Holy kitten, thank you Anet team for a great story this episode! (Spoilers!) - Page 2 — Guild Wars 2 Forums

Holy kitten, thank you Anet team for a great story this episode! (Spoilers!)

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  • Gambino.2109Gambino.2109 Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 9, 2019

    Honestly.. it did feel like your team we're not hitting it off as well as they could have

  • Teratus.2859Teratus.2859 Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 9, 2019

    @Ashantara.8731 said:

    @ZDragon.3046 said:

    @Ashantara.8731 said:

    @ZDragon.3046 said:
    I don't think Aurene is gone for good though, simply too many key factors say otherwise.

    There are crystal spikes driven through her body. Are you kidding me? ;)

    Whats your point. Its a magical world.

    There are still rules to this world, and Aurene is DEAD. Do you want her to return as a zombie (Zhaitan magic) or Lich (Palawa Joko)?

    Death is a funny thing in this game.

    Yeah I suspect that Aurine is very much dead dead at this point.
    She can't come back the same way we did and she can't revive herself like Joko either.

    But since Kralkatorrik is essentially invincible now that she's gone we are going to need her back and I expect Kralkatorrik himself will be responsible for doing this.
    Anet has put a fair bit of focus on Kralkatorrik having Zhaitan magic.. there is even dialogue during the fight of him using it.
    My guess is that Kralkatorrik who has eliminated the threat of Aurine and suffered severe damage from the recent battle will seek to recover from his wounds and since he's also lacking a champion (that we killed in Jahai) he will take advantage of Aurines corpse.. branding it from death and reviving her under his control.
    Season 6 prediction then involves seeking out the forgotten and learning how they broke Glint free from her corruption in the past so that we can replicate the process on Aurine regaining our most powerful ally and our only viabile solution to killing Kralkatorrik.
    His influence will likely empower her as well making her bigger and stronger and once freed she will have even more power to use against him the next time we face off.

  • Cant wait till the next fight with Godzilla. =)

  • @Gehenna.3625 said:
    Sure but just because you or I might meta-think that one through, doesn't justify what our characters do. There is no indication of our character and the alliance around them having that discussion. So we learned we shouldn't kill anymore dragons and then we go out to kill another one just the same. Without a reason in the story to change our mind on that, the plan was just to go out and kill another dragon and that's a pretty daft thing to do.

    We've had that conversation, though. I cannot for the life of me remeber exactly when, but it was around the time when Aurene gobbled up part of Balthazar's magic. We destroyed the spear because letting the dragon magic run wild would, according to Taimi, destroy Tyria. Later, it is discussed that Aurene could take Kralkatorrik's magic into herself and thus he could be killed safely. Its the only reason we are trying to kill Kralk. Ill see if i cant pin down exactly when it happened, but i know its in there.

  • Ashantara.8731Ashantara.8731 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Katastroff.1045 said:
    Cant wait till the next fight with Godzilla. =)

    Yes!! More poking its eye! (LOL) =)

    @Teratus.2859 said:
    But since Kralkatorrik is essentially invincible now that she's gone we are going to need her back and I expect Kralkatorrik himself will be responsible for doing this.

    Well, what would be the point then to our benefit? An undead Aurene under Kralkatorrik's control won't be of any use to us nor would she be able to replace him (as we would need a living dragon for that, or else Glint could have returned from the Mists to do the job ;) ).


    My GW2 content charts: (1) LWS 4, (2) PoF , (3) Personal story (pre-Claw Island/Orr) , (4) LWS 2 , (5) HoT, (6) Orr campaign , (7) LWS 3

  • ZDragon.3046ZDragon.3046 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Ashantara.8731 said:

    @ZDragon.3046 said:

    @Ashantara.8731 said:

    @ZDragon.3046 said:
    I don't think Aurene is gone for good though, simply too many key factors say otherwise.

    There are crystal spikes driven through her body. Are you kidding me? ;)

    Whats your point. Its a magical world.

    There are still rules to this world, and Aurene is DEAD. Do you want her to return as a zombie (Zhaitan magic) or Lich (Palawa Joko)?

    @ZDragon.3046 said:

    @phs.6089 said:
    What happened with magic Aurine suppose to let out if she is gone, I wonder?

    See this guy gets it :+1: :# ;)

    Their question about the energy that has LEFT Aurene's body when she died was completely unrelated to your funny claims.

    Your way of thinking is rather closed minded if i do say so. It has EVERYTHING to do with the whole point of why we cant and shouldn't go willy nilly killing anymore elder dragons. Because they release tons of magic on death. The fact that we didnt directly see this happen with Aurene leaves the possibility open that she will in some way be brought back to some one who is rather observant to the actions of past events in the game.
    Vlast was not an elder dragon and died and on death exploded releasing the magical energy that was within his body while leaving no trace of his body other than Crystals scattered all over.
    We know that Aurene was strong and had quite a bit of magical energy built up inside her in fact this whole time she has been getting stronger so why... ON HER DEATH would she not share a similar result to every other dragon of power and relevance we have seen thus far.

    Im sorry but its completely related to my so called "Funny claims"

  • perilisk.1874perilisk.1874 Member ✭✭✭

    @Ashantara.8731 said:
    How could Ascension bring her back? It is not a ritual to revive the dead, now is it? At least I don't remember it as that from GW1. ;)

    I seriously doubt it's the direction they'll go, but one of the trials involved fighting a doppelganger of yourself. So, if she could perform Ascension magic, she could maybe have done a bait and switch to fool Kraalkatorik. I doubt it, though.

    Alternatively, with no gods, and with her having god essence now, maybe we need her in the Mists to start enabling mortals to ascend again. Maybe "Ascension" is the weapon that enables mortals to do the work of dragons, though that doesn't make much sense -- Balthazar wouldn't need it, or would already have access, or something.

