Homeless roamers

spectrito.8513 · March 17, 2019

First of all i'm not even close to be a WvW veteran but in the last year i spent 90 % of my time in WvW mostly solo roaming and ocasionally zerging.Secondly i will define what i see as a roamer and what i do as one because some people are confused about what is roaming and what is ganking.

A roamer is a player who run around the map seeking to take sentries, camps and FIGHTS whoever cross his path afterall it's a PVP ENVIROMENT and people should be willing to face a fightWhich is distinct from ganking from my perspective, a ganker is a player who is looking for a easy fight against people who cant fight back. which IMO is the main difference between gankers and roamers.

Just to clarify :Ganker - is a player who wants to kills mostly ,unaware zergers who cant fight back.Roamer - is a player who mostly likes to pvp and runs around the map taking objectives in order to find a other people to fight.

People will say "If you like to pvp go to Spvp instead"Spvp is completely different :1 - It's all about holding a circle2 - You can play only with one friend3 - You have to rely on people you don't know4 - Restrict gear5 - its only 5v56 - its stressful if you care to winAmong many other things

WvW give roamers the freedom Spvp doesnt

In the current state Warclaw only promotes PvP avoidance and outnumbered ganking from the 2v1's up to (insert uneven number here) and cheese builds(mostly ranged) will be way more common because people will need more damage to dismount. While melee roamers are rendered useless.

To give you an idea on what is happening.I only play weaver and used to solo roam a lot on a hybrid s/d and had a great time but because of mounts i cant play it anymore. I had to adapt so i saw myself forced to switch to FA glass cannon so i can dismount people with one combo and kill with another.What do you think will happen to roamers that used to play melee classes such as warrior and revenants ?If i had to guess they will play SB longbow or some other cheese build or just abandon the gamemode because for some people THATS THE ONLY REASON THEY PLAY WvW.

I think thats why people think anyone who is not in a zerg is a ganker.Like me, people who used to roam had to adapt.It's really hard to solo roam nowadays people hardly walk alone you cant finish someone before 3~4 mounted enemies are coming to you , so again roamers adapted and started to run as a groupIt creates an enviroment with groups of glass cannon builds to dismount people

There are pros and cons about the mount but as it is right now it harms more than it helps

Warclaw needs some serious changes to not kill playstyles/builds/classes cuz right now melees are nearly useless as roamers creating this like this :

"Just had a player stalled a camp from getting capped for minutes from a group of 3. Making use of the terrain, LoS angles, leaps and CC immunity. :+1:From my experience, played a game of cat and mouse on mounts (1v3) around the middle ruins for 15mins. Tips : Use the leap to dodge attacks, NOT for the sake to create distance. The mount speed is fast enough to outrun them when they dismount to get you out of combat to regen (Leap = dodge, do not burn dodge unnecessarily)."https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/71182/warclaw-has-improved-the-quality-of-roaming/p1

And this"Pretty much that why you got sniff skill to check surrounding before dismount. I still solo roam and kill enemy home sentry but skipping camp and you can just ride back into friendly."https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/71399/warclaw-should-have-1-hp-and-1-dodge#latest

People think roaming doesnt envolve fight and they are just avoiding it with their new toy.

But if it's working as intended...

Welcome to Groupcheesingankingblob Wars 2

subversiontwo.7501 · March 17, 2019

I was getting excited there for a moment. You spent all that time defining a terminology from your perspective so I thought something creative was comming, like a guide on how to enjoy the game as a roamer or some sort of player organisation for it. Instead, it came down to balance talk. The "problem" with that is that then any other definition of the terminology (where roaming is any relatively aimless combat exploration and ganking is simply gang-killing or outmanned gameplay) becomes as valid as yours and that takes from your discussion, in spite of your honest constructive attempt.

sephiroth.4217 · March 17, 2019

zergs gank too.

Please for the love of god, stop using the word "gankers" as if its some sort of playstyle similar to roaming, havok or zerg. Its not, its an action that those 3 playstyles dabble in everytime they engage a fight.

Ill add a definition for everyone who is confused about it.

GankingIt is a word commonly used in online video games, usualy used in an MMORPG. Ganking is the process in which a group of charecters gang up on one or more players that do not have a chance to defend themselves.

So as you can see here, ganking is actually more associated with zerg mentality players than anyone else IF we were to label a group as gankers BUT only if we continue to be ignorant to the fact that literally everyone is a ganker.We've all been ganked before and we've all ganked someone.

Rest of the post is pretty much true, I hopped off DD Tempest which I used for open field roaming around SM and now currently use stealth builds or complete cheese builds and am forced to spawn camp in order to get fights.

I don't mind adapting but I can already tell that players are frustrated from me easy tapping thier keep all day and farming those without a mount between thier spawn and keep.

spectrito.8513 · March 17, 2019

@"sephiroth.4217" said:zergs gank too.
Please for the love of god, stop using the word "gankers" as if its some sort of playstyle similar to roaming, havok or zerg. Its not, its an action that those 3 playstyles dabble in everytime they engage a fight.
Ill add a definition for everyone who is confused about it.
GankingIt is a word commonly used in online video games, usualy used in an MMORPG. Ganking is the process in which a group of charecters gang up on one or more players that do not have a chance to defend themselves.
So as you can see here, ganking is actually more associated with zerg mentality players than anyone else IF we were to label a group as gankers BUT only if we continue to be ignorant to the fact that literally everyone is a ganker.We've all been ganked before and we've all ganked someone.
Rest of the post is pretty much true, I hopped off DD Tempest which I used for open field roaming around SM and now currently use stealth builds or complete cheese builds and am forced to spawn camp in order to get fights.
I don't mind adapting but I can already tell that players are frustrated from me easy tapping thier keep all day and farming those without a mount between thier spawn and keep.

I agree with you seph but my original intent was to show people who are thinking that a roamer is exclusively a ganker who only kills helpless zergers running back to his tag which i think is their main issue

Loosmaster.8263 · March 17, 2019

@"subversiontwo.7501" said:I was getting excited there for a moment. You spent all that time defining a terminology from your perspective so I thought something creative was comming, like a guide on how to enjoy the game as a roamer or some sort of player organisation for it. Instead, it came down to balance talk. The "problem" with that is that then any other definition of the terminology (where roaming is any relatively aimless combat exploration and ganking is simply gang-killing or outmanned gameplay) becomes as valid as yours and that takes from your discussion, in spite of your honest constructive attempt.

Actually after reading all that, to me it comes down to another "I don't like the mount" thread...

spectrito.8513 · March 17, 2019

@Loosmaster.8263 said:
@"subversiontwo.7501" said:I was getting excited there for a moment. You spent all that time defining a terminology from your perspective so I thought something creative was comming, like a guide on how to enjoy the game as a roamer or some sort of player organisation for it. Instead, it came down to balance talk. The "problem" with that is that then any other definition of the terminology (where roaming is any relatively aimless combat exploration and ganking is simply gang-killing or outmanned gameplay) becomes as valid as yours and that takes from your discussion, in spite of your honest constructive attempt.

Actually after reading all that, to me it comes down to another "I don't like the mount" thread...

Im not against the mount, my issue is actually how It was implemented and how it change WvW as a whole.I think Warclaw need to change, or do you think its perfectly fine as it is ?

Loosmaster.8263 · March 17, 2019

@spectrito.8513 said:
@Loosmaster.8263 said:
@"subversiontwo.7501" said:I was getting excited there for a moment. You spent all that time defining a terminology from your perspective so I thought something creative was comming, like a guide on how to enjoy the game as a roamer or some sort of player organisation for it. Instead, it came down to balance talk. The "problem" with that is that then any other definition of the terminology (where roaming is any relatively aimless combat exploration and ganking is simply gang-killing or outmanned gameplay) becomes as valid as yours and that takes from your discussion, in spite of your honest constructive attempt.

Actually after reading all that, to me it comes down to another "I don't like the mount" thread...

Im not against the mount, my issue is actually how It was implemented and how it change WvW as a whole.I think Warclaw need to change, or do you think its perfectly fine as it is ?

