why is condi burst still a thing — Guild Wars 2 Forums

why is condi burst still a thing

thief and mesmer still can condi burst in 1 second kitten why.

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Comments

  • Vieux P.1238Vieux P.1238 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Same with Warrior & scourge & what else? burn guards. God forbid you actually need to click on a few buttons to defend now that some of your Passives have been remove.

    Winter Nerf is coming!

  • DragonFury.6243DragonFury.6243 Member ✭✭✭

    @will de grijze jager.6594 said:
    thief and mesmer still can condi burst in 1 second kitten why.

    because the devz saw no one plays teef and mes !!! so they gave them the condi burst and rest professions GTH no one care !!!

  • @Vieux P.1238 said:
    Same with Warrior & scourge & what else? burn guards. God forbid you actually need to click on a few buttons to defend now that some of your Passives have been remove.

    i can deal with them but it is kitten to play against.

  • Vieux P.1238Vieux P.1238 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @DragonFury.6243 said:

    @will de grijze jager.6594 said:
    thief and mesmer still can condi burst in 1 second kitten why.

    because the devz saw no one plays teef and mes !!! so they gave them the condi burst and rest professions GTH no one care !!!

    No, it was there before & still is. It was 2 patches ago they removed Defensive auto passives on certain classes. In my book, the devs have not done anoth & should remove all passives that procs automatically.

    Winter Nerf is coming!

  • STIHL.2489STIHL.2489 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @DragonFury.6243 said:

    @will de grijze jager.6594 said:
    thief and mesmer still can condi burst in 1 second kitten why.

    because the devz saw no one plays teef and mes !!! so they gave them the condi burst and rest professions GTH no one care !!!

    No, it was there before & still is. It was 2 patches ago they removed Defensive auto passives on certain classes. In my book, the devs have not done anoth & should remove all passives that procs automatically.

    should this include auras, damage fields, and condition ticks?

    There are two kinds of Gamers, Salty, and Extra Salty.
    Ego is the Anesthesia that dullens the pain of Stupidity.

  • Vieux P.1238Vieux P.1238 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @STIHL.2489 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @DragonFury.6243 said:

    @will de grijze jager.6594 said:
    thief and mesmer still can condi burst in 1 second kitten why.

    because the devz saw no one plays teef and mes !!! so they gave them the condi burst and rest professions GTH no one care !!!

    No, it was there before & still is. It was 2 patches ago they removed Defensive auto passives on certain classes. In my book, the devs have not done anoth & should remove all passives that procs automatically.

    should this include auras, damage fields, and condition ticks?

    Not the same as passives that proc's when your under attack or under a certain amount of health. I have no problem with anything that use's a players ability to click on a skill to activate it. But other wise it makes for lazy playing that makes players think there pros. haha!

    Winter Nerf is coming!

  • DaShi.1368DaShi.1368 Member ✭✭✭

    We something to go up against all the god-like players who can beat everything but conditions.

  • saerni.2584saerni.2584 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Lol this same tired argument again?

    Northern Shiverpeaks (NSP)
    Deadeye (Thief)
    Commandant of P/D and Apex Predator

  • STIHL.2489STIHL.2489 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @saerni.2584 said:
    Lol this same tired argument again?

    I know right.. when is Anet going to.. you know.. fix this problem.. so we can complain about something else.

    There are two kinds of Gamers, Salty, and Extra Salty.
    Ego is the Anesthesia that dullens the pain of Stupidity.

  • Airdive.2613Airdive.2613 Member ✭✭✭

    @STIHL.2489 said:

    There is a massive difference, as most power based builds depend on doing most of their damage in the first hits, as such blocking any of them can result in a 30 - 50% reduction in their total barrage damage, whereas condition applications are a bunch of little hits that stack many conditions on you, as such blocking only 1 of those attacks has minimal impact on the overall damage they will do to you.

    I believe blocking some of the more massive "condi bomb" skills will result in 30 to 50% damage reduction as well.
    And if we're talking about sustained damage, those builds wouldn't receive such damage reduction in their power form.

    not to mention the first three hits can be avoided with a ages and two dodge rolls, in effect negating almost all the damage that a physical based build would be able to do, there is no such counter to conditions.

    What if I told you you can avoid condition applications with aegis as well as two dodge rolls? You're not damaged if you're not hit.

    Couple this, with the fact that to max out physical damage you end up with a very glassy build, and this very vulnerable to counter attacks like retaliation and reflects, whereas condition based builds have no such weakness and are able to invest in both offensive and defensive stats equally, making them highly resistant to any counter attacks.

    This is true as far as pure attributes go, but there's more to a build. Attributes, professions and individual skills all work differently and are in (need of) intricate balance.
    From a different perspective, however, you can suddenly realize: a) condition burst is scarier that power burst, b) condition burst ignores armor. The conclusion, then, is to not invest in toughness at all. Now, nothing stops you from going direct damage, or vitality/cleansing, or condition/countercondition.

  • STIHL.2489STIHL.2489 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Airdive.2613 said:

    @STIHL.2489 said:

    There is a massive difference, as most power based builds depend on doing most of their damage in the first hits, as such blocking any of them can result in a 30 - 50% reduction in their total barrage damage, whereas condition applications are a bunch of little hits that stack many conditions on you, as such blocking only 1 of those attacks has minimal impact on the overall damage they will do to you.

    I believe blocking some of the more massive "condi bomb" skills will result in 30 to 50% damage reduction as well.
    And if we're talking about sustained damage, those builds wouldn't receive such damage reduction in their power form.

    not to mention the first three hits can be avoided with a ages and two dodge rolls, in effect negating almost all the damage that a physical based build would be able to do, there is no such counter to conditions.

    What if I told you you can avoid condition applications with aegis as well as two dodge rolls? You're not damaged if you're not hit.

    Couple this, with the fact that to max out physical damage you end up with a very glassy build, and this very vulnerable to counter attacks like retaliation and reflects, whereas condition based builds have no such weakness and are able to invest in both offensive and defensive stats equally, making them highly resistant to any counter attacks.

    This is true as far as pure attributes go, but there's more to a build. Attributes, professions and individual skills all work differently and are in (need of) intricate balance.
    From a different perspective, however, you can suddenly realize: a) condition burst is scarier that power burst, b) condition burst ignores armor. The conclusion, then, is to not invest in toughness at all. Now, nothing stops you from going direct damage, or vitality/cleansing, or condition/countercondition.

    Ideally the best route is to build a condition based build, that has a lot of cleanse, because that allows you to also invest in defensive stats, and still do optimal damage..

    See the problem?

    There are two kinds of Gamers, Salty, and Extra Salty.
    Ego is the Anesthesia that dullens the pain of Stupidity.

  • Vieux P.1238Vieux P.1238 Member ✭✭✭✭

    I get what the op's is saying. & Losing some damage output in exchange for condi cleans is not a bad thing. It's called balance. But there are overtuned builds such as SD condi thief that can dish out on any light armor more then 35k condi poison damage on 1 shot. plus everything else. Now that's unbalance. I should put pic's of it make you all grow wide eyed from it.

    Winter Nerf is coming!

  • Hyper Cutter.9376Hyper Cutter.9376 Member ✭✭✭

    Also Trailblazer doesn't even exist in PVP (nor do any of the truly defensive stat combinations).

  • STIHL.2489STIHL.2489 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Hyper Cutter.9376 said:
    Also Trailblazer doesn't even exist in PVP (nor do any of the truly defensive stat combinations).

    I just revamped my power reaper to a condi scourge in WvW, and just outfitted them in Trailblazer.... as you can imagine.. Condi (burst or otherwise) is OP AP in that game mode.

    There are two kinds of Gamers, Salty, and Extra Salty.
    Ego is the Anesthesia that dullens the pain of Stupidity.

