Why dont people buy expansions?

I have played most of the big name MMOs going back to my Ultima Online days in the late 90s. So why is this literally like the only game where people just dont buy expansions? I have even seen some absurd forum posts accusing the game of being pay2win since most Elite Specs are stronger than their Cores.

@Dabrixmgp.4758 said:So why is this literally like the only game where people just dont buy expansions?

How do you know people don't buy the expansions?

@maddoctor.2738 said:

@Dabrixmgp.4758 said:So why is this literally like the only game where people just dont buy expansions?

proly the obvious signs like the fact metabattle takes the time to make guides for core builds? Or when people request core builds and state they dont own any expansions. Or when I join HP trains in HoT and people arent using mounts. Or leveling new alts and seeing other people leveling but they dont use mounts.

I was unaware that 'literally everyone' that played/plays other games bought every expansion.
I've only bought every expansion for Guild Wars and Guild Wars 2.
I'm odd.

This is not the only game where some dont buy the expansions.

I think the static level cap is a major factor.

For every game, there are people who haven't bought the expansions yet, sometimes for quite a long time. For most games, this however means they aren't max level yet, or are still doing stuff at the old max that aren't endgame any more.

For GW2, all of that stuff is still endgame - HoT metas, WBs, SW farming, etc. The fact that these remain available even without buying the latest expansion have two effects:1) People who for some reason can't buy it yet still participate in parts of the end game, thus wanting guidance regarding builds.2) Some players don't feel as motivated to get the expansion, at least not as soon, asbthry can still participate in endgame activities.

Edit: Just to be clear, I heartily approve of the static level cap. I don't find any of the things I note above to be problems.

Go into PVP and nearly everyone uses an elite spec

There are people who are core (core Guard/Thief) but most of these have bought expansions--it's just those core builds are very strong at the moment.

God, I detest it when people trot out the word "literally" when they have no real point in using it other than emphasis. It makes me just ignore the rest of the post.

@Dabrixmgp.4758 said:

@maddoctor.2738 said:

@Dabrixmgp.4758 said:So why is this literally like the only game where people just dont buy expansions?

Some people have f2p accounts, since the limitations are pretty lax. You can reach max level and play all non-expansion content, so it makes sense that there's some demand for core build guides. Also, before PoF, some people who did own HoT chose to play core builds if they disliked the one elite spec their class got, or if that spec had worse dps than core (e.g. druid). There are also returning players who might choose to not make another purchase before catching up with older content.

But I do think you are severely underestimating the number of people who own both expansions.

If I was buying GW2 today the only reason I'd get the expansions right away is because it's hard to find the core game on it's own and it's roughly the same price (the core game might even be more expensive right now, since there's a sale going on). If I'm buying a game I want to play all of it in order, not skip to the latest bit, so it would be weeks or months before I'd be on to expansion content, and if I have the option I'd prefer to space the purchases out and not buy more of the game until I know I'm actually going to play it enough to want extra content...unless of course it's cheaper to get it all together.

And this is definitely not the only game where people don't all buy the expansions as they're released. I see much the same things on the Elder Scrolls Online forum...not helped by the fact that a year after releasing their first expansion and making a huge fuss about how it wasn't DLC and therefore couldn't possibly be included in the subscription (which gives access to all the DLC) they released a second expansion and 'downgraded' the first to DLC...so now a lot of subscribers have concluded that if they simply wait a year they'll get the expansions without paying more than they already are.

It used to happen in GW1 and in Ultima Online too - people would ask for advice on the best place to find something or level a skill and get sent to an expansion map, then say they didn't have it. I started playing UO not long after the first expansion was released and that map was always noticeably emptier than the main one, even in busy areas.

Some games do make it quite impractical to keep playing without the latest expansion, and I've heard that there's some MMOs where you literally can't log in without it, although no one's ever named an example, but even though so far I've always pre-purchased GW2 expansions I much prefer feeling like it's my choice whether I get them or not.

@Dabrixmgp.4758 said:Or when I join HP trains in HoT and people arent using mounts.

If they are in HoT, they bought an expansion.

@Dabrixmgp.4758 said:

@maddoctor.2738 said:

@Dabrixmgp.4758 said:So why is this literally like the only game where people just dont buy expansions?

Why does not having a mount for HoT HP trains or leveling have to mean you don't have the expansions? Maybe some do but choose not to use them. After all you didn't have them prior to PoF anyway. In fact, the really good commanders don't even require mounts for those trains.

