the wall and see a bunch of marks you should probably anticipate having to negate a temporal curtain pull (into the void). It has a 1 second delay and makes an obnoxious noise. Yes, I actually know the name of the roll-over skill for Temporal Curtain. Its called learning.

The thing is it can pull people from the 8th-11th step from top of inner part of stairs - that is no longer a part of the top of the wall. It pulls you from the stairs to the topside of the wall and drags you to the edge. It has a bigger reach than it should. Sure, top of the wall, no problem, but not at the places I've talked about.

@Nimon.7840 said:As said above. It rlly gets out of hand. There are always mesmers that pull you from one side of the wall down on the other side. 600 range is just too much.We'll you could say necro pull is 1200 range. But you need LoS.You cannot pull someone from one edge of a wall over the whole wall down on the other side.

Mesmer can. Because no LoS required.That makes defending objectives pretty hard since people can be pulled out of their defending siege weapons pretty easily.

this , also Necro AoE all of it not just scourge ignores LoS when you use Snap Cast to target or a camera exploit or hack im not aware of, same goes for elementalist , so its basically an exploit done with Ground targetted AoE regardless of profession.