  • Airdive.2613Airdive.2613 Member ✭✭✭

    @STIHL.2489 said:

    @Airdive.2613 said:

    @STIHL.2489 said:

    There is a massive difference, as most power based builds depend on doing most of their damage in the first hits, as such blocking any of them can result in a 30 - 50% reduction in their total barrage damage, whereas condition applications are a bunch of little hits that stack many conditions on you, as such blocking only 1 of those attacks has minimal impact on the overall damage they will do to you.

    I believe blocking some of the more massive "condi bomb" skills will result in 30 to 50% damage reduction as well.
    And if we're talking about sustained damage, those builds wouldn't receive such damage reduction in their power form.

    not to mention the first three hits can be avoided with a ages and two dodge rolls, in effect negating almost all the damage that a physical based build would be able to do, there is no such counter to conditions.

    What if I told you you can avoid condition applications with aegis as well as two dodge rolls? You're not damaged if you're not hit.

    Couple this, with the fact that to max out physical damage you end up with a very glassy build, and this very vulnerable to counter attacks like retaliation and reflects, whereas condition based builds have no such weakness and are able to invest in both offensive and defensive stats equally, making them highly resistant to any counter attacks.

    This is true as far as pure attributes go, but there's more to a build. Attributes, professions and individual skills all work differently and are in (need of) intricate balance.
    From a different perspective, however, you can suddenly realize: a) condition burst is scarier that power burst, b) condition burst ignores armor. The conclusion, then, is to not invest in toughness at all. Now, nothing stops you from going direct damage, or vitality/cleansing, or condition/countercondition.

    Ideally the best route is to build a condition based build, that has a lot of cleanse, because that allows you to also invest in defensive stats, and still do optimal damage..

    See the problem?

    Ideally, you only need one key press from a guardian (any light field) followed by one key press from a thief (dagger storm elite) to fully cleanse your entire team in a teamfight.

  • STIHL.2489STIHL.2489 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Airdive.2613 said:

    @STIHL.2489 said:

    @Airdive.2613 said:

    @STIHL.2489 said:

    There is a massive difference, as most power based builds depend on doing most of their damage in the first hits, as such blocking any of them can result in a 30 - 50% reduction in their total barrage damage, whereas condition applications are a bunch of little hits that stack many conditions on you, as such blocking only 1 of those attacks has minimal impact on the overall damage they will do to you.

    I believe blocking some of the more massive "condi bomb" skills will result in 30 to 50% damage reduction as well.
    And if we're talking about sustained damage, those builds wouldn't receive such damage reduction in their power form.

    not to mention the first three hits can be avoided with a ages and two dodge rolls, in effect negating almost all the damage that a physical based build would be able to do, there is no such counter to conditions.

    What if I told you you can avoid condition applications with aegis as well as two dodge rolls? You're not damaged if you're not hit.

    Couple this, with the fact that to max out physical damage you end up with a very glassy build, and this very vulnerable to counter attacks like retaliation and reflects, whereas condition based builds have no such weakness and are able to invest in both offensive and defensive stats equally, making them highly resistant to any counter attacks.

    This is true as far as pure attributes go, but there's more to a build. Attributes, professions and individual skills all work differently and are in (need of) intricate balance.
    From a different perspective, however, you can suddenly realize: a) condition burst is scarier that power burst, b) condition burst ignores armor. The conclusion, then, is to not invest in toughness at all. Now, nothing stops you from going direct damage, or vitality/cleansing, or condition/countercondition.

    Ideally the best route is to build a condition based build, that has a lot of cleanse, because that allows you to also invest in defensive stats, and still do optimal damage..

    See the problem?

    Ideally, you only need one key press from a guardian (any light field) followed by one key press from a thief (dagger storm elite) to fully cleanse your entire team in a teamfight.

    Ideally.. which almost never happens.. because I just crushed the thief with a condi bust after they tried to power attack me dead, and ran the guard in circles.

    There are two kinds of Gamers, Salty, and Extra Salty.
    Ego is the Anesthesia that dullens the pain of Stupidity.

  • babazhook.6805babazhook.6805 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited June 13, 2018

    @Vieux P.1238 said:
    I get what the op's is saying. & Losing some damage output in exchange for condi cleans is not a bad thing. It's called balance. But there are overtuned builds such as SD condi thief that can dish out on any light armor more then 35k condi poison damage on 1 shot. plus everything else. Now that's unbalance. I should put pic's of it make you all grow wide eyed from it.

    35k on one shot? Would you care to elaborate how that possible? The most s/d can get poison wise with one shot is off the Immob with a spider venom loaded. This will add all of 3 poison stacks. Added to this the duration of the poison ohf the Immob is 2 seconds base for a maximum of 4 seconds if traited somehow for 100 percent condition duration which highly unlikley in PvP.

    What exactly is your definition of "one shot" ? Is it multiple attacks of various types in a row, none of which you avoided?

  • Vieux P.1238Vieux P.1238 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @babazhook.6805 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:
    I get what the op's is saying. & Losing some damage output in exchange for condi cleans is not a bad thing. It's called balance. But there are overtuned builds such as SD condi thief that can dish out on any light armor more then 35k condi poison damage on 1 shot. plus everything else. Now that's unbalance. I should put pic's of it make you all grow wide eyed from it.

    **35k on one shot? Would you care to elaborate how that possible? **

    Idk... only thing i know is it's a SD jumping in & out thief that drops out tons of condis where i don't have anoth condition clear to clear it up. I got a great pic too. Just to lazy to poste it. Thief is not the only one that does ridiculous amount of damage. Welcom to PoF

    Winter Nerf is coming!

  • Meteor.3720Meteor.3720 Member ✭✭✭

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @STIHL.2489 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @DragonFury.6243 said:

    @will de grijze jager.6594 said:
    thief and mesmer still can condi burst in 1 second kitten why.

    because the devz saw no one plays teef and mes !!! so they gave them the condi burst and rest professions GTH no one care !!!

    No, it was there before & still is. It was 2 patches ago they removed Defensive auto passives on certain classes. In my book, the devs have not done anoth & should remove all passives that procs automatically.

    should this include auras, damage fields, and condition ticks?

    Not the same as passives that proc's when your under attack or under a certain amount of health. I have no problem with anything that use's a players ability to click on a skill to activate it. But other wise it makes for lazy playing that makes players think there pros. haha!

    If you're angry about lazy playing and builds that make players think they're* pros, why do you always defend mirage so much? Epitome of bad players carried by class.

  • Vieux P.1238Vieux P.1238 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Meteor.3720 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @STIHL.2489 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @DragonFury.6243 said:

    @will de grijze jager.6594 said:
    thief and mesmer still can condi burst in 1 second kitten why.

    because the devz saw no one plays teef and mes !!! so they gave them the condi burst and rest professions GTH no one care !!!

    No, it was there before & still is. It was 2 patches ago they removed Defensive auto passives on certain classes. In my book, the devs have not done anoth & should remove all passives that procs automatically.

    should this include auras, damage fields, and condition ticks?

    Not the same as passives that proc's when your under attack or under a certain amount of health. I have no problem with anything that use's a players ability to click on a skill to activate it. But other wise it makes for lazy playing that makes players think there pros. haha!

    If you're angry about lazy playing and builds that make players think they're* pros, why do you always defend mirage so much? Epitome of bad players carried by class.

    Have you actually played mirage to make this kind of remark?

    Winter Nerf is coming!

  • Meteor.3720Meteor.3720 Member ✭✭✭

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @Meteor.3720 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @STIHL.2489 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @DragonFury.6243 said:

    @will de grijze jager.6594 said:
    thief and mesmer still can condi burst in 1 second kitten why.

    because the devz saw no one plays teef and mes !!! so they gave them the condi burst and rest professions GTH no one care !!!

    No, it was there before & still is. It was 2 patches ago they removed Defensive auto passives on certain classes. In my book, the devs have not done anoth & should remove all passives that procs automatically.

    should this include auras, damage fields, and condition ticks?

