defiant stance is to op for not being an elite — Guild Wars 2 Forums

defiant stance is to op for not being an elite

Tact.8063Tact.8063 Member ✭✭

the thing with SB is that it trury rely on this stance to heal there overlarge then other health pool but why its op?
lets copmpare to one utility stance endure pain

Take no damage from attacks. You are still susceptible to conditions and crowd control effects.

 Enduring Pain (4s): You take no damage from incoming attacks. You are still susceptible to conditions and control effects.
 Breaks stun.png Breaks Stun

Cooldown 60 second
you are still susceptible to condition damage making condition a weeakness of SB

defiant stance

Heal yourself. Absorb all incoming strikes for a period of time.

healing: 1,853 (0.4)?
Defiant Stance.png Defiant Stance (4s): All incoming attacks heal you.

cool down 30 second
NOTE -While the stance is active, incoming retaliation, condition and direct damage will heal the warrior for the full amount otherwise dealt.

THIS SKILL NOT ONLY MAKE WARRIOR TAKE NO DAMAGE FROM EVEN CONDITION IT HEAL THEM SO IF AND SB HAVE CONDITION ANJD LOW HEALTH THERE IS NO ONE STOPING THEM FROM REACHING THERE OVERLARGE HEALTH POOL
IT HEAL FOR WHOLE DAMAGE???
all of this that is better then endure pain in every way on HALF the CD
this skill make warrior invunrable to kill for 4 second only control effect work which we all know heal warr for another 2k on stun break
this skill aloan keep my SB ALIVE for to long it has CD OF 30 SECOND
to compare it we use one of gurdians skill
Litany of Wrath

Heal yourself. For a brief time, heal yourself based on a percentage of damage dealt to enemies.

 Healing.png Healing: 1,640 (0.25)?
 Litany of Wrath.png Litany of Wrath (6s): 25% of damage dealt is returned to you as healing.

this skill only heal 25% of damage dealt
so idont understand why a larger health pool get a better skill that give it invunrablty/FULL HEAL for 4 sceond and a small one does not even heal 50% of damage??

THIS IS THE ONLY PROMBLE WITH SB (and that full counter visual bug talk about in other theread)
so either cd to above 60 second (because endure pain has justified CD OF 60 second) or reduce stance by half duration

thank you for listening

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Comments

  • Blocki.4931Blocki.4931 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Yes, give a heal skill a 60 second cooldown. Fantastic idea.

    Logging out forever.

  • Tact.8063Tact.8063 Member ✭✭

    @Crinn.7864 said:
    This is not why SB is strong. Trying to pin all of SB sustain on a single skill is naïve. Defiant stance is no different than rev's glint heal.

    it is the potential to heal 30k in for second from condition that cant be remove by enemy give him effective health pool 60k hp
    my point is that it is simiar to endure pain in some case even better and have onLY 1/2 of CD

    @bigo.9037 said:
    most warriors don't even use that heal skill. also.. just stop attacking him??? it doesn't last very long.

    this is another case of git gud. I'm sorry.

    revenants have this skill too you know. why aren't you complaining about them?

    well as i stated above againt condition it is imposible to stop "attacking" and by not att for 4 second you are basicly giving it a 4 second invunrablity largest invunrable skill is of 3 second invunrablity and have large cool down what i am doing is compqareing it to other similar skill

    you have no idea how many time i have full becuse of it

    Legendary Dragon. Consume. Consume Facet of Light to heal yourself and invert all incoming strikes to healing for a short duration.

     Healing.png Healing: 1,853 (1.0)?
     Infuse Light.png Infuse Light (3s): Inverts all incoming damage to healing.
    

    yes it is similar but it is possible to catch a reve in assian legend rather then glient also it is 1 second down which actualy counts in inence pvp + reve dont really thave that much sustain and is only mid health pool

    @Blocki.4931 said:
    Yes, give a heal skill a 60 second cooldown. Fantastic idea.

    as stated above it can basicly compare to 3 second invunrablity at a cool down of 30 second most invunrablity have CD of around 60-90 (gurd , mesmer)
    altenative is to reduce stance duration

  • bigo.9037bigo.9037 Member ✭✭✭

    @Tact.8063 said:

    @Crinn.7864 said:
    This is not why SB is strong. Trying to pin all of SB sustain on a single skill is naïve. Defiant stance is no different than rev's glint heal.

