NERF MESMER — Guild Wars 2 Forums

NERF MESMER

Ultima.8673Ultima.8673 Member ✭✭
edited August 19, 2018 in Mesmer

on a good Player this class is just too strong:
too many clones , invincibility, Stealth, too high Damage, too high mobility
and cause of mesmer mechanics to hard to kill in a 1v1 Situation...

nerf this kitten and also nerf spellbreakers Sustain.....

<13

Comments

  • DragonFury.6243DragonFury.6243 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited August 21, 2018

    NO NO NO NO NO NO
    dont kill the fun i currently have in pvp because

    when ever i fight a mesmer i end up with a bleeding nose like this

    when ever i fight a SB i see nothing but BS like this

    when ever i fight a DE i see little fish like this

    and more but i dont have the time i must go to pvp to laugh and have fun

  • Eddbopkins.2630Eddbopkins.2630 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Its the mechanics of the class that make them better then the rest, and that cant be change easily at all.
    For example with warrior/spellbraker, they pretty much have the highest base hp and armor giving them great suatain to begin with. Coupled with demolishers ammy and that class has a staggering 3k armor, ontop of rousling resistance it has 4k amor and 20k hp. And now with the shake it off buff it can suatain condis so well with his resistance boon application that it is extremly difficult to kill when placed in the right hands in 1v1s and can really do some big damage in group fights with easy mode skill Full Counter. This is just my opinion though.

  • Daishi.6027Daishi.6027 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited August 19, 2018

    You have every opportunity to anticipate; use it then punish.

  • Vieux P.1238Vieux P.1238 Member ✭✭✭✭

    To many clones. I wasting my burst on clones instead of the mesmer. Plz nerf the number of clones 1 at a time so i can target the mesmer. & plz remove stealth.
    Mesmer with stealth is OP. & Also remove Elusive minds & Ambush from Mirage traits.
    Thq

    Winter Nerf is coming!

  • Vieux P.1238Vieux P.1238 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited August 19, 2018

    @felincyriac.5981 said:
    All joking aside, the class is way too bloated.

    what does that mean?.. & fyi i never joke about mesmers.

    Winter Nerf is coming!

  • @LegendaVagyok.9132

    opening thread has a point

    within a short time span (less than 5 seconds), a mesmer with the right build and good management skills can create 3-4 clones and has make you lose target twice, oh and slapped you with 4-5 conditions to boot

    10 seconds pass in the battle and you are in the exact same position except you've lost target another 4 times

    I had this one Charr Mesmer create (I kid you not) like 8-10 clones when he was node defending our home point in a Kyhlo match

    it was kitten how this one mesmer could literally illusion dance around you and do so continuously without any drawback (that I'm seeing)

    soulbeast rangers can put up crazy burst damage for sure, but their time to do so is hard capped and they have to trade off utility to run it

    mesmers don't seem to have any hard cap on their end but have good utility to boot

    and the camera angles don't help as players trying to constantly find where the mesmer unstealths is made more difficult because of a lack of zooming out

    on my norn guardian - I can't see kitten happening around me unless it is infront of me


    the only changes I would make is to nerf mesmers to have less stealth skills and less target breaks by "unpoofing" their clone mechanic

    make it like how WoW uses mage clones in where the mage creates the clones but doesn't give them free stealth so it doesn't break the attacker's target

