Siege: Who thought that 1 hour was enough? — Guild Wars 2 Forums

Siege: Who thought that 1 hour was enough?

Astrolicus.3716Astrolicus.3716 Member ✭✭✭
edited February 8, 2019 in WvW

My complaint about WvW is the siege, who thought that 1 hour was enough? This bothers me a lot, honestly, there are people who do not even care about refreshing it and all the siege that someone built is lost in the end. My suggestion is simple, let Keep / Tower refresh the siege automatically or increase the count instead 1 hour. There are players who do not even care about refreshing it and that's a problem. You can save a keep or a tower if people remember to refresh it.

Even worse when your T3 Keep / Tower is captured by the enemy because people didn't want to refresh the siege at all. I just ask you to increase the count or let Keep / Tower refresh it automatically.

Comments

  • If a team can't be bothered to refresh the siege, then let it expire. I certainly don't think it's a good direction for siege to last infinitely long, just because it's in a keep, which would mean people could leave the map entirely and the siege would remain.

    I'm not against compromises, e.g. a new WvW mastery which allows siege you place to last two hours instead of one or a tactivator that refreshes all siege within range of the objective.

    There are players who do not even care about refreshing it and that's a problem.

    That's a human problem, a leadership problem, a management problem; I don't see at as a mechanical or game mode issue that ANet needs to address.

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  • Jey.2349Jey.2349 Member ✭✭

    @Illconceived Was Na.9781 is right, siege need to expire at some point in time and I think they shouldn't remain more than two hours.

    But what about a new tactic that increases the siege expire time by 50% so they'd last for 1.5 hours? For a single person refreshing the siege, half an hour is a big deal :)

  • HazyDaisy.4107HazyDaisy.4107 Member ✭✭✭✭

    On the flip side, I can't count how many times the back cappers have jumped out of a freshly capped objective and strolled right past enemy catas without a care in the world, almost as if they're just inviting these guys to come back so they can come back in 10 mins too.

    Once participation became more important than scouting and defending, players stopped caring, that's the long and short of it.

    So ok, yes, you get participation for destroying leftover enemy seige, but you get more for getting out and heading to the next juicy objective so you can back cap that. You however, get nothing for refreshing your own seige, hell, half the time you get nothing for using it defesively because most of your backup is off getting participation elsewhere.

    Changing the timer will not fix the lack of care, adding participation increases for refreshing it will though, but then you'll have to deal with troll seige and afk pippers, so there's no easy way to rectify it, the best we can do is get those that still care to refresh stuff every hour.

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  • Caedmon.6798Caedmon.6798 Member ✭✭✭

    Theres a siege map limit. I remember times where people would make dozens of siege on useless spots and commanders were unable to siege a tower with rams or catas or w/e siege because the limit was reached. This got changed a long time back to stop this from happening.

  • Strider Pj.2193Strider Pj.2193 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Kylden Ar.3724 said:
    Better idea, remove the timers, but ANYONE can use them, friend or foe.

    Then you have to be careful about your siege placement, or go break it when done (might need a self destruct skill on each then) to prevent it being used against you.

    Or make it so they can be used OR DAMAGED by each side. Making their use somewhat more potentially interesting.

    Though both would allow trolls to further impact their servers.

  • Jura.2170Jura.2170 Member ✭✭✭

    It takes a scout ~ 15 minutes to refresh siege in a fully sieged garri or keep, and its usually just one person who feels they have to do it to stop something awful happening later without it

    They then spend another 15 or 20 minutes running around towers and the castle if they have that too to refresh the siege there

    There's not much time for a scout to enjoy the rest of the game like fights. No one thanks them for it or gives them anything for it

    So please try to make their lives a little easier by making superior siege disappear at 90 minutes or more

    If you're worried about trolls making normal siege to waste supply and siege cap, make normal siege disappear after half an hour, and put a cap on how much supply an account can use to make normal siege each day

    Maybe siege blueprints should also have a range preview so we can see how far they'll shoot

