Gods and Dragons Theory (lose theory!)

So I had a shower thought which developed into a theory regarding the dragons and human gods etc. Feel free to disagree or if you have any counterpoints go for it. Or if anyone has already posted something similar.

So things to remember:

• Human gods are not creators - they came from another realm/place with humans in tow
• Mursaat can phase out of the fabric of our realm - so there are ways of traversing realms
• 6 gods 6 dragons
• We can’t keep killing dragons
• When a human god dies (Abbadon/Balthazar) their essence dissipates into another vessel - much like when a dragon is killed.

What if in a parallel realm where humanity originated from, they had a similar issue with dragons but found a way to stop the cycle? By containing the magical energy rather than destroying and redistributing the energy, they were able to keep the dragons in a dormant state as the only solution to maintain balance.

Perhaps a few chosen were imbued with levels of magic so to stop the saturation of magic getting so high that it would awaken the dragons. Humans could not hold as much magic as an elder dragon but could be made to hold enough to stop them awakening (some sort of ritual or item that they have… I don’t know).

At some point, they may have started lording it over people and were exiled along with the followers who would become the foundation of their faith system in our Tyria. Or perhaps they left with the magic still bound to them to make sure that it could not seep out and awaken their dragons along with followers who over the years the faith arose.

Potentially they did not know of the dragon threat in this Tyria so had not considered the consequences.

This could explain why Kralk could absorb Balthazar much in the way that he tried to do that to Jormag/Primordus - the magic is the same and compatible.

Thoughts?

Tldr; the human gods are just magic infused humans from another dimension/realm in a bid to reduce the saturation of magic on their end in order to save their people.

About Gods not being creators theres some Asura researcher who said this theory, but do not remember who it is, if anyone can remember would be grateful. I can not remember if it was in a book in Durmandy Priory.

if the human gods know how to beat the EDs, why would they abandon tyria? (btw: it is confirmed they left because they couldn't win against the EDs)

Interesting. Maybe history is repeating itself with our Commanders and their companions, and eventually they'll become the 'Gods' of some other world out there in the Mists.

Their essence doesn't dissipate into another vessel, it HAD to be absorbed or it would run rampant, this is why Kormir absorbed Abaddon's. In Balthazar's case, of course 2 magic-absorbing Dragons took all his magic, it's what they do.

Not only that, but in a book in-game called The Six: Being or Playing God, it is implied the Gods may not be actual Gods at all, but they're actually Humans who had attained incredible amounts of magic and longevity. This would explain why some of them have families [balthazar has a father and brother, Grenth is actually Dwayna's son with a human father]. Kormir is, literally, a Human that absorbed Abaddon's power, which pretty much confirms this theory and, of course, the fact that we defeat Balthazar without any sort of actual power or blessing [and this is an EMPOWERED Balthazar with magic from 2 Elder Dragons thanks to Taimi's machine].

@"ugrakarma.9416" said:About Gods not being creators theres some Asura researcher who said this theory, but do not remember who it is, if anyone can remember would be grateful. I can not remember if it was in a book in Durmandy Priory.

It's not just a theory. The timeline of the game has Tyria, the Elder Dragons, and more than half a dozen races well established long before the Six arrived. Even mainstream human religion has accepted that their gods didn't create the world, although they did do quite a bit to make it more livable for humanity.

@Kholem.6092 said:When a human god dies (Abbadon/Balthazar) their essence dissipates into another vessel - much like when a dragon is killed.

This isn't entirely accurate. It is more that when a god (or former god in Balthazar's case), the magic they contain gets unleashed in a magical storm that, if not contained, will effectively explode.

Whereas with the Elder Dragons, it non-violently will spread into its surroundings, where it is free for absorption by others.

@Kholem.6092 said:What if in a parallel realm where humanity originated from, they had a similar issue with dragons but found a way to stop the cycle? By containing the magical energy rather than destroying and redistributing the energy, they were able to keep the dragons in a dormant state as the only solution to maintain balance.

