Twilight Oasis is a gameplay disaster — Guild Wars 2 Forums

Twilight Oasis is a gameplay disaster

I just tried to complete the Twilight Oasis on Tier 3 with a full group of extremely well-geared and experienced players, and it was the most unfair and boring experience I have had so far. The final boss "Amala" has WAY too much AoE or too short cooldowns on her attacks. For me as a druid healer it is literally impossible to utilize my class in any way because all I can do is run around to avoid AoE's and try to revive people, but even that is impossible because Amala keeps throwing so many AoE's literally EVERY second. This fractal needs to be more friendly to all the classes and that boss needs a serious revamp. The AoE attacks are fine as long as we can breathe for at least a few seconds in between to actually be able to use some skills, ESPECIALLY for me as a druid. I was completely useless. I also began to explore other flaws during the fight and whaddya know? The AoE's hit you even when you're NOT within the enemy AoE fields. This happened so many times I can't even count it, so not only are the AoE's eating away about 70% of your health in one swoop, they happen EVERY second without any form of cooldown or short pause, they also cover the entire room except for a few holes in the AoE fields on the ground where you can stand to avoid it, but that is also useless, because like I mentioned, they hit you even when you're outside them. There are many elements and factors to this boss fight, but the AoE's do not need to be like they are to make it more difficult. And if we bring in some mistlock instabilities as well you can be certain that it is literally impossible unless you're either lucky or spend 3-4 hours on that same fractals trying to complete it. Nobody wants that, and while a challenging game instance is nice and fun, this is not challenging, it's just unfair and infuriating. I am mostly saying this as a druid healer mind you, because I want my class to have something to bring to this fight. My healing didn't even do anything because of the relentless attack cycles so there NEEDS to be a pause between some of her attacks.
I may get some criticism for this post, but I don't care. This is the experience I had, it is my opinion and I stand by it. Twilight Oasis needs a nerf.

Comments

  • Answer: Every time it recharges

    Answer: I follow the exact rotation from Metabattle's Boon Support Healer build for druid https://metabattle.com/wiki/Build:Druid_-_Boon_Support_Healer

    Answer: Mostly Axe/Warhorn for regen and so I can do more damage since I mostly use Avatar to heal and focus on spamming boons.

    I'm not a pro healer at all, but I know how to use my class. I understand that not all pugs are great at fractals, but it is my opinion that a fractal should not be made so you have to spend 3-4 hours to complete just the one and then MAYBE get something good.
    It doesn't really matter what I did and how, because I couldn't do a single rotation due to the attacks that cover the entire room and eat 70% of your health every second. We probably could have completed it with some effort if the AoE's didn't hit you when you were outside the AoE fields. I carefully watched the AoE's and noted my position several times, and I was not the only one in the party who experienced this issue. I have sent a bug report about this stuff before, and it seems to be a recurring thing for PoF.

    It's probably possible to complete it somehow, but it's not worth it for me.

  • Amineo.8951Amineo.8951 Member ✭✭✭
    edited February 17, 2019

    Unfortunately TC, this is the endgame that people like, since PoF fights have been major clusterfucks where you can't see anything on your screen and forces you to spam heals if you want your team to survive, Amala and Soulless Horror in Hall of Chains (Wing 5) are my least favourite encounters in this game by a mile, it's just awful on the screen.

    Some of the new instabilities also makes some fractals that were fine not enjoyable anymore (99CM and 100CM just became worse than before and the latter has the 2nd boss aka Artsariiv which is as bad as Amala IMO), in Twilight Oasis case it's something I didn't want to see and it happened...

  • phs.6089phs.6089 Member ✭✭✭✭

    The new wave of fractals drastically differ from others. TO, Deeepstone, SR.
    Amala is scary till you get used to her attacks and start using special skill action to dodge.
    T3s in general are the place where people really start to learn things.
    Hang on in there, things will get easier.

    "There is always a lighthouse, there's always a man, there's always a city."

  • I have to agree with Cyninja and phs, this fractal gets a lot easier once you understand her attack pattern - apart from Lyssa and Grenth you can avoid everything with simple positioning and your special action key.

