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Fractal Firebrand and Quickness Thoughts?


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Hello everyone!

I was in a group with a firebrand recently. His group quickness and ability to pull mobs for mass aoe seemed really great. It was like being with a skilled chrono. Very smooth T4 run with lots of boons. Guardians are my first love, and seeing the great success of the run was inspiring. It seems like a great build for support, fractals or general world boss killing where people are everywhere.

Are FB a good alternative for chronos? We seemed to have quickness on all the time plus boons.

I have also read conflicting information about their dps. I thought they were full condi for huge burning. But I spoke to a frequent fractal'er, and he said his FB was zerker since it takes 10+ seconds for the full dps of a FB to get rolling. By then the mobs are dead, so you don't take full advantage of FB's dps. My last question, what are you thoughts on the following armour stats?

  • Viper is recommended since FB damage is a bit hybrid, physical and condi. Though you are a glass cannon with minimal survivability.
  • As previously mentioned, the FB I spoke to said he used zerker stats since condi didn't dps wouldn't get up to full steam until after the mobs are dead (10s after combat starts, since they were likely killed already).
  • I'm a fan of versatility and including survivability. I was thinking of celestial stats. Overall you get more attributes, and you get a decent amount of defense, hit points, and healing for the regen mantra. Yes this will impact damage, but you still get 4 damage attributes: Condi, power, precision and ferocity. To be honest, this seems like the best overall but I'd still like to hear your input.

In all cases, I'd use FB runes with the burning and +10% boon sigils. Thank you in advance for your advice!

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FB is rolling fractals atm, I even start to think to make second guardian and start playing FB. FBs I ran with were harrier in fractals, some with minstrel rings and /or amulet( I pug, they pug, they want some durability, we all know how unpredictable pugs can go :) ) All of them were over 150 AR to get benefits from fractal portions.This is the babysitting FBs I speak about.DPS should really be in glass cannon build as you have very little to worry about your survivability given you know mech and can dodge.

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I want to give-up on chrono because it's just so clunky to use in 5-man content. I'm also thinking about making a "carry" FB since I pug T4s everyday. So what's the build for that? Is it full harrier? Wouldn't that be overkill on boon duration with mist omnipots? Or should I not even bother min-maxing? Or maybe screw boon duration and go in full serk? Or just stop playing this game?

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The full Viper build is Quickbrand. Usually run with FB runes. Pretty much only provides perma quickness (minor Might and Fury, some Aegis), but has good dps, and burst isnt horrible due to burning being short high damage condition.

If you want to carry (main healer, perma Quickness, 25 Might, perma Fury, Regen, Protection etc) , go full harrier FB, with some Magi or whatever else you prefer, due to free boon dura from potions for Fractals.

Keep in mind, FB doesn't directly replace Chrono, unless you don't want Alacrity.You either run it with a Chrono, or a Rev, at least for difficult content like CM's.

For T4's and Recs, sure, things die quickly enough that you don't really need Alacrity, and you can run Harrier FB, BS, 3 DPS.

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Our full zerker fb with pack runes, concentration sigil and soul pastries does about the dps of our bannerwarrior. Definitely depends on the amount of time we need to phase.For pulls you got GS5 + F1 tome, skill 3, which surprisingly is pretty much enough. Axe on occasion, though its not strictly necessary and a scepter is more dps imo.We are a bit struggling on might, but then we havent forced our bannerwarrior yet to run strength runes, only dumplings as food for PS trait to trigger.Precast on singularity usually is banners + alacrity (renegade ofc) + elite shout and mantras. GGing is generally kept to a bare minimum, since re-casting mantras is painful and eats just way too much time.For skips we either have a tempest or a daredevil, and everyone brings a xera portal.All in all, it works very well and is really quite comfortable. I honestly can say, that I wouldnt want to go back to chrono... alone the amount of time spent with chrono on singularity precast is ridiculous and totally destroys fractals for me.

But this is current status, lets see what next tuesday brings. Either firebrand or renegade will have to be flexible to run as a healer maybe, and Im now rather swayed towards keeping renegade purely as a power specc and switching on firebrand. But this all depends on so many not-yet disclosed factors... like is the leaked instability rework really coming? How much extra dps would be boonrip on spb, how much for renegade. How much dmg do you get from certain instabilities... how much condi remove do you need.... do you need perma protection.... how much dps really IS power renegade with diviners, etc.

