Petless Ranger dps testing data — Guild Wars 2 Forums

Petless Ranger dps testing data

Aomine.5012Aomine.5012 Member ✭✭✭
edited September 12, 2017 in Ranger

This post is like a reminder for Anet about the issue of power ranger .
I think making Soulbeast much stronger in terms of power build is not the way to go to fix Power ranger. Fixing the weapon power coefficient itself is the way to go there because otherwise you're just pigeon-hole and polarize build diversity.

PS: Pet's dps is around 2~2.5k (Lynx's dps) max if you don't grab nature magic due to target limit of boon application and boon priority issue (Always go to players first even though they're not even in your party)

Traits:

Marksmanship: Steady Aim, Predator
Skirmishing: Sharpened Edge, Spotter, Vicious
Beastmaster: Two Hand Training, Honed Axe

Gears: Full Berzerker
Ascended Weapon with Sigil of Fire and Sigil of Force
Ascended Trinkets
Exotic Armors with Rune of Scholar

Utility: Signet of Wild (Not bringing Sharpened Edge because rangers will most likely bring spirits)
This test is assumed I have all boons and all class exclusive buffs/ banners/ spirits/ glyph/ alacrity
This test uses 6% + 3% power utility and 100 power 70 precision food. (No ferocity)

All Golems have 25 stacks of Vulnerability and Cripple
The test is taking 5 dps numbers from Raid Golem and take the average of that number

GS: 14864
Sword Axe + GS: 17612
Sword Axe: 20254
Sword Axe + Axe Warhorn: 20298
Axe Warhorn: 15217
Axe Axe: 18355
Longbow (1000+ range + Predator): 16779
Longbow (1000+ range + LtW): 14911
Longbow (melee range + Predator): 14797
Sword Axe + LB (Quick Draw): 17206
Sword Axe + LB (Vicious Quarry): 19379

As you can see, it is much lower than most of the classes when using all boons.
For reference Guardian can reach 34k~35k with their power build, while thief can reach around 29k.

Comments

  • this is sad, i dunno if was you that posted in the old forums but i read somewhere that guardians can reach 30k plus of dps and we cant barely get to 20k lol, guardians been a support class kinda (i know there r no roles but that is how you kinda see guards). When you play in PvE with ranger and other classes you kinda feel it takes longer to kill stuff with ranger than other classes, that is why i love my thief.

    Yea i saw you mention the guardian dps at the end, didnt saw that before writing but yea.

  • It's a problem till you have full condi set, then you can solo Champs like other professions wish they could. Pets are a perfect meat shield. Easy to solo Tier 1 Guild Bounties solo on condi ranger.

  • Aomine.5012Aomine.5012 Member ✭✭✭

    @NemesiS.6749 said:
    this is sad, i dunno if was you that posted in the old forums but i read somewhere that guardians can reach 30k plus of dps and we cant barely get to 20k lol, guardians been a support class kinda (i know there r no roles but that is how you kinda see guards). When you play in PvE with ranger and other classes you kinda feel it takes longer to kill stuff with ranger than other classes, that is why i love my thief.

    Yea i saw you mention the guardian dps at the end, didnt saw that before writing but yea.

    Yes it is me.

    Also I have my own Guardian, and I did the testing myself already.
    With the current Dragon Hunter benchmark set, my Guardian can reach 35k dps without ever swapping out of GS.

  • But still, shouldn't we be happy that there is POSSIBLY different play style to implement with ranger, than just next zerker? It has flaws, but at the same time, gameplay experience is slightly more unique, when you play ranger in comparison to typical DPS builds.

    Of course, again, it has to be about time ;) Like people couldn't enjoy game itself.

  • Ive always been power build and will always be. Conditions just seem lackluster.

    I've always enjoyed power builds

  • I play exclusively Power Ranger, but I sometimes switch to my Daredevil, the difference is extreme.

    Thank you for this post, I will still play ranger because I like the pet and I doubt ArenaNET will ever buff it.

  • Luna.1598Luna.1598 Member ✭✭
    edited September 13, 2017

    I think classes should always feel unique, but the damage across the dps classes needs to be looked at. You should be able to play a variety of dps classes and have them all be effective. I don't understand the point of having one or two classes be the best at dps, when all this really does is force certain classes out of the meta.

    There is really no need or purpose to have so many different classes if only a few of them will every be selected for high level fractals or raids, because they are the best option for dps/support. I love the game and appreciate what we have, but I do feel like Arena Net could do a better job of keeping all the classes relevant.

  • Substance E.4852Substance E.4852 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @NemesiS.6749 said:
    this is sad, i dunno if was you that posted in the old forums but i read somewhere that guardians can reach 30k plus of dps and we cant barely get to 20k lol, guardians been a support class kinda (i know there r no roles but that is how you kinda see guards). When you play in PvE with ranger and other classes you kinda feel it takes longer to kill stuff with ranger than other classes, that is why i love my thief.

