Among the new (horrifying and catastrophic) instabilities, which one do you hate the most? — Guild Wars 2 Forums

Among the new (horrifying and catastrophic) instabilities, which one do you hate the most?

Among the new (horrifying and catastrophic) instabilities, which one do you hate the most? 60 votes

**Slippery Slope**
65% 39 votes
**Outflanked**, to get a funny 300% extra damage from crowds of mobs around you, like in swampland or Molten Boss. And slippery slope equally hateable.
8% 5 votes
**We bleed fire**, to make crowds of mobs, like in swampland or Molten Boss, become machine guns that will kill you if you don't have a reflect ready. And slippery slope equally hateable.
8% 5 votes
**Birds**, to become spam-attacked every five seconds and die if you cannot spam-dodge quick enough. And slippery slope equally hateable.
16% 10 votes
**Vengeance**, to make crowds of mobs, like in swampland or Molten Boss, get more and more boons everytime you kill one of them. And slippery slope equally hateable.
1% 1 vote

Comments

  • Glider.5792Glider.5792 Member ✭✭✭

    Probably Slipperly slope. And Slippery slope equally hateable.

    https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCeFWMeskOJhk8N-SvOFCJXA
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  • Saniyah.1984Saniyah.1984 Member ✭✭
    edited January 10, 2019

    I like them, but maybe they should tested it more.. We had the bird instability yesterday (89 swampland).It felt like if you dodged the birds it spawned a hostile bird that should attacked enemies, but sometimwes there would be no enemies nearby and it went after random people maybe it should be and ally bird instead? I think slippery slope is ok except maybe cliffside or Uncategorized? also vigor may help with bird instability and purple star marker so you know they will attack you soon

  • Yasi.9065Yasi.9065 Member ✭✭✭

    I kinda like them? We bleed fire you can reflect for extra dmg, which I find really nice. Outflanked no issue with that. The birds are a bit weird, but honestly not a problem except if they spawn camp you on bloomhunger together with skelks ;) For vengeance I suggest bringing a spellbreaker, it helps tons.

  • Infusion.7149Infusion.7149 Member ✭✭✭

    Slippery slope should have added ice patches or oil slicks. I don't see how making a whole zone slick is a good idea.

    Also I don't see how stability duration compensates for it.

  • Tiviana.2650Tiviana.2650 Member ✭✭✭

    Oh man this must be like affixes, cant wait to see this i remember all the crying in wow over affixes lol

  • Safandula.8723Safandula.8723 Member ✭✭✭✭

    New instabilities awards good plays. Outflanked and many others can be helpful.
    But slippery is disaster, it needs another look with big rework.

  • Deepcuts.9740Deepcuts.9740 Member ✭✭✭

    All instabilities are BAD.

  • Zhaid Zhem.6508Zhaid Zhem.6508 Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 11, 2019

    Frailty + birds : try to play an elem with 8k HP against mobs with >20might and fury and birds that ""randomly"" chose you everytime. As if Elem had boonstrip or blind or stab or anything with any use but pur dmg. You liked the RNG "you'll be the only one with the flux bomb", you'll laugh a lot.
    Vengeance also a pain.
    I'm not sure it awards a "good" play, in a way it will just close a little more composition; like FB with wall and bubble and stab and aegis everytime evrywhere, SpB with a lot of boonstrip and not war or berserker, and DPS with hp pool or good enough own sustain like SB, Holo, DH.

  • Honestly instabs like sugar rush and outflanked just make pugging unnecessarily annoying. Seems like the damage or attribute bonuses for enemies need to be balanced. Right now, add mobs to way too much damage, and not in a way where the damage is easily telegraphed or mitigated, they just straight up attack faster or hit harder. It doesn't seem like good design. SA is an example of a great rework. Doesn't punish you with over the top incoming damage, but forces you to play slightly differently to add some amount of fun to the mechanics. That's what I feel like instabs should be.

