Ranger is way too strong 1v1 in WvW - Page 3 — Guild Wars 2 Forums

Ranger is way too strong 1v1 in WvW

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  • Arheundel.6451Arheundel.6451 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @mrauls.6519 said:
    The main issue I have with Soul Beast is how it can perform unblockable attacks for 4 WHOLE seconds. It should be like the first 3 hits... and if they miss it should remove 1 stack. Ranger does have a lot of sustain (core/Druid/Soul Beast).

    The main issue here there is something going through your rotation of blocks and you hating on it...the main issue here is the same as always...."typical GW2 cheese build which let casuals believe to be the next coming of jesus for MMO...next the cheese build get cheesed and all hell break lose"

    Unblockable skills/traits are becoming abundant in game because the devs realise that the amount of blocks has gone out of control, to a point where certain classes can keep a near constant defensive wall negating all sort of direct dmg effectively hard countering many professions, making them close to unplayable

    ...shield...shelter....sword...focus......yeah easy to make miserable the life of a direct dmg dealer that lacks unblockable....let's insert here your L2P comment as habit dictates

    The OP plays a spellbreaker....and that says everything already...those who would agree with the OP, equally play an "easy" mode spec abundant in blocks/evasions and that would make sense

    Maybe before addressing unblockable skills/trait in game...we should address the hefty amount of blocks available to certain classes ...oh look it seems you play one of them...

    -A wise man once said- "Fight cheese with cheese or be cheesed in return, mind not those who will accuse you of being a cheese as they like cheese themselves"

  • ChartFish.1308ChartFish.1308 Member ✭✭✭

    @DeceiverX.8361 stoneform actually only lasts like 2 sec in WvW despite what the tooltip says. If you scroll down to some earlier posts you'll see people wondering about if it's a bug or not

  • mrauls.6519mrauls.6519 Member ✭✭✭

    @Arheundel.6451 said:

    @mrauls.6519 said:
    The main issue I have with Soul Beast is how it can perform unblockable attacks for 4 WHOLE seconds. It should be like the first 3 hits... and if they miss it should remove 1 stack. Ranger does have a lot of sustain (core/Druid/Soul Beast).

    The main issue here there is something going through your rotation of blocks and you hating on it...the main issue here is the same as always...."typical GW2 cheese build which let casuals believe to be the next coming of jesus for MMO...next the cheese build get cheesed and all hell break lose"

    Unblockable skills/traits are becoming abundant in game because the devs realise that the amount of blocks has gone out of control, to a point where certain classes can keep a near constant defensive wall negating all sort of direct dmg effectively hard countering many professions, making them close to unplayable

    ...shield...shelter....sword...focus......yeah easy to make miserable the life of a direct dmg dealer that lacks unblockable....let's insert here your L2P comment as habit dictates

    The OP plays a spellbreaker....and that says everything already...those who would agree with the OP, equally play an "easy" mode spec abundant in blocks/evasions and that would make sense

    Maybe before addressing unblockable skills/trait in game...we should address the hefty amount of blocks available to certain classes ...oh look it seems you play one of them...

    Who are you fighting in PvP that uses shelter? Bunker Guardians in WvW? I like how you make everything seem easy... 4 seconds where you're unblockable is ridiculous for any profession. It needs to be changed. Guardians are built around blocking attacks... They are part of the group with the lowest health pool in game. It's the class design. What don't you understand? If you want Guardians to have less blocks, raise their HP pool to max... lmfao

  • DeceiverX.8361DeceiverX.8361 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited August 22, 2018

    @Arheundel.6451 said:

    @mrauls.6519 said:
    The main issue I have with Soul Beast is how it can perform unblockable attacks for 4 WHOLE seconds. It should be like the first 3 hits... and if they miss it should remove 1 stack. Ranger does have a lot of sustain (core/Druid/Soul Beast).

    The main issue here there is something going through your rotation of blocks and you hating on it...the main issue here is the same as always...."typical GW2 cheese build which let casuals believe to be the next coming of jesus for MMO...next the cheese build get cheesed and all hell break lose"

    Unblockable skills/traits are becoming abundant in game because the devs realise that the amount of blocks has gone out of control, to a point where certain classes can keep a near constant defensive wall negating all sort of direct dmg effectively hard countering many professions, making them close to unplayable

    ...shield...shelter....sword...focus......yeah easy to make miserable the life of a direct dmg dealer that lacks unblockable....let's insert here your L2P comment as habit dictates

    The OP plays a spellbreaker....and that says everything already...those who would agree with the OP, equally play an "easy" mode spec abundant in blocks/evasions and that would make sense

    Maybe before addressing unblockable skills/trait in game...we should address the hefty amount of blocks available to certain classes ...oh look it seems you play one of them...

    If there are too many blocks in the game, they should be nerfed, and not unblockable access increased. That's what I said in my original post. This rock-paper-scissors gameplay is out of control.

    Otherwise leaving things as they are shuts out a variety of builds or even classes (Core Guard/DH) which strictly depend on blocks as their active defense.

    I can only imagine the frustration coming from many players about a trait on something like thief which denied all healing and damage negation upon using Steal. As far as the Soulbeast into core/DH matchup goes, this is pretty much what it looks like, considering RF one-skill-kills guardian outside of full tank builds or burning major skills like Renewed Focus.

