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Scourge: Dessicate


DoNotBelieveMe.3029

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I personally have not heard of anyone actively using the 'Dessicate' skill so I am wondering if the scourge players actually use it at all.For pollers, if you do use it, do elaborate on when it is viable.Or otherwise if you have suggestions for improvements to the skill, please keep it within the bounds of the current skill parameters (Might stacks/ might duration / boons converted / life force generated / radius / torment stacks and duration on conversion / raw damage)

Also do note that this is not a 'real' poll but rather one to find out if the skill is actually being used by a number of people in any game mode.

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Is used sometimes in PvE support scourge for might stacking. The issue of course is that Scourge has fairly poor boon options. I imagine if Scourge can somehow offer a reliable source of other boons like fury, regen(dodge mark is wonky), or protection then I can see this skill be used much more often.

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@Drarnor Kunoram.5180 said:

@Lahmia.2193 said:I'd say Dessicate and Serpent's Siphon are in need of some buffs.

Serpent's Siphon is in need of a complete rework, sadly. Numbers changes won't help that skill because the function is bad.

Your point about Serpent Siphon is interesting, have you felt it was always nonviable (aka outclassed by other utility skills, even those in the core necro category) since the launch of PoF? Because that too is another skill that I have not really seen or heard being used much in any game mode.

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@DoNotBelieveMe.3029 said:

@Lahmia.2193 said:I'd say Dessicate and Serpent's Siphon are in need of some buffs.

Serpent's Siphon is in need of a complete rework, sadly. Numbers changes won't help that skill because the function is bad.

Your point about Serpent Siphon is interesting, have you felt it was always nonviable (aka outclassed by other utility skills, even those in the core necro category) since the launch of PoF? Because that too is another skill that I have not really seen or heard being used much in any game mode.

Serpent Siphon has not only never been viable, but it's actually been nerfed from its original horribly underpowered state. There are zero situations where the skill is good, either from outclassed by other utility skills (like Well of Corruption, which has pulsing damage and boon corruption, still unblockable, and gives life force with a shorter casting time,) or from facets of the skill being self-defeating (barrier pickups, wanting more of them means more enemies that you're in melee range of, which defeats the purpose of the barrier).

I would say it's a contender for worst skill in the game, and that was before its nerfs.

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dessicate as well as Serpent Siphon dont see much Play.dessicate Maybe sometimes in pve but theres better skills to take (BiP, Well of Power, SIgnet of undeath, Poison Cloud) just to Name a few.

especially Serpent Siphon is even worse than dessicate i think, as it will only drop those barrier pickups when you hit someone, and then your allies have to walk over them.

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I only use Dessicate on condi-Scourge for LF gen in super-casual, open world events. The area might is a minor benefit. Boon corruption seems underwhelming when opponents just get more, instantly.

Both utility shouts and utility punishments rank below core utilities in my book and are not, in any way, elite.

Augury of Death could add some form of group utility like a short AoE stab, something that works directly on break bars, or tweaks per shout to give it purpose in a game mode where it is lacking as shown in the examples below.

  • Suffer - also transfer 1 condi from an ally to their target. Up to 9 allies.
  • NCSY - 1 sec AoE stab for 9 allies
  • Rise - automatically spawns max shambling horrors vs defiant mobs
  • YaaW - give might to 9 allies
  • CttB and YSiM stay the same

Sadistic Searing simply needs a split between game modes and a massive dps boost for PvE to make up for not becoming a barrier slave.

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Serpent Siphon is really in a bad state. i like the idea, but how its works is terrible.Make it 3s AoE pulsing skill with in total 4 hits:

Damage x4Targets 5Each pulse 1 Stack Poison for 8s, Final pulse 2 StacksFinal pulse: The barrier orbs as actual on topEach pulse: 1 Boon corrupt

If the dmg is'nt the worst then, it would be a nice skill.

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Dessicate is basically a weaker version of Blood is Power; it's the old version of Blood is Power except it gives 10% Life Force~ which isn't too bad of a number~ but it deserves to be a little more unique. I think it could actually get ammo; it's not too strong, so it could totally handle as a ammo Punishment and a no longer glitched whirl finisher and actually be the finisher. It'd be a really interesting skill in that sense, giving Scourge the potential to abuse combo fields.

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I use this skill in fractals, dungeons, open world PvE. Why? Because I press it always on cooldown. Best LF generation in game, since it can be used out of combat.

Is the skill boring? YesDoes the skill serve any other purpose besides LF generation for me? NoWould I use the skill if it wouldn't allow off combat LF generation? Hell no.

So, yes I want it to get changed, but since there's no other skill that gives me easy access to fill up my LF so easy and on top of that allows this to happen out of combat, with a 16 sec CD (talented), this is my skill to go.

I am always starting combat with a full or almost filled LF bar.

