Which class is the best for pure healing output? (Mostly about raids) — Guild Wars 2 Forums

Which class is the best for pure healing output? (Mostly about raids)

Heal engi can push about 6000 healing/second to allies, any there any classes that can push higher?

full napkin-math calculations here

I research the game numbers and do wiki stuff sometimes. If you have any questions about how damage is calculated, feel free to ask me (easier to hit me up on reddit @ towelcat though)

Comments

  • Hoodie.1045Hoodie.1045 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Definitely Druid. In every single fractals and raids group I go into, there is definitely going to be at least one Druid involved. Healing engineer is only a descent substitute if your group just happens to not have a Druid.

    Karras

  • Opopanax.1803Opopanax.1803 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited September 10, 2018

    I would think support tempest since auras heal at range and have consistent healing. Druid seems very punctuated with CA.

    It's not just about raw.healing,.but.the range of heals and burst vs sustain.

  • Lunateric.3708Lunateric.3708 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Hoodie.1045 said:
    Definitely Druid. In every single fractals and raids group I go into, there is definitely going to be at least one Druid involved. Healing engineer is only a descent substitute if your group just happens to not have a Druid.

    Druid isn't a good healer, you take it because it brings offensive modifiers with spirits and GoE, plus 10man might.

  • sokeenoppa.5384sokeenoppa.5384 Member ✭✭✭✭

    If i recall right, tempest is still best healer (hp/sec). It isnt a good raid healer tho.

    I'll have two number 9s, a number 9 large, a number 6 with extra dip, a number 7, two number 45s, one with cheese, and a large soda.

  • Not really sure the answer to this, but a Glint/Ventari Herald with Draconic Echo traited has pretty high hps since the regen will not only be hitting 10 targets at once, but is also being hit by healing modifiers as well as the regen modifier in Herald.

    Healing orbs are a mistake. Please delete them ANet.

  • cat.8975cat.8975 Member ✭✭✭

    @sokeenoppa.5384 said:
    If i recall right, tempest is still best healer (hp/sec). It isnt a good raid healer tho.

    Can it outheal the most damaging field in the DPS golem area? The field does roughly ~4k dps to a light armor target without any damage reduction.

    I research the game numbers and do wiki stuff sometimes. If you have any questions about how damage is calculated, feel free to ask me (easier to hit me up on reddit @ towelcat though)

  • Stand The Wall.6987Stand The Wall.6987 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited September 14, 2018

    well heres what I crunched for heal rev.

    maximum potential heal over 60 sec

    assuming +heal % applies to self as well cuz lazy
    hps=heals per second
    numbers rounded up or down

    heal rev
    http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vlAQJAWmnnN2gSyJvQRNlbosoyPU4U5IKIs8EFFglZNgDSwu2dDG-jFSDQBO4QAMMlfy7JAsHdBsUJImU/JK7PAgLAApA8bmF-w
    2000 hp w/life sigil
    +132% heal with traits/rune/sigil/food

    sigil of renewal 1100 per weapon swap x6 weapon swaps x5 people 1100x132%=2500x5people=12500x6times75000
    sigil of water 670 x2 procs x5 x6 670x132%=1500x2=3000x5=15000x6=90000
    sigil of water taken over renewal
    rune of the monk 4th bonus 2640x132%=6100x4=25000
    regen 380 per tic x5 people x60 tics 380x132%=880x20%(trait)=1050x5=5280x60=316800
    rejuvenating assault 465 x60 orbs 465x132%=1100x60=66000x50%(quickness)=99000
    renewing wave 2600 x5 x4 2600x132%=6000x5=30000x4=120000
    elevated compassion 700/3 (once every 3 sec) x60 tics 700x132%=1600x60=530x60=31800

    project tranquility 400/3(interval) x3 pulses x6 400x132%=900/3=300 x3=900x6=5400
    ventaris will 1600 x5 x3 times used x6 1600x132%=3700x5=18500x3=55500x6=333000
    natural harmony 5600 x5 x3 x6 5600x132%=13000x3=39000x5=195000x6=1170000
    purifying essence 700x3(assuming condis cleansed) x5 x6 700x132%=1600x3=4900x5=24300x6=146100

    =2337900 per minute /60 = 38965 hps/5(1 person hps)=7790
    10 condis removed per 18sec
    75% alacrity uptime
    100% regen
    100% protection
    50% swiftness
    50% fury
    (boons uptime depend on whats needed, regen always taken)

    edit
    elevated compassion added

    Te lazla otstra.
    nerf list

  • alcopaul.2156alcopaul.2156 Member ✭✭✭
    edited September 11, 2018

    some firebrand healed me for 4k hp and popped almost successive 3k hp heals (in pvp tho, could be higher in wvw). that's for inbound heal.

    for outbound heal, elementalist (must be a weaver) can endure 3 people hitting it for some significant time.