    Another possibility is that Glint gave her the equivalent of the blessing Kormir received, but it just primed her for becoming a god/dragon/whatever. Actually triggering the change then required eating a massive burst of living energy point-blank, and only her spirit actually transformed. Though, you would expect her body to be vaporized in that case.

    It could be the Joko thing though -- some people don't like it, but it would make a more coherent story out of the season, since the first three episodes would be as critical for the conclusion as the last two. There were out-of-game hints that Arenanet planned for Aurene to become undead at some point, IIRC.

  • Ashantara.8731Ashantara.8731 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 9, 2019

    @perilisk.1874 said:
    It could be the Joko thing though -- some people don't like it, but it would make a more coherent story out of the season, since the first three episodes would be as critical for the conclusion as the last two. There were out-of-game hints that Arenanet planned for Aurene to become undead at some point, IIRC.

    Really? For that to work, she would have needed to be dead already (but she died as a living being with no precautions being taken to resurrect her) and have someone to resurrect her. Also, her body would have needed to be intact and not mangled like that (even an undead needs some physical basics to function properly ;) ).

    If that is what they have planned for an upcoming plot line, I will go berserk, because I am so tired of dragon-related kitten as main plot. I thought we would be done with it soon and move on to something more inspiring, but no such luck. :/


    My GW2 content charts: (1) LWS 4, (2) PoF , (3) Personal story (pre-Claw Island/Orr) , (4) LWS 2 , (5) HoT, (6) Orr campaign , (7) LWS 3

  • ZDragon.3046ZDragon.3046 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 9, 2019

    @Teratus.2859 said:

    @Ashantara.8731 said:

    @ZDragon.3046 said:

    @Ashantara.8731 said:

    @ZDragon.3046 said:
    I don't think Aurene is gone for good though, simply too many key factors say otherwise.

    There are crystal spikes driven through her body. Are you kidding me? ;)

    Whats your point. Its a magical world.

    There are still rules to this world, and Aurene is DEAD. Do you want her to return as a zombie (Zhaitan magic) or Lich (Palawa Joko)?

    Death is a funny thing in this game.

    Yeah I suspect that Aurine is very much dead dead at this point.
    She can't come back the same way we did and she can't revive herself like Joko either.

    But since Kralkatorrik is essentially invincible now that she's gone we are going to need her back and I expect Kralkatorrik himself will be responsible for doing this.
    Anet has put a fair bit of focus on Kralkatorrik having Zhaitan magic.. there is even dialogue during the fight of him using it.
    My guess is that Kralkatorrik who has eliminated the threat of Aurine and suffered severe damage from the recent battle will seek to recover from his wounds and since he's also lacking a champion (that we killed in Jahai) he will take advantage of Aurines corpse.. branding it from death and reviving her under his control.
    Season 6 prediction then involves seeking out the forgotten and learning how they broke Glint free from her corruption in the past so that we can replicate the process on Aurine regaining our most powerful ally and our only viabile solution to killing Kralkatorrik.
    His influence will likely empower her as well making her bigger and stronger and once freed she will have even more power to use against him the next time we face off.

    This is a very possible idea and there is still the idea of Cathie too. She has always been a bit of a shady character and its possible that she still knows something that she may be keeping hidden from us. The bond she shared with Aurene appeared to be fading but we will have to wait and see if she fully returns to her normal self completely in the next bit before we can assume to much.

    To be honest I though that she was going to die to considering that kind of connection she shared with Aurene but she didn't.
    After the final trails Aurene was taken away from the player and clearly shown something during the same moment that we were being told about a world without Kralkatorrik. Its possible that Aurene already knew she would die and was just now brave enough to face it regardless of if she is DEAD DEAD or only kinda dead she will for sure make a return to us that I have very little doubt in.

    While i don't think we will be able to find any forgotten (considering most of them are.... all puns aside forgotten) aka dead or branded its not likely thats the solution. Glint mentioned something about having to be there for her and endure with her (2 things of which did not really come off strongly in the final fight or though the chapter outside of that trial) so while i think your ideal is a total possibility in regards to having to cleanse a death branded version of her. I don't think the forgotten will be an option we have.

    There is also the possibility that Kralk has no reason to brand Aurene either. He could have just rebranded Glint when he went for her but didn't and just killed her instead. In truth we dont know what Kralk is going to do thats part of what makes him such a good character in the plot of it all. If he is thoughtful he might not want to risk the same mistake again as he did with Glint and knowing that it means he wont want to brand her why not just leave her dead dead. If he did that he technically already won.

    The story open to a lot of things right now but i think going in hopes of saving the world without an Aurene is highly unlikely. ;)

  • perilisk.1874perilisk.1874 Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 9, 2019

    @Ashantara.8731 said:

    @perilisk.1874 said:
    It could be the Joko thing though -- some people don't like it, but it would make a more coherent story out of the season, since the first three episodes would be as critical for the conclusion as the last two. There were out-of-game hints that Arenanet planned for Aurene to become undead at some point, IIRC.

    Really? For that to work, she would have needed to be dead already (but she died as a living being, so...) and have someone to resurrect her. If that is what they planned for an upcoming plot line, I will go berserk, because I am so tired of dragon-related kitten as main plot. I thought we would be done with it soon and move on to something more inspiring, but no such luck. ;)

    She didn't eat an Awakened, she ate Joko, who could self-resurrect. The rumors of her mortality could be drastically... overstated. We've never seen ordinary necromancy do what Joko could do (endlessly create fully sapient thralls and self-revive). I suspect he somehow got his hands on divine magic, though I doubt they'll bother explaining it. But we have seen that when dragons consume divine and draconic magics, they retain much of their original nature, rather than being converted into the dragon's own magic. Anyway, there's a chance that the Awakening magic is still functional inside Aurene, much like Zafirah can sense Balthazar's presence.