    it is the potential to heal 30k in for second from condition that cant be remove by enemy give him effective health pool 60k hp
    my point is that it is simiar to endure pain in some case even better and have onLY 1/2 of CD

    @bigo.9037 said:
    most warriors don't even use that heal skill. also.. just stop attacking him??? it doesn't last very long.

    this is another case of git gud. I'm sorry.

    revenants have this skill too you know. why aren't you complaining about them?

    well as i stated above againt condition it is imposible to stop "attacking" and by not att for 4 second you are basicly giving it a 4 second invunrablity largest invunrable skill is of 3 second invunrablity and have large cool down what i am doing is compqareing it to other similar skill

    you have no idea how many time i have full becuse of it

    Legendary Dragon. Consume. Consume Facet of Light to heal yourself and invert all incoming strikes to healing for a short duration.

     Healing.png Healing: 1,853 (1.0)?
     Infuse Light.png Infuse Light (3s): Inverts all incoming damage to healing.
    

    yes it is similar but it is possible to catch a reve in assian legend rather then glient also it is 1 second down which actualy counts in inence pvp + reve dont really thave that much sustain and is only mid health pool

    @Blocki.4931 said:
    Yes, give a heal skill a 60 second cooldown. Fantastic idea.

    as stated above it can basicly compare to 3 second invunrablity at a cool down of 30 second most invunrablity have CD of around 60-90 (gurd , mesmer)
    altenative is to reduce stance duration

    so a SB using a skill to counter conditions means it's OP??

    I don't think so.

  • Tact.8063Tact.8063 Member ✭✭
    edited October 23, 2018

    @bigo.9037 said:

    @Tact.8063 said:

    @Crinn.7864 said:
    This is not why SB is strong. Trying to pin all of SB sustain on a single skill is naïve. Defiant stance is no different than rev's glint heal.

    it is the potential to heal 30k in for second from condition that cant be remove by enemy give him effective health pool 60k hp
    my point is that it is simiar to endure pain in some case even better and have onLY 1/2 of CD

    @bigo.9037 said:
    most warriors don't even use that heal skill. also.. just stop attacking him??? it doesn't last very long.

    this is another case of git gud. I'm sorry.

    revenants have this skill too you know. why aren't you complaining about them?

    well as i stated above againt condition it is imposible to stop "attacking" and by not att for 4 second you are basicly giving it a 4 second invunrablity largest invunrable skill is of 3 second invunrablity and have large cool down what i am doing is compqareing it to other similar skill

    you have no idea how many time i have full becuse of it

    Legendary Dragon. Consume. Consume Facet of Light to heal yourself and invert all incoming strikes to healing for a short duration.

     Healing.png Healing: 1,853 (1.0)?
     Infuse Light.png Infuse Light (3s): Inverts all incoming damage to healing.
    

    yes it is similar but it is possible to catch a reve in assian legend rather then glient also it is 1 second down which actualy counts in inence pvp + reve dont really thave that much sustain and is only mid health pool

    @Blocki.4931 said:
    Yes, give a heal skill a 60 second cooldown. Fantastic idea.

    as stated above it can basicly compare to 3 second invunrablity at a cool down of 30 second most invunrablity have CD of around 60-90 (gurd , mesmer)
    altenative is to reduce stance duration

    so a SB using a skill to counter conditions means it's OP??

    I don't think so.

    @bigo.9037 said:

    @Tact.8063 said:

    @Crinn.7864 said:
    This is not why SB is strong. Trying to pin all of SB sustain on a single skill is naïve. Defiant stance is no different than rev's glint heal.

    it is the potential to heal 30k in for second from condition that cant be remove by enemy give him effective health pool 60k hp
    my point is that it is simiar to endure pain in some case even better and have onLY 1/2 of CD

    @bigo.9037 said:
    most warriors don't even use that heal skill. also.. just stop attacking him??? it doesn't last very long.

    this is another case of git gud. I'm sorry.

    revenants have this skill too you know. why aren't you complaining about them?

    well as i stated above againt condition it is imposible to stop "attacking" and by not att for 4 second you are basicly giving it a 4 second invunrablity largest invunrable skill is of 3 second invunrablity and have large cool down what i am doing is compqareing it to other similar skill

    you have no idea how many time i have full becuse of it

    Legendary Dragon. Consume. Consume Facet of Light to heal yourself and invert all incoming strikes to healing for a short duration.