    Not the same as passives that proc's when your under attack or under a certain amount of health. I have no problem with anything that use's a players ability to click on a skill to activate it. But other wise it makes for lazy playing that makes players think there pros. haha!

    If you're angry about lazy playing and builds that make players think they're* pros, why do you always defend mirage so much? Epitome of bad players carried by class.

    Have you actually played mirage to make this kind of remark?

    Yes I have.

  • Vieux P.1238Vieux P.1238 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Meteor.3720 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @Meteor.3720 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @STIHL.2489 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @DragonFury.6243 said:

    @will de grijze jager.6594 said:
    thief and mesmer still can condi burst in 1 second kitten why.

    because the devz saw no one plays teef and mes !!! so they gave them the condi burst and rest professions GTH no one care !!!

    No, it was there before & still is. It was 2 patches ago they removed Defensive auto passives on certain classes. In my book, the devs have not done anoth & should remove all passives that procs automatically.

    should this include auras, damage fields, and condition ticks?

    Not the same as passives that proc's when your under attack or under a certain amount of health. I have no problem with anything that use's a players ability to click on a skill to activate it. But other wise it makes for lazy playing that makes players think there pros. haha!

    If you're angry about lazy playing and builds that make players think they're* pros, why do you always defend mirage so much? Epitome of bad players carried by class.

    Have you actually played mirage to make this kind of remark?

    Yes I have.

    If you did, like really played it, you would'nt make this kind of remark. Mirage, Chrono, core mesmer is far from a one lazy button mashing class. There's no passives traits like defy pain that proc's on it's own & there is thought to be put on your playing style. You can't say this on most classes. So no, i don't think you have played the class at all.

    Winter Nerf is coming!

  • Meteor.3720Meteor.3720 Member ✭✭✭

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @Meteor.3720 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @Meteor.3720 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @STIHL.2489 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @DragonFury.6243 said:

    @will de grijze jager.6594 said:
    thief and mesmer still can condi burst in 1 second kitten why.

    because the devz saw no one plays teef and mes !!! so they gave them the condi burst and rest professions GTH no one care !!!

    No, it was there before & still is. It was 2 patches ago they removed Defensive auto passives on certain classes. In my book, the devs have not done anoth & should remove all passives that procs automatically.

    should this include auras, damage fields, and condition ticks?

    Not the same as passives that proc's when your under attack or under a certain amount of health. I have no problem with anything that use's a players ability to click on a skill to activate it. But other wise it makes for lazy playing that makes players think there pros. haha!

    If you're angry about lazy playing and builds that make players think they're* pros, why do you always defend mirage so much? Epitome of bad players carried by class.

    Have you actually played mirage to make this kind of remark?

    Yes I have.

    If you did, like really played it, you would'nt make this kind of remark. Mirage, Chrono, core mesmer is far from a one lazy button mashing class. There's no passives traits like defy pain that proc's on it's own & there is thought to be put on your playing style. You can't say this on most classes. So no, i don't think you have played the class at all.

    First, I never mentioned chrono or core mesmer. But yes, chrono is also braindead but at least less effective than it used to be. And it's not all about passive traits, it's about fail safes. Yes, mirage doesn't have passives, but if you get stunned you can stunbreak or still dodge. You have a lot of disengage if you mess up and plenty of ways to avoid being punished for making mistakes.
    Obviously there is a skill floor and some players play it far better than others, but that doesn't change the fact that mirage is brainless in the sense that you don't need to worry about making mistakes or not landing key skills.

    The whole community says so, other than you, ithilwen and epicturtle.

  • Sampson.2403Sampson.2403 Member ✭✭✭

    @Meteor.3720 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @Meteor.3720 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @Meteor.3720 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @STIHL.2489 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @DragonFury.6243 said:

    @will de grijze jager.6594 said:
    thief and mesmer still can condi burst in 1 second kitten why.

    because the devz saw no one plays teef and mes !!! so they gave them the condi burst and rest professions GTH no one care !!!

    No, it was there before & still is. It was 2 patches ago they removed Defensive auto passives on certain classes. In my book, the devs have not done anoth & should remove all passives that procs automatically.

    should this include auras, damage fields, and condition ticks?

    Not the same as passives that proc's when your under attack or under a certain amount of health. I have no problem with anything that use's a players ability to click on a skill to activate it. But other wise it makes for lazy playing that makes players think there pros. haha!

    If you're angry about lazy playing and builds that make players think they're* pros, why do you always defend mirage so much? Epitome of bad players carried by class.

    Have you actually played mirage to make this kind of remark?

    Yes I have.

    If you did, like really played it, you would'nt make this kind of remark. Mirage, Chrono, core mesmer is far from a one lazy button mashing class. There's no passives traits like defy pain that proc's on it's own & there is thought to be put on your playing style. You can't say this on most classes. So no, i don't think you have played the class at all.

    First, I never mentioned chrono or core mesmer. But yes, chrono is also braindead but at least less effective than it used to be. And it's not all about passive traits, it's about fail safes. Yes, mirage doesn't have passives, but if you get stunned you can stunbreak or still dodge. You have a lot of disengage if you mess up and plenty of ways to avoid being punished for making mistakes.
    Obviously there is a skill floor and some players play it far better than others, but that doesn't change the fact that mirage is brainless in the sense that you don't need to worry about making mistakes or not landing key skills.

    The whole community says so, other than you, ithilwen and epicturtle.

    I would argue that you do need to land key skills. Torch 4 and 5.

  • @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @Meteor.3720 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @Meteor.3720 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @STIHL.2489 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @DragonFury.6243 said:

    @will de grijze jager.6594 said:
    thief and mesmer still can condi burst in 1 second kitten why.

    because the devz saw no one plays teef and mes !!! so they gave them the condi burst and rest professions GTH no one care !!!

    No, it was there before & still is. It was 2 patches ago they removed Defensive auto passives on certain classes. In my book, the devs have not done anoth & should remove all passives that procs automatically.

    should this include auras, damage fields, and condition ticks?

    Not the same as passives that proc's when your under attack or under a certain amount of health. I have no problem with anything that use's a players ability to click on a skill to activate it. But other wise it makes for lazy playing that makes players think there pros. haha!

    If you're angry about lazy playing and builds that make players think they're* pros, why do you always defend mirage so much? Epitome of bad players carried by class.

    Have you actually played mirage to make this kind of remark?

    Yes I have.

    If you did, like really played it, you would'nt make this kind of remark. Mirage, Chrono, core mesmer is far from a one lazy button mashing class. There's no passives traits like defy pain that proc's on it's own & there is thought to be put on your playing style. You can't say this on most classes. So no, i don't think you have played the class at all.

    They have passive invis 😉

    ~ God Tier Guardian

  • Vieux P.1238Vieux P.1238 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Meteor.3720 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @Meteor.3720 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @Meteor.3720 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @STIHL.2489 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @DragonFury.6243 said:

    @will de grijze jager.6594 said:
    thief and mesmer still can condi burst in 1 second kitten why.

    because the devz saw no one plays teef and mes !!! so they gave them the condi burst and rest professions GTH no one care !!!

    No, it was there before & still is. It was 2 patches ago they removed Defensive auto passives on certain classes. In my book, the devs have not done anoth & should remove all passives that procs automatically.

    should this include auras, damage fields, and condition ticks?

    Not the same as passives that proc's when your under attack or under a certain amount of health. I have no problem with anything that use's a players ability to click on a skill to activate it. But other wise it makes for lazy playing that makes players think there pros. haha!

    If you're angry about lazy playing and builds that make players think they're* pros, why do you always defend mirage so much? Epitome of bad players carried by class.

    Have you actually played mirage to make this kind of remark?

    Yes I have.

    If you did, like really played it, you would'nt make this kind of remark. Mirage, Chrono, core mesmer is far from a one lazy button mashing class. There's no passives traits like defy pain that proc's on it's own & there is thought to be put on your playing style. You can't say this on most classes. So no, i don't think you have played the class at all.