    Your Math Tèacher [MATH]
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  • Nimon.7840Nimon.7840 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Hoodie.1045 said:
    Definitely Druid. In every single fractals and raids group I go into, there is definitely going to be at least one Druid involved. Healing engineer is only a descent substitute if your group just happens to not have a Druid.

    Druid isn't taken because of the healing he provides.
    Druid has one of the lowest healing off all healing specs.
    But it's the only spec that can provide so many offensive buffs while still doing enough healing.

  • Dadnir.5038Dadnir.5038 Member ✭✭✭✭

    All in all, the issue isn't really hp/s, the issue is more which healer have the healing system the most appropriate for each encounter.

    For example tempest and engineer will have excellent sustain healing while they may be weaker in burst healing. On the other hand, revenant and druid will have slightly weaker sustain healing but have good burst healing capacities. Some professions will also provide damage mitigation which might help reduce the healing needed. For example, assuming that the healer grant 100% prot uptime, he will need only 70% of the healing output of a healer that don't provide prot to achieve the same result.

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:
    snip
    =2306100 per minute /60 = 38400 hps/5(1 person hps)=7700
    10 condis removed per 18sec
    75% alacrity uptime
    100% regen
    100% protection
    50% swiftness
    50% fury
    (boons uptime depend on whats needed, regen always taken)

    Energy management probably reduce healing number a bit.

  • @Dadnir.5038 said:
    All in all, the issue isn't really hp/s, the issue is more which healer have the healing system the most appropriate for each encounter.

    For example tempest and engineer will have excellent sustain healing while they may be weaker in burst healing. On the other hand, revenant and druid will have slightly weaker sustain healing but have good burst healing capacities. Some professions will also provide damage mitigation which might help reduce the healing needed. For example, assuming that the healer grant 100% prot uptime, he will need only 70% of the healing output of a healer that don't provide prot to achieve the same result.

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:
    snip
    =2306100 per minute /60 = 38400 hps/5(1 person hps)=7700
    10 condis removed per 18sec
    75% alacrity uptime
    100% regen
    100% protection
    50% swiftness
    50% fury
    (boons uptime depend on whats needed, regen always taken)

    Energy management probably reduce healing number a bit.

    I took that into account. boon uptime is relevant to the situation tho since you cant pulse off all them.

    Te lazla otstra.
    nerf list

  • sokeenoppa.5384sokeenoppa.5384 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited September 12, 2018

    @cat.8975 said:

    @sokeenoppa.5384 said:
    If i recall right, tempest is still best healer (hp/sec). It isnt a good raid healer tho.

    Can it outheal the most damaging field in the DPS golem area? The field does roughly ~4k dps to a light armor target without any damage reduction.

    Ill test later

    I'll have two number 9s, a number 9 large, a number 6 with extra dip, a number 7, two number 45s, one with cheese, and a large soda.

  • Asum.4960Asum.4960 Member ✭✭✭

    Tempest, Heal Renegade and heal Scourge (if you count Barrier) are pretty crazy when it comes to healing.

    "As you know, those who you once called friends have become enemies." ~Glint

  • Sephylon.4938Sephylon.4938 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited September 17, 2018

    @Asum.4960 said:
    Tempest, Heal Renegade and heal Scourge (if you count Barrier) are pretty crazy when it comes to healing.

    Barrier doesn't count towards scholar runes so I don't count it as healing. Also it disappears, by itself, after a few seconds so you'll be back to needing a heal after that. At best I'd call it mitigation, not a heal.

    I am a giant tomato filled with love. I have come to sell you a house made out of pancakes.

  • InsaneQR.7412InsaneQR.7412 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited September 17, 2018

    @cat.8975 said:
    Druid actually has one of the lowest healing outputs of all the healing builds. The reason druid is meta is from the offensive buffs it provides (10 man might, spirits, glyph), and the utility of knockbacks/immobilizes. The optimal raid comp only has 1 healer (druid), but most groups will run 2 healers for safety, and the second would be much better off on another class for either more healing, more utility, or both.

    Traited it still comes up at the top with over 10k Heal with one skill. As a buffer it performs just better in organized groups because the offhealing it does is enough to carry.
    Its mainly burst heal though.
    Else id say Ventari-Healer is one of the strongest healers. Idk if herald or renegade though. Tempest also has high hps but is better in fractals because 10 targets etc.

  • @InsaneQR.7412 said:
    Traited it still comes up at the top with over 10k Heal with one skill. As a buffer it performs just better in organized groups because the offhealing it does is enough to carry.
    Its mainly burst heal though.
    Else id say Ventari-Healer is one of the strongest healers. Idk if herald or renegade though. Tempest also has high hps but is better in fractals because 10 targets etc.