  • Here's Discretize's written+video guide for the T4 version as of September 2018 (getting to Amala is easier now; the boss fight is largely unchanged). Play it at reduced speed if you need.
    https://discretize.eu/fractals/twilight-oasis

    Hype is the path to the dark side. Hype leads to unfulfilled expectations. Disappointment leads to anger. Anger leads to disgust. Disgust leads to "oh, new shinies! I'm back!"

  • Safandula.8723Safandula.8723 Member ✭✭✭✭

    I can agree, with some instabs this fractal can be pain, but imo it's the best designed fractal in the game.
    If u know all amala attacks, u can simply avoid 90 % of dmg.
    There should be more fractals like that.
    I would only remove these kitten tornadoes

    make prepardness baseline plz

  • Eramonster.2718Eramonster.2718 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 18, 2019

    @Sareth Nagata.4809
    Like everyone above said, comes down to experience. It can be a rough experience climbing through T3. It's the intersection where mechanics starts to come in :smile: given attention to, damage and such. T.O as example, some aoe circles will be bigger, Melandru applies some minor cc/knockbacks and Balthazar will create shockwave after leaping and meteor which you can jump across to save endurance/dodges (which are not present in T1/T2). T3 is similar to T4 in many ways (just like T1 and T2). But less rewarding hence it's sparse to find veteran players actively going for it while having a better alternative.

    • What was the 2 instabilities at play?
    • What's causing the wipe? If you can provide more info on which phase etc, we can help picture and figure something out.
  • I personally enjoy twilight oasis if the instabilities dont kill the experience. The end fight is indeed littered with effects and I wouldnt mind there beind a BIT less but it is far from unhealable. My last run had me healing on renegade in a rene/FB combi while carrying 2 friends with sub 100 AR on T4 with bloody last laugh birds and we still managed. If you were unable to keep your dudes alive, it was either you or them. Just take your time to learn the encounter (on lower tiers if necessary) and DO USE YOUR SPECIAL KEY. It is insanely powerful and could as well replace all the dodges if you use it correctly.

  • Love this fractal, it's one of my favorites. Feels great once you know the fight and can avoid almost everything she throws at you.

  • People were probably not that exp'd/good at their roles, if you're keeping Stone/Sun spirits and WH5 regen up people shouldn't take much damage, you got a lot of dmg reduction, lots of dodges, special action key + heals.

    I'd advise against Water spirit btw, pretty bad heal for Fractals, traited Healing Spring is really nice but only if people stand in it, Glyph of Rejuvenation is GREAT for burst heals, for elite Nature spirit stab is nice but Glyph of Unity is probably better if you need even more heals.

  • Your problem is that you are treating this game as an RPG instead of the platformer that it is. What determines whether or not you can complete content is whether or not you can do the encounter mechanics which in this case is using the special action key and dodging well. The skill bar is only used for a rote DPS rotation which merely determines the speed at which you complete the content.

  • ProtoGunner.4953ProtoGunner.4953 Member ✭✭✭✭

    With 'extremely well geared' people T3 is a walk in the park. It's a question of experience. But you can also run a bit more tanky and boon/healer oriented build if you have problems.

    I remember though the 1st time we did T4 and it surely was hard. Experience makes the difference. That said the visual clutter is once more over the top. Something that Anet should address before it's too late.

  • Safandula.8723Safandula.8723 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @ProtoGunner.4953 said:
    With 'extremely well geared' people T3 is a walk in the park. It's a question of experience. But you can also run a bit more tanky and boon/healer oriented build if you have problems.

    I remember though the 1st time we did T4 and it surely was hard. Experience makes the difference. That said the visual clutter is once more over the top. Something that Anet should address before it's too late.

    with bad instabs, gear cant carry u, on some t3. volcanic, amala or sirens with birds+we bleed fire will kitten u if ur gonna count on gear only

    make prepardness baseline plz

  • Turkeyspit.3965Turkeyspit.3965 Member ✭✭✭✭

    It isn't called the Michael Bay of Fractals for nothing...