My alt account is a f2p account and has no mounts or gliding. Doesn't mean I don't have the expansions. I do, just on my main account. And if it's a new player leveling without mounts have you considered that maybe people don't want to go out of order, as far as story goes, to get mounts just to "make leveling easier?" If I just started playing the game I wouldn't even bother buying the expansions until I had a toon ready to move onto them, and then it'd be in order, which means no mounts til I actually got to PoF.

Sorry, but I think you're just assuming too much.

@Dabrixmgp.4758 said:I have played most of the big name MMOs going back to my Ultima Online days in the late 90s. So why is this literally like the only game where people just dont buy expansions? I have even seen some absurd forum posts accusing the game of being pay2win since most Elite Specs are stronger than their Cores.

Well to be honest elite specs are stronger than their core, despite anet Stating they didnt want them to be. They wanted them to be alternate ways to play. In some cases its the only way to play because the core class got nerfed to make the elite spec seem more attractive, so if you are using a broad definition of pay to win i agree with that.

@Dante.1763 said:

@Dabrixmgp.4758 said:I have played most of the big name MMOs going back to my Ultima Online days in the late 90s. So why is this literally like the only game where people just dont buy expansions? I have even seen some absurd forum posts accusing the game of being pay2win since most Elite Specs are stronger than their Cores.

its a biit hard choice to call it a pay to win as all you need to do is buy the expacs if you need them..and thats it

That is not how i would personally define p2w, at all and believe me, I have seen some insane p2w mmo business sytem before.

@TatsuyaHiroki.7412 said:

@Dante.1763 said:

@"Dabrixmgp.4758" said:I have played most of the big name MMOs going back to my Ultima Online days in the late 90s. So why is this literally like the only game where people just dont buy expansions? I have even seen some absurd forum posts accusing the game of being pay2win since most Elite Specs are stronger than their Cores.

Hence why i said "Broad Definition of Pay to Win". I played WoT for years, got really good at it, im familiar with P2W too. GW2 does not have it. But making things in the expansions stronger than the base game despite stating they arent supposed to be, well, i can understand peoples frustrations.

Dabrixmgp.4758 said: "Or when I join HP trains in HoT and people arent using mounts."Mostly, I don't use Mounts in HOT due to the tangled nature of the Jungle.

@Dabrixmgp.4758 said:I have played most of the big name MMOs going back to my Ultima Online days in the late 90s. So why is this literally like the only game where people just dont buy expansions? I have even seen some absurd forum posts accusing the game of being pay2win since most Elite Specs are stronger than their Cores.

Whatever gave you that impression? Seems like PoF sold about as well as HoT? Personally I dropped GW2 after HoT for a multitude of reasons but it seems that just about every other player that didn't share my views went right on to PoF?Sure, I did not buy the latest expansion because I did not enjoy HoT (loathed it) and therefore no longer play GW2. But most of the people here enjoy the current incarnation of GW2 so they keep supporting the game, buy the expansions and gems on top of that - I don't understand your the point of your post?Guild Wars 2 is quite successful!(And yes. while I left GW2, I am still happy that so many ppl enjoy GW2 and I wish them all kind of success - Keeps my original GW running :))

@"Dibdabs.3410" said:God, I detest it when people trot out the word "literally" when they have no real point in using it other than emphasis. It makes me just ignore the rest of the post.

A bit like when there is no real point to using 'God' in a sentence. ;)

@Dabrixmgp.4758 said:

@maddoctor.2738 said:

@Dabrixmgp.4758 said:So why is this literally like the only game where people just dont buy expansions?

Wait, what? Literally no one is buying expansions, but you're playing in HoT with people that don't summon mounts. Maybe I haven't had enough coffee yet, but isn't that impossible? I mean, last I checked, HoT is an expansion, right?

@Dabrixmgp.4758 said:

@maddoctor.2738 said:

@Dabrixmgp.4758 said:So why is this literally like the only game where people just dont buy expansions?

@ReaverKane.7598 said:

@Dabrixmgp.4758 said:

@maddoctor.2738 said:

@Dabrixmgp.4758 said:So why is this literally like the only game where people just dont buy expansions?

Mind elaborating why you don't think PoF is worth it? In terms of content it has HoT easily beat. In quality it is very high up there. It's not even full price, so would you consider HoT worth the price (when it came out?) now?)