    I have no objections to the soulbeast dealing the damage it deals. But I also play one because of how effective it is. It's extremely easy and seriously lacks counterplay in a ton of matchups.

    You sure that Sniper idea is as good as you thought it was gonna be?
    Because I think my original idea is better.
    Quit/Inactive. No, you can't have my stuff.

  • mrauls.6519mrauls.6519 Member ✭✭✭

    @DeceiverX.8361 said:

    @Arheundel.6451 said:

    @mrauls.6519 said:
    The main issue I have with Soul Beast is how it can perform unblockable attacks for 4 WHOLE seconds. It should be like the first 3 hits... and if they miss it should remove 1 stack. Ranger does have a lot of sustain (core/Druid/Soul Beast).

    The main issue here there is something going through your rotation of blocks and you hating on it...the main issue here is the same as always...."typical GW2 cheese build which let casuals believe to be the next coming of jesus for MMO...next the cheese build get cheesed and all hell break lose"

    Unblockable skills/traits are becoming abundant in game because the devs realise that the amount of blocks has gone out of control, to a point where certain classes can keep a near constant defensive wall negating all sort of direct dmg effectively hard countering many professions, making them close to unplayable

    ...shield...shelter....sword...focus......yeah easy to make miserable the life of a direct dmg dealer that lacks unblockable....let's insert here your L2P comment as habit dictates

    The OP plays a spellbreaker....and that says everything already...those who would agree with the OP, equally play an "easy" mode spec abundant in blocks/evasions and that would make sense

    Maybe before addressing unblockable skills/trait in game...we should address the hefty amount of blocks available to certain classes ...oh look it seems you play one of them...

    If there are too many blocks in the game, they should be nerfed, and not unblockable access increased. That's what I said in my original post. This rock-paper-scissors gameplay is out of control.

    Otherwise leaving things as they are shuts out a variety of builds or even classes (Core Guard/DH) which strictly depend on blocks as their active defense.

    I can only imagine the frustration coming from many players about a trait on something like thief which denied all healing and damage negation upon using Steal. As far as the Soulbeast into core/DH matchup goes, this is pretty much what it looks like, considering RF one-skill-kills guardian outside of full tank builds or burning major skills like Renewed Focus.

    I have no objections to the soulbeast dealing the damage it deals. But I also play one because of how effective it is. It's extremely easy and seriously lacks counterplay in a ton of matchups.

    Thank you for this post. Some people don't want to accept the fact it's EASY

  • discussion about soulbeast here seems to be ping ponging back and forth between wvw and pvp without really any clarification in most of the posts I'm seeing which in turn just makes this entire thread all the more confusing. Personally I believe there are a few things that should be changed about ranger to alleviate some problems but the manner of which I'm seeing people talk about it here just makes everything sound so much absurdly worse then it really is.

    Personally on a matter I'm not quite sure about myself is the rangers up time on unblockable attacks, since it can very much so nuke certain builds down quite easily. But on the other hand I know that the ranger heavily relies on unblockable attacks to do ANY damage at all on some targets so it's not really quite easy to just say nerf it to hell and back.

  • Turk.5460Turk.5460 Member ✭✭✭✭

    I wish killing the pet actually did something against soulbeasts. There is literally no point in the pet having a health bar as it is instantly revived when they exit beastform.

    Fort Aspenwood
    Jekkies

  • Lynnie.7213Lynnie.7213 Member ✭✭✭

    @Turk.5460 said:
    I wish killing the pet actually did something against soulbeasts. There is literally no point in the pet having a health bar as it is instantly revived when they exit beastform.

    I wish pets were like this on druid.

    DONEE - Youtube
    https://youtube.com/donee

  • @mrauls.6519 said:
    The main issue I have with Soul Beast is how it can perform unblockable attacks for 4 WHOLE seconds. It should be like the first 3 hits... and if they miss it should remove 1 stack. Ranger does have a lot of sustain (core/Druid/Soul Beast).

    -Sustain
    -Gimmick Damage

    Pick one please because you can't spec for both at the same time.

    I know the meme is that ranger's some kind of brick house nuclear bomb that's paradoxically totally useless in a zerg but please engage with reality.

  • Dawdler.8521Dawdler.8521 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited August 25, 2018

    @Turk.5460 said:
    I wish killing the pet actually did something against soulbeasts. There is literally no point in the pet having a health bar as it is instantly revived when they exit beastform.

    For WvW this is pretty much irrelevant. Even on a normal ranger/druid, killing the pet is only a factor in very specific builds that probably would have died to you regardless considering the time it takes to even kill two pets. And much like with other gimmicky builds like condi mirage/thief relying on people being idiots, builds relying on pets becomes worse and worse the more people you fight.

    Dont look a gift Asura in the mouth.
    No seriously, dont. Shark teeth.

  • Lynnie.7213Lynnie.7213 Member ✭✭✭

    @Dawdler.8521 said:

    @Turk.5460 said:
    I wish killing the pet actually did something against soulbeasts. There is literally no point in the pet having a health bar as it is instantly revived when they exit beastform.

    For WvW this is pretty much irrelevant. Even on a normal ranger/druid, killing the pet is only a factor in very specific builds that probably would have died to you regardless considering the time it takes to even kill two pets. And much like with other gimmicky builds like condi mirage/thief relying on people being idiots, builds relying on pets becomes worse and worse the more people you fight.

