DDoS attack in ranked PvP? — Guild Wars 2 Forums

DDoS attack in ranked PvP?

Sagadeath.4683Sagadeath.4683 Member ✭✭

Hi :)

I came to tell something that has happened to me now. The scenario was simple, we had the lead and unexpectedly my team got a massive lag spike at the same time, around 900ms but the opposite team seemed to be normal. However when they capped everything and the match was close to the end, magically our ping just normalized.

I tried to search for other topics of the same kind but I had no luck. I don't know if i am thinking it to much but at least I want to leave a record of this incident.

Thanks and sorry for my bad english!

Comments

  • Trevor Boyer.6524Trevor Boyer.6524 Member ✭✭✭✭

    What's your time zone and what time was it? I had a couple big rando lag DCs myself, earlier in wvw.

  • Sagadeath.4683Sagadeath.4683 Member ✭✭
    edited March 7, 2019

    @Trevor Boyer.6524 said:
    What's your time zone and what time was it? I had a couple big rando lag DCs myself, earlier in wvw.

    GMT-5
    The lag started at 00:03
    Ended at 00:08

  • rng.1024rng.1024 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Happened to me too yesterday evening, in the middle of matches there were big spikes messing up my movement and skills. Happened in 2 separate games, got fixed in one but lasted until I came back to the lobby in the other. Asked in team chat both times if anyone else got the same, only 1 replied affirmative so not sure on what end the cause originates.

  • sephiroth.4217sephiroth.4217 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited March 7, 2019

    Can players actually do this sorta stuff?
    I don't want to sound paranoid or nothing but a week or so ago I had a game where we won mid fight, had home and rotated to far on Khylo essentially locking the map down then someone on my team DC'd and I had lag spikes for the whole match, and this started shortly after wiping the whole enemy team.

    Not to brag, but I put together a puzzle in 4 days and the box said 2-4 years.
    Please allow team queue with rewards again at our own discretion.
    06210311 251521 121512

  • This happened to me too... When our team has a huge advantage and snowballing the opposition, suddenly get hit by lags and one would DC from our team and lag lasts until we can't turn the match around in anyway... But I'm a low to mid gold so... There really is no motive for an enemy player to go to such lengths just to win a gold match... If it were happening in plat mid to high, this might be worth looking into

  • Trevor Boyer.6524Trevor Boyer.6524 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited March 7, 2019

    @Sagadeath.4683

    If anything, it's probably some form or another of a drophack and not a DDOS. I'm not a super knowledgeable programmer, but from what I understand, here is the difference between the two:

    • DDOSing is a coordinated aggressive attack vs. an IP address specifically. A person would usually not go out of their way to DDOS unless there was a real purpose behind it. like DDOSing some company's website, who they feel screwed them over. Or if they DDOS someone personally through a game, it happens during some money tournament. Real DDOS attacks aren't so simple to perform. DDOSing sends all of these little packets of information to overflow a system's resources, and then you start getting errors like "Cannot connect to server." In Guild Wars 2, when we've been DDOSed in the past, we all DC to the character screen and can't log back into the server. So the DDOS is only lagging us out of the server, it isn't shutting the game client down on us. The DDOS isn't going any further than creating server-side problems. It is not causing anything to happen client-side. If a person were to go out of their way to DDOS an individual person, they would need to know your IP address directly. Now I know that using voice-chats is usually a pretty easy way to make your IP rather public to anyone who is seeking to obtain it, so if you use things like Discord & TS3 often, chances are, your IP is floating around out there on some guy's list of player IPs. Now if someone DDOSed you mid ranked game, it wouldn't lag just GW2, it would lag everything. To my knowledge, it would be impossible to find someone's IP mid-match if they didn't already know it, to be able to DDOS another player. To do something like that, they'd need to have Arenanet employee like admin access to server information. And even if they did, would it be worth dinking around in a 2nd window to pull all of this stuff up, to launch a DDOS mid-match, when you only have like 8 minutes to win the match to begin with? Probably not, but I could be wrong. And I have known a couple people who were DDOSed because of this game, but when a real DDOS attack lays down on someone, it isn't a single drop from a game, it's usually some elongated amount of time that your IP is being hit, preventing you from being able to do anything at all.
    • Drophacks are one of the oldest forms of cheating/hacking via online gaming. These obnoxious programs are like the common cold, there just isn't any way to stop them from emerging. These stupid programs exist EVERYWHERE, and the reason why is because of how easy they are to configure and setup as a downloadable program. People think drophacks are "sending them lag" or "someone lagging them out of the game" this has nothing to do with how drophacks function. All the drophack is, is a program that is exploiting corrupted or broken information packets, that the client-side processing gets confused over, and then your game critical errors and shuts down on you. It actually isn't lag at all. It may feel like lag while it's happening, but it's actually your client-side game processing getting confused and bugging out, which usually results in the game client just shutting down completely or freezing up so that you have to manually restart the program. If you DC out to character select it was a lag DC. If your game is completely turning itself off or ultra deep freezing, that's some kind of a processing error, not lag. They can easily configure it into a program and distribute it to many, once they've figured out which in-game packets can create crash bugging. The program sends some corrupt packets to the server, and then the server tries to relay that information to the players standing near the guy sending the packets in-game, and then client-side processing implodes when it can't understand what the server is saying is happening on the screen or in the game engine.