    Honestly the two I mentioned are worse to me than toxic trail because at least there were visual indicators for the toxic trails that you could reasonably avoid by standing somewhere different. The new "positive effects" are kind of gimmicky too. Good concept, poor execution. Just buffing everyone's attack/move speed 15% does not offset adds also attacking and moving 35% faster. Adds moving and attacking faster makes them borderline unavoidable unless killed (again, unlike toxic trails), which sometimes can't even be done because pugs don't move in concert and will typically die trying to solo 2 vets with +35% attack speed before adds can be killed.

    I'm not sure if ANet is trying to encourage a shakeup of the metagame, but if that's the goal, this feels like the wrong way to go about it. Like, if the answer to "Enemies deal more damage or attack faster" is "build more toughness or vitality for survivability!" then there's something seriously wrong, because instabilities change daily and most people don't have gear that they can simply stat swap each time instabs change.

  • I think it's premature to offer an opinion. It hasn't even been a week, so not every fractal frequenter has had a chance to experience all of them. Very few of us have had time to absorb the changes, let alone consider how best to adapt. I am sure that in a month (probably less), there will be all sorts of ways to mitigate or take advantage of nearly all of them.

    It might even turn out that the new social awkwardness is the worst, because people can knock each other off platforms, while Birds might end up being the best once people figure out how to ensure the Ravens go after fiends instead of friends.

    In other words: give it time.

    "Face the facts. Then act on them. It's ...the only doctrine I have to offer you, & it's harder than you'd think, because I swear humans seem hardwired to do anything but. Face the facts. Don't pray, don't wish, ...FACE THE FACTS. THEN act." — Quellcrist Falconer

  • Grogba.6204Grogba.6204 Member ✭✭✭

    I think it's premature to offer an opinion. It hasn't even been a week, so not every fractal frequenter has had a chance to experience all of them. Very few of us have had time to absorb the changes, let alone consider how best to adapt.

    I choose not to adapt to it and dropping fractals entirely. I see Anet having a different opinion when it comes to the content than me and that is disappointing (for me). This leaves me with very little to do with dungeons dead but I was never a fan of instabilities in the past and the new ones do not give me any reason to play them. (Fractal God, close to 300 CM 100 and 400 CM 99 runs)

  • phs.6089phs.6089 Member ✭✭✭✭

    I wan't to know who came up with the 'Bird' and what exactly they though was fun or challenging in that instability?

    "There is always a lighthouse, there's always a man, there's always a city."

  • Its fun coz now u can die for nothing on laser areas in Aetherblade fractal. Or any other stun/locked situations.
    I want to know who posted a poll to ask new instabilities ??

  • Vinceman.4572Vinceman.4572 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Instabilities were never fun or challenging for experienced players. Ran Aetherblade in a random pug today. Me and another one were carrying the other 3 in the final boss room with the golems and the lasers because they all died due to bird damage. Again it was a highlight to see casual players having no clue and wiping for no reason because they are too bad to adapt. Same will happen to Slippery Slope fractals where you'll constantly have players dying left and right. Well done, Anet!

  • @Vinceman.4572 said:
    Instabilities were never fun or challenging for experienced players. Ran Aetherblade in a random pug today. Me and another one were carrying the other 3 in the final boss room with the golems and the lasers because they all died due to bird damage. Again it was a highlight to see casual players having no clue and wiping for no reason because they are too bad to adapt. Same will happen to Slippery Slope fractals where you'll constantly have players dying left and right. Well done, Anet!

    Lets see how u do in underground facility standing on plates and birds picking your eyes out ^^

  • I didn't enjoy birds. Mini was okay. Still seeing others.

  • "we bleed fire" on Siren's Reef today (no t4 but was doing it for the maze achie before boss), we thought we might as well do the boss while we were there, had no problem with it before.. But nope, the constant flow of mobs during the endfight is just ridiculous to deal with while all of them are shooting rockets, you don't rally on any of the ghosts and you have to dodge the winds that push you off the boat so you can't really reflect as you can't stack. Definitely needs an adjustment, not the number of mobs since that's fine without the instability, but more like only having it on a certain number of the mobs or boss only.