    You couldn't have said better.

    DONEE - Youtube
    https://youtube.com/donee

  • @Dawdler.8521 said:

    @Turk.5460 said:
    I wish killing the pet actually did something against soulbeasts. There is literally no point in the pet having a health bar as it is instantly revived when they exit beastform.

    For WvW this is pretty much irrelevant. Even on a normal ranger/druid, killing the pet is only a factor in very specific builds that probably would have died to you regardless considering the time it takes to even kill two pets. And much like with other gimmicky builds like condi mirage/thief relying on people being idiots, builds relying on pets becomes worse and worse the more people you fight.

    Killing the pet stopped being relevant when HoT made the regen dodge tank Ranger build obsolete.

  • BadMed.3846BadMed.3846 Member ✭✭✭

    @Aridon.8362 said:
    It is too hard to kill a ranger, they get too many invulns dodging and stealth and hit like a truck. I block, and they pierce through my shield, I cripple, and they stealth and teleport away, I activate my invuln yet somehow the skill bugs out and allows me to still take physical damage enough is enough my dude. They need a nerf as they have a serious advantage in the roaming scene. I switch to full toughness armor and that bear greatsword skill chomped all of my hp and I'm still questioning how that even happens.

    You need to look at enemy and dodge those few heavy hitting skills. I hope you know this game has dodges?

  • Brian.1289Brian.1289 Member ✭✭

    @Aridon.8362 said:
    It is too hard to kill a ranger, they get too many invulns dodging and stealth and hit like a truck. I block, and they pierce through my shield, I cripple, and they stealth and teleport away, I activate my invuln yet somehow the skill bugs out and allows me to still take physical damage enough is enough my dude. They need a nerf as they have a serious advantage in the roaming scene. I switch to full toughness armor and that bear greatsword skill chomped all of my hp and I'm still questioning how that even happens.

    sounds like u stand idle alot most those skills u mention can be dodge super duper easy. cracks me up when i read these sb topics most people dont even understand or know the names of the skills they getting killed by. And these wi numbers off npc lords is hilarious in these videos/screen shots every profession in the game hits the npc super hard. ws-bm-sb is so much better build i wont even miss the gimmick mm-bm-sb build

  • Ran the copy paste build everyone is using and honestly it's the easiest time I've ever had in roaming an duels. This is hilarious.

  • I like how this has gone 3 pages. Literally a thread about 1v1 in WvW. Are you playing against a server with 3 people?

  • @Gotejjeken.1267 said:
    I like how this has gone 3 pages. Literally a thread about 1v1 in WvW. Are you playing against a server with 3 people?

    No, we're playing on a server where half the people or more are running the copy paste soulbeast build. LOL

  • Lazze.9870Lazze.9870 Member ✭✭✭

    If a bear slams your HP in half, don’t stand in the most telegraphed burst in the game.

    Denying it is a l2p issue is actually funny, as I’d bet that ranger mains rarely get hit by other player’s Maul. I don’t, anyway.

    (and while we do have a couple of sources of stealth, we got no teleports. Exaggerations as usual).

  • Lynnie.7213Lynnie.7213 Member ✭✭✭

    Had this laying around, thought would be a good fit for this discussion. That spellbreaker, man ... :s

    DONEE - Youtube
    https://youtube.com/donee

  • Brian.1289Brian.1289 Member ✭✭
    edited August 30, 2018

    @Lynnie.7213 said:
    Had this laying around, thought would be a good fit for this discussion. That spellbreaker, man ... :s

    lmao just stop with these videos that ar spellbreaker is really bad i have played him before and the other guy literally just opened the wrapper on the game,the spell breaker is just following you around key board turning. anet should grow a pair of kitten and just say this game is balanced at a competitive level not at the wood league level to get gud like blizzard would say.post a video of fighting other good soulbeast and spell breakers that can atleast jump dodge goodness. This thread needs to die lol WI is just a maul that roots with a 25 second cooldown now. Ranger has to be the only profession in the game that ranger mains come in here begging for nerfs

  • Lynnie.7213Lynnie.7213 Member ✭✭✭

    @Brian.1289 said:

    @Lynnie.7213 said:
    Had this laying around, thought would be a good fit for this discussion. That spellbreaker, man ... :s

    lmao just stop with these videos that ar spellbreaker is really bad i have played him before and the other guy literally just opened the wrapper on the game,the spell breaker is just following you around key board turning. anet should grow a pair of kitten and just say this game is balanced at a competitive level not at the wood league level to get gud like blizzard would say.post a video of fighting other good soulbeast and spell breakers that can atleast jump dodge goodness. This thread needs to die lol WI is just a maul that roots with a 25 second cooldown now. Ranger has to be the only profession in the game that ranger mains come in here begging for nerfs

    Broken Soulbeast. lol

    DONEE - Youtube
    https://youtube.com/donee


  • Working as intended.

  • Lynnie.7213Lynnie.7213 Member ✭✭✭

    @RangerThings.9810 said:

    Working as intended.

    kitten, a JQ friend got you, huh? :)

    DONEE - Youtube
    https://youtube.com/donee

  • gimo.3281gimo.3281 Member ✭✭

    @RangerThings.9810 said:

    Working as intended.

    that's like a 3,478% increase from the max base damage of long range shot.