    Honesly running double druid is a but of a waste these days, after all the nerfs. Yea it can still sustain the entire party but you wont be picking the increased healing over GoTL. This all coming from a looong time raid druid main. People just grab two of them both because its the done thing, and maybe a slight increase in DPS. If you have a soulbeast in your squad they might as well grab a spirit too!

    I recently tried out the thinking man scourge, paired with a subsquad druid. It's a beastly support. The druid was mostly camping longbow (desmina amd her horrors) so their heailing output wasn't as good as it could've been but i was able to pick everyone off the ground as easy as breathing. The respower is insane, even if it cant compete in pure healing with the top dogs.

  • InsaneQR.7412InsaneQR.7412 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @ChartFish.1308 said:

    @InsaneQR.7412 said:
    Traited it still comes up at the top with over 10k Heal with one skill. As a buffer it performs just better in organized groups because the offhealing it does is enough to carry.
    Its mainly burst heal though.
    Else id say Ventari-Healer is one of the strongest healers. Idk if herald or renegade though. Tempest also has high hps but is better in fractals because 10 targets etc.

    Honesly running double druid is a but of a waste these days, after all the nerfs. Yea it can still sustain the entire party but you wont be picking the increased healing over GoTL. This all coming from a looong time raid druid main. People just grab two of them both because its the done thing, and maybe a slight increase in DPS. If you have a soulbeast in your squad they might as well grab a spirit too!

    I recently tried out the thinking man scourge, paired with a subsquad druid. It's a beastly support. The druid was mostly camping longbow (desmina amd her horrors) so their heailing output wasn't as good as it could've been but i was able to pick everyone off the ground as easy as breathing. The respower is insane, even if it cant compete in pure healing with the top dogs.

    Yeah scourge has the biggest carry potential and huge dmg mitigation.
    Its Barrier per second isnt comparable to other healers hps but paired with a buff druid its probably a sick support comp and fantastic for pugs.
    Sadly ppl still think necro is deadweight (pun intended).

  • Knox.8962Knox.8962 Member ✭✭✭

    Scourge HP/s and Barrier/s combined is absolutely on par with other healers in terms of effective output. Barrier "heals" are almost 100% effective healing unless people are not taking any damage at all. Transfusion heals similarly to soothing mist, but thanks to barrier spam, it is smarter in who it gets applied to.

    The one big drawback is very limited targeted healing, but if you just want a healing blanket for the group, heal scourge is similar to heal tempest in overall output.

  • Robban.1256Robban.1256 Member ✭✭
    edited October 7, 2018

    @Hoodie.1045 said:
    Definitely Druid. In every single fractals and raids group I go into, there is definitely going to be at least one Druid involved. Healing engineer is only a descent substitute if your group just happens to not have a Druid.

    Druid is great for the offensive buffs, but as a healer it is weaker than scourge, tempest,heal engie, ren/herald, firebrand

    "It is impossible to live without failing at something, unless you live so cautiously that you might has well not have lived at all, in which case you have failed by default"- J.K Rowling
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  • messiah.1908messiah.1908 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Dadnir.5038 said:
    All in all, the issue isn't really hp/s, the issue is more which healer have the healing system the most appropriate for each encounter.

    For example tempest and engineer will have excellent sustain healing while they may be weaker in burst healing. On the other hand, revenant and druid will have slightly weaker sustain healing but have good burst healing capacities. Some professions will also provide damage mitigation which might help reduce the healing needed. For example, assuming that the healer grant 100% prot uptime, he will need only 70% of the healing output of a healer that don't provide prot to achieve the same result.

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:
    snip
    =2306100 per minute /60 = 38400 hps/5(1 person hps)=7700
    10 condis removed per 18sec
    75% alacrity uptime
    100% regen
    100% protection
    50% swiftness
    50% fury
    (boons uptime depend on whats needed, regen always taken)

    Energy management probably reduce healing number a bit.

    rev is the best of sustain healing and burst healing

    just with ventari and true nature you can have 3.4k hps on 1 ally (13k on 4 allies) using only heal skill
    if you need healer go with rev. for buff go with herald or druid. might stacks fury.

  • Dadnir.5038Dadnir.5038 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @messiah.1908 said:

    rev is the best of sustain healing and burst healing

    just with ventari and true nature you can have 3.4k hps on 1 ally (13k on 4 allies) using only heal skill
    if you need healer go with rev. for buff go with herald or druid. might stacks fury.

    It always depend on what you fight and your group, ventari heal skill will heal every 3 seconds, water staff elementalist auto attack will heal every attack for more than 1k (and frost bow auto attack will heal even more). That's why it's arguable to say that revenant is the "best" sustain healer. Burst, yes he is good maybe even the best but sustain, that's arguable.

