My opinion about raids - Page 9 — Guild Wars 2 Forums

My opinion about raids

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  • Tyson.5160Tyson.5160 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @maddoctor.2738 said:

    @Tyson.5160 said:
    I get the sense that if Anet releases another set for non raids, that this would somehow hurt raids for some reason.

    It wouldn't hurt Raids as a whole, Hall of Chains doesn't have Legendary Armor either.
    What it could hurt is Heart of Thorns sales and Forsaken Thicket / Bastion of the Penitent runs.
    Remember that Envoy Armor is exclusive to that expansion unlike the PVP and WVW Legendary Armors that are available for everyone.
    Maybe they want to keep Legendary Armor acquisition behind their first expansion to boost its sales, at the very least Envoy armor skin will most likely remain a Heart of Thorns exclusive, I don't see other expansion skins available outside their respective expansions, even the reward tracks require expansion purchase.
    The best way would be to add a new Legendary Armor skin in the next expansion, or through LS3, so as not to undermine Heart of Thorns.

    Honestly, any Legendary Armor, not attached to Raids, I would be happy with them implementing.

  • maddoctor.2738maddoctor.2738 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Tyson.5160 said:
    Honestly, any Legendary Armor, not attached to Raids, I would be happy with them implementing.

    Well I can imagine that would come in a future expansion, if not in LS3. Because WVW and PVP were easy to add since they are content for everyone. If they add a new Legendary Armor in the next expansion it could very well be an expansion seller, of course different skin than Envoy AND available in the core of the expansion and not in the Raids of that expansion.

  • Tyson.5160Tyson.5160 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @maddoctor.2738 said:

    @Tyson.5160 said:
    Honestly, any Legendary Armor, not attached to Raids, I would be happy with them implementing.

    Well I can imagine that would come in a future expansion, if not in LS3. Because WVW and PVP were easy to add since they are content for everyone. If they add a new Legendary Armor in the next expansion it could very well be an expansion seller, of course different skin than Envoy AND available in the core of the expansion and not in the Raids of that expansion.

    That would work.

  • Astralporing.1957Astralporing.1957 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited June 13, 2018

    @ButcherofMalakir.4067 said:

    @Astralporing.1957 said:

    @Feanor.2358 said:

    @Tyson.5160 said:
    And therein lies the problem. I would agree a billion percent with you, if they didn’t attach the Legendary Envoy armor to Raids. They purposely design a piece of content that’s “Not for everyone” and they stuck Legendary Armor to it. Legendary Armor should never be for a niche, it should be like Legendary Weapons.

    First off, everything legendary is niche.

    Yes. The problem is, that's a different niche.

    Second, every piece of content has an exclusive reward. Raids are no exception.

    Sure. They have exclusive rewards comparable to exclusive rewards in other content. They also have the Legendary Armor. Which happens to be on only the only PvE legendary armor, but also the only legendary armor with an actual skin, and the only transforming armor set in the game.
    If raids really were no exception worth mentioning, we wouldn't be mentioning that.

    Third, if you want a legendary armor so badly, the game offers two more ways of getting one. Pick your poison.

    Ah, you see, even if you can pick your poison, it's still poison.

    And last but not least, just yesterday I pugged Dhuum CM. And got VitV after also pugging Desmina and statues achievements. Compared to that, getting the Envoy collections is a piece of cake, so you can pug your way there with ease. Just stop complaining and start playing for the reward you want.

    And? It's not like your anegdotal story changes or refutes any of the abovementioned points.

    Is ad infinitum only legendary backpack?

    No. Notice though, that the two other legendary backpacks do have a skin comparable to ad infinitum, that it was never claimed that there won't be more pve options in the future, and that from the very beginning there were two equal options available (with third added later on). Unlike with raids, that originally were supposed to be the only path to legendary armor. Notice also, that, even though Anet did gave in, and offered also sets for WvW and SPvP, they offered only lesser versions, without their own skins (and definitely without skills on comparable level to envoy set). And they did say they will never again do a legendary armor skin.

    Basically, while legendary backpacks have three equal options available, and a possibility of more to come, legendary armor has only one full option, two half-kittened options, not much chances for any more, and even those two "lower tier" sets would never have been offered if not for community reaction.

    So, Ad Infinitum existence does not make Raids any less of an exception.

    @maddoctor.2738 said:

    @Tyson.5160 said:
    I get the sense that if Anet releases another set for non raids, that this would somehow hurt raids for some reason.

    It wouldn't hurt Raids as a whole, Hall of Chains doesn't have Legendary Armor either.

    It does offer LIs, which are an important part of the path towards it.

    The best way would be to add a new Legendary Armor skin in the next expansion, or through LS3, so as not to undermine Heart of Thorns.

    LS4 you mean? LS3 is locked behind HoT, remember?

    The whole point of a social game is to play with the people you want to play with, not be forced to play with the people you don't.