    Yea i saw you mention the guardian dps at the end, didnt saw that before writing but yea.

    Even full condi is like #11 against small targets and is actually ~0.5k behind rifle engineer. They have a much harder rotation for that build but it still shows how rough things are. No one even uses rifle on engineer and it's still better than our best.

    https://qtfy.eu/guildwars/benchmarks-august-balance-patch/

  • @Substance E.4852 said:

    @NemesiS.6749 said:
    this is sad, i dunno if was you that posted in the old forums but i read somewhere that guardians can reach 30k plus of dps and we cant barely get to 20k lol, guardians been a support class kinda (i know there r no roles but that is how you kinda see guards). When you play in PvE with ranger and other classes you kinda feel it takes longer to kill stuff with ranger than other classes, that is why i love my thief.

    Yea i saw you mention the guardian dps at the end, didnt saw that before writing but yea.

    Even full condi is like #11 against small targets and is actually ~0.5k behind rifle engineer. They have a much harder rotation for that build but it still shows how rough things are. No one even uses rifle on engineer and it's still better than our best.

    https://qtfy.eu/guildwars/benchmarks-august-balance-patch/

    wow lol, i know anet cant fix everything, i know it probably takes a lot of time probably to fix something simple with so much code and kitten, i dont know. But seriously sometimes i wonder if they do play their game, listen or see all this. Its honestly sad, i dont even log in to my ranger anymore that much. I hope soulbeast change things a little but i doubt it, if on release its the same state as it was in the beta meeeeh nothing wow and will still be low tier and getting kicked of wvw groups.

  • tigirius.9014tigirius.9014 Member ✭✭✭
    edited September 13, 2017

    I can see this being a similar problem here as it was in another game title I used to play where a ranged class was built on it's pet damage and couldn't let go.
    This is going to turn into a balance nightmare because I can see that they'll most likely add a trait or a function that will increase a rangers damage output by a percentage only to get complaints from the people in PVP and after several tries never getting the percentage increase correct because of how the numbers in these games typically go.

    They should have made this class have all of it's damage on it's own and given the pets various options for either creating boons, increasing stats, creating condi or even enhancing condis, and/or CCing-draining-debuffing enemies from the start without a pet base damage of it's own which would eliminate the base damage issue.

  • Substance E.4852Substance E.4852 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited September 13, 2017

    They don't even need to buff our ranged.

    As much as I would love longbow to be more menacing without having to go full glass, the main problem lies with our incredibly weak melee.

    Greatsword can keep it's pool noodle damage if they are set on keeping the evade, but there's no reason 1h sword needs to hit for so little when it has no burst skill, no effective gap closer, and none of the offhands that can be paired with it are especially powerful in pvp offensively.

    They could probably increase damage on autos by 50% and have near negligible effect on pvp while closing the gap between conditions and power.

  • Dante.1763Dante.1763 Member ✭✭✭✭

    This thread made me really sad. I love my ranger, and i hate to have to park it..and while i know this is without pets, even with pets i feel like im doing far less than i can with my thief, or guardian, and after the nerf to the Condi build i know im doing much less than i was before too...

    Amana Silentchild; My Main
    Ember Wandertooth; The Kingslayer, Kianda Redpaw; The Blazing Light
    Why GW is Called Guildwars

  • Dante.1763Dante.1763 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Esquilax.3491 said:
    There is no excuse this time.

    Base ranger: "you can't have good dps because you have a pet tank" -okay...

    Druid: "You can't have good dps because of support and heals" -ok makes sense I guess.

    Soulbeast: "You can't have good dps because uh um stuff" -Not good enough.

    I think the excuses are stupid anyways. The pets die to quickly(Pve and WvW) to be very effective at anything(dont know about PVP).

    Amana Silentchild; My Main
    Ember Wandertooth; The Kingslayer, Kianda Redpaw; The Blazing Light
    Why GW is Called Guildwars

  • Unholy Pillager.3791Unholy Pillager.3791 Member ✭✭✭
    edited September 14, 2017

    @Dante.1763 said:

    @Esquilax.3491 said:
    There is no excuse this time.

    Base ranger: "you can't have good dps because you have a pet tank" -okay...

    Druid: "You can't have good dps because of support and heals" -ok makes sense I guess.

    Soulbeast: "You can't have good dps because uh um stuff" -Not good enough.

    I think the excuses are stupid anyways. The pets die to quickly(Pve and WvW) to be very effective at anything(dont know about PVP).

    In sPvP, they can be alright in some situations, but useless in others. The main issue is that certain movements seem to prevent them from landing autoattacks reliably, and now that Ancient Seeds' cooldown has been nerfed, that is even more of a problem for most melee pets. That's one reason for the popularity of the Bristleback.

