How to pick a class that you can play long term despite meta changes? — Guild Wars 2 Forums

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How to pick a class that you can play long term despite meta changes?

Asking because I sometimes find that I’ll take a class that I enjoy and has a meta build and then next balance patch is no longer part of meta for PVE (I understand that meta is only really important for raids/high level fractals). But just wanted to ask how to pick a class to play long term/ opinions on classes that have remained relatively well balanced

Answers

  • flarezi.9381flarezi.9381 Member ✭✭

    Warrior would be my safe bet.

  • SoulSin.5682SoulSin.5682 Member ✭✭✭

    This is irrelevant.
    On the long term, every class will always be buffed and every class will always be nerfed.

    Grinding Alts is extremely easy on Gw2. At some point just have more characters.

  • ArthurDent.9538ArthurDent.9538 Member ✭✭✭

    Warrior has been permanently top tier meta for just about everything in pve and will continue to be so until they finally address how over the top powerful banners are.

  • Rysdude.3824Rysdude.3824 Member ✭✭✭

    Mesmer isnt going anywhere

  • Try and find out.

    When I first started playing I chose the Necromancer and I thought it was nice. I played it for about a year before deciding it just wasn't for me. I tried the Engineer after that and despite all the ups and downs it's had I still exclusively play only it 5 years later.

    Try some classes and find out is all we can really say.

  • Catchyfx.5768Catchyfx.5768 Member ✭✭✭

    Mesmer, Warrior, Elementalist Safe pick meta in both PvE and PvP/WvW for loooong time

    #FreePosini

  • Do you think that professions will always come in and out of meta? If some mechanics of a profession get nerfed others will get buffed - therefore only changing the meta build of a profession rather than the meta professions. I was looking at elementalist because of its versatility and therefore can fulfil many roles for changing meta?

  • Catchyfx.5768Catchyfx.5768 Member ✭✭✭

    8/9 classes have 2/3 builds that are meta in PvE , only necromancer have 1 build wich works only half a year because nerfs. So pick anything except necro.

    #FreePosini

  • Westenev.5289Westenev.5289 Member ✭✭✭

    Remember that different builds can have different playstyles and themes, even within the same class. It's important not to judge a class based on one build (a pitfall I find people fall into wayyyy too often).

    If you want a "safe" class that won't see major nerfs or buffs, pick Guardian - AKA Anet's balance measuring stick. Since HoT, it has never been "out of meta", yet it's rarely too stronk.

  • @Westenev.5289 said:
    Remember that different builds can have different playstyles and themes, even within the same class. It's important not to judge a class based on one build (a pitfall I find people fall into wayyyy too often).

    If you want a "safe" class that won't see major nerfs or buffs, pick Guardian - AKA Anet's balance measuring stick. Since HoT, it has never been "out of meta", yet it's rarely too stronk.

    I really like my guardian, with D/hunter brings great dps and firebrand brings decent support and condition dps. So Seems as it will be able to cope better with meta changes as it will have multiple builds. Can the same be said with ele?

  • Westenev.5289Westenev.5289 Member ✭✭✭

    @PsYclOpS.8017 said:

    @Westenev.5289 said:
    Remember that different builds can have different playstyles and themes, even within the same class. It's important not to judge a class based on one build (a pitfall I find people fall into wayyyy too often).

    If you want a "safe" class that won't see major nerfs or buffs, pick Guardian - AKA Anet's balance measuring stick. Since HoT, it has never been "out of meta", yet it's rarely too stronk.

    I really like my guardian, with D/hunter brings great dps and firebrand brings decent support and condition dps. So Seems as it will be able to cope better with meta changes as it will have multiple builds. Can the same be said with ele?

    Hard to say. Ele has always been carried by its staff rotations and large hitbox aoe's for DPS, which I feel is slowly getting nerfed over time. Some people believe healing ele's work, but I prefer my Druid.

