Dhuumfire: Say what??????????

Dhuumfire: This trait now has a cooldown when used in conjunction with the scourge specialization. This cooldown is set at 5 seconds in PvP and WvW and 3 seconds in PvE.What? what? what? I had to check this if it were true and it is, the recharge only appears with Scourge as 3rd trait.Ok let me get this straight, correct me if I'm wrong, this is by far the ONLY core trait which gets directly influenced by an Elite Specialization.Isn't this a bit too unfair treatment? Necromancers have always had it hard, but now they get unique nerfs just because a certain trait works too well with new Elite Spec?

I wasn't on for a while so I don't really know, if there were other changes like this and if there were please post them here.But if it is the first time, then this is a truly low blow.

Its the right move. They need to do this with other traits. Other classes. Other specs. Too many skills are too strong when combined with elite specs.

No its not the right move, you just know nothing about scourge armageddon, or maybe you are plain bad

Ok let me get this straight, correct me if I'm wrong, this is by far the ONLY core trait which gets directly influenced by an Elite Specialization.

Say "Hi" to path of corruption.

They only did this because it's to much work to address the real issues.

correct me if I'm wrong, this is by far the ONLY core trait which gets directly influenced by an Elite Specialization

Path of corruption

@"Dadnir.5038" said:

Ok let me get this straight, correct me if I'm wrong, this is by far the ONLY core trait which gets directly influenced by an Elite Specialization.

I see, but are there any non-necromancer changes like this?

@Rikimaru.7890 said:

@"Dadnir.5038" said:

Ok let me get this straight, correct me if I'm wrong, this is by far the ONLY core trait which gets directly influenced by an Elite Specialization.

I think mesmer has 1 trait that changes (vai nerf) when choronomancer is used with it but its nothing as impactful as path of corruption or dhuumfire is to scourge.

Thats about the only one though.

As i said in another post my issues thisDhuumfire is a questionable Grand masterIt underperforms with core shroudIt performs decently with reapers melee autoIt was considered to be over-performing with scourge. (more so before some of the recent nerfs to scourge )

So while they are making split rules to reduce its effectiveness with scourge why don't we see them scaling it up when its used without an elite spec at all.

@Rikimaru.7890 said:

@"Dadnir.5038" said:

Ok let me get this straight, correct me if I'm wrong, this is by far the ONLY core trait which gets directly influenced by an Elite Specialization.

Berserker f skills used to count as a lvl 3 adrenaline for their traits till it was reduced to 1 if that counts. Honestly though, not really suprising considering we also have the only trait in game that reduces one of the bonuses we get from a boon to boost another stat; awaken the pain, pinnacle of str's sad, deformed relative.

@ArmageddonAsh.6430 said:Its the right move. They need to do this with other traits. Other classes. Other specs. Too many skills are too strong when combined with elite specs.

Yeah. But right now it only happened to necro 2 times and not to other classes if i recall correctly!?

I was wondering why devs are having so big issues with balancing necro. If this forum has more topics like this one, I don't expect them fixing necro anytime soon. Instead of asking devs for the justification of nerfing Scourge (underperforming spec in PvE) without giving anything back for it, you're biased about 'change that was never made for other class' roflmao...

If anything, this is a really positive move: Anet recognising unbalanced over-synergy with one elite spec, and rather than nerfing that trait/skill into oblivion, they nerf it only when used with that elite, preserving its utility in a more general sense. It means we don't have to worry about older builds being nerfed as a result of newer ones.

Well for WvW i can understand this nerf but for PvE it is unnecessary, a bad and lazy way to balance a class. I expected even big shade nerf or rework, but tbh Dhuumfire was a surprise to me.

burning made up over 50% of wvw scourge damage, this was a 75% nerf to burning output on scourge. they just took condi scourge out of wvw completely, last patch took support scourge out.

you can still play power scourge, but honestly why would you? reaper does it better

@Egorum.9506 said:burning made up over 50% of wvw scourge damage, this was a 75% nerf to burning output on scourge. they just took condi scourge out of wvw completely, last patch took support scourge out.

you can still play power scourge, but honestly why would you? reaper does it better

reaper better???? try to push a 60 men zerg as reaper… revs hammer will hit you with 8k+ dmg and ele Meteors will terminate you with 12k+ hits Long before you are able to hit just 1 enemie. this patch shows again: devs are a joke…

core necro has 40 seconds cd on shroud skills that made Maybe 25 % of other classes burstskills that have 5-6 seconds cd. a class without ANY stability, block, invul invis or mobility.

Reaper is melee while slowliest class in the game, everyone has more range and higher mobility. so gap Closing is nearly impsossible against half way decent opponents, WHILE haveing nearly no stability and no other defense mechanics.

scourge perform poorly as power dmg dealer in comparison to ele or rev. while condi and support builds got terminated without any compensation. ridiculous.

what is anet doing? they terminate a WHOLE class! while classes like warrior, ele, engi get many buffs for their invulns and dmg skills. necro get Nothing? when everyone else gets tronger and necro dont. its a nerf.