  • Aaralyna.3104Aaralyna.3104 Member ✭✭✭

    A mesmer can only have 3 clones up (which die as soon as target dies). These clones are slower than the player and they tend to not move at all either (unless you shatter them but then they simply come hug you). The other ones you see are phantasms (illusions) which carry the world "illusionary" so its easily to see its not the actual player. These can only attack once and then are destroyed and become a clone (it will replace one of your old ones if you had 3 up). Phantasms can be destroyed by damaging them before they even attack. Theoretically it is possible to get 3 clones up and 2 phantasms via skill slots and 1 per weapon equipped (2 in case of shield according wiki?) of which I believe is only at skill 1-3 but I am not entirely sure. Clones and phantasms are easy to kill when it comes to them being 1 hits or close enough. When I fight a mesmer in pvp (amature casual unranked player here), I can usually see almost directly which is the real player and which is the fake. I tend to tag the real player as well so others see which to target. Once a mesmer is in downed state... they are pretty much dead (can port once but if they are interrupted they can only sit it out to die and with a little luck manage to spawn 1 clone but usually thats too late). When it comes to portalling, stealth and such... As mesmer you have to choose which skills to put in your slots, you can't have it all at the same time and the cd's are not short either. (Keep in mind that skills in pvp vs pve are different).There has already been nerfs in both core mesmer as well as chronomancer in last months. When it comes to mirage, I got not enough experience to say anything about that one. I am playing a non meta mesmer chrono (greatsword/sword & focus (I am a 3 sec death on melee so I rather stick with my ranged option :P)

  • Vieux P.1238Vieux P.1238 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited August 20, 2018

    No! mesmer has been proven & voted on that it was the class that got the least nerfs from all the classes. & it needs to be majorly nerf hammered.
    It's a broken class. It's to confusing to target & there's to many clones. & to many evades & dodges. It should not have any stealth, no evades & 1 dodge only.
    & should only summon 1 clone at a time before summoning the next. Then we might be happy.

    Winter Nerf is coming!

  • @Vieux P.1238 said:
    No! mesmer has been proven & voted on that it was the class that got the least nerfs from all the classes. & it needs to be majorly nerf hammered.
    It's a broken class. It's to confusing to target & there's to many clones. & to many evades & dodges. It should not have any stealth, no evades & 1 dodge only.
    & should only summon 1 clone at a time before summoning the next. Then we might be happy.

    Hilarious - 1 clone? The number of clones/phantasms was really never the problem. They die fast, don't hit that hard, can be dodged/killed before executing anything that does hit hard, and are so obviously different from real players. If the number of clones is your problem, you really need to just pay more attention.

    The constant resets and continuous application of conditions throughout - now that I have a problem with. Would be nice if there was a higher cost to mirages breaking target and resetting fights. I main a ranger that's mostly single-target based, so it makes mesmer fights a bit harder for me.

  • Vieux P.1238Vieux P.1238 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited August 20, 2018

    @voltaicbore.8012 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:
    No! mesmer has been proven & voted on that it was the class that got the least nerfs from all the classes. & it needs to be majorly nerf hammered.
    It's a broken class. It's to confusing to target & there's to many clones. & to many evades & dodges. It should not have any stealth, no evades & 1 dodge only.
    & should only summon 1 clone at a time before summoning the next. Then we might be happy.

    Hilarious - 1 clone? The number of clones/phantasms was really never the problem. They die fast, don't hit that hard, can be dodged/killed before executing anything that does hit hard, and are so obviously different from real players. If the number of clones is your problem, you really need to just pay more attention.

    The constant resets and continuous application of conditions throughout - now that I have a problem with. Would be nice if there was a higher cost to mirages breaking target and resetting fights. I main a ranger that's mostly single-target based, so it makes mesmer fights a bit harder for me.

    No..i don't care.. This is not what Gw2 pvp is all about. Gw2 caters to the casual players thus i should not work on figuring out witch one is you & witch one is your clone.
    1 clone or phantasm is all you get at a time. No one cares on how weak they are. You just want EZ wins with an no skill class. Mesmer is a no skill class that should be deleted. There i said it.
    My 2 cent

    Winter Nerf is coming!

  • All I can say is 3 seconds of exhaustion for a stun break and condition clear on dodge. That is how the developers settled on nerfing the single most powerful trait ever introduced to PvP.

    It’s a complete joke how over-tuned this class is in all 3 game modes and there is no sign that the developers even think it is an issue.