  • anduriell.6280anduriell.6280 Member ✭✭✭
    edited August 31, 2018

    @gimo.3281 said:

    @RangerThings.9810 said:

    Working as intended.

    that's like a 3,478% increase from the max base damage of long range shot.

    That's how the multiplicative percentages buffs to damage works.

    LB base damage at 3800 power does around 1.9K of base damage to 2500 armor.

    Then you have a lot of small damage buffs from traits, runes and sigils. What in an additive damages buffs would be around 87% damage increase, with multiplicative it becomes 250% increase.

    So your base damage you multiply by 2.5 and then multiply that for the 286% from critical damage.

    It's doubling the damage twice. I think a way yo mitigate this is to make the damage buffs to be additive instead multiplicative. Otherwise it always be prone to get out of hand.

    This is happening to all classes in this game thou. It not something exclusive on the soulbeast. We all have seen too many one shot meme builds.

  • Arheundel.6451Arheundel.6451 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @DeceiverX.8361 said:

    @Arheundel.6451 said:

    @mrauls.6519 said:
    The main issue I have with Soul Beast is how it can perform unblockable attacks for 4 WHOLE seconds. It should be like the first 3 hits... and if they miss it should remove 1 stack. Ranger does have a lot of sustain (core/Druid/Soul Beast).

    The main issue here there is something going through your rotation of blocks and you hating on it...the main issue here is the same as always...."typical GW2 cheese build which let casuals believe to be the next coming of jesus for MMO...next the cheese build get cheesed and all hell break lose"

    Unblockable skills/traits are becoming abundant in game because the devs realise that the amount of blocks has gone out of control, to a point where certain classes can keep a near constant defensive wall negating all sort of direct dmg effectively hard countering many professions, making them close to unplayable

    ...shield...shelter....sword...focus......yeah easy to make miserable the life of a direct dmg dealer that lacks unblockable....let's insert here your L2P comment as habit dictates

    The OP plays a spellbreaker....and that says everything already...those who would agree with the OP, equally play an "easy" mode spec abundant in blocks/evasions and that would make sense

    Maybe before addressing unblockable skills/trait in game...we should address the hefty amount of blocks available to certain classes ...oh look it seems you play one of them...

    If there are too many blocks in the game, they should be nerfed, and not unblockable access increased. That's what I said in my original post. This rock-paper-scissors gameplay is out of control.

    Otherwise leaving things as they are shuts out a variety of builds or even classes (Core Guard/DH) which strictly depend on blocks as their active defense.

    I can only imagine the frustration coming from many players about a trait on something like thief which denied all healing and damage negation upon using Steal. As far as the Soulbeast into core/DH matchup goes, this is pretty much what it looks like, considering RF one-skill-kills guardian outside of full tank builds or burning major skills like Renewed Focus.

    I have no objections to the soulbeast dealing the damage it deals. But I also play one because of how effective it is. It's extremely easy and seriously lacks counterplay in a ton of matchups.

    Care to list these matchups? I am hell sure that at some point I had to give up playing something else because these matchup of yours lacked counterplay, I am just too curious to know....if some builds are countered by soulbeast...what of the builds they counter back with no counterplay?

    -A wise man once said- "Fight cheese with cheese or be cheesed in return, mind not those who will accuse you of being a cheese as they like cheese themselves"

  • Ferus.3165Ferus.3165 Member ✭✭✭

    @DuckDuckBOOM.4097 said:
    https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Magebane_Tether_(trait_skill)
    You have a pulsing reveal to counter stealth as a warrior. Use it. It will also cc them and pull them back to you when they "teleport away." If they are 1 hit KO'ing you with Maul, and that is possible, they are full glass and have very little defense or stability. Chain CC them.

    How is a warrior going to chain cc a ranger??? maybe with hammer and mace/shield, but then again what ranger loses.. no gets even hit by a warrior running that combo?
    And magebane tether is simply not reliable. First of all, if you are against a condi player you lost with this skill, next problem is that you have to hit the enemy with a burstskill and that is (depending on the enemy and ranger is quite slippery with lots of evades/blocks/knockbacks/invis) not always possible (especially because ranger lb invis has no distinct cast animation nor does it have a cast time) or at least not when you need something that specific (like a reveal for rangers instacast invis). And there are more problems, magebane tether only hits 1 target and it can hit pets and clones aswell (making it completely useless against mesmer btw.). And the tether can easily be broken even if the warrior was able to succesfully hit you with it, you only need 1 stack of stability for that.
    It is actually quite easy for the ranger to completely deny the warrior the tether as it always goes on the same cd regardless of how long the tether was active. Let your pet eat one of the warrior bursts that you dodge/block and right after the tether hit the pet pull it back to you/swap it with the second pet or merge with it.

  • reddie.5861reddie.5861 Member ✭✭✭

    @Aridon.8362 said:
    It is too hard to kill a ranger, they get too many invulns dodging and stealth and hit like a truck. I block, and they pierce through my shield, I cripple, and they stealth and teleport away, I activate my invuln yet somehow the skill bugs out and allows me to still take physical damage enough is enough my dude. They need a nerf as they have a serious advantage in the roaming scene. I switch to full toughness armor and that bear greatsword skill chomped all of my hp and I'm still questioning how that even happens.

    u just nag now cus of people using sic em and other kitten skills to tear 1 person down in a flash of a second?
    rangers always been kitten strong in hand of a good player and would prolly win any 1v1.

    just people playing cheese build at the moment

  • @Ferus.3165 said:
    How is a warrior going to chain cc a ranger???