    Plus, with the Awakened, there's a whole "undead are people too" thing going on all season to soften the blow of our dragon being awakened. Not like crystal rots anyway... Aurene's magic combined with Joko's is more like transfiguration than undeath.

    And they put an Awakened sylvari in the last instance to establish that dragon minions can be Awakened -- this is probably not just coincidence.

  • Zagerus.8675Zagerus.8675 Member ✭✭
    edited January 9, 2019

    I agree. Little hard to find words right now but.. I've never went so fast from feeling like a Hero who's helping to answer the call of destiny to.. well. Best patch ever (again.)

  • coso.9173coso.9173 Member ✭✭✭

    this was really awesome to be honest. i have been moved by gw2 just a few times, and this is one of them. congratulations! it was really shocking and sad ending, but awesome.
    Also, is it me or when kralkatorric fires his beam at us in the final battle, we can see mordremoth, baltazaar and... bubbles? i wasn't able to see correctly, what was that that appeared next to him?

  • Teratus.2859Teratus.2859 Member ✭✭✭

    @Ashantara.8731 said:

    @Katastroff.1045 said:
    Cant wait till the next fight with Godzilla. =)

    Yes!! More poking its eye! (LOL) =)

    @Teratus.2859 said:
    But since Kralkatorrik is essentially invincible now that she's gone we are going to need her back and I expect Kralkatorrik himself will be responsible for doing this.

    Well, what would be the point then to our benefit? An undead Aurene under Kralkatorrik's control won't be of any use to us nor would she be able to replace him (as we would need a living dragon for that, or else Glint could have returned from the Mists to do the job ;) ).

    She wouldn't be dead technically.. Branded isn't undeath it's something else.. we typically just say corrupted.
    Glint was Kralkatorriks original champion and she was freed from his corruption.. if branded was undeath then Glint would have been regarded as an undead being.

  • Teratus.2859Teratus.2859 Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 9, 2019

    @ZDragon.3046 said:

    @Teratus.2859 said:

    @Ashantara.8731 said:

    @ZDragon.3046 said:

    @Ashantara.8731 said:

    @ZDragon.3046 said:
    I don't think Aurene is gone for good though, simply too many key factors say otherwise.

    There are crystal spikes driven through her body. Are you kidding me? ;)

    Whats your point. Its a magical world.

    There are still rules to this world, and Aurene is DEAD. Do you want her to return as a zombie (Zhaitan magic) or Lich (Palawa Joko)?

    Death is a funny thing in this game.

    Yeah I suspect that Aurine is very much dead dead at this point.
    She can't come back the same way we did and she can't revive herself like Joko either.

    But since Kralkatorrik is essentially invincible now that she's gone we are going to need her back and I expect Kralkatorrik himself will be responsible for doing this.
    Anet has put a fair bit of focus on Kralkatorrik having Zhaitan magic.. there is even dialogue during the fight of him using it.
    My guess is that Kralkatorrik who has eliminated the threat of Aurine and suffered severe damage from the recent battle will seek to recover from his wounds and since he's also lacking a champion (that we killed in Jahai) he will take advantage of Aurines corpse.. branding it from death and reviving her under his control.
    Season 6 prediction then involves seeking out the forgotten and learning how they broke Glint free from her corruption in the past so that we can replicate the process on Aurine regaining our most powerful ally and our only viabile solution to killing Kralkatorrik.
    His influence will likely empower her as well making her bigger and stronger and once freed she will have even more power to use against him the next time we face off.

    While i don't think we will be able to find any forgotten (considering most of them are.... all puns aside forgotten) aka dead or branded its not likely thats the solution. Glint mentioned something about having to be there for her and endure with her (2 things of which did not really come off strongly in the final fight or though the chapter outside of that trial) so while i think your ideal is a total possibility in regards to having to cleanse a death branded version of her. I don't think the forgotten will be an option we have.

    Well we still know of them.. the Forgotten were involved in Path of Fire as we saw and learned a little but no living members of the race have been seen in the game.
    We thought the Mursaat were all gone too and yet one returned and was impersonated.
    If I am right about Aurine being revivebranded then the Forgotten are the only ones with the knowledge on how to free her and it would be cool to go and track them down to learn how.
    I've long wanted to see them again in this franchise ^^
    The only living members would likely be in the mists and we've kinda made a habit of going there for answers lately.

    There is also the possibility that Kralk has no reason to brand Aurene either. He could have just rebranded Glint when he went for her but didn't and just killed her instead. In truth we dont know what Kralk is going to do thats part of what makes him such a good character in the plot of it all. If he is thoughtful he might not want to risk the same mistake again as he did with Glint and knowing that it means he wont want to brand her why not just leave her dead dead. If he did that he technically already won.

    The story open to a lot of things right now but i think going in hopes of saving the world without an Aurene is highly unlikely. ;)

    He might not have had the chance to rebrand Glint.. she didn't oppose him alone and I think she actually sacrificed herself during that battle and at the time Kralkatorrik did not possess the ability to brand the dead.
    He may have had a new champion Shatterer at that point as well.
    Kralkatorrik has recently lost his Death Branded Shatterer Champion and we've seen no other dragons under his control.. a few wyverns but no dragons.
    It's possible that he may brand Aurine because he lacks a champion right now and she is far more powerful than anything else in his army and it may be easier for him to brand her corpse than revive the Shatterer again.. plus Shatterer has proven to be a failure against the moral races on two different occasions.

    Aurine was Kralks biggest threat but in his weakened state he may fear we could take advantage and finish him off.. after all Aurine didn't do all this damage to him on her own.
    I don't know if Kralkatorrik knows that his death would end the world without a replacement but his fear of a world without him tends to hint that he is not aware of this and thus does not know that without a replacement we cannot kill him.
    That fear could be the reason he seeks a new champion to protect him while he recovers from his wounds.. that could be why he may brand Aurine.
    More so if he thinks that the ritual used to free Glint has been lost to time and that the only race who knew how to perform it have gone extinct.