     Healing.png Healing: 1,853 (1.0)?
     Infuse Light.png Infuse Light (3s): Inverts all incoming damage to healing.
    

    yes it is similar but it is possible to catch a reve in assian legend rather then glient also it is 1 second down which actualy counts in inence pvp + reve dont really thave that much sustain and is only mid health pool

    @Blocki.4931 said:
    Yes, give a heal skill a 60 second cooldown. Fantastic idea.

    as stated above it can basicly compare to 3 second invunrablity at a cool down of 30 second most invunrablity have CD of around 60-90 (gurd , mesmer)
    altenative is to reduce stance duration

    so a SB using a skill to counter conditions means it's OP??

    I don't think so.

    no it means a heal of 30k and no heal skill heal that much in any case or situation

  • bigo.9037bigo.9037 Member ✭✭✭

    @Tact.8063 said:

    @bigo.9037 said:

    @Tact.8063 said:

    @Crinn.7864 said:
    This is not why SB is strong. Trying to pin all of SB sustain on a single skill is naïve. Defiant stance is no different than rev's glint heal.

    it is the potential to heal 30k in for second from condition that cant be remove by enemy give him effective health pool 60k hp
    my point is that it is simiar to endure pain in some case even better and have onLY 1/2 of CD

    @bigo.9037 said:
    most warriors don't even use that heal skill. also.. just stop attacking him??? it doesn't last very long.

    this is another case of git gud. I'm sorry.

    revenants have this skill too you know. why aren't you complaining about them?

    well as i stated above againt condition it is imposible to stop "attacking" and by not att for 4 second you are basicly giving it a 4 second invunrablity largest invunrable skill is of 3 second invunrablity and have large cool down what i am doing is compqareing it to other similar skill

    you have no idea how many time i have full becuse of it

    Legendary Dragon. Consume. Consume Facet of Light to heal yourself and invert all incoming strikes to healing for a short duration.

     Healing.png Healing: 1,853 (1.0)?
     Infuse Light.png Infuse Light (3s): Inverts all incoming damage to healing.
    

    yes it is similar but it is possible to catch a reve in assian legend rather then glient also it is 1 second down which actualy counts in inence pvp + reve dont really thave that much sustain and is only mid health pool

    @Blocki.4931 said:
    Yes, give a heal skill a 60 second cooldown. Fantastic idea.

    as stated above it can basicly compare to 3 second invunrablity at a cool down of 30 second most invunrablity have CD of around 60-90 (gurd , mesmer)
    altenative is to reduce stance duration

    so a SB using a skill to counter conditions means it's OP??

    I don't think so.

    @bigo.9037 said:

    @Tact.8063 said:

    @Crinn.7864 said:
    This is not why SB is strong. Trying to pin all of SB sustain on a single skill is naïve. Defiant stance is no different than rev's glint heal.

    it is the potential to heal 30k in for second from condition that cant be remove by enemy give him effective health pool 60k hp
    my point is that it is simiar to endure pain in some case even better and have onLY 1/2 of CD

    @bigo.9037 said:
    most warriors don't even use that heal skill. also.. just stop attacking him??? it doesn't last very long.

    this is another case of git gud. I'm sorry.

    revenants have this skill too you know. why aren't you complaining about them?

    well as i stated above againt condition it is imposible to stop "attacking" and by not att for 4 second you are basicly giving it a 4 second invunrablity largest invunrable skill is of 3 second invunrablity and have large cool down what i am doing is compqareing it to other similar skill

    you have no idea how many time i have full becuse of it

    Legendary Dragon. Consume. Consume Facet of Light to heal yourself and invert all incoming strikes to healing for a short duration.

     Healing.png Healing: 1,853 (1.0)?
     Infuse Light.png Infuse Light (3s): Inverts all incoming damage to healing.
    

    yes it is similar but it is possible to catch a reve in assian legend rather then glient also it is 1 second down which actualy counts in inence pvp + reve dont really thave that much sustain and is only mid health pool

    @Blocki.4931 said:
    Yes, give a heal skill a 60 second cooldown. Fantastic idea.

    as stated above it can basicly compare to 3 second invunrablity at a cool down of 30 second most invunrablity have CD of around 60-90 (gurd , mesmer)
    altenative is to reduce stance duration

    so a SB using a skill to counter conditions means it's OP??