    I don't know, heard of a skill called rampage? Even a ranger not running glass can easily be caught by that, with only one skill that grants stability. Bait their dolly stance with any other cc and then rampage. They will be caught.

    Also lb3 is not insta cast :F it looks like it, with no cast time on tool tip, but it has an animation thus not insta cast. Use it's unreliableness against the ranger- this skill will always fire when pressed, no LoS warnings, no turn around to face target, it will go off even if you're behind the ranger (as such wasting the entire skill)

  • Ferus.3165Ferus.3165 Member ✭✭✭

    @ChartFish.1308 said:

    @Ferus.3165 said:
    How is a warrior going to chain cc a ranger???

    I don't know, heard of a skill called rampage? Even a ranger not running glass can easily be caught by that, with only one skill that grants stability. Bait their dolly stance with any other cc and then rampage. They will be caught.

    Also lb3 is not insta cast :F it looks like it, with no cast time on tool tip, but it has an animation thus not insta cast. Use it's unreliableness against the ranger- this skill will always fire when pressed, no LoS warnings, no turn around to face target, it will go off even if you're behind the ranger (as such wasting the entire skill)

    xD when warrior uses rampage everything the ranger has to do is go invis and kite a little bit. Seriously there is no ranger in this game who is worth a kitten who gets perma cc'ed by rampage in a 1v1.

  • Arheundel.6451Arheundel.6451 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Ferus.3165 said:

    @ChartFish.1308 said:

    @Ferus.3165 said:
    How is a warrior going to chain cc a ranger???

    I don't know, heard of a skill called rampage? Even a ranger not running glass can easily be caught by that, with only one skill that grants stability. Bait their dolly stance with any other cc and then rampage. They will be caught.

    Also lb3 is not insta cast :F it looks like it, with no cast time on tool tip, but it has an animation thus not insta cast. Use it's unreliableness against the ranger- this skill will always fire when pressed, no LoS warnings, no turn around to face target, it will go off even if you're behind the ranger (as such wasting the entire skill)

    xD when warrior uses rampage everything the ranger has to do is go invis and kite a little bit. Seriously there is no ranger in this game who is worth a kitten who gets perma cc'ed by rampage in a 1v1.

    Ranger doesn't go stealth automatically when CCed....he has hefty cast times and CD to follow, yah I can play warrior and I meet my fare share of glass LB and given that I main ranger I know most tactics used by common copy/paste sniper. Most of them will remain in SB mode after first burst, it's easy to dodge twice and LoS and follow with bull's charge/rush...rest is skill dependant matchup but we all know that not every ranger out there is @kiritsugu emeya.3962 and not every warrior is @Vaahn.7142 ..let's stop pretending it's otherwise ok? Majority of copy/paste snipers are backpedalling glass pewpew...losing to them it's a L2P freaking huge issue

    -A wise man once said- "Fight cheese with cheese or be cheesed in return, mind not those who will accuse you of being a cheese as they like cheese themselves"

  • Ferus.3165Ferus.3165 Member ✭✭✭

    @Arheundel.6451 said:

    @Ferus.3165 said:

    @ChartFish.1308 said:

    @Ferus.3165 said:
    How is a warrior going to chain cc a ranger???

    I don't know, heard of a skill called rampage? Even a ranger not running glass can easily be caught by that, with only one skill that grants stability. Bait their dolly stance with any other cc and then rampage. They will be caught.

    Also lb3 is not insta cast :F it looks like it, with no cast time on tool tip, but it has an animation thus not insta cast. Use it's unreliableness against the ranger- this skill will always fire when pressed, no LoS warnings, no turn around to face target, it will go off even if you're behind the ranger (as such wasting the entire skill)

    xD when warrior uses rampage everything the ranger has to do is go invis and kite a little bit. Seriously there is no ranger in this game who is worth a kitten who gets perma cc'ed by rampage in a 1v1.

    Ranger doesn't go stealth automatically when CCed....he has hefty cast times and CD to follow, yah I can play warrior and I meet my fare share of glass LB and given that I main ranger I know most tactics used by common copy/paste sniper. Most of them will remain in SB mode after first burst, it's easy to dodge twice and LoS and follow with bull's charge/rush...rest is skill dependant matchup but we all know that not every ranger out there is @kiritsugu emeya.3962 and not every warrior is @Vaahn.7142 ..let's stop pretending it's otherwise ok? Majority of copy/paste snipers are backpedalling glass pewpew...losing to them it's a L2P freaking huge issue

    nobody is talking about backpeddling glass rangers lol? and noone ever said rainger can stealth when cc'ed?? ranger can simply cast lb 3 or gs 3 and kite though whenever a warrior uses rampage?

  • mortrialus.3062mortrialus.3062 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited September 3, 2018

    @Bashi.8902 said:

    @Aridon.8362 said:
    It is too hard to kill a ranger, they get too many invulns dodging and stealth and hit like a truck. I block, and they pierce through my shield, I cripple, and they stealth and teleport away, I activate my invuln yet somehow the skill bugs out and allows me to still take physical damage enough is enough my dude. They need a nerf as they have a serious advantage in the roaming scene. I switch to full toughness armor and that bear greatsword skill chomped all of my hp and I'm still questioning how that even happens.

