Destiny's Edge in Cantha? — Guild Wars 2 Forums

Destiny's Edge in Cantha?

Alga.6498Alga.6498 Member ✭✭✭✭
edited May 25, 2018 in Lore

Well, this question has been up for years and I've been thinking for this for years aswell, :lol:
But reading about Destiny's Edge what they've been up to before PC became a hero, they've been fighting against Kralkatorrik once Before and his minions, loosing Snaff and Glint, fighting against Destroyers, the Guild disbanded, and also fighting in Jade Sea!

So DE has actually been in Cantha?! Why are there not more information about this? They've been fighting at the Jade Sea so that means they've been in Cantha, even though they kicked out and banned all non-human creatures and closed it's border, though this was before Zhaitan was awaken… so that's probably why. ;)
BUT still!!!! :)

| Separatist | Nightmare Court | Inquest | White Mantle | Sunspears | Loyalists | Ascalon | Kryta | Ebonhawke | Elona | Istan | Kourna | Vabbi | Cantha | Luxon | Kurzick | 71 characters | "Rally to me, Ascalonians!" "Keep Ascalon in your heart." "May the Gods protect you." "Be blessed by the Six."

Comments

  • Konig Des Todes.2086Konig Des Todes.2086 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 25, 2018

    Conceptual art, not meant to portray actual lore but artists presenting ideas.

    Destiny's Edge has never been to Cantha. Heck, we can't even be sure that "jade sea" mentioned here is "The Jade Sea" or just named such because it's a greenish sea setting. Presuming this was meant to depict DE in Cantha, it might have been an idea from before "Cantha got cut off" was a thing (after all, Caithe here is shown as a spellcaster).

    they kicked out and banned all non-human creatures and closed it's border, though this was before Zhaitan was awaken

    This actually happened after Zhaitan woke up, as the tengu had to make their way through risen forces to reach Kryta.

  • Aaron Ansari.1604Aaron Ansari.1604 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Konig Des Todes.2086 said:

    This actually happened after Zhaitan woke up, as the tengu had to make their way through risen forces to reach Kryta.

    Hard to say. The Movement of the World is still our only half-decent source on the Canthan timeline, and it makes clear that the process had at least begun by the time Orr rose. Hidden Arcana suggests they were driven out even earlier, and that there may have been a period of exile before they claimed the Dominion, which might explain Hayato's strange comment about Elonian tengu.

    R.I.P., Old Man of Auld Red Wharf. Gone but never forgotten.

  • Konig Des Todes.2086Konig Des Todes.2086 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 25, 2018

    The Movement of the World also has seems to have Jormag and Zhaitan's awakening times swapped, as Jormag is said to have woken up around 100 years ago (rather than 150) while the order of dragon awakening is suggested to be (to me at least) Primordus -> Zhaitan -> Jormag -> DSD -> Kralkatorrik in the Movement.

    In addition to Hayato's comment about Elonian tengu (which isn't unlikely given that we didn't explore all of Elona, they could have been in Dzalana or east of Kourna, away from humanity), he mentions that "A descendent of the venerable Silverwing led our people here through waves of Orrian corruption."

    Further, in Divinity's Reach, there's a very specific dialogue talking about leaving Kryta and the whole "where do we go?" One was about Cantha:

    Citizen (1): I'm so tired of hearing about all these bandit attacks. I should move someplace nicer, like Elona.
    Citizen (2): Elona? We haven't heard from them in decades. It might be nicer, if anyone's still there, but with Orr so close...
    Citizen (1): Oh. Right. Well, what about Cantha, then? Surely they can't have it that bad.
    Citizen (2): The tengu were the last ones to make that trip. But that was over a century ago, and they were leaving. And they went right past—
    Citizen (1): Orr, right. Well, I guess the bandits aren't that bad.

    Suggesting that the tengu had, just as Hayato says, gone through risen forces.

    EDIT: Furthermore, Sea of Sorrows makes no mention of tengu ever, suggesting that this migration may have happened after 1256 AE; or at the very least, after Act 3 (1230 AE).

  • Aaron Ansari.1604Aaron Ansari.1604 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Konig Des Todes.2086 said:
    The Movement of the World also has seems to have Jormag and Zhaitan's awakening times swapped, as Jormag is said to have woken up around 100 years ago (rather than 150) while the order of dragon awakening is suggested to be (to me at least) Primordus -> Zhaitan -> Jormag -> DSD -> Kralkatorrik in the Movement.

    I'd considered that, but it pushes the tengu migration even further back, not forwards- if it was a direct swap between the dragons, it'd mean that they were slated to make the journey before 1165.