    I don't think so.

    no it means a heal of 30k and no heal skill heal that much in any case or situation

    after he uses his heal, condi bomb him.

  • Crinn.7864Crinn.7864 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Tact.8063 said:

    @Crinn.7864 said:
    This is not why SB is strong. Trying to pin all of SB sustain on a single skill is naïve. Defiant stance is no different than rev's glint heal.

    it is the potential to heal 30k in for second from condition that cant be remove by enemy give him effective health pool 60k hp
    my point is that it is simiar to endure pain in some case even better and have onLY 1/2 of C

    For defiant stance to heal for 30k from conditions the warrior would have to be taking 7.5k damage per second over the duration. That doesn't happen. Scourge tops out at 3k per sec under optimal circumstances. Moreover if a warrior was taking 7.5k per sec he would evaporate the moment defiance ended.

    Also endure pain has a 30 second cooldown in PvP. I don't know where you are getting that defiance has half the cooldown of endure pain.

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  • Daishi.6027Daishi.6027 Member ✭✭✭
    edited October 23, 2018

    Well if you can do 30k worth of ticks and you think he has this heal, either bait it out then apply it. Or bomb him twice because most classes burst or condi bomb earlier than 30 second intervals.

    War’s passive heal and sustain is much more of a problem, than this stance which has a TON of counterplay. In all cases if you fail to kill your opponents technique you have failed 1/3 of your criteria to conquer them.

  • this is not WvW forum mate

  • tinyreborn.1938tinyreborn.1938 Member ✭✭✭
    edited October 23, 2018

    @Toron.4856 said:
    You are the first person i see complaining about this skill

    And i yet have to see someone actually use this skill in pvp...

    Boyce meme'd with this month ago? Worst thing this apes always heal him to full each time he use it.... :d

  • defiant stance is trash and gets countered by a single weapon stow dude.

  • Pterikdactyl.7630Pterikdactyl.7630 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Is this even used in sPvP? I only ever see the kamikaze bubblers use it in WvW.

    Anyways, this skill has a distinct auditory cue as well as a very noticeable blue icon on the warrior's effect bar. The skill is not OP whatsoever. Infuse Light is better because A) Revs have access to a second heal (which is admittedly pretty weak for Shiro) and B) It can be cast instantly as long as you have the facet active, which means it can be used while CC'd and while simultaneously using other skills.

  • I didn't even know the name of that heal. It's not even worth taken, I don't understand why anyone would complain about that.

  • DanAlcedo.3281DanAlcedo.3281 Member ✭✭✭

    Someone complains about D Stance? Well thats a first.

  • Noha.3749Noha.3749 Member ✭✭✭

    Heralds got the same thing except it lasts 3 seconds and not 4.

    I guess OP faced a "tank" SB and found it too frustrating to beat. I know the feel, i find SB metabuilds to be annoying enough. Endure Pain and lesser endure pain along with block and full counter is enough defense to make you throw your desk out the window :/

    Just dont fight a warrior 1v1, they are made to be way durable. They have issues of their own with landing their damage on alot of other metapicks, so i guess its kinda fair.
    I rarely see Warriors racking up "kills" on their own.

    If you wanna beat Warriors so badly i suggest you play:
    Soulbeast, Theif(any spec), Shiro revenant, Mesmer (any spec), Holosmith.

    So basically any profession that is fast, slipperly and bursty that doesnt require too much "setup" for their damage or are locked behind long CDs.

  • prohint for the OP that he didn't consider in his post at all:
    poison condition
    -33% heal effectiveness

  • sephiroth.4217sephiroth.4217 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited October 24, 2018

    @milego.4830 said:
    I didn't even know the name of that heal. It's not even worth taken, I don't understand why anyone would complain about that.

    Because most people wouldnt complain about themselves.....

    He could have stoppped attacking at anytime but decided to throw his burst down instead.

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  • BeLZedaR.4790BeLZedaR.4790 Member ✭✭✭

    This needs to be relocated to WvW forum

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    Make condi rev great again!
    Say no to braindead high reward builds

  • ChartFish.1308ChartFish.1308 Member ✭✭✭
    edited October 24, 2018

    Well you see litany of wrath is 25% of your damage done in healing because 1. You can deal massive amounts of damage and a 100% would be almost certanly a fullheal on use. And 2. You can control it to a certain extent, it's not dependent on other people to work

    MEANWHILE DEFIANT STANCE is 100% dependent on your enemy attacking you. Easiest counter? Just stop. Stow your weapons. Do a /dance. Laff as your enemy gets no value out of their heal. You say conditions are unavoidable healing, but conditions only have such long a duration. You have 3sec to prepare a burst.