    Rangers are Squishy. Rangers require more mechanical skill then most other classes

    Lol

    That's a good one.

    Point Blank Shot+ Rapid Fire is literally all I've ever seen a ranger do whether they're a scrub I'm ganking or a top 100 SPvper.

    The Psychomancer: Mesmer Elite Specialization Suggestion

  • bigo.9037bigo.9037 Member ✭✭✭

    @InsaneQR.7412 said:

    @whoknocks.4935 said:

    @ChartFish.1308 said:
    Ranger has many counters. Warriors, power revenants, condi/power thieves (sword in particular), engi, mesmer etc. Basically professions that can reliably catch up, cc and burst out high sustained damage.
    Ranger is not bad. It's in a ok-spot. If it's so OP, how come it's not meta. It barely even makes the small-scale roaming list.

    Power revenant counters soulbeast haha what a joke, joke even harder is engi countering soulbeast xD

    Engi (Holo) It's countered since always by 1. Condi classes, especially necro, 2. Ranged pressure aka Rangers.
    With the toss elixir u change only shield is left for engi to deal with range, and that's not a counter but an active defense which is different.

    In any MMO the ranger counters the melee warrior fighter class, this is not an exception, so you even counters warriors because you kite a warrior for days if you play right.
    If you are killed by a warrior you are just got outplayed and that's your fault.

    Sword thief got nerfed and I think it's a fair fight, definitely thief doesn't counter rangers at all, if you camp longbow you are actually the counter to thief who can't use sword2 as they want to, since you constantly pressure them from 1500 range. In an open field they have zero chances, in a field full of trees and upper/lower levels thief have an advantage.
    Condi thief not sure, but yeah since that build seems so low on condi cleanses probably counters you tho.

    Mesmer... let's see, only condi mesmer is probably a threat, power mesmer not so much, if you catch him in the free weak window you do 100-0 to him easily.

    I would love to hear from you why those classes counters you now.

    Power rev can counter rangers farely well. They have high range CC and a 1200 gap closer. In addition to a plethra of stability, good burst they also have reveal on herald and a strong heal that makes rapid fire useless.
    Ofc it depends on the skill of the rev.
    Warriors can counter rangers and vice versa. Also this depends on skill.
    Sword thief counters ranger fairly well as long as they try to pewpew them they will have a thief faster in their face as they like.
    Thief can be countered by a ranger too if they time the reveal right but also this depends on skill.
    Mesmer can kill a ranger pretty fast in a 1v1 if not on an open plain. In close quarters a mirage is a dethscentence for a average soulbeast.

    Ofc i agree that pewpew one shot ranger is cheesy and not really engaging gameplay but pewpew rangers have always been cheesy in any iteration. They can be countered if you know how. CC and gap closing is the key. Rangers are somewhat of a noobfilter fue to the fact that they kill a plethra of unexperienced players.
    Sure you have a vast disadvantage if your profession is countered by ranger heavily and you do not want to change profession just for the sake of meta and i can understand your grief, but a pls nerf is OP argument isnt really helping either. Its not a constructive critisism, its postmodern complaining.

    Saying sonething like: Move the unblockable from Call if the Wild to Hunters Call and make Hinters Call requiring a target, would be a valid suggestion for example. It reduces the time unblockables can be stacked at max range without reducing the unblockable availability. This way the ranger needs to come closer for dmg and takes a higher risk for more reward.

    I am main ranger since launch and i can understand the motives behind your complain. But pure nerf isnt going to change much. Rangers will even more camp range and annoy you from afar if you strip the dmg, instead give the optimal playstyle a shift so rangers need to close in before taking full ranged advantage, its easier to counter and would need more skilled gameplay but wouldnt reduce the potency.

    dude... rev does not counter soulbeast...
    soulbeast has way too much CC.
    what you guys are forgetting is that ranger has the best passive and active healing in the game. dodging gives you protection (33%) less dmg and health. baseline, without healing power stats, you can achieve about 200-280 ( iirc ) health per second if you have high protection uptime. over the course of 10 seconds that's 2000-2800 health... combine that with 33% less dmg taken and you have insane sustain.

    soulbeast hard counters warriors because they have longbow AND more CC and options in melee. they lose on both weapon swaps.

    revenant is just as bad against soulbeast. the only thing they have going for them vs us is their reveal but if you stealth and pop superspeed you can easily avoid getting hit by that. dolyak stance basically makes their staff CC combo useless cus it's only gonna hit once and you'll take no dmg. the only thing you have to watch out for is immob and sword 2 or 3 ( the thing that chills you and hits hard) that's it. they have less stability than us, they have less CC, they have no stealth, they have less sustain. and to make matters even worse revenant is also hard countered by conditions which soulbeast is not. soulbeast handles conditions like they are nothing.

  • bigo.9037bigo.9037 Member ✭✭✭

    @ChartFish.1308 said:

    @Ferus.3165 said:
    How is a warrior going to chain cc a ranger???

    I don't know, heard of a skill called rampage? Even a ranger not running glass can easily be caught by that, with only one skill that grants stability. Bait their dolly stance with any other cc and then rampage. They will be caught.