    I mean, I can't see Anet over-nerfing elementalists - they're the squishiest profession in the game.

  • @Westenev.5289 said:

    @PsYclOpS.8017 said:

    @Westenev.5289 said:
    Remember that different builds can have different playstyles and themes, even within the same class. It's important not to judge a class based on one build (a pitfall I find people fall into wayyyy too often).

    If you want a "safe" class that won't see major nerfs or buffs, pick Guardian - AKA Anet's balance measuring stick. Since HoT, it has never been "out of meta", yet it's rarely too stronk.

    I really like my guardian, with D/hunter brings great dps and firebrand brings decent support and condition dps. So Seems as it will be able to cope better with meta changes as it will have multiple builds. Can the same be said with ele?

    Hard to say. Ele has always been carried by its staff rotations and large hitbox aoe's for DPS, which I feel is slowly getting nerfed over time. Some people believe healing ele's work, but I prefer my Druid.

    I mean, I can't see Anet over-nerfing elementalists - they're the squishiest profession in the game.

    Yeah, I noticed in the balance patch the other day that some of the staff skills had their dps ramp ups increased (meteor shower/lava font). But with potential sword buffs weaver sword would become more of the meta so then it just comes back to the meta build of a profession changing rather than the meta professions changing, would that be a fair comment. Warrior would probably be a good bet but not a fan of the playstyle. May be i'm just overthinking it haha. Like you say being the squishiest profession in the game (although defense is more in weapon skills and utility rather than high health pool) ele has to have some pay off in damage for or else noone would pick it

  • starlinvf.1358starlinvf.1358 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @PsYclOpS.8017 said:
    Asking because I sometimes find that I’ll take a class that I enjoy and has a meta build and then next balance patch is no longer part of meta for PVE (I understand that meta is only really important for raids/high level fractals). But just wanted to ask how to pick a class to play long term/ opinions on classes that have remained relatively well balanced

    You don't pick "one" class.... you build at least 3 to cover your bases, and go with cheap gear options when you can get away with it. For instance, my Guard runs Firebrand in both PvE and WvW, but I run Full Cele in openworld and Half Cele/Half Minstrel in WvW. I have 2 gear sets for Necro to be either Power Reaper or Condi Scourge. My Mesmer is built support Chrono, and run 1 gear set for all modes (very easy to adapt utility via traits). And a Power Warrior that used to be a power Berserker, and a Phalanx warrior before that.

    The problem with picking "one class" based on long term viability is how the Devs are now using Especs to disrupt entire metas. Before POF I would had said Guardian would always remain relevant in every game mode for its inline support. But with the push for overly specialized support builds, and each other class collectively capable of outclassing it in specific areas, Raid meta will very readily throw builds out because of the amount of leeway it get in terms of group comp. WvW has a harder time of this, because it has consistently needed the same set of things since its inception, and individual build performance has to encompass personal defense on top of group comp.

    Because of this intentional dismantling of Meta level concepts, no class is safe from being marginalized as many now rely on a hand full of key elements that can cause the whole build to collapse if messed with. For Support Chorno thats its boon share for Quickness and Alacrity, and much of that focused into Signet of Inspiration to create overlap. For Field based DPS builds, its the ability to strike multiple times across a large hit box. Druid's viability currently hinges entirely on Might stacks and a Glyph... which if something else gives better might, that knocks the entire Druid spec out, leaving the Ranger spirits as the only reason to even bring the class. Firebrand, Scourge and Spell Breaker are a symbiotic meta that collectively breaks the previous Stability/Boon share meta, and replaced it as a Conversion meta. And that synergy relies heavily on Scourge converting boons directly into Torment and Cripple, which bottlenecks the reverse conversion to Might/Swiftness that are overstacked boon to begin with. If you somehow break that process, you can break that entire synergy and supersede it with something else.

