Why these characters need to die.... Spoilers...I guess? — Guild Wars 2 Forums

Why these characters need to die.... Spoilers...I guess?

cptaylor.2670cptaylor.2670 Member ✭✭✭✭
  1. Taimi's involvement led us to a machine that put two elder dragons to sleep in one episode - Good thing that Mary Sue's already dying. Let's speed up the process.
  2. Kashmeer gave us all illusions to look like Joko's generals which led to us overthrowing Balthazar, as well as the initial line that led us to revealing that Lazarus was Balthazar. I'm sure there's lots of other things I'm missing but she's a major Mary Sue and needs to die too!
  3. Kashmeer's lover that's a necromancer whose name I can't remember that made that bone bridge way back when before we got Aurene's egg in Season 2? That Mary Sue is the reason we've reached this point of the story. Kill her off immediately. (Oh, that's right.. her name's Marjory)
  4. Faren - even admits to being the greatest and answer to every problem in Tyria - Mary Sue - get rid of this one fast.
  5. Braham - has a magical scroll or bow or something now and shows up through the mists in the middle of abandoned ruins of Istan from a continent away in the North - Also has a ghost mother that tells us when to move the plot forward - Mary Sue. Just get rid of him, his ghost mother, his enchanted scrolls, and his convenient shield bubbles when buildings are collapsing on us.
  6. Gorrik and his intricate knowledge of insects made us realize that the scarab plague wasn't nearly as dangerous as it could have been. Deus ex machina! Kill him off quick!
  7. Jenna - this one is the worst. Shields an entire city full of people, creates illusions of elder dragons, talk about a real Mary Sue. This one shouldn't last longer than two more episodes or the integrity of the story will be undone and become nothing but complete failure in the industry moving forward.
  8. Rhytlock, - mary sue, magical swords from gods that he just lets us borrow whenever we want to kill something that takes a little extra effort. Dives into the mists and comes back after being gone for ages and has new stronger abilities. What a Mary Sue. We can't have characters just coming back whenever they feel like it. It doesn't make any sense and lessens the impact of them being gone in the first place. Easy, cheesy writing. Obviously we should get rid of him before he does anymore damage to the story.

Comments

  • ugrakarma.9416ugrakarma.9416 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 17, 2019

    I'm fine with all these side characters. They're just like "tools" not main protagonist. The only OP guy really is the commander.

    Due to the nature of the game, the mechanics, since it is an MMPORG, the villains are hardly alone (after all, no game is made of final bosses only). If they removed the allied side-characters, the commander would still be overpowered yet, battling entire armies alone lolz.

    Tannhauser Engineer(SoS) | Atlantean Sword | Khel the Undead

  • Cyninja.2954Cyninja.2954 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Konig Des Todes.2086 said:
    TL;DR version: "Everyone who does something needs to die."

    BTW, you should look up what "Mary Sue" means. Because "having an mcguffin" is not being a Mary Sue.

    This.

    @cptaylor.2670 please check what a Mary Sue actually entails. None of the characters you mentioned fit the description. Some one stating that they are the greatest is most definitely not a Mary Sue, neither are side characters with little development.

  • Konig Des Todes.2086Konig Des Todes.2086 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 17, 2019

    I wouldn't call anything Kasmeer, Marjory, Braham, Faren, or Jennah did trivializing the plot. Certainly not what you listed.

    Progressing, yes, but not trivializing.

  • Castigator.3470Castigator.3470 Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 17, 2019

    Sarcasm doesn't transfer well to text, so next time place a /s to avoid the angry responses. Good polemic, though.
    And I agree, that the native murder of crows (not snowcrows) has been getting annoying lately. All you hear is this or that thing has to die. It feels like a game of Town of Salem, where everyone has lost track and calls for random executions.
    And this is how you spell deus as in deus ex machina. It's as if people get it wrong on purpose.