    The first few times I did it I hated that fractal, but over time I've become more accustomed to the mechanics, and with a good group composition it isn't too terrible a fractal to complete. The final fight is a doozy, no doubt, but with practice it gets easier.

    And TO with birds + bleed fire does suck far more than on other fractals. /shrug

  • Zhaid Zhem.6508Zhaid Zhem.6508 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Even aoes have a pattern/direction, with the front/back of Amala.
    Obviously first times you run in all directions, trying to dodge the present aoe, but with some experience you can divine the next and place yourself properly.
    For example.
    Lyssa, if you have troubles, kill the clones, one hit is often sufficient and you'll take less dmg/conditions; the F5 Scourge or the lazer disk from Holo will kill them all while running.
    Grenth, the first aoe smash you just need to get around, then she "whirl" (don't know the verb in english) and deals strong dmg, DH's F3 or some blocks/aegis will help you to burst her easily, or stay mid range. Balthazar, you stay at her back and can burst, you just need to do some steps sideways to avoid the fire cyclone.

    About the visual clutter and epileptic crisis ... I don't know.

  • I have to admit I did not real all the feedback you've got, so I might repeat some or all of that.
    As a druid main, I have to tell you, either you or your team had no clue what was happening.
    Judging by the way you write it's the former.
    As a druid you don't really camp staff.
    Actually we don't know anything about your gear and traits
    In general, your rotation is starting on staff, then swapping to warhorn for Quick Draw #5, then CA, spam whatever for 9 seconds, leave CA, #5 with Quick Draw, CA, rinse and repeat.
    Also, about aoe, there's a lot of stuff you can outright ignore, especially as a druid. Rule of thumb is the longer animation the harder it will hit, so just dodge that. Also just run/dodge when she's in Dwayna's form and spam lightnings.
    Plus cc her whenever possible.

  • DragonFury.6243DragonFury.6243 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Sareth Nagata.4809 said:
    I just tried to complete the Twilight Oasis on Tier 3 with a full group of extremely well-geared and experienced players, and it was the most unfair and boring experience I have had so far. The final boss "Amala" has WAY too much AoE or too short cooldowns on her attacks. For me as a druid healer it is literally impossible to utilize my class in any way because all I can do is run around to avoid AoE's and try to revive people, but even that is impossible because Amala keeps throwing so many AoE's literally EVERY second. This fractal needs to be more friendly to all the classes and that boss needs a serious revamp. The AoE attacks are fine as long as we can breathe for at least a few seconds in between to actually be able to use some skills, ESPECIALLY for me as a druid. I was completely useless. I also began to explore other flaws during the fight and whaddya know? The AoE's hit you even when you're NOT within the enemy AoE fields. This happened so many times I can't even count it, so not only are the AoE's eating away about 70% of your health in one swoop, they happen EVERY second without any form of cooldown or short pause, they also cover the entire room except for a few holes in the AoE fields on the ground where you can stand to avoid it, but that is also useless, because like I mentioned, they hit you even when you're outside them. There are many elements and factors to this boss fight, but the AoE's do not need to be like they are to make it more difficult. And if we bring in some mistlock instabilities as well you can be certain that it is literally impossible unless you're either lucky or spend 3-4 hours on that same fractals trying to complete it. Nobody wants that, and while a challenging game instance is nice and fun, this is not challenging, it's just unfair and infuriating. I am mostly saying this as a druid healer mind you, because I want my class to have something to bring to this fight. My healing didn't even do anything because of the relentless attack cycles so there NEEDS to be a pause between some of her attacks.
    I may get some criticism for this post, but I don't care. This is the experience I had, it is my opinion and I stand by it. Twilight Oasis needs a nerf.

    No
    NO it isnt
    you can complete Twilight Oasis end boss with almost any instabilities and you ll never get hit once (just learn the mechanics )
    do you want to know what is a game play disaster Siren's Reef end boss

  • Oh, this thread has real spirit.

  • Zenith.7301Zenith.7301 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 27, 2019

    Learn to use your special keys. It virtually counters every single boss mechanic and group of adds in there. You're supposed to use it to dodge all the aoe and ground waves and brak stuns/knockbacks.