    First, I never mentioned chrono or core mesmer. But yes, chrono is also braindead but at least less effective than it used to be. And it's not all about passive traits, it's about fail safes. Yes, mirage doesn't have passives, but if you get stunned you can stunbreak or still dodge. You have a lot of disengage if you mess up and plenty of ways to avoid being punished for making mistakes.
    Obviously there is a skill floor and some players play it far better than others, but that doesn't change the fact that mirage is brainless in the sense that you don't need to worry about making mistakes or not landing key skills.

    The whole community says so, other than you, ithilwen and epicturtle.

    So now all of a sudden there's a skill floor to playing mirage. No longer lazy play as you furiously accuse before. Nice way to change your toon. & you said to, Mirage has no passives. & if we get stunned, mirage get's stun break. Wow. No other classes can claim that. Only mirage. Dodges as well... only mirage has dodges. You say we have lots of disengage. We have 2 that's link on our dodges yes thq kind sir.

    Winter Nerf is coming!

  • mortrialus.3062mortrialus.3062 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited June 13, 2018

    @STIHL.2489 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @STIHL.2489 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @DragonFury.6243 said:

    @will de grijze jager.6594 said:
    thief and mesmer still can condi burst in 1 second kitten why.

    because the devz saw no one plays teef and mes !!! so they gave them the condi burst and rest professions GTH no one care !!!

    No, it was there before & still is. It was 2 patches ago they removed Defensive auto passives on certain classes. In my book, the devs have not done anoth & should remove all passives that procs automatically.

    should this include auras, damage fields, and condition ticks?

    Not the same as passives that proc's when your under attack or under a certain amount of health. I have no problem with anything that use's a players ability to click on a skill to activate it. But other wise it makes for lazy playing that makes players think there pros. haha!

    Oh come off it.. stacking conditions in general is lazy play.

    A condi attack is still just an attack that has to land. I really don't see any functional difference between power and condition damage except the flavor in how they're delivered; power being immediate and condition being more but over a longer period of time.

    Confusion and torment are supposed to be burstier conditions because the victim themselves is doing most of the legwork into making those conditions do damage. The main problem and outlier is Mesmer Torch's burning. It's absurdly high. Between the two mesmer torch skills, when traited it's like 18k damage over 4 seconds if you land all three pulses of burning. They need to get trimmed or tuned into one stack across like 12 seconds or something.

    The Psychomancer: Mesmer Elite Specialization Suggestion

  • Vieux P.1238Vieux P.1238 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @AngelLovesFredrik.6741 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @Meteor.3720 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @Meteor.3720 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @STIHL.2489 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @DragonFury.6243 said:

    @will de grijze jager.6594 said:
    thief and mesmer still can condi burst in 1 second kitten why.

    because the devz saw no one plays teef and mes !!! so they gave them the condi burst and rest professions GTH no one care !!!

    No, it was there before & still is. It was 2 patches ago they removed Defensive auto passives on certain classes. In my book, the devs have not done anoth & should remove all passives that procs automatically.

    should this include auras, damage fields, and condition ticks?

    Not the same as passives that proc's when your under attack or under a certain amount of health. I have no problem with anything that use's a players ability to click on a skill to activate it. But other wise it makes for lazy playing that makes players think there pros. haha!

    If you're angry about lazy playing and builds that make players think they're* pros, why do you always defend mirage so much? Epitome of bad players carried by class.

    Have you actually played mirage to make this kind of remark?

    Yes I have.

    If you did, like really played it, you would'nt make this kind of remark. Mirage, Chrono, core mesmer is far from a one lazy button mashing class. There's no passives traits like defy pain that proc's on it's own & there is thought to be put on your playing style. You can't say this on most classes. So no, i don't think you have played the class at all.

    They have passive invis 😉

    That is true. Desperate decoy minor trait is a passive not worth taking. I mean with all them telegraph skill's that still hit's you like a truck when going stealth. But we wer talking about mirage passives. Where there's none.

    Winter Nerf is coming!

  • DragonFury.6243DragonFury.6243 Member ✭✭✭

    @mortrialus.3062 said:

    @STIHL.2489 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @STIHL.2489 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @DragonFury.6243 said:

    @will de grijze jager.6594 said:
    thief and mesmer still can condi burst in 1 second kitten why.

    because the devz saw no one plays teef and mes !!! so they gave them the condi burst and rest professions GTH no one care !!!

    No, it was there before & still is. It was 2 patches ago they removed Defensive auto passives on certain classes. In my book, the devs have not done anoth & should remove all passives that procs automatically.

    should this include auras, damage fields, and condition ticks?

    Not the same as passives that proc's when your under attack or under a certain amount of health. I have no problem with anything that use's a players ability to click on a skill to activate it. But other wise it makes for lazy playing that makes players think there pros. haha!

    Oh come off it.. stacking conditions in general is lazy play.

    A condi attack is still just an attack that has to land. I really don't see any functional difference between power and condition damage except the flavor in how they're delivered; power being immediate and condition being more but over a longer period of time.

    Confusion and torment are supposed to be burstier conditions because the victim themselves is doing most of the legwork into making those conditions do damage. The main problem and outlier is Mesmer Torch's burning. It's absurdly high. Between the two mesmer torch skills, when traited it's like 18k damage over 4 seconds if you land all three pulses of burning. They need to get trimmed or tuned into one stack across like 12 seconds or something.

    OMG i hope you enjoy your brainless mirage and i hope you give scourge a try i am sure you ll like it

  • mortrialus.3062mortrialus.3062 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @DragonFury.6243 said:

    @mortrialus.3062 said:

    @STIHL.2489 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @STIHL.2489 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @DragonFury.6243 said:

    @will de grijze jager.6594 said:
    thief and mesmer still can condi burst in 1 second kitten why.

    because the devz saw no one plays teef and mes !!! so they gave them the condi burst and rest professions GTH no one care !!!

    No, it was there before & still is. It was 2 patches ago they removed Defensive auto passives on certain classes. In my book, the devs have not done anoth & should remove all passives that procs automatically.

    should this include auras, damage fields, and condition ticks?

    Not the same as passives that proc's when your under attack or under a certain amount of health. I have no problem with anything that use's a players ability to click on a skill to activate it. But other wise it makes for lazy playing that makes players think there pros. haha!

    Oh come off it.. stacking conditions in general is lazy play.

    A condi attack is still just an attack that has to land. I really don't see any functional difference between power and condition damage except the flavor in how they're delivered; power being immediate and condition being more but over a longer period of time.

    Confusion and torment are supposed to be burstier conditions because the victim themselves is doing most of the legwork into making those conditions do damage. The main problem and outlier is Mesmer Torch's burning. It's absurdly high. Between the two mesmer torch skills, when traited it's like 18k damage over 4 seconds if you land all three pulses of burning. They need to get trimmed or tuned into one stack across like 12 seconds or something.

    OMG i hope you enjoy your brainless mirage and i hope you give scourge a try i am sure you ll like it

    What's your problem?

    The Psychomancer: Mesmer Elite Specialization Suggestion

  • Meteor.3720Meteor.3720 Member ✭✭✭

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @Meteor.3720 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @Meteor.3720 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @Meteor.3720 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @STIHL.2489 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @DragonFury.6243 said:

    @will de grijze jager.6594 said:
    thief and mesmer still can condi burst in 1 second kitten why.

    because the devz saw no one plays teef and mes !!! so they gave them the condi burst and rest professions GTH no one care !!!

    No, it was there before & still is. It was 2 patches ago they removed Defensive auto passives on certain classes. In my book, the devs have not done anoth & should remove all passives that procs automatically.

    should this include auras, damage fields, and condition ticks?

    Not the same as passives that proc's when your under attack or under a certain amount of health. I have no problem with anything that use's a players ability to click on a skill to activate it. But other wise it makes for lazy playing that makes players think there pros. haha!