    Each and every "healer" have it's strong points and it's weak points and you rarely only need "heal", the lack of needed utility more than often outweight the overhealing.

    • elementalist: good sustain (auto attack, soothing mist, regen), revive (yes it's quite good at reviving with geyser), gated heal bursts, deal damage alongside healing.
    • revenant: medium sustain (regen, short CD heal, energy gated heal), good heal burst, alacrity and ferocity buff.

    Which mean that in optimal situation an elementalist will be able to deal damage while sustain healing and rez any downed ally better than a revenant, while a revenant will tend to dish out big healing number and support via alacrity. On another hand, the elementalist have a huge downside on it's healing burst which is gated behind it's elemental elite, while the revenant might experience lack of energy forcing him on another legend and reducing it's sustain healing for a 10 seconds. This is why revenant is better at burst and elementalist better at sustain.

  • messiah.1908messiah.1908 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Dadnir.5038 said:

    @messiah.1908 said:

    rev is the best of sustain healing and burst healing

    just with ventari and true nature you can have 3.4k hps on 1 ally (13k on 4 allies) using only heal skill
    if you need healer go with rev. for buff go with herald or druid. might stacks fury.

    It always depend on what you fight and your group, ventari heal skill will heal every 3 seconds, water staff elementalist auto attack will heal every attack for more than 1k (and frost bow auto attack will heal even more). That's why it's arguable to say that revenant is the "best" sustain healer. Burst, yes he is good maybe even the best but sustain, that's arguable.

    Each and every "healer" have it's strong points and it's weak points and you rarely only need "heal", the lack of needed utility more than often outweight the overhealing.

    • elementalist: good sustain (auto attack, soothing mist, regen), revive (yes it's quite good at reviving with geyser), gated heal bursts, deal damage alongside healing.
    • revenant: medium sustain (regen, short CD heal, energy gated heal), good heal burst, alacrity and ferocity buff.

    Which mean that in optimal situation an elementalist will be able to deal damage while sustain healing and rez any downed ally better than a revenant, while a revenant will tend to dish out big healing number and support via alacrity. On another hand, the elementalist have a huge downside on it's healing burst which is gated behind it's elemental elite, while the revenant might experience lack of energy forcing him on another legend and reducing it's sustain healing for a 10 seconds. This is why revenant is better at burst and elementalist better at sustain.

    there you go
    with the last update ventari rev just using facet of nature and tablet moving can heal each ally more than 3k hps

    regen proc 950 per sec
    elevated compassion 500 hps (3 sec proc)
    facet of nature ventari 340 hps (3 sec proc)
    project tranquility 280 hps (3 sec proc)
    moving the tablet 1000 hps (3 sec proc)
    rune of water 350 hps (10 sec proc)

    total 3,420 healing per sec

    every 3 sec it will heal 6,360 (without regen)

    talking about easy sustain healing ....

  • Zenith.7301Zenith.7301 Member ✭✭✭✭

    A pointless conversation because due to the existence of 2 dodges and several blocks/immunities on several if not most classes, sustained healing requirements are marginal.

    We are in a game where before the nerfs to their DPS, condition druids were sufficient to do all raid bosses.

    And unfortunately that doesn't vary by format because in WvW and PvP it is all about burst healing, not sustained healing.

  • cat.8975cat.8975 Member ✭✭✭

    @Zenith.7301 said:
    A pointless conversation because due to the existence of 2 dodges and several blocks/immunities on several if not most classes, sustained healing requirements are marginal.

    We are in a game where before the nerfs to their DPS, condition druids were sufficient to do all raid bosses.

    And unfortunately that doesn't vary by format because in WvW and PvP it is all about burst healing, not sustained healing.

    Continuous, sustained healing still has its uses in WvW. For raids, Desmina/River of Souls can be trivialized with a strong offhealer.

    I research the game numbers and do wiki stuff sometimes. If you have any questions about how damage is calculated, feel free to ask me (easier to hit me up on reddit @ towelcat though)

  • Zenith.7301Zenith.7301 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @cat.8975 said:

    @Zenith.7301 said:
    A pointless conversation because due to the existence of 2 dodges and several blocks/immunities on several if not most classes, sustained healing requirements are marginal.

    We are in a game where before the nerfs to their DPS, condition druids were sufficient to do all raid bosses.

    And unfortunately that doesn't vary by format because in WvW and PvP it is all about burst healing, not sustained healing.

    Continuous, sustained healing still has its uses in WvW. For raids, Desmina/River of Souls can be trivialized with a strong offhealer.

    Sure, but the point is that it's not even close to being so valuable as to be desired because the game's own systems completely undermine any form of support that isn't offensive support, which is why tempest/revenant/scourge support builds far well behind druid despite massively outhealing druids (which is going to be a serious issue with druids once they address offensive buffs, alongside warrior and chronomancer).

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