For fractals, Id tell you to wait until tuesday.

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I pug t4 fractals each day too so yes, having the survivability is nice. Maybe I'll just make a FB with celestial for random world events and bosses to have my cake and eat it too without worrying about trying to keep up boons permanently. Though in the Palawadan events I've been testing FB in, it seems I don't heal since there is so much splash heal from everyone else + barriers, seems as though everyone is always topped up.

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Honestly, a harrier (or givers/minstrel) firebrand is a good investment. Worst case you can play it as healer or respectively healer-tank in raids, except VG mid and Deimos ranged you can tank everything on minstrel/givers firebrand quite nicely.

Zerker firebrand atm might be just a fluke, I cant really tell yet. Or it might become the new meta in fractals with renegade on harrier for pugs. Who knows exactly whats gonna get preferred.

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@Yasi.9065 said:Zerker firebrand atm might be just a fluke, I cant really tell yet. Or it might become the new meta in fractals with renegade on harrier for pugs. Who knows exactly whats gonna get preferred.

While Berserker Firebrand sounds meh, I think Diviner Firebrand may become a thing... If you run Retribution instead of Virtues, you can easily get 100% crit chance and some increased ferocity since you'll have 100% boon duration. And you can still run mantra of potency for that quickness for everyone.

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@Jeknar.6184 said:

@Yasi.9065 said:Zerker firebrand atm might be just a fluke, I cant really tell yet. Or it might become the new meta in fractals with renegade on harrier for pugs. Who knows exactly whats gonna get preferred.

While Berserker Firebrand sounds meh, I think Diviner Firebrand may become a thing... If you run Retribution instead of Virtues, you can easily get 100% crit chance and some increased ferocity since you'll have 100% boon duration. And you can still run mantra of potency for that quickness for everyone.

Why does Berserker FB sound worse than Diviner? FB needs only 12% boon duration for perma quickness. Fractal potion overcaps that already. You don't run Virtues on a Berserker FB either.Diviner FB wont even become a thing in raids. Concentration sigil + 1-2 trinkets or food is enough there aswell. Or just condi with firebrand runes.

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@Nephalem.8921 said:

@Yasi.9065 said:Zerker firebrand atm might be just a fluke, I cant really tell yet. Or it might become the new meta in fractals with renegade on harrier for pugs. Who knows exactly whats gonna get preferred.

While Berserker Firebrand sounds meh, I think Diviner Firebrand may become a thing... If you run Retribution instead of Virtues, you can easily get 100% crit chance and some increased ferocity since you'll have 100% boon duration. And you can still run mantra of potency for that quickness for everyone.

Why does Berserker FB sound worse than Diviner? FB needs only 12% boon duration for perma quickness. Fractal potion overcaps that already. You don't run Virtues on a Berserker FB either.Diviner FB wont even become a thing in raids. Concentration sigil + 1-2 trinkets or food is enough there aswell. Or just condi with firebrand runes.

To give a higher uptime in the other boons? Last I checked, Firebrand also gave Protection, Fury, Regen, Retaliation, Vigor, Stability and Aegis. This is specially useful if you are running it with Renegade which only gives Alacrity and Might.

Maybe it won't become meta, but it will definetely increase the speed of the runs of people running 2 pure supports.

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@Nephalem.8921 said:

@Yasi.9065 said:Zerker firebrand atm might be just a fluke, I cant really tell yet. Or it might become the new meta in fractals with renegade on harrier for pugs. Who knows exactly whats gonna get preferred.

While Berserker Firebrand sounds meh, I think Diviner Firebrand may become a thing... If you run Retribution instead of Virtues, you can easily get 100% crit chance and some increased ferocity since you'll have 100% boon duration. And you can still run mantra of potency for that quickness for everyone.

Why does Berserker FB sound worse than Diviner? FB needs only 12% boon duration for perma quickness. Fractal potion overcaps that already. You don't run Virtues on a Berserker FB either.Diviner FB wont even become a thing in raids. Concentration sigil + 1-2 trinkets or food is enough there aswell. Or just condi with firebrand runes.

