Stop Mesmer Never-Ending Nerfs!! -Rework!!--Save Mesmer!! — Guild Wars 2 Forums

Stop Mesmer Never-Ending Nerfs!! -Rework!!--Save Mesmer!!

Burnfall.9573Burnfall.9573 Member ✭✭✭✭
edited February 4, 2019 in PVP

Anet return this profession to who they are meant to be--ability to confuse, distract, and drain the enemy's resources.
https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Mesmer

'A master of illusion, misdirection, and control, the Mesmer subverts the damage-dealing capabilities of others, manipulating their perceptions to achieve personal goals'

Yes, confusion is mesmer signature and it need to return solely to them at full potential. During their rework process, i ask Anet to remove Rune of Perplexity including complete removal of all related confusions in the game to be solely used by Mesmer only.

I encourage Anet to stop nerfing Mesmer and to put a final end of doing so. All the nerfs does is adding more conflict with endless non- results. Having 6 years of this profession identity being tossed around like a rag doll, to be abused non-stop to be pleased by the masses, to be something that they are not and to be continually mocked because of it---a laughing stock, to be called out continuously in countless forums for their actions that is outside of who they are not called to be.......being harrassed unconditionally because of it

Enough is Enough!!

To fix a root cause of a never-ending problem is to pull the plug completely and to deal with its root

' I'm lost. Will i ever find myself '

End Mesmer suffering and loss of identity-Mesmer is innocent and lost--out of control
Anet the time has come for you to save Mesmer--redesign-rework this profession---the never ending nerfs has only done more harm than good

Anet, Take Action~!!

ALone+Boy+in+Rain.jpg

Comments

  • Curunen.8729Curunen.8729 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 4, 2019

    @Solori.6025 said:

    @Burnfall.9573 said:
    Anet return this profession to who they are meant to be--ability to confuse, distract, and drain the enemy's resources.
    https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Mesmer

    'A master of illusion, misdirection, and control, the Mesmer subverts the damage-dealing capabilities of others, manipulating their perceptions to achieve personal goals'

    See that's the problem...

    Mirage was probably the closest they got to actual misdirection and "Master of illusion"

    People didn't like it when mesmer utilized stealth- Nerf threads appeared
    People didn't like clone deaths- Clones death trait nerfed
    People didn't like the ability for chrono to make you waste resources- Chrono was nerfed.
    People didn't like mesmer having control- Control was nerfed.

    People don't like mesmer. They could have a complete rework or another elite spec and take clones completely away, and this class would still be on the spectrum for people to hate it.
    Because it's never them that messes up, it's the mesmer.
    And ANET seems to think anyone playing a mesmer doesn't know what they are talking about. So lets not listen to the thousands of suggestions about how to make the class fun yet balanced NOOOoooOO
    Instead they look at the thread that starts off with " MesMeR HaS PeRmA sTeALtH and InVuLn! Plz nerf dis how..."
    It's why issues that are ACTUALLY issues haven't been addressed yet.

    /rant

    Anyway. Nothing they do at this point could make the class fun and balanced.
    It will either be dead completely because they will nerf everything instead of just the one build that needs to be addressed, or it will have one build that over performs because they refuse to address it.

    Well said, any time gw2 mesmer gets new misdirection mechanics it's usually the source of new whining. It's just how it is - the class that's intended to misdirect and troll is continually hated for being able to do so, because players don't like control being taken away.

    Mirage is probably the best example being a dual of the two most hated classes, mesmer+thief, for minimal visual tell on dodge and repositioning/detarget - source of so much ire when to be frank that's kind of the best execution of gw2 mesmer misdirection and how I've wanted to play all along, have some potential to confuse and misdirect with clones.
    Even then it's barely functional due to paper clones and no issue with reselecting correct player (providing the player actually has good targeting keybinds). I find it funny on pof launch so many thought detargeting was useless outside of one scenario where it actually buys you a couple of seconds (eg staff with IA and stand still while praying for rng luck), yet now it's one of the main things being complained about for some reason...

