Fun idea: we might not just replace [spoiler], but also [spoiler] too! [PoF to LS4:5]

There has been a lot of focus on Aurene replacing Kralkatorrik. The word "Ascend" has been tossed around a lot, too. While digging around, I realized I completely forgot that "Ascension" was also used to describe Kormir absorbing Abaddon's power and becoming a god herself. When we killed Balthazar, there was no blessed human to absorb that power, so Aurene and Kralkatorrik both took a share. Kralkatorrik is likely retreating to the Mists - the home of the Gods - and I can't imagine we won't chase him. While we're there, we may get an opportunity to help replace Balthazar, too.

Ascension in reference to Kormir usurping Abaddon is the general use of the term. As in ascension into godhood. As in apotheosis.

Glint seems to be using it in reference to the act of Ascension which players go through in Prophecies, known as Weh no Su by Canthans, in which mortals become capable of unlocking their full magical potential and is capable of seeing beings (such as ghosts) that are hiding in the halfworld between Tyria and the Mists.

Though ArenaNet could retroactively claim that the blessing Kormir received was equivalent to Ascension, as far as current confirmed lore goes, two different things.

Regarding Balthazar, he was not a god when he was killed, so the magic he unleashed was very, very differnet from the magic Abaddon released. One was divine (Abaddon), one came from Bloodstone and Elder Dragons (Balthazar). By all indication, based on GW1 lore and Kormir's wording in Facing the Truth, Balthazar has had a replacement since he was stripped of his power sometime between the two games. There's been a "new" god of war for 1-2 centuries.

@"Konig Des Todes.2086" said:Regarding Balthazar, he was not a god when he was killed, so the magic he unleashed was very, very differnet from the magic Abaddon released. One was divine (Abaddon), one came from Bloodstone and Elder Dragons (Balthazar). By all indication, based on GW1 lore and Kormir's wording in Facing the Truth, Balthazar has had a replacement since he was stripped of his power sometime between the two games. There's been a "new" god of war for 1-2 centuries.

Balthazar wasn't one of the Six when he was killed, but he was still a part of the larger class of beings of which the Six is an elite subset (which are often called "gods"). He is sometimes called a "fallen god", which I used to think was a generic descriptor of status, but might actually have some metaphysical significance as the opposite of Ascension?

He still seems, like the dragons, to convert lesser magic into his own type of magic (so, at the very least, the Bloodstone magic is now Balthazar magic), and his own magic (like dragon magic) retains its identity after being absorbed by dragons. It's unclear whether he could convert dragon magic into his own magic -- neither Primordus nor Jormag were killed, so he would have extracted energy from them without absorbing their essence. Plus, Primordus magic is fire magic, so how could you tell? And was it ever definitively stated that he fed on Jormag's magic?

He wasn't just a superpowered wizard or magical battery. I think he was probably the equivalent (for divine magic) of whatever Aurene was in this episode. Having many of the same powers and traits as the Six (but not all -- no blinding aura, for one thing), and probably capable of killing the new god of war and seizing control over that domain.

@perilisk.1874 said:And was it ever definitively stated that he fed on Jormag's magic?Yes, through both visuals in Flashpoint, and developer comments in AMAs.

The rest... I know. But my point in stating all that is that there is no need to replace Balthazar by killing Kralkatorrik, because Balthazar was already replaced long ago, unless ArenaNet does massive levels of retcons that just utterly destroys the very foundation of the game (and the plot of Nightfall).

Thank you both for clearing this up for me. I apparently missed some important plot points about Balthazar already being replaced :)

@"Erik.6951" said:Thank you both for clearing this up for me. I apparently missed some important plot points about Balthazar already being replaced :)

To clarify further, it's not explicitly stated that Balthazar has a replacement. What is stated is that he was stripped of divinity/godhood and power. And from Nightfall, we know that a god's power when not in a vessel is extremely volatile to the point of destroying Tyria from the center of the Realm of Torment; we also know from this that neither can a god absorb another god's power nor can an object suffice to house said power. The only known possible outcome is "a new god of war exists".

@Konig Des Todes.2086 said:

@"Erik.6951" said:Thank you both for clearing this up for me. I apparently missed some important plot points about Balthazar already being replaced :)

I don't think thats the only possible outcome, no? No new god of war is actually mentionedIf a god was present at the death of either Abaddon or Bath Salts and couldn't absorb their power, then we would know for sure they couldn't.And it would probably have to be some kind of super special something to absorb god-magic, you can't just stick that in a rice cooker or something.

@"Rockin Twilight Sparkle.2615" said:

@Konig Des Todes.2086 said:

@"Erik.6951" said:Thank you both for clearing this up for me. I apparently missed some important plot points about Balthazar already being replaced :)

If a god could absorb Abaddon's magic, why didn't they? It's not just to do with when players killed Abaddon, but the fact they never killed him despite him being imprisoned and weakened for over a thousand years, and acting up for 200 of those years. If it was a moral issue, they could have popped in and killed him when he was acting up and saved hundreds if not thousands of lives; instead of this, they opted to grant a blessing to Kormir so that she gained the ability to contain the divine essence and became a new god.

In addition, and this is a bit smaller, Kormir still calls the group "the Six", despite the fact she's referred to them as "the Five" her entire mortal life.

If they didn't replace Abaddon for a thousand years, chances are this is because they couldn't.

Or they found the idea of killing one of their own unsavory, especially given that just them fighting each other created the Crystal Desert?

@"Rockin Twilight Sparkle.2615" said:Or they found the idea of killing one of their own unsavory, especially given that just them fighting each other created the Crystal Desert?

Yet, it was okay to let someone else do that very same killing?

And Abaddon was already weakened, his power sealed, after the Exodus. With him in chains and the damage done, they could have killed him and took his power without real further consequence (probably could have even prevented the Elder Dragons' rising from that released power, since they wouldn't hesitate as it began to go wild but absorb it immediately).