  • Arioch.4810Arioch.4810 Member ✭✭✭

    At this point in time, any resources dedicated to PvP should go toward modifications that would solve afk-ers (aka pip farmers) issue. After that, some changes that would bring more players in, we need to increase population.

    After that, Anet could look into class balance. But until then....

  • Senteliks.2360Senteliks.2360 Member ✭✭
    edited August 20, 2018

    @Vieux P.1238 said:
    To many clones. I wasting my burst on clones instead of the mesmer. Plz nerf the number of clones 1 at a time so i can target the mesmer. & plz remove stealth.
    Mesmer with stealth is OP. & Also remove Elusive minds & Ambush from Mirage traits.
    Thq

    You are basically asking to re-design the class or just make it plain useless. The limit is already set, it's 3 clones per say. "Unlimited" is just illusion for people like you who don't
    get idea that clones are generated by certain conditions, which mirage makes much easier and brainless. But at all times there can only be 3 clones. And remove Ambush from Mirage and you get useless specialization. Pff people just never cease to amaze me.

    While Mesmer in good player hands is challenging so is Thief, Warrior, Elemental, Engineer, Revenant, Ranger, Guardian, Necromancer (famous 2 hit win scourge BS move). Basically every profession on it's own to deal is pain in good hands. Revenant being an exception and Engineer because it requires too much effort to perform well.

    Rather, than giving pointless vent, how about constructive ideas to solve the problem. Look at the SB, pets doing all the hard lifting, or SB, or wait, where is the end to this? Whole balance is the mess and it's not just one profession that will fix it.

  • Azure The Heartless.3261Azure The Heartless.3261 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited August 20, 2018

    The only thing that needs to go on Mesmers is Elusive Mind. Other than that toxic trait they're obnoxious, but fine.
    Spellbreakers are a slow burn down if you don't trigger their Full Counter.

    [Charr Noises]
    [Plays every class]
    [JUST GIT EVEN GUDDER ITS FINE]

  • SnowHawk.3615SnowHawk.3615 Member ✭✭✭

    they need to nerf the condi on mirage, nothing else.
    "Good players should be punished!"
    is what you're saying.

  • It's been six moths since the exhaustion introduction, and yet people still don't realize the true reason why mesmers take EM, and how in fact limiting and disadvantageous this trait is now. The moment they rework the trait along with removing the stunbreak on dodge and thus the exhaustion, you (people who qq about mesmers) are going to regret that more than ever.

  • phokus.8934phokus.8934 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Kondor.2904 said:
    It's been six moths since the exhaustion introduction, and yet people still don't realize the true reason why mesmers take EM, and how in fact limiting and disadvantageous this trait is now. The moment they rework the trait along with removing the stunbreak on dodge and thus the exhaustion, you (people who qq about mesmers) are going to regret that more than ever.

    Uncle Rico, is that you?

    There's no indication at all that they're going to change EM.

  • @Kondor.2904 said:
    It's been six moths since the exhaustion introduction, and yet people still don't realize the true reason why mesmers take EM, and how in fact limiting and disadvantageous this trait is now. The moment they rework the trait along with removing the stunbreak on dodge and thus the exhaustion, you (people who qq about mesmers) are going to regret that more than ever.

    Why? Because they have another incredibly powerful and broken trait in Infinite Horizon? I don’t think that is a good argument on why people should stop complaining about how OP this class is.

  • My gripe with mirage is actually quite small, I just don't like how their dodge mechanic acts essentially like an instant cast skill, even without taking elusive mind they can dodge while cc'd, casting other skills, and stomping/rezzing. It isn't even EM that pisses me off. a long time ago there were a handful of skills that could be dodged in while channeling like warriors axe 5, this was promptly removed from the game as a "bug" as it was considered far too imbalanced, now we have a whole class that can dodge while casting anything, during any cc, and even any action like stomping.