Nope and it should have never been added but it's going to get gutted to where it will be more useful in PvE.

subversiontwo.7501 · March 17, 2019

@Loosmaster.8263 said:
@spectrito.8513 said:
@Loosmaster.8263 said:
@"subversiontwo.7501" said:I was getting excited there for a moment. You spent all that time defining a terminology from your perspective so I thought something creative was comming, like a guide on how to enjoy the game as a roamer or some sort of player organisation for it. Instead, it came down to balance talk. The "problem" with that is that then any other definition of the terminology (where roaming is any relatively aimless combat exploration and ganking is simply gang-killing or outmanned gameplay) becomes as valid as yours and that takes from your discussion, in spite of your honest constructive attempt.

Actually after reading all that, to me it comes down to another "I don't like the mount" thread...

Im not against the mount, my issue is actually how It was implemented and how it change WvW as a whole.I think Warclaw need to change, or do you think its perfectly fine as it is ?

Nope and it should have never been added but it's going to get gutted to where it will be more useful in PvE.

I wouldn't be too sure given the track record that WvW attention has. It isn't too unlikely that most of its teething issues will be left to rot. Like the scoring system, EotM or the GH arena.

As far solo/small play goes there are certainly boths shake-ups and issues but we are already seeing small roaming players adapt to the mount in ways that play to their strengths (even though they may not necessarily be healthy for the mode as a whole over longer term). I saw one rather established roaming guild yesterday that doubled up on targets, in a larger swath of players, with quick classes (Thieves in this case) and then used their superior mobility to create mounting distance and being able to disengage at will in situations that normally would have been problematic even for those classes. Thus the mount can and certainly will be used to facilitate ganking and focus play as much as it counteracts it, I'm sure less experienced players will learn that lesson over time as experienced players adapt like that.

So while there are teething issues, those hit the solo-small scene in specific ways and some of them wouldn't be surprising if they were left in to rot, the real issue with the mount project is mostly that it was toted as something exciting while it is mostly a very overbearing and detoured poke at balance while trying to sell skins at a very poorly chosen time, when they have upset the players and the players are starving. In short, it has mostly been a waste of resources and they are probably not committed or equipped to pick up the fallout. So it will not necessarily make things better, only different, possibly worse, but not necessarily as catastrophic as some imply. I see it more as a feature of the current balance patch now and a factor in future balance patches. Those come and go, as you know, for better or worse. I find other choices in this patch to be as sloppy and convoluted as the mount (eg., WoD, shades, gyros, spirits). They are now also different but certainly not better and the redesign of them seem superfluous compared to just a rebalance as had been suggested (sizes, reaches, mobilities, etc.), to me also worse (but not catastrophic).

Anput.4620 · March 17, 2019

I have played the game only twice since warclaw, wasn't fun at all. I don't want to quit the game, i really just go on my weaver/war/non-longbow ranger and kill people but i literally just can't play the game, been playing other games but i just want to get back to doing my usual :/

If the mount won't be nerfed to swiftness speed everywhere i don't see myself playing anymore.

bq pd.2148 · March 17, 2019

@spectrito.8513 said:Just to clarify :Ganker - is a player who wants to kills mostly ,unaware zergers who cant fight back.Roamer - is a player who mostly likes to pvp and runs around the map taking objectives in order to find a other people to fight.

can you clarify how you determine if a player 'can fight back' ?

the reason all these threads are going into 'you are all gankers' is that you guys claim, that you only seek challanging fights and not easy fights. but then you said you need tools to force the fight. now for me a challanging opponent needs the interest to fight me, a build to fight me and the experience to pose a challange. such an opponent will hardly ever run away.

i mostly fight around objectives and dont really seek fights, while i dont elude reasonable fights. this usually deals with the awkward situation of both being on mounts and will go straight to a fight. i like mounts to avoid larger groups as they reduced other options to do so over the years, they may remove em if they gimme my stealth back on a viable solo build ;) .

i think it just takes some time for roamers to adjust to mounts. before the mounts, if you were not on a heavily stealth using build, people engaged each other right away on sight 'kill it before it gets away' . right now you can abuse this mindset to kill plenty roamers. for example the other day i was on my core thief and there was a rev coming my way, i was riding towards him and didnt have in mind to elude the fight. the moment he got in range he used is shiro port and tried to oneshot my mount. i dodged that ofc and then proceeded to use every dodge/HP my mount has to drain him off energy and CDs, to show him that he was simply too aggressive. with no dodge left and 200 HP i dismounted myself to avoid the CC and had an easy kill.just use some 'trash skill' (low cooldown/resources) to show your interest in a fight and opponents posing a challange usually will dismount quickly. going about it too aggressively is just asking to abuse the mount to drain resources.fights you need to force are hardly a challange, i mean maybe forcing the fight is a challange now but the fight itself is not.

sephiroth.4217 · March 17, 2019

@MUDse.7623 said:
@spectrito.8513 said:Just to clarify :Ganker - is a player who wants to kills mostly ,unaware zergers who cant fight back.Roamer - is a player who mostly likes to pvp and runs around the map taking objectives in order to find a other people to fight.

can you clarify how you determine if a player 'can fight back' ?

the reason all these threads are going into 'you are all gankers' is that you guys claim, that you only seek challanging fights and not easy fights. but then you said you need tools to force the fight. now for me a challanging opponent needs the interest to fight me, a build to fight me and the experience to pose a challange. such an opponent will hardly ever run away.

i mostly fight around objectives and dont really seek fights, while i dont elude reasonable fights. this usually deals with the awkward situation of both being on mounts and will go straight to a fight. i like mounts to avoid larger groups as they reduced other options to do so over the years, they may remove em if they gimme my stealth back on a viable solo build ;) .

i think it just takes some time for roamers to adjust to mounts. before the mounts, if you were not on a heavily stealth using build, people engaged each other right away on sight 'kill it before it gets away' . right now you can abuse this mindset to kill plenty roamers. for example the other day i was on my core thief and there was a rev coming my way, i was riding towards him and didnt have in mind to elude the fight. the moment he got in range he used is shiro port and tried to oneshot my mount. i dodged that ofc and then proceeded to use every dodge/HP my mount has to drain him off energy and CDs, to show him that he was simply too aggressive. with no dodge left and 200 HP i dismounted myself to avoid the CC and had an easy kill.just use some 'trash skill' (low cooldown/resources) to show your interest in a fight and opponents posing a challange usually will dismount quickly. going about it too aggressively is just asking to abuse the mount to drain resources.fights you need to force are hardly a challange, i mean maybe forcing the fight is a challange now but the fight itself is not.

This is why we need to be able to CC a mount or give the mount a dismount ability...

Having a staring competition with a mounted enemy waiting on eachother to dismount is sort of awkward, so awkward in fact that I alt + F4 half way through my second stare down and played ARURF on LoL instead.

Rashagar.8349 · March 17, 2019

@sephiroth.4217 said:
@MUDse.7623 said:
@spectrito.8513 said:Just to clarify :Ganker - is a player who wants to kills mostly ,unaware zergers who cant fight back.Roamer - is a player who mostly likes to pvp and runs around the map taking objectives in order to find a other people to fight.

can you clarify how you determine if a player 'can fight back' ?

the reason all these threads are going into 'you are all gankers' is that you guys claim, that you only seek challanging fights and not easy fights. but then you said you need tools to force the fight. now for me a challanging opponent needs the interest to fight me, a build to fight me and the experience to pose a challange. such an opponent will hardly ever run away.

i mostly fight around objectives and dont really seek fights, while i dont elude reasonable fights. this usually deals with the awkward situation of both being on mounts and will go straight to a fight. i like mounts to avoid larger groups as they reduced other options to do so over the years, they may remove em if they gimme my stealth back on a viable solo build ;) .

i think it just takes some time for roamers to adjust to mounts. before the mounts, if you were not on a heavily stealth using build, people engaged each other right away on sight 'kill it before it gets away' . right now you can abuse this mindset to kill plenty roamers. for example the other day i was on my core thief and there was a rev coming my way, i was riding towards him and didnt have in mind to elude the fight. the moment he got in range he used is shiro port and tried to oneshot my mount. i dodged that ofc and then proceeded to use every dodge/HP my mount has to drain him off energy and CDs, to show him that he was simply too aggressive. with no dodge left and 200 HP i dismounted myself to avoid the CC and had an easy kill.just use some 'trash skill' (low cooldown/resources) to show your interest in a fight and opponents posing a challange usually will dismount quickly. going about it too aggressively is just asking to abuse the mount to drain resources.fights you need to force are hardly a challange, i mean maybe forcing the fight is a challange now but the fight itself is not.