    Like totally scratch head. I mean I was addicted to axe 3 and IA pretty much since pof launched because it's way more fun to play mind games with this than with stealth (after they lowered the cooldown of IA from beta 30s to release 20s), always been glued to my skill bar but even then in wvw it's only really had lasting impact on bad groups (ie where you can fool say 8 bad players and kite) but against say 2 excellent players it doesn't buy you any time.

    Would sooner have how mirage functions now, than incentivise old PU passive gameplay (wvw of course, not pvp) which was truly stupid.

    IH hybrid | My ears, how are you! | Kourna Jackrabbit for default Springer

  • Mesmer like many other classes need nerfs. At least Nerf chaos armor and protection in chaos trait line. Mesmer should have super low amount of protection or not at all. In mirage make it so that you cant dodge while stunned. EM can allow dodging while stunned but not brake stun. There is more but these feel like the most important ones to me.

  • I still play core mes in pvp and find it viable, it's just not stupid easy like mirage. It dunks on boonbeast, scourge, FB, etc. There's so much synergy in the core trees it's ridiculous. The only thing I'd realllllly want for mesmer is my clone death traits back and Deceptive Evasion made not a GM trait :)

  • Lincolnbeard.1735Lincolnbeard.1735 Member ✭✭✭✭

    I actually support burnfall on this one.
    ANet please redesign mesmer into gw1 type of mesmer.
    Let the "omg evade evade invuln teleport..." qq era end and let the "omg I can't get skills to fire off and when I can I get rupted and 1/4 of my hp is lost, why is my entire skill bar on long cds always when fighting a mesmer and why I'm always with 0 endurance even tho I don't dodge, please nerf" era begin.

  • BadMed.3846BadMed.3846 Member ✭✭✭

    Stop defending a broken and utterly disappointing class. The mechanics are completely over the top and are nothing short of harrassing enemies. Such ruthless mechanics only deserve huge nerfs to make this class even acceptable on a somewhat even playing field. This class is so broken that I'm now fine with every other class and its mechanics. Just NERF the MIRAGE please!

  • Bigpapasmurf.5623Bigpapasmurf.5623 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 4, 2019

    Yes, dont BALANCE Mirage, NERF it. Dont balance Holo, NERF IT!. Boonbeast...dont think about balancing it...NERF EET!!! Its easier to nerf than to balance...meaning its the lazy way out and the lazy persons suggestion.

    Red = Dead...or someone runs away. Either way it's gone.
    twitch.tv/TRMC
    Lover of Jumping puzzles, Squirrels, WvW, and Taimi
    Co-Leader of SOmething inAPpropriate {SOAP}

  • Burnfall.9573Burnfall.9573 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 4, 2019

    @BadMed.3846 said:
    Stop defending a broken and utterly disappointing class. The mechanics are completely over the top and are nothing short of harrassing enemies. Such ruthless mechanics only deserve huge nerfs to make this class even acceptable on a somewhat even playing field. This class is so broken that I'm now fine with every other class and its mechanics. Just NERF the MIRAGE please!

    It's easy to ask for more Mesmer nerfs but it take courage to face it all....to stand with Mesmer for a complete rework

  • @Trevor Boyer.6524 said:
    Don't make it dramatic. Mirage needs nerfing, right along with Boonbeasts and Holos.

    Big +1

  • Zenix.6198Zenix.6198 Member ✭✭✭

    Why would you want to redesign the class.
    Gee people are so theatrical.
    Remove the "being able to dodge while stunned" thing.
    Nerf some Ambush skills (Staff, Axe and Scepter in particular, especially for Illusions when using IH).
    And mirage will be far more manageable.

    Its kinda funny how I never see people complaining about ambush skills. They legit are the lions-share of a Cmirages sustained dmg....and also add to the spammy gameplay.

  • Lincolnbeard.1735Lincolnbeard.1735 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Trevor Boyer.6524 said:
    They've been trying to balance Mirage ever since PoF release and it isn't fixing anything. At this point people are tired of waiting, and Mirage is actually driving people away from competitive game modes. It just needs to be nerfed man, like real nerfing. It could stand to lose about 1/5th of its damage output, that or about 1/5th of it's Saiyan like defenses, or in all honesty, maybe both.