Part Diviner could make sense. Depends on how much gain can be had from not using Concentration sigil (difficult since 10% flat bonus is the highest you can get on sigils) and trinkets. Remember, 4 stat gear has more total stats meaning if you can compensate the loss in power for concentration in other areas, Diviner might outperform berserker in raids.

For fractals, the already used potions cover everything needed.

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@Jeknar.6184 said:

@Yasi.9065 said:Zerker firebrand atm might be just a fluke, I cant really tell yet. Or it might become the new meta in fractals with renegade on harrier for pugs. Who knows exactly whats gonna get preferred.

While Berserker Firebrand sounds meh, I think Diviner Firebrand may become a thing... If you run Retribution instead of Virtues, you can easily get 100% crit chance and some increased ferocity since you'll have 100% boon duration. And you can still run mantra of potency for that quickness for everyone.

Why does Berserker FB sound worse than Diviner? FB needs only 12% boon duration for perma quickness. Fractal potion overcaps that already. You don't run Virtues on a Berserker FB either.Diviner FB wont even become a thing in raids. Concentration sigil + 1-2 trinkets or food is enough there aswell. Or just condi with firebrand runes.

To give a higher uptime in the other boons? Last I checked, Firebrand also gave Protection, Fury, Regen, Retaliation, Vigor, Stability and Aegis. This is specially useful if you are running it with Renegade which only gives Alacrity and Might.

Maybe it won't become meta, but it will definetely increase the speed of the runs of people running 2 pure supports.

Dps Fb doesnt provide any of that boons except fury if he takes axe instead. Diviner is a power set. Run Support if you want to play support FB. The build you need to provide those boons is simply not worth it to run on a dps FB.

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In fractals its differently, at least atm for us since we arent a full static. We cant force pug power bs to run strength runes, we would never be able to fill that slot then. So, might and part of fury and protection has to be covered by firebrand as well.

Might (ha!) be differently with the comp becoming more popular, but atm you have to get more boon duration than you need for quickness.

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  • 3 weeks later...

im playing Fb as a Celestial FB and it work wonders i dont have the magic number but i can support/dps and tank at the same time, The celestial Fb is jack of all trads but master of non i have no problem getting the DPS on 13-15 k dmg. FB can use the utility from all stats to help it and can be a good baby sitter in most dungeon/fractal here is my build

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vVMQJARWnsADFBjtCBOCDEEhlACDbF8d2BWBgsVcaPieR7oA-jBCBABQcBBSUXDDHCBHVCamyPSV/Jm9HA4JFsOYAYmkJZm5MzMTjMzMzMzUEA7YA-e

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@"Sylli.3891" said:im playing Fb as a Celestial FB and it work wonders i dont have the magic number but i can support/dps and tank at the same time, The celestial Fb is jack of all trads but master of non i have no problem getting the DPS on 13-15 k dmg. FB can use the utility from all stats to help it and can be a good baby sitter in most dungeon/fractal here is my build

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vVMQJARWnsADFBjtCBOCDEEhlACDbF8d2BWBgsVcaPieR7oA-jBCBABQcBBSUXDDHCBHVCamyPSV/Jm9HA4JFsOYAYmkJZm5MzMTjMzMzMzUEA7YA-e

That build has 0 boon duration. Now with Fractal Potions and Boon duration food and Sigil of concentration that might be fine (you have neither boon duration food nor sigil of concentration in that build).

What you linked to is basically a mediocre healer build and mediocre damage build with low boon support and duration.

Sorry, but unless you forgot something, that build can be improved on, a lot.