    If you're angry about lazy playing and builds that make players think they're* pros, why do you always defend mirage so much? Epitome of bad players carried by class.

    Have you actually played mirage to make this kind of remark?

    Yes I have.

    If you did, like really played it, you would'nt make this kind of remark. Mirage, Chrono, core mesmer is far from a one lazy button mashing class. There's no passives traits like defy pain that proc's on it's own & there is thought to be put on your playing style. You can't say this on most classes. So no, i don't think you have played the class at all.

    First, I never mentioned chrono or core mesmer. But yes, chrono is also braindead but at least less effective than it used to be. And it's not all about passive traits, it's about fail safes. Yes, mirage doesn't have passives, but if you get stunned you can stunbreak or still dodge. You have a lot of disengage if you mess up and plenty of ways to avoid being punished for making mistakes.
    Obviously there is a skill floor and some players play it far better than others, but that doesn't change the fact that mirage is brainless in the sense that you don't need to worry about making mistakes or not landing key skills.

    The whole community says so, other than you, ithilwen and epicturtle.

    So now all of a sudden there's a skill floor to playing mirage. No longer lazy play as you furiously accuse before. Nice way to change your toon.

    It can be a lazy class with a skill floor. It's just incredibly easy and forgiving to play no matter how trash you are, but it can still be played well. Doesn't mean it's not a lazy profession.

    & you said to, Mirage has no passives. & if we get stunned, mirage get's stun break. Wow. No other classes can claim that.

    No other class can claim stunbreak on dodge.

    Only mirage. Dodges as well... only mirage has dodges.

    But mirage dodge is overtuned with the ability to cast skills and actions mid dodge, get ambush attacks, and mirage has high vigor uptime.

    You say we have lots of disengage. We have 2 that's link on our dodges yes thq kind sir.

    Sword ambush, blind, portal, jaunt, torch stealth, signet of midnight/ decoy. Yes. Only 2 disengage.

  • @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @Meteor.3720 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @Meteor.3720 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @Meteor.3720 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @STIHL.2489 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @DragonFury.6243 said:

    @will de grijze jager.6594 said:
    thief and mesmer still can condi burst in 1 second kitten why.

    because the devz saw no one plays teef and mes !!! so they gave them the condi burst and rest professions GTH no one care !!!

    No, it was there before & still is. It was 2 patches ago they removed Defensive auto passives on certain classes. In my book, the devs have not done anoth & should remove all passives that procs automatically.

    should this include auras, damage fields, and condition ticks?

    Not the same as passives that proc's when your under attack or under a certain amount of health. I have no problem with anything that use's a players ability to click on a skill to activate it. But other wise it makes for lazy playing that makes players think there pros. haha!

    If you're angry about lazy playing and builds that make players think they're* pros, why do you always defend mirage so much? Epitome of bad players carried by class.

    Have you actually played mirage to make this kind of remark?

    Yes I have.

    If you did, like really played it, you would'nt make this kind of remark. Mirage, Chrono, core mesmer is far from a one lazy button mashing class. There's no passives traits like defy pain that proc's on it's own & there is thought to be put on your playing style. You can't say this on most classes. So no, i don't think you have played the class at all.

    First, I never mentioned chrono or core mesmer. But yes, chrono is also braindead but at least less effective than it used to be. And it's not all about passive traits, it's about fail safes. Yes, mirage doesn't have passives, but if you get stunned you can stunbreak or still dodge. You have a lot of disengage if you mess up and plenty of ways to avoid being punished for making mistakes.
    Obviously there is a skill floor and some players play it far better than others, but that doesn't change the fact that mirage is brainless in the sense that you don't need to worry about making mistakes or not landing key skills.

    The whole community says so, other than you, ithilwen and epicturtle.

    So now all of a sudden there's a skill floor to playing mirage. No longer lazy play as you furiously accuse before. Nice way to change your toon. & you said to, Mirage has no passives. & if we get stunned, mirage get's stun break. Wow. No other classes can claim that. Only mirage. Dodges as well... only mirage has dodges. You say we have lots of disengage. We have 2 that's link on our dodges yes thq kind sir.

    Mirage is the only class that can dodge while stunned, and even break a stun with a mere dodge.
    Mirage can easily disengage with dodge + sword ambush even after eating a cc. No other class has that luxory. They can jaunt and phase retreat while stunned if they don't want to waste endurance. I'm not going to take blink into account as that's a stunbreak utility.

    On top of being able to jaunt, dodge or phase retreat out of stuns. They also have distortion. If by some miracle all the previous mentioned abilities are on cooldown, a simple F1 through F3(4) blinds. No cast time, no counterplay, no ICD.

    No other class had nearly this much access to active defense. Although I guess spellbreaker comes kind of close.
    Mirage probably has one of the highest skill ceilings in the game, but it's also the single most forgiving class of you do kitten up.

    ~ God Tier Guardian

  • DragonFury.6243DragonFury.6243 Member ✭✭✭

    @mortrialus.3062 said:

    @DragonFury.6243 said:

    @mortrialus.3062 said:

    @STIHL.2489 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @STIHL.2489 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @DragonFury.6243 said:

    @will de grijze jager.6594 said:
    thief and mesmer still can condi burst in 1 second kitten why.

    because the devz saw no one plays teef and mes !!! so they gave them the condi burst and rest professions GTH no one care !!!

    No, it was there before & still is. It was 2 patches ago they removed Defensive auto passives on certain classes. In my book, the devs have not done anoth & should remove all passives that procs automatically.

    should this include auras, damage fields, and condition ticks?

    Not the same as passives that proc's when your under attack or under a certain amount of health. I have no problem with anything that use's a players ability to click on a skill to activate it. But other wise it makes for lazy playing that makes players think there pros. haha!

    Oh come off it.. stacking conditions in general is lazy play.

    A condi attack is still just an attack that has to land. I really don't see any functional difference between power and condition damage except the flavor in how they're delivered; power being immediate and condition being more but over a longer period of time.

    Confusion and torment are supposed to be burstier conditions because the victim themselves is doing most of the legwork into making those conditions do damage. The main problem and outlier is Mesmer Torch's burning. It's absurdly high. Between the two mesmer torch skills, when traited it's like 18k damage over 4 seconds if you land all three pulses of burning. They need to get trimmed or tuned into one stack across like 12 seconds or something.

    OMG i hope you enjoy your brainless mirage and i hope you give scourge a try i am sure you ll like it

    What's your problem?

    my problem is the comparison between power and condi
    counter play to power is protection witch all core profession have and easy to spam /toughness witch dont do much in SPVP
    counter play to condi is resistance and cleansing but with the amount of different condi mirage and scourge do its hard to mitigate plus the application of weakness tell me what power can do in the face of all that

  • saerni.2584saerni.2584 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @DragonFury.6243 said:

    @mortrialus.3062 said:

    @DragonFury.6243 said:

    @mortrialus.3062 said:

    @STIHL.2489 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @STIHL.2489 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @DragonFury.6243 said:

    @will de grijze jager.6594 said:
    thief and mesmer still can condi burst in 1 second kitten why.

    because the devz saw no one plays teef and mes !!! so they gave them the condi burst and rest professions GTH no one care !!!

    No, it was there before & still is. It was 2 patches ago they removed Defensive auto passives on certain classes. In my book, the devs have not done anoth & should remove all passives that procs automatically.

    should this include auras, damage fields, and condition ticks?

    Not the same as passives that proc's when your under attack or under a certain amount of health. I have no problem with anything that use's a players ability to click on a skill to activate it. But other wise it makes for lazy playing that makes players think there pros. haha!

    Oh come off it.. stacking conditions in general is lazy play.

    A condi attack is still just an attack that has to land. I really don't see any functional difference between power and condition damage except the flavor in how they're delivered; power being immediate and condition being more but over a longer period of time.