  • Vinceman.4572Vinceman.4572 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @spankyed.4735 said:

    @Vinceman.4572 said:
    Instabilities were never fun or challenging for experienced players. Ran Aetherblade in a random pug today. Me and another one were carrying the other 3 in the final boss room with the golems and the lasers because they all died due to bird damage. Again it was a highlight to see casual players having no clue and wiping for no reason because they are too bad to adapt. Same will happen to Slippery Slope fractals where you'll constantly have players dying left and right. Well done, Anet!

    Lets see how u do in underground facility standing on plates and birds picking your eyes out ^^

    If I'm not in combat np because I'll be stealthed.

  • Zenith.7301Zenith.7301 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @phs.6089 said:
    I wan't to know who came up with the 'Bird' and what exactly they though was fun or challenging in that instability?

    Aren't birds just extra DPS for your group?

  • Slippery Slope
    Cancer, makes it harder to prestack, manevuer, and prevents certain skills from working properly, e.g. druid staff #3

    Outflanked
    Just stack properly? Mobs, especially in Swampland die to two hits, three with protection.

    We bleed fire
    Support can easily cleanse this. And cd itself is pretty long anyway.

    Birds
    I've got a small dot, will just try not dodging during it's duration.

    Vengeance
    The same as with outflanked, most of the time you pull mobs in packs so everything dies roughly at the same time

  • All of them becouse negative effect its to strong: Failty and sugar rush: Low heal and enemy attack faster like in new frac endless enemy spawn make it horribl

  • stone cold.8609stone cold.8609 Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 13, 2019

    shejesa - agree with everything you said except for Birds. The others, except for Slippery Slope and Birds, rewards good positioning and team play. I really like those types of instabilities.

    Slippery slope is fun for about the first 3 minutes you have it then it becomes very annoying. I don't find it fun to loose control of my character. It defeats careful positioning that is one of the hallmarks of skilled fractal play. It also makes team mechanics much more difficult. Just had it in a T2 combined with the new social awkwardness and basically felt like I was playing with massive lag.

    Birds is just annoying. It's not a small dot - it's around 7K damage to you if you eat all of it that also blinds you so you can't effectively attack. When you dodge it doesn't reliably get transferred, and doesn't seem to effect the mobs nearly as much as the player. It's not that this instability is challenging - it's not. I just find it no fun and annoying to be constantly swarmed by birds pecking and blinding you. They are kind of like flying Dredge that can show up in any fractal.

  • Zhaid Zhem.6508Zhaid Zhem.6508 Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 14, 2019

    One by one of course they are not "insurmountable".
    But start to combine them .... Try to play weaver or thief when you get -30% HP and enemies deal more dmg or quicker or tons of conditions.
    Deepstone today ; birds + We bleed fire : birds (already annoying, you can dodge, ok, but what about the 4 others deadbrain members ) and mobs and the "orbs" give fire, the boss fire projectile take off 40% of HP ...
    Siren's Reef yesterday : Frailty + Sugar Rush, elems and thiefs (no good cleave) instant die.

    So what is it about ? (A good) Healer is close to mandatory now, + resistance/ condi cleanse spam + stab spam + good cleave + good amount of HP or armor.
    Yeah we can handle new instabilities, does it mean half the classes would be push out the zone to not be boring ?

  • hate all of them but especially i really hate slippery slope, i dont understand why should i do ice skating while killing some mobs in fractals. pls anet explain why SS why ...

  • DrFox.8091DrFox.8091 Member ✭✭
    edited January 14, 2019

    Before last nerf patch, my routine was Dailys + recs ( ~1h, lfg random party) + farming some T3 and T2 coz it was fun to help ppl with my supp.
    Total playtime between 1h - 2h
    Still on chrono nowdays (without the fun) Only doing dailys and recs (around 1h playtime) with exp ppl, when i can finish them.