This is why we need to be able to CC a mount or give the mount a dismount ability...

Having a staring competition with a mounted enemy waiting on eachother to dismount is sort of awkward, so awkward in fact that I alt + F4 half way through my second stare down and played ARURF on LoL instead.

On the other hand, I seem to remember the initial staring contest being a staple moment in the gameplay of a subset of WvW roamers/duellers/nomenclature of choice. Stare, bow, engage.

Fat Disgrace.4275 · March 17, 2019

@MUDse.7623 said:
@spectrito.8513 said:Just to clarify :Ganker - is a player who wants to kills mostly ,unaware zergers who cant fight back.Roamer - is a player who mostly likes to pvp and runs around the map taking objectives in order to find a other people to fight.

can you clarify how you determine if a player 'can fight back' ?

the reason all these threads are going into 'you are all gankers' is that you guys claim, that you only seek challanging fights and not easy fights. but then you said you need tools to force the fight. now for me a challanging opponent needs the interest to fight me, a build to fight me and the experience to pose a challange. such an opponent will hardly ever run away.

i mostly fight around objectives and dont really seek fights, while i dont elude reasonable fights. this usually deals with the awkward situation of both being on mounts and will go straight to a fight. i like mounts to avoid larger groups as they reduced other options to do so over the years, they may remove em if they gimme my stealth back on a viable solo build ;) .

i think it just takes some time for roamers to adjust to mounts. before the mounts, if you were not on a heavily stealth using build, people engaged each other right away on sight 'kill it before it gets away' . right now you can abuse this mindset to kill plenty roamers. for example the other day i was on my core thief and there was a rev coming my way, i was riding towards him and didnt have in mind to elude the fight. the moment he got in range he used is shiro port and tried to oneshot my mount. i dodged that ofc and then proceeded to use every dodge/HP my mount has to drain him off energy and CDs, to show him that he was simply too aggressive. with no dodge left and 200 HP i dismounted myself to avoid the CC and had an easy kill.just use some 'trash skill' (low cooldown/resources) to show your interest in a fight and opponents posing a challange usually will dismount quickly. going about it too aggressively is just asking to abuse the mount to drain resources.fights you need to force are hardly a challange, i mean maybe forcing the fight is a challange now but the fight itself is not.

If they are out to venture on there own then it is presumed that they are capable of fighting back.

Last night a dh was just trolling around on his mount in a 1v1 on my warrior, soon jumped of mid fight vs a scourge and they both still lost.

spectrito.8513 · March 17, 2019

@Fat Disgrace.4275 said:
@MUDse.7623 said:
@"spectrito.8513" said:Just to clarify :Ganker - is a player who wants to kills mostly ,unaware zergers who cant fight back.Roamer - is a player who mostly likes to pvp and runs around the map taking objectives in order to find a other people to fight.

can you clarify how you determine if a player 'can fight back' ?

the reason all these threads are going into 'you are all gankers' is that you guys claim, that you only seek challanging fights and not easy fights. but then you said you need tools to force the fight. now for me a challanging opponent needs the interest to fight me, a build to fight me and the experience to pose a challange. such an opponent will hardly ever run away.

Given the skill of a average WvW player If you only pick "challenging" fights you will end up fighting against the same 3-4 players all the time. Thats why i think people come to WvW seeking out duels.If people are not in their respective tag and they're bad they should be deadi mostly fight around objectives and dont really seek fights, while i dont elude reasonable fights. this usually deals with the awkward situation of both being on mounts and will go straight to a fight. i like mounts to avoid larger groups as they reduced other options to do so over the years, they may remove em if they gimme my stealth back on a viable solo build ;) .

Yeah you can avoid larger groups on a mount, but If you are fighting someone and still stuck in combat, a large group will come to you you'll end up most likely dead, maybe thiefs can manage to escape, other classes/builds....not so muchi think it just takes some time for roamers to adjust to mounts. before the mounts, if you were not on a heavily stealth using build, people engaged each other right away on sight 'kill it before it gets away' . right now you can abuse this mindset to kill plenty roamers. for example the other day i was on my core thief and there was a rev coming my way, i was riding towards him and didnt have in mind to elude the fight. the moment he got in range he used is shiro port and tried to oneshot my mount. i dodged that ofc and then proceeded to use every dodge/HP my mount has to drain him off energy and CDs, to show him that he was simply too aggressive. with no dodge left and 200 HP i dismounted myself to avoid the CC and had an easy kill.just use some 'trash skill' (low cooldown/resources) to show your interest in a fight and opponents posing a challange usually will dismount quickly. going about it too aggressively is just asking to abuse the mount to drain resources.I already adjusted my build, and i doubt im the only one who switched to a glass cannon to dismount people it will just be way more common in non-zerg buildsfights you need to force are hardly a challange, i mean maybe forcing the fight is a challange now but the fight itself is not.

If they are out to venture on there own then it is presumed that they are capable of fighting back.

This ^

bq pd.2148 · March 17, 2019

@spectrito.8513 said:
@Fat Disgrace.4275 said:
@MUDse.7623 said:
@spectrito.8513 said:Just to clarify :Ganker - is a player who wants to kills mostly ,unaware zergers who cant fight back.Roamer - is a player who mostly likes to pvp and runs around the map taking objectives in order to find a other people to fight.

can you clarify how you determine if a player 'can fight back' ?

the reason all these threads are going into 'you are all gankers' is that you guys claim, that you only seek challanging fights and not easy fights. but then you said you need tools to force the fight. now for me a challanging opponent needs the interest to fight me, a build to fight me and the experience to pose a challange. such an opponent will hardly ever run away.

Given the skill of a average WvW player If you only pick "challenging" fights you will end up fighting against the same 3-4 players all the time. Thats why i think people come to WvW seeking out duels.If people are not in their respective tag and they're bad they should be deadi mostly fight around objectives and dont really seek fights, while i dont elude reasonable fights. this usually deals with the awkward situation of both being on mounts and will go straight to a fight. i like mounts to avoid larger groups as they reduced other options to do so over the years, they may remove em if they gimme my stealth back on a viable solo build ;) .

Yeah you can avoid larger groups on a mount, but If you are fighting someone and still stuck in combat, a large group will come to you you'll end up most likely dead, maybe thiefs can manage to escape, other classes/builds....not so muchi think it just takes some time for roamers to adjust to mounts. before the mounts, if you were not on a heavily stealth using build, people engaged each other right away on sight 'kill it before it gets away' . right now you can abuse this mindset to kill plenty roamers. for example the other day i was on my core thief and there was a rev coming my way, i was riding towards him and didnt have in mind to elude the fight. the moment he got in range he used is shiro port and tried to oneshot my mount. i dodged that ofc and then proceeded to use every dodge/HP my mount has to drain him off energy and CDs, to show him that he was simply too aggressive. with no dodge left and 200 HP i dismounted myself to avoid the CC and had an easy kill.just use some 'trash skill' (low cooldown/resources) to show your interest in a fight and opponents posing a challange usually will dismount quickly. going about it too aggressively is just asking to abuse the mount to drain resources.I already adjusted my build, and i doubt im the only one who switched to a glass cannon to dismount people it will just be way more common in non-zerg buildsfights you need to force are hardly a challange, i mean maybe forcing the fight is a challange now but the fight itself is not.

If they are out to venture on there own then it is presumed that they are capable of fighting back.

