Jump to content
  • Sign Up

shroud cooldown


DEATHsCLAW.1978

Recommended Posts

while I like the overall balance direction of anet, the last patch was clearly a nerf to necro sustain again! it wasnt great to begin with, but last gasp was one of the stronger traits necro had, now its gone. can we at least get our reduced shroud cooldown back now?

It'd be 2 simple changes:Sinister Shroud: reduce recharge of all shroud skills by 30%

entering/exiting shroud becomes a shroud skill and is therefore affected by Sinister Shroud

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@DEATHsCLAW.1978 said:while I like the overall balance direction of anet, the last patch was clearly a nerf to necro sustain again! it wasnt great to begin with, but last gasp was one of the stronger traits necro had, now its gone. can we at least get our reduced shroud cooldown back now?

It'd be 2 simple changes:Sinister Shroud: reduce recharge of all shroud skills by 30%

entering/exiting shroud becomes a shroud skill and is therefore affected by Sinister Shroud

tbh shroud enter exit being reduced by 15% would be good in and of itself

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@Crinn.7864 said:

@DEATHsCLAW.1978 said:while I like the overall balance direction of anet, the last patch was clearly a nerf to necro sustain again! it wasnt great to begin with, but last gasp was one of the stronger traits necro had, now its gone. can we at least get our reduced shroud cooldown back now?

It'd be 2 simple changes:Sinister Shroud: reduce recharge of all shroud skills by 30%

entering/exiting shroud becomes a shroud skill and is therefore affected by Sinister Shroud

tbh shroud enter exit being reduced by 15% would be good in and of itself

shroud cooldown reduction used to be 30% back in the days.. And I really think it should come back!

15% doesnt do enough id say..

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@"Phoenix the One.4071" said:Can it be destroyed in one-hit? We got 50% dmg reduction when in shroud?So that would be a 26 k burst :0

Honnestly? Yes, a 26k burst in PvP is achievable, otherwise you wouldn't have some PvE benchmarks reaching up to 40k dps. Thought, the one using the burst build would be quite squishy.

The defense of the necromancer is based on the idea that you'll apply weakness on your opponent (to prevent him from criting) and mitigate damage with "health points". Idea which is supposed to prevent incoming 26k burst. However, this defense is difficult to achieve when you don't have the time to weaken your opponent and have diminishing return with each additionnal foe in the fight, which isn't the case for skills that make you block/evade/invuln for a set amount of time. This defensive system also don't prevent incoming CC or even conditions from being applied. On another hand this defensive system allow the necromancer to deal damage at the same time as he defend.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@Dadnir.5038 said:

@"Phoenix the One.4071" said:Can it be destroyed in one-hit? We got 50% dmg reduction when in shroud?So that would be a 26 k burst :0

Honnestly? Yes, a 26k burst in PvP is achievable, otherwise you wouldn't have some PvE benchmarks reaching up to 40k dps. Thought, the one using the burst build would be quite squishy.

The defense of the necromancer is based on the idea that you'll apply weakness on your opponent (to prevent him from criting) and mitigate damage with "health points". Idea which is supposed to prevent incoming 26k burst. However, this defense is difficult to achieve when you don't have the time to weaken your opponent and have diminishing return with each additionnal foe in the fight, which isn't the case for skills that make you block/evade/invuln for a set amount of time. This defensive system also don't prevent incoming CC or even conditions from being applied. On another hand this defensive system allow the necromancer to deal damage at the same time as he defend.

True, and while I remember it to be a pain to handle at release, I think the powercreep and increasing accesibility to defencive/semi-passive effects as evade, aegis, invul and more have changed the landscape.

I mean I still love shroud, it can turn the tide 1v1, but lockong out healing (which made sense back then), utilities and your elites, can be a death sentence, since (unlessed traited) you got no stun break, you do got infusion terror (which was nerfed though).And Core Necros are locked out of the stability (unless traited).

I like the accessibility to blind and weakness though. And try to not compare too mich to my guardian (blind, block, a few leaps here and there), or thief (blind spam, weakness, few blocks, insane mobility, evades).But maybe give us access to utilities (I mean traiting for passive signet effects or 143 health per sec, feels a bit meaningless imo).

But tbh I am not keen on this balance.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@Phoenix the One.4071 said:Can it be destroyed in one-hit? We got 50% dmg reduction when in shroud?So that would be a 26 k burst :0

the 50% dmg reduction of shroud doesnt work if you got hitted by 30k+ dmg.

i got one shotted by a ranger in wvw when i had 75 %(~21k lifepoints) lifepoints on full marauder build and 50 % LF (~10k LF) shroud while i was in shroud. with dmg reduction up usually the ranger should Need 40k + dmg to kill shroud and than my lifepoints. but a 33 k dmg hit was enough to bring me directly to downstate.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

the 50% dmg reduction of shroud doesnt work if you got hitted by 30k+ dmg.

i got one shotted by a ranger in wvw when i had 75 %(~21k lifepoints) lifepoints on full marauder build and 50 % LF (~10k LF) shroud while i was in shroud. with dmg reduction up usually the ranger should Need 40k + dmg to kill shroud and than my lifepoints. but a 33 k dmg hit was enough to bring me directly to downstate.

I had exactly the same experience but with a mesmer poping out of invisibility to one shot me with a full shroud and paladin amulet.

The only way to improve shroud defence is to make it pulse perma retaliation as a baseline so that other players are too scared to hit us while in shroud! After all the best defends is offence ;)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Shroud will cut the damage in half of that particular hit doesn't cause you to have less than 0 shroud. Else you will take full damage.

