Oglaf.1074 Posted July 12, 2018 Share Posted July 12, 2018 So all it took to kill him was to tear him limb from limb like that? How come nobody has ever tried to simply behead him before?Personally I'm not convinced he is dead.In his own words, his immortality is quite amazing. There is in my mind a distinct possibility that if you were to behead him, the head would remain alive - Black Knight style. Awakened seem far more durable than that, and Joko was the uber-Awakened. Lesser Awakaned have been brought back to undeath after getting all messed up and thought dead, too.Which of course raises the posibility that he might still be alive inside of Aurene in some kind of horrible, horrible vore-inspired fever nightmare....! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Illconceived Was Na.9781 Posted July 12, 2018 Share Posted July 12, 2018 @"Oglaf.1074" said:So all it took to kill him was to tear him limb from limb like that? How come nobody has ever tried to simply behead him before?Well, first of all, he wasn't beheaded: he was eaten. By a dragon, one of the world's primal forces. So I think I'd translate the question as, "how come none of the other dragons tried to eat him before?" (Answer: because they don't seem to care much about other sentient life forms.)Second, we don't know how it was he escaped death before. If he had a horcrux phylactery, maybe he needed time to use it and didn't get a chance because he thought he had already won this battle. Or maybe Aurene's magic prevented his soul from reaching it. Maybe he ran out of soulboxes (although, like the overplanning project manager that he is, that seems unlikely; he has more contingency plans than NASA). Maybe his soul tried to escape and was consumed by Aurene? Maybe the commander weakened him more than he thought?Which of course raises the posibility that he might still be alive inside of Aurene in some kind of horribly, horrible vore-inspired fever nightmare....!Sure, that could be true. I hope it's not because I've never enjoyed the fantasy trope of epic enemies that keep coming back. The Green Goblin and the Joker and yes, the Daleks become less appealing to me with each iteration. (Probably because I think it shows a lack of imagination on the part of the authors.) That's not to say it never works; I just don't like to see it as the first choice, unless there's a strong compelling story behind it.Mind you: I do hope the story takes a moment or three to (ahem) flesh out what exactly happened to the lich, even though I don't agree that there's some sort of plot hole or much chance of a Joko Part IV. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oglaf.1074 Posted July 12, 2018 Author Share Posted July 12, 2018 Beheaded, dismembered, eaten - all the same really. Devastating bodily harm. Something the Awakened prior have shown quite the impressive resistance to. It just seems odd to finish Joko off with that method as you'd think it'd be quite ineffective (which he proved just seconds before). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quaniesan.8497 Posted July 12, 2018 Share Posted July 12, 2018 Anti-climax at its best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oglaf.1074 Posted July 12, 2018 Author Share Posted July 12, 2018 @quaniesan.8497 said:Anti-climax at its best.Kind of, yeah. Especially since the scene where he fixes his broken body and gives that awesome speech just before it was amazing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drarnor Kunoram.5180 Posted July 12, 2018 Share Posted July 12, 2018 @Oglaf.1074 said:Beheaded, dismembered, eaten - all the same really. Devastating bodily harm. Something the Awakened prior have shown quite the impressive resistance to. It just seems odd to finish Joko off with that method as you'd think it'd be quite ineffective (which he proved just seconds before).Because Aurene didn't just eat his body, which he probably could have come back from just fine. She ate his magic as well. Having his magic was absolutely necessary for him to survive.I had called Aurene eating Joko as being his final death, I just didn't expect it to happen this episode. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randulf.7614 Posted July 12, 2018 Share Posted July 12, 2018 He was eaten AFTER Aurene unbound his magic. Taking him apart limb from limb is the irrelevant part. He was already destroyed by that point Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derd.6413 Posted July 12, 2018 Share Posted July 12, 2018 since EDs eat magic, and some effects after being eaten, it's safe to assume it wasn't the bodily harm that killed him but the magical harm that did Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tsakhi.8124 Posted July 12, 2018 Share Posted July 12, 2018 And what remains of Joko's sentience is standing in the Mist, sad."Hello from the other side!I must have died a thousand times.To tell you I'm sorry for giving my heart (and everything else)"[scene fades] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ephemiel.5694 Posted July 12, 2018 Share Posted July 12, 2018 @Illconceived Was Na.9781 said:@Oglaf.1074 said:So all it took to kill him was to tear him limb from limb like that? How come nobody has ever tried to simply behead him before?he thought he had already won this battle.Wrong. When you finish the final mission, you can find a statue that reveals a recording he made exactly because he thought he could die during the fight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Illconceived Was Na.9781 Posted July 12, 2018 Share Posted July 12, 2018 @Ephemiel.5694 said:@Illconceived Was Na.9781 said:@Oglaf.1074 said:So all it took to kill him was to tear him limb from limb like that? How come nobody has ever tried to simply behead him before?he thought he had already won this battle.Wrong. When you finish the final mission, you can find a statue that reveals a recording he made exactly because he thought he could die during the fight.I think you've misunderstood the point I'm making, besides also not accounting for some possibilities.Joko's reputation as being undefeatable, unkillable is mostly due to ... Joko's self-promotion. Folk think he can't be killed because he claims he can't be.Even if that's not the case, the recording he made was a small part of his many, many, many contingency plans. The fact that he made it only let's us know he was prepared to lose that battle. At the moment that Aurene swept in, however, he clearly was unprepared — at that moment, he was convinced he was done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zaraki.5784 Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 Aurene will have to poo sooner or later :p Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ephemiel.5694 Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 @Illconceived Was Na.9781 said:@Ephemiel.5694 said:@Illconceived Was Na.9781 said:@"Oglaf.1074" said:So all it took to kill him was to tear him limb from limb like that? How come nobody has ever tried to simply behead him before?he thought he had already won this battle.Wrong. When you finish the final mission, you can find a statue that reveals a recording he made exactly because he thought he could die during the fight.I think you've misunderstood the point I'm making, besides also not accounting for some possibilities.Joko's reputation as being undefeatable, unkillable is mostly due to ... Joko's self-promotion. Folk think he can't be killed because he claims he can't be.Even if that's not the case, the recording he made was a small part of his many, many, many contingency plans. The fact that he made it only let's us know he was prepared to lose that battle. At the moment that Aurene swept in, however, he clearly was unprepared — at that moment, he was convinced he was done.Joko's rep for being unkillable is, quite literally, because he's a Lich. Hell, WE "kill" him and he happily stands back up.The whole point for that recording, and why it's unavailable till we finish that mission, is to imply that he not only knows far more than he lets on, but that he actually truly considered the fact he might die. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oglaf.1074 Posted July 13, 2018 Author Share Posted July 13, 2018 ... where can one fidn this recording exactly? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Konig Des Todes.2086 Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 @Oglaf.1074 said:So all it took to kill him was to tear him limb from limb like that? How come nobody has ever tried to simply behead him before?If you watch the cinematic, there's a burst of magical energy the very moment Aurene first chomps down on him. It isn't a simple case of tearing him limb from limb - he was already dead by the time Aurene was eating him. It was a case of the magic that made him immortal being destroyed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Ansari.1604 Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 @Illconceived Was Na.9781 said:Joko's reputation as being undefeatable, unkillable is mostly due to ... Joko's self-promotion. Folk think he can't be killed because he claims he can't be.To expand on Ephemial's response, the reputation wasn't even Joko's doing. It originally stemed from Turai Ossa and the fledgling Order of Whispers doing everything they could think of to try to kill him... and failing. Joko mentions being 'sundered' while he was sealed away before GW1, so this wasn't the first time he was bodily torn apart. He somehow managed to piece himself back together, seemingly without outside intervention. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Illconceived Was Na.9781 Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 @Aaron Ansari.1604 said:@Illconceived Was Na.9781 said:Joko's reputation as being undefeatable, unkillable is mostly due to ... Joko's self-promotion. Folk think he can't be killed because he claims he can't be.To expand on Ephemial's response, the reputation wasn't even Joko's doing. It originally stemed from Turai Ossa and the fledgling Order of Whispers doing everything they could think of to try to kill him... and failing. Joko mentions being 'sundered' while he was sealed away before GW1, so this wasn't the first time he was bodily torn apart. He somehow managed to piece himself back together, seemingly without outside intervention. Maybe he didn't invent the idea of being unkillable. But he's certainly used in marketing his brand. My point is: we don't really know that he's unkillable. We just know that he says he is (and ok, other people think it, too).It's like being surprised that Stainless Steel can be ... stained. Despite the name, it's never been better than stain-resistant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Rex.4261 Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 Joko is not dead. He is eternal - and we're going to rescue him from the stomach of that feral beast - and everyone who dared to sully his name will be severely punished.As our king, our god - Palawa Joko is eternal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oglaf.1074 Posted July 13, 2018 Author Share Posted July 13, 2018 So yeah... never got an answer: Where is the post-story recording located...? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyson.5160 Posted July 14, 2018 Share Posted July 14, 2018 @Oglaf.1074 said:So yeah... never got an answer: Where is the post-story recording located...?It’s on the second level of the loyalist encampment on the west side of the zone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tachenon.5270 Posted July 14, 2018 Share Posted July 14, 2018 "It's a FAKE!" ~ VreenakSee, what happened was, when Joko zapped that nearby Awakened, he didn't absorb it's, ah, undead force? -- magical energy? -- whatever -- he actually switched places with it, presto-switcho, ya know, oldest trick in the book, and while our intrepid commanders and Braham-Braham were all caught up (literally) listening as false Joko carried on with the evil-villain tirade, the real Joko quietly slipped away to plot again another day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randulf.7614 Posted July 14, 2018 Share Posted July 14, 2018 @"Tachenon.5270" said:"It's a FAKE!" ~ VreenakSee, what happened was, when Joko zapped that nearby Awakened, he didn't absorb it's, ah, undead force? -- magical energy? -- whatever -- he actually switched places with it, presto-switcho, ya know, oldest trick in the book, and while our intrepid commanders and Braham-Braham were all caught up (literally) listening as false Joko carried on with the evil-villain tirade, the real Joko quietly slipped away to plot again another day.OK all I can hear in my head now is this, with visions of Joko tip-toeing out of viewhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9OPc7MRm4Y8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tabasco.1743 Posted July 14, 2018 Share Posted July 14, 2018 @"Illconceived Was Na.9781" said:I hope it's not because I've never enjoyed the fantasy trope of epic enemies that keep coming back. The Green Goblin and the Joker and yes, the Daleks become less appealing to me with each iteration. (Probably because I think it shows a lack of imagination on the part of the authors.)Hey whoa hey uncalled for why are we bringing the Daleks into this? EX-PLAIN?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maximus Delion.8719 Posted July 15, 2018 Share Posted July 15, 2018 Yeah, I'm curious whether Joko is really dead, or if his "essence" is just being held inside Aurene.Let's assume Aurene becomes a fully-grown Elder Dragon, and does the usual Elder Dragon thing of consuming a bunch of magic, then going to sleep for thousands of years... and then several millennia later, that magic starts to slowly seep out of her. Perhaps in another 10,000 years we'll finally see Joko again (though I can't imagine he'd be in a very good state of mind after being imprisoned in the gut of a dragon for that long.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tanith.5264 Posted July 15, 2018 Share Posted July 15, 2018 Joko as a Dalek. Now there's a terrifying mental picture. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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