@Zero.3871 said:

@"Egorum.9506" said:burning made up over 50% of wvw scourge damage, this was a 75% nerf to burning output on scourge. they just took condi scourge out of wvw completely, last patch took support scourge out.

you can still play power scourge, but honestly why would you? reaper does it better

I feel like scourge mains are getting upset with reaper mains for some reason... As far as playing reaper goes, you either get it or you don't. I'm getting to the point where when I see an enemy reaper, I give them a jeep wave. Good reapers can definitely push 60 man zergs lol. Excellent video :smile:

Why the f... Ist this scourge Vs reaper? This should be necro Vs devs

@Egorum.9506 said:

@Zero.3871 said:

@Egorum.9506 said:burning made up over 50% of wvw scourge damage, this was a 75% nerf to burning output on scourge. they just took condi scourge out of wvw completely, last patch took support scourge out.

you can still play power scourge, but honestly why would you? reaper does it better

what do you want to Show me? after 1 min in this Video you have just 120 k dmg, you are only first place because your teammates are useless, and enemie is way more useless… a good ele has 200k+ dmg after first Meteor. a good rev does 40k dmg on rev hammer 2 and 3 every 4 and 8 seconds...after 60 seconds of Fighting you should have way more. so plz dont Show me a Video where skillless People Play against even more skilless People just to Show a reaper is first rank dmg dealer in this clownfiesta...

@Zero.3871 said:

@Egorum.9506 said:

@Zero.3871 said:

@Egorum.9506 said:burning made up over 50% of wvw scourge damage, this was a 75% nerf to burning output on scourge. they just took condi scourge out of wvw completely, last patch took support scourge out.

you can still play power scourge, but honestly why would you? reaper does it better

It's in response to the guy who says you can't play reaper in zergs homie. And the only time you'll see 200k off one meteor or rev bomb is if the enemy doesn't have fbs or chronos. Come play in t1?

@Egorum.9506 said:

@Zero.3871 said:

@Egorum.9506 said:

@Zero.3871 said:

@Egorum.9506 said:burning made up over 50% of wvw scourge damage, this was a 75% nerf to burning output on scourge. they just took condi scourge out of wvw completely, last patch took support scourge out.

you can still play power scourge, but honestly why would you? reaper does it better

i played in every Tier and People dont get better in higher Tiers, just more, so PLLLZZZZ. and you are wrong, you just Need a good zerg that know how to bomb. that means, SB bubbles, hard CC in this bubbles so enemy cant dodge out, and than bomb...and repeat.

@ArmageddonAsh.6430 said:Its the right move. They need to do this with other traits. Other classes. Other specs. Too many skills are too strong when combined with elite specs.

No, the right move would be to change Sand Savant from a Major area denial trait into a supportive trait so we wouldn't have necromancer's covering a massive portion of ground while vomiting multiple conditions. So that the smaller shades could be used to create choke points to open strategic placing. This change does nothing to solve that issue and just further nerfs necromancer's already bad DPS in PvE. Scourge is still going to be dominant in PvP and WvW. This wont change much or anything really. You'll still see a blanket of sand savant shades and dozens of conditions. This is the wrong move. So was nerfing Epidemic.

I'm going to have to retire my necromancer. Not because I want to but because I literally wont be taken for raid groups or wanted in Fractals. It already was a struggle as it was.

"Dhuumfire: The scourge's internal cooldown for this skill has been reduced from 3 seconds to 1 second in PvE only."

PRAISE THE LORD. I guess this should significantly cushion the nerfs.

@"Naustis.8510" said:I was wondering why devs are having so big issues with balancing necro. If this forum has more topics like this one, I don't expect them fixing necro anytime soon. Instead of asking devs for the justification of nerfing Scourge (underperforming spec in PvE) without giving anything back for it, you're biased about 'change that was never made for other class' roflmao...

Its not "just necro"...... Everything currently revolves around a massive DPS model, and has for a very long time. Boon Corruption/Conversion added a facet to this- but keep in mind that Boons were mitigating the previous power damage meta. Condi was just as dangerous back then, but the frequency of application was notably lower, and thus cleansing/support builds could more easily keep pace. If you lose your supports, the condis would definitely eat you alive; but with the Supports in relative balance against it, this made Power damage a stronger defining factor. The big battle of the last meta was CC vs Stability, since power damage can be negated simply by moving out of the AOEs. That doesn't work with condi, because it lingers.

If you look at every aspect of every meta for WvW and PvE, the viability of builds are determined by how they slot into this DPS model. Supports can either mitigate or negate damage, or buff allied damage. DPS builds are ranked by their damage output. Controls only matter in edge cases; with raids designing edge cases to create demand for them. PvP differs in that viability is split between damage and shut down. This is afford by the lower damage thresholds needed to be lethal, going along side the lower reliability of buffs/boons.

Like I was saying in another thread, Necros balance problem largely stem from a model thats purely number driven, and can grow in parallel using condi. They can't negate incoming damage, so much as Soak it; and their outgoing damage without is low frequency (which cleanses can deal with), but with Scourge it becomes very high frequency. The flaw here is that Shades are a delivery mechanism that Scourge can optionally pile more conditions into, and then burst it in a short window. Ironically this isn't a new concept for Necro, as the last wvw meta had Marks/Wells. But those also needed the target to be pinned in the AOEs, where Shades can do this without that requirement.

@"Azrielvon.7836" said:"Dhuumfire: The scourge's internal cooldown for this skill has been reduced from 3 seconds to 1 second in PvE only."

PRAISE THE LORD. I guess this should significantly cushion the nerfs.

There shouldn't have to be an epic meltdown before thinking about the implications of skill changes.