  • @cptaylor.2670 said:
    1. Taimi's involvement led us to a machine that put two elder dragons to sleep in one episode - Good thing that Mary Sue's already dying. Let's speed up the process.
    2. Kashmeer gave us all illusions to look like Joko's generals which led to us overthrowing Balthazar, as well as the initial line that led us to revealing that Lazarus was Balthazar. I'm sure there's lots of other things I'm missing but she's a major Mary Sue and needs to die too!
    3. Kashmeer's lover that's a necromancer whose name I can't remember that made that bone bridge way back when before we got Aurene's egg in Season 2? That Mary Sue is the reason we've reached this point of the story. Kill her off immediately. (Oh, that's right.. her name's Marjory)
    4. Faren - even admits to being the greatest and answer to every problem in Tyria - Mary Sue - get rid of this one fast.
    5. Braham - has a magical scroll or bow or something now and shows up through the mists in the middle of abandoned ruins of Istan from a continent away in the North - Also has a ghost mother that tells us when to move the plot forward - Mary Sue. Just get rid of him, his ghost mother, his enchanted scrolls, and his convenient shield bubbles when buildings are collapsing on us.
    6. Gorrik and his intricate knowledge of insects made us realize that the scarab plague wasn't nearly as dangerous as it could have been. Deus ex machina! Kill him off quick!
    7. Jenna - this one is the worst. Shields an entire city full of people, creates illusions of elder dragons, talk about a real Mary Sue. This one shouldn't last longer than two more episodes or the integrity of the story will be undone and become nothing but complete failure in the industry moving forward.
    8. Rhytlock, - mary sue, magical swords from gods that he just lets us borrow whenever we want to kill something that takes a little extra effort. Dives into the mists and comes back after being gone for ages and has new stronger abilities. What a Mary Sue. We can't have characters just coming back whenever they feel like it. It doesn't make any sense and lessens the impact of them being gone in the first place. Easy, cheesy writing. Obviously we should get rid of him before he does anymore damage to the story.

    Most of these I could go either way. Taimi however, needs to go and go asap. She is a waste of some good pixels. Unfortunately I don't think we will get rid of her permanently, why else would Anet bring Blish into the story for such a short time.

  • Randulf.7614Randulf.7614 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 17, 2019

    ha, and here i thought it was blatant what the op was doing! I was surprised you didnt add in the PC though!

    What sleep is here? What dreams there are in the unctuous coiling of the snakes mortal shuffling. weapon in my hand. My hand the arcing deathblow at the end of all things. The horror. The horror. I embrace it. . .

  • For those discussing the "obvious sarcasm". Let me offer some perspective. I'm a British expat living in Australia and every day I'm surprised by the smallest of communication differences that just don't translate across to the locals. It's even harder to comprehend when you consider that a large part of the Australian heritage is from the UK, and that both cultures fully believe that they are extremely similar. There's so much to joke about on that front, and yet, the more time I spend here, the more time I realise we aren't similar. ESPECIALLY when it comes to our sense of humor.

    Prior to moving to Australia, I traveled around various countries and I found a similar thing, but it was more explicitly obvious that there were communication differences based on wildy different language and culture.

    So my overall point is this:

    1. Non-native speakers of English will struggle to pick up on the sarcasm. They will read the text literally, and struggle to understand subtleties like metaphor, slang, tone etc. This is even harder for those whose native language is tonal. They don't know how to grasp tone in an otherwise "non-tonal" language, because tone is used quite differently when there's flexibility, and;
    2. Culture has the same effect. Example: Try making a dour, self-deprecating, typically British-banter style joke to an Aussie. They will take it literally and conclude you have a negative personality.
  • Poormany.4507Poormany.4507 Member ✭✭✭