    If you are going to be able to dodge while cc'd you should have to be able to at least trait for it(i.e. take elusive mind), as it is now they can run infinite horizon eat a stun they should have dodged and spam there mirage cloak while stunned(granted it doesn't stunbreak the stun so if the stun is long enough they are still "stunned") avoid all the damage that would have hit them as a consequence of said missed dodge, and in this case there clones if any are up are now pelting the enemy player.

    I am all for skilled play and trade offs, but I do feel mechanically mirage cloak is a bit strong. Sadly I doubt anet would do anything to its mechanics, thus outside of some number tweaking which will either do very little or destroy the class all together I don't expect much change here.

    Full Counter is supposed to counter everything, why else is it called FULL Counter... Just like 100 blades should really hit 100 times so you instantly die to retaliation.

  • Vieux P.1238Vieux P.1238 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited August 20, 2018

    @Senteliks.2360 said:

    @Vieux P.1238 said:
    To many clones. I wasting my burst on clones instead of the mesmer. Plz nerf the number of clones 1 at a time so i can target the mesmer. & plz remove stealth.
    Mesmer with stealth is OP. & Also remove Elusive minds & Ambush from Mirage traits.
    Thq

    You are basically asking to re-design the class or just make it plain useless. The limit is already set, it's 3 clones per say. "Unlimited" is just illusion for people like you who don't
    get idea that clones are generated by certain conditions, which mirage makes much easier and brainless. But at all times there can only be 3 clones. And remove Ambush from Mirage and you get useless specialization. Pff people just never cease to amaze me.

    While Mesmer in good player hands is challenging so is Thief, Warrior, Elemental, Engineer, Revenant, Ranger, Guardian, Necromancer (famous 2 hit win scourge BS move). Basically every profession on it's own to deal is pain in good hands. Revenant being an exception and Engineer because it requires too much effort to perform well.

    Rather, than giving pointless vent, how about constructive ideas to solve the problem. Look at the SB, pets doing all the hard lifting, or SB, or wait, where is the end to this? Whole balance is the mess and it's not just one profession that will fix it.

    I'm not basically, ....i am asking to re-design the mesmer class to be useless. Gw2 should cater to my type of game play where i don't have to work to win. It should be easy & should not use any of my brain power or skills for me to win. So plz make it so my AA AOE explode any mesmer in my vicinity. Then i will be happy. But at the moment, it's so hard. sigh...

    Winter Nerf is coming!

  • breno.5423breno.5423 Member ✭✭✭

    Just remove the break stun fact from dodge and its ok.

  • Fat Disgrace.4275Fat Disgrace.4275 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @breno.5423 said:
    Just remove the break stun fact from dodge and its ok.

    But why? EM was never that good. Infinite horizon on the other hand...

  • Wonder why ANet don't listen to any of the things the so little PvP community want
    Everyone kitten wants to get the mesmer nerfed. Even high pro legends from PvP think mesmer need a nerf but i don't even know why ANet do nothing. They want everyone to just unninstall the game and when they see the number go down they'll do something?

  • sephiroth.4217sephiroth.4217 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited August 21, 2018

    On some classes I don't stand a chance against a Mesmer, on other classes they don't stand a chance against me...

    The only thing that I feel is unfair is the ability to cast/channel while dodging, that seems outside of the parameters of what's allowed to all the other classes.

    Not to brag, but I put together a puzzle in 4 days and the box said 2-4 years.
    Please allow team queue with rewards again at our own discretion.
    Apologies if I come off as dry or blunt.

  • Odik.4587Odik.4587 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @sephiroth.4217 said:
    On some classes I don't stand a chance against a Mesmer, on other classes they don't stand a chance against me...

    The only thing that I feel is unfair is the ability to cast/channel while dodging, that seems outside of the parameters of what's allowed to all the other classes.

    Thats extremely OP but same I can say about photon forge, full counter etc that brought by other elite specs .

