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Do you want new dungeons?


Lucius.2140

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I'm making the poll in the general section because it will be visible for more people and more importantly of more groups of the player base.

Edit: Things happened and the thread went to the Fractals, Dungeons & Raids subforum:

At 20/09/18 4 hours and 15 minutes before reset: 179Yes, i want more dungeons.49% (89 votes)No, i don't want more dungeon: 7% (14 votes),Yes, only if they are of better quality than the old ones: 15%,No, we have fractals for that: 20% (36 votes).

As put when i started this thread, moving this to the "Dungeons, fractals and raids" subforum could cause a bias:Most people that played only dungeons (not fractals), play group content only a little or don't play because the dungeons are forgotten, don't have incentives to come to this subforum.Making more probable that the new voters come from the group that mainly do fractals to vote. The general forum because is not biased to a specific group that could defend a specific position.

I'm adding this explanation to my starting thread post.To a moderator: Please put this back in the general forum and thank you very much.

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You left out the "hey, it'd be cool because I like new content but I'm ok if I don't get this specific content" option. Which isn't quite "I don't care" since I do like the idea of more of them with all the design lessons ANet has learned, I do care a little, it's just not vitally important to me.

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@Haishao.6851 said:If they were to make new dungeons it would just be like raid or fractal anyway, so what's the point?Aetherpath is the last dungeon they made and it's exactly like a fractal, just a little bit longer.

Aetherblades was about 2-3 fractals in size.Also, fractals aren't linked with the story or are the reality of the present Tyria, are mist's maybe, could have been, will be and was.

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I'm a big fan of any instanced group content, so it's a thumbs up from me. There's definitely room for new paths to be added to the existing dungeons.

But...the appeal of the core dungeons lies in their simplicity. Since the Aether path there's been a pretty clear shift towards overly complicated combat and mechanics that I don't enjoy, so I'm not too optimistic about any new instanced PVE stuff.

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@Jahroots.6791 said:I'm a big fan of any instanced group content, so it's a thumbs up from me. There's definitely room for new paths to be added to the existing dungeons.

But...the appeal of the core dungeons lies in their simplicity. Since the Aether path there's been a pretty clear shift towards overly complicated combat and mechanics that I don't enjoy, so I'm not too optimistic about any new instanced PVE stuff.

Im not against the mechanics but i do agree that you could play with more flexibility in strategy in the old dungeons.If you were alone the fights were very dynamic that is a plus, the difficulty however made it necessary that players went alone or in duo for it (also add todays power creep).

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I would love to see the already existing and paid for assets put to new use. The difference between Fractals and Dungeons is that the Fractals are about special events, frozen in time in the mist, while Dungeons are the stories of the locations they take place in. It just feels strange that nothing has happened in CM after the events of LS3 for example, or that nothing has changed in Arah, 5 years after we killed Zhaitan.

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@lokh.2695 said:I would love to see the already existing and paid for assets put to new use. The difference between Fractals and Dungeons is that the Fractals are about special events, frozen in time in the mist, while Dungeons are the stories of the locations they take place in. It just feels strange that nothing has happened in CM after the events of LS3 for example, or that nothing has changed in Arah, 5 years after we killed Zhaitan.

Strange when ever anet do this people complain that its reused assets and that they should do something new instead guess they can never win.

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Fractal is Dungeons, right? If so, we have Deepstone, I hate this one so much, but its new.I cant tell the differences between the original Dungeons and Fractal. Is it the gear requirement to do high tier fractal? Thats why people want original Dungons more?

I really respect players who understand and follow GW's story. I couldnt bother to listen or read the lines while doing the story. I skipped whenever possible or looked away when unskippable. I may somedays ask my friend to summarize the story for me.

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Yes, I would love to see additional dungeons. However, I would equally enjoy simply offering a solo/duo mode for the existing dungeons so the enemies scale based on number of players. I would like to actually enjoy a dungeon, take my time instead of the constant speedrun/skip/stack demands from other players.

! Yes, I have made LFG specifying going slow and not skipping enemies. However, every time enough people join, they all ignore the party specifications I made and insist on speedrunning and skipping everything. What happens when I politely inquire as to why did they join my 'go slow/no skip' LFG if they just wanted to speed run and skip? They all make insults and vote kick me since I wasn't going to speed run/skip...and that's if they even say anything, much of the time I inquire about them skipping and they all silently vote kick me since I wasn't speedrunning. It's horrible. Dungeons are absurd to do unless you have a guild with members who agree to go slow or not skip. LFG is worthless for dungeons. Make it so I can solo from the start, or at least have it scale so I could continue on and solo the dungeon after getting booted from my own party by party thieves.

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@Omnicron.2467 said:Unless they improve the rewards for dungeons I don't see people being motivated to run them, unlike Fractals

They deliberately nerfed the rewards to discourage people from running them. You used to be able to get (IIRC) 5g per unique daily run.

Why they stopped supporting dungeons and replaced them with fractals I'll never know. It's the same thing... yet they went to significant effort to push people out of dungeons and into fracs. I don't get it.

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@Rhyse.8179 said:

@Omnicron.2467 said:Unless they improve the rewards for dungeons I don't see people being motivated to run them, unlike Fractals

They deliberately nerfed the rewards to discourage people from running them. You used to be able to get (IIRC) 5g per unique daily run.

Why they stopped supporting dungeons and replaced them with fractals I'll never know. It's the same thing... yet they went to significant effort to push people out of dungeons and into fracs. I don't get it.