    TO and Shattered Observatory are where I see people virtually never make use of their special keys when it could save them. Artsariv knocked you down with an orb and is about to stomp? Stunbreak with hypernova launch and dodge. TO's Amala scythe spin knocks you back? Stunbreak out. She raises her scythe to the air and is about to slam it on the ground? Dodge the ground pound and waves by jumping up with the special key.

    Of course, bosses get much harder with poor group DPS because in this game the healing cannot overcome the bursts of damage for extended periods of time.

    So ultimately you have to develop knowledge of mechanics but also weed out people who can't DPS properly and send them back to lower fractals until they learn their DPS rotations.

  • reapex.8546reapex.8546 Member ✭✭✭
    edited February 28, 2019

    @Sareth Nagata.4809 said:
    I just tried to complete the Twilight Oasis on Tier 3 with a full group of extremely well-geared and experienced players, and it was the most unfair and boring experience I have had so far. The final boss "Amala" has WAY too much AoE or too short cooldowns on her attacks. For me as a druid healer it is literally impossible to utilize my class in any way because all I can do is run around to avoid AoE's and try to revive people, but even that is impossible because Amala keeps throwing so many AoE's literally EVERY second. This fractal needs to be more friendly to all the classes and that boss needs a serious revamp. The AoE attacks are fine as long as we can breathe for at least a few seconds in between to actually be able to use some skills, ESPECIALLY for me as a druid. I was completely useless. I also began to explore other flaws during the fight and whaddya know? The AoE's hit you even when you're NOT within the enemy AoE fields. This happened so many times I can't even count it, so not only are the AoE's eating away about 70% of your health in one swoop, they happen EVERY second without any form of cooldown or short pause, they also cover the entire room except for a few holes in the AoE fields on the ground where you can stand to avoid it, but that is also useless, because like I mentioned, they hit you even when you're outside them. There are many elements and factors to this boss fight, but the AoE's do not need to be like they are to make it more difficult. And if we bring in some mistlock instabilities as well you can be certain that it is literally impossible unless you're either lucky or spend 3-4 hours on that same fractals trying to complete it. Nobody wants that, and while a challenging game instance is nice and fun, this is not challenging, it's just unfair and infuriating. I am mostly saying this as a druid healer mind you, because I want my class to have something to bring to this fight. My healing didn't even do anything because of the relentless attack cycles so there NEEDS to be a pause between some of her attacks.
    I may get some criticism for this post, but I don't care. This is the experience I had, it is my opinion and I stand by it. Twilight Oasis needs a nerf.

    Twilight Oasis has been nerfed overall. It should not take 3-4 hours unless the group is inexperience. Wipes are often cost during the Amala fight when the group stands in the bigger aoe circles. The group can ignore the smaller aoe circles because their healer can heal them through them just fine. Twilight Oasis is one of my favorite fractals because it feels like a roller coaster, things get really intense then they calm down. Only to get really intense again, when you really understand the fight you can ride on the difficulty like surfing a wave. Don't fight against the wave, learn the mechanics, and adapt to the fight.
    Edit: My main role here is Druid on T4 Twilight Oasis.

  • i've 2 manned this fractal on t4 with a condi zerker + condi scourge. it's easy as hell, git gud

  • Timo.1065Timo.1065 Member ✭✭✭

    @Sareth Nagata.4809 said:
    I just tried to complete the Twilight Oasis on Tier 3 with a full group of extremely well-geared and experienced players, and it was the most unfair and boring experience I have had so far.

    Boring cuz you can't do it? Don't be mad, just practice more with your extremely well-geared and experienced players.
    You have dodge, buffs from another players and special key ability to avoid all aoe. Easy.

  • "a full group of extremely well-geared and experienced players" will not have any trouble in TO nowadays......, at least in Tier 4's. try to hire an experienced healer quickness firebrand in your group and you will see the difference. Anything below T4s nowadays you won't have any trouble unless your whole group playing Leeroy to have fun

  • Turkeyspit.3965Turkeyspit.3965 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @XenoSpyro.1780 said:
    Oh, this thread has real spirit.

    This is why we need No Downed State week.