    @Fat Disgrace.4275 said:

    @breno.5423 said:
    Just remove the break stun fact from dodge and its ok.

    But why? EM was never that good. Infinite horizon on the other hand...

    O , someone recognize IH being cancerous even more than EM ... About that ... Axe ambush is broken as hell , just compare it to scepter ambush for example , poor scepter pales in comparision . You could nerf this reflect dodge (that basically have no cd) , BD, bleeds on pistol a bit ,axe ambush , if you touch dodge duration mesmer playerbase will burn your house xD

  • Tom Hsiao.9705Tom Hsiao.9705 Member ✭✭✭

    I think the whole clone or invis thing should just be removed! I’m amazed they did nothing to change this like it’s impossible to 1vs1 a decent Mesmer!!
    I tried Mesmer (mirage) the other day just grab a build from a Friend and I was able to 1 va 3 without really knowing what I was doing... but I have played my elementalist for YEARs still can’t win 1 vs 3... this is some bs! Either give elementalist some massively strong summon to compensate or remove this whole bs at once!

    I thought Mesmer was annoy at gw1 but you know whattt they weren’t really able to 1 vs 2 at gw1!!!! And can easily be gank and be done with...but this new Mesmer of gw2 is something else... high mobility can barely catch them and with all the insane burst with all the clone to confuse their foe and lose target this is just too op.

    Don’t just argue for the sake of arguing, I don’t have time for trolls!

  • Odik.4587Odik.4587 Member ✭✭✭✭

    1x3 w/o knowing what you doing? Was those enemies names are "heavy golem" ,"medium golem' and "light golem' ?
    I think you need more ' ! ' in your post,after each word please

  • Senteliks.2360Senteliks.2360 Member ✭✭
    edited August 21, 2018

    @Tom Hsiao.9705 said:
    I think the whole clone or invis thing should just be removed! I’m amazed they did nothing to change this like it’s impossible to 1vs1 a decent Mesmer!!
    I tried Mesmer (mirage) the other day just grab a build from a Friend and I was able to 1 va 3 without really knowing what I was doing... but I have played my elementalist for YEARs still can’t win 1 vs 3... this is some bs! Either give elementalist some massively strong summon to compensate or remove this whole bs at once!

    I thought Mesmer was annoy at gw1 but you know whattt they weren’t really able to 1 vs 2 at gw1!!!! And can easily be gank and be done with...but this new Mesmer of gw2 is something else... high mobility can barely catch them and with all the insane burst with all the clone to confuse their foe and lose target this is just too op.

    Er, I don't believe you. Maybe you successfully run away somewhere in 1 vs 3 but to actually win battle for someone who never touched mesmer is fairy tail, you tell to others and yourself. I had seen other mesmers on field and you can tell whatever they are rookies or not, by how they die like flies on the field because they think they are obnoxious in utilizing class.

  • Imperadordf.2687Imperadordf.2687 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Fat Disgrace.4275 said:

    @breno.5423 said:
    Just remove the break stun fact from dodge and its ok.

    But why? EM was never that good. Infinite horizon on the other hand...

    Wat? EM was godlike before. Now IH is better just because Axe is meta. Nerf axe and you'll never see IH again.

  • Fat Disgrace.4275Fat Disgrace.4275 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited August 21, 2018

    @Imperadordf.2687 said:

    @Fat Disgrace.4275 said:

    @breno.5423 said:
    Just remove the break stun fact from dodge and its ok.

    But why? EM was never that good. Infinite horizon on the other hand...

    Wat? EM was godlike before. Now IH is better just because Axe is meta. Nerf axe and you'll never see IH again.

    Are we talking Condi here? I dunno much about spvp Condi meta stuff but in wvw sword ambush with IH is pretty crazy, it also adds better dps with gs. I never though of EM being godlike since you already had mirage cloak which made any stun burst kinda meh anyway.