    This is only going to get worse as time goes on, unless they can normalize Especs.... which I doubt will happen, since being OP is kind of a selling point for many of the Especs on a conceptual level. Right now the most likely solution is to normalize Core, so no matter which way the Especs go, they add damage or support to compliment them. Or if we can afford to wait for 2 more expansions, 4 Especs for each class to cover the major build types (pDPS, cDPS, Support and Control).

  • phs.6089phs.6089 Member ✭✭✭

    @flarezi.9381 said:
    Warrior would be my safe bet.

    War! Cus banners :)

    Numbers have accomplished what strategy alone could not.

  • SunTzu.4513SunTzu.4513 Member ✭✭✭

    Find a nice guild that suits you and you can play whatever you want. I'm a necro and rev main player but with the right mates you can raid with those classes too.

  • Fenom.9457Fenom.9457 Member ✭✭✭✭

    I just picked ele cause I liked it and never changed because I was right and I did enjoy it. I never struggle in the world in such a way that leads me to believe my choice of class is to blame. Ele is fairly meta so maybe I'm just lucky

    HARRY! DIDYA PUT YER NAME IN DA GOBLET OF FIYAH?!

  • Just another view on this, pick an armour weight instead of a class. That way you need one set of armour and limited weapons. GW2 is extremely alt friendly so use that to your advantage.

  • @starlinvf.1358 said:

    @PsYclOpS.8017 said:
    Asking because I sometimes find that I’ll take a class that I enjoy and has a meta build and then next balance patch is no longer part of meta for PVE (I understand that meta is only really important for raids/high level fractals). But just wanted to ask how to pick a class to play long term/ opinions on classes that have remained relatively well balanced

    You don't pick "one" class.... you build at least 3 to cover your bases, and go with cheap gear options when you can get away with it. For instance, my Guard runs Firebrand in both PvE and WvW, but I run Full Cele in openworld and Half Cele/Half Minstrel in WvW. I have 2 gear sets for Necro to be either Power Reaper or Condi Scourge. My Mesmer is built support Chrono, and run 1 gear set for all modes (very easy to adapt utility via traits). And a Power Warrior that used to be a power Berserker, and a Phalanx warrior before that.

    The problem with picking "one class" based on long term viability is how the Devs are now using Especs to disrupt entire metas. Before POF I would had said Guardian would always remain relevant in every game mode for its inline support. But with the push for overly specialized support builds, and each other class collectively capable of outclassing it in specific areas, Raid meta will very readily throw builds out because of the amount of leeway it get in terms of group comp. WvW has a harder time of this, because it has consistently needed the same set of things since its inception, and individual build performance has to encompass personal defense on top of group comp.

    Because of this intentional dismantling of Meta level concepts, no class is safe from being marginalized as many now rely on a hand full of key elements that can cause the whole build to collapse if messed with. For Support Chorno thats its boon share for Quickness and Alacrity, and much of that focused into Signet of Inspiration to create overlap. For Field based DPS builds, its the ability to strike multiple times across a large hit box. Druid's viability currently hinges entirely on Might stacks and a Glyph... which if something else gives better might, that knocks the entire Druid spec out, leaving the Ranger spirits as the only reason to even bring the class. Firebrand, Scourge and Spell Breaker are a symbiotic meta that collectively breaks the previous Stability/Boon share meta, and replaced it as a Conversion meta. And that synergy relies heavily on Scourge converting boons directly into Torment and Cripple, which bottlenecks the reverse conversion to Might/Swiftness that are overstacked boon to begin with. If you somehow break that process, you can break that entire synergy and supersede it with something else.

    This is only going to get worse as time goes on, unless they can normalize Especs.... which I doubt will happen, since being OP is kind of a selling point for many of the Especs on a conceptual level. Right now the most likely solution is to normalize Core, so no matter which way the Especs go, they add damage or support to compliment them. Or if we can afford to wait for 2 more expansions, 4 Especs for each class to cover the major build types (pDPS, cDPS, Support and Control).