This ^

so you DO go for easy fights, as you wont fight just the same 3-4 players.

@spectrito.8513 said:Which is distinct from ganking from my perspective, a ganker is a player who is looking for a easy fight against people who cant fight back. which IMO is the main difference between gankers and roamers.

spectrito.8513 · March 17, 2019

@MUDse.7623 said:
@spectrito.8513 said:
@Fat Disgrace.4275 said:
@MUDse.7623 said:
@spectrito.8513 said:Just to clarify :Ganker - is a player who wants to kills mostly ,unaware zergers who cant fight back.Roamer - is a player who mostly likes to pvp and runs around the map taking objectives in order to find a other people to fight.

can you clarify how you determine if a player 'can fight back' ?

the reason all these threads are going into 'you are all gankers' is that you guys claim, that you only seek challanging fights and not easy fights. but then you said you need tools to force the fight. now for me a challanging opponent needs the interest to fight me, a build to fight me and the experience to pose a challange. such an opponent will hardly ever run away.

Given the skill of a average WvW player If you only pick "challenging" fights you will end up fighting against the same 3-4 players all the time. Thats why i think people come to WvW seeking out duels.If people are not in their respective tag and they're bad they should be deadi mostly fight around objectives and dont really seek fights, while i dont elude reasonable fights. this usually deals with the awkward situation of both being on mounts and will go straight to a fight. i like mounts to avoid larger groups as they reduced other options to do so over the years, they may remove em if they gimme my stealth back on a viable solo build ;) .

Yeah you can avoid larger groups on a mount, but If you are fighting someone and still stuck in combat, a large group will come to you you'll end up most likely dead, maybe thiefs can manage to escape, other classes/builds....not so muchi think it just takes some time for roamers to adjust to mounts. before the mounts, if you were not on a heavily stealth using build, people engaged each other right away on sight 'kill it before it gets away' . right now you can abuse this mindset to kill plenty roamers. for example the other day i was on my core thief and there was a rev coming my way, i was riding towards him and didnt have in mind to elude the fight. the moment he got in range he used is shiro port and tried to oneshot my mount. i dodged that ofc and then proceeded to use every dodge/HP my mount has to drain him off energy and CDs, to show him that he was simply too aggressive. with no dodge left and 200 HP i dismounted myself to avoid the CC and had an easy kill.just use some 'trash skill' (low cooldown/resources) to show your interest in a fight and opponents posing a challange usually will dismount quickly. going about it too aggressively is just asking to abuse the mount to drain resources.I already adjusted my build, and i doubt im the only one who switched to a glass cannon to dismount people it will just be way more common in non-zerg buildsfights you need to force are hardly a challange, i mean maybe forcing the fight is a challange now but the fight itself is not.

If they are out to venture on there own then it is presumed that they are capable of fighting back.

This ^

so you DO go for easy fights, as you wont fight just the same 3-4 players.

@spectrito.8513 said:Which is distinct from ganking from my perspective, a ganker is a player who is looking for a
easy fight
against people who cant fight back. which IMO is the main difference between gankers and roamers.

I fight ANYONE who i come across which lately due to the new influx of newbies i hardly find someone worth fighting and believe me i dont really like stomping newbies i'd rather have a fight worth fighting.I just want to PvP in a open world and If i cant fight without HAVE to rely on teammates to succed in a fight(SPvP and zerging), im done with gw2.

bq pd.2148 · March 17, 2019

@spectrito.8513 said:
@MUDse.7623 said:
@spectrito.8513 said:
@Fat Disgrace.4275 said:
@MUDse.7623 said:
@spectrito.8513 said:Just to clarify :Ganker - is a player who wants to kills mostly ,unaware zergers who cant fight back.Roamer - is a player who mostly likes to pvp and runs around the map taking objectives in order to find a other people to fight.

can you clarify how you determine if a player 'can fight back' ?

the reason all these threads are going into 'you are all gankers' is that you guys claim, that you only seek challanging fights and not easy fights. but then you said you need tools to force the fight. now for me a challanging opponent needs the interest to fight me, a build to fight me and the experience to pose a challange. such an opponent will hardly ever run away.

Given the skill of a average WvW player If you only pick "challenging" fights you will end up fighting against the same 3-4 players all the time. Thats why i think people come to WvW seeking out duels.If people are not in their respective tag and they're bad they should be deadi mostly fight around objectives and dont really seek fights, while i dont elude reasonable fights. this usually deals with the awkward situation of both being on mounts and will go straight to a fight. i like mounts to avoid larger groups as they reduced other options to do so over the years, they may remove em if they gimme my stealth back on a viable solo build ;) .

Yeah you can avoid larger groups on a mount, but If you are fighting someone and still stuck in combat, a large group will come to you you'll end up most likely dead, maybe thiefs can manage to escape, other classes/builds....not so muchi think it just takes some time for roamers to adjust to mounts. before the mounts, if you were not on a heavily stealth using build, people engaged each other right away on sight 'kill it before it gets away' . right now you can abuse this mindset to kill plenty roamers. for example the other day i was on my core thief and there was a rev coming my way, i was riding towards him and didnt have in mind to elude the fight. the moment he got in range he used is shiro port and tried to oneshot my mount. i dodged that ofc and then proceeded to use every dodge/HP my mount has to drain him off energy and CDs, to show him that he was simply too aggressive. with no dodge left and 200 HP i dismounted myself to avoid the CC and had an easy kill.just use some 'trash skill' (low cooldown/resources) to show your interest in a fight and opponents posing a challange usually will dismount quickly. going about it too aggressively is just asking to abuse the mount to drain resources.I already adjusted my build, and i doubt im the only one who switched to a glass cannon to dismount people it will just be way more common in non-zerg buildsfights you need to force are hardly a challange, i mean maybe forcing the fight is a challange now but the fight itself is not.

If they are out to venture on there own then it is presumed that they are capable of fighting back.

This ^

so you DO go for easy fights, as you wont fight just the same 3-4 players.

@spectrito.8513 said:Which is distinct from ganking from my perspective, a ganker is a player who is looking for a
easy fight
against people who cant fight back. which IMO is the main difference between gankers and roamers.

I fight ANYONE who i come across which lately due to the new influx of newbies i hardly find someone worth fighting and believe me i dont really like stomping newbies i'd rather have a fight worth fighting.I just want to PvP in a open world and If i cant fight without HAVE to rely on teammates to succed in a fight(SPvP and zerging), im done with gw2.

its all good, just the roamers do feel offended too easily when they are called gankers. i mean i dont have an issue to just admit that most people i kill didnt have a chance to begin with. the threads lead to nowhere aslong as so many claim they only fight people that do have a chance and when you ask em, they actually do kill alot of helpless targets.

Zok.4956 · March 17, 2019

@"sephiroth.4217" said:zergs gank too.

Yes, some do. But the better zergs and commanders do not.

GankingIt is a word commonly used in online video games, usualy used in an MMORPG. Ganking is the process in which a group of charecters gang up on one or more players that do not have a chance to defend themselves.

ok.

So as you can see here, ganking is actually more associated with zerg mentality players than anyone else

No, it is not. Ganking is associated with players that have ganker-mentality, nothing else. And some servers have more players and commanders with "ganker-mentality" than others. No, I do not write names, this is not a matchup or server discussion.

The "normal" behaviour of a good zerg (at least of the zergs and commanders I run with) is to just ignore defendless enemy players as long as they do not start a fight by themselves. I have seen it countless times, that single enemy players, that crossed the way of a zerg, were just ignored.

If enemy players defend an objective (keep, tower,...) and were killed during the fight to take that objective, thats not ganking.

If an enemy zerg takes our keep and I am killed defending it, they have not ganked me. But if, after that, the enemy zerg runs to our spawn and is then "spawn camping" our spawn to kill single players that try to leave the spawn, thats ganking.

IF we were to label a group as gankers BUT only if we continue to be ignorant to the fact that literally everyone is a ganker.

Not everyone is a ganker.

We've all been ganked before

Yes

and we've all ganked someone.