  • Gehenna.3625Gehenna.3625 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Sevifor.1925 said:

    @Gehenna.3625 said:
    Sure but just because you or I might meta-think that one through, doesn't justify what our characters do. There is no indication of our character and the alliance around them having that discussion. So we learned we shouldn't kill anymore dragons and then we go out to kill another one just the same. Without a reason in the story to change our mind on that, the plan was just to go out and kill another dragon and that's a pretty daft thing to do.

    We've had that conversation, though. I cannot for the life of me remeber exactly when, but it was around the time when Aurene gobbled up part of Balthazar's magic. We destroyed the spear because letting the dragon magic run wild would, according to Taimi, destroy Tyria. Later, it is discussed that Aurene could take Kralkatorrik's magic into herself and thus he could be killed safely. Its the only reason we are trying to kill Kralk. Ill see if i cant pin down exactly when it happened, but i know its in there.

    Ahh well if that happened then I missed that. I will admit that sometimes I drift off because some conversations seem to go on forever, but if that's the case that would explain it for sure.

    "In my experience, if you can't say what you mean, you can never mean what you say. The details are everything." ~ Minister Durano

  • sorudo.9054sorudo.9054 Member ✭✭✭✭

    congrats, for ones in my GW2 times i am in awe.
    the sheer details gone into the zone is stunning, the story is really good and it finally made me cry from the inside when i saw aurene impaled.

  • Falan.1839Falan.1839 Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 10, 2019

    The cinemats were good, but the fights were just boring as hell. I actually managed myself to get stuck on the way to the final fight and ended up in the wall. I was still occasionally hit there, but kept getting out of combat, meanwhile Aurene fought Kralkatorrik without me and actually without taking damage. So eventually she did the whole fight without me while I was deperately trying to get myself killed to get out of the kitten wall. Quite the underwhelming experience, and frankly in line with the fights before. Like, killing a few trash mobs close to the pillar with 3 extra buffs? Really?

    Falásya / Caissech

  • Svennis.3852Svennis.3852 Member ✭✭✭

    I legit cried. That ending was TRAUMATIZING (in the best way possible). Not much gets me emotional, but just the seer storytelling with the walk of doom opening on the exact pose of Aurene's death that we foresaw in her vision.

    ADSLKFJNadsflkjnSA DFLKJ BHSDFVLKAJS CNVLKJ ALKSJNFKSL;DJVN ALSKFJNVA;LSKFNVM'ALDKSVMF;s

  • Clyan.1593Clyan.1593 Member ✭✭✭

    @Chasind.3128 said:
    The story made me feel like an errand boy
    It made me realize that my teammates are morons and once again, your efforts are pointless bc youre taking on the role of supporting character.

    Oh boy, here we go again. In what sense are you a supporting character? You are that anyway, no matter what. Every hero is in support of anything.

  • that was awesome
    I was in shock, numb. What that can't be right
    I am the hero, I need to get to that shield spell, maybe I needed to jump down that hole
    I was just standing in the wrong place, it was rushed things happened to fast, I was not ready.
    then I go to that dark place in my child hood and hear Vader's voice "I am your father"

    my daughter was sitting next to me she has this angry-hurt look on her face, intense eyes boring into me
    and she was looking at me like it was my fault
    I begin to think maybe it is my fault am I somehow future Kralkatorrik, did I want this to happen
    i no longer feel sad but start feeling rather guilty.
    how does she know? How does she know?
    no....no that has to be way too dark.
    almost in tears she demanded that "I do it again again, and do it right this time!"
    thankfully she stormed off after that.

  • Talindra.4958Talindra.4958 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Okami Amaterasu.9237 said:
    Holy Kitten Kitten, thank you ArenaNet for another amazing episode! I’ve been waiting a long, long time to see in the story when

    our plans eventually backfire and we fail so incredibly, enormously disastrously just right after promising that everything will be alright. Having Kralkatorrik withstand our assault and then break through Aurene’s defense of us and end up impaling and killing her with Brand was so marvelous and absolutely fantastic! Not only was the shot of Kralk slithering away creepy and ominous, but the whole “slow, uh oh what just happened walk” in the branded destruction with Taimi's? eerie cries echoing in the background really built up the suspense towards that moment and I absolutely loved it. I suppose my only nitpick this time would be the first instance and how it was a little slow, especially with just crystalline sound effects and no actual music, but oh well. If what we get in return are more cutscenes and story development like what we had here, then I really, really don’t care about the little things like that. This was well worth the wait, and I can't wait to see what happens next! Please don't resurrect her, please, thank you.

    Once again, I absolutely loved the story. The map is very, very pretty and I loved the verticality to parts of it, reminding me of Verdant Brink in parts and Frostgorge Sound in others. It felt Dwarven, which is something we've needed ever since Lornar's Pass and Dredgehaunt Cliffs. And with the episode's ending, I have no idea where we'll go next, but at least we got out of the desert this time!

    This sound sarcastic... The whole thing was like a big joke. I dont like any of the story. There's so many ways to end this.. they have picked the easiest.

    Death is Energy [DIE] in EU
    Envoy's Herald, CoZ, VitV, DD, SS, The Eternal, LNHB, Champion Magus, Champion Phantom, Wondrous Achiever etc.

  • Talindra.4958Talindra.4958 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @chopsaki.3021 said:
    that was awesome
    I was in shock, numb. What that can't be right
    I am the hero, I need to get to that shield spell, maybe I needed to jump down that hole
    I was just standing in the wrong place, it was rushed things happened to fast, I was not ready.
    then I go to that dark place in my child hood and hear Vader's voice "I am your father"

    my daughter was sitting next to me she has this angry-hurt look on her face, intense eyes boring into me
    and she was looking at me like it was my fault
    I begin to think maybe it is my fault am I somehow future Kralkatorrik, did I want this to happen
    i no longer feel sad but start feeling rather guilty.
    how does she know? How does she know?
    no....no that has to be way too dark.
    almost in tears she demanded that "I do it again again, and do it right this time!"
    thankfully she stormed off after that.