    Thanks :) so, that essentially mean you just want multiple classes and hope one of those is meta at a given point in time? Take one from each armour type perhaps

  • Nimon.7840Nimon.7840 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited July 12, 2018

    From history?
    Play mesmer. It's been meta since raids exist
    Or warrior with its banners

  • otto.5684otto.5684 Member ✭✭✭✭

    PvE, Mesmer, warrior and gurdian are the best bets. They always tend to have one build the is meta.

    PvP, I think necro and Mesmer.

    Though, I agree with op that Anet does not have seem to have a vision of where things should be and keep and how classes should perform. This is why the class balance is kitten.

  • Kumouta.4985Kumouta.4985 Member ✭✭✭

    Go mesmer.

  • starlinvf.1358starlinvf.1358 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @PsYclOpS.8017 said:

    @starlinvf.1358 said:

    @PsYclOpS.8017 said:
    Asking because I sometimes find that I’ll take a class that I enjoy and has a meta build and then next balance patch is no longer part of meta for PVE (I understand that meta is only really important for raids/high level fractals). But just wanted to ask how to pick a class to play long term/ opinions on classes that have remained relatively well balanced

    You don't pick "one" class.... you build at least 3 to cover your bases, and go with cheap gear options when you can get away with it. For instance, my Guard runs Firebrand in both PvE and WvW, but I run Full Cele in openworld and Half Cele/Half Minstrel in WvW. I have 2 gear sets for Necro to be either Power Reaper or Condi Scourge. My Mesmer is built support Chrono, and run 1 gear set for all modes (very easy to adapt utility via traits). And a Power Warrior that used to be a power Berserker, and a Phalanx warrior before that.

    The problem with picking "one class" based on long term viability is how the Devs are now using Especs to disrupt entire metas. Before POF I would had said Guardian would always remain relevant in every game mode for its inline support. But with the push for overly specialized support builds, and each other class collectively capable of outclassing it in specific areas, Raid meta will very readily throw builds out because of the amount of leeway it get in terms of group comp. WvW has a harder time of this, because it has consistently needed the same set of things since its inception, and individual build performance has to encompass personal defense on top of group comp.

    Because of this intentional dismantling of Meta level concepts, no class is safe from being marginalized as many now rely on a hand full of key elements that can cause the whole build to collapse if messed with. For Support Chorno thats its boon share for Quickness and Alacrity, and much of that focused into Signet of Inspiration to create overlap. For Field based DPS builds, its the ability to strike multiple times across a large hit box. Druid's viability currently hinges entirely on Might stacks and a Glyph... which if something else gives better might, that knocks the entire Druid spec out, leaving the Ranger spirits as the only reason to even bring the class. Firebrand, Scourge and Spell Breaker are a symbiotic meta that collectively breaks the previous Stability/Boon share meta, and replaced it as a Conversion meta. And that synergy relies heavily on Scourge converting boons directly into Torment and Cripple, which bottlenecks the reverse conversion to Might/Swiftness that are overstacked boon to begin with. If you somehow break that process, you can break that entire synergy and supersede it with something else.

    This is only going to get worse as time goes on, unless they can normalize Especs.... which I doubt will happen, since being OP is kind of a selling point for many of the Especs on a conceptual level. Right now the most likely solution is to normalize Core, so no matter which way the Especs go, they add damage or support to compliment them. Or if we can afford to wait for 2 more expansions, 4 Especs for each class to cover the major build types (pDPS, cDPS, Support and Control).