No.

apharma.3741 · March 17, 2019

@MUDse.7623 said:
@spectrito.8513 said:
@MUDse.7623 said:
@spectrito.8513 said:
@Fat Disgrace.4275 said:
@MUDse.7623 said:
@spectrito.8513 said:Just to clarify :Ganker - is a player who wants to kills mostly ,unaware zergers who cant fight back.Roamer - is a player who mostly likes to pvp and runs around the map taking objectives in order to find a other people to fight.

can you clarify how you determine if a player 'can fight back' ?

the reason all these threads are going into 'you are all gankers' is that you guys claim, that you only seek challanging fights and not easy fights. but then you said you need tools to force the fight. now for me a challanging opponent needs the interest to fight me, a build to fight me and the experience to pose a challange. such an opponent will hardly ever run away.

Given the skill of a average WvW player If you only pick "challenging" fights you will end up fighting against the same 3-4 players all the time. Thats why i think people come to WvW seeking out duels.If people are not in their respective tag and they're bad they should be deadi mostly fight around objectives and dont really seek fights, while i dont elude reasonable fights. this usually deals with the awkward situation of both being on mounts and will go straight to a fight. i like mounts to avoid larger groups as they reduced other options to do so over the years, they may remove em if they gimme my stealth back on a viable solo build ;) .

Yeah you can avoid larger groups on a mount, but If you are fighting someone and still stuck in combat, a large group will come to you you'll end up most likely dead, maybe thiefs can manage to escape, other classes/builds....not so muchi think it just takes some time for roamers to adjust to mounts. before the mounts, if you were not on a heavily stealth using build, people engaged each other right away on sight 'kill it before it gets away' . right now you can abuse this mindset to kill plenty roamers. for example the other day i was on my core thief and there was a rev coming my way, i was riding towards him and didnt have in mind to elude the fight. the moment he got in range he used is shiro port and tried to oneshot my mount. i dodged that ofc and then proceeded to use every dodge/HP my mount has to drain him off energy and CDs, to show him that he was simply too aggressive. with no dodge left and 200 HP i dismounted myself to avoid the CC and had an easy kill.just use some 'trash skill' (low cooldown/resources) to show your interest in a fight and opponents posing a challange usually will dismount quickly. going about it too aggressively is just asking to abuse the mount to drain resources.I already adjusted my build, and i doubt im the only one who switched to a glass cannon to dismount people it will just be way more common in non-zerg buildsfights you need to force are hardly a challange, i mean maybe forcing the fight is a challange now but the fight itself is not.

If they are out to venture on there own then it is presumed that they are capable of fighting back.

This ^

so you DO go for easy fights, as you wont fight just the same 3-4 players.

@spectrito.8513 said:Which is distinct from ganking from my perspective, a ganker is a player who is looking for a
easy fight
against people who cant fight back. which IMO is the main difference between gankers and roamers.

I fight ANYONE who i come across which lately due to the new influx of newbies i hardly find someone worth fighting and believe me i dont really like stomping newbies i'd rather have a fight worth fighting.I just want to PvP in a open world and If i cant fight without HAVE to rely on teammates to succed in a fight(SPvP and zerging), im done with gw2.

its all good, just the roamers do feel offended too easily when they are called gankers. i mean i dont have an issue to just admit that most people i kill didnt have a chance to begin with. the threads lead to nowhere aslong as so many claim they only fight people that do have a chance and when you ask em, they actually do kill alot of helpless targets.

I think it comes down to intent more than anything. A group of roamers killing people coming back from respawn to help out the servers commander flipping a T3 structure that's been annoying them all day is in my book generally fine, they're doing what they can for the good of their server, but to a lot of zerglings looks like ganking.

Groups of 3-5 running around with high stealth constantly targeting smaller and solo players and running from an even fight? Yeah that's gankers.

spectrito.8513 · March 17, 2019

@MUDse.7623 said:
@spectrito.8513 said:
@MUDse.7623 said:
@spectrito.8513 said:
@Fat Disgrace.4275 said:
@MUDse.7623 said:
@spectrito.8513 said:Just to clarify :Ganker - is a player who wants to kills mostly ,unaware zergers who cant fight back.Roamer - is a player who mostly likes to pvp and runs around the map taking objectives in order to find a other people to fight.

can you clarify how you determine if a player 'can fight back' ?

the reason all these threads are going into 'you are all gankers' is that you guys claim, that you only seek challanging fights and not easy fights. but then you said you need tools to force the fight. now for me a challanging opponent needs the interest to fight me, a build to fight me and the experience to pose a challange. such an opponent will hardly ever run away.

Given the skill of a average WvW player If you only pick "challenging" fights you will end up fighting against the same 3-4 players all the time. Thats why i think people come to WvW seeking out duels.If people are not in their respective tag and they're bad they should be deadi mostly fight around objectives and dont really seek fights, while i dont elude reasonable fights. this usually deals with the awkward situation of both being on mounts and will go straight to a fight. i like mounts to avoid larger groups as they reduced other options to do so over the years, they may remove em if they gimme my stealth back on a viable solo build ;) .

Yeah you can avoid larger groups on a mount, but If you are fighting someone and still stuck in combat, a large group will come to you you'll end up most likely dead, maybe thiefs can manage to escape, other classes/builds....not so muchi think it just takes some time for roamers to adjust to mounts. before the mounts, if you were not on a heavily stealth using build, people engaged each other right away on sight 'kill it before it gets away' . right now you can abuse this mindset to kill plenty roamers. for example the other day i was on my core thief and there was a rev coming my way, i was riding towards him and didnt have in mind to elude the fight. the moment he got in range he used is shiro port and tried to oneshot my mount. i dodged that ofc and then proceeded to use every dodge/HP my mount has to drain him off energy and CDs, to show him that he was simply too aggressive. with no dodge left and 200 HP i dismounted myself to avoid the CC and had an easy kill.just use some 'trash skill' (low cooldown/resources) to show your interest in a fight and opponents posing a challange usually will dismount quickly. going about it too aggressively is just asking to abuse the mount to drain resources.I already adjusted my build, and i doubt im the only one who switched to a glass cannon to dismount people it will just be way more common in non-zerg buildsfights you need to force are hardly a challange, i mean maybe forcing the fight is a challange now but the fight itself is not.

If they are out to venture on there own then it is presumed that they are capable of fighting back.

This ^

so you DO go for easy fights, as you wont fight just the same 3-4 players.

@spectrito.8513 said:Which is distinct from ganking from my perspective, a ganker is a player who is looking for a
easy fight
against people who cant fight back. which IMO is the main difference between gankers and roamers.

I fight ANYONE who i come across which lately due to the new influx of newbies i hardly find someone worth fighting and believe me i dont really like stomping newbies i'd rather have a fight worth fighting.I just want to PvP in a open world and If i cant fight without HAVE to rely on teammates to succed in a fight(SPvP and zerging), im done with gw2.

its all good, just the roamers do feel offended too easily when they are called gankers. i mean i dont have an issue to just admit that most people i kill didnt have a chance to begin with. the threads lead to nowhere aslong as so many claim they only fight people that do have a chance and when you ask em, they actually do kill alot of helpless targets.

I dont mind being called a ganker, i was forced to turn into one in order to still enjoy the game when in bored of zerging or there's are no tags running.Thanks to Warclaw

spectrito.8513 · March 17, 2019

@apharma.3741 said:
@MUDse.7623 said:
@spectrito.8513 said:
@MUDse.7623 said:
@spectrito.8513 said:
@Fat Disgrace.4275 said:
@MUDse.7623 said:
@spectrito.8513 said:Just to clarify :Ganker - is a player who wants to kills mostly ,unaware zergers who cant fight back.Roamer - is a player who mostly likes to pvp and runs around the map taking objectives in order to find a other people to fight.

can you clarify how you determine if a player 'can fight back' ?

the reason all these threads are going into 'you are all gankers' is that you guys claim, that you only seek challanging fights and not easy fights. but then you said you need tools to force the fight. now for me a challanging opponent needs the interest to fight me, a build to fight me and the experience to pose a challange. such an opponent will hardly ever run away.