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I play both ren and FB (same equipment).If you want to play Quickness FB or a support class for PUG, play Harrier FB.When people will be more used to FB and Ren, Zerk or Vipere FB will be good too. I know people speak about zerk FB and so harrier Ren, but :

  • The stab/aegis/quickness/fury/resistance spam is just so good; it'd be an error if you pug alone to play without boon duration and healing, and may be not clear for others players, mostly if you don't play with a Ren.The "Bane signet share" is very strong. Virtues helps a lot too with a lil endurance boost, Master of consecration if Wall or Hallowed ground needed.
  • Harrier Ren can give 25 mights, perma alacrity and very strong powerbuff and heal; but people need to pack really really close or you'll have issue or with might or with alacrity; not very convenient in PUG or with certain instabilities, it will multiply support classes ... It's messier than FB.
  • Plus FB slots easier with more compo, because quickness take precedence over alacrity, and the boons spam.
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@Cyninja.2954 said:

@"Sylli.3891" said:im playing Fb as a Celestial FB and it work wonders i dont have the magic number but i can support/dps and tank at the same time, The celestial Fb is jack of all trads but master of non i have no problem getting the DPS on 13-15 k dmg. FB can use the utility from all stats to help it and can be a good baby sitter in most dungeon/fractal here is my build

That build has 0 boon duration. Now with Fractal Potions and Boon duration food and Sigil of concentration that might be fine (you have neither boon duration food nor sigil of concentration in that build).

What you linked to is basically a mediocre healer build and mediocre damage build with low boon support and duration.

Sorry, but unless you forgot something, that build can be improved on, a lot.

you dont know the meaning in jack of all trads, you dont have to use the same traits and that the point of the build u can go for what u need and is was never a full support or max dps but the utility is great i dont see use for boon duration but u can go and swap the runes out to get it, i have no problem having full uptime on Reg/Retaliation/might/fury/ i get about 70 % on quickness and about 40 % on stab. but u cant do dps when u laying down on u full max dmg build i see that way to offen, this way u can help the group and still do ok dmg. its only build for a team not to rush fractal or dungeon but the runs are way more smooth. if u look at it this way u have 5 player and ea player do about 20 % dmg. i give up 10 % dmg and i give quickness that give 50% faster attack speed so i can buff the team more then we lose from the 10% dps. I can still give out boons and heal if needed and its was never a T4 fractal or raid build but its soild

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@Sylli.3891 said:

@Sylli.3891 said:im playing Fb as a Celestial FB and it work wonders i dont have the magic number but i can support/dps and tank at the same time, The celestial Fb is jack of all trads but master of non i have no problem getting the DPS on 13-15 k dmg. FB can use the utility from all stats to help it and can be a good baby sitter in most dungeon/fractal here is my build

That build has 0 boon duration. Now with Fractal Potions and Boon duration food and Sigil of concentration that might be fine (you have neither boon duration food nor sigil of concentration in that build).

What you linked to is basically a mediocre healer build and mediocre damage build with low boon support and duration.

Sorry, but unless you forgot something, that build can be improved on, a lot.

you dont know the meaning in jack of all trads, you dont have to use the same traits and that the point of the build u can go for what u need and is was never a full support or max dps but the utility is great i dont see use for boon duration but u can go and swap the runes out to get it, i have no problem having full uptime on Reg/Retaliation/might/fury/ i get about 70 % on quickness and about 40 % on stab. but u cant do dps when u laying down on u full max dmg build i see that way to offen, this way u can help the group and still do ok dmg. its only build for a team not to rush fractal or dungeon but the runs are way more smooth. if u look at it this way u have 5 player and ea player do about 20 % dmg. i give up 10 % dmg and i give quickness that give 50% faster attack speed so i can buff the team more then we lose from the 10% dps. I can still give out boons and heal if needed and its was never a T4 fractal or raid build but its soild

You can't give 70% quickness with that build. It will drop during longer fights and you won't have short fights with this build. That build can't have more than 50% quickness uptime during longer fights.Why don't you take the 2 quickness traits in the firebrand traitline? You could achieve 100% uptime with 12% boon duration and would lose nothing.

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@Sylli.3891 said:

@Sylli.3891 said:im playing Fb as a Celestial FB and it work wonders i dont have the magic number but i can support/dps and tank at the same time, The celestial Fb is jack of all trads but master of non i have no problem getting the DPS on 13-15 k dmg. FB can use the utility from all stats to help it and can be a good baby sitter in most dungeon/fractal here is my build

That build has 0 boon duration. Now with Fractal Potions and Boon duration food and Sigil of concentration that might be fine (you have neither boon duration food nor sigil of concentration in that build).

What you linked to is basically a mediocre healer build and mediocre damage build with low boon support and duration.