    My point is im not masochist, i'll not spend too much time on something that i used to like and finish "quickly" and wich is now annoying or cancer gameplay thanks the new instas. For expl we tried to finish the Siren last boss yesterday, after 6 try we left. Less a question of skills or mechs knowledge, more a question of annoying instabilities.

    End results for me :

    • Fractal are not attractive anymore atm, lost some kind of "fun".
    • Not helping on low anymore coz boons are not easy to share with new players + after T4 instas my mind need fresh air.
      = Less playtime, no farm, less rewards (wich is the goal i presume)

    • Have to make choices/selection with who we play

    • Avoiding all Slippery's, and sometimes even fail run (or close to) with bad insta combinaisons.
    • Was thinking to switch necro heal but since new insta's i got doubts. Why invest time and money for playing annoying contents..?

    If elite players are happy with the last patch im glad for them. But i guess im not the only one who lost some interest for this content and who's not masochist enought for those kind of "improvements".

  • DoNotBelieveMe.3029DoNotBelieveMe.3029 Member ✭✭
    edited January 14, 2019

    Based on the history of instabilities, the new ones aren't really the exception to the norm.
    I would invite anyone to read up on the old instabilities from 2015 https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Category:Mistlock_Instabilities

    I was personally taking a hiatus from the game during that dark age of 2013- 2015 but reading stuff like https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Mistlock_Instability:_Antielitism [This does not down you, it instantly defeats you upon your activation of any elite skill.]
    makes me think whoever started implementing instabilities always thought of it as a joke and this feature was unfortunately retained till now.

  • Jeknar.6184Jeknar.6184 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Illconceived Was Na.9781 said:
    In other words: give it time.

    Oh yes, I'm giving it time by not doing fractals everytime Slipery Slope is there...

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  • @Jeknar.6184 said:

    @Illconceived Was Na.9781 said:
    In other words: give it time.

    Oh yes, I'm giving it time by not doing fractals everytime Slipery Slope is there...

    That's an ... interesting choice.
    You could instead try hopping and dodging, which mitigates most of the navigation issues. (And during fights, it doesn't seem to matter much.)

    "Face the facts. Then act on them. It's ...the only doctrine I have to offer you, & it's harder than you'd think, because I swear humans seem hardwired to do anything but. Face the facts. Don't pray, don't wish, ...FACE THE FACTS. THEN act." — Quellcrist Falconer

  • Eramonster.2718Eramonster.2718 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 15, 2019

    The wiki tells us nothing or severely lacks info. Didn't expect spawned minnions(eg. Birds etc) will trigger "We Bleed Fire". Imagine WBF + Mist Convergence; Abomination's weapon minnions cluster spawn :lol:.

    • Is there a damage difference between the AoE triggered? Since the projectile size varied from Veteran, Elite and Boss (legendary).

    • 20% reduction to all condi dmg Sounds extreme to all condi class and with no counterplay(boon strip).

  • yann.1946yann.1946 Member ✭✭✭

    @Eramonster.2718 said:
    The wiki tells us nothing or severely lacks info. Didn't expect spawned minnions(eg. Birds etc) will trigger "We Bleed Fire". Imagine WBF + Mist Convergence; Abomination's weapon minnions cluster spawn :lol:.

    • Is there a damage difference between the AoE triggered? Since the projectile size varied from Veteran, Elite and Boss (legendary).

    • 20% reduction to all condi dmg Sounds extreme to all condi class and with no counterplay(boon strip).

    Isn't the reduction of condi damage only for incoming damage to the player?

  • Grogba.6204Grogba.6204 Member ✭✭✭

    @Illconceived Was Na.9781 said:

    That's an ... interesting choice.
    You could instead try hopping and dodging, which mitigates most of the navigation issues. (And during fights, it doesn't seem to matter much.)

    I enjoy SAB a lot. I absolutely hate Slippery Slope (and instabilities as a whole). I played W2-3 tribulation mode enough to know how to work with "ice physics" yet I despise the mechanic in regular PvE. It is not fun for me so I will look elsewhere for fun. If it is another game then that it shall be.