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  • Strider Pj.2193Strider Pj.2193 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Jura.2170 said:
    It takes a scout ~ 15 minutes to refresh siege in a fully sieged garri or keep, and its usually just one person who feels they have to do it to stop something awful happening later without it

    They then spend another 15 or 20 minutes running around towers and the castle if they have that too to refresh the siege there

    There's not much time for a scout to enjoy the rest of the game like fights. No one thanks them for it or gives them anything for it

    So please try to make their lives a little easier by making superior siege disappear at 90 minutes or more

    If you're worried about trolls making normal siege to waste supply and siege cap, make normal siege disappear after half an hour, and put a cap on how much supply an account can use to make normal siege each day

    Maybe siege blueprints should also have a range preview so we can see how far they'll shoot

    If the server can only field one scout, and that scout is so valued, they should be getting shared participation.

    If that one scout wants to play other things, it was their choice to do the ‘scouting and refreshing’. Choose not to.

    Keep the Siege despawn timer at 60 minutes.

  • Jura.2170Jura.2170 Member ✭✭✭

    Some servers don't have people tagged up all the time, so there's no one who can give shared participation. And lots of tags forget to invite scouts to their squad or don't care about giving it to them

    And to some scouts, it's necessary, not a choice. Because if they don't do it and no one else wants to, their server looses everything on the map and they get spawn camped for hours

    Which is what happened to a server in Tier 3 yesterday

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  • Jwake.7013Jwake.7013 Member ✭✭✭

    Honestly I get where the op is coming from but this is more on the players end then the game needing adjusting imo. If an entire server of people is too lazy to refresh siege once an hour.... I get why the one person who actually is doing gets frustrated when no one else is though (as I have been in that situation myself many a times.)

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  • vier.1327vier.1327 Member ✭✭

    If they do not refresh the siege in 1 hour, they would not do even if the time would bigger.

    The siege should be not protected, the players must be protected from siege.

  • Strider Pj.2193Strider Pj.2193 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Again, if it’s that important, then it’s worth it. If it’s not, then do other things.

    It sounds more like the siege wouldn’t have mattered because you didn’t have enough on.

    If the tag doesn’t care, move on to something else.

  • Israel.7056Israel.7056 Member ✭✭✭✭

    They should make siege refresh cost supply so it would slowly drain an objective to just have tons of siege sitting in there. Also siege should have an ammo system so you couldn't just fire stuff endlessly without reloading it. For the realism.

  • ArchonWing.9480ArchonWing.9480 Member ✭✭✭
    edited February 8, 2019

    Remove the ability to place siege besides golems in towers/keeps entirely, and replace them with preplaced, fixed arrow carts/balli/trebs/whatnot that have to be built like cannons and oil, appearing when you t2/t3 a structure. However, most of them would be put in locations that are possible to destroy. Siege to player damage should also be nerfed. The "maintenance" for those of you that actually like doing it, would just be to rebuild them. It's also far more intuitive to new players to build at a build site then it is to check some timer nobody cares about.

    You would only be able to place siege offensively (or in camps) I guess, and refreshing is irrelevant. Siege trolling is also irrelevant. Mass sieging a tower is also irrelevant. Draining/wasting supply is harder to do. This would also be fair since everyone has equal access to the same amount of siege in their objectives.

    Siege is an outdated concept, was never good to begin with, and detracts from the concept of players actually fighting each other. Why should players be forced to a 24/7 banal activity on a nonstop basis? And it's not like this game mode isn't decided enough by people no-lifeing it. Let's just face reality. (Almost) no one cares anymore. It is not fun. The very existence of such a topic proves that. Siege is one of the factors why this game mode is dead and we need to move past it. The buff to arrow carts back then was one of the worst things to happen to the game mode. The nerf to it that happened was probably one of the better things.