Given the skill of a average WvW player If you only pick "challenging" fights you will end up fighting against the same 3-4 players all the time. Thats why i think people come to WvW seeking out duels.If people are not in their respective tag and they're bad they should be deadi mostly fight around objectives and dont really seek fights, while i dont elude reasonable fights. this usually deals with the awkward situation of both being on mounts and will go straight to a fight. i like mounts to avoid larger groups as they reduced other options to do so over the years, they may remove em if they gimme my stealth back on a viable solo build ;) .

Yeah you can avoid larger groups on a mount, but If you are fighting someone and still stuck in combat, a large group will come to you you'll end up most likely dead, maybe thiefs can manage to escape, other classes/builds....not so muchi think it just takes some time for roamers to adjust to mounts. before the mounts, if you were not on a heavily stealth using build, people engaged each other right away on sight 'kill it before it gets away' . right now you can abuse this mindset to kill plenty roamers. for example the other day i was on my core thief and there was a rev coming my way, i was riding towards him and didnt have in mind to elude the fight. the moment he got in range he used is shiro port and tried to oneshot my mount. i dodged that ofc and then proceeded to use every dodge/HP my mount has to drain him off energy and CDs, to show him that he was simply too aggressive. with no dodge left and 200 HP i dismounted myself to avoid the CC and had an easy kill.just use some 'trash skill' (low cooldown/resources) to show your interest in a fight and opponents posing a challange usually will dismount quickly. going about it too aggressively is just asking to abuse the mount to drain resources.I already adjusted my build, and i doubt im the only one who switched to a glass cannon to dismount people it will just be way more common in non-zerg buildsfights you need to force are hardly a challange, i mean maybe forcing the fight is a challange now but the fight itself is not.

If they are out to venture on there own then it is presumed that they are capable of fighting back.

This ^

so you DO go for easy fights, as you wont fight just the same 3-4 players.

@spectrito.8513 said:Which is distinct from ganking from my perspective, a ganker is a player who is looking for a
easy fight
against people who cant fight back. which IMO is the main difference between gankers and roamers.

I fight ANYONE who i come across which lately due to the new influx of newbies i hardly find someone worth fighting and believe me i dont really like stomping newbies i'd rather have a fight worth fighting.I just want to PvP in a open world and If i cant fight without HAVE to rely on teammates to succed in a fight(SPvP and zerging), im done with gw2.

its all good, just the roamers do feel offended too easily when they are called gankers. i mean i dont have an issue to just admit that most people i kill didnt have a chance to begin with. the threads lead to nowhere aslong as so many claim they only fight people that do have a chance and when you ask em, they actually do kill alot of helpless targets.

I think it comes down to intent more than anything. A group of roamers killing people coming back from respawn to help out the servers commander flipping a T3 structure that's been annoying them all day is in my book generally fine, they're doing what they can for the good of their server, but to a lot of zerglings looks like ganking.

Groups of 3-5 running around with high stealth constantly targeting smaller and solo players and running from an even fight? Yeah that's gankers.

Not just groups of 3-5v1, as i wrote :"In the current state Warclaw only promotes PvP avoidance and outnumbered ganking from the 2v1's up to (insert uneven number here)"

bq pd.2148 · March 17, 2019

@apharma.3741 said:
@MUDse.7623 said:
@spectrito.8513 said:
@MUDse.7623 said:
@spectrito.8513 said:
@Fat Disgrace.4275 said:
@MUDse.7623 said:
@spectrito.8513 said:Just to clarify :Ganker - is a player who wants to kills mostly ,unaware zergers who cant fight back.Roamer - is a player who mostly likes to pvp and runs around the map taking objectives in order to find a other people to fight.

can you clarify how you determine if a player 'can fight back' ?

the reason all these threads are going into 'you are all gankers' is that you guys claim, that you only seek challanging fights and not easy fights. but then you said you need tools to force the fight. now for me a challanging opponent needs the interest to fight me, a build to fight me and the experience to pose a challange. such an opponent will hardly ever run away.

Given the skill of a average WvW player If you only pick "challenging" fights you will end up fighting against the same 3-4 players all the time. Thats why i think people come to WvW seeking out duels.If people are not in their respective tag and they're bad they should be deadi mostly fight around objectives and dont really seek fights, while i dont elude reasonable fights. this usually deals with the awkward situation of both being on mounts and will go straight to a fight. i like mounts to avoid larger groups as they reduced other options to do so over the years, they may remove em if they gimme my stealth back on a viable solo build ;) .

Yeah you can avoid larger groups on a mount, but If you are fighting someone and still stuck in combat, a large group will come to you you'll end up most likely dead, maybe thiefs can manage to escape, other classes/builds....not so muchi think it just takes some time for roamers to adjust to mounts. before the mounts, if you were not on a heavily stealth using build, people engaged each other right away on sight 'kill it before it gets away' . right now you can abuse this mindset to kill plenty roamers. for example the other day i was on my core thief and there was a rev coming my way, i was riding towards him and didnt have in mind to elude the fight. the moment he got in range he used is shiro port and tried to oneshot my mount. i dodged that ofc and then proceeded to use every dodge/HP my mount has to drain him off energy and CDs, to show him that he was simply too aggressive. with no dodge left and 200 HP i dismounted myself to avoid the CC and had an easy kill.just use some 'trash skill' (low cooldown/resources) to show your interest in a fight and opponents posing a challange usually will dismount quickly. going about it too aggressively is just asking to abuse the mount to drain resources.I already adjusted my build, and i doubt im the only one who switched to a glass cannon to dismount people it will just be way more common in non-zerg buildsfights you need to force are hardly a challange, i mean maybe forcing the fight is a challange now but the fight itself is not.

If they are out to venture on there own then it is presumed that they are capable of fighting back.

This ^

so you DO go for easy fights, as you wont fight just the same 3-4 players.

@spectrito.8513 said:Which is distinct from ganking from my perspective, a ganker is a player who is looking for a
easy fight
against people who cant fight back. which IMO is the main difference between gankers and roamers.

I fight ANYONE who i come across which lately due to the new influx of newbies i hardly find someone worth fighting and believe me i dont really like stomping newbies i'd rather have a fight worth fighting.I just want to PvP in a open world and If i cant fight without HAVE to rely on teammates to succed in a fight(SPvP and zerging), im done with gw2.

its all good, just the roamers do feel offended too easily when they are called gankers. i mean i dont have an issue to just admit that most people i kill didnt have a chance to begin with. the threads lead to nowhere aslong as so many claim they only fight people that do have a chance and when you ask em, they actually do kill alot of helpless targets.

I think it comes down to intent more than anything. A group of roamers killing people coming back from respawn to help out the servers commander flipping a T3 structure that's been annoying them all day is in my book generally fine, they're doing what they can for the good of their server, but to a lot of zerglings looks like ganking.

Groups of 3-5 running around with high stealth constantly targeting smaller and solo players and running from an even fight? Yeah that's gankers.

that is ganking for you. if you ask different people you will get different answers as to what is ganking.so the result is that these threads all get lost into a debate what is ganking and what is not ganking in order to justify changes to the mount or turn them down.i think it would be easier to accept that many of the roaming encounters will be considerd ganking by some and go by how that is part of the mode and therefor you need changes. but right now in all these threads roamers back off rightaway when someone calls it ganking, that wont lead em far in this debate.

@spectrito.8513 said:
@MUDse.7623 said:
@spectrito.8513 said:
@MUDse.7623 said:
@spectrito.8513 said:
@Fat Disgrace.4275 said:
@MUDse.7623 said:
@spectrito.8513 said:Just to clarify :Ganker - is a player who wants to kills mostly ,unaware zergers who cant fight back.Roamer - is a player who mostly likes to pvp and runs around the map taking objectives in order to find a other people to fight.

can you clarify how you determine if a player 'can fight back' ?

the reason all these threads are going into 'you are all gankers' is that you guys claim, that you only seek challanging fights and not easy fights. but then you said you need tools to force the fight. now for me a challanging opponent needs the interest to fight me, a build to fight me and the experience to pose a challange. such an opponent will hardly ever run away.

