Raids in 2k18 became farm fiesta. Remove rewards from the old wings finally. And fix it, please

I feel like raids turns into dungeons in 2018. And it became a farm fiesta. There's alot of old bosses and wings that community mastered to perfection. Even doing it lowman etc, etc. And right now its more like farming easy things to get gold and stuff, rather than looking for challengies. Alot of people skip hard things, cause there's no reason to do it. Because they just can select easier (old) bosses and wings to get rewards (gold, loot etc etc). Its because reward and progression systems in Guild Wars 2 are very different from those in other mmorpg's. Here's no gear progression. So e.g gold is main reward because of that.

I would love to see more focus on the new things. Like new raid wings and new bosses. Faster than once per year. Progression, rather than farming old bosses again and again.

That's why IMO ArenaNet should delete rewards like gold and loot from old wings. Because its very, very old content. People should do it just for achievements, and stuff like that. If they're new and still dont have it. Or if they wants to do legendary armor and things like that. But why loot? Its not new content anymore.

This thread will surely be entertaining. :popcorn:

Also I disagree. (With the whole kill off old content, because that has worked tremendously in the past already)

@Grogba.6204 said:This thread will surely be entertaining. :popcorn:

Also I disagree. (With the whole kill off old content, because that has worked tremendously in the past already)

Doing old content for achievements and legendary armor dont mean it will be dead :)

HoT raids are older with every year. players' skills are increasing. While the rewards are the same.It shouldnt work like that.

@Xar.1387 said:

@Grogba.6204 said:This thread will surely be entertaining. :popcorn:

Also I disagree. (With the whole kill off old content, because that has worked tremendously in the past already)

Yes, because everyone who wants to get those rewards has gotten them, right? because i know i havent gotten all the rewards i want yet.

And no, killing off content is bad, regardless of the reasons.

Ok longer answer:

It's clear that Raids have been a learning experience for both the players and the developers as time went on. This is very noticable in the newer wings with more intricate mechanics to both perform by the players (distance based aggro at Qadim, Largos CM making it necessary to jump off the arena) and which designs work (Evolution of Handkiter at Deimos to Messengerkiter at Dhuum to Elementalkiter at Qadim). Many people have become so confortable with W1-4 that nowadays I see more and more LFGs without huge LI/KP or any requirements at all outside of very specific cases (Xera, Deimos).

Truth is, Powercreep has certainly a lot to do with that (Scourge, Holosmith, Mirage, Deadeye) but also better balancing (Compare HoTs "2 Chrono, 2 Druid, 2 Berserker, Herald, 3 Tempest" Metacomp with todays incredible fluid composition of "2 Chrono, 1 Druid, 1Warr, 6 DPS(5 DPS+1Healer"). In return, the average skill of the playerbase certainly has improved to the point that - I at least - do not care how well someone is performing as long as the fight doesn't become a total disaster.

And since I mentioned HoT: W1-W4 are HoT Content, W5-WX are PoF Content. By removing the rewards/killing off the content you greatly reduce the value of the expansion while also making it harder for people to get into raiding because you remove the incentive for a lot of players still doing them, be it for Skins, LI or the liquid gold. Even if you are insanely good at running W1-W4 you would still make less gold per hour than farming Istan, Silverwastes and especially the Halloween Labyrinth.

This is how well-done raids works in mmorpg's. Once people master it to the perfection it dont reward people anymore. And it goes to the trash cause its not "raid" anymore. It's already worn out. Task is done - players learned it. Its over. Ppl start to avoid mechanics etc etc. Its time for community to fully focus on new bosses.

Bosses dont change - they're always the same. Their difficulty dont increase. While game changes

E.gVG - no greenGorse - no updraftEtc, etc

Rewards?SameXD

Most ppl dont understand it. But if Anet wont change it in the future. Somehow. It will work negatively on raiding community.They will just burnout sooner or later.

Well this isn't every other MMO, this is GW2.

There are still people learning the old raids and rewards are not an issue.

@Blocki.4931 said:Well this isn't every other MMO, this is GW2.

Exactly. And other mmorpg's dont have that problem at all. Cause there's gear treadmill.Just GW2 got this problem

IMO good solution for Anet is to delete rewards like loot and gold from old wings.Just leave achievements there. Cause new people should be able to do it if they want. Why not.

And focus more on the new raid wings. Release it much faster than 1 per year.

Deleting rewards from old wings wont magicaly make them produce new raids faster.

@Xar.1387 said:

@Grogba.6204 said:This thread will surely be entertaining. :popcorn:

Also I disagree. (With the whole kill off old content, because that has worked tremendously in the past already)

Yes, yes it should, that's exactly how it's supposed to be lol.Older wings become cheese for veteran raiders while the newer ones are the next challenge, there's nothing wrong in that imho.Moreover a free 2g+1 random crappy exotic (most of the times) is not that much of a reward and it should be increased instead! I mean c'mon, doing SW or Istan yields much more than raids! Does it sounds normal?

@Linken.6345 said:Deleting rewards from old wings wont magicaly make them produce new raids faster.

Yeah. But anyway its all connected.

No new wings added regularly + Still rewarding for old ones = Raids become farm fiesta

As hilarious as it would be to see old raids be taken out back and shot to make new content look better in comparison, like was done to dungeons for their sake, I'm really wondering what your stake in this is...

https://old.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/9ptwoc/raids_in_2k18_became_farm_fiesta_remove_rewards/The response on Reddit seem to be mostly the same: GW2 is not the game you are seeking, if you want planned obsolescence. What good does it do the community to reduce the rewards? What about people who just started the game today?

