T2 Fractals are too easy

There are a lot of players who have no clue of simple fractals and bosses mechanics in T3, and the main reason is they don't get punished hard in T2 if they ignore the mechanics, especially in boss fights.

I know the T2 is not supposed to be hard, but at least players should be punished hard if they ignore the mechanics.

so it should be

T1: players should know the mechanicsT2: players must not ignore the mechanicsT3: players should face some challengesT4: players should face more challenges

Although I agree with you that T2s could be more challenging, I would be inclined to say that T3s are really another learning step before T4s/CMs and not overly re-playable content.It's probably the roughest bracket to go through since it's the first tier where ignoring mechanics has significant impact (far more than T2s - as you mentioned) and practically no experienced players go there (apart from recs maybe) so no chance to be carried. On the plus side, it shouldn't take very long to pass into T4s where things are much more predictable/stable.My suggestion is - if you think you know the mechanics, etc. well enough, try to ask friends or guildies to get you straight into T4s (since you cant access the T4 LFG).

@MarshallLaw.9260 said:Although I agree with you that T2s could be more challenging, I would be inclined to say that T3s are really another learning step before T4s/CMs and not overly re-playable content.It's probably the roughest bracket to go through since it's the first tier where ignoring mechanics has significant impact (far more than T2s - as you mentioned) and practically no experienced players go there (apart from recs maybe) so no chance to be carried. On the plus side, it shouldn't take very long to pass into T4s where things are much more predictable/stable.My suggestion is - if you think you know the mechanics, etc. well enough, try to ask friends or guildies to get you straight into T4s (since you cant access the T4 LFG).

The thing is i was wanting to stay at T3 for ever, it was my goal once i started the fractals, because i am somehow a chill player who do not want so much attention and challenges while playing a pve, T3 rewards are decent enough, BUT when i started playing some of the T3 i surprised by the amount of noobies there, i maybe didn't notice them at T2 since it was a forgiving tier. idk.

@NiSHAN.4385 said:

@MarshallLaw.9260 said:Although I agree with you that T2s could be more challenging, I would be inclined to say that T3s are really another learning step before T4s/CMs and not overly re-playable content.It's probably the roughest bracket to go through since it's the first tier where ignoring mechanics has significant impact (far more than T2s - as you mentioned) and practically no experienced players go there (apart from recs maybe) so no chance to be carried. On the plus side, it shouldn't take very long to pass into T4s where things are much more predictable/stable.My suggestion is - if you think you know the mechanics, etc. well enough, try to ask friends or guildies to get you straight into T4s (since you cant access the T4 LFG).

Obviously each to their own, but once you get to a certain level you'll perhaps find T3s boring and see that T4s can be pretty chill as long as everyone knows mechanics.A fairly casual, non-meta group can get through daily T4s within 30-40 mins easily (dependent on which fractals are in rotation - some, like SO just take longer because of cut-scenes and transitions).You're right, T3s are less forgiving but also the majority of people in T3 are ones trying to climb to T4 as fast as they can which means they will bundle through any way they can and have probably done the bare minimum of T1s and 2s. The system lets you skip a lot of fractals anyway (as an example - the first time I even saw inside Shattered Observatory was at T4, having skipped T1-T3).

Why not just have a bonus reward for not being hit by anything avoidable?

Positive reinforcement works better than negative.

@MarshallLaw.9260 said:

@NiSHAN.4385 said:

@MarshallLaw.9260 said:Although I agree with you that T2s could be more challenging, I would be inclined to say that T3s are really another learning step before T4s/CMs and not overly re-playable content.It's probably the roughest bracket to go through since it's the first tier where ignoring mechanics has significant impact (far more than T2s - as you mentioned) and practically no experienced players go there (apart from recs maybe) so no chance to be carried. On the plus side, it shouldn't take very long to pass into T4s where things are much more predictable/stable.My suggestion is - if you think you know the mechanics, etc. well enough, try to ask friends or guildies to get you straight into T4s (since you cant access the T4 LFG).

i think you are right, i will be playing T3 for a week or two and see if get bored :)

@MithranArkanere.8957 said:Why not just have a bonus reward for not being hit by anything avoidable?

Positive reinforcement works better than negative.

Fractals are already easy especially at the lower tiers.And their rewards (Positive reinforcement) are on of the best in the game right now.So going to the negative reinforcement side makes sense.