    The reason is simple and has been said in some threads.
    Reason is the nerfs were based on forum qq instead of mesmer players suggestions, hence why the nerfs didn't hit the right places.

    @Zenix.6198 said:
    Why would you want to redesign the class.
    Gee people are so theatrical.
    Remove the "being able to dodge while stunned" thing.
    Nerf some Ambush skills (Staff, Axe and Scepter in particular, especially for Illusions when using IH).
    And mirage will be far more manageable.

    Its kinda funny how I never see people complaining about ambush skills. They legit are the lions-share of a Cmirages sustained dmg....and also add to the spammy gameplay.

    Funny enough, mesmer players have been the ones saying ambushes need a look at, some, in which I'm included have been arguing IH needs to be baseline in order for ambushes to get an easier balance, while it's not baseline ambushes are weak or strong as kitten.
    Of those you mentioned axe is really strong, scepter ambush is meh at best, staff is so so, with IH that is, without IH they're all on the "meh" side.

  • Burnfall.9573Burnfall.9573 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 4, 2019

    @Zenix.6198 said:
    Why would you want to redesign the class.
    Gee people are so theatrical.
    Remove the "being able to dodge while stunned" thing.
    Nerf some Ambush skills (Staff, Axe and Scepter in particular, especially for Illusions when using IH).
    And mirage will be far more manageable.

    Its kinda funny how I never see people complaining about ambush skills. They legit are the lions-share of a Cmirages sustained dmg....and also add to the spammy gameplay.

    Here are more interesting guide of mesmer including its roles
    https://guildwiki.gamepedia.com/Effective_mesmer_guide

    'Guide to playing as a mesmer'-
    https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Guide_to_playing_as_a_mesmer

    'Mesmers are often called the most difficult profession to play in Guild Wars, but if played well, can cause a lot of trouble for the enemy. They are best described as the debilitating or the saboteur profession that eschew outright attacks; they instead use misdirection against the foolish and rely on control-based abilities to sap foes of their strength. They can be used to their highest potential when played in a group'

    'Knowing your enemy as well as yourself is the path to victory for Mesmers, whose primary function is to control the enemy's agenda. Mesmers enjoy a vast array of tools to disrupt or turn enemy actions against them, as well as more standard degenerative and nerfing skills. Mesmers can push out enormous armor ignoring damage and influence the outcome of the battle with a single well-placed spell. A Mesmer can shut down enemies by interrupting their actions, disabling their skills and removing their adrenaline and energy. They can also cause health degeneration and afflict hexes that reverse the advantages of foes into liabilities, and apply a wide range of conditions. A Mesmer can even use someone's own energy against them (with skills like Energy Burn)'

  • @Solori.6025 said:
    And ANET seems to think anyone playing a mesmer doesn't know what they are talking about. So lets not listen to the thousands of suggestions about how to make the class fun yet balanced NOOOoooOO
    Instead they look at the thread that starts off with " MesMeR HaS PeRmA sTeALtH and InVuLn! Plz nerf dis how..."
    It's why issues that are ACTUALLY issues haven't been addressed yet.

    My laugh lines hate you. :joy:

    @Burnfall.9573 said:
    'Mesmers are often called the most difficult profession to play in Guild Wars, but if played well, can cause a lot of trouble for the enemy. They are best described as the debilitating or the saboteur profession that eschew outright attacks; they instead use misdirection against the foolish and rely on control-based abilities to sap foes of their strength. They can be used to their highest potential when played in a group'

    Sounds good but don't think people would hate Mesmers any less.

    'Knowing your enemy as well as yourself is the path to victory for Mesmers, whose primary function is to control the enemy's agenda. Mesmers enjoy a vast array of tools to disrupt or turn enemy actions against them, as well as more standard degenerative and nerfing skills.

    Sounds kind of like confusion and torment.

    Mesmers can push out enormous armor ignoring damage and influence the outcome of the battle with a single well-placed spell. A Mesmer can shut down enemies by interrupting their actions, disabling their skills and removing their adrenaline and energy. They can also cause health degeneration and afflict hexes that reverse the advantages of foes into liabilities, and apply a wide range of conditions. A Mesmer can even use someone's own energy against them (with skills like Energy Burn)'

    I think they gave some of this to necro.