    I had my 8yo daughter, myself and my hub doing the story together.. no one say anything at the end. We just walk away from the computer and I said to all time to sleep let's go.. silly game silly story...

    Death is Energy [DIE] in EU
    Envoy's Herald, CoZ, VitV, DD, SS, The Eternal, LNHB, Champion Magus, Champion Phantom, Wondrous Achiever etc.

  • ProtoGunner.4953ProtoGunner.4953 Member ✭✭✭✭

    It really seem that a great amount of gw2 players never played high quality story telling single player games like Metal Gear Solid, Final Fantasy or God of War. This is nothing special, I really don't get the hype. It wasn't bad for an MMO though.

  • @Talindra.4958 said:
    This sound sarcastic... The whole thing was like a big joke. I dont like any of the story. There's so many ways to end this.. they have picked the easiest.

    You would have preferred if we had killed Kralkatorrik right then and there? When he had just consumed Even More Magic after Balthazar's death by going into the Mists and consuming that magic there? What a way to diffuse any Weight behind the story if we could just kill him so easily the very first try after "he's even more powerful now!".

    The whole Destiny's Edge team (except Logan who had a date with Jenna) along with Glint herself (who was far more experienced than Aurene) couldn't defeat Kralkatorrik when he was just the Crystal Dragon. Now he is the Crystal + Plant/Mind + Death/Shadow + Balthazar (Bloodstone, Primordus, Jormag, Mists) + more Mists - Dragon. You think we can beat him with just most of Dragon's Watch (where are you Marjory and Kasmeer?), the allies we've gained since Path of Fire and LWS4 (which amounts to about the same number of people as the Pact before they launched their fleet into Verdant Brink and still lost, against Just the Jungle Dragon), and an adolescent, inexperienced Aurene? Aurene even had a vision of all of the futures where she faces Kralkatorrik right now and she Died in every single one of them. We rushed it.

    Do you think after all of that if we had won it would have been a better story?
    Do you think if we had lost but had no actual consequences for losing, it'd be a better story?

    Personally, I'm really satisfied with this ending as it leaves us confused, saddened, and now even more vengeful against Kralkatorrik, whom we still have to deal with before he ultimately Brands over Tyria. I'm excited to see how Aurene's death affects everyone, how it affects their perception of us and our judgement, and how we're going to manage to bring everyone together again to fight Kralkatorrik once more, but killing him For Good this time. Also, we need to see his whole body. Until we see his whole body, I'll think we're gonna lose in that fight. Anyway, time to explore more of the new map, so see y'all there!

  • googel.3278googel.3278 Member ✭✭✭

    Final Fantasy makes GW2 look like a pebble. People playing GW2 often worships these fashion skins, so ofc the story isnt going to be good.

  • @googel.3278 said:
    Final Fantasy makes GW2 look like a pebble. People playing GW2 often worships these fashion skins, so ofc the story isnt going to be good.

    There are good parts and bad parts to every story; the authors are only human after all. Unless you think there is a "perfect story" for the MMORPG genre to base itself around, I'll look at things circumstantially and not just make blanket statements about any game's story as a whole, especially without speaking any evidence. What parts do you not like and what do you think can be done better next time?

  • Talindra.4958Talindra.4958 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Okami Amaterasu.9237 said:

    @Talindra.4958 said:
    This sound sarcastic... The whole thing was like a big joke. I dont like any of the story. There's so many ways to end this.. they have picked the easiest.

    You would have preferred if we had killed Kralkatorrik right then and there? When he had just consumed Even More Magic after Balthazar's death by going into the Mists and consuming that magic there? What a way to diffuse any Weight behind the story if we could just kill him so easily the very first try after "he's even more powerful now!".

    The whole Destiny's Edge team (except Logan who had a date with Jenna) along with Glint herself (who was far more experienced than Aurene) couldn't defeat Kralkatorrik when he was just the Crystal Dragon. Now he is the Crystal + Plant/Mind + Death/Shadow + Balthazar (Bloodstone, Primordus, Jormag, Mists) + more Mists - Dragon. You think we can beat him with just most of Dragon's Watch (where are you Marjory and Kasmeer?), the allies we've gained since Path of Fire and LWS4 (which amounts to about the same number of people as the Pact before they launched their fleet into Verdant Brink and still lost, against Just the Jungle Dragon), and an adolescent, inexperienced Aurene? Aurene even had a vision of all of the futures where she faces Kralkatorrik right now and she Died in every single one of them. We rushed it.

    Do you think after all of that if we had won it would have been a better story?
    Do you think if we had lost but had no actual consequences for losing, it'd be a better story?

    Personally, I'm really satisfied with this ending as it leaves us confused, saddened, and now even more vengeful against Kralkatorrik, whom we still have to deal with before he ultimately Brands over Tyria. I'm excited to see how Aurene's death affects everyone, how it affects their perception of us and our judgement, and how we're going to manage to bring everyone together again to fight Kralkatorrik once more, but killing him For Good this time. Also, we need to see his whole body. Until we see his whole body, I'll think we're gonna lose in that fight. Anyway, time to explore more of the new map, so see y'all there!

    No.. I don't prefer we defeat the elder dragon right there in such a short time.

    Death is Energy [DIE] in EU
    Envoy's Herald, CoZ, VitV, DD, SS, The Eternal, LNHB, Champion Magus, Champion Phantom, Wondrous Achiever etc.