  • sephiroth.4217sephiroth.4217 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Odik.4587 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:
    On some classes I don't stand a chance against a Mesmer, on other classes they don't stand a chance against me...

    The only thing that I feel is unfair is the ability to cast/channel while dodging, that seems outside of the parameters of what's allowed to all the other classes.

    Thats extremely OP but same I can say about photon forge, full counter etc that brought by other elite specs .

    @Fat Disgrace.4275 said:

    @breno.5423 said:
    Just remove the break stun fact from dodge and its ok.

    But why? EM was never that good. Infinite horizon on the other hand...

    O , someone recognize IH being cancerous even more than EM ... About that ... Axe ambush is broken as hell , just compare it to scepter ambush for example , poor scepter pales in comparision . You could nerf this reflect dodge (that basically have no cd) , BD, bleeds on pistol a bit ,axe ambush , if you touch dodge duration mesmer playerbase will burn your house xD

    Imagine if you could freely cast during full counter though... Just seems a little too much.

    Not to brag, but I put together a puzzle in 4 days and the box said 2-4 years.
    Please allow team queue with rewards again at our own discretion.
    Apologies if I come off as dry or blunt.

  • Abazigal.3679Abazigal.3679 Member ✭✭✭

    From my point of view , the issue isn't about mesmer being op but about the way condis are applied and the learning curve. Most of the time you're going to take 5 conditions from one way which will be considered " out of nowhere ".

    Whatever, the biggest problem remains in the confusion condition. 2 Ideas of rework :

    • No damage received when auto attack
    • Damage received when the skill hits or finishs to cast, not when click.
  • Odik.4587Odik.4587 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @Odik.4587 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:
    On some classes I don't stand a chance against a Mesmer, on other classes they don't stand a chance against me...

    The only thing that I feel is unfair is the ability to cast/channel while dodging, that seems outside of the parameters of what's allowed to all the other classes.

    Thats extremely OP but same I can say about photon forge, full counter etc that brought by other elite specs .

    @Fat Disgrace.4275 said:

    @breno.5423 said:
    Just remove the break stun fact from dodge and its ok.

    But why? EM was never that good. Infinite horizon on the other hand...

    O , someone recognize IH being cancerous even more than EM ... About that ... Axe ambush is broken as hell , just compare it to scepter ambush for example , poor scepter pales in comparision . You could nerf this reflect dodge (that basically have no cd) , BD, bleeds on pistol a bit ,axe ambush , if you touch dodge duration mesmer playerbase will burn your house xD

    Imagine if you could freely cast during full counter though... Just seems a little too much.

    what you talking about question mark

  • Crab Fear.1624Crab Fear.1624 Member ✭✭✭✭

    It seems the only real "issue" with mesmers right now is how mirage cloak works.

    I understand the dodge mechanic change and the appearance to trick/confuse enemies, but it SHOULD NOT BE USABLE IF STUNNED
    unless the player chooses EM trait.

    I see the dev's tied a "exhaustion" fee to the trait, but you can still dodge while stunned even if you don't break stun, you still essentially negate the follow up burst.

    Maybe even all classes should get this "dodge on stun" ...even if it just move us a little away from the enemy so he can't do his burst (even if we can't use skills)

    Doesn't sound right to me either.

    It's not thematic, it's an unfair advantage in a competitive scene. It really should be tied to the trait with the "exhaustion" cost.

    After that all is well.

    Soon™ ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
    Bring back Impending Dhuum.
    No FotM for me, only thief, weak or strong.

  • phokus.8934phokus.8934 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Abazigal.3679 said:
    From my point of view , the issue isn't about mesmer being op but about the way condis are applied and the learning curve. Most of the time you're going to take 5 conditions from one way which will be considered " out of nowhere ".

    Whatever, the biggest problem remains in the confusion condition. 2 Ideas of rework :

    • No damage received when auto attack
    • Damage received when the skill hits or finishs to cast, not when click.