    Yeah overall even if Mesmer were reworked this way, I'm 99% sure the qq would continue.

    “People fear what they don't understand and hate what they can't conquer.”
    ― Andrew Smith

  • EpicTurtle.8571EpicTurtle.8571 Member ✭✭✭✭

    GW1 Mesmer wouldn't work here. Most of its functions either are covered under generalized conditions (confusion, slow, etc), traits (every interrupt trait basically), or can't function in this game (anything that deals with energy manipulation). Furthermore, your call for a rework, which is unlikely in itself, is extremely vague. How should it be reworked? The criteria you mentioned are extremely subjective and it's entirely possible the ANet and many players already see them as having filled that theme.

  • Lincolnbeard.1735Lincolnbeard.1735 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 4, 2019

    @EpicTurtle.8571 said:
    GW1 Mesmer wouldn't work here. Most of its functions either are covered under generalized conditions (confusion, slow, etc), traits (every interrupt trait basically), or can't function in this game (anything that deals with energy manipulation). Furthermore, your call for a rework, which is unlikely in itself, is extremely vague. How should it be reworked? The criteria you mentioned are extremely subjective and it's entirely possible the ANet and many players already see them as having filled that theme.

    It would work, there are several threads on elite specs (I mentioned those on mirage/mesmer is op thread) that take gw1 mes influence and move it into gw2 aspects.
    But just imagine the reaction of people that are constantly saying mirage is op if anet reworked gw2 mes into gw1 mes. Forums would blow up from all nerf mes threads.

  • EpicTurtle.8571EpicTurtle.8571 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Lincolnbeard.1735 said:

    @EpicTurtle.8571 said:
    GW1 Mesmer wouldn't work here. Most of its functions either are covered under generalized conditions (confusion, slow, etc), traits (every interrupt trait basically), or can't function in this game (anything that deals with energy manipulation). Furthermore, your call for a rework, which is unlikely in itself, is extremely vague. How should it be reworked? The criteria you mentioned are extremely subjective and it's entirely possible the ANet and many players already see them as having filled that theme.

    It would work, there are several threads on elite specs (I mentioned those on mirage/mesmer is op thread) that take gw1 mes influence and move it into gw2 aspects.
    But just imagine the reaction of people that are constantly saying mirage is op if anet reworked gw2 mes into gw1 mes. Forums would blow up from all nerf mes threads.

    Yeah I looked at them, I arrived at much the same conclusion. Personally I thought they were rather hamfisted attempts at bringing GW1 into the game, but that's my opinion.

  • Amaranthe.3578Amaranthe.3578 Member ✭✭✭

    Boy you are taking the game way too seriously.

  • the "flavor" of Mesmer/Mirage is well-done in game; it just seems too effective in pvp.

    Confuse/Distract/Misdirection/Trolling is fine, but it shouldn't be able to kill/sustain so easily -- if distraction and misdirection is the idea, that sounds more like a support role.

  • Ganathar.4956Ganathar.4956 Member ✭✭✭

    How about Anet rework professions that actually need it instead of reworking mesmer every year?

    All that mesmer needs is a few nerfs to get rid of the unnecessary bloat thiat it has compared to most other professions.

  • apharma.3741apharma.3741 Member ✭✭✭✭

    The GW2 community cannot handle GW1 mesmer, you think the QQ is bad about current condi mirage? Amplify it by 2-3 times and you might get close to the crying that mesmer would generate if it was closer to GW1.

  • mortrialus.3062mortrialus.3062 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @apharma.3741 said:
    The GW2 community cannot handle GW1 mesmer, you think the QQ is bad about current condi mirage? Amplify it by 2-3 times and you might get close to the crying that mesmer would generate if it was closer to GW1.

    Mesmer interrupts putting skills on full cooldown alone would cause an ocean of boiling kitten to shoot out of everyone's eyes even with clones being removed.