  • Bast Bow.2958Bast Bow.2958 Member ✭✭
    edited January 11, 2019

    Pretty marvelous writing this is. (trying) To get players somewhat emotionally attached to Aurene and then letting her die. Now who DOESN'T want to play the next episode to see what's up next? Bravo Anet. This isn't sarcasm btw.
    Personality I really do hope she'll revive in some way. But it shouldn't happen too much to main characters, you'll withhold getting fond of a character if main characters are dropping by the bunch but also getting revived again. People get trust issues and it’ll lose a certain depth. That shouldn't happen.

  • Chasind.3128Chasind.3128 Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 12, 2019

    My complaint: I waited this long for this little of a story? And on top of that, doing the same things --gathering, tasks, nothing new for this new content. The story was OKAY at best. It was predictable what was going to happen, if you've followed the very short past instances you knew and know what is going to occur. It's like a Thanos with the Gauntlet scenario-- what is dead wont stay dead

    I've felt no real attachment to any of the characters, there isn't much to them that makes you feel warm and fuzzy or struck in a way that some characters do to you. If anyone has played any game of any relevance with an amazing story (like baldurs gate or even elder scrolls or dragon age) You'd know what I meant. There is a lack of that in this game.

    I wasn't in awe or sad really, it sucked a little but we all knew it was coming. I wasn't shook like everyone seems to be, I don't understand why.

    Where was I supposed to be wow'd with this? I'm not trolling or hating... it's just I don't think this game harbors interest in my kind of playerbase anymore and it favors more so to the 2 hour sunday player.

  • Donari.5237Donari.5237 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Gehenna.3625 said:

    @Wizler.8192 said:

    @Gehenna.3625 said:
    Well, last episode we learned that we shouldn't kill anymore dragons because it's bad for the world. Soooo....we go out and try to kill another dragon.

    I always expected that Aurene would replace Kralkatorrik which made it safe to kill him (she would absorb his magic to prevent world instability). And of course she was on our side which made it safe.

    Sure but just because you or I might meta-think that one through, doesn't justify what our characters do. There is no indication of our character and the alliance around them having that discussion. So we learned we shouldn't kill anymore dragons and then we go out to kill another one just the same. Without a reason in the story to change our mind on that, the plan was just to go out and kill another dragon and that's a pretty daft thing to do.

    I am pretty sure it was directly spelled out in the PoF and subsequent stories that the Commander and friends were thinking Aurene (and Vlast, before we lost him) could stand in to help with the balance of magic. Based on the vision of the pyramid, anyway. I hope Sevifor can find the specifics.

  • Gehenna.3625Gehenna.3625 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Donari.5237 said:

    @Gehenna.3625 said:

    @Wizler.8192 said:

    @Gehenna.3625 said:
    Well, last episode we learned that we shouldn't kill anymore dragons because it's bad for the world. Soooo....we go out and try to kill another dragon.

    I always expected that Aurene would replace Kralkatorrik which made it safe to kill him (she would absorb his magic to prevent world instability). And of course she was on our side which made it safe.

    Sure but just because you or I might meta-think that one through, doesn't justify what our characters do. There is no indication of our character and the alliance around them having that discussion. So we learned we shouldn't kill anymore dragons and then we go out to kill another one just the same. Without a reason in the story to change our mind on that, the plan was just to go out and kill another dragon and that's a pretty daft thing to do.

    I am pretty sure it was directly spelled out in the PoF and subsequent stories that the Commander and friends were thinking Aurene (and Vlast, before we lost him) could stand in to help with the balance of magic. Based on the vision of the pyramid, anyway. I hope Sevifor can find the specifics.

    Well it is entirely possible that I missed it or just had a different interpretation/expectation of what was said because they made such a big deal out of not killing dragons anymore before that. I do have a vague memory of this now that it was mentioned but it clearly didn't make much of an impression on me lol.

    "In my experience, if you can't say what you mean, you can never mean what you say. The details are everything." ~ Minister Durano

  • Tachenon.5270Tachenon.5270 Member ✭✭✭

    My thought was that Aurene somehow magicked her mind into Kralkatorrik's body and the real battle is taking place there.

  • Carighan.6758Carighan.6758 Member ✭✭✭✭

    It's interesting, I had nearly the opposite reaction. To me this is a really bad episode. Not in idea, the ending idea is neat. The execution however:

    • The ending also lacks emotional impact. The key death we were foretold. That we lost... umm... we do that a lot? HoT beginning? Fleet entirely wasted? Important character deaths happen frequently? Defense of Lion's Arch and it getting destroyed? It's nothing truly special, pretty as it was.
    • Most of the instances are terribly confusing due to the characters chatting in-realtime during the instance. While combat is ongoing. And colors flashing everywhere. I had to turn off most sounds just so I could actually follow what was happening.
    • There's no epilogue at all once you come out of the final instance. Nothing changed. Where's the big thing which just happened?
    • Ogden is an even worse Deus Ex Machina than Taimi is. And "the time wasn't right"? Oh yeah until Joko is dead, I forgot that's part of the "tell Heroes about Ultimate Weapon"-checklist, how silly of me, kill that which has no life is of course on there! :joy:
    • Way too much is automated. Combat feels weird, it should be oppressive, but everything just dies randomly because nothing is ever clearly shown due to the amount of purple flashing.
    • We have big K sitting there and yet we... get asked to look away from him. Most of the time.
    • Typical yak-shaving story, to do X we have to get Y done for which we need Z but we only get Z by helping A do B, bla bla. We're the Commander! Order minions to do it! Oversee minions doing it! Get stuff done!
    • The whole Caithe thing? Leftover art assets or what was that about? Lasted about 7 minutes I think though I didn't check the clock, granted.