    I don't think they need to change how confusion works. The biggest culprit with condition Mesmer is the number of conditions they can put on you giving them condi coverage. Bleed, torment, confusion, burning, and vulnerability in one go is a bit much.

    I just don't think they should put out that many unique conditions with relative ease.

  • Dawdler.8521Dawdler.8521 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited August 21, 2018

    @phokus.8934 said:

    @Abazigal.3679 said:
    From my point of view , the issue isn't about mesmer being op but about the way condis are applied and the learning curve. Most of the time you're going to take 5 conditions from one way which will be considered " out of nowhere ".

    Whatever, the biggest problem remains in the confusion condition. 2 Ideas of rework :

    • No damage received when auto attack
    • Damage received when the skill hits or finishs to cast, not when click.

    I don't think they need to change how confusion works. The biggest culprit with condition Mesmer is the number of conditions they can put on you giving them condi coverage. Bleed, torment, confusion, burning, and vulnerability in one go is a bit much.

    I just don't think they should put out that many unique conditions with relative ease.

    Eh I think is the first time I've seen someone complain about the range of condis on the mirage, lol... Because its pathetic compared to a scourge. There is a reason its considered weak vs condi cleanse.

    Now, the amount of stacks for each individual condi and the speed of which it can be reapplied is a whole other matter. 20+ of anything is ridiculous and the mirage reach 40+. Remember the good old times before deathly chill when 10 bleed stacks was a bomb?

  • @Crab Fear.1624 said:
    It seems the only real "issue" with mesmers right now is how mirage cloak works.

    I understand the dodge mechanic change and the appearance to trick/confuse enemies, but it SHOULD NOT BE USABLE IF STUNNED
    unless the player chooses EM trait.

    This would work for me too. Then Infinite Horizon would be your damage GM and Elusive Mind would be your defensive GM.

    [Charr Noises]
    [Plays every class]
    [JUST GIT EVEN GUDDER ITS FINE]

  • phokus.8934phokus.8934 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Dawdler.8521 said:

    @phokus.8934 said:

    @Abazigal.3679 said:
    From my point of view , the issue isn't about mesmer being op but about the way condis are applied and the learning curve. Most of the time you're going to take 5 conditions from one way which will be considered " out of nowhere ".

    Whatever, the biggest problem remains in the confusion condition. 2 Ideas of rework :

    • No damage received when auto attack
    • Damage received when the skill hits or finishs to cast, not when click.

    I don't think they need to change how confusion works. The biggest culprit with condition Mesmer is the number of conditions they can put on you giving them condi coverage. Bleed, torment, confusion, burning, and vulnerability in one go is a bit much.

    I just don't think they should put out that many unique conditions with relative ease.

    Eh I think is the first time I've seen someone complain about the range of condis on the mirage, lol... Because its pathetic compared to a scourge. There is a reason its considered weak vs condi cleanse.

    Now, the amount of stacks for each individual condi and the speed of which it can be reapplied is a whole other matter. 20+ of anything is ridiculous and the mirage reach 40+. Remember the good old times before deathly chill when 10 bleed stacks was a bomb?

    I play Mirage and have played Mesmer since day one and the number of cover condis for confusion is kind of high. Hell you can (or did) hit high burn ticks that rivaled guardians. With FIFO on condi cleanse and with condi cover from poison, torment, and vuln, it makes for some hair raising damage.

    Just in my opinion, I don't think the number of stacks is the main problem.

  • Odik.4587Odik.4587 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited August 21, 2018

    @Dawdler.8521 said:
    the mirage reach 40+.

    You are on high or ?

    @Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

    @Crab Fear.1624 said:
    It seems the only real "issue" with mesmers right now is how mirage cloak works.

    I understand the dodge mechanic change and the appearance to trick/confuse enemies, but it SHOULD NOT BE USABLE IF STUNNED
    unless the player chooses EM trait.