    The Psychomancer: Mesmer Elite Specialization Suggestion

  • Swagg.9236Swagg.9236 Member ✭✭✭✭

    While Mirage is about as close to "master of misdirection" as this game has ever attempted to present, no one should be able to attack with impunity while under the aegis of protracted invulnerability. The only way to balance this sort of ability is either with a risk-riddled charge-up mechanic or by concurrently stripping the user of all out-going effects. Either mesmer isn't invulnerable at all, or gets to be invulnerable, but only as some sort of bizarre support role.

    GW1 Mesmer does exist in GW2: it's staff ele because it's the only true control and area hazard spec. However, everyone has stability and/or teleports, so it doesn't really have any effect on the field. Funny how that works.

  • Burnfall.9573Burnfall.9573 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 5, 2019

    @mortrialus.3062 said:

    @Swagg.9236 said:
    While Mirage is about as close to "master of misdirection" as this game has ever attempted to present, no one should be able to attack with impunity while under the aegis of protracted invulnerability. The only way to balance this sort of ability is either with a risk-riddled charge-up mechanic or by concurrently stripping the user of all out-going effects. Either mesmer isn't invulnerable at all, or gets to be invulnerable, but only as some sort of bizarre support role.

    GW1 Mesmer does exist in GW2: it's staff ele because it's the only true control and area hazard spec. However, everyone has stability and/or teleports, so it doesn't really have any effect on the field. Funny how that works.

    Staff Elementalist isn't even remotely close to GW1's mirage playstyle. Like... at all. GW1 Mesmers basically pick targets and tell them ' You don't get to contribute anything this fight. You skills fail. You're skills are interrupted. You energy is drained. You literally contribute nothing until I decided to let you '

    I like this line; It fits well with Mesmer persona

  • Ovark.2514Ovark.2514 Member ✭✭✭

    I like how the moderators have effectively given up on combining the condi mirage threads. I think last I checked the top 3 or 4 were all different threads about this subject.

  • apharma.3741apharma.3741 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Ovark.2514 said:
    I like how the moderators have effectively given up on combining the condi mirage threads. I think last I checked the top 3 or 4 were all different threads about this subject.

    Well when you cultivate a player base of casual players who are openly hostile to the possibility of thinking and learning to play what do you expect? We're just missing twitch thots and....oh wait.

  • mortrialus.3062mortrialus.3062 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Burnfall.9573 said:

    @mortrialus.3062 said:

    @Swagg.9236 said:
    While Mirage is about as close to "master of misdirection" as this game has ever attempted to present, no one should be able to attack with impunity while under the aegis of protracted invulnerability. The only way to balance this sort of ability is either with a risk-riddled charge-up mechanic or by concurrently stripping the user of all out-going effects. Either mesmer isn't invulnerable at all, or gets to be invulnerable, but only as some sort of bizarre support role.

    GW1 Mesmer does exist in GW2: it's staff ele because it's the only true control and area hazard spec. However, everyone has stability and/or teleports, so it doesn't really have any effect on the field. Funny how that works.

    Staff Elementalist isn't even remotely close to GW1's mirage playstyle. Like... at all. GW1 Mesmers basically pick targets and tell them ' You don't get to contribute anything this fight. You skills fail. You're skills are interrupted. You energy is drained. You literally contribute nothing until I decided to let you '

    I like this line; It fits well with Mesmer persona

    If you think mesmer is oppressive now. Imagine confusion condi mesmers except now they also have another condition that causes blowout damage if you don't use skills and will hit you with both at the same time.

    The Psychomancer: Mesmer Elite Specialization Suggestion

  • Zenix.6198Zenix.6198 Member ✭✭✭

    @Lincolnbeard.1735 said:

    Funny enough, mesmer players have been the ones saying ambushes need a look at, some, in which I'm included have been arguing IH needs to be baseline in order for ambushes to get an easier balance, while it's not baseline ambushes are weak or strong as kitten.
    Of those you mentioned axe is really strong, scepter ambush is meh at best, staff is so so, with IH that is, without IH they're all on the "meh" side.

    I mean.....I kinda agree with you. But for PvP at least the axe ambush is far too strong. And personally I think Staff ambush also is really good. You are right about scepter ambush tho....its kinda meh. That weapon has other issues altogether.