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  • Jeknar.6184Jeknar.6184 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 8, 2019

    @Israel.7056 said:
    They should make siege refresh cost supply so it would slowly drain an objective to just have tons of siege sitting in there. Also siege should have an ammo system so you couldn't just fire stuff endlessly without reloading it. For the realism.

    For the realism too, I would like my trebuchet shots to actually one shot players. How are this people surviving a giant boulder being tossed at them?

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  • GDchiaScrub.3241GDchiaScrub.3241 Member ✭✭✭✭

    No. Siege refresh as a concept further favor's the server with more coverage. I would argue you have siege expire after an hour (not including canons, mortars, and oils). End of story. This makes it so there is an upkeep to even maintaining T3 objectives considering "Prime" time is in 3 hour windows anyway. In theory this would favor aggressive plays when it comes to siege warfare.

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  • Ayrilana.1396Ayrilana.1396 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 8, 2019

    @Jura.2170 said:
    It takes a scout ~ 15 minutes to refresh siege in a fully sieged garri or keep, and its usually just one person who feels they have to do it to stop something awful happening later without it

    They then spend another 15 or 20 minutes running around towers and the castle if they have that too to refresh the siege there

    There's not much time for a scout to enjoy the rest of the game like fights. No one thanks them for it or gives them anything for it

    So please try to make their lives a little easier by making superior siege disappear at 90 minutes or more

    If you're worried about trolls making normal siege to waste supply and siege cap, make normal siege disappear after half an hour, and put a cap on how much supply an account can use to make normal siege each day

    Maybe siege blueprints should also have a range preview so we can see how far they'll shoot

    If it takes 15 minutes to refresh a single garri or keep the the issue is with the scout.

    All players should make it a habit to refresh siege as they go by them.

    An issue that I see with extending the time is that it allows troll siege to last longer. Superior siege is not all that expensive.

  • Kylden Ar.3724Kylden Ar.3724 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Jeknar.6184 said:

    @Israel.7056 said:
    They should make siege refresh cost supply so it would slowly drain an objective to just have tons of siege sitting in there. Also siege should have an ammo system so you couldn't just fire stuff endlessly without reloading it. For the realism.

    For the realism too, I would like my trebuchet shots to actually one shot players. How are this people surviving a giant boulder being tossed at them?

    This is actually a fantastic idea. REALLY increase the damage, but make it take so much supply it takes an actual squad to use it.

    How many times we gotta tell you GRIND IS NOT CONTENT there ANet?

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  • Infusion.7149Infusion.7149 Member ✭✭✭

    It's due to siege trolls and improper placement (i.e. paper siege or random flame rams) that a 1 hour cap is necessary.

  • Optimator.3589Optimator.3589 Member ✭✭✭

    Okay, double the timers on all siege except ACs. Cut the timer on those in half and we got a deal.

    REDUCE NA TO 3 TIERS

  • @Jura.2170 said:
    It takes a scout ~ 15 minutes to refresh siege in a fully sieged garri or keep, and its usually just one person who feels they have to do it to stop something awful happening later without it

    They then spend another 15 or 20 minutes running around towers and the castle if they have that too to refresh the siege there

    There's not much time for a scout to enjoy the rest of the game like fights. No one thanks them for it or gives them anything for it

    So please try to make their lives a little easier by making superior siege disappear at 90 minutes or more

    If you're worried about trolls making normal siege to waste supply and siege cap, make normal siege disappear after half an hour, and put a cap on how much supply an account can use to make normal siege each day

    Maybe siege blueprints should also have a range preview so we can see how far they'll shoot

    normal siege is so useless it should expire in 15 minutes max. ugh. garbage

    Just another WvW lifer who'll never say die... while dying again and again!

  • Aeolus.3615Aeolus.3615 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 10, 2019

    Siege expiration makes sense in a game where siege cant be destroyed from outside, but on gw2 siege experitation timer or siege mechanics needs to be double checked at this time due how easy is to reach lameness lvls and use LoS with the skills.