  • Feanor.2358Feanor.2358 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Astralporing.1957 said:

    @ButcherofMalakir.4067 said:

    @Astralporing.1957 said:

    @Feanor.2358 said:

    @Tyson.5160 said:
    And therein lies the problem. I would agree a billion percent with you, if they didn’t attach the Legendary Envoy armor to Raids. They purposely design a piece of content that’s “Not for everyone” and they stuck Legendary Armor to it. Legendary Armor should never be for a niche, it should be like Legendary Weapons.

    First off, everything legendary is niche.

    Yes. The problem is, that's a different niche.

    Second, every piece of content has an exclusive reward. Raids are no exception.

    Sure. They have exclusive rewards comparable to exclusive rewards in other content. They also have the Legendary Armor. Which happens to be on only the only PvE legendary armor, but also the only legendary armor with an actual skin, and the only transforming armor set in the game.
    If raids really were no exception worth mentioning, we wouldn't be mentioning that.

    Third, if you want a legendary armor so badly, the game offers two more ways of getting one. Pick your poison.

    Ah, you see, even if you can pick your poison, it's still poison.

    And last but not least, just yesterday I pugged Dhuum CM. And got VitV after also pugging Desmina and statues achievements. Compared to that, getting the Envoy collections is a piece of cake, so you can pug your way there with ease. Just stop complaining and start playing for the reward you want.

    And? It's not like your anegdotal story changes or refutes any of the abovementioned points.

    Is ad infinitum only legendary backpack?

    No. Notice though, that the two other legendary backpacks do have a skin comparable to ad infinitum, that it was never claimed that there won't be more pve options in the future, and that from the very beginning there were two equal options available (with third added later on). Unlike with raids, that originally were supposed to be the only path to legendary armor. Notice also, that, even though Anet did gave in, and offered also sets for WvW and SPvP, they offered only lesser versions, without their own skins (and definitely without skills on comparable level to envoy set). And they did say they will never again do a legendary armor skin.

    Three words: Legendary Sublime Mistforged. I know many players who prefer that skin over the Envoy. So I can't quite accept that reasoning. That being said, I have no problem with ANet adding a different legendary armor some place else in PvE. But I do have my doubts they are going to. At least I don't expect them to do that before they release a full set of legendary trinkets.

  • Astralporing.1957Astralporing.1957 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Feanor.2358 said:
    Three words: Legendary Sublime Mistforged. I know many players who prefer that skin over the Envoy. So I can't quite accept that reasoning.

    Legendary sublime mistforged is just a normal skin with one sfx effect added. It's in reality no different than luminescent or leyline armor sets.
    It's also an ascened set, not a legendary one.
    Remember also that, when legendaries for both PvP modes were being considered, they were allowed only under two considerations:
    1. they won;t have their own skins
    2. they won't count for legendary armor achievement, nor will they have their own achievements.

    Basically, they were never _to be "complete" legendaries. And originally they were not even meant to be at all.

    That being said, I have no problem with ANet adding a different legendary armor some place else in PvE. But I do have my doubts they are going to. At least I don't expect them to do that before they release a full set of legendary trinkets.

    Yes. it's exactly those low expectations that generate so much pressure for opening accessibility to the Envoy set. If we could expect another set to be made, the situation would be different.

    The whole point of a social game is to play with the people you want to play with, not be forced to play with the people you don't.

  • Feanor.2358Feanor.2358 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Legendary Sumblime Mistforged is legendary, not ascended. It has the same skin as the ascended, upgradable version, but that's irrelevant. Can you get a legendary with WvW-specific skin? You can.

  • Tyson.5160Tyson.5160 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited June 14, 2018

    @Feanor.2358 said:
    Legendary Sumblime Mistforged is legendary, not ascended. It has the same skin as the ascended, upgradable version, but that's irrelevant. Can you get a legendary with WvW-specific skin? You can.

    @Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:

    @zealex.9410 said:

    @Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:

    @Tyson.5160 said:
    When they take about pvp armor 1 and 2 what set are they talking. Also they are working on armor set 2.5, have we received any info on what this?

    https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Glorious_armor
    2.5 is going to be new variation of the Ascended glorious sets with some fx treatments. It's still in progress.

    How come its not for the legendary armor?

    "Legendary" skin has a certain connotation to it that we don't want to ascribe to these skins. They aren't going to have similar features. Flashy animations and the like. And while they are being enhanced, they are still going to be very similar to the base Glorious armor.

    There ya go, it’s not WvW but the pvp Armor, straight from a dev’s mouth.

    Edit: Another one

    @Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:

    @xDudisx.5914 said:
    Spvp legendary armor needs a legendary skin.

    It's pretty unlikely. Legendary skins are extremely work intensive.

    Edit: and another

    @Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:

    @Tyson.5160 said:

    @Red Haired Savage.5430 said:

    @Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:

    @zealex.9410 said:

    @Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:

    @Tyson.5160 said:
    When they take about pvp armor 1 and 2 what set are they talking. Also they are working on armor set 2.5, have we received any info on what this?

    https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Glorious_armor
    2.5 is going to be new variation of the Ascended glorious sets with some fx treatments. It's still in progress.