@Dabrixmgp.4758 said:

@maddoctor.2738 said:

@Dabrixmgp.4758 said:So why is this literally like the only game where people just dont buy expansions?

What kind of argument is this? Metabattle isn't some weird entity, players make the guides and if they are good they get rated as good. Some people have started playing recently and want to finish the core game before they buy an expac. Mounts aren't required for anything outside of PoF, so if they want to play that way they can do so too. I don't understand a stance that is absolutely against them, given how much quality we're getting, but they can do whatever they want so ultimately I don't care.

@Dabrixmgp.4758 said:

@maddoctor.2738 said:

@Dabrixmgp.4758 said:So why is this literally like the only game where people just dont buy expansions?

As for the guides, some core classes are still viable. Not all are upgrades.For example, druid is a combative downgrade.Reaper will change a necromancer’s shroud, so you have to weigh the utility.As for warrior, you’d be stupid not to play berserker. Without headbutt you’re only half a warrior.This isn’t like WoW and other common MMOs where an expansion renders the old stuff obsolete.

Only people missing the expansions will ask for more help, so as their voices echo, they sound numerous. But as one man asks to deal with a no-expac acount, there are a thousand people playing the game and not asking for help.

As for mounts. Sometimes its groups of new people who have yet to visit PoF, and sometimes people with PoF accomodate to people without mounts. At best people use raptor to engage with the strong CC.

As for people not using mounts in general, why do you have to? I have plenty of times i dont use mounts when i’m not in a hurry.

All in all, i think your sense of people not buying expansions is flawed on a founditional argument.Thisis only a guess based on experience, but i think about 20% of acounts at best are still core, and maybe shy of 10% everyone has at least PoF or HoT, if not both.

@Blocki.4931 said:

@ReaverKane.7598 said:

@Dabrixmgp.4758 said:

@maddoctor.2738 said:

@Dabrixmgp.4758 said:So why is this literally like the only game where people just dont buy expansions?

HoT was very overpriced when it came out, but it redeemed itself largely over time, with a lot of it's flaws getting reworked. PoF had no such redeeming features, and for as fun as mounts are, they aren't the whole game and if PoF had come out at the same price as HoT i wouldn't have bought it. I think they realized their mistake as well, and lowered the price for a reason.

What do you mean PoF isn't full-price? As an expansion it's more than full price, there's even full PC games released at that price. Name one expansion outside Activision Blizzard's World of Cash cows that costs 39€ or more for PC.Not even mentioning people, like me, that buy games at deluxe prices, but that's my choice.Other people wouldn't. Half the (very) active players in my guild quit because they didn't agree with HoT's price at release. Wanted to wait for a discount (which happened like 3-6 months later), but by the time it came out discounted they had already moved on, and most never returned.Also, personally, outside the living world, the whole game dropped immensely in quality post HoT. Idk if it was Colin and other talent leaving the team, the weird "cookie cutter" standards they established and kept even when it clearly doesn't work (like the irredeemable balance cadence, that even after they sped it up is woefully slow, especially given the tiny, and many times misguided changes we see eve after those wait periods).So yeah, even though i've bought each expansion (twice) at deluxe prices, AND core, i can't fault anyone else for not choosing to do so.In fact, if the current state and direction of the game is kept, i don't think i'll buy the next expansion, unless its sold for like 10 bucks or less. I mean 10€ i can afford to "throw away" on a risky premiss, but not 40, definitely not 70-100€, which were the prices i spent on each purchase so far (twice).

Also answering the OP again...I took a quick look at GW2 Efficiency. Flawed as it might be, it's none the less a good sample of the game's population, and according to the site, of the people registered there, 77% have BOTH expansions. 1% are Free to Play.Even if you stretch this by a long mile, you'll probably end up at most with 5-10% F2P players that are active, and not just "checking out" the game for a weekend.https://gw2efficiency.com/account/player-statistics

It may seem that way but thats only because many of us have many alt accounts. I have 5, 3 are core 1 is HoT and my main has all 3. I would probably make my 3 core into HoT if it ever goes 50% off. I dont see any value in PoF as an alt that i would barely be playing.

I'm not following the OP's reasoning at all. I very rarely come across a level 80 that doesn't have Mastery levels (and thus expansions). Sub-80s could be new players and aren't fair to judge until they decide whether they want to continue with the game or not.