    I would say if the very ending was the same but everything else changed, I think it'd be really good. But the way it is, it files in the typical "good idea, bad execution" I see so often in this game's story :pensive:

  • @Carighan.6758 said:
    It's interesting, I had nearly the opposite reaction. To me this is a really bad episode. Not in idea, the ending idea is neat. The execution however:

    • The ending also lacks emotional impact. The key death we were foretold. That we lost... umm... we do that a lot? HoT beginning? Fleet entirely wasted? Important character deaths happen frequently? Defense of Lion's Arch and it getting destroyed? It's nothing truly special, pretty as it was.

    We haven't had many important character deaths since Heart of Thorns. The people that died since HoT, as far as I can remember, were Demmi and Caudecus Beetlestone, Lazarus, Vlast, Ourself, Balthazar, Joko, and Blish. Out of those people, Balthazar and Joko were the most important, but they were both villains and we eventually Expected them to die. We didn't get to know Vlast all too well until after he died with his memory crystals and the Kesho instance. Blish was a nice character but he was just introduced in Ep 2 and then killed in Ep 4 while Gorrik is still available for further development. So I don't know what you mean when you say important character deaths happen frequently.

    Aurene has been with us however, technically since LWS2. More accurately it has been since Ep 2 of LWS3 when we saw her being born and hatched from the egg. We've seen her grow up and personally helped trained her; we've seen her be in serious peril and also come to help us when we needed it. I was beginning to worry that Aurene would become "the face of GW2" since she's been with us for so long, but it's all been building up to the moment when she dies. The theme for the past two episodes has been specifically that Aurene is our hope, our "star to guide us". We cannot defeat Kralkatorrik without her . . . but she dies anyway just like in her vision, no matter how much we didn't want to believe it. If that is not even just slightly emotionally impactful, if not at least shocking/surprising, then maybe you just didn't care for her anyway?

    • Most of the instances are terribly confusing due to the characters chatting in-realtime during the instance. While combat is ongoing. And colors flashing everywhere. I had to turn off most sounds just so I could actually follow what was happening.

    Yeah I admit, it can be a little hectic, especially the first time around. Maybe turn off post-processing in the graphics options so it isn't as brightly shiny and distracting if you want to hear every word of dialogue the first time you run through it?

    • There's no epilogue at all once you come out of the final instance. Nothing changed. Where's the big thing which just happened?

    "The big thing" that just happened was Aurene's Death. There's no epilogue because it's meant to be a moment of confusion, hopelessness, etc. Braham even asks aloud "What do we do now?" and we say "I don't know . . ." because it's a confusing, heartbreaking moment. We've put all our hope into Aurene until now and she Just died in front of us, ultimately because of us. It's not Meant to be immediately resolved afterwards with a scene that tells us where we're going next or what to do next.

    • Ogden is an even worse Deus Ex Machina than Taimi is. And "the time wasn't right"? Oh yeah until Joko is dead, I forgot that's part of the "tell Heroes about Ultimate Weapon"-checklist, how silly of me, kill that which has no life is of course on there! :joy:

    We don't know if Ogden even knows that Joko is dead (unless he has dialogue in the open world that I missed). He might have been waiting for Aurene and her champion to come to him when they thought they were ready to take on Kralkatorrik and needed advice on how to go about it. Even if he should have been in the story earlier, it's nowhere near a deus-ex-machina, especially not on the level of Taimi during Flashpoint in LWS3. Besides, "it's good to see him" anyway.

    • Way too much is automated. Combat feels weird, it should be oppressive, but everything just dies randomly because nothing is ever clearly shown due to the amount of purple flashing.

    Well, in the instance you have a lot of allied NPCs fighting the branded alongside you, and a battle isn't always "clear", naturally. But maybe you can adjust your settings so the branded effects don't bother you as much?

    • We have big K sitting there and yet we... get asked to look away from him. Most of the time.

    None of the objectives are timed, so you can stand there and look at Kralk gnashing and roaring at Aurene fighting him as long as you want, if you don't die to the branded mobs around you. Besides that, you get to fly over him twice cinematically just to get the scale and size of his head and neck compared to the giant room/chamber that you've trapped him in. You also fight his Eye directly and get a cutscene right afterwards that clearly shows him trying to kill you. Sure, we don't see his whole body, but since he's still alive and we're going to fight him again, we probably will once we're ready.

    • Typical yak-shaving story, to do X we have to get Y done for which we need Z but we only get Z by helping A do B, bla bla. We're the Commander! Order minions to do it! Oversee minions doing it! Get stuff done!

    You'd rather play a game where you order around your "minions" to go out and explore the new map and do events and help people instead of actually doing it yourself? That sounds more like a strategy game to me than an RPG . . .

    • The whole Caithe thing? Leftover art assets or what was that about? Lasted about 7 minutes I think though I didn't check the clock, granted.

    It gives Caithe some development as a character to be Aurene's "herald" or such. It gave her a purpose so we could reintroduce her back into the story this episode. Since Aurene is dead, however, things will have to change for Caithe next time. Maybe she's not "developing" or really "changing" much personality-wise, but would you rather have her just show up and join in the story for no reason and not change at all?

    I would say if the very ending was the same but everything else changed, I think it'd be really good. But the way it is, it files in the typical "good idea, bad execution" I see so often in this game's story :pensive:

    Everything else? You mean the other two instances? I think the first instance could've gone a little faster and/or added music, sure. I think the second instance was well-done and had a nice cutscene with Caithe and Aurene. Both of those instances developed the story/plot further so they're not "pointless" or anything. What would you want changed? The open-world stuff is meant to help extend the episode's playtime just a little. It also gives us a reason to explore parts of the new map and participate in the open world instead of just going from instance-instance-instance, done. How would you do it differently?

  • PseudoNewb.5468PseudoNewb.5468 Member ✭✭
    edited January 12, 2019

    @Carighan.6758 said:

    • There's no epilogue at all once you come out of the final instance. Nothing changed. Where's the big thing which just happened?

