I Dont Get Fractal Design — Guild Wars 2 Forums

I Dont Get Fractal Design

Apolo.5942Apolo.5942 Member ✭✭✭
edited January 10, 2019 in Guild Wars 2 Discussion

Fractals are a kind of content that is meant to be grinded and farmed, it is even in the repetitive nature of its name, yet from tier 3 onward they become increasingly more and more difficult and their mechanics more complex.

Complex and difficult content is oposite to content that is meant to grinded.

Conditions need to be normalized:
1- SINGLE PLAYER conditions stack on DURATION.
2- MULTIPLE PLAYERS conditions stack on INTENSITY.
3- REBALANCE condition duration, damage and application.

Comments

  • People run full T4 and CM under a hour

    Play/grind more

  • Apolo.5942Apolo.5942 Member ✭✭✭

    @Eloc Freidon.5692 said:
    When you do them regularly to understand the mechanics and get into a competent group setup, they can be done in 40 minutes. They're also very rewarding.

    Again, that is the oposite of Grind, a good example of that is Raids, they are Very Hard and Very rewarding content.

    Fractals, while very hard they are far from rewarding, specially tier 4, the set up gear and people needed are way disproportionate to the rewards.

    Conditions need to be normalized:
    1- SINGLE PLAYER conditions stack on DURATION.
    2- MULTIPLE PLAYERS conditions stack on INTENSITY.
    3- REBALANCE condition duration, damage and application.

  • Algreg.3629Algreg.3629 Member ✭✭✭

    You should send the standard work "What grind is and how developers must implement it" to Anet. Apparently, they are missing that one in the office. Yes, clarification, I mean that sarcastically.

  • Glider.5792Glider.5792 Member ✭✭✭

    @Apolo.5942 said:

    @Eloc Freidon.5692 said:
    When you do them regularly to understand the mechanics and get into a competent group setup, they can be done in 40 minutes. They're also very rewarding.

    Again, that is the oposite of Grind, a good example of that is Raids, they are Very Hard and Very rewarding content.

    Fractals, while very hard they are far from rewarding, specially tier 4, the set up gear and people needed are way disproportionate to the rewards.

    The difference between raid and fractals is that... fractals aint hard really.... Once you learn the encounters you just "swoosh" through everything.
    Raids on the other hand... they need proper team compositions, teamwork, dps, knowing mechanics etc. In fractals you can solokill most bosses while playing druid if wanted, just gonna take ages. 99cm and 100cm are a bit different story, but still alot easier compared to raids.

    https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCeFWMeskOJhk8N-SvOFCJXA
    Fractal speed kills, raids, Black Lion Chest Openings, random.

  • Maybe you dont get fractal design. If you want mindless grind play something else. Fractals are not hard but you must actualy press some keys to finish them. They are way more proffitable then raids because you can get 30 gold in 40 minutes. If you want to grind them but t3 are hard then either grind t2 (where you dont need any knowlage or skill - true grind) or actualy learn them

  • Clyan.1593Clyan.1593 Member ✭✭✭

    T4 rewards are actually good. You get ascended armor randomly or other stuff. Don't know what you're talking about. There is nothing better in terms of ascended stats.

  • Cyninja.2954Cyninja.2954 Member ✭✭✭✭

    It's grind at the top end.

    Fractals are really not hard, maybe challenge modes can be considered challenging but even those are not hard hard.

    There is a ton of ways to cheese fractals or make near un-killable comps or builds. It's all a matter of practice, patience and understanding. The idea is that people grind the fractal difficulty they are comfortable with, then move on to a higher one once the current one gets to easy. Unfortunately this only semi works in T3 and T4 because the quality of players stuck in T3 can be vastly lower than T4 (which is natural since it takes a while to get full ascended and/or feel comfortable to move on to T4).

    As a referance to WoW players, T3 fractals are probably similar to Mythic+ dungeons, T4 fractals are Mythic+5 and T4 CMs are Mythic +7 up to +10 depending on how good your composition is. This is based off of not totally over gearing the content. Subtract 1-3 difficulty scales if you are familiar with basic MMO fight tactics like stacking, crowd control and line of sight.

  • flog.3485flog.3485 Member ✭✭✭

    @Apolo.5942 said:
    Fractals are a kind of content that is meant to be grinded and farmed, it is even in the repetitive nature of its name, yet from tier 3 onward they become increasingly more and more difficult and their mechanics more complex.