Sorry, but unless you forgot something, that build can be improved on, a lot.

you dont know the meaning in jack of all trads, you dont have to use the same traits and that the point of the build u can go for what u need and is was never a full support or max dps but the utility is great i dont see use for boon duration but u can go and swap the runes out to get it, i have no problem having full uptime on Reg/Retaliation/might/fury/ i get about 70 % on quickness and about 40 % on stab. but u cant do dps when u laying down on u full max dmg build i see that way to offen, this way u can help the group and still do ok dmg. its only build for a team not to rush fractal or dungeon but the runs are way more smooth. if u look at it this way u have 5 player and ea player do about 20 % dmg. i give up 10 % dmg and i give quickness that give 50% faster attack speed so i can buff the team more then we lose from the 10% dps. I can still give out boons and heal if needed and its was never a T4 fractal or raid build but its soild

What is the point of the build?

I could rework the build with diviner and harrier to:

  • provide permanent stability, quickness, protection, fury and regeneration
  • provide way better healing and damage

Those 30% quickness uptime you are missing (and I am going by your numbers, not saying that 70% uptime is achievable) are a dps loss to the group of around 3-4k per dps, so 10-15k total.

The missing fury uptime is another dps loss.

The missing protection uptime is a huge survival loss.

Celestial stats are missing boon uptime. It is one of their main crucial flaws in the current game design. Your build is basically a jack of all healer/dps which lacks the essential boon support demanded from support builds. Making it a jack-of-half build in an arena where jack-of-all builds are already struggling.

In short: any pure harrier support or quickness brand (either power or condi) would be of more value to your group. Given the dps loss due to lacking boons, a full harrier healer would improve the groups overall dps enough to make it surpass your 12-13k dps. A quickness brand would lose the mediocre healing and instead increase the groups dps through permanent boons and put out twice your personal dps at the very least.

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@Nephalem.8921 said:

@Sylli.3891 said:im playing Fb as a Celestial FB and it work wonders i dont have the magic number but i can support/dps and tank at the same time, The celestial Fb is jack of all trads but master of non i have no problem getting the DPS on 13-15 k dmg. FB can use the utility from all stats to help it and can be a good baby sitter in most dungeon/fractal here is my build

That build has 0 boon duration. Now with Fractal Potions and Boon duration food and Sigil of concentration that might be fine (you have neither boon duration food nor sigil of concentration in that build).

What you linked to is basically a mediocre healer build and mediocre damage build with low boon support and duration.

Sorry, but unless you forgot something, that build can be improved on, a lot.

you dont know the meaning in jack of all trads, you dont have to use the same traits and that the point of the build u can go for what u need and is was never a full support or max dps but the utility is great i dont see use for boon duration but u can go and swap the runes out to get it, i have no problem having full uptime on Reg/Retaliation/might/fury/ i get about 70 % on quickness and about 40 % on stab. but u cant do dps when u laying down on u full max dmg build i see that way to offen, this way u can help the group and still do ok dmg. its only build for a team not to rush fractal or dungeon but the runs are way more smooth. if u look at it this way u have 5 player and ea player do about 20 % dmg. i give up 10 % dmg and i give quickness that give 50% faster attack speed so i can buff the team more then we lose from the 10% dps. I can still give out boons and heal if needed and its was never a T4 fractal or raid build but its soild

You can't give 70% quickness with that build. It will drop during longer fights and you won't have short fights with this build. That build can't have more than 50% quickness uptime during longer fights.Why don't you take the 2 quickness traits in the firebrand traitline? You could achieve 100% uptime with 12% boon duration and would lose nothing.

if u go for that kind of traits then its best to build it full support and this is NOT a full support build its a jack of all trade u lose so much dmg from only 4 page and u cant get the dmg up on only 4 page that is why. offen the burst come when i go into burning book and its insane dmgfirst of all u dont have 30 % quickness you use the books the get a boost of quickness ea time you use them and most fight is done before 20 sec so it dont matter and this is still not a raid/T4 fractal build

-the taits that give you 8 sec fury 10 sec/CD that need 3 burn to work i have 100 % uptime on fury

-but this is still not a support and the 100 % uptime on protection is what a full support is for