    How come its not for the legendary armor?

    "Legendary" skin has a certain connotation to it that we don't want to ascribe to these skins. They aren't going to have similar features. Flashy animations and the like. And while they are being enhanced, they are still going to be very similar to the base Glorious armor.

    Let me make sure I'm reading this right. So the Ascended 2.5 version is going to be similar to the base Glorious armor, and the legendary is going to be flashier and different?

    My understanding is the legendary component is an upgrade. So it would take the initial appearance of the Ardent Hero or Glorious Hero set. I would imagine this new 2.5 armor can also be used as a precursor as well for the upgrade, perhaps replacing the Glorious Hero. That is my understanding. As in it works just like the wvw legendary upgrade.

    This is the current plan.

    Edit: one more

    @Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:

    @Tyson.5160 said:

    @Red Haired Savage.5430 said:

    @Tyson.5160 said:

    @Red Haired Savage.5430 said:

    @Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:

    @zealex.9410 said:

    @Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:

    @Tyson.5160 said:
    When they take about pvp armor 1 and 2 what set are they talking. Also they are working on armor set 2.5, have we received any info on what this?

    https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Glorious_armor
    2.5 is going to be new variation of the Ascended glorious sets with some fx treatments. It's still in progress.

    How come its not for the legendary armor?

    "Legendary" skin has a certain connotation to it that we don't want to ascribe to these skins. They aren't going to have similar features. Flashy animations and the like. And while they are being enhanced, they are still going to be very similar to the base Glorious armor.

    Let me make sure I'm reading this right. So the Ascended 2.5 version is going to be similar to the base Glorious armor, and the legendary is going to be flashier and different?

    My understanding is the legendary component is an upgrade. So it would take the initial appearance of the Ardent Hero or Glorious Hero set. I would imagine this new 2.5 armor can also be used as a precursor as well for the upgrade, perhaps replacing the Glorious Hero. That is my understanding. As in it works just like the wvw legendary upgrade.

    Yea but it kinda sounds like legendary armor is going to get it's own look eventually?

    Don’t think so, however, Ben would have to confirm that, not me.

    No, legendary PvP is not likely to ever get a unique look.

  • maddoctor.2738maddoctor.2738 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Astralporing.1957 said:

    The best way would be to add a new Legendary Armor skin in the next expansion, or through LS3, so as not to undermine Heart of Thorns.

    LS4 you mean? LS3 is locked behind HoT, remember?

    Sorry yes LS4, either LS4 or the next expansion.

  • Astralporing.1957Astralporing.1957 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Feanor.2358 said:
    Legendary Sumblime Mistforged is legendary, not ascended. It has the same skin as the ascended, upgradable version, but that's irrelevant. Can you get a legendary with WvW-specific skin? You can.

    Is there a legendary-specific wvw (or SPvP) skin? No.

    And also the dev quotes Tyson mentioned above - apparently devs agree with me on there not being any legendary spvp/WvW armor skins.

    The whole point of a social game is to play with the people you want to play with, not be forced to play with the people you don't.

  • Tyson.5160Tyson.5160 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Astralporing.1957 said:

    @Feanor.2358 said:
    Legendary Sumblime Mistforged is legendary, not ascended. It has the same skin as the ascended, upgradable version, but that's irrelevant. Can you get a legendary with WvW-specific skin? You can.

    Is there a legendary-specific wvw (or SPvP) skin? No.

    And also the dev quotes Tyson mentioned above - apparently devs agree with me on there not being any legendary spvp/WvW armor skins.

    It’s just a definition for Armor type with the stat change. I hate to say but WvW and PvP do not get Legendary skins, nor will they. 😢

  • CptAurellian.9537CptAurellian.9537 Member ✭✭✭✭

    I'd take the Mistforged Triumphant Hero skins over envoy any day. Especially for medium armor.

    Praise delta!

  • Tyson.5160Tyson.5160 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited June 14, 2018

    @CptAurellian.9537 said:
    I'd take the Mistforged Triumphant Hero skins over envoy any day. Especially for medium armor.

    I think some additional effects on the other pieces would definitely bump it closer to Envoy regarding the effects. Am I expecting them to redo the Armor to be transforming, no, but some additional effects on the pieces other then the chest, would be nice.

  • Tyson.5160Tyson.5160 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Astralporing.1957 said:

    @Feanor.2358 said:
    Legendary Sumblime Mistforged is legendary, not ascended. It has the same skin as the ascended, upgradable version, but that's irrelevant. Can you get a legendary with WvW-specific skin? You can.

    Is there a legendary-specific wvw (or SPvP) skin? No.

    And also the dev quotes Tyson mentioned above - apparently devs agree with me on there not being any legendary spvp/WvW armor skins.

    Guess that discussion got quashed.

  • Alehin.3746Alehin.3746 Member ✭✭✭

    Thank you so much for your opinion, OP!

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