The reason for this is previously if a hit knocked you our of shroud , shroud would block the entire hit. Regardless of how little LF you had and how big the hit was. E.g. you had 1k shroud but got hit for 40k? You would be knocked out of shroud and take no further damage.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@Sigmoid.7082 said:Shroud will cut the damage in half of that particular hit doesn't cause you to have less than 0 shroud. Else you will take full damage.

The reason for this is previously if a hit knocked you our of shroud , shroud would block the entire hit. Regardless of how little LF you had and how big the hit was. E.g. you had 1k shroud but got hit for 40k? You would be knocked out of shroud and take no further damage.

I think it should still be like that. ITs a pretty good block for a necro. Lets be honest, if its OP for a reaper shroud to block 100% hit at 1k LF remaining, then by simple reverse logic a block/ invulnerability or skill that costs nothing but its ICD that lets you mitigate 100% damage for the other professions should be deemed OP and removed too.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@James.1065 said:

@Sigmoid.7082 said:Shroud will cut the damage in half of that particular hit doesn't cause you to have less than 0 shroud. Else you will take full damage.

The reason for this is previously if a hit knocked you our of shroud , shroud would block the entire hit. Regardless of how little LF you had and how big the hit was. E.g. you had 1k shroud but got hit for 40k? You would be knocked out of shroud and take no further damage.

I think it should still be like that. ITs a pretty good block for a necro. Lets be honest, if its OP for a reaper shroud to block 100% hit at 1k LF remaining, then by simple reverse logic a block/ invulnerability or skill that costs nothing but its ICD that lets you mitigate 100% damage is OP too.

The porblen is it's not a block. Comparing apples and oranges. We all know or exactly what type of mechanic shroud is.

There was a clear reason it got changed.

You also have to bare in mind that shroud could drain at a 2% rate and have a 7s cool down at the time.

We'll get block and evades hopefully as an elite spec without shroud. Which would make 2 with a shroud and 2 without.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The porblen is it's not a block. Comparing apples and oranges. We all know or exactly what type of mechanic shroud is.

I agree that is a problem. It's more like comparing apples with a giant Anet middle finger. What is shroud actualy? defence? offence? or something to just look cool? cause it doesn't really excel in any of those options, but the latter.

There was a clear reason it got changed.

That reason is not so clear to me

You also have to bare in mind that shroud could drain at a 2% rate and have a 7s cool down at the time.

Should, but doesn't, instead it drains at 5% and is on a 9s CD.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm talking a out shroud in general not reaper. Reapers shroud drains so fast because it does damage. Reaper used to be a lot more tanky than it is now but people kept saying it should be a damage shroud so that's why it's currently the way it is. It also used to do decent condition damage but the fixation on power damage was incredibly strong. That does leave room for a main hand condition/power hybrid weapon elite though.

Core shroud , and core necromancer in general, can be built to be very tanky. It's not a team fighter though. Core isn't far off being decent. It had a lot of variety. It not as bad as people give it credit for.

Anyways back on topic: lowering the cooldown on shroud wouldn't really fix or change some of the fundamental issues necromancer tends to suffer from. I would rather more meaningful changes be made else where.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@Sigmoid.7082 said:I'm talking a out shroud in general not reaper. Reapers shroud drains so fast because it does damage. Reaper used to be a lot more tanky than it is now but people kept saying it should be a damage shroud so that's why it's currently the way it is. It also used to do decent condition damage but the fixation on power damage was incredibly strong. That does leave room for a main hand condition/power hybrid weapon elite though.

Core shroud , and core necromancer in general, can be built to be very tanky. It's not a team fighter though. Core isn't far off being decent. It had a lot of variety. It not as bad as people give it credit for.

Anyways back on topic: lowering the cooldown on shroud wouldn't really fix or change some of the fundamental issues necromancer tends to suffer from. I would rather more meaningful changes be made else where.

Personally I find a 7 seconds shroud a lot more fun because of its synergy with a 6 seconds Reaper shroud 2 dash.It also allows us to utilize enter/exit shroud traits a lot more effectively.This allows us to shroud flash when needed to utilize the shroud 2 dash for mobility/gap closing reasons and not have to sit in shroud to maximize its effectiveness which has become a bad thing to do due to the increased shroud degeneration rate.Also it makes us a lot more unpredictable to foes.

We are now quite a one-dimensional class that is easier to for opponents to kite and predict.Similar to how the Spellbreaker's full counter CD was nerfed from 8 seconds to 12 seconds.They become more predictable.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

After the nerf of retaliation I cannot see why this should help us? Yeah some dmg back at ya, but that doesn’t stop the 40k dmg you talk about.

Also I think they could change Reapers shroud to be 7-8 sec CD and 3% drain.Ability-wise I love reaper shroud since I brungs a bit of that utility we lose by not having access to utilities.Mobility, Projectile hate, CC and stability and dmg reduction.It is a mini elite and can be traited to be a stunbreak on 10 sec CD.

I think the problem is on Paper shrouds sounds OP... in reality, not so much.If you use shroud to try to stay alive, you are usually dead anyway (unless you flee and your enemies got their leap on CD).

I would like Shroud to be a more tactical utility, than a “ohh-shit”-ability.Like predicting big hits and let the shroud soak it up, throwing CC or chill/fear, change out and keep on dmg with weapons.Or when you break the bar on a champion, change to buff allies and deal a high dmg burst, then back again :bI guess in someway it might be a bit like this..

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

×
×
  • Create New...