I would love to see more focus on the new things.How does removing older content make that happen? The vast majority of ANet's focus on the game is on adding new stuff, which is why older bugs can take forever to address. And even so, they don't have enough time to implement all the ideas that they (and we) want to.

And finally, what's wrong with people skipping stuff they don't like, once they get the idea of how its done?I'm not against ANet adjusting the ghost phases of VG: they aren't fun after the first or second time, and they take up a lot of time. However, that's got nothing to do with what people do in the rest of the instance.

No thanks.

@Xar.1387 said:

@Blocki.4931 said:Well this isn't every other MMO, this is GW2.

Why do you call it a problem though? Why shouldn't people be rewarded for still running older content? Why shouldn't it exist as an additional source for some gold? Since many raiders actually enjoy clearing doing full clears and getting the flat gold rewards every week?

Players dont do raids for gold. You can get more gold by farming silverwastes for 1 hr than you can doign a full clear of w1-4. Players do them for LI or for the fun of clearing the content.

People are still doing new raids almost as much as old ones. Only reason they are not run as much is they are considered 'harder' and therefore theres less people who have the needed skill to complete them.

Anet already addressed the issue of people farming old content for new rewards by changing LI in POF raids to LD.

While we’re at it, let’s remove rewards from HoT metas, Silverwastes, and World Bosses. Heart of Thorns and core Tyria is soooo last expansion, Path of Fire is what’s “in” right now.

Let's remove rewards from Queensdale after all everyone should be done with it by now (and the other starting zones)

What good could possibly come from removing old content? Some veteran players may not like old content, but some veteran players and new players do. Should anet remove ALL old content, and focus solely on new content, only to remove it once newer content comes out? That'll isolate a lot of players and reduce the player population.

Not only that but, if you remove what little rewards the old content gives, why would the people who have cleared the old content ever come back to it and help new players earn the various rewards, such as legendary armor? This is such a stupid idea.

@maddoctor.2738 said:Let's remove rewards from Queensdale after all everyone should be done with it by now (and the other starting zones)

Remove rewards from Palawadan! Storywise the place has been surely be reclaimed by now. ( ͡☉ ͜ʖ ͡☉)(Also all of Orr, it's 2k18 people! The Risen are culled for the most part!)

Raids should actually have MORE rewards. As it is right now even PvPing my way into ranked with a cheese build that I win 50/50 is more profitable. If anything raids have too little incentive to be played and specially replayed (one in a time CMs are already a thing like you suggest to normals, and it is considered largely to be a failure).

Dont compare raids - endgame, challenging content to the open world, please.It's a different thing.

Also as u can see I didnt wrote about deleting EVERYTHING there.Ofc there should be an option to get achievements, titles and things like that.

Look. I will ask u something. As wiki says: Raids are the "ultimate challenge".Is e.g Vale Guardian still that challenge? No. Its 2old to be a challenge anymore.IMO its not "raid" anymore. And calling it like that is kind of pathetic. And also shows the game in a bad way.New players focused on raids will simply laugh at it and go away.It shouldnt be rewarded SAME WAY as in 2k15 when people were doing it. Its almost 2019 here guys.

@"Xar.1387" said:Dont compare raids - endgame, challenging content to the open world, please.It's a different thing.

Also as u can see I didnt wrote about deleting EVERYTHING there.Ofc there should be an option to get achievements, titles and things like that.

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Look. I will ask u something. As wiki says: Raids are the "ultimate challenge". Endgame.Is e.g Vale Guardian still that challenge? No. Its 2old to be a challenge anymore.IMO its not "raid" anymore. And calling it like that is kind of pathetic. And also shows the game in a bad way.New players focused on raids will simply laugh at it and go away.It shouldnt be rewarded SAME WAY as in 2k15 when people were doing it. Its almost 2019 here guys.

Its the same comparison. If you remove rewards from older raids they WILL die off, Achievements arent enough to draw people to older content in droves. Without being able to get the ascended armor, weapons, minis, the raid currency, nobody will want to participate in them making it nearly immpossible for groups of newer players to do those raids, newer players i might who may have never raided in any game before and they WILL find those paths difficult until they learn them. So i repeat, it should stay the same. They may not be hard to people like you, but to people like me who dont run them often due to difficulty as it is in finding players to do those paths, they need those rewards and they need to stay the same.

@Dante.1763 said:

@"Xar.1387" said:Dont compare raids - endgame, challenging content to the open world, please.It's a different thing.

Also as u can see I didnt wrote about deleting EVERYTHING there.Ofc there should be an option to get achievements, titles and things like that.

---

Look. I will ask u something. As wiki says: Raids are the "ultimate challenge". Endgame.Is e.g Vale Guardian still that challenge? No. Its 2old to be a challenge anymore.IMO its not "raid" anymore. And calling it like that is kind of pathetic. And also shows the game in a bad way.New players focused on raids will simply laugh at it and go away.It shouldnt be rewarded SAME WAY as in 2k15 when people were doing it. Its almost 2019 here guys.

Do new content then? That's most important thing in raids anyway - doing new challenges.Also. How many players made Dhuum CM? Maybe when they wont farm that much, then they will find more time to progress things ;) ?And experience real raiding. Rather than farm fiesta raiding which consumes ALOT of ppl's time.

@Xar.1387 said:Do new content then?

Heart of Thorns Raids provide access to Legendary Armor. If they remove the rewards other than titles and achievements then fewer and fewer players will run the older Raids, meaning players starting the game later (or wanting to Raid later) will find it progressively harder to get into groups. This is terrible design, not everyone has Legendary Armor already.