Given the skill of a average WvW player If you only pick "challenging" fights you will end up fighting against the same 3-4 players all the time. Thats why i think people come to WvW seeking out duels.If people are not in their respective tag and they're bad they should be deadi mostly fight around objectives and dont really seek fights, while i dont elude reasonable fights. this usually deals with the awkward situation of both being on mounts and will go straight to a fight. i like mounts to avoid larger groups as they reduced other options to do so over the years, they may remove em if they gimme my stealth back on a viable solo build ;) .

Yeah you can avoid larger groups on a mount, but If you are fighting someone and still stuck in combat, a large group will come to you you'll end up most likely dead, maybe thiefs can manage to escape, other classes/builds....not so muchi think it just takes some time for roamers to adjust to mounts. before the mounts, if you were not on a heavily stealth using build, people engaged each other right away on sight 'kill it before it gets away' . right now you can abuse this mindset to kill plenty roamers. for example the other day i was on my core thief and there was a rev coming my way, i was riding towards him and didnt have in mind to elude the fight. the moment he got in range he used is shiro port and tried to oneshot my mount. i dodged that ofc and then proceeded to use every dodge/HP my mount has to drain him off energy and CDs, to show him that he was simply too aggressive. with no dodge left and 200 HP i dismounted myself to avoid the CC and had an easy kill.just use some 'trash skill' (low cooldown/resources) to show your interest in a fight and opponents posing a challange usually will dismount quickly. going about it too aggressively is just asking to abuse the mount to drain resources.I already adjusted my build, and i doubt im the only one who switched to a glass cannon to dismount people it will just be way more common in non-zerg buildsfights you need to force are hardly a challange, i mean maybe forcing the fight is a challange now but the fight itself is not.

If they are out to venture on there own then it is presumed that they are capable of fighting back.

This ^

so you DO go for easy fights, as you wont fight just the same 3-4 players.

@spectrito.8513 said:Which is distinct from ganking from my perspective, a ganker is a player who is looking for a
easy fight
against people who cant fight back. which IMO is the main difference between gankers and roamers.

I fight ANYONE who i come across which lately due to the new influx of newbies i hardly find someone worth fighting and believe me i dont really like stomping newbies i'd rather have a fight worth fighting.I just want to PvP in a open world and If i cant fight without HAVE to rely on teammates to succed in a fight(SPvP and zerging), im done with gw2.

its all good, just the roamers do feel offended too easily when they are called gankers. i mean i dont have an issue to just admit that most people i kill didnt have a chance to begin with. the threads lead to nowhere aslong as so many claim they only fight people that do have a chance and when you ask em, they actually do kill alot of helpless targets.

I dont mind being called a ganker, i was forced to turn into one in order to still enjoy the game when in bored of zerging or there's are no tags running.Thanks to Warclaw

then embrace being a ganker and defend your playstyle.

apharma.3741 · March 17, 2019

@MUDse.7623 said:
@apharma.3741 said:
@MUDse.7623 said:
@spectrito.8513 said:
@MUDse.7623 said:
@spectrito.8513 said:
@Fat Disgrace.4275 said:
@MUDse.7623 said:
@spectrito.8513 said:Just to clarify :Ganker - is a player who wants to kills mostly ,unaware zergers who cant fight back.Roamer - is a player who mostly likes to pvp and runs around the map taking objectives in order to find a other people to fight.

can you clarify how you determine if a player 'can fight back' ?

the reason all these threads are going into 'you are all gankers' is that you guys claim, that you only seek challanging fights and not easy fights. but then you said you need tools to force the fight. now for me a challanging opponent needs the interest to fight me, a build to fight me and the experience to pose a challange. such an opponent will hardly ever run away.

Given the skill of a average WvW player If you only pick "challenging" fights you will end up fighting against the same 3-4 players all the time. Thats why i think people come to WvW seeking out duels.If people are not in their respective tag and they're bad they should be deadi mostly fight around objectives and dont really seek fights, while i dont elude reasonable fights. this usually deals with the awkward situation of both being on mounts and will go straight to a fight. i like mounts to avoid larger groups as they reduced other options to do so over the years, they may remove em if they gimme my stealth back on a viable solo build ;) .

Yeah you can avoid larger groups on a mount, but If you are fighting someone and still stuck in combat, a large group will come to you you'll end up most likely dead, maybe thiefs can manage to escape, other classes/builds....not so muchi think it just takes some time for roamers to adjust to mounts. before the mounts, if you were not on a heavily stealth using build, people engaged each other right away on sight 'kill it before it gets away' . right now you can abuse this mindset to kill plenty roamers. for example the other day i was on my core thief and there was a rev coming my way, i was riding towards him and didnt have in mind to elude the fight. the moment he got in range he used is shiro port and tried to oneshot my mount. i dodged that ofc and then proceeded to use every dodge/HP my mount has to drain him off energy and CDs, to show him that he was simply too aggressive. with no dodge left and 200 HP i dismounted myself to avoid the CC and had an easy kill.just use some 'trash skill' (low cooldown/resources) to show your interest in a fight and opponents posing a challange usually will dismount quickly. going about it too aggressively is just asking to abuse the mount to drain resources.I already adjusted my build, and i doubt im the only one who switched to a glass cannon to dismount people it will just be way more common in non-zerg buildsfights you need to force are hardly a challange, i mean maybe forcing the fight is a challange now but the fight itself is not.

If they are out to venture on there own then it is presumed that they are capable of fighting back.

This ^

so you DO go for easy fights, as you wont fight just the same 3-4 players.

@spectrito.8513 said:Which is distinct from ganking from my perspective, a ganker is a player who is looking for a
easy fight
against people who cant fight back. which IMO is the main difference between gankers and roamers.

I fight ANYONE who i come across which lately due to the new influx of newbies i hardly find someone worth fighting and believe me i dont really like stomping newbies i'd rather have a fight worth fighting.I just want to PvP in a open world and If i cant fight without HAVE to rely on teammates to succed in a fight(SPvP and zerging), im done with gw2.

its all good, just the roamers do feel offended too easily when they are called gankers. i mean i dont have an issue to just admit that most people i kill didnt have a chance to begin with. the threads lead to nowhere aslong as so many claim they only fight people that do have a chance and when you ask em, they actually do kill alot of helpless targets.

I think it comes down to intent more than anything. A group of roamers killing people coming back from respawn to help out the servers commander flipping a T3 structure that's been annoying them all day is in my book generally fine, they're doing what they can for the good of their server, but to a lot of zerglings looks like ganking.

Groups of 3-5 running around with high stealth constantly targeting smaller and solo players and running from an even fight? Yeah that's gankers.

that is ganking for you. if you ask different people you will get different answers as to what is ganking.so the result is that these threads all get lost into a debate what is ganking and what is not ganking in order to justify changes to the mount or turn them down.i think it would be easier to accept that many of the roaming encounters will be considerd ganking by some and go by how that is part of the mode and therefor you need changes. but right now in all these threads roamers back off rightaway when someone calls it ganking, that wont lead em far in this debate.

@spectrito.8513 said:
@MUDse.7623 said:
@spectrito.8513 said:
@MUDse.7623 said:
@spectrito.8513 said:
@Fat Disgrace.4275 said:
@MUDse.7623 said:
@spectrito.8513 said:Just to clarify :Ganker - is a player who wants to kills mostly ,unaware zergers who cant fight back.Roamer - is a player who mostly likes to pvp and runs around the map taking objectives in order to find a other people to fight.

can you clarify how you determine if a player 'can fight back' ?

the reason all these threads are going into 'you are all gankers' is that you guys claim, that you only seek challanging fights and not easy fights. but then you said you need tools to force the fight. now for me a challanging opponent needs the interest to fight me, a build to fight me and the experience to pose a challange. such an opponent will hardly ever run away.

