To revive or not to revive... — Guild Wars 2 Forums

To revive or not to revive...

Batel.9206Batel.9206 Member ✭✭✭

...that is sort of the question.

Scenario: I and a teammate are fighting a tough opponent who knows his class like the back of his hand and can easily handle a 2v1 situation. Teammate goes down, I'm still at a decent amount of health (but running out of endurance and most of my utilities are on cooldown), and the opponent is at less than 10% health. I'm pretty sure I can kill him if I throw everything I've got at him and then finish him off in the downstate, but if and only if I work at it, because this guy can kill me in two seconds flat if I lose concentration or fumble a keybind (which happens pretty often because I'm still terrible at PVP). I'm backed into a corner, so I can't just run away, recover health, and then run back. Teammate yells at me to stop shooting him and revive [teammate].

So the question is, what should I do in situations like that? Continue to try and kill the opponent? Or ignore the opponent and try to revive my teammate? Is it a case-by-case scenario?

(As for the outcome of that particular incident...I hesitated, trying to see if I could even get to my teammate without being instantly killed. Predictably, in the span of my split-second hesitation, I got steamrolled into the ground in a storm of multicolored pyrotechnics, and the opponent merrily strolled off, leaving two dead enemies and a captured point for his team. We narrowly lost the game...I'm pretty sure that was my fault. :( Sorry, teammates. That one's on me.)

fear not this night
you will not go astray

Comments

  • Alatar.7364Alatar.7364 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited November 5, 2018

    Depends if you have some Rez-traits.
    But less than 10% HP? Ye, definitely murder it first.

    ~ I Aear cân ven na mar

  • Falan.1839Falan.1839 Member ✭✭✭
    edited November 5, 2018

    In this high dps meta the answer is usually "Don't", unless you have dedicated rez abilities like Mercy Signet, Blood Nec, Scrapper, Druid with rez trait etc. In a situation where the enemy is low and your teammate still has a decent amount of downed hp you should almost always down the enemy first and then rez. Even if you dont get a kill right away he might be forced to disengage and you get a safer rez that way in the end. Obviously the whole thing is situational and you need to develop a feeling for those situations. Mistakes like those outlined are one of the main reasons why bad players still manage to lose outnumbering at times. It shouldn't happen in any situation. Also it obviously depends on what you are fighting. If you face a Trama War dishing out 8-10k with Arcing Slice and Final Thrust, or a holo with constant cleave and ccs it's almost never wise to hard rez while he's still up, while the situation is different let's say against a Weaver.

    As a rule of thumb I'd say if you are not sure you can a) get the rez or b) fail the rez attempt without losing signicant amount of health and/or cooldowns, then don't. Rather counterpressure the opponents' cleave or stomp attempt and then get a kill yourself - obviously only after your teammate died, in case he is beyond saving.

    Falásya / Caissech

  • MyPuppy.8970MyPuppy.8970 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited November 5, 2018

    Same as above. Without dedicated rez and support ability, it is safer to pressure low hp enemy than risking a double downstate.

    Edit: it's a teamgame, the guy who went down first is also responsible for not disengaging in time.

  • Depends, if your downed friend has downstate pressure such as Necro or thief, I'd say res. Otherwise go for the kill.

    ~ God Tier Guardian

  • Airdive.2613Airdive.2613 Member ✭✭✭

    My two copper:

    • If the node is yours, go for the down, then revive your teammate;
    • if the node is enemy's, go for the kill;
    • if the node is neutral or you are fighting off-node, disengage.
  • Taygus.4571Taygus.4571 Member ✭✭✭

    dont revive.. omg I hate when someone stops killing the enemy to revive me..worse when the enemy player is downed.. and they revive me first when it would be quicker to finish them off

  • Alatar.7364Alatar.7364 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited November 5, 2018

    @Airdive.2613 said:
    My two copper:

    • If the node is yours, go for the down, then revive your teammate;
    • if the node is enemy's, go for the kill;
    • if the node is neutral or you are fighting off-node, disengage.

    I am sorry but what does a node status have to do with the possibility to Kill or Revive?
    Staying alive is always more important than the node with the one and only exception when you need it to keep ticking in extremely rare scenarios such as 499 vs 494 (heavily dependant on other nodes status)

    ~ I Aear cân ven na mar

  • Crab Fear.1624Crab Fear.1624 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Forget reviving, they need to introduce mercy kill :

    • cast time 1/2 second, ally immediately dies, nearby foes are weakened and blinded with tears for 3 seconds due to your manliness
  • Airdive.2613Airdive.2613 Member ✭✭✭

    @Alatar.7364 said:

    @Airdive.2613 said:
    My two copper:

    • If the node is yours, go for the down, then revive your teammate;
    • if the node is enemy's, go for the kill;
    • if the node is neutral or you are fighting off-node, disengage.