    Over the years, I've ran across several people that I had strong suspicion of them using drophacks. There are always a few tell tale signs of potential drophack use:

    • Never happens in unranked or pve. Quite mysterious indeed.
    • Only ever happens when I'm "winning" a ranked match or in wvw.
    • Always seems to happen when I am around a particular player. I'll play 20 games in a day's time, and the 2 matches where my game magically freezes and drops me, will both be matches where that particular player is present, and it always happens when I engage that particular player directly.
    • Happens in wvw from time to time. Every time it happens, the circumstance is the same that, there is some X amount of roamers that I keep winning against. I can always tell the guys who are getting heated about it, because they start going out of their way to come looking for you. Then it always happens the same way. Some person who is heated, who came looking for me, jumps in to engage me and then all of a sudden my game crashes and shuts down. It never happens before the person finds me, never happens after I kill him, always as he approaches and engages me. And it never happens with random people, only ever the people that you can tell are heated, who are trying hard to epride on you.

    I don't want to convince you that everyone is drophacking each other left & right, that certainly isn't the case. But these things do exist, and I find it quite curious that the rate of frequency for random game crash DCs is much higher for teams who are winning, than for teams who were already losing lol.

  • phokus.8934phokus.8934 Member ✭✭✭✭

    L3 handles most of the internet backbone within the continental US and they were experiencing issues yesterday. Good chances that’s why you and others were seeing issues.

  • XIAN ZHE JING JING.2158XIAN ZHE JING JING.2158 Member ✭✭
    edited September 11, 2019

    https://imgur.com/a/5LpFQ4E
    I have not encountered it for the first time.
    The situation described by Trevor Boyer.6524

    I got 2000+4000+PING.
    But as long as I stay away from some players, my PING will be normal.

    I opened the work manager PING display is not the same as the value in the game.

    I have repaid this question before, but GM does not understand it at all.

    https://imgur.com/SctEA0j
    GW2 GAME ping500+
    performance monitor ping248~335

  • Gamble.4580Gamble.4580 Member ✭✭✭

    I had yesterday in every fight a thf was in I noticed it was laggy and happened the next game to but might of just been me as no1 replayed when I asked about it in /m

  • MyPuppy.8970MyPuppy.8970 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Is there any pride, joy, or satisfaction winning like that?

  • Engal.6359Engal.6359 Member ✭✭✭

    It's technically possible, but much more likely your ISP is as crappy as everyone else's. They would have be very committed to win a ranked game that way. So yeah you almost certainly weren't getting ddosed, call your ISP and complain to them.

  • @MyPuppy.8970 said:
    Is there any pride, joy, or satisfaction winning like that?

    I think the same thing. But there's tons of gold and even legendary armor to be had farming this way. Though for some hackers the feeling of messing up someone else's system also gives satisfaction. It's super illegal and dumb to do but that's part of it.

  • @Engal.6359 said:
    It's technically possible, but much more likely your ISP is as crappy as everyone else's. They would have be very committed to win a ranked game that way. So yeah you almost certainly weren't getting ddosed, call your ISP and complain to them.

    I am Taiwan Player.
    I have used WinMTR.
    WinMTR shows PING is 200~250.
    The same server ip, the game is showing 500+ ping or even higher.
    If it is an ISP problem, then I should get the same high PING.

    I have already reported this problem.
    Game and WinMTR show ping different.
    But the only answer I got was to ask me to check the ISP.