    Complex and difficult content is oposite to content that is meant to grinded.

    That is why you have 3 tiers below to grind them very hard if you want it.

  • Turin.6921Turin.6921 Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 10, 2019

    You are not supposed to grind them .That is why there are dailies with different fractals that reset everyday. They are designed to be done once a day at most. If you call this a grind you have a very low standard of it.

    Also T4 fractal dailies can be done within 40 minutes even without optimal comps as long as ppl know the basics. So they are easily farmable. Also farming of difficult content is supposed to be possible as a reward of getting better at it. Not be good at it without any effort. You "farm " raids as well. But only as a reward of your group actually getting better at it.

  • sokeenoppa.5384sokeenoppa.5384 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Apolo.5942 said:

    @Eloc Freidon.5692 said:
    When you do them regularly to understand the mechanics and get into a competent group setup, they can be done in 40 minutes. They're also very rewarding.

    Again, that is the oposite of Grind, a good example of that is Raids, they are Very Hard and Very rewarding content.

    Fractals, while very hard they are far from rewarding, specially tier 4, the set up gear and people needed are way disproportionate to the rewards.

    What is this thing about raids been rewarding? :D i do full clears weekly and i can tell you that they arent rewarding.
    Fractals however are fast to do and rewards are great.

    I'll have two number 9s, a number 9 large, a number 6 with extra dip, a number 7, two number 45s, one with cheese, and a large soda.

  • HardRider.2980HardRider.2980 Member ✭✭✭

    That's half the issue with fractals really.. out side the dailies.. there's no point running them (minus achivements, but again.. a 1 off thing).

    A City of Heroes never die... A City of Villains will never surrender... Neither City will be forgotten.

  • @Apolo.5942 said:
    Fractals are a kind of content that is meant to be grinded and farmed, it is even in the repetitive nature of its name, yet from tier 3 onward they become increasingly more and more difficult and their mechanics more complex.

    Complex and difficult content is oposite to content that is meant to grinded.

    Actually fractal is not a place for anyone who want a mindless grind like other pve farming area. It's just a series of mini dungeon. They're just provide some fun 5 ppl content for us. The daily reward is the candy that anet "encourage" player to do it.

    Some people are good enough to repeatly do fracs and get tons of stuff/relic. It's just like old dungeon farm, nothing else.

  • phs.6089phs.6089 Member ✭✭✭✭

    T4s are easier then T3s, T3s is the forge of fractal runners. It's in t3s things get real and people start to realize they/someone in team doing something wrong.

    Va'esse deireádh aep eigean, va'esse eigh faidh'ar

  • Glider.5792Glider.5792 Member ✭✭✭

    @HardRider.2980 said:
    That's half the issue with fractals really.. out side the dailies.. there's no point running them (minus achivements, but again.. a 1 off thing).

    Not realy, if you got yourself fractal god title, fractals can be the most profitable way to get gold, and that is by not doing dailies but grinding specific fractals for encryptions.

    https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCeFWMeskOJhk8N-SvOFCJXA
    Fractal speed kills, raids, Black Lion Chest Openings, random.

  • perilisk.1874perilisk.1874 Member ✭✭✭

    @HardRider.2980 said:
    That's half the issue with fractals really.. out side the dailies.. there's no point running them (minus achivements, but again.. a 1 off thing).

    There's no point playing games at all... I mean, an achievement is just a number in a database somewhere, it means nothing at all. If you aren't at least engaged or having fun, you're wasting some of your very finite time on earth.

  • A fractal is a subset of a Euclidean space for which the Hausdorff dimension strictly exceeds the topological dimension. Fractals are encountered ubiquitously in nature due to their tendency to appear nearly the same at different levels, as is illustrated here in the successively small magnifications of the Mandelbrot set. Fractals exhibit similar patterns at increasingly small scales, also known as expanding symmetry or unfolding symmetry; If this replication is exactly the same at every scale, as in the Menger sponge, it is called affine self-similar.

    One way that fractals are different from finite geometric figures is the way in which they scale. Doubling the edge lengths of a polygon multiplies its area by four, which is two (the ratio of the new to the old side length) raised to the power of two (the dimension of the space the polygon resides in). Likewise, if the radius of a sphere is doubled, its volume scales by eight, which is two (the ratio of the new to the old radius) to the power of three (the dimension that the sphere resides in). However, if a fractal's one-dimensional lengths are all doubled, the spatial content of the fractal scales by a power that is not necessarily an integer. This power is called the fractal dimension of the fractal, and it usually exceeds the fractal's topological dimension.