So your theory has one flaw, and it is a massive one. We had dev comment telling us that the reason why humans believe the Six Gods made magic in the world js because 1) magic was very low in Tyria at the time of gifting magic and 2) the world humanity came from had little to no magic.

@Kholem.6092 said:This could explain why Kralk could absorb Balthazar much in the way that he tried to do that to Jormag/Primordus - the magic is the same and compatible.

Kralkatorrik and Aurene could eat the magic unleashed by Balthazar because all that magic was Tyrian in the first place, it all came from the Maguuma Bloodstone, Primordus, and Jormag. None of it was non-Tyrian because as Kormir said, Balthazar was stripped of his divinity.

@"Ephemiel.5694" said:Not only that, but in a book in-game called The Six: Being or Playing God, it is implied the Gods may not be actual Gods at all, but they're actually Humans who had attained incredible amounts of magic and longevity. [...] Kormir is, literally, a Human that absorbed Abaddon's power, which pretty much confirms this theory and, of course, the fact that we defeat Balthazar without any sort of actual power or blessing [and this is an EMPOWERED Balthazar with magic from 2 Elder Dragons thanks to Taimi's machine].

Well... Not quite. It's pretty clear that neither Balthazar nor Abaddon were human anymore. I am on my phone so I cannot make a full fledged post with citations but basically evidence shows that the Six Gods are not living beings at all but husks of pure magical energy, and not any magical energy but a special type of magic which marks then as "the Six".

Koss on Koss object found during Hidden Arcana in season2 as well as Kormir's Journal in Facing the Truth both mention that Kormir "died" whem she ascended.

In Heart of the Volcano when scanning Balthazar the scanner comes back with "no life detected". When he does and breaks apart (juat as Abaddon did!) we see that he is just skin, bone, and a ton of magic.

And we could beat Balthazar because he was bo longer a god. His divine power was taken from him as Kormir stated. Not onlu that but we wielded his own sword, Sohothon, and was being protected by Aurene who had eaten magic from Mordremoth's death. Balthazar may have been "empowered" but before that he was on par to mortals again, and we were NOT without our own tricks.

i found the text i mentioned.

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/The_Six:_Being_or_Playing_God

More editorial than actual historical work, this book by Xakk, published in 1326 A.E., deconstructs the nature of the gods worshipped by humans.Is it coincidence that they have been gone since the first dragon began to stir? I think not. While they may not be gods, they are certainly not fools. The dragons would covet magic such as theirs.These beings are benefactors—often reluctant, sometimes misguided, and occasionally vindictive. To say that they created our world is ridiculous.Did they bring humans to Tyria? I cannot argue against this. It is an ancient belief that has no proof to support or deny it. Perhaps humans are constructs created from clay and bone.Perhaps they were brought here from somewhere else in the Mists or some other realm within the Eternal Alchemy. I think either of these is plausible, given the power wielded by these beings.But, are they gods? I say no. They are what we would all become if given the amount of magical energy they possess and allowed to live as long as they appear to have.

@Konig Des Todes.2086 said:

@Kholem.6092 said:When a human god dies (Abbadon/Balthazar) their essence dissipates into another vessel - much like when a dragon is killed.

@Kholem.6092 said:What if in a parallel realm where humanity originated from, they had a similar issue with dragons but found a way to stop the cycle? By containing the magical energy rather than destroying and redistributing the energy, they were able to keep the dragons in a dormant state as the only solution to maintain balance.

@Kholem.6092 said:This could explain why Kralk could absorb Balthazar much in the way that he tried to do that to Jormag/Primordus - the magic is the same and compatible.

@"Ephemiel.5694" said:Not only that, but in a book in-game called

The Six: Being or Playing God,

it is implied the Gods may not be actual Gods at all, but they're actually Humans who had attained incredible amounts of magic and longevity. [...] Kormir is, literally, a Human that absorbed Abaddon's power, which pretty much confirms this theory and, of course, the fact that we defeat Balthazar without any sort of actual power or blessing [and this is an EMPOWERED Balthazar with magic from 2 Elder Dragons thanks to Taimi's machine].