  • Engal.6359Engal.6359 Member ✭✭✭

    @XIAN ZHE JING JING.2158 said:

    @Engal.6359 said:
    It's technically possible, but much more likely your ISP is as crappy as everyone else's. They would have be very committed to win a ranked game that way. So yeah you almost certainly weren't getting ddosed, call your ISP and complain to them.

    I am Taiwan Player.
    I have used WinMTR.
    WinMTR shows PING is 200~250.
    The same server ip, the game is showing 500+ ping or even higher.
    If it is an ISP problem, then I should get the same high PING.

    I have already reported this problem.
    Game and WinMTR show ping different.
    But the only answer I got was to ask me to check the ISP.

    Not to offend anyone, but the chances that you're high enough rated for ppl to bother are minimal (I'm certainly not). No one would take that much time outside mAT or top 10 games. If someone is ddosing you it's probably personal. Unless you have a static IP they would have to find it every time they wanted to mess with you.

    As frustrating as it can be, ping isnt caused by some malicious "hacker". Its just an annoying problem.

  • I had an unranked game last week where my team had a 200 point lead in Capricorn, I went to go decap far and hard crashed(had to alt f4) when I loaded back in my entire team had dc’d and the enemy had capped everything, not a single player on the other team disconnected. It was unranked, and was more strange than anything, and I’m not trying to be accusatory. But it certainly felt like someone was trying something.

  • Disconnects have been happening to me. Sadly my isp has already come to my house 5 times and can't really pinpoint the problem I get so many network errors and high random pings and the support just shrugs and says web congestion

  • Trevor Boyer.6524Trevor Boyer.6524 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited September 12, 2019

    YEAH IT'S JUST PRETTY WEIRD WHEN IT ONLY HAPPENS WHEN YOU'RE WINNING.

    And INB4 "Oh it probably happens just as often when you're losing but you don't remember it." No, some people actually pay attention to things like this. I get maybe a ratio 10 winning DCs to 1 losing DC. And all of the super weird highly questionable DCs are the ones that happen when I'm winning. When I DC if I am already losing, it always looks like a clear actual real DC, where my entire ISP goes down due to maintenance or something and my neighbor across the hall on his XBOX will experience the same thing. But when I DC when I'm winning, it's always like: "Nothing DCs except GW2, and when I log back in no one else experienced the lag or lock up except me."

    No over exaggeration there ^ If other players cared enough to begin paying attention, they would also notice these similar patterns. Got to wonder why that's happening the way that it is.

    I've said this in another thread before and I'll say it again: "The poop is poop. I don't need to bend down and touch it or pick it up or send it in to a team of highly trained scientists to run tests on it. If I see poop in a field, I know it's poop, and no one is going to tell me it isn't poop when it is quite clearly poop."

    Such is the amount of obvious cheating in Guild Wars 2 spvp.

  • XIAN ZHE JING JING.2158XIAN ZHE JING JING.2158 Member ✭✭
    edited September 12, 2019

    @Engal.6359 said:

    @XIAN ZHE JING JING.2158 said:

    @Engal.6359 said:
    It's technically possible, but much more likely your ISP is as crappy as everyone else's. They would have be very committed to win a ranked game that way. So yeah you almost certainly weren't getting ddosed, call your ISP and complain to them.

    I am Taiwan Player.
    I have used WinMTR.
    WinMTR shows PING is 200~250.
    The same server ip, the game is showing 500+ ping or even higher.
    If it is an ISP problem, then I should get the same high PING.

    I have already reported this problem.
    Game and WinMTR show ping different.
    But the only answer I got was to ask me to check the ISP.

    Not to offend anyone, but the chances that you're high enough rated for ppl to bother are minimal (I'm certainly not). No one would take that much time outside mAT or top 10 games. If someone is ddosing you it's probably personal. Unless you have a static IP they would have to find it every time they wanted to mess with you.

    As frustrating as it can be, ping isnt caused by some malicious "hacker". Its just an annoying problem.

    I have already played 130+ MAT PVP this time.
    I am a gold 3.
    My situation is when the other side is behind.
    Are happening close to a specific player.
    When the score is close, it will happen again.

    WvW
    The person I want to know, I already know what I am saying, just like that.