    Confusion and torment are supposed to be burstier conditions because the victim themselves is doing most of the legwork into making those conditions do damage. The main problem and outlier is Mesmer Torch's burning. It's absurdly high. Between the two mesmer torch skills, when traited it's like 18k damage over 4 seconds if you land all three pulses of burning. They need to get trimmed or tuned into one stack across like 12 seconds or something.

    OMG i hope you enjoy your brainless mirage and i hope you give scourge a try i am sure you ll like it

    What's your problem?

    my problem is the comparison between power and condi
    counter play to power is protection witch all core profession have and easy to spam /toughness witch dont do much in SPVP
    counter play to condi is resistance and cleansing but with the amount of different condi mirage and scourge do its hard to mitigate plus the application of weakness tell me what power can do in the face of all that

    Given that condi is played effectively on only a few builds out of all those available...I’m not sure you’ve established power builds can do “nothing” or are weaker than condi.

    You also acknowledge that condi is mitigated by cleanse and resistance (and minus duration traits/runes) but discount it based on the fact you can’t stop a condi build from killing you, which is entirely the point. Otherwise, condi wouldn’t be viable.

    You also treat condi as a problem solely based on mirage and scourge while claims of a 35k condi thief burst are...frankly wrong unless you redefine busy to mean “landing all attacks without the target cleansing for over 15 seconds.” I guarantee that anyone who stands there for that long and doesn’t use mitigation will die regardless of being damaged from condi or power.

    Northern Shiverpeaks (NSP)
    Deadeye (Thief)
    Commandant of P/D and Apex Predator

  • DragonFury.6243DragonFury.6243 Member ✭✭✭

    @saerni.2584 said:

    @DragonFury.6243 said:

    @mortrialus.3062 said:

    @DragonFury.6243 said:

    @mortrialus.3062 said:

    @STIHL.2489 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @STIHL.2489 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @DragonFury.6243 said:

    @will de grijze jager.6594 said:
    thief and mesmer still can condi burst in 1 second kitten why.

    because the devz saw no one plays teef and mes !!! so they gave them the condi burst and rest professions GTH no one care !!!

    No, it was there before & still is. It was 2 patches ago they removed Defensive auto passives on certain classes. In my book, the devs have not done anoth & should remove all passives that procs automatically.

    should this include auras, damage fields, and condition ticks?

    Not the same as passives that proc's when your under attack or under a certain amount of health. I have no problem with anything that use's a players ability to click on a skill to activate it. But other wise it makes for lazy playing that makes players think there pros. haha!

    Oh come off it.. stacking conditions in general is lazy play.

    A condi attack is still just an attack that has to land. I really don't see any functional difference between power and condition damage except the flavor in how they're delivered; power being immediate and condition being more but over a longer period of time.

    Confusion and torment are supposed to be burstier conditions because the victim themselves is doing most of the legwork into making those conditions do damage. The main problem and outlier is Mesmer Torch's burning. It's absurdly high. Between the two mesmer torch skills, when traited it's like 18k damage over 4 seconds if you land all three pulses of burning. They need to get trimmed or tuned into one stack across like 12 seconds or something.

    OMG i hope you enjoy your brainless mirage and i hope you give scourge a try i am sure you ll like it

    What's your problem?

    my problem is the comparison between power and condi
    counter play to power is protection witch all core profession have and easy to spam /toughness witch dont do much in SPVP
    counter play to condi is resistance and cleansing but with the amount of different condi mirage and scourge do its hard to mitigate plus the application of weakness tell me what power can do in the face of all that

    Given that condi is played effectively on only a few builds out of all those available...I’m not sure you’ve established power builds can do “nothing” or are weaker than condi.

    You also acknowledge that condi is mitigated by cleanse and resistance (and minus duration traits/runes) but discount it based on the fact you can’t stop a condi build from killing you, which is entirely the point. Otherwise, condi wouldn’t be viable.

    You also treat condi as a problem solely based on mirage and scourge while claims of a 35k condi thief burst are...frankly wrong unless you redefine busy to mean “landing all attacks without the target cleansing for over 15 seconds.” I guarantee that anyone who stands there for that long and doesn’t use mitigation will die regardless of being damaged from condi or power.

    AHH i forget condi teef but you miss my point witch is the application of different condi in less than a 3 sec that why you dont see players complain about firebrand who can do 60k to a profession that dont have any cleansing
    4+ different condi is just too much specially if they are applied by less than 3 skills
    the application of cripple from scourge and bind from mirage and imob from teef should be remove so the condi cleanse do something in pvp
    also in team fight we have shared protection from other team mate but the share condi cleanse is almost none exist in the current meta
    if i am fighting 1 mirage 1 scourge you will not see me here complain cuz my condi cleanse will give me a chance to survive to either kill the enemy or disengage the fight but if you played pvp yesterday you ll see that is not the situation
    but the pvp community know that the amount of condi cleanse in the game is very low that why you see the condi teef also join the pvp now
    that why you see player complain not just mirage but the amount of condi in the match can kill me 10 times before i can cap a point

  • EpicTurtle.8571EpicTurtle.8571 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited June 13, 2018

    @Meteor.3720 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @Meteor.3720 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @Meteor.3720 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @STIHL.2489 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @DragonFury.6243 said:

    @will de grijze jager.6594 said:
    thief and mesmer still can condi burst in 1 second kitten why.

    because the devz saw no one plays teef and mes !!! so they gave them the condi burst and rest professions GTH no one care !!!

    No, it was there before & still is. It was 2 patches ago they removed Defensive auto passives on certain classes. In my book, the devs have not done anoth & should remove all passives that procs automatically.

    should this include auras, damage fields, and condition ticks?

    Not the same as passives that proc's when your under attack or under a certain amount of health. I have no problem with anything that use's a players ability to click on a skill to activate it. But other wise it makes for lazy playing that makes players think there pros. haha!

    If you're angry about lazy playing and builds that make players think they're* pros, why do you always defend mirage so much? Epitome of bad players carried by class.

    Have you actually played mirage to make this kind of remark?

    Yes I have.

    If you did, like really played it, you would'nt make this kind of remark. Mirage, Chrono, core mesmer is far from a one lazy button mashing class. There's no passives traits like defy pain that proc's on it's own & there is thought to be put on your playing style. You can't say this on most classes. So no, i don't think you have played the class at all.

    First, I never mentioned chrono or core mesmer. But yes, chrono is also braindead but at least less effective than it used to be. And it's not all about passive traits, it's about fail safes. Yes, mirage doesn't have passives, but if you get stunned you can stunbreak or still dodge. You have a lot of disengage if you mess up and plenty of ways to avoid being punished for making mistakes.
    Obviously there is a skill floor and some players play it far better than others, but that doesn't change the fact that mirage is brainless in the sense that you don't need to worry about making mistakes or not landing key skills.

    The whole community says so, other than you, ithilwen and epicturtle.

    I haven't said anything about whether or not it is skillful. Please don't put words in my mouth. If I say something, it's generally to bring parity or clarification to the usually incoherent ramblings that are indicative of such threads. If you bother to actually read any of my comments I do note that Mirage is overtuned and several core traits need to be looked at and I've never once said that EM was fine or that being able to dodge while stunned is just fine, although since it's unlikely to be changed I'm not going to bother touching on it.

  • mortrialus.3062mortrialus.3062 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited June 13, 2018

    @DragonFury.6243 said:

    @mortrialus.3062 said:

    @DragonFury.6243 said:

    @mortrialus.3062 said:

    @STIHL.2489 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @STIHL.2489 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @DragonFury.6243 said:

    @will de grijze jager.6594 said:
    thief and mesmer still can condi burst in 1 second kitten why.

    because the devz saw no one plays teef and mes !!! so they gave them the condi burst and rest professions GTH no one care !!!

    No, it was there before & still is. It was 2 patches ago they removed Defensive auto passives on certain classes. In my book, the devs have not done anoth & should remove all passives that procs automatically.

    should this include auras, damage fields, and condition ticks?