We don't use any tricks though, unless a still-baby dragon and a sword empowered BY HIM can somehow count.

@Ephemiel.5694 said:We don't use any tricks though, unless a still-baby dragon and a sword empowered BY HIM can somehow count.

They do. It's a sword made by a god. And protection from a dragon who ate the magic of an Elder Dragon who had ate the magic of another Elder Dragon. These are not things to scoff at.

@"Konig Des Todes.2086" said:Koss on Koss object found during Hidden Arcana in season2 as well as Kormir's Journal in Facing the Truth both mention that Kormir "died" whem she ascended.

This sort of conflicts with the lore around Dwayna and Grenth though, since she's clearly still "alive" enough to get knocked up by a mortal. I'm pretty sure that wouldn't work with a ghost, or anomaly, or djinn, though I guess I could be wrong if biology works very, very differently in Tyria. Don't know if it's a retcon, if the relationship of Dwayna and Grenth is a lie, or if there's some explanation for the conflict.

@Konig Des Todes.2086 said:

@Ephemiel.5694 said:We don't use any tricks though, unless a still-baby dragon and a sword empowered BY HIM can somehow count.

Against a God that also has the magic of 2 Elder Dragons. Also, why would he be weak to his own sword? Did he suddenly gained Kralkatorikk's weakness of getting his butt kicked by his own power?

Also, now that i think about it, this would've been the perfect time to write Magdaer back into the story since Eir picked it up from the Ascalonian Catacombs all the way back during the Personal Story since she's the sister blade to Sohothin.

@"Ephemiel.5694" said:Against a God that also has the magic of 2 Elder Dragons. Also, why would he be weak to his own sword? Did he suddenly gained Kralkatorikk's weakness of getting his butt kicked by his own power?

Also, now that i think about it, this would've been the perfect time to write Magdaer back into the story since Eir picked it up from the Ascalonian Catacombs all the way back during the Personal Story since she's the sister blade to Sohothin.

Balthazar is not the deity he once was. He's still a powerful being, but the sword is also very powerful and had it's power reignited. I don't think it's a matter of "Balthazar's weakness is this sword", but rather "this sword is powerful enough to pierce through Balthazar's defenses".

There's a fundamental difference between using acid that can melt armour (a 'weakness' if you will) and firing a large bullet at a high enough speed to pierce the armour (the bullet that wouldn't pierce that armour at slower speeds or smaller sizes). One directly attacks the integral structure of what makes metal strong and easily removes it as protection, the other is sheer brute force. The sword (in my opinion) is just 'sheer brute force' powerful enough to strike Balthazar and deal enough damage to him to make it an even fight.

We had also previously fought Balthazar using many of his effective techniques when he killed us. Not only do we have experience from the fight in a way that allows us to know his strategy, but we've also surprised Balthazar with our return to life AND Sohothin reignited. On top of that, we free Aurene for some extra fire power that ultimately destroys Balthazar.

I also agree this would have been a good time to use Magdaer, but it looks like the devs haven't really figured out what to do with that and there's possibly some issues with bringing it back that we're not seeing (possibly related to how a bunch of Ascalon has foefire ghosts as key enemies and related to many events, but other stuff too). We'll see what happens with it in the future, but I believe that we're not really gonna see it for a while.

@"perilisk.1874" said:This sort of conflicts with the lore around Dwayna and Grenth though, since she's clearly still "alive" enough to get knocked up by a mortal. I'm pretty sure that wouldn't work with a ghost, or anomaly, or djinn, though I guess I could be wrong if biology works very, very differently in Tyria. Don't know if it's a retcon, if the relationship of Dwayna and Grenth is a lie, or if there's some explanation for the conflict.

Does seem weird buy Dwayne is the goddess of life and who knows how biology functions with constructs of unearthly magic in the first place.