    I am sorry but what does a node status have to do with the possibility to Kill or Revive?
    Staying alive is always more important than the node with the one and only exception when you need it to keep ticking in extremely rare scenarios such as 499 vs 494 (heavily dependant on other nodes status)

    Your node: you want to make your enemy waste as much time as possible, and that is achieved by letting them bleed.
    Enemy node: you want to try and kill the enemy or at least to try and waste their time going down right on the node, while if you try to run away the enemy simply follows you so you're very likely to go down off-node anyway.
    Neutral node: by disengaging you force your enemy to choose between chasing you and capturing the node, thus the situation has the chance of going your way.

  • Alatar.7364Alatar.7364 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited November 5, 2018

    @Airdive.2613 said:

    @Alatar.7364 said:

    @Airdive.2613 said:
    My two copper:

    • If the node is yours, go for the down, then revive your teammate;
    • if the node is enemy's, go for the kill;
    • if the node is neutral or you are fighting off-node, disengage.

    I am sorry but what does a node status have to do with the possibility to Kill or Revive?
    Staying alive is always more important than the node with the one and only exception when you need it to keep ticking in extremely rare scenarios such as 499 vs 494 (heavily dependant on other nodes status)

    Your node: you want to make your enemy waste as much time as possible, and that is achieved by letting them bleed.
    Enemy node: you want to try and kill the enemy or at least to try and waste their time going down right on the node, while if you try to run away the enemy simply follows you so you're very likely to go down off-node anyway.
    Neutral node: by disengaging you force your enemy to choose between chasing you and capturing the node, thus the situation has the chance of going your way.

    We are talking about Rezzing team-mates here. Not about how to fight enemy in Conquest mode.

    ~ I Aear cân ven na mar

  • Airdive.2613Airdive.2613 Member ✭✭✭

    @Alatar.7364 said:

    @Airdive.2613 said:

    @Alatar.7364 said:

    @Airdive.2613 said:
    My two copper:

    • If the node is yours, go for the down, then revive your teammate;
    • if the node is enemy's, go for the kill;
    • if the node is neutral or you are fighting off-node, disengage.

    I am sorry but what does a node status have to do with the possibility to Kill or Revive?
    Staying alive is always more important than the node with the one and only exception when you need it to keep ticking in extremely rare scenarios such as 499 vs 494 (heavily dependant on other nodes status)

    Your node: you want to make your enemy waste as much time as possible, and that is achieved by letting them bleed.
    Enemy node: you want to try and kill the enemy or at least to try and waste their time going down right on the node, while if you try to run away the enemy simply follows you so you're very likely to go down off-node anyway.
    Neutral node: by disengaging you force your enemy to choose between chasing you and capturing the node, thus the situation has the chance of going your way.

    We are talking about Rezzing team-mates here. Not about how to fight enemy in Conquest mode.

    And I stated that I would revive my teammate once I've downed the enemy on my own node (to add: as well as on any node if my enemy is about to rally), while I would prefer to fight or retreat (meaning, not revive) in the general case of enemy and neutral node, respectively.

  • MyPuppy.8970MyPuppy.8970 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Crab Fear.1624 said:
    Forget reviving, they need to introduce mercy kill :

    • cast time 1/2 second, ally immediately dies, nearby foes are weakened and blinded with tears for 3 seconds due to your manliness

    You forgot to make it unblockable and undodgeable. It should also be a stun.

  • Crab Fear.1624Crab Fear.1624 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @MyPuppy.8970 said:

    @Crab Fear.1624 said:
    Forget reviving, they need to introduce mercy kill :

    • cast time 1/2 second, ally immediately dies, nearby foes are weakened and blinded with tears for 3 seconds due to your manliness

    You forgot to make it unblockable and undodgeable. It should also be a stun.

    For reference on how it should play out.

  • Alatar.7364Alatar.7364 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Airdive.2613 said:

    @Alatar.7364 said:

    @Airdive.2613 said:

    @Alatar.7364 said:

    @Airdive.2613 said:
    My two copper:

    • If the node is yours, go for the down, then revive your teammate;
    • if the node is enemy's, go for the kill;
    • if the node is neutral or you are fighting off-node, disengage.

    I am sorry but what does a node status have to do with the possibility to Kill or Revive?
    Staying alive is always more important than the node with the one and only exception when you need it to keep ticking in extremely rare scenarios such as 499 vs 494 (heavily dependant on other nodes status)

    Your node: you want to make your enemy waste as much time as possible, and that is achieved by letting them bleed.
    Enemy node: you want to try and kill the enemy or at least to try and waste their time going down right on the node, while if you try to run away the enemy simply follows you so you're very likely to go down off-node anyway.
    Neutral node: by disengaging you force your enemy to choose between chasing you and capturing the node, thus the situation has the chance of going your way.

    We are talking about Rezzing team-mates here. Not about how to fight enemy in Conquest mode.

    And I stated that I would revive my teammate once I've downed the enemy on my own node (to add: as well as on any node if my enemy is about to rally), while I would prefer to fight or retreat (meaning, not revive) in the general case of enemy and neutral node, respectively.