    As mathematical equations, fractals are usually nowhere differentiable. An infinite fractal curve can be conceived of as winding through space differently from an ordinary line - although it is still 1-dimensional its fractal dimension indicates that it also resembles a surface.

    The mathematical roots of fractals have been traced throughout the years as a formal path of published works, starting in the 17th century with notions of recursion, then moving through increasingly rigorous mathematical treatment of the concept to the study of continuous but not differentiable functions in the 19th century by the seminal work of Bernard Bolzano, Bernhard Riemann, and Karl Weierstrass, and on to the coining of the word fractal in the 20th century with a subsequent burgeoning of interest in fractals and computer-based modelling in the 20th century. The term "fractal" was first used by mathematician Benoit Mandelbrot in 1975. Mandelbrot based it on the Latin frāctus meaning "broken" or "fractured", and used it to extend the concept of theoretical fractional dimensions to geometric patterns in nature.

    There is some disagreement amongst mathematicians about how the concept of a fractal should be formally defined. Mandelbrot himself summarized it as "beautiful, kitten hard, increasingly useful. That's fractals." More formally, in 1982 Mandelbrot stated that "A fractal is by definition a set for which the Hausdorff-Besicovitch dimension strictly exceeds the topological dimension." Later, seeing this as too restrictive, he simplified and expanded the definition to: "A fractal is a shape made of parts similar to the whole in some way." Still later, Mandelbrot settled on this use of the language: "...to use fractal without a pedantic definition, to use fractal dimension as a generic term applicable to all the variants."

    The consensus is that theoretical fractals are infinitely self-similar, iterated, and detailed mathematical constructs having fractal dimensions, of which many examples have been formulated and studied in great depth. Fractals are not limited to geometric patterns, but can also describe processes in time. Fractal patterns with various degrees of self-similarity have been rendered or studied in images, structures and sounds and found in nature, technology, art, architecture and law. Fractals are of particular relevance in the field of chaos theory, since the graphs of most chaotic processes are fractals.

    Hope this clears things up for you, sir.

  • Turkeyspit.3965Turkeyspit.3965 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Apolo.5942 said:
    Fractals are a kind of content that is meant to be grinded and farmed, it is even in the repetitive nature of its name, yet from tier 3 onward they become increasingly more and more difficult and their mechanics more complex.

    Complex and difficult content is oposite to content that is meant to grinded.

    Why are you grinding and farming them in the first place? For rewards.
    The harder the difficulty, the better the rewards.
    You can farm T1 fractals every day, or get roughly 4x the rewards by doing the same content in T4.

    If the rewards from T1 were all that were available, I wouldn't be spending my time farming them.

  • Illconceived Was Na.9781Illconceived Was Na.9781 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 10, 2019

    Fractal T4 rewards are very generous. It's the only content in the game in which ascended gear drops at a rate high enough to support gearing up of alt characters. There are also plenty of rares, some decent liquid gold, and the occasional exotic or special skin.

    The only part of fractal rewards that can be grinded are the attunements, which are designed to reward people who were already doing daily fractals in the first place. The cost of those rewards is huge outside of fractal currency and the benefits only have value in fractals.

    tl;dr no, fractals are not designed to be grinded or farmed. They are designed to be just difficult enough for enough people that it's interesting to do daily.
    (It just happens that there's nothing in the universe that can be done daily that won't end up being repetitive in some way.)

    "Face the facts. Then act on them. It's ...the only doctrine I have to offer you, & it's harder than you'd think, because I swear humans seem hardwired to do anything but. Face the facts. Don't pray, don't wish, ...FACE THE FACTS. THEN act." — Quellcrist Falconer

  • Its all about learning mechanics op. If there is one thing i learned playing tanks and heals in my long mmo history its that learning the raid/dungeon/frac/w/e gets easier and easier as you retain the knowledge of mechanics and pathing. What starts out as a frustrating two hour wipefest will eventually turn into a 15 min burn run. Practice and learn the instances, you can do them blindfolded eventually.

  • Ayakaru.6583Ayakaru.6583 Member ✭✭✭✭

    "That is meant to be grinded and farmed"
    No, its not, its what you want to be able to grind and farm

    To defeat the dragons, see the good in them.
    Zhaitan reunites lost ones, primordus creates fertile land, mordremoth spreads the green, and jormag..
    ..jormag? Who's that?

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