@Ephemiel.5694 said:

@Konig Des Todes.2086 said:

@Ephemiel.5694 said:We don't use any tricks though, unless a still-baby dragon and a sword empowered BY HIM can somehow count.

1. Balthazar is no longer a god at any point we see him in GW2. As he and Kormir both state, his divinity was stripped from him. He is not a god. He is a former god. Even with hid power boost, he was notably weaker than a god (doesn't even make others go blind looking upon him like when we saw Kormir).
2. He doesn't have all of Primordus' and Jormag's power. Not even half. Enough of the magic to prevent its exchange from killing the Elder Dragons but not enough to even noticeably reducr the size of the beams of magic.
3. It worked because its a freaking god sword used against a non-god. If anet didn't need to make Rytlock weaker than the PC to prevent him from carrying the game unintentionally, Rytlock would be kicking ass left and right just because of the sword.
4. Yes. Yes it was the perfect time to bring it back. And the crown from S2.

@Konig Des Todes.2086 said:

@"perilisk.1874" said:This sort of conflicts with the lore around Dwayna and Grenth though, since she's clearly still "alive" enough to get knocked up by a mortal. I'm pretty sure that wouldn't work with a ghost, or anomaly, or djinn, though I guess I could be wrong if biology works very, very differently in Tyria. Don't know if it's a retcon, if the relationship of Dwayna and Grenth is a lie, or if there's some explanation for the conflict.

@Ephemiel.5694 said:

@Konig Des Todes.2086 said:

@Ephemiel.5694 said:We don't use any tricks though, unless a still-baby dragon and a sword empowered BY HIM can somehow count.

1. Balthazar is no longer a god at any point we see him in GW2. As he and Kormir both state, his divinity was stripped from him. He is not a god. He is a former god. Even with hid power boost, he was notably weaker than a god (doesn't even make others go blind looking upon him like when we saw Kormir).
2. He doesn't have all of Primordus' and Jormag's power. Not even half. Enough of the magic to prevent its exchange from killing the Elder Dragons but not enough to even noticeably reducr the size of the beams of magic.
3. It worked because its a freaking god sword used against a non-god. If anet didn't need to make Rytlock weaker than the PC to prevent him from carrying the game unintentionally, Rytlock would be kicking kitten left and right just because of the sword.
4. Yes. Yes it was the perfect time to bring it back. And the crown from S2.

But he IS a God. His powers may have been stripped [which....how did he reignite the sword then? Slight plothole there], but it's still his sword, it won't be stronger than him.

Also, he DOES have a ton of their power since it was stated that they were forced into a pre-awakened state [and this is after they both gained a lot of magic from both Zhaitan and Mordremoth].

@Ephemiel.5694 said:But he IS a God. His powers may have been stripped [which....how did he reignite the sword then? Slight plothole there], but it's still his sword, it won't be stronger than him.

Also, he DOES have a ton of their power since it was stated that they were forced into a pre-awakened state [and this is after they both gained a lot of magic from both Zhaitan and Mordremoth].

Here's the conversation in the Library with Kormir about the matter:

Lady Kasmeer Meade: I—please excuse me, Goddess. Perhaps I wasn't clear—we can't hope to defeat Balthazar without the aid of the Six.Rytlock Brimstone: Or the five. Balthazar is one of the Six.Kormir: No. He isn't. Balthazar has been stripped of his claim and title. He is no longer one of the Six....Kormir: The rest of the Six—Dwayna, Grenth, Melandru, even Lyssa—reached an agreement. Balthazar had to be dealt with.Balthazar: If you won't join the fight against the dragons, I'll see you all burn with them!Balthazar: Cowards! ALL OF YOU!Kormir: We stripped him of his power, and chained him in the Mists. There he would remain, forever—powerless to carry out his plans.

Seemingly from the conversation, Balthazar's very divinity was stripped. There's a difference between stripping Balthazar of most of his powers and stripping Balthazar of the very thing that made him a deity, his divinity. With his divinity stripped, he is no longer a god and cannot be considered anything close to a god. Thus, his sword would be effective against his new, weakened, non-god state.