    @cptaylor.2670 said:
    1. Taimi's involvement led us to a machine that put two elder dragons to sleep in one episode - Good thing that Mary Sue's already dying. Let's speed up the process.
    2. Kashmeer gave us all illusions to look like Joko's generals which led to us overthrowing Balthazar, as well as the initial line that led us to revealing that Lazarus was Balthazar. I'm sure there's lots of other things I'm missing but she's a major Mary Sue and needs to die too!
    3. Kashmeer's lover that's a necromancer whose name I can't remember that made that bone bridge way back when before we got Aurene's egg in Season 2? That Mary Sue is the reason we've reached this point of the story. Kill her off immediately. (Oh, that's right.. her name's Marjory)
    4. Faren - even admits to being the greatest and answer to every problem in Tyria - Mary Sue - get rid of this one fast.
    5. Braham - has a magical scroll or bow or something now and shows up through the mists in the middle of abandoned ruins of Istan from a continent away in the North - Also has a ghost mother that tells us when to move the plot forward - Mary Sue. Just get rid of him, his ghost mother, his enchanted scrolls, and his convenient shield bubbles when buildings are collapsing on us.
    6. Gorrik and his intricate knowledge of insects made us realize that the scarab plague wasn't nearly as dangerous as it could have been. Deus ex machina! Kill him off quick!
    7. Jenna - this one is the worst. Shields an entire city full of people, creates illusions of elder dragons, talk about a real Mary Sue. This one shouldn't last longer than two more episodes or the integrity of the story will be undone and become nothing but complete failure in the industry moving forward.
    8. Rhytlock, - mary sue, magical swords from gods that he just lets us borrow whenever we want to kill something that takes a little extra effort. Dives into the mists and comes back after being gone for ages and has new stronger abilities. What a Mary Sue. We can't have characters just coming back whenever they feel like it. It doesn't make any sense and lessens the impact of them being gone in the first place. Easy, cheesy writing. Obviously we should get rid of him before he does anymore damage to the story.

    My Predictions:
    1. Probably gonna be golemized and stay on our team
    2. & 3. Possibly going to get branded by Kralk
    4. Nah, he's too great comic relief
    5. Probably gonna be ice crystalled by Jormag
    6. Maybe after he golemizes Taimi
    7- AKA Lyssa
    8- Could betray/leave PC in Blood Legion HL episode or could keep going along being OP while keeping secrets from everyone

  • @cptaylor.2670 said:
    1. Taimi's involvement led us to a machine that put two elder dragons to sleep in one episode - Good thing that Mary Sue's already dying. Let's speed up the process.
    2. Kashmeer gave us all illusions to look like Joko's generals which led to us overthrowing Balthazar, as well as the initial line that led us to revealing that Lazarus was Balthazar. I'm sure there's lots of other things I'm missing but she's a major Mary Sue and needs to die too!
    3. Kashmeer's lover that's a necromancer whose name I can't remember that made that bone bridge way back when before we got Aurene's egg in Season 2? That Mary Sue is the reason we've reached this point of the story. Kill her off immediately. (Oh, that's right.. her name's Marjory)
    4. Faren - even admits to being the greatest and answer to every problem in Tyria - Mary Sue - get rid of this one fast.
    5. Braham - has a magical scroll or bow or something now and shows up through the mists in the middle of abandoned ruins of Istan from a continent away in the North - Also has a ghost mother that tells us when to move the plot forward - Mary Sue. Just get rid of him, his ghost mother, his enchanted scrolls, and his convenient shield bubbles when buildings are collapsing on us.
    6. Gorrik and his intricate knowledge of insects made us realize that the scarab plague wasn't nearly as dangerous as it could have been. Deus ex machina! Kill him off quick!
    7. Jenna - this one is the worst. Shields an entire city full of people, creates illusions of elder dragons, talk about a real Mary Sue. This one shouldn't last longer than two more episodes or the integrity of the story will be undone and become nothing but complete failure in the industry moving forward.
    8. Rhytlock, - mary sue, magical swords from gods that he just lets us borrow whenever we want to kill something that takes a little extra effort. Dives into the mists and comes back after being gone for ages and has new stronger abilities. What a Mary Sue. We can't have characters just coming back whenever they feel like it. It doesn't make any sense and lessens the impact of them being gone in the first place. Easy, cheesy writing. Obviously we should get rid of him before he does anymore damage to the story.

    A Marie-Sue would be some gal who has amnesia and realizes in episode 1 that she can do all of the above, then in episode 2 she suddenly starts understanding and speaking Korean.