@NiSHAN.4385 said:

@MithranArkanere.8957 said:Why not just have a bonus reward for not being hit by anything avoidable?

Positive reinforcement works better than negative.

As a general rule, negative reinforcement does not work out well. It is generally the worst possible choice of training methods, so ... this is unlikely to get players to improve, just to be sulky, mad, and generally either not play fractals, or work out how to ignore the mechanics with, eg, healing.

I don't think the evidence supports the claim that "T2" is too easy. The fact that we see people struggling with T3 is only an indication that, well, people struggle with T3. There are lots of reasons we might see that.

There are several pillars to success in fractals: knowing the mechanics, dishing out damage, working as a team, active defense, and (intertwined to the last three), having appropriate gear+build. At T1, any one of those will do. At T2, any two suffice. T3 is the first time that you need some combination of all of the above. In addition, folks who can't T3, drop to T2 while those that can T3 move out of T3 as quickly as possible: for nearly identical effort, the reward is roughly twice as good in T4.

So it's not so much that the difficulty jumps suddenly, it's that the things that matter ... matter more. Thus T3 is disproportionately populated by those that have trouble in T3, while T2 is disproportionately populated by those who find it a cake walk. That gives the illusion that one is too hard, the other too easy.

Under these circumstances, I like the current status quo: T2 is chill, T4 is mostly good, and there's a single tier that causes conniptions that no one needs to remain in for long.

T4's are mostly fine,and i agree with the Positive reinforcement is better negative thing,i mean remember when they released twilight oasis??people whined so much on the forums they nerfed to the ground,heck some ppl still are whining.

@NiSHAN.4385 said:There are a lot of players who have no clue of simple fractals and bosses mechanics in T3, and the main reason is they don't get punished hard in T2 if they ignore the mechanics, especially in boss fights.

I know the T2 is not supposed to be hard, but at least players should be punished hard if they ignore the mechanics.

so it should be

T1: players should know the mechanicsT2: players must not ignore the mechanicsT3: players should face some challengesT4: players should face more challenges

Players arent even punished in t4 for failing mechanics u expect them to be punished in t2? LOL

@zealex.9410 said:

@NiSHAN.4385 said:There are a lot of players who have no clue of simple fractals and bosses mechanics in T3, and the main reason is they don't get punished hard in T2 if they ignore the mechanics, especially in boss fights.

I know the T2 is not supposed to be hard, but at least players should be punished hard if they ignore the mechanics.

so it should be

T1: players should know the mechanicsT2: players must not ignore the mechanicsT3: players should face some challengesT4: players should face more challenges

True, we need t5/t6 fractals already if Anet doesnt want to make a CM for at least half the fractals

T1-2 are intentionally super easy so any player can clear them with no challenge or problems. It's a result of arena.net's design philosophy.

@"Illconceived Was Na.9781" said:I don't think the evidence supports the claim that "T2" is too easy. The fact that we see people struggling with T3 is only an indication that, well, people struggle with T3. There are lots of reasons we might see that.

There are several pillars to success in fractals: knowing the mechanics, dishing out damage, working as a team, active defense, and (intertwined to the last three), having appropriate gear+build. At T1, any one of those will do. At T2, any two suffice. T3 is the first time that you need some combination of all of the above. In addition, folks who can't T3, drop to T2 while those that can T3 move out of T3 as quickly as possible: for nearly identical effort, the reward is roughly twice as good in T4.

So it's not so much that the difficulty jumps suddenly, it's that the things that matter ... matter more. Thus T3 is disproportionately populated by those that have trouble in T3, while T2 is disproportionately populated by those who find it a cake walk. That gives the illusion that one is too hard, the other too easy.

Under these circumstances, I like the current status quo: T2 is chill, T4 is mostly good, and there's a single tier that causes conniptions that no one needs to remain in for long.

The only thing I would add to this excellent summary is this: if you are here on the forums, you are already one of the most dedicated players in the game. As such, it is very easy to forget just how good you are at it.

Something might seem trivially easy to you, so you could run it blindfold and backwards, and still seem like an insurmountable wall of challenge to someone who isn't nearly so good as you are. Not because they are inherently bad, but just because they have not yet mastered the full complexity of the game, the game mode, and all the other things that go into making you the end result of, well, "git gud" in action. :)