  • ProtoGunner.4953ProtoGunner.4953 Member ✭✭✭✭

    That slippery slope thingy reminds me of the ice levels in Super Mario games. Looks funny, though not sure how it is in gw2. I don't play often and have done one fractal run since the release of the new patch.

  • ZeftheWicked.3076ZeftheWicked.3076 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 17, 2019

    Since i'm a necro main, i guess birds would be most dangerous for me....though i could still work around that (hello vigor from well of power + blood is power).

    Tbh at current moment the most hated instability is the good old hamstring. I can get over it with blood build, leeching so much health Drakula would be proud, but still off all i've experienced this one is most dangerous one for me.

  • Turkeyspit.3965Turkeyspit.3965 Member ✭✭✭✭

    while I agree with @Illconceived Was Na.9781 that we haven't had enough time to properly formulate an opinion, my initial thoughts are as follows:

    • Stick Together: I think this is fantastic. At last an instability that actually ENCOURAGES players to adopt the correct gameplay strategy for how GW2's mechanics work. This is the very opposite of the old (and hated) Social Awkwardness.

    Sadly that's the only one I 'like'.

    • Vengeance: just like Last Laugh, this is fine, and the kind of instability one would expect to find for this game mode. Nice that that using boon strip can turn this into a DPS increase, though it would be nice if more professions had access to that mechanic.
    • We Bleed Fire: like Vengeance, I'm ok with this. It seems like the damage is unavoidable but I know players will adapt. Will be a challenge for players new to T3/T4
    • Suger Rush: I don't even understand the logic here. You run faster and attack faster, but the enemy mobs can run and attack even faster than you? It just means that in a bad situation where you get swarmed, instead of being able to dodge out with low health you get insta mistlocked or downed. Volcanic and Molten Boss trash stands out as obvious problems for this one.
    • Frailty: this one makes even less sense than Sugar Rush. OK, so we are smaller (relevance?) and have 30% health, but to compensate...we move 25% faster? Does ANET think we are running away from damage? 25% faster endurance regeneration for more dodges would have made much more sense here.
    • Outflanked: just like Sugar Rush, this opens up the chance of getting insta downed. I remember a few days back I got careless and got clipped by Ensolysis' charge. Normally it just knocks you on your behind, but as I was turned away from him, the hit dropped me to like 10% health. In fights with lots of adds, like Volcanic, Molten, Siren's, this can lead to easy wipes.
    • Birds: First exposure to this lead to lots of deaths. Not really that fun a mechanic to deal with, especially as it can hit you at times when you wouldn't normally have to deal damage; Nightmare agony bullet circles comes to mind.
    • Boon Overload: stupid design. The obvious way to counter this would be to reduce the amount of boons. Not only does that mean you will do less damage and have less protection overall, but most of the boons we receive are added PASSIVELY from our skills, meaning we have no control over them and can't just turn them off. Good thing they nerfed Chrono's SOI because that would have led to mass party wipes with this instability.
    • Social Awkwardness: I don't know why ANET just doesn't get it. The original was terrible because your party took extra agony damage from doing what you are supposed to do, which is stack. They changed the instability so that there is no damage, only now you are bumping people way; or in other words, you are physically prevented from stacking. The developers design a combat system and then try to actively prevent players from using that combat system in the optimal fashion. SMH.
    • Slippery Slope: Take it or leave it. It doesn't make the fractal more fun but it also doesn't make the fractal impossible to complete. But with no real means to counter it, players, regardless of skill, are just forced to deal with this silliness, which to me is an overall negative impact. As I've said earlier, if they think whimsical things like this are wanted by the players, then design it so players can enable this instability through a challenge mote or similar system, so those who want to play Fractals on Ice can do so, and leave the rest of us to just play the content.

    The devs said they wanted the instabilities to contribute to an overall more positive gaming experience. I say instabilities should also add challenge and perhaps also prompt a change in strategy to keep things new and interesting. Of the 10 instabilities I listed above, only Stick Together really meets that description, and 1/10 is a pretty pitiful score.

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