    Not the same as passives that proc's when your under attack or under a certain amount of health. I have no problem with anything that use's a players ability to click on a skill to activate it. But other wise it makes for lazy playing that makes players think there pros. haha!

    Oh come off it.. stacking conditions in general is lazy play.

    A condi attack is still just an attack that has to land. I really don't see any functional difference between power and condition damage except the flavor in how they're delivered; power being immediate and condition being more but over a longer period of time.

    Confusion and torment are supposed to be burstier conditions because the victim themselves is doing most of the legwork into making those conditions do damage. The main problem and outlier is Mesmer Torch's burning. It's absurdly high. Between the two mesmer torch skills, when traited it's like 18k damage over 4 seconds if you land all three pulses of burning. They need to get trimmed or tuned into one stack across like 12 seconds or something.

    OMG i hope you enjoy your brainless mirage and i hope you give scourge a try i am sure you ll like it

    What's your problem?

    my problem is the comparison between power and condi
    counter play to power is protection witch all core profession have and easy to spam /toughness witch dont do much in SPVP
    counter play to condi is resistance and cleansing but with the amount of different condi mirage and scourge do its hard to mitigate plus the application of weakness tell me what power can do in the face of all that

    Except even protection doesn't just retroactively negate attacks that correctly landed on you the way just cleansing conditions and resistance does.

    Right now the majority of builds you're going to see are power based. Warriors, revs, guardians, rangers, engineers, elementalists (Weaver duelist is kind of a jack of all trades kind of thing) are all running either power builds or support builds (I say support in an "Runs mender amulet and doesn't die" sort of way). Thieves are about a 50/50 split between power and condi in ranked. It's really just mesmers and necros primarily running condition builds and even then there's tons of power chronos and reapers in ranked.

    I think when you look at power vs. condition we're in an overall good place right now. In a good meta, we should see a variety of power and condition based builds and that's exactly what we got.

    The Psychomancer: Mesmer Elite Specialization Suggestion

  • DragonFury.6243DragonFury.6243 Member ✭✭✭

    @mortrialus.3062 said:

    @DragonFury.6243 said:

    @mortrialus.3062 said:

    @DragonFury.6243 said:

    @mortrialus.3062 said:

    @STIHL.2489 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @STIHL.2489 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @DragonFury.6243 said:

    @will de grijze jager.6594 said:
    thief and mesmer still can condi burst in 1 second kitten why.

    because the devz saw no one plays teef and mes !!! so they gave them the condi burst and rest professions GTH no one care !!!

    No, it was there before & still is. It was 2 patches ago they removed Defensive auto passives on certain classes. In my book, the devs have not done anoth & should remove all passives that procs automatically.

    should this include auras, damage fields, and condition ticks?

    Not the same as passives that proc's when your under attack or under a certain amount of health. I have no problem with anything that use's a players ability to click on a skill to activate it. But other wise it makes for lazy playing that makes players think there pros. haha!

    Oh come off it.. stacking conditions in general is lazy play.

    A condi attack is still just an attack that has to land. I really don't see any functional difference between power and condition damage except the flavor in how they're delivered; power being immediate and condition being more but over a longer period of time.

    Confusion and torment are supposed to be burstier conditions because the victim themselves is doing most of the legwork into making those conditions do damage. The main problem and outlier is Mesmer Torch's burning. It's absurdly high. Between the two mesmer torch skills, when traited it's like 18k damage over 4 seconds if you land all three pulses of burning. They need to get trimmed or tuned into one stack across like 12 seconds or something.

    OMG i hope you enjoy your brainless mirage and i hope you give scourge a try i am sure you ll like it

    What's your problem?

    my problem is the comparison between power and condi
    counter play to power is protection witch all core profession have and easy to spam /toughness witch dont do much in SPVP
    counter play to condi is resistance and cleansing but with the amount of different condi mirage and scourge do its hard to mitigate plus the application of weakness tell me what power can do in the face of all that

    Except even protection doesn't just retroactively negate attacks that correctly landed on you the way just cleansing conditions and resistance does.

    Right now the majority of builds you're going to see are power based. Warriors, revs, guardians, rangers, engineers, elementalists (Weaver duelist is kind of a jack of all trades kind of thing) are all running either power builds or support builds (I say support in an "Runs mender amulet and doesn't die" sort of way). Thieves are about a 50/50 split between power and condi in ranked. It's really just mesmers and necros primarily running condition builds and even then there's tons of power chronos and reapers in ranked.

    I think when you look at power vs. condition we're in an overall good place right now. In a good meta, we should see a variety of power and condition based builds and that's exactly what we got.

    AHHH so you think reaper can kill scourge in pvp the mmr will match a reaper vs scourge the one that can attack 10 players and you still think that the team that have reaper will have a chance then please play reaper for 50 games and see you rank drop to gold 3

  • mortrialus.3062mortrialus.3062 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited June 13, 2018

    @DragonFury.6243 said:

    @mortrialus.3062 said:

    @DragonFury.6243 said:

    @mortrialus.3062 said:

    @DragonFury.6243 said:

    @mortrialus.3062 said:

    @STIHL.2489 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @STIHL.2489 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @DragonFury.6243 said:

    @will de grijze jager.6594 said:
    thief and mesmer still can condi burst in 1 second kitten why.

    because the devz saw no one plays teef and mes !!! so they gave them the condi burst and rest professions GTH no one care !!!

    No, it was there before & still is. It was 2 patches ago they removed Defensive auto passives on certain classes. In my book, the devs have not done anoth & should remove all passives that procs automatically.

    should this include auras, damage fields, and condition ticks?

    Not the same as passives that proc's when your under attack or under a certain amount of health. I have no problem with anything that use's a players ability to click on a skill to activate it. But other wise it makes for lazy playing that makes players think there pros. haha!

    Oh come off it.. stacking conditions in general is lazy play.

    A condi attack is still just an attack that has to land. I really don't see any functional difference between power and condition damage except the flavor in how they're delivered; power being immediate and condition being more but over a longer period of time.

    Confusion and torment are supposed to be burstier conditions because the victim themselves is doing most of the legwork into making those conditions do damage. The main problem and outlier is Mesmer Torch's burning. It's absurdly high. Between the two mesmer torch skills, when traited it's like 18k damage over 4 seconds if you land all three pulses of burning. They need to get trimmed or tuned into one stack across like 12 seconds or something.

    OMG i hope you enjoy your brainless mirage and i hope you give scourge a try i am sure you ll like it

    What's your problem?

    my problem is the comparison between power and condi
    counter play to power is protection witch all core profession have and easy to spam /toughness witch dont do much in SPVP
    counter play to condi is resistance and cleansing but with the amount of different condi mirage and scourge do its hard to mitigate plus the application of weakness tell me what power can do in the face of all that

    Except even protection doesn't just retroactively negate attacks that correctly landed on you the way just cleansing conditions and resistance does.

    Right now the majority of builds you're going to see are power based. Warriors, revs, guardians, rangers, engineers, elementalists (Weaver duelist is kind of a jack of all trades kind of thing) are all running either power builds or support builds (I say support in an "Runs mender amulet and doesn't die" sort of way). Thieves are about a 50/50 split between power and condi in ranked. It's really just mesmers and necros primarily running condition builds and even then there's tons of power chronos and reapers in ranked.

    I think when you look at power vs. condition we're in an overall good place right now. In a good meta, we should see a variety of power and condition based builds and that's exactly what we got.

    AHHH so you think reaper can kill scourge in pvp the mmr will match a reaper vs scourge the one that can attack 10 players and you still think that the team that have reaper will have a chance then please play reaper for 50 games and see you rank drop to gold 3

    You're really bizarrely hostile.