He still obtained a ton of power, but that's not going to make up for the loss of his divinity, the loss of his status as a god.

Also, it's not really a plot hole that Balthazar still had some modicum of power. Dhuum and Abaddon were both chained/shackled into areas of the mists. They were still powerful (Abaddon remained a full god, shackled he may have been and his form dispersed on top of that, Dhuum however is no longer a god), which remains in tune with Balthazar. They however seemingly have made new strides into depowering a god (my theory is that Abaddon held the secret to a ritual that would do to him what was done to Balthazar. With Kormir replacing him entirely, she would have gained access to that knowledge), which is why Balthazar had to regain power the way he did.

@"Konig Des Todes.2086" said:

1. Balthazar is no longer a god at any point we see him in GW2. As he and Kormir both state, his divinity was stripped from him. He is not a god. He is a former god. Even with hid power boost, he was notably weaker than a god (doesn't even make others go blind looking upon him like when we saw Kormir).
2. He doesn't have all of Primordus' and Jormag's power. Not even half. Enough of the magic to prevent its exchange from killing the Elder Dragons but not enough to even noticeably reducr the size of the beams of magic.
3. It worked because its a freaking god sword used against a non-god. If anet didn't need to make Rytlock weaker than the PC to prevent him from carrying the game unintentionally, Rytlock would be kicking kitten left and right just because of the sword.
4. Yes. Yes it was the perfect time to bring it back. And the crown from S2.

I have few unclear things - I will start with the pt.3: "It worked because its a freaking god sword used against a non-god. "That sword was crafted by Balthazar. It is what it is because Balthazar imbued it with his power. It is his own creation, powered by its own power.Then, pt.1: "As he and Kormir both state, his divinity was stripped from him. He is not a god."

From 1 and 3 I can understand that even if the "divinity" was stripped from Balthazar, the spark of divinity remained into the sword. And by reigniting it (it seems that to do this is not necessary to be a god) the sword became stronger than its creator? Really? How can be a "god" so stupid? Instead using the sword as an object powered by his power - that means stronger when Balthazar is stronger and weaker (going to null godish strength) when Balthazar is weaker, he made an insanely powerful artifact, no matter if this artifact may be used against him. And making it to keep the divine power?

Question: What is that "divinity"? It seems that this "divinity" is not part of a god from the birth. It can be achieved / stripped. Even by the humans. I bet the other races can achieve this also. So, if this "divinity" is something any mortal can achieve (even with the help of other gods), is this "divinity" a real divinity? What is the definition of "divinity" in the GW2 universe?

@"Kholem.6092" said:

Tldr; the human gods are just magic infused humans from another dimension/realm in a bid to reduce the saturation of magic on their end in order to save their people.

I agree with the OP - the "gods" are magic infused beings, insanely powerful and having great knowledge about the Universe. They are mortals - as the Balthazar episode shows - and have no hesitation to lie the humans that they are Gods.

In my opinion they are Gods in the same way a rock or the Sky or a Corrupted Ice being is a God for grawls: The rock is eternal / the sky is untouchable / the Ice Being is very strong and can kill anything.From this point of view all the other races proved themselves smarter than the humans:

• the Charr needs no gods - is a statement that everything the gods can do can be achieved by the charr society (with greater efforts and slowly, but eventually achievable)
• the Assurans have no trust in the actual "gods". They acknowledged them as powerful and wise but they consider the gods to be part of the Eternal Alchemy - turning the EA into the creator of the gods.
• the Nords already have other beings taking care of the world - they also acknowledged the gods but considers the Great Spirits to do a better job in preserving the Universe.
• the Sylvari - they don't even know what a God is. Remember the dialogue in the Grove: "You constructed the Golem? That means you are its mother? Or the father?" In they minds everything is related with creation. No creation, then no Mother (or Father).

The only remaining race stupid enough to worship the false gods are the humans. I think they should wake up and start to hunt down the impostors. Because, to do that is enough to strip them of divinity - and we know that even a human can do this.