  • cptaylor.2670cptaylor.2670 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Poormany.4507 said:

    @cptaylor.2670 said:
    1. Taimi's involvement led us to a machine that put two elder dragons to sleep in one episode - Good thing that Mary Sue's already dying. Let's speed up the process.
    2. Kashmeer gave us all illusions to look like Joko's generals which led to us overthrowing Balthazar, as well as the initial line that led us to revealing that Lazarus was Balthazar. I'm sure there's lots of other things I'm missing but she's a major Mary Sue and needs to die too!
    3. Kashmeer's lover that's a necromancer whose name I can't remember that made that bone bridge way back when before we got Aurene's egg in Season 2? That Mary Sue is the reason we've reached this point of the story. Kill her off immediately. (Oh, that's right.. her name's Marjory)
    4. Faren - even admits to being the greatest and answer to every problem in Tyria - Mary Sue - get rid of this one fast.
    5. Braham - has a magical scroll or bow or something now and shows up through the mists in the middle of abandoned ruins of Istan from a continent away in the North - Also has a ghost mother that tells us when to move the plot forward - Mary Sue. Just get rid of him, his ghost mother, his enchanted scrolls, and his convenient shield bubbles when buildings are collapsing on us.
    6. Gorrik and his intricate knowledge of insects made us realize that the scarab plague wasn't nearly as dangerous as it could have been. Deus ex machina! Kill him off quick!
    7. Jenna - this one is the worst. Shields an entire city full of people, creates illusions of elder dragons, talk about a real Mary Sue. This one shouldn't last longer than two more episodes or the integrity of the story will be undone and become nothing but complete failure in the industry moving forward.
    8. Rhytlock, - mary sue, magical swords from gods that he just lets us borrow whenever we want to kill something that takes a little extra effort. Dives into the mists and comes back after being gone for ages and has new stronger abilities. What a Mary Sue. We can't have characters just coming back whenever they feel like it. It doesn't make any sense and lessens the impact of them being gone in the first place. Easy, cheesy writing. Obviously we should get rid of him before he does anymore damage to the story.

    My Predictions:
    1. Probably gonna be golemized and stay on our team
    2. & 3. Possibly going to get branded by Kralk
    4. Nah, he's too great comic relief
    5. Probably gonna be ice crystalled by Jormag
    6. Maybe after he golemizes Taimi
    7- AKA Lyssa
    8- Could betray/leave PC in Blood Legion HL episode or could keep going along being OP while keeping secrets from everyone

    On a serious note:

    1. Probably.
      2 and 3. Doubtful, but it wouldn't surprise me if they were as quickly as characters are dying these days. Who knows, maybe they could get heir branded reversed if the plot went a specific way. Still doubtful though. At worst they'll just become the next Zolja and permanently disappear from the story.
    2. Canach is all the comic relief I need! Faren is alright. Maybe we can replace Marjory and Kash with a male couple now and just have him and Canach for some even more taboo relationship than just two human females!
    3. Don't really care, and haven't ever cared what happens to Braham. I don't know why they put enough focus on him to even redeem his personality flaws from last season. Was it worth it?
    4. Maybe.
    5. Would actually make sense and has been speculated by some. Could be explained as easily as anything else could at this point.
    6. I honestly like Rhytlock, but I still don't see the difference from him handing us the one weapon that can kill Balthazar to Aurene swooping in to help or eating Joko. Or the difference between those and Taimi inventing a machine to put two elder dragons to sleep. The only difference with Rhytlock being that he's undoing the mistake he made of freeing Balthazar and the fact that he already had the sword. Still though? Why so much hate on Aurene for the parts she's played that could just as easily be written to make as much sense as the other two being "easy solutions."

    It's anyone's guess what's next though. Taimi is dying, blish is dead, eir is dead, Zolja is basically dead, Marj and Kash have vanished this season. Aurene. We have an elder dragon threatening on a cosmic level, god dying, tyria is getting destroyed either way at this point. I mean at this point the gods really could come back and transport us to some other planet and it would just be another day in the life of the player character.

    I wonder what the point of it all is though. Killing off everyone and just replacing them with characters like Zafirah that just appear in a random episode for the sake of appeasing people that were wondering what happened to Balthazar's followers. What's next? We kill off Taimi for good and replace her with some random Zephyrite? It's just hard to become attached to any of the characters anymore. They're highly involved one episode and dying or dead the next, or just missing for half a season. Or dying, made pact leader to distance them from the story, and then suddenly brought back in. I guess Logan at least makes sense with Kralk and Destiny's Edge. But still... the only consistencies really are Rox, Braham, and Canach. And Rox is clearly being set up to do her own thing with her new tribe leaving Canach as the only consistently likable character.