  • Is the op from the movie Clueless?

  • Healing while attacking is normal. If we stay on warrior he also has signet of healing or adrenal health. A basic boon is regen and we got much more.

    If you mean healing by getting attacked there got rev a similar one and on lidle different aspect got the guard healed by blocking with aegis.

    At all we coud also say rangers heal is op, cause he can dodge and attack while get healed or something like that. The main problem is maybe the overload on effects.

    Btw even if we talk about the potential to ignore dmg by condis he still gets affected all other effects like chill. On that case we have stronger options on most classes, at least warrior is one of the most condi weak classes, esp if you can corrupt boons.

    But it didn't change his rolle as duellist, cause he still can do more mistakes then other classes, that can counter him or duell onpoint.

  • Yeah this is the same for Revenants heal... It doesn't always work. So in one case, all damage is stopped no matter what. In the other case I might get healed, but if someone realizes the tell quickly, I don't.... They can kite for a few seconds, then kill me...

    It's great in specific situations, just not all the time. And the classes are so different, there are far more factors determining what is powerful in which situation.

  • Trevor Boyer.6524Trevor Boyer.6524 Member ✭✭✭✭

    "Heal when getting hit" and "Heal for damage dealt" will naturally over-perform in a very high DPS meta.

    Just be thankful Frenzy had "take double damage on use" removed a long time ago. That would have made Defiant OP.

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  • As others have said, defiant stance is still far worse than healing sig in pvp. WvW zergs maybe not, but that isn't where this was posted.

  • Defiant Stance is Overpowered

    XD I needed a laugh today

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    [Plays every class]
    [Every PvP game has bad balance because every PvP game has bad players.]

  • How is it worse than healing signet? Just use it in a group fight and all you "stop attacking yeller arguments" are busted. Also hard hitters heal you more with one hit than healing signets effects

  • @Bazsi.2734 said:
    I agree, this skill really needs nerf. Right now its so OP that absolutely noone uses it apart from newbies and trolls, this really needs to be toned down. I'd say 90 second cooldown, 0.5 second duration, 2 second casting time and you take damage instead of healing from it. BALANCE!

    Its so OP that every warrior agreed that it would be unfair to use it and signed a pact to never ever use it.

  • Hitman.5829Hitman.5829 Member ✭✭✭✭

    hahaha I once fought a warrior using defiant stance in WvW. All I had to do was stop attacking him and he was only heal by 1800.
    Once in a while I accidental hit him 1 or 2 times and heal him for about 3000, but the green numbers are so obvious!

    I do the same thing with revenants, I sometimes attack them full damage when they have their healing skill active so i can have more fun fighting them (I only do this against bad players and backpedalers hehehe)

    The OP has a L2P issue.

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  • Dadnir.5038Dadnir.5038 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Defiant stance is only good in optimal situations. Most of the time you'll favor another heal for more flexibility and flexibility can be vital in sPvP.
    That said, on paper it's a very good skill like a lot of skills that are seldom used in this game.

  • mortrialus.3062mortrialus.3062 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 1, 2018

    @Blocki.4931 said:
    Yes, give a heal skill a 60 second cooldown. Fantastic idea.

    "Something about your comment, and imagining your avatar saying it was really amusing to me.

  • idolin.2831idolin.2831 Member ✭✭✭

    Why are we digging this thread again? Everyone agrees OP has a L2P problem and that's it.

  • Ovark.2514Ovark.2514 Member ✭✭✭

    5 secs of invuln is a problem. FBF any invuln is a problem.

  • Hitman.5829Hitman.5829 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Ovark.2514 said:
    5 secs of invuln is a problem. FBF any invuln is a problem.

    Great Scotts, vulnerable?
    This is heavy doc!
    Just stop attacking him during those 5 seconds and he is only going to be heal by a lousy 1800 health. Then you can resume with your attacks and finish him with ease.

    Charr Warrior Master Race!
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  • apharma.3741apharma.3741 Member ✭✭✭✭

    What is this 2013 again where people are new to the game and only just discovering skills that are largely easy to play around?

    I stand with Mo.

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