@derd.6413 said:if the human gods know how to beat the EDs, why would they abandon tyria? (btw: it is confirmed they left because they couldn't win against the EDs)

Ur missing a Little Detail here. it is not said that the gods cant win against the Dragons but that the fight itself would be too devastating to the world to be even considered without knowing the outcome of the battle. the Six could win and it would still be the end to planet Tyria. or the Dragons win and the unleashed divine Magic destroys tyria and the Dragons with it.

it's a loss - loss Situation for the Six to enter a direct fight against the Dragons.

and still its a whole different Story why they retreat entirely. with their knowledge and skills should still be ways to fight the Dragons without open confrontation.but we learned that the forgotten told the Six some stuff so we can assume that the forgotten had more knowledge and wisdom.

it is possible that the gods left cuz the world reached a Point that got predicted to some extend in the past and things went in a way that this would be the best Option available they reached together with the forgotten. or the world is so far away from the predictions of the forgotten that they retreated cuz they just did not know how to continue and now are searching for a better realm for the humans to live.

in best case some place with Magic cuz lot of tyrians just dont know how to live without

@norbes.3620 said:

@"derd.6413" said:if the human gods know how to beat the EDs, why would they abandon tyria? (btw: it is confirmed they left because they couldn't win against the EDs)

Sorry for my sub-par masrey of the english language but that's what i meant with "they couldn't win)

But even with your explenation it doesn't explain anything: if the gods have fought another set of EDs before and "won" then why would they leave tyria and their realms instead of hiding in their realms waitin for another opertunity to "defeat" the dragons.

And another thing i just noticed: the EDs don't wake up because there's to much magic in the air but because they don't have enough magic inside them (they get hungry) so draining them of their magic and storing it inside some rando ppl would keep them awake for longer not keep them asleep permanently. (And before you point towards jormag and prim, that's a diffrent situation and doesn't make sense in either situation without a secondary reason.)

If Balthazar is no longer a god, then why is Kormir so dead set against helping out against him?

Commander: You don't have to go. You could stay. Fight with us.Kormir: You ask for a war between the gods. Do you not know the cost of such a battle?

She goes on to describe the conflict with Abaddon, then adds --

Kormir: There is no victory to be found in a war between the gods. Only casualties.Commander: I understand...but we don't have the choice you have. We have to fight.Commander: Balthazar doesn't care whether he destroys Tyria. He said so himself.

So... is he or isn't he? Perhaps only his hairdresser knows for sure.

@derd.6413 said:

@norbes.3620 said:

@derd.6413 said:if the human gods know how to beat the EDs, why would they abandon tyria? (btw: it is confirmed they left because they couldn't win against the EDs)

were is stated that the gods did fight a set of other ED anywere, sure it was stated somewhere in this post as a possibility but i personally doubt thatfrom what i know the humans were brought to tyria from another world with lesser to no Magic at all. there are alot of possibilitys about how the Six came to be devine existences but thats just for peoples Imagination except for Kormir and Grenth (while grenths case is not as clear as Kormirs)

I sure tried to Point out that im not satisfied with the given explanations bout why the gods left and was mumbling some of the reasons i came up with from wich the strongest is indeed the one, that they are looking for another world for humans to live in. one without a devastating threat like the Dragonsmaybe i did not make this clear

And another thing i just noticed: the EDs don't wake up because there's to much magic in the air but because they don't have enough magic inside them (they get hungry) so draining them of their magic and storing it inside some rando ppl would keep them awake for longer not keep them asleep permanently. (And before you point towards jormag and prim, that's a diffrent situation and doesn't make sense in either situation without a secondary reason.)

i agree with this one. storing away their Food would not solve the Dragon Problem at all cuz they would still wake up from hunger and run wild wanting to eat.so if u want to Keep them sleeping u have to Keep the Magic inside the Dragons or constantly infuse them with the Magic they are sweating outthat would propably lead into a world without Magic cuz all the Magic is used to feed Dragons in their sleep. whats something the People (greedy as they are) would not want

@Tachenon.5270 said:If Balthazar is no longer a god, then why is Kormir so dead set against helping out against him?