    Wait, I am still not following this explanation.
    So, your explanation suggests that you would fight an enemy in any node, but then you say you'd also retreat if it was enemy or neutral. What I don't follow is why would you retreat and leave your teammate if the enemy, just as OP says, has 10% HP?
    That's a free kill and a free node while you could have easily down him, if your teammate is down and enemy 10% HP then there is absolutely no node science included, just get the enemy.

    ~ I Aear cân ven na mar

  • You really have 3 options:

    • Continue offensive pressure and kill ASAP, then res your team-mate. Do this if your team-mate is around 50% health or more.
    • Keep offensive pressure, but don't down the enemy until team-mate is full-dead. You do this if your team-mate is at like 20% health or below. You don't want to down the guy just as your team-mate dies and you give him a free rally and bunch of health back.
    • You disengage if you are going to die yourself. No reason to give them a double-win.

    It is probably not a great choice to go for a res unless you know they are completely out of CD's and you aren't going to be killed. If they have a burst or interrupt, they can completely demolish you while you try to res, so its not worth it without a res utility.

  • Trevor Boyer.6524Trevor Boyer.6524 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited November 6, 2018

    All of these explanations are overly complex. Ok let's keep this simple:

    Dying in conquest is the worst thing you can do. It is always a good idea to revive a team mate, but only if you know that you can do it successfully. If it looks like you would be downed in the process of attempting the revive, just get out and don't die yourself. It is better to let 1 player die, than to have 2 players die, or have a team wipe because everyone sat and tried to revive in a cleave trap.

    If you're trying to make the decision of "Should I revive or kill the 10% opponent to rally?" It all depends on the situation. A good dose of common sense will help resolve such questions when they arise.

    The 10 Commandments Of Conquest
    Abide by the commandments or God shalt deliver unto thee a packet of salt as often as thou did break them
    -> https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/38081/the-10-commandments-of-conquest#1

  • Batel.9206Batel.9206 Member ✭✭✭

    You guys are amazing. :grin: Can't thank you enough for all the advice!! I'll remember it in the future.

    Once again, thank you all! :heart:

    fear not this night
    you will not go astray

  • Hex.2579Hex.2579 Member ✭✭✭
    edited November 6, 2018

    in your case, i would throw everything at him since he's almost dead. just need the right burst or some condis to tick in and he should find himself downed since <10% hp.
    then when enemy is down, rub your teammate just a little bit so he won't bleed to death at this point (but don't full rez), turn around to finish the enemy. that way you can both properly rez a teammate without compromising yourself, while stomping the enemy. when you have everything on cd, better play safe than sorry. your mate can yell all he wants but as long as you get the rez, it's all good.
    it sounds like the enemy counters you hard as you mention he could kill you in 2s. but if he downs while being far away from your teammate then you don't have to rub your teammate at all. he's likely not going to bleed out from enemy's downstate skills.
    so it'll be best to kite away forcing the enemy to chase you if he's blood thirsty. this way you would leave your teammate to self rez or at least not bleed himself to oblivion. while you could buy sometime for off cd, and it's easier to stomp enemy once you down him. then come back for your teammate.
    unless you're playing support and/or have rezzing traits that will boost the rezzing uptime, or still have stability, invulnerable, or block, then it's a suicide sitting down to rez while everything is on cd and enemy can 1 shot you.

    it's really a case by case situation.
    i usually do something rather than be hesitant because i think it's very bad. if it's your fault, you own it and you learn from it. sometimes i do make the same mistake a few times, but then you just grow out of it and know what to do when the same scenario presents itself.
    but if i do nothing, i'm likely getting my teammate killed, may just get myself killed being distracted and thinking about what to do. it hurts the team morale a lot after that especially when you have a good, big chance to provide a rez but you didn't.
    in any case, i hope he wasn't salty to you or the rest of the teammates xD

    edit: weird format. whelps.

  • ProtoGunner.4953ProtoGunner.4953 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited November 6, 2018

    Always all in and kill the opponent. 10% HP is like nothing. As soon as the enemy is down, your teammate is rezzed (if he used attacks on him).

  • MikeL.8260MikeL.8260 Member ✭✭✭
    edited November 6, 2018

    @ProtoGunner.4953 said:
    Always all in and kill the opponent. 10% HP is like nothing. As soon as the enemy is down, your teammate is rezzed (if he used attacks on him).

    That is very wrong 10% is A LOT of hp especially when you are playing against someone that can 1v2 you like the Opener said. I've turned duels around with less than 5% hp.

  • Kumouta.4985Kumouta.4985 Member ✭✭✭

    Focus on killing but rez your teammate a little so they don't bleed out. Too many times have i rallied opponents by bleeding out cuz my teammate didn't bother to do so.

  • I occasionally drop in a partial res to prevent cleave or bleed out if it can be helped there's nothing worse than your downed enemy rallying in the last tenth of a second of your stomp -_-

    Sparkr's Wonderful World of Engineering - https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCEONFRaJV2u2f12ytXEir9A

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