    Also lb3 is not insta cast :F it looks like it, with no cast time on tool tip, but it has an animation thus not insta cast. Use it's unreliableness against the ranger- this skill will always fire when pressed, no LoS warnings, no turn around to face target, it will go off even if you're behind the ranger (as such wasting the entire skill)

    "only one skill granting stability" lol what you actually run the pof elite??? most rangers i meet play dolly stance + sotp.... thats twice as much stab uptime.

  • bigo.9037bigo.9037 Member ✭✭✭

    @RangerThings.9810 said:

    Working as intended.

    fake. you could just unequib your armor to get those numbers. show video or its fake.

  • DeadlySynz.3471DeadlySynz.3471 Member ✭✭✭✭

    WvW isn't about 1v1; if anything this thread should be moved over to the PvP forum where there is much smaller group play. You take a soulbeast and let them open fire in a general group battle, you'd be lucky to crack 1.5k with any crit long range shot, or 2.5k with any crit rapid fire. Their damage in WvW is abysmal at best; their only real use is harassing necros and revenants. Once a group battle starts and you single someone out, then a warrior comes out of nowhere at you, you're dying 99.9% of the time.

    Lets not even mention the hoard of reflects, blocks, and invulnerables flying around. Then to add insult to injury the spellbreaker bubbles littering the battlefield that your projectiles can't go through. Then to add more salt to the wound, if you manage to open fire on a downed target.. along comes a guardian with their revive bubble blocking the projectiles. There is only so much unblockable possibility out there.

    You don't look at a SB in wvw as being overpowered in 1v1 (that's pvp, if you want that, join pvp instead). You look at them as completely under-powered in group play which is in fact what WvW is designed around. There is far too much projectile mitigation given the amount of blocks, reflects, and warrior bubbles kicking about. If their attacks do get through, you are often met with a 1.5k - 2.5k hit in full zerk gear which leaves one scratching their head.

  • Just gonna throw it out there since the whole "huge ranger burst" with longbow is something people seem to bring up constantly. But if you're having trouble with those types of rangers for whatever reason then you can simply run something with projectile destruction/reflect, and if you don't it's simply just your fault. If the ranger is truly doing such INSANE damage or whatever then they're most likely going to just kill themselves or blow all their endurance from dodging their own attack. Hell even if they're smart enough to end their attack you can either just now win if they really did put everything into that opening burst or just simply disengage since most rangers in wvw from what I've seen don't run with things that cripple/immobilize.

  • bigo.9037bigo.9037 Member ✭✭✭

    @Xenash.1245 said:
    Just gonna throw it out there since the whole "huge ranger burst" with longbow is something people seem to bring up constantly. But if you're having trouble with those types of rangers for whatever reason then you can simply run something with projectile destruction/reflect, and if you don't it's simply just your fault. If the ranger is truly doing such INSANE damage or whatever then they're most likely going to just kill themselves or blow all their endurance from dodging their own attack. Hell even if they're smart enough to end their attack you can either just now win if they really did put everything into that opening burst or just simply disengage since most rangers in wvw from what I've seen don't run with things that cripple/immobilize.

    I agree that ranger isn't that big of an issue in general wvw blob fighting but you're missing 2 key points.
    1: unlockable makes reflects irrelevant and as discussed earlier they have high uptime because of 1 single trait.
    2: the thread discusses 1v1, where soulbeast outshines pretty much any class in wvw balance.

    sure, wvw isn't made for 1v1 but neither is Spvp, yet 1v1s happen on the regular. dismissing 1v1 balance entirely is really stupid as it impacts a lot of players. anet knows this too, which is why there isn't only 1 class capable of utterly destroying everything while the rest are only good for group fighting.

  • @RangerThings.9810 said:

    Working as intended.

    Hey that was ME!

  • @bigo.9037 said:

    @RangerThings.9810 said:

    Working as intended.

    fake. you could just unequib your armor to get those numbers. show video or its fake.

    No its legit I did it to him.

  • bigo.9037bigo.9037 Member ✭✭✭

    @Maven.1690 said:

    @bigo.9037 said:

    @RangerThings.9810 said:

    Working as intended.

    fake. you could just unequib your armor to get those numbers. show video or its fake.

    No its legit I did it to him.

    okay I take it you're running all the mm traits that proc opening strike with 25% dmg, bloodlust, warhorn to stack 25 might with whao and other things? what armor was the target using?? it's literally only on the forums I see anyone complaining about this stuff. never see it happen inside the game. zerk v zerk has always been broken. you could complain about thief backstabbing 10k+ from stealth as well. that's what happens when both run full zerk.

    posting raw combat log without any other info isn't enough to justify your position that longbow is dmg is OP.

  • Yes its a purprose built build to crit heavy and hard on the opening two or 3 shots. He was running a druid build staff and bow so not sure what armor but pretty sure i caught him by surprise and got the shots off before he knew what happened. You can call it cheese but its really just glass and takes a fair amount of effort to not get jumped unawares. Pretty fun watching everyone argue rock paper scissors though.

  • bigo.9037bigo.9037 Member ✭✭✭

    @Maven.1690 said:
    Yes its a purprose built build to crit heavy and hard on the opening two or 3 shots. He was running a druid build staff and bow so not sure what armor but pretty sure i caught him by surprise and got the shots off before he knew what happened. You can call it cheese but its really just glass and takes a fair amount of effort to not get jumped unawares. Pretty fun watching everyone argue rock paper scissors though.

    yeah my point is that it's not something you see happening regularly and is just as easy to kill for other players who are ready for the attack. unlike deadeye, rangers can't just permestealth and reset 100000 times until they win.

