Dropping Alchemy

Hey guys, WvW holo solo roamer player here ^^

To roam around we all know pretty much exists 2 main builds, static discharge holosmith with marauder zerker stats (pretty standard) and Xan's pistol/shield build using HGH because of elixir s elixir u and elixir c.

I tend to run static discharge build lately because I like the burst potential, I run zero elixirs. Rifle turret + Photon wall + spectrum shield. Sometime i switch rifle turret for hard light arena, depending on the mood.What do you guys think instead of running the usual tools alchemy holo, running instead tools inventions and holo?I feel inventions might gives you more than alchemy. You won't have the passive elixir s that's true, but i never liked it much, even after the latest change.and the cooldowns on alchemy wihout hgh are pretty long anyway, the only good trait there is actually iron blooded to reduce a lot both power and condi damage, but other than that I don't feel it's worth it.

Using inventions with tools you can still keep the damage of static discharge and add for example the hard light arena cleanse, or the little bombs/heals spawned on crit.

Using a static discharge build condis are really tough to handle if you get caugh off guard by those noobs scourges or condi spamming mirages.I know it's main holo weakness together with ranged pressure, but maybe could work.

What you guys think? Do you think alchemy is really impossible to get rid of just because the meta says so?

@whoknocks.4935 said:What you guys think? Do you think alchemy is really impossible to get rid of just because the meta says so?

I don't look at the meta. I look at what a certain specialization does for your profession. To me, inventions is only good if you're using the Healing Turret so that you can cleanse three conditions and applying protection to allies. Outside of those two reasons, I would never swap alchemy for inventions.

The main reason being that I'm a core engineer main and I use four kits in my build (yes, four kits) and the passive health regeneration when using kits gives me more sustain than inventions. My build includes the Elixir Gun and using the trait HGH with the tools specialization reduces the cooldown on the stun breaker Healing Mist from 35 seconds to 24 seconds.

@Hoodie.1045 said:

@whoknocks.4935 said:What you guys think? Do you think alchemy is really impossible to get rid of just because the meta says so?

But I am talking of a static discharge build used for roaming in wvw, Not talking of pvp or pve. You are talking of core engi, I am talking of holo roamer.

@whoknocks.4935 said:

@Hoodie.1045 said:

@whoknocks.4935 said:What you guys think? Do you think alchemy is really impossible to get rid of just because the meta says so?

I guess it could work. Try it out and if it does, then go ahead, use inventions instead of alchemy.

Iron blooded is a big loss. I think inventions works better as a team fighter but Alchemy is better for solo roaming.

@Frostmane.9734 said:Iron blooded is a big loss. I think inventions works better as a team fighter but Alchemy is better for solo roaming.

Yeah maybe I try to switch to Xan's build instead.My main issues are really good scourges who simply port over me and condi bomb me with 10 condis in less than 2 seconds amd interrupting every single skill i try to use, i literally dunno what to do, I get out of shades imemdiately and i am inside another shade again with cripple chill torment etc.

I think if you took inventions you'd be forced into overshield, mecha legs, and anti corrosion plating. Just to supplement the loss of so much sustain from alchemy.

If using shield overshield is pretty great. You gain a lot of sustain from popping protection with shield abilities and heal. With anti corrosion plating will heal 4 conditions. You can use the shield to daze and push back the condi bombers. Though best way to deal with them is to dodge roll and CC. The constant 25% speed increase from mechanical legs is really good, I generally run inventions with alchemy. The increased boon duration from alchemy is nice. Then I run thumper turret with advanced turrets trait for the CC additional stun break and another source of protection.

@whoknocks.4935 said:

@Frostmane.9734 said:Iron blooded is a big loss. I think inventions works better as a team fighter but Alchemy is better for solo roaming.

Might try losing the rifle turret in favor of rocket boots to cure those conditions and create space. Or elixir u for some stability and quickness.

Torment plus fear sucks, elixir u and s are both stun breakers. Even if you decide not to use alchemy, I would at least run elixir u for the stun break and stab/vigor. Scourges are very weak to range and I don’t think they have much condi clear. Practice kiting them, two scourges at once are such a pain.