    I think Living Story episodes are more like chapters than episodes. What I mean is, it will probably be more cohesive to play them in a continuous form along with the expansion content. Season 2, and 3 also have the problem of kinda simply being rather long prologues to the expansion packs. PoF didn't really end neatly, so season 4 seems to be the extension to it, instead of being used to lead up to future content. If the next episode ties everything up for the crystal dragon, as I think many people expect, then season 4 will finally be a season where we end major plot lines instead of simply running into the next paid content. It would be nice to have a Season end properly (like Season 1 :grimace:). Basically, because these are more like chapters in a book, rather than a narrative episode, they don't alone, make a well rounded narrative or story. I'd have to guess this is basically the penultimate chapter in a story, the climax, so... the epilogue, and resolution, will be the next episode... unfortunately, around 3 months away :disappointed: .

  • SnowHawk.3615SnowHawk.3615 Member ✭✭✭

    what was so great about it?
    all the commander is anyways in an errand girl/boy while watching other peoples events unfold from the sidelines and waiting to clean up everyone else's mess.
    was too short- and it felt rushed.

  • Carighan.6758Carighan.6758 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 13, 2019

    @Okami Amaterasu.9237 said:
    "The big thing" that just happened was Aurene's Death. There's no epilogue because it's meant to be a moment of confusion, hopelessness, etc. Braham even asks aloud "What do we do now?" and we say "I don't know . . ." because it's a confusing, heartbreaking moment.

    Uh, actually... what we do is go right back to farming events and doing dailies, including the ones in the very zone. Plus right after we zone out, everything is unchanged and back to normal, so it's trivial to forget about any emotional impact there might have been.

    @Okami Amaterasu.9237 said:
    Everything else? You mean the other two instances? I think the first instance could've gone a little faster and/or added music, sure. I think the second instance was well-done and had a nice cutscene with Caithe and Aurene. Both of those instances developed the story/plot further so they're not "pointless" or anything. What would you want changed? The open-world stuff is meant to help extend the episode's playtime just a little. It also gives us a reason to explore parts of the new map and participate in the open world instead of just going from instance-instance-instance, done. How would you do it differently?

    No I meant, the fact that Aurene dies for naught because well, we got told if we just attack Kralky then that'd happen, and we did, and it happened (another part why I didn't feel there was much emotional impact, we clearly got told this would happen, it even was a big thing at the time).

    But hrm, how would I do it different... it's not easy to think about because I dislike the basic structure of how GW2 releases the story. But I would focus on the part where the Commander is forced to take action they don't want to (since we know it'll kill Aurene), and then on the gravity of it. More logistics, diplomacy, no fetch quests, no constant handholding individual NPCs. Show how big a thing this is.

    Ideally play with how difficult this is, too. Make us miss important parts of the fight because we're busy getting a huge multi-facetted army into gear. Make us in fact lose parts of the preparation due to that. Force the Commander to do the risky thing. This'd drive the part where we are too cocky home much better because the player feels like they want to go smash things, since the game actively kept them away from the action now. I didn't ever feel "Oh yay, go smash Kralky!" in this episode, it just felt... boring? Samey? The visuals are different but I just keep hammering on whatever has a red name? The final fight versus Balthazar felt a lot better, and that one was already... meh.

    And most importantly: Change the last ending, the part where you walk. What a way to toss out the potential grievance from the Commander willingly sacrificing Aurene when they know it'll kill her. It should show our allies abandoning us. We should have seen them trying to stop us, other than Canach's usual and by-now-ignored "this is a kitten plan"-comments. And in the end they should be - rightfully - angry. Bonus points if due to the instance overlapping we no longer see our allies around the zone afterwards.

  • Ashantara.8731Ashantara.8731 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 13, 2019

    @Chasind.3128 said:
    My complaint: I waited this long for this little of a story? [...]

    I completely agree on this.

    I've felt no real attachment to any of the characters [...]

    Over the years, I have grown fond of some of them, although I agree: the character writing can't compete with the likes of Dragon Age: Origins (love your user name btw ;) ). It has a lot to do with the modern slang used in GW2 (tongue-in-cheek also does not help getting attached emotionally) and the stereotypical behavior of many of the characters (for instance, Rytlock has been a constant grumpy whiner for years, and it's just very annoying).

    Where was I supposed to be wow'd with this? I'm not trolling or hating... it's just I don't think this game harbors interest in my kind of playerbase anymore and it favors more so to the 2 hour sunday player.

    I was expecting more in terms of length regarding this episode and was more shocked that it was over so soon than I was with the unpleasant results. ;)


    My GW2 content charts: (1) LWS 4, (2) PoF , (3) Personal story (pre-Claw Island/Orr) , (4) LWS 2 , (5) HoT, (6) Orr campaign , (7) LWS 3

  • I just want to give a big kitten YOU to the kitten that blurted the ending out in map chat last night.

  • To the players that ragequit the game:

    If you haven't noticed Aurene actually saw it happened in the last Episode. That's what she was afraid of. All visions come more or less true.... Just don't forget that the crystal shattered after she was impaled in her last vision..... Before you complain that the game is over search for the obvious breadcrumbs the devs gave us. Rewatch what Kormir said in PoF, compare it to what the Gods said in the mission where you have to kill Shiro and the Lich and GW1. All that is no coincidence.

    Death doesnt mean it's over, neither is Aurene "dead" in the way you understand that word. Joko was also "dead". We ourselves also came back to life. I wouldn't try to apply your cultural mask to the lore of GW2. Just remember that one is only truly dead if he's killed on a Bloodstone? It's not how things work in that world. Also the barrier to the mists is shifting. Grenth isn't anymore there, and remember that Grenth is justice not death itself.

    Play GW2 as if you read a really good book, don't think about that death is for you, but what it means for the characters in the game world. If you complain that she "died" it's similar to not reading the Tolkiens books, then complain that Gandalf died in Moria.... So you won't watch the other Movies :P

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