    This would work for me too. Then Infinite Horizon would be your damage GM and Elusive Mind would be your defensive GM.

    Even with that change you will still cry (until its becomes as bad as renegade),what the point?:d

  • Azure The Heartless.3261Azure The Heartless.3261 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited August 21, 2018

    @Odik.4587 said:

    @Dawdler.8521 said:
    the mirage reach 40+.

    You are on high or ?

    @Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

    @Crab Fear.1624 said:
    It seems the only real "issue" with mesmers right now is how mirage cloak works.

    I understand the dodge mechanic change and the appearance to trick/confuse enemies, but it SHOULD NOT BE USABLE IF STUNNED
    unless the player chooses EM trait.

    This would work for me too. Then Infinite Horizon would be your damage GM and Elusive Mind would be your defensive GM.

    Even with that change you will still cry (until its becomes as bad as renegade),what the point?:d

    Please tell me other aspects of my future, fortuneteller. <3

    I play mesmer. I also play revenant. I just dislike people cheesing wins and labeling it "skill", or people struggling just to perform at baseline with whatever class they like the most. Mesmer has a pretty large buffer to sit on before any large facet of their core or elites become unplayable. They'll handle having to pick one GM for defense over one for damage, just like everyone else.

    [Charr Noises]
    [Plays every class]
    [JUST GIT EVEN GUDDER ITS FINE]

  • EpicTurtle.8571EpicTurtle.8571 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited August 22, 2018

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @Odik.4587 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:
    On some classes I don't stand a chance against a Mesmer, on other classes they don't stand a chance against me...

    The only thing that I feel is unfair is the ability to cast/channel while dodging, that seems outside of the parameters of what's allowed to all the other classes.

    Thats extremely OP but same I can say about photon forge, full counter etc that brought by other elite specs .

    @Fat Disgrace.4275 said:

    @breno.5423 said:
    Just remove the break stun fact from dodge and its ok.

    But why? EM was never that good. Infinite horizon on the other hand...

    O , someone recognize IH being cancerous even more than EM ... About that ... Axe ambush is broken as hell , just compare it to scepter ambush for example , poor scepter pales in comparision . You could nerf this reflect dodge (that basically have no cd) , BD, bleeds on pistol a bit ,axe ambush , if you touch dodge duration mesmer playerbase will burn your house xD

    Imagine if you could freely cast during full counter though... Just seems a little too much.

    That would be casting while casting, that's entirely different. If you give Mirage a decent functioning mechanical change as opposed to a dodge modification sure, fine. Otherwise if all we get is a fancy new dodge that's slightly longer and no extra endurance either then channeling while doing it seems fair enough. The other two things the spec provides (Deceptions and Axe) are underwhelming and good respectively but don't justify not having Mirage Cloak.

    @Crab Fear.1624 said:
    It seems the only real "issue" with mesmers right now is how mirage cloak works.

    I understand the dodge mechanic change and the appearance to trick/confuse enemies, but it SHOULD NOT BE USABLE IF STUNNED
    unless the player chooses EM trait.

    I see the dev's tied a "exhaustion" fee to the trait, but you can still dodge while stunned even if you don't break stun, you still essentially negate the follow up burst.

    Maybe even all classes should get this "dodge on stun" ...even if it just move us a little away from the enemy so he can't do his burst (even if we can't use skills)

    Doesn't sound right to me either.

    It's not thematic, it's an unfair advantage in a competitive scene. It really should be tied to the trait with the "exhaustion" cost.

    After that all is well.

    Or players could learn to delay their burst literally one second when the Mirage has nothing left to dodge with. Mirage gets nothing else aside from Deceptions and Axe and neither of those are good enough to justify Mirage Cloak being too strong with the spec. Like I said above, give Mirage a decent change to the class mechanic and I doubt anyone would be mad, but a dodge modification is completely in line.

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