@Tehologist.5841 said:If using shield overshield is pretty great. You gain a lot of sustain from popping protection with shield abilities and heal. With anti corrosion plating will heal 4 conditions. You can use the shield to daze and push back the condi bombers. Though best way to deal with them is to dodge roll and CC. The constant 25% speed increase from mechanical legs is really good, I generally run inventions with alchemy. The increased boon duration from alchemy is nice. Then I run thumper turret with advanced turrets trait for the CC additional stun break and another source of protection.

Taking both inventions and alchemy? You're placing all of your damage on your gear and Holosmith. Personally, a good chunk of my damage comes from static discharge.

Correct, I find static discharge difficult to hit the intended target. I prefer goggle stun break and lock on when I use tools. For sustain, the synergy between holo leap and gaining vigor when gain swiftness from alchemy is extremely good. The best thing from inventions for my playstyle is reduced cool down on shield with protection. The lower cool down allows to daze, stun and interrupt more and block is strong. I personally use firearms with alchemy for might generation, boon duration and high chance to crit.

Some time ago I was running firearms, explosions and holosmith with sword/shield, laser-disk, hard light arena and Elixir S (+ Beam & coolant blast, 150% heat trait, maro-gear + pack runes). I think it was a fun build since your defense is now active while your offense is getting more passive. coolant blast to focus condi-clear, healing turret otherwise. medikit might be a good compromise now...Since it lacks range, fighting scourges is more depending on your CC-timing than on your positioning and reapers might pose a problem, but the CC, blocks, and invis is actually helping against warriors. Might want to use Elixir U now after the rework...

However, especially in zerg fights, I can top the reapers, scourges, and mages in the dps-table while providing protection and fury for the group.

@Tehologist.5841 said:Correct, I find static discharge difficult to hit the intended target. I prefer goggle stun break and lock on when I use tools. For sustain, the synergy between holo leap and gaining vigor when gain swiftness from alchemy is extremely good. The best thing from inventions for my playstyle is reduced cool down on shield with protection. The lower cool down allows to daze, stun and interrupt more and block is strong. I personally use firearms with alchemy for might generation, boon duration and high chance to crit.

I use lock on on my static discharge build.

Trust me that on those cheesy soulbeasts and druids with perma protection, using a static discharge build is the only way to have a chance to kill them, they are even more noob friendly and low risk than a spellbreaker in wvw. Without static discharge you can't deny their constant sustain healing abilities and can't pressure them enough only with photon forge due to the high kiting they have.

It's a risky build yes, only one stunbreak you have and usually only the passive invuln every minute. So you have to choose your fights always, adopt a more hit and run playstyle and avoid getting ganked/caught off guard.

Xan's build is less risky and more focused in team fights, even if it's quite good in solo as well.

But the damage you pull out with static discharge can melt even spellbreakers in few seconds after they have no endure pain left and you make them rage a lot.

Yeah, warriors and rangers are my hardest matchups when playing holo. Ranged weapons are hard to deal with and warriors have such great sustain. Deadeyes are just annoying.

I run a high cleanse/boon build with p/sh and inventions, alchemy, holo. I run three elixirs and thus HGH, and in team play purity of purpose. I suppose taking tools wouldn't hurt much, but probably push me away from elixirs in which case I'd probably add more holo utilities for sustain and static discharge and still have decent sustain through protection synergy with inventions.

Might actually try this tonight.

I run a very similar build when roaming, I use pistol shield mostly for reflect and protection. Elixir u, elixir s and elixir gun with healing turret. Inventions/alchemy what armor are you using stat wise?

@Tehologist.5841 said:I run a very similar build when roaming, I use pistol shield mostly for reflect and protection. Elixir u, elixir s and elixir gun with healing turret. Inventions/alchemy what armor are you using stat wise?

Mara/zerker, dura runes, and a couple commanders trinkets. Same elixirs, but hard light arena for more protection and CC on the belt, sometimes elixir H, sometimes turret. It's really a derivative of Xan's build, I just like things a bit more sustainy.

I see, so nothing for condition damage. I was originally running rabid with superior rune of the aristocrat and soldiers accessories. I switched to knights with rune of strength with firearms. I love the sustain and crit with might and zerker accessories for ferocity with some soldiers for vitality. Plus I often run a power hammer build so it works well.