-Harriaer is not a good pick on FB if u go into the trait in honor and the grandmaster give you more outgoing healing when you have more vitality and that is a big buff to healing and minstreal work better on guard but it cant hit that is why i see the build lack at the healing part. If i pick that trait i get 21 % outgoing healing and i do the same healing Harriaer can do if i swap runes

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@Cyninja.2954 said:

@Sylli.3891 said:im playing Fb as a Celestial FB and it work wonders i dont have the magic number but i can support/dps and tank at the same time, The celestial Fb is jack of all trads but master of non i have no problem getting the DPS on 13-15 k dmg. FB can use the utility from all stats to help it and can be a good baby sitter in most dungeon/fractal here is my build

That build has 0 boon duration. Now with Fractal Potions and Boon duration food and Sigil of concentration that might be fine (you have neither boon duration food nor sigil of concentration in that build).

What you linked to is basically a mediocre healer build and mediocre damage build with low boon support and duration.

Sorry, but unless you forgot something, that build can be improved on, a lot.

you dont know the meaning in jack of all trads, you dont have to use the same traits and that the point of the build u can go for what u need and is was never a full support or max dps but the utility is great i dont see use for boon duration but u can go and swap the runes out to get it, i have no problem having full uptime on Reg/Retaliation/might/fury/ i get about 70 % on quickness and about 40 % on stab. but u cant do dps when u laying down on u full max dmg build i see that way to offen, this way u can help the group and still do ok dmg. its only build for a team not to rush fractal or dungeon but the runs are way more smooth. if u look at it this way u have 5 player and ea player do about 20 % dmg. i give up 10 % dmg and i give quickness that give 50% faster attack speed so i can buff the team more then we lose from the 10% dps. I can still give out boons and heal if needed and its was never a T4 fractal or raid build but its soild

What is the point of the build?

I could rework the build with diviner and harrier to:
  • provide permanent stability, quickness, protection, fury and regeneration
  • provide way better healing and damage

Those 30% quickness uptime you are missing (and I am going by your numbers, not saying that 70% uptime is achievable) are a dps loss to the group of around 3-4k per dps, so 10-15k total.

The missing fury uptime is another dps loss.

The missing protection uptime is a huge survival loss.

Celestial stats are missing boon uptime. It is one of their main crucial flaws in the current game design. Your build is basically a jack of all healer/dps which lacks the essential boon support demanded from support builds. Making it a jack-of-half build in an arena where jack-of-all builds are already struggling.

In short: any pure harrier support or quickness brand (either power or condi) would be of more value to your group. Give the dps loss due to lacking boons, a full harrier healer would improve the groups overall dps enough to make it surpass your 12-13k dps. A quickness brand would lose the mediocre healing and instead increase the groups dps through permanent boons and put out twice your personal dps at the very least.

the dmg in harrier is low dmg and u cant get the fury 100 % uptime on that. When u do this build you have high dmg in burning book and i think you need to try it to understand. when you have celestial stats most of the time i use the power part of FB i can go more into Burning and try axe but i dont have that yet so that why i use GS.

-1 major give 1381 - 2 minor give 961 - 3 stats give Total 3303here u see i get about 2/3 of what the minor get so i lose some but 2/3 its not that much. and if u look at Major stats that is power celestial give total in dmg stats 2556power give 639crit hit give 639crit dmg give 639condition dmg give 639

-2 major give 1173 - 2 minor give 633 -4 stats give total 3612and there i get more stats then the minor and that is why its not better if u go for minor healing or dmg

-7 major celestial give u 639 and total 4473Celestial give 861 stats more then 4 stats in total and that is what im getting the free tank from and the 3 stats harrrier's have low dmg beside celestial. i think u see only full support and full dmg as a good build but you are missing the big picture.

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@Sylli.3891 said:

@Sylli.3891 said:im playing Fb as a Celestial FB and it work wonders i dont have the magic number but i can support/dps and tank at the same time, The celestial Fb is jack of all trads but master of non i have no problem getting the DPS on 13-15 k dmg. FB can use the utility from all stats to help it and can be a good baby sitter in most dungeon/fractal here is my build

That build has 0 boon duration. Now with Fractal Potions and Boon duration food and Sigil of concentration that might be fine (you have neither boon duration food nor sigil of concentration in that build).