    In addition to Hayato's comment about Elonian tengu (which isn't unlikely given that we didn't explore all of Elona, they could have been in Dzalana or east of Kourna, away from humanity), he mentions that "A descendent of the venerable Silverwing led our people here through waves of Orrian corruption."

    He doesn't say where he led them from, though. We only assume Cantha because we'd been assuming that they went straight from Cantha to the Dominion, but that's not actually supported anywhere in Hayato's dialogue- any sea travel from Elona to the Dominion, for instance, would also entail passing Orr.

    (I find it more compelling that he does mention that there were still tengu in Cantha at that point, which, in conjunction with the Movement talking about Usoku 'beginning' a crackdown, makes me think that the expulsion of non-humans was more of a period of time than one discrete event.)

    Further, in Divinity's Reach, there's a very specific dialogue talking about leaving Kryta and the whole "where do we go?" One was about Cantha:

    Citizen (1): I'm so tired of hearing about all these bandit attacks. I should move someplace nicer, like Elona.
    Citizen (2): Elona? We haven't heard from them in decades. It might be nicer, if anyone's still there, but with Orr so close...
    Citizen (1): Oh. Right. Well, what about Cantha, then? Surely they can't have it that bad.
    Citizen (2): The tengu were the last ones to make that trip. But that was over a century ago, and they were leaving. And they went right past—
    Citizen (1): Orr, right. Well, I guess the bandits aren't that bad.

    Suggesting that the tengu had, just as Hayato says, gone through risen forces.

    No mention of risen in that, just an observation that the route goes too close to Orr to be viable for travel in 1325.

    EDIT: Furthermore, Sea of Sorrows makes no mention of tengu ever, suggesting that this migration may have happened after 1256 AE; or at the very least, after Act 3 (1230 AE).

    Why would it? None of the activity in the novel takes place on or near Sanctum Cay, and with everything else going on (and with Sanctum Cay seemingly abandoned long beforehand), there's no reason to expect that a fledgling tengu colony would be brought up- or even noticed.

    R.I.P., Old Man of Auld Red Wharf. Gone but never forgotten.

  • Konig Des Todes.2086Konig Des Todes.2086 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 25, 2018

    @Aaron Ansari.1604 said:

    @Konig Des Todes.2086 said:
    The Movement of the World also has seems to have Jormag and Zhaitan's awakening times swapped, as Jormag is said to have woken up around 100 years ago (rather than 150) while the order of dragon awakening is suggested to be (to me at least) Primordus -> Zhaitan -> Jormag -> DSD -> Kralkatorrik in the Movement.

    I'd considered that, but it pushes the tengu migration even further back, not forwards- if it was a direct swap between the dragons, it'd mean that they were slated to make the journey before 1165.

    I don't see an issue in this. The entire isolationism of Cantha was pushed back as well with Sea of Sorrows (if not beforehand internally), which makes mention of Cobiah (or more accurately, the Indomitable) trading with Cantha shortly before / during 1219 AE. Basically, when you discount The Movement of the World, all sources (except this guy who matches the Movement) basically tell us that Cantha's full out isolationism and xenophobia happened after Zhaitan's rise, and we only know of this thanks to the tengu who fled through the risen forces (if it really was full out isolationism; remember that the Movement does make mention of Canthan ships washing ashore Tyrian coasts, which seems a mighty far distance if they weren't sending out ships our way for a while after Zhaitan's rise).

    As you said, I don't think it was a singular event - such things rarely are - but trade with the Krytan government lasted more than 200 years prior to the game as the Movement and the Canthan Scholar would claim.

    @Aaron Ansari.1604 said:
    Why would it? None of the activity in the novel takes place on or near Sanctum Cay, and with everything else going on (and with Sanctum Cay seemingly abandoned long beforehand), there's no reason to expect that a fledgling tengu colony would be brought up- or even noticed.

    There were quite a few discussions about the ongoings of Kryta as a whole as a repercussion of Zhaitan's rise and LA's independence. Further, the Dominion of Winds had made the same "transgressions" as Lion's Arch did by taking Krytan soil and becoming independent. Yet for all of the unrelated-to-LA discussions about Beade and Edair, not one mention of the exact same situation being done by tengu just a few days travel away from Lion's Arch.

    Fledgling colony or not, it was a case of non-humans annexing human territory. And said humans got pissed when a human did the same and allowed non-humans into that annexed land.

©2010–2018 ArenaNet, LLC. All rights reserved. Guild Wars, Guild Wars 2, Heart of Thorns, Guild Wars 2: Path of Fire, ArenaNet, NCSOFT, the Interlocking NC Logo, and all associated logos and designs are trademarks or registered trademarks of NCSOFT Corporation. All other trademarks are the property of their respective owners.