    I wonder how long until Canach gets mowed down with a weedwacker to force some kind of reaction onto our player character whose only job is to be this prism that just reflects what's happening around them while constantly overcoming end of the universe circumstances due to everyone around them sacrificing themselves.

    Is it possible to have a compelling story in this context without constant sacrifice? I'm not a writer so I wouldn't really know. People don't want Aurene saving the current story but what is a lowly mortal commander supposed to do against these odds otherwise?

  • 75% of useless Dragons watch should be killed in the next elder dragon fight, have the commander go into some random part of the world in a self exile kinda like ripping off batman begins.

  • What is it with people having such an inferiority complex while playing this game? :/

  • cptaylor.2670cptaylor.2670 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Ignigknawt.7869 said:
    What is it with people having such an inferiority complex while playing this game? :/

    Not sure I understand what you're getting at.

  • Roam.5208Roam.5208 Member ✭✭

    @cptaylor.2670 said:

    @Ignigknawt.7869 said:
    What is it with people having such an inferiority complex while playing this game? :/

    Not sure I understand what you're getting at.

    I think he's saying (maybe) that people get furious if the commander isn't at the exact center of every plot point ever. Basically, what the original post is satirizing is all of the people whining on the forums that "x is more important than we are!"

    I've never played GW1, but I'm pretty sure the player was never the main character, so I'm not sure why there's such a big change in mentality here. It's what got Trahearne killed, and I'm sure it'll lead to the deaths of many more yet. A prime example would be the latest target of ire, Caithe.

  • Aaron Ansari.1604Aaron Ansari.1604 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Actually, in GW1- particularly Nightfall- the PC was more of a commander than the GW2 PC has ever been. There wasn't a whole lot of, well, character to the character, but they were pretty firmly set as the center of things for every release except Factions and the first couple chapters of Beyond.

    R.I.P., Old Man of Auld Red Wharf. Gone but never forgotten.

  • dusanyu.4057dusanyu.4057 Member ✭✭✭

    @Aaron Ansari.1604 said:
    Actually, in GW1- particularly Nightfall- the PC was more of a commander than the GW2 PC has ever been. There wasn't a whole lot of, well, character to the character, but they were pretty firmly set as the center of things for every release except Factions and the first couple chapters of Beyond.

    we were Beginning of prophecies we were playing Rurick's second fiddle, afterwords some stuff for the white mantle than we were second fiddle to Evenia. we rilly did not become the "center" until Fire islands

    Factions: Third fiddle to Master Bozo and his Cronie Brother Aggro

    Nightfall : we were the only person who did not dislike Kormir

  • Aaron Ansari.1604Aaron Ansari.1604 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 22, 2019

    @dusanyu.4057 said:

    @Aaron Ansari.1604 said:
    Actually, in GW1- particularly Nightfall- the PC was more of a commander than the GW2 PC has ever been. There wasn't a whole lot of, well, character to the character, but they were pretty firmly set as the center of things for every release except Factions and the first couple chapters of Beyond.

    we were Beginning of prophecies we were playing Rurick's second fiddle, afterwords some stuff for the white mantle than we were second fiddle to Evenia. we rilly did not become the "center" until Fire islands

    Prophecies, we were the literal Chosen one from a hundreds-year-old prophecy. Yeah, other characters pointed us in the right direction throughout, but after we got the refugees to Kryta we acted as free agents, not beholden to any one leader or cause.

    Factions: Third fiddle to Master Bozo and his Cronie Brother Aggro

    NPC programming was definitly an issue in Factions. Lots of good ideas that campaign that got poor implementation.

    Nightfall : we were the only person who did not dislike Kormir

    Every single one of the protagonists liked Kormir. There was even a cutscene near the end where our PC tried to (unfairly) call Kormir on her kitten, and the other character present leaped to her defense.

    That's not really relevant, though, because Kormir herself was only relevant to small portions of the story. Even before her capture, she was gone for most of Istan, and after that our PC is, for all intents and purposes, the acting head of the Sunspears.

    R.I.P., Old Man of Auld Red Wharf. Gone but never forgotten.

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