  • @bigo.9037 said:

    @Maven.1690 said:
    Yes its a purprose built build to crit heavy and hard on the opening two or 3 shots. He was running a druid build staff and bow so not sure what armor but pretty sure i caught him by surprise and got the shots off before he knew what happened. You can call it cheese but its really just glass and takes a fair amount of effort to not get jumped unawares. Pretty fun watching everyone argue rock paper scissors though.

    yeah my point is that it's not something you see happening regularly and is just as easy to kill for other players who are ready for the attack. unlike deadeye, rangers can't just permestealth and reset 100000 times until they win.

    Yea you sacrafice sustain, melee, and escape for 18 seconds of insanity.

  • @bigo.9037 said:
    "only one skill granting stability" lol what you actually run the pof elite??? most rangers i meet play dolly stance + sotp.... thats twice as much stab uptime.

    Im aware SoTP grants stab. So fine if you're knitpicking, that's two. But if you get caught by a rampage CC you will not have time to activate SoTP before you're caught in chain. From that perspective, dollyak stance is only skill because it breaks stun and grants stab.

    PoF elite is actually decent :p it's a solid pick for most builds

  • bigo.9037bigo.9037 Member ✭✭✭
    edited September 5, 2018

    @ChartFish.1308 said:

    @bigo.9037 said:
    "only one skill granting stability" lol what you actually run the pof elite??? most rangers i meet play dolly stance + sotp.... thats twice as much stab uptime.

    Im aware SoTP grants stab. So fine if you're knitpicking, that's two. But if you get caught by a rampage CC you will not have time to activate SoTP before you're caught in chain. From that perspective, dollyak stance is only skill because it breaks stun and grants stab.

    PoF elite is actually decent :p it's a solid pick for most builds

    most builds have at least 2 stunbreaks on low cd.
    1: sb merge
    2: utility slot like protect me or LR

    you have dolly stance too. save it for when he uses rampage. sotp as a general usage stab buff when the fight start and use it whenever you can. it's really not that hard to counter rampage. all you have to do is not waste your stunbreaks on nothing and save dollu stance for his rampage cc. even if you don't, and many times I've popped dolly stance just because of habit ( and nothing has forced me to change that habit because:::) the cast time for rampage is like 1 second so it can be interrupted OR you can just stealth before he gets to hit you without anything, then pop sotp. or kite him if you have enough dodges. I mean.. really. rampage is only good to beat someone down who is already kinda losing the fight. I have never seen a warrior go from losing out on the rotations consistently to suddenly winning a fight just because he used rampage lmao.

    taking into account soulbeast has more melee options for CC and dmg than warrior (except for when they pop rampage obviously) you should easily be able to save your dolly stance.

  • Turk.5460Turk.5460 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @mortrialus.3062 said:

    @Bashi.8902 said:

    @Aridon.8362 said:
    It is too hard to kill a ranger, they get too many invulns dodging and stealth and hit like a truck. I block, and they pierce through my shield, I cripple, and they stealth and teleport away, I activate my invuln yet somehow the skill bugs out and allows me to still take physical damage enough is enough my dude. They need a nerf as they have a serious advantage in the roaming scene. I switch to full toughness armor and that bear greatsword skill chomped all of my hp and I'm still questioning how that even happens.

    Rangers are Squishy. Rangers require more mechanical skill then most other classes

    Lol

    That's a good one.

    Point Blank Shot+ Rapid Fire is literally all I've ever seen a ranger do whether they're a scrub I'm ganking or a top 100 SPvper.

    I'm in shock that he actually said that, and seemed serious. A big Owen Wilson WOW for that guy.

    Fort Aspenwood
    Jekkies

  • @Maven.1690 said:

    @bigo.9037 said:

    @RangerThings.9810 said:

    Working as intended.

    fake. you could just unequib your armor to get those numbers. show video or its fake.

    No its legit I did it to him.

    Ranger has enough damage modifiers to do this pretty easily. It's just a gimmick build like the 1 shot Maul build. You blow multiple cooldowns to get numbers like that which means if you know it's coming, you know they've just made themselves extremely vulnerable. It also means they probably only have 1 or 2 defensive skills since they're investing everything in to 1 shot.

    If you think a 12k Long Range Shot is nuts, check this one out. That said, I was full zerk/Scholar Reaper at the time and I was already heading in to a 2 v 1 fight I was prepared to lose. I hid behind a wall waiting for the 2 Rangers to get close enough to me and I pulled them with Grasping Darkness. At which point I was caught off guard by the sudden downed state when I was only hit once. Instantly knew what had happened but I had never seen it come from Winter's Bite before.
    https://imgur.com/a/Jifoygh

    And for clarity, I'm not joining this discussion. I think SB is very strong but I'm not making complaints here. Just stating that the screenshot is from a gimmick build and sharing my own experience against one.

    PS. I don't understand how to directly link a picture so that you can see it right here. The URL and image URL things don't work and pasting it directly to the comment doesn't either ):

    💎 [HUNT] [IH] [JEEP] | Necromancer, Engineer, Revenant | Maguuma | Diamond Legend 💎

  • I'm honestly surprised people took this thread seriously at this length.

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