    I know the program that might bring this kind of effect, but I am not sure I have not tried it.
    https://v.youku.com/v_show/id_XOTIyNDc4OTA4.html?spm=a2hzp.8253869.0.0
    2015 Chinese video film, some people tested, the side effect is that other players will be very LAG.
    This program is free.
    But he is only 32-bit version

  • @XIAN ZHE JING JING.2158 said:

    @Engal.6359 said:
    It's technically possible, but much more likely your ISP is as crappy as everyone else's. They would have be very committed to win a ranked game that way. So yeah you almost certainly weren't getting ddosed, call your ISP and complain to them.

    I am Taiwan Player.
    I have used WinMTR.
    WinMTR shows PING is 200~250.
    The same server ip, the game is showing 500+ ping or even higher.
    If it is an ISP problem, then I should get the same high PING.

    I have already reported this problem.
    Game and WinMTR show ping different.
    But the only answer I got was to ask me to check the ISP.

    The ping you see under f11 is not the same as from the map you are on, just mentioning.

  • Dami.5046Dami.5046 Member ✭✭✭✭

    In another game, there was hacks -proven by a friend one day- that could d/c a player. I saw it in action, because my account got D/C, . So I wouldn't say its a DDOS attack, sir.
    Just some people can't bare to lose.

  • XIAN ZHE JING JING.2158XIAN ZHE JING JING.2158 Member ✭✭
    edited September 12, 2019

    @TheMaverick.6104 said:

    @XIAN ZHE JING JING.2158 said:

    @Engal.6359 said:
    It's technically possible, but much more likely your ISP is as crappy as everyone else's. They would have be very committed to win a ranked game that way. So yeah you almost certainly weren't getting ddosed, call your ISP and complain to them.

    I am Taiwan Player.
    I have used WinMTR.
    WinMTR shows PING is 200~250.
    The same server ip, the game is showing 500+ ping or even higher.
    If it is an ISP problem, then I should get the same high PING.

    I have already reported this problem.
    Game and WinMTR show ping different.
    But the only answer I got was to ask me to check the ISP.

    The ping you see under f11 is not the same as from the map you are on, just mentioning.

    So what is the PING displayed by the work administrator?
    The /IP directive is not trusted?
    https://imgur.com/SctEA0j
    Or use other means to get the correct server ip?
    When I have a very serious LAG, I open the work administrator to view the ping, it is normal, only the game shows abnormal.

  • Trevor Boyer.6524Trevor Boyer.6524 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited September 12, 2019

    @XIAN ZHE JING JING.2158 said:

    @TheMaverick.6104 said:

    @XIAN ZHE JING JING.2158 said:

    @Engal.6359 said:
    It's technically possible, but much more likely your ISP is as crappy as everyone else's. They would have be very committed to win a ranked game that way. So yeah you almost certainly weren't getting ddosed, call your ISP and complain to them.

    I am Taiwan Player.
    I have used WinMTR.
    WinMTR shows PING is 200~250.
    The same server ip, the game is showing 500+ ping or even higher.
    If it is an ISP problem, then I should get the same high PING.

    I have already reported this problem.
    Game and WinMTR show ping different.
    But the only answer I got was to ask me to check the ISP.

    The ping you see under f11 is not the same as from the map you are on, just mentioning.

    So what is the PING displayed by the work administrator?
    The /IP directive is not trusted?
    https://imgur.com/SctEA0j
    Or use other means to get the correct server ip?
    When I have a very serious LAG, I open the work administrator to view the ping, it is normal, only the game shows abnormal.

    Ping is reading your latency, the speed in which data is being transferred between your PC and the Arenanet server, or your PC and your ISP in general.

    Drophacks are not like DDOS at all. Drophacks aren't even lag. Drophacks are just corrupt files that someone sends the server, and then the server tries to send your PC. It happens at normal latency speeds "normal ping". It only feels like you're lagging when you DC or crash because your game client stops responding because it doesn't know how to respond to broken packets. This is why nothing else is lagging or seems to have high ping, except the GW2. Sometimes a drophack doesn't completely crash your client, but it confuses it enough to where things start bugging out for a few seconds and the ping rises a bit because the system is hiccupping from trying to figure out what in the hell data it's even reading and what it's going to do with it.

    If it were actual lag spikes coming from Arenanet's server, more people would be experiencing it rather than just YOU. If it were your ISP lagging, everything would be lagging, not just GW2.