    Thanks :) so, that essentially mean you just want multiple classes and hope one of those is meta at a given point in time? Take one from each armour type perhaps

    Essentially yes. But given how much I like the idea of them differing on a mechanical level, I made one of each, and roll with the builds I find interesting. Like how I don't like core thief stealth juggling for minimum viability, but a brawler DareDevil has a much lower skill requirement, and can still use the stealth mechanics as an edge case. That is something I can work with. I never take it into PvP because I can't use it properly, but a far as PvE is concerned, I can tool around with it and not fail instantly. But Deadeye is interesting as hell, and does a lot of stuff you could never do on Longbow Ranger, despite both fitting the same overall function in WvW, and both being considered equally worthless in the Meta. :p

    I don't get full use out of every class.... but regardless of what content block playing, I always have at least one build that will pass muster when I need to focus on success. And once I get bored or need to adopt a new role, I can experiment with builds and learn how they operate. I do this kind of thing in every game I play. Just constantly explore builds and playstyles to see whats fun, or at least gain insight into what it is.

  • Ephemiel.5694Ephemiel.5694 Member ✭✭✭

    All of them.

    Regardless of how the forums go berserk, ALL of the professions and specs can do everything and happily do it well. People are just prone to crazy when others don't use the strongest stuff [ironically they don't use it either, yet demand others do] or when their mains are nerfed, regardless of how little it is [let me direct you to Overwatch, where people complained like crazy when Soldier:76's damage was reduced.....by 1].

  • It's just tough trying to balance what i want to play with what people want me to play. I still believe that each profession should have its core theme and each elite spec extends from that. I think i'm just trying to find a profession that isn't reliant on a small handful of traits. It's why im considering ele just because it is a DPS class; needing pay off for skill curve/squishy? but also has healing/support role as well

  • Obtena.7952Obtena.7952 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited July 15, 2018

    If you are willing to balance what you want to play vs. what people tell you to play, just take the class you like and run the meta builds on it. In the long term, there isn't a guarantee it will stay. Take each one. Most classes are reliant on a handful of traits, especially if you play meta.

    If you think balancing is only driven by performance and justified by comparisons to other classes then prepare to be educated:

    https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/balance-updates-the-heralds-near-future-and-pvp-league-season-13/

  • I don't care meta I care for play for class what I love.
    See many people jump ship to that meta this meta and see oh mi gosh myliferuin meta balancechit!!
    well...

  • Manpag.6421Manpag.6421 Member ✭✭✭

    Or just ignore the meta. Play your way, if something works – great! If it doesn't, change it until it does. It's a game, if you find yourself playing something you hate just because it's effective, you've already lost the whole point of this being a game.

  • starlinvf.1358starlinvf.1358 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Manpag.6421 said:
    Or just ignore the meta. Play your way, if something works – great! If it doesn't, change it until it does. It's a game, if you find yourself playing something you hate just because it's effective, you've already lost the whole point of this being a game.

    Blinding following the meta is unwise, but so is trying to ignore it. The conceptual approach to meta is fairly solid, but our use of it is fundamentally flawed. That is, its built on the idea that players understand buildcraft, and displays prominent build synergy, as well as interactions with other builds. But in practice its used to copy a build with little understanding of how it works, and get around comprehension through rout memorization of a rotation.

    The biggest issue of this is how its overuse and tendency to overall specialize has forced the Devs into directly responding to it, and can be seen in POF's Especs basically built to counter an entire game wide meta. This further plugs into the Raids, which has created this feedback loop that only has good visibility on whats overly effective, leading them to target those more then addressing a more underlying problem. The irony being other builds are destroyed as collateral damage, because different builds don't scale consistently despite using common elements.

  • Dace.8173Dace.8173 Member ✭✭✭

    I play whats fun and just ignore meta. If it's good it's good. If it's bad it's bad. But if I love my character then good or bad don't matter so long as I'm having fun. I mained Engie up until HoT and then I added Rev to my main list, replacing Necro. But I still find Necro fun, even if people say it sucks. The same with Rev. I know that Renegade may not be the most OP thing I could play but I find it to be a blast and so that's all that really matters.

    But I do run several characters. I think the only one I have not created is a Mesmer, which I will get around too soonish. I didn't like my Warrior until I tried Spellbreaker and now I find that one more fun. So just play what's fun and you will be able to weather the good and bad.

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