What you linked to is basically a mediocre healer build and mediocre damage build with low boon support and duration.

Sorry, but unless you forgot something, that build can be improved on, a lot.

you dont know the meaning in jack of all trads, you dont have to use the same traits and that the point of the build u can go for what u need and is was never a full support or max dps but the utility is great i dont see use for boon duration but u can go and swap the runes out to get it, i have no problem having full uptime on Reg/Retaliation/might/fury/ i get about 70 % on quickness and about 40 % on stab. but u cant do dps when u laying down on u full max dmg build i see that way to offen, this way u can help the group and still do ok dmg. its only build for a team not to rush fractal or dungeon but the runs are way more smooth. if u look at it this way u have 5 player and ea player do about 20 % dmg. i give up 10 % dmg and i give quickness that give 50% faster attack speed so i can buff the team more then we lose from the 10% dps. I can still give out boons and heal if needed and its was never a T4 fractal or raid build but its soild

What is the point of the build?

I could rework the build with diviner and harrier to:
  • provide permanent stability, quickness, protection, fury and regeneration
  • provide way better healing and damage

Those 30% quickness uptime you are missing (and I am going by your numbers, not saying that 70% uptime is achievable) are a dps loss to the group of around 3-4k per dps, so 10-15k total.

The missing fury uptime is another dps loss.

The missing protection uptime is a huge survival loss.

Celestial stats are missing boon uptime. It is one of their main crucial flaws in the current game design. Your build is basically a jack of all healer/dps which lacks the essential boon support demanded from support builds. Making it a jack-of-half build in an arena where jack-of-all builds are already struggling.

In short: any pure harrier support or quickness brand (either power or condi) would be of more value to your group. Give the dps loss due to lacking boons, a full harrier healer would improve the groups overall dps enough to make it surpass your 12-13k dps. A quickness brand would lose the mediocre healing and instead increase the groups dps through permanent boons and put out twice your personal dps at the very least.

the dmg in harrier is low dmg and u cant get the fury 100 % uptime on that.

Yes you can, I do so regularly. Axe 2 or even sword 2 (which is strait up inferior to axe) is sufficient. You are wrong.

You also provide permanent protection (which will be a significant advantage over you mediocre healing).

Permanent stability is not as required since an experienced Firebrand can trigger stability on demand if needed, it is nice to have though.

@Sylli.3891 said:When u do this build you have high dmg in burning book and i think you need to try it to understand.

You do not have high burning damage or high damage. Check the math behind damage calculation, this is plain wrong. Also your assumption you are 10% behind a pure dps is hilarious. Damage calculation in this game reward stat and multiplier stacking. This has been known since 2013, back when celestial was semi good since boon duration did not exist.

@Sylli.3891 said:when you have celestial stats most of the time i use the power part of FB i can go more into Burning and try axe but i dont have that yet so that why i use GS.

-1 major give 1381 - 2 minor give 961 - 3 stats give Total 3303here u see i get about 2/3 of what the minor get so i lose some but 2/3 its not that much. and if u look at Major stats that is power celestial give total in dmg stats 2556power give 639crit hit give 639crit dmg give 639condition dmg give 639

-2 major give 1173 - 2 minor give 633 -4 stats give total 3612and there i get more stats then the minor and that is why its not better if u go for minor healing or dmg

-7 major celestial give u 639 and total 4473Celestial give 861 stats more then 4 stats in total and that is what im getting the free tank from and the 3 stats harrrier's have low dmg beside celestial. i think u see only full support and full dmg as a good build but you are missing the big picture.

This is 2019, if you don't understand how damage in this game works and how stat stacking works and still consider celestial good for pve, that is not my problem. Total stats matter not when 2/7th of the stats are strait up useless (vitality and toughness add nothing to your group) and the remaining stats lack one of the most powerful multipliers in the game (boon duration for boon up-time). You are now relying on a pure support or a second mediocre jack-of-all-trades build to come in and cover for the lacking boon support. Both are a significant dps loss to the group.

I'm going to repeat again, celestial is lacking boon duration. The loss in boon up-time alone will let a pure support build boost the groups performance past your personal dps while providing way superior healing. The quickbrand offensive support build will destroy you in terms of personal dps and group boon support to group.

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