    Anyway, Reaper is hard countered by scourge in specific but there's still a lot of people maining reaper in upper platinum. Is scourge a better build? Yeah but reaper is in no way the worst off build in the game. In fact, Reaper's biggest weakness is just the fact that Scourge is it's hard counter and Scourge is meta. If that wasn't the case and it had a reliable way to disengage it would be a top tier build. It's plenty viable.

    The Psychomancer: Mesmer Elite Specialization Suggestion

  • UfoCoffee.2084UfoCoffee.2084 Member ✭✭✭

    The game is the most balanced it's ever been. Maybe change your stubburn builds and add more condi cleanse onto it? Condi thief and mesmer can be annoying but they're one trick ponies. If you dodge or block their burst, they have nothing for like 25 seconds or so.

  • babazhook.6805babazhook.6805 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @babazhook.6805 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:
    I get what the op's is saying. & Losing some damage output in exchange for condi cleans is not a bad thing. It's called balance. But there are overtuned builds such as SD condi thief that can dish out on any light armor more then 35k condi poison damage on 1 shot. plus everything else. Now that's unbalance. I should put pic's of it make you all grow wide eyed from it.

    **35k on one shot? Would you care to elaborate how that possible? **

    Idk... only thing i know is it's a SD jumping in & out thief that drops out tons of condis where i don't have anoth condition clear to clear it up. I got a great pic too. Just to lazy to poste it. Thief is not the only one that does ridiculous amount of damage. Welcom to PoF

    Then you are talking about multiple attacks, including dodges, the steal , utilities and the like and calling it ONE SHOT. At 35k it also more then a little likely it involved venom share with thieves guild or other players. In other words you did nothing to mitigate or avoid all of these attacks as they were ongoing.

    If I did multiple attacks on you from any power class and you did nothing to try and avoid or mitigate the same you would be just as dead.

    The thing which so many seem not to understand is just as you do not rely on your heal to heal all damage from a power attack , you do not rely on a cleanse to clean all the attacks that apply conditions. Just as with power damage incoming you use blocks. , dodges , evades and the like to make sure a given condition attack does not hit in the first place. What I find of great Interest is that If I am on my thief using a p/p unload , the enemy will dodge it or use a block or a reflect to ensure that at leas t some of the damage avoided or reflected yet I can face the same player using a condition build and apply multiple conditions and they just eat the damage.

    The same mitigation and avoidance measures work against a number of Condition sources so why not use them?

  • Vieux P.1238Vieux P.1238 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @babazhook.6805 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @babazhook.6805 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:
    I get what the op's is saying. & Losing some damage output in exchange for condi cleans is not a bad thing. It's called balance. But there are overtuned builds such as SD condi thief that can dish out on any light armor more then 35k condi poison damage on 1 shot. plus everything else. Now that's unbalance. I should put pic's of it make you all grow wide eyed from it.

    **35k on one shot? Would you care to elaborate how that possible? **

    Idk... only thing i know is it's a SD jumping in & out thief that drops out tons of condis where i don't have anoth condition clear to clear it up. I got a great pic too. Just to lazy to poste it. Thief is not the only one that does ridiculous amount of damage. Welcom to PoF

    Then you are talking about multiple attacks, including dodges, the steal , utilities and the like and calling it ONE SHOT. At 35k it also more then a little likely it involved venom share with thieves guild or other players. In other words you did nothing to mitigate or avoid all of these attacks as they were ongoing.

    If I did multiple attacks on you from any power class and you did nothing to try and avoid or mitigate the same you would be just as dead.

    The thing which so many seem not to understand is just as you do not rely on your heal to heal all damage from a power attack , you do not rely on a cleanse to clean all the attacks that apply conditions. Just as with power damage incoming you use blocks. , dodges , evades and the like to make sure a given condition attack does not hit in the first place. What I find of great Interest is that If I am on my thief using a p/p unload , the enemy will dodge it or use a block or a reflect to ensure that at leas t some of the damage avoided or reflected yet I can face the same player using a condition build and apply multiple conditions and they just eat the damage.

    The same mitigation and avoidance measures work against a number of Condition sources so why not use them?

    No im talking 1 attack. If i add the other attacks we are talking about 50-60k total

    Winter Nerf is coming!

  • babazhook.6805babazhook.6805 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @babazhook.6805 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @babazhook.6805 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:
    I get what the op's is saying. & Losing some damage output in exchange for condi cleans is not a bad thing. It's called balance. But there are overtuned builds such as SD condi thief that can dish out on any light armor more then 35k condi poison damage on 1 shot. plus everything else. Now that's unbalance. I should put pic's of it make you all grow wide eyed from it.

    **35k on one shot? Would you care to elaborate how that possible? **

    Idk... only thing i know is it's a SD jumping in & out thief that drops out tons of condis where i don't have anoth condition clear to clear it up. I got a great pic too. Just to lazy to poste it. Thief is not the only one that does ridiculous amount of damage. Welcom to PoF

    Then you are talking about multiple attacks, including dodges, the steal , utilities and the like and calling it ONE SHOT. At 35k it also more then a little likely it involved venom share with thieves guild or other players. In other words you did nothing to mitigate or avoid all of these attacks as they were ongoing.

    If I did multiple attacks on you from any power class and you did nothing to try and avoid or mitigate the same you would be just as dead.

    The thing which so many seem not to understand is just as you do not rely on your heal to heal all damage from a power attack , you do not rely on a cleanse to clean all the attacks that apply conditions. Just as with power damage incoming you use blocks. , dodges , evades and the like to make sure a given condition attack does not hit in the first place. What I find of great Interest is that If I am on my thief using a p/p unload , the enemy will dodge it or use a block or a reflect to ensure that at leas t some of the damage avoided or reflected yet I can face the same player using a condition build and apply multiple conditions and they just eat the damage.

    The same mitigation and avoidance measures work against a number of Condition sources so why not use them?

    No im talking 1 attack. If i add the other attacks we are talking about 50-60k total

    Rubbish. One attack can not apply 35k in poison.

  • Vieux P.1238Vieux P.1238 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @babazhook.6805 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @babazhook.6805 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:

    @babazhook.6805 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:
    I get what the op's is saying. & Losing some damage output in exchange for condi cleans is not a bad thing. It's called balance. But there are overtuned builds such as SD condi thief that can dish out on any light armor more then 35k condi poison damage on 1 shot. plus everything else. Now that's unbalance. I should put pic's of it make you all grow wide eyed from it.

    **35k on one shot? Would you care to elaborate how that possible? **

    Idk... only thing i know is it's a SD jumping in & out thief that drops out tons of condis where i don't have anoth condition clear to clear it up. I got a great pic too. Just to lazy to poste it. Thief is not the only one that does ridiculous amount of damage. Welcom to PoF

    Then you are talking about multiple attacks, including dodges, the steal , utilities and the like and calling it ONE SHOT. At 35k it also more then a little likely it involved venom share with thieves guild or other players. In other words you did nothing to mitigate or avoid all of these attacks as they were ongoing.

    If I did multiple attacks on you from any power class and you did nothing to try and avoid or mitigate the same you would be just as dead.

    The thing which so many seem not to understand is just as you do not rely on your heal to heal all damage from a power attack , you do not rely on a cleanse to clean all the attacks that apply conditions. Just as with power damage incoming you use blocks. , dodges , evades and the like to make sure a given condition attack does not hit in the first place. What I find of great Interest is that If I am on my thief using a p/p unload , the enemy will dodge it or use a block or a reflect to ensure that at leas t some of the damage avoided or reflected yet I can face the same player using a condition build and apply multiple conditions and they just eat the damage.

    The same mitigation and avoidance measures work against a number of Condition sources so why not use them?

    No im talking 1 attack. If i add the other attacks we are talking about 50-60k total

    Rubbish. One attack can not apply 35k in poison.

    Are you willing to bet on it? Like 1000 gold. Remember, i got a pic that im to lazy to post. But 1000 gold would make me less lazy.

    Winter Nerf is coming!

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