Commander: You don't have to go. You could stay. Fight with us.Kormir: You ask for a war between the gods. Do you not know the cost of such a battle?

She goes on to describe the conflict with Abaddon, then adds --

Kormir: There is no victory to be found in a war between the gods. Only casualties.Commander: I understand...but we don't have the choice you have. We have to fight.Commander: Balthazar doesn't care whether he destroys Tyria. He said so himself.

So... is he or isn't he? Perhaps only his hairdresser knows for sure.

This is what happens when the writing team backs themselves into a corner. They say they stripped him of his divinity and power, yet still say he's a God and cannot intervene.

And like i said, he reignited his sword, doing that couldn't possibly make the sword stronger than him or else the GOD OF WAR would not have let Rytlock leave with it.

@Ephemiel.5694 said:

@Tachenon.5270 said:If Balthazar is no longer a god, then why is Kormir so dead set against helping out against him?

Commander: You don't have to go. You could stay. Fight with us.Kormir: You ask for a war between the gods. Do you not know the cost of such a battle?

She goes on to describe the conflict with Abaddon, then adds --

Kormir: There is no victory to be found in a war between the gods. Only casualties.Commander: I understand...but we don't have the choice you have. We have to fight.Commander: Balthazar doesn't care whether he destroys Tyria. He said so himself.

So... is he or isn't he? Perhaps only his hairdresser knows for sure.

You misunderstand. It's less the fact that HE is a God, it's the fact that SHE is a God and the Six as a whole have already decided they no longer partake in such fights. She would have gone against their agreement & perhaps faced repercussions based on that.

He reignited Sohothin so he could be freed, but in his weakened state he could never have taken it back by force. He either expected to take it back later OR never expected to be attacked BY it at a later point. He didn't sound very surprised when he saw Rytlock during The Departing, but I am sure he didn't expect to ever meet him again outside the mists.

Personally, I think they stripped him of his power, not his divinity. As to what they did with that extra power, that's another question that might be answered someday. "Divinity" seems to be gained by holding the power of a god, but losing that power doesn't seem to strip you of the ability to control magic. Balthazar still had the knowledge he always had and the capability to manipulate magic in ways others usually can't, but without his godly power, he couldn't free himself. He used his knowledge to reignite the sword he had previously imbued with divine magic, and had innate knowledge of how to manipulate mass quantities of magic to funnel some portion of the power from the bloodstone into himself (but not all of it since there's obviously plenty of loose bloodstone magic plaguing the world), and use Taimi's machine to steal power from two dragons. However, there's nothing that said how much power he took from the dragons, or if he could use it as effectively as his original divine power. It could be that the stolen power he wielded in PoF paled in comparison to what he originally had as a god, and that a weapon created by him (a god at the height of his power) could still harm him.

@Blocki.4931 said:

@Ephemiel.5694 said:

@Tachenon.5270 said:If Balthazar is no longer a god, then why is Kormir so dead set against helping out against him?

Commander: You don't have to go. You could stay. Fight with us.Kormir: You ask for a war between the gods. Do you not know the cost of such a battle?

She goes on to describe the conflict with Abaddon, then adds --

Kormir: There is no victory to be found in a war between the gods. Only casualties.Commander: I understand...but we don't have the choice you have. We have to fight.Commander: Balthazar doesn't care whether he destroys Tyria. He said so himself.

So... is he or isn't he? Perhaps only his hairdresser knows for sure.

1. She flatout says that he's still a God even after saying they removed his divinity. If the Gods thought he needed to be subdued, it should have been obvious that they would want to step in if someone not only freed him, but he also absorbed power from 2 Elder Dragons.
2. How did he reignite his sword [which was made with his power btw] when he's supposed to have no power and was chained to the Mists? Clearly he still had a lot of power and could simply not use it because he was trapped.