  • Dante.1763Dante.1763 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Unholy Pillager.3791 said:

    @Dante.1763 said:

    @Esquilax.3491 said:
    There is no excuse this time.

    Base ranger: "you can't have good dps because you have a pet tank" -okay...

    Druid: "You can't have good dps because of support and heals" -ok makes sense I guess.

    Soulbeast: "You can't have good dps because uh um stuff" -Not good enough.

    I think the excuses are stupid anyways. The pets die to quickly(Pve and WvW) to be very effective at anything(dont know about PVP).

    In sPvP, they can be alright in some situations, but useless in others. The main issue is that certain movements seem to prevent them from landing autoattacks reliably, and now that Ancient Seeds' cooldown has been nerfed, that is even more of a problem for most melee pets. That's one reason for the popularity of the Bristleback.

    And thats what im getting at. Pets are near useless for damage(certain pets can perform, but id wager that the majority are hardly ever used), but a chunk of our damage is tied up in them when really it shouldnt be because of how unreliable they are.

    Amana Silentchild; My Main
    Ember Wandertooth; The Kingslayer, Kianda Redpaw; The Blazing Light
    Why GW is Called Guildwars

  • @Dante.1763 said:

    @Unholy Pillager.3791 said:

    @Dante.1763 said:

    @Esquilax.3491 said:
    There is no excuse this time.

    Base ranger: "you can't have good dps because you have a pet tank" -okay...

    Druid: "You can't have good dps because of support and heals" -ok makes sense I guess.

    Soulbeast: "You can't have good dps because uh um stuff" -Not good enough.

    I think the excuses are stupid anyways. The pets die to quickly(Pve and WvW) to be very effective at anything(dont know about PVP).

    In sPvP, they can be alright in some situations, but useless in others. The main issue is that certain movements seem to prevent them from landing autoattacks reliably, and now that Ancient Seeds' cooldown has been nerfed, that is even more of a problem for most melee pets. That's one reason for the popularity of the Bristleback.

    And thats what im getting at. Pets are near useless for damage(certain pets can perform, but id wager that the majority are hardly ever used), but a chunk of our damage is tied up in them when really it shouldnt be because of how unreliable they are.

    I agree. And as someone who played Ranger quite a bit in the original Guild Wars, I'm rather peeved that they forced pets on you this time around, in addition to making the combat system much more difficult for them to remain effective in. In the original and GW2, pets stood still to autoattack. In GW1, this wasn't a problem; everyone stood still to attack or use any skill with a cast time (which was most of them), allowing them to either kite or deal damage/heal, but not both simultaneously. So as soon as they stop to attack or cast, the pet gets to hit them. That doesn't work in GW2, because they don't actually need to stop moving in order to use skills. Another problem is that they based the combat system on active defense, mostly in the form of dodge rolling, yet failed to give this important feature to pets. Therefore, they can either make pets ridiculously tough in order to compensate (resulting in whining about how overpowered pet health and armor is), or they can allow them to be killed easily, thus putting Rangers at a severe disadvantage.

    Honestly, they really just need to make Soulbeast deal more damage, bringing it up to par with other classes, when in Beast Form. That would at least give us a strong option for DPS.

  • Henry.5713Henry.5713 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Any proper DPS build that utilizes Open Strikes, Attacks of Opportunity and of course Quick Draw would be nice to see. We never had a build like that in over five years.
    A power build that could keep up the with the resident top DPS builds. Don't see why that would change now, though.

    Besides, you will still be playing druid in raids no matter what. I seem to be one of the few people who greatly prefer druid over the base ranger here.

    Progress isn't made by early risers. It's made by lazy men trying to find easier ways to do something. ~ Robert Heinlein

  • It would be quite interesting to have pet damage specified after a pvp game as a % of my total damage. Now, with different playstyles, it would be quite different for different players and builds, but still I think Anet should provide that info for us.

  • @OGDeadHead.8326 said:
    It would be quite interesting to have pet damage specified after a pvp game as a % of my total damage. Now, with different playstyles, it would be quite different for different players and builds, but still I think Anet should provide that info for us.

    That would be pretty great, but I suspect the value would be pretty embarassing. I would like to see both the value and the % as I feel the value has more errm value.

  • @Henry.5713 said:
    Any proper DPS build that utilizes Open Strikes, Attacks of Opportunity and of course Quick Draw would be nice to see. We never had a build like that in over five years.
    A power build that could keep up the with the resident top DPS builds. Don't see why that would change now, though.

    Besides, you will still be playing druid in raids no matter what. I seem to be one of the few people who greatly prefer druid over the base ranger here.

    Honestly, I like the ranger playstyle in GW1. There are just a lot of aspects that can't be replicated in GW2, and others that they apparently refuse to.

  • Great thread. Would be nice if a Dev would highlight and bookmark it as something to action.