    Do some GOOGLE searches yourself on "Drop Hack". You'll see that they aren't even technically "Hacks" and that even a junior programmer in some college program can easily devise this stuff and put it to use really easily in and on almost every platform of gaming out there, in any game.

  • phokus.8934phokus.8934 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @XIAN ZHE JING JING.2158 said:

    @TheMaverick.6104 said:

    @XIAN ZHE JING JING.2158 said:

    @Engal.6359 said:
    It's technically possible, but much more likely your ISP is as crappy as everyone else's. They would have be very committed to win a ranked game that way. So yeah you almost certainly weren't getting ddosed, call your ISP and complain to them.

    I am Taiwan Player.
    I have used WinMTR.
    WinMTR shows PING is 200~250.
    The same server ip, the game is showing 500+ ping or even higher.
    If it is an ISP problem, then I should get the same high PING.

    I have already reported this problem.
    Game and WinMTR show ping different.
    But the only answer I got was to ask me to check the ISP.

    The ping you see under f11 is not the same as from the map you are on, just mentioning.

    So what is the PING displayed by the work administrator?
    The /IP directive is not trusted?
    https://imgur.com/SctEA0j
    Or use other means to get the correct server ip?
    When I have a very serious LAG, I open the work administrator to view the ping, it is normal, only the game shows abnormal.

    The ping value in game is, if I recall, RTT (round-trip time) which differs from ping. RTT takes into consideration a few more layers (especially on the application layer) where ping is a simple ICMP value to a specified server.

    There's a whole slew of possibilities as to why you have a low ping but experience latency type issues when in game. The most likely scenario is the intermittent high latency is due to routing from your ISP to GW2's servers. Considering you're in Taiwan, the amount of nodes traffic has to go through could be having an issue.

  • XIAN ZHE JING JING.2158XIAN ZHE JING JING.2158 Member ✭✭
    edited September 13, 2019

    @phokus.8934 said:

    @XIAN ZHE JING JING.2158 said:

    @TheMaverick.6104 said:

    @XIAN ZHE JING JING.2158 said:

    @Engal.6359 said:
    It's technically possible, but much more likely your ISP is as crappy as everyone else's. They would have be very committed to win a ranked game that way. So yeah you almost certainly weren't getting ddosed, call your ISP and complain to them.

    I am Taiwan Player.
    I have used WinMTR.
    WinMTR shows PING is 200~250.
    The same server ip, the game is showing 500+ ping or even higher.
    If it is an ISP problem, then I should get the same high PING.

    I have already reported this problem.
    Game and WinMTR show ping different.
    But the only answer I got was to ask me to check the ISP.

    The ping you see under f11 is not the same as from the map you are on, just mentioning.

    So what is the PING displayed by the work administrator?
    The /IP directive is not trusted?
    https://imgur.com/SctEA0j
    Or use other means to get the correct server ip?
    When I have a very serious LAG, I open the work administrator to view the ping, it is normal, only the game shows abnormal.

    The ping value in game is, if I recall, RTT (round-trip time) which differs from ping. RTT takes into consideration a few more layers (especially on the application layer) where ping is a simple ICMP value to a specified server.

    There's a whole slew of possibilities as to why you have a low ping but experience latency type issues when in game. The most likely scenario is the intermittent high latency is due to routing from your ISP to GW2's servers. Considering you're in Taiwan, the amount of nodes traffic has to go through could be having an issue.

    This is the problem.

    This will only happen when the opposite score is behind.
    And only if you encounter a specific player.
    If the player is at the MID I am at FAR or at home, I am normal.

    Don't meet a specific player.
    X V1 is normal.

  • this happened to me. moof, and i think nero the same time one game. It's on one of moof's stream vods if you care enough to find it . it was really sus

  • Engal.6359Engal.6359 Member ✭✭✭

    There is a confirmation bias here. You are much more likely to notice/remember high ping when you lose than when you win. If you really have problems, use a VPN. If they are attacking your IP, they won't be able to trace you. Also, its much more likely you're getting DoSed than DDoSed as DDoS requires multiple machines.

    No one notices high ping when rotating across the map because you can't tell unless you're using skills. You only remember when you're in a fight and get screwed by lag. That doesn't mean it doesn't happen, it means you dont pay attention when it does.

    ** TL;DR: You are not the target of a malicious conspiracy.**

  • Is it me or does it happen more often when there's players from EU?

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