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Based on the comments thus far,Would I be right to assume:

  1. The primary use of dessicate seems to be for its 'almost instant' 10% Lifeforce regen (in any game mode).
  2. Might is an accompanying feature that is largely irrelevant due to the low stacks/duration. (PVE support scourges, if dessicate were among the 3 utilities, and you had to remove 1 skill to suit the encounter, would dessicate be the first to be replaced over BiP or signet of undeath?)
  3. It is not used for boon conversion at all.
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@DoNotBelieveMe.3029

I don't believe you! ;)

If anything, your synthese prove that the skill is versatile. The life force is always welcome, outgoing might from the necromancer have always been unsatisfying (I guess it's a "feature of the necromancer) and boon conversion is always more or less usefull (The more people bash on a single mob, the less usefull boon conversion become usually).

It's a skill that you'll use when you need versatility, which fit more small scale PvP fight than anything.

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That is correct, I do believe the skill is versatile, and have included 'niche use' in the poll options to try to reflect my starting opinion that it may have been taken for either might, lifeforce or boon conversion.

I am merely speculating, based on the current feedback, what is the main draw of Dessicate at the moment to players and why it is playing second fiddle to other skills that scourges use.

I did invite players to share what niche uses Dessicate had in different game modes, and most of the responses:

  1. Mostly centered around life force generation.
  2. Used in conjunction with BiP for might, never a top tier pick on it's own.
  3. No real mention about boon conversion aside from 1 post, but fractal boons often come in multiples so stripping 1 of the 3 or 5 boons enemies apply to themselves seem a bit lacking and weak.
  4. None of the posts reflect that it is taken for the full package of Lifeforce + Might + Boon conversion.

The second stage is looking to understand if any reasonable buff to the skill parameters would make it a more frequent pick over necromancer core skills, it is a e-spec utility after all. But admittedly it seems Serpent Siphon requires this more than Dessicate.

On a side note, in PvP/WvW would Dessicate be a skill that is usually picked over the other options within your limited utility slots?

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I do really have a problem with dessicate and serpent siphon, 2 out of 4skills of an elite spec being only very niche use is not good balance/design.Sure there will always be better skills than others, but right now, only trail of anguish sees a lot of play. And to some extent sand swell.

You want might? Take BiPYou want lifeforce? Take bone minions, shadow fiend or signet of undeathYou want booncorrupt? Take corrupt boon or well of corruption

You want barrier from utility skills? Take sand swell as it applies barrier 100% of the times, and isn't as random/conditional as serpent siphon.

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@"DoNotBelieveMe.3029" said:On a side note, in PvP/WvW would Dessicate be a skill that is usually picked over the other options within your limited utility slots?

Asking this question is like asking whether being versatile in PvP/WvW is better than being specialized. In "organized" group fight you want specialists that cover other specialists weaknesses because this is a way to reach the maximum potential that those specialists can reach. In random fights (mostly roaming) you'd want to be able to be versatile enough to answer most situation.

Like most of the tools of the necromancer, dessicate overly lean toward versatility and at the same time can only really find some use in large scale PvP battle. So the only answer to your question is that the skill cannot be "meta" in PvP/WvW but offer enough and can only release it's true potential there. Can it be improved? Yes. Could it become meta after being improved? I doubt it. The skill follow the codes of the punishment skillset in the context of the scourge which is supposed to be a "support" spec at it's core. The issue is that for it to become "meta" in PvP/WvW, you'd have to specialized it and specializing it would most likely make it break free from the codes that it follow.

On a side note, if boons weren't cheap, the skill would be a "must" in PvP/WvW. However, boons like conditions are cheap and the skill just cannot be seen as very attractive due to that. There is to much things that have been trivialized over the years for versatile design to be really effective in PvP/WvW, however at the same time the necromancer's skills have always been pushed toward "versatility". We can't do sh** against it, this is the major design flaw of the necromancer's design. Devs just continue over and over to force onto the necromancer skills that try to do everything at the same time without being peculiarly good at anything in the end. The shroud is like that, the shades are like that, the reaper's shout are like that, the punishment skills are like that... etc.

The necromancer's mediocrity is due to it's inability to specialized which is indirectly due to how the necromancer's defensive mechanism was tied to the shroud at release. It's always the same issue over and over. ANet can't give defensive skills to the core skillset because of shroud and the lack of defensive skills in the core skillset prevent anet from giving defensive skills outside of the shroud skills. Which at the same time prevent any kind of real "role" specialization to ensure "balance". A necromancer can't do high damage because of it's natural resilience and at the same time the necromancer can't have good support/defense because he can continue to do that while doing damage.

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Dessicate is a standard part of my support scourge's arsenal, though I probably don't use it quite like others. Instead of trying to boon spam with it (which let's face it, necros are not good at boons) I use Dessicate situationally to help refill my Life Force when I'm running low, or when we're in a burst phase and I need to fire off every bit of damage I can.

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