    Maybe Anet could change the mechanics of the expiration and make damage from that siege getting reduced 20% every 1h and loosing max health as well.
    For superior siege, make it "demoted over time", to just normal siege with the same health penalty's.

    With the current LoS and its "way of manipulation for better results" high ground is not an advantage when on walls, it is actually a disavantage if the atackers know how to play and use the current mechanics. :} (it's scrub game at the end, there cant be much validations because it becomes hard for most).

  • Jura.2170Jura.2170 Member ✭✭✭

    What if you could only make siege if you were lvl 80?

    Would anyone mind the change if it helped stop siege trolling?

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  • MUDse.7623MUDse.7623 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Jura.2170 said:
    What if you could only make siege if you were lvl 80?

    Would anyone mind the change if it helped stop siege trolling?

    is lvl 80 really a restriction?

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  • Jura.2170Jura.2170 Member ✭✭✭

    @MUDse.7623 said:
    is lvl 80 really a restriction?

    It could help a bit

    Some trolls use lvl 2 alts to pull tacts and make paper siege next to supply huts

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  • MUDse.7623MUDse.7623 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Jura.2170 said:

    @MUDse.7623 said:
    is lvl 80 really a restriction?

    It could help a bit

    Some trolls use lvl 2 alts to pull tacts and make paper siege next to supply huts

    the only troll for whom leveling is an issue, is one that swaps server every matchup for free by deleting characters. but you could just disable being able to use tactivators/siege during the time you are not considered a citizen of that world.

    read this, become a better player now.

  • Towelie.9504Towelie.9504 Member ✭✭✭

    A siege buff is the last thing this game mode needs.

  • Blodeuyn.2751Blodeuyn.2751 Member ✭✭✭

    As a scout I'm ok with the 1 hour timer. Its enough time to make rounds to refresh, but not too long in order to allow troll siege to disappear. The timer use to be 30 minutes. Now that sucked.

    (Some of you know I have been sick for a while and it turns out I have a highly aggressive cancer. I'm now on week 4 of 6 for radiation therapy. I miss you guys!)

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  • Sviel.7493Sviel.7493 Member ✭✭✭

    What if there was some way to pull a single lever in the lord's room to refresh all siege inside the walls? There'd have to be some way to mark individual siege to be excluded from being refreshed, but that would be a whole lot less hassle for scouts.

    I'd still prefer to make guild siege last way longer since it's more easily traced, though.

  • @Astrolicus.3716 said:
    My complaint about WvW is the siege, who thought that 1 hour was enough? This bothers me a lot, honestly, there are people who do not even care about refreshing it and all the siege that someone built is lost in the end. My suggestion is simple, let Keep / Tower refresh the siege automatically or increase the count instead 1 hour. There are players who do not even care about refreshing it and that's a problem. You can save a keep or a tower if people remember to refresh it.

    Even worse when your T3 Keep / Tower is captured by the enemy because people didn't want to refresh the siege at all. I just ask you to increase the count or let Keep / Tower refresh it automatically.

    I think an unattended objective should degrade in some manner. If you want to encourage siege refresh perhaps offering some participation for the effort would be appropriate.

  • Strider Pj.2193Strider Pj.2193 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Glass Hand.7306 said:

    @Astrolicus.3716 said:
    My complaint about WvW is the siege, who thought that 1 hour was enough? This bothers me a lot, honestly, there are people who do not even care about refreshing it and all the siege that someone built is lost in the end. My suggestion is simple, let Keep / Tower refresh the siege automatically or increase the count instead 1 hour. There are players who do not even care about refreshing it and that's a problem. You can save a keep or a tower if people remember to refresh it.

    Even worse when your T3 Keep / Tower is captured by the enemy because people didn't want to refresh the siege at all. I just ask you to increase the count or let Keep / Tower refresh it automatically.

    I think an unattended objective should degrade in some manner. If you want to encourage siege refresh perhaps offering some participation for the effort would be appropriate.

    Participation is already kept up easily enough. Tapping siege should not be eligible for participation.

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