    Then again, Im also fine with ambush skills being on the "meh side" without IH.
    The gameplay it inspires is just too spammy. And looking out for ambush skills on top of shatters and all the other "mini-condi-bursts" (like pistol / torch) is just too much.
    And personally I'm fine with mirages keeping their condi-bursts (those a tleast are hit or miss)...it's really their sustained flow of condies (from ambushes) that just rubs me the wrong way.

  • Lincolnbeard.1735Lincolnbeard.1735 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Zenix.6198 said:
    And personally I'm fine with mirages keeping their condi-bursts (those a tleast are hit or miss)...it's really their sustained flow of condies (from ambushes) that just rubs me the wrong way.

    Most mesmers agree with this aswell, since a long time we've been saying condi application should be toned down.

  • Megametzler.5729Megametzler.5729 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Lincolnbeard.1735 said:

    @Zenix.6198 said:
    And personally I'm fine with mirages keeping their condi-bursts (those a tleast are hit or miss)...it's really their sustained flow of condies (from ambushes) that just rubs me the wrong way.

    Most mesmers agree with this aswell, since a long time we've been saying condi application should be toned down.

    Even that would be okay for me, if they would have to sacrafice sustain for it. Change mirage evade to not work during stun (and maybe immobilize?), give that functionality to Elusive Mind and get rid of that ridiculous exhaustion nonsense. Let mirage choose between damage with ambushes and defense with EM. Choices are interesting!

    Not gonna argue with the amount of cover conditions though. :smile:

  • Lincolnbeard.1735Lincolnbeard.1735 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 5, 2019

    @Megametzler.5729 said:

    @Lincolnbeard.1735 said:

    @Zenix.6198 said:
    And personally I'm fine with mirages keeping their condi-bursts (those a tleast are hit or miss)...it's really their sustained flow of condies (from ambushes) that just rubs me the wrong way.

    Most mesmers agree with this aswell, since a long time we've been saying condi application should be toned down.

    Even that would be okay for me, if they would have to sacrafice sustain for it. Change mirage evade to not work during stun (and maybe immobilize?), give that functionality to Elusive Mind and get rid of that ridiculous exhaustion nonsense. Let mirage choose between damage with ambushes and defense with EM. Choices are interesting!

    Not gonna argue with the amount of cover conditions though. :smile:

    Disagree with EM being able to evade while stun bit. Would prefer EM to cleanse one condi and - one soft cc cleanse or -20% CD on deception skills.

  • Megametzler.5729Megametzler.5729 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Lincolnbeard.1735 said:

    @Megametzler.5729 said:

    @Lincolnbeard.1735 said:

    @Zenix.6198 said:
    And personally I'm fine with mirages keeping their condi-bursts (those a tleast are hit or miss)...it's really their sustained flow of condies (from ambushes) that just rubs me the wrong way.

    Most mesmers agree with this aswell, since a long time we've been saying condi application should be toned down.

    Even that would be okay for me, if they would have to sacrafice sustain for it. Change mirage evade to not work during stun (and maybe immobilize?), give that functionality to Elusive Mind and get rid of that ridiculous exhaustion nonsense. Let mirage choose between damage with ambushes and defense with EM. Choices are interesting!

    Not gonna argue with the amount of cover conditions though. :smile:

    Disagree with EM being able to evade while stun bit. Would prefer EM to cleanse one condi and - one soft cc cleanse or -20% CD on deception skills.

    Well, the weaker mirage evade gets the better. I just want that incredibly strong mechanic not baseline. :wink:

  • PvP right now is swarming with condi mesmers... it's ridiculous. >.> If there's two of them in an enemy team, you're screwed.

  • Swagg.9236Swagg.9236 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 6, 2019

    @mortrialus.3062 said:

    @Swagg.9236 said:
    While Mirage is about as close to "master of misdirection" as this game has ever attempted to present, no one should be able to attack with impunity while under the aegis of protracted invulnerability. The only way to balance this sort of ability is either with a risk-riddled charge-up mechanic or by concurrently stripping the user of all out-going effects. Either mesmer isn't invulnerable at all, or gets to be invulnerable, but only as some sort of bizarre support role.