The answer to that is easy..... people were farming the crap out of COF P1/P3; some even completely dedicated to nothing but that. Even with the diminishing returns, it was still outputting too much rewards that could be converted to gold (for its time effort), and eventually moved 70% of the token/gold reward into the Daily limit. The hope was people would do more varied dungeon runs.... but instead people just abandoned it and complained on the forums.

I'm not sure how much later, but the aetherblade path in Twilight Arbor seemed like an attempt to test the waters for a more repeatable reward system. Fractals being a lot shorter, and has its own built in cost gating mechanism (see AR), it eventually won out as the best format for farmable instanced content. On top of which, the Fractal rewards scale a lot better, recycles the content via tier scaling, and gives the Devs more control on the rewards flow. Consider how the dailies are per fractal, instead of completing X number of Fractals in a day? Its made to prevent focused farming on easy fractals..... though, the nature of 40 Molten boss allowed it to slip through the cracks.

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I enjoy dungeons because they are short(~5-10 min), you meet many new players and even one single good player can carry the whole group without a problem. Even though the rewards are not that great compared to other money making methods, they are simply fun with random groups. Though that's probably the reason I dislike Aether, Arah and the other longer paths...

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Going to fractals is VERY different from taking the time to go to a specific map and do a dungeon from there. It has a different feeling imo. Feeling of old school mmo.

Ever since they introduced the fractals I’ve never really liked them. There’s barely any story besides a hoooo evil asura scientist. In other mmos doing a dungeon is a way to go forward with the story. If we could have quality ones that would be so great, sadly Anet is just way too focused on fractals/raids and I don’t think they will provide that content ever again. Especially after nerfing the dungeon rewards to force people to move to fractals. That move was lame af.

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I still don't see any difference in dungeons and fractals. If I'm in a group and port to LA and get a pop up to enter fractals or if I port to Caledon Forest and get a pop up to enter TA is no difference for me.The only difference I see is that fractals have 4 tiers of difficulty.

LS is the kind of "dungeons" here in GW2 which is used to go forward with the story.

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@lokh.2695 said:I would love to see the already existing and paid for assets put to new use. The difference between Fractals and Dungeons is that the Fractals are about special events, frozen in time in the mist, while Dungeons are the stories of the locations they take place in. It just feels strange that nothing has happened in CM after the events of LS3 for example, or that nothing has changed in Arah, 5 years after we killed Zhaitan.

But your logic doesn’t make any sense. It is true that “dungeons are the stories of the location they take place in”. However, the location of the stories they take place in are always frozen in time anyway. No matter how you twist it, you can’t change Arah path because if new players come into the game in the process of defeating Zhaitan, the dungeons have to reflect on the story of Zhaitan being an ominous threat to Tyria.

In the end, the biggest mistake they did with dungeons, was to introduce us to them and yet, never force us to play the dungeon story like they could force us in GW1 to play the story missions with people.

It just feels like to me, that some players consider that dungeons have to be developed only because “dungeons is a staple of MMO”, which is quite a poor reasoning.At this point the only missing for fractal is a fractal skin armor just like there is dungeon armor.

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@"Donari.5237" said:You left out the "hey, it'd be cool because I like new content but I'm ok if I don't get this specific content" option. Which isn't quite "I don't care" since I do like the idea of more of them with all the design lessons ANet has learned, I do care a little, it's just not vitally important to me.

That's exactly what I was thinking. I'm in favour of more content, both for solo/open-world and groups, and I don't really care what they call it or where they put the entrance.

@starlinvf.1358 said:

@Omnicron.2467 said:Unless they improve the rewards for dungeons I don't see people being motivated to run them, unlike Fractals

They deliberately nerfed the rewards to discourage people from running them. You used to be able to get (IIRC) 5g per unique daily run.

Why they stopped supporting dungeons and replaced them with fractals I'll never know. It's the same thing... yet they went to significant effort to push people out of dungeons and into fracs. I don't get it.

The answer to that is easy..... people were farming the crap out of COF P1/P3; some even completely dedicated to nothing but that. Even with the diminishing returns, it was still outputting too much rewards that could be converted to gold (for its time effort), and eventually moved 70% of the token/gold reward into the Daily limit. The hope was people would do more varied dungeon runs.... but instead people just abandoned it and complained on the forums.

I'm not sure how much later, but the aetherblade path in Twilight Arbor seemed like an attempt to test the waters for a more repeatable reward system. Fractals being a lot shorter, and has its own built in cost gating mechanism (see AR), it eventually won out as the best format for farmable instanced content. On top of which, the Fractal rewards scale a lot better, recycles the content via tier scaling, and gives the Devs more control on the rewards flow. Consider how the dailies are per fractal, instead of completing X number of Fractals in a day? Its made to prevent focused farming on easy fractals..... though, the nature of 40 Molten boss allowed it to slip through the cracks.

Yeah sadly it seems a lot of the 'harcore dungeon running' crowd was actually only interested in the fastest way to make gold so as soon as dungeons weren't the fastest way, or it was more complicated that picking the most 'efficient' path and speed running it until you hit DR dungeons were dropped in favour of more profitable areas. I assume a lot of them are the people who now spend all day in Istan farming the meta event.

All the dungeons are still in the game, they're all still fully playable and still give gold and unique skins. But for whatever reason players keep talking about them as if they're broken or give literally no rewards.

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