    GW1 Mesmer does exist in GW2: it's staff ele because it's the only true control and area hazard spec. However, everyone has stability and/or teleports, so it doesn't really have any effect on the field. Funny how that works.

    Staff Elementalist isn't even remotely close to GW1's mirage playstyle. Like... at all. GW1 Mesmers basically pick targets and tell them "You don't get to contribute anything this fight. You skills fail. You're skills are interrupted. You energy is drained. You literally contribute nothing until I decided to let you."

    It's a ranged caster that deals high amounts of damage while also inflicting crippling CC, and it will destroy anybody 1v1 if they lack teleport spam and stability. God help you if you play a necromancer around me: the moment you don't have stability, you stop playing the game because I'm pressing my buttons now; and that basically goes for anyone else who is caught in a moment of rotation cooldown or without panic buttons. Given how that was exactly what happened to anybody who approached a Mesmer in GW1 (a game that didn't have many teleports and lacked stability entirely), it's effectively the same. And aside from the staff kit itself, Tornado on its own is basically the effect of an entire E-surge bar at the press of a button.

  • mortrialus.3062mortrialus.3062 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Swagg.9236 said:

    @mortrialus.3062 said:

    @Swagg.9236 said:
    While Mirage is about as close to "master of misdirection" as this game has ever attempted to present, no one should be able to attack with impunity while under the aegis of protracted invulnerability. The only way to balance this sort of ability is either with a risk-riddled charge-up mechanic or by concurrently stripping the user of all out-going effects. Either mesmer isn't invulnerable at all, or gets to be invulnerable, but only as some sort of bizarre support role.

    GW1 Mesmer does exist in GW2: it's staff ele because it's the only true control and area hazard spec. However, everyone has stability and/or teleports, so it doesn't really have any effect on the field. Funny how that works.

    Staff Elementalist isn't even remotely close to GW1's mirage playstyle. Like... at all. GW1 Mesmers basically pick targets and tell them "You don't get to contribute anything this fight. You skills fail. You're skills are interrupted. You energy is drained. You literally contribute nothing until I decided to let you."

    It's a ranged caster that deals high amounts of damage while also inflicting crippling CC, and it will destroy anybody 1v1 if they lack teleport spam and stability. God help you if you play a necromancer around me: the moment you don't have stability, you stop playing the game because I'm pressing my buttons now; and that basically goes for anyone else who is caught in a moment of rotation cooldown or without panic buttons. Given how that was exactly what happened to anybody who approached a Mesmer in GW1 (a game that didn't have many teleports and lacked stability entirely), it's effectively the same. And aside from the staff kit itself, Tornado on its own is basically the effect of an entire E-surge bar at the press of a button.

    Oh I remember! You made that video of you playing staff Ele in plat! That was a great video to watch. Also +1 for recognizing Capricorn sucks for peel out strategies.

    GW1 mesmer would be like a halfway point between Staff Ele and GW2 mesmer. See GW2 mesmer does hearken back to both GW1 mesmers as well as classic illusionists that mesmers have always drawn inspiration from. Confusion, Torment, it's heavy access to blind, it's interrupts and all the value it can get out of interrupts are veeeery GW1 mesmer. More so than Elementalist's crowd control. The problem with mesmer is the minionmancer gameplay slapped on top of it.

    Illusionists since D&D Dragon Magazine #1 have summoned copies of themselves to fool opponents. That's literally the 70's and 80s. Even stuff like Blurred Frenzy and Distortion are classic illusionist spells as illusionists have historically used illusions to blurr their image and make them more difficult to hit. So I don't mind that being rolled into mesmer. But summoning swarms of minions, sacrificing them at key times for powerful effects, summoning more powerful minions on long cooldowns with strong singular effects. That's classic minion master gameplay more befitting of necromancers than illusionists. Mesmers summoning clones to disrupt opponents is fine, but everything revolving around clones and shatters was a flavor mistake. That should really have been Necromancer's class mechanic, minions and sacrifices.

    But I feel I've strayed far off topic at this point.

    The Psychomancer: Mesmer Elite Specialization Suggestion

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