Given the skill of a average WvW player If you only pick "challenging" fights you will end up fighting against the same 3-4 players all the time. Thats why i think people come to WvW seeking out duels.If people are not in their respective tag and they're bad they should be deadi mostly fight around objectives and dont really seek fights, while i dont elude reasonable fights. this usually deals with the awkward situation of both being on mounts and will go straight to a fight. i like mounts to avoid larger groups as they reduced other options to do so over the years, they may remove em if they gimme my stealth back on a viable solo build ;) .

Yeah you can avoid larger groups on a mount, but If you are fighting someone and still stuck in combat, a large group will come to you you'll end up most likely dead, maybe thiefs can manage to escape, other classes/builds....not so muchi think it just takes some time for roamers to adjust to mounts. before the mounts, if you were not on a heavily stealth using build, people engaged each other right away on sight 'kill it before it gets away' . right now you can abuse this mindset to kill plenty roamers. for example the other day i was on my core thief and there was a rev coming my way, i was riding towards him and didnt have in mind to elude the fight. the moment he got in range he used is shiro port and tried to oneshot my mount. i dodged that ofc and then proceeded to use every dodge/HP my mount has to drain him off energy and CDs, to show him that he was simply too aggressive. with no dodge left and 200 HP i dismounted myself to avoid the CC and had an easy kill.just use some 'trash skill' (low cooldown/resources) to show your interest in a fight and opponents posing a challange usually will dismount quickly. going about it too aggressively is just asking to abuse the mount to drain resources.I already adjusted my build, and i doubt im the only one who switched to a glass cannon to dismount people it will just be way more common in non-zerg buildsfights you need to force are hardly a challange, i mean maybe forcing the fight is a challange now but the fight itself is not.

If they are out to venture on there own then it is presumed that they are capable of fighting back.

This ^

so you DO go for easy fights, as you wont fight just the same 3-4 players.

@spectrito.8513 said:Which is distinct from ganking from my perspective, a ganker is a player who is looking for a
easy fight
against people who cant fight back. which IMO is the main difference between gankers and roamers.

I fight ANYONE who i come across which lately due to the new influx of newbies i hardly find someone worth fighting and believe me i dont really like stomping newbies i'd rather have a fight worth fighting.I just want to PvP in a open world and If i cant fight without HAVE to rely on teammates to succed in a fight(SPvP and zerging), im done with gw2.

its all good, just the roamers do feel offended too easily when they are called gankers. i mean i dont have an issue to just admit that most people i kill didnt have a chance to begin with. the threads lead to nowhere aslong as so many claim they only fight people that do have a chance and when you ask em, they actually do kill alot of helpless targets.

I dont mind being called a ganker, i was forced to turn into one in order to still enjoy the game when in bored of zerging or there's are no tags running.Thanks to Warclaw

then embrace being a ganker and defend your playstyle.

Which tends to detract from the actual message, that mounts by in large have destroyed small scale fights at least from what I can see. I wrote a story of my last bit of roaming I did with my friend, TLDR we logged out of GW2 and played Apex together and had a lot more fun, so much that we spent 5 hours doing it without realising.

bq pd.2148 · March 17, 2019

@apharma.3741 said:
@MUDse.7623 said:
@apharma.3741 said:
@MUDse.7623 said:
@spectrito.8513 said:
@MUDse.7623 said:
@spectrito.8513 said:
@Fat Disgrace.4275 said:
@MUDse.7623 said:
@spectrito.8513 said:Just to clarify :Ganker - is a player who wants to kills mostly ,unaware zergers who cant fight back.Roamer - is a player who mostly likes to pvp and runs around the map taking objectives in order to find a other people to fight.

can you clarify how you determine if a player 'can fight back' ?

the reason all these threads are going into 'you are all gankers' is that you guys claim, that you only seek challanging fights and not easy fights. but then you said you need tools to force the fight. now for me a challanging opponent needs the interest to fight me, a build to fight me and the experience to pose a challange. such an opponent will hardly ever run away.

Given the skill of a average WvW player If you only pick "challenging" fights you will end up fighting against the same 3-4 players all the time. Thats why i think people come to WvW seeking out duels.If people are not in their respective tag and they're bad they should be deadi mostly fight around objectives and dont really seek fights, while i dont elude reasonable fights. this usually deals with the awkward situation of both being on mounts and will go straight to a fight. i like mounts to avoid larger groups as they reduced other options to do so over the years, they may remove em if they gimme my stealth back on a viable solo build ;) .

Yeah you can avoid larger groups on a mount, but If you are fighting someone and still stuck in combat, a large group will come to you you'll end up most likely dead, maybe thiefs can manage to escape, other classes/builds....not so muchi think it just takes some time for roamers to adjust to mounts. before the mounts, if you were not on a heavily stealth using build, people engaged each other right away on sight 'kill it before it gets away' . right now you can abuse this mindset to kill plenty roamers. for example the other day i was on my core thief and there was a rev coming my way, i was riding towards him and didnt have in mind to elude the fight. the moment he got in range he used is shiro port and tried to oneshot my mount. i dodged that ofc and then proceeded to use every dodge/HP my mount has to drain him off energy and CDs, to show him that he was simply too aggressive. with no dodge left and 200 HP i dismounted myself to avoid the CC and had an easy kill.just use some 'trash skill' (low cooldown/resources) to show your interest in a fight and opponents posing a challange usually will dismount quickly. going about it too aggressively is just asking to abuse the mount to drain resources.I already adjusted my build, and i doubt im the only one who switched to a glass cannon to dismount people it will just be way more common in non-zerg buildsfights you need to force are hardly a challange, i mean maybe forcing the fight is a challange now but the fight itself is not.

If they are out to venture on there own then it is presumed that they are capable of fighting back.

This ^

so you DO go for easy fights, as you wont fight just the same 3-4 players.

@spectrito.8513 said:Which is distinct from ganking from my perspective, a ganker is a player who is looking for a
easy fight
against people who cant fight back. which IMO is the main difference between gankers and roamers.

I fight ANYONE who i come across which lately due to the new influx of newbies i hardly find someone worth fighting and believe me i dont really like stomping newbies i'd rather have a fight worth fighting.I just want to PvP in a open world and If i cant fight without HAVE to rely on teammates to succed in a fight(SPvP and zerging), im done with gw2.

its all good, just the roamers do feel offended too easily when they are called gankers. i mean i dont have an issue to just admit that most people i kill didnt have a chance to begin with. the threads lead to nowhere aslong as so many claim they only fight people that do have a chance and when you ask em, they actually do kill alot of helpless targets.

I think it comes down to intent more than anything. A group of roamers killing people coming back from respawn to help out the servers commander flipping a T3 structure that's been annoying them all day is in my book generally fine, they're doing what they can for the good of their server, but to a lot of zerglings looks like ganking.

Groups of 3-5 running around with high stealth constantly targeting smaller and solo players and running from an even fight? Yeah that's gankers.

that is ganking for you. if you ask different people you will get different answers as to what is ganking.so the result is that these threads all get lost into a debate what is ganking and what is not ganking in order to justify changes to the mount or turn them down.i think it would be easier to accept that many of the roaming encounters will be considerd ganking by some and go by how that is part of the mode and therefor you need changes. but right now in all these threads roamers back off rightaway when someone calls it ganking, that wont lead em far in this debate.

@spectrito.8513 said:
@MUDse.7623 said:
@spectrito.8513 said:
@MUDse.7623 said:
@spectrito.8513 said:
@Fat Disgrace.4275 said:
@MUDse.7623 said:
@spectrito.8513 said:Just to clarify :Ganker - is a player who wants to kills mostly ,unaware zergers who cant fight back.Roamer - is a player who mostly likes to pvp and runs around the map taking objectives in order to find a other people to fight.

can you clarify how you determine if a player 'can fight back' ?

the reason all these threads are going into 'you are all gankers' is that you guys claim, that you only seek challanging fights and not easy fights. but then you said you need tools to force the fight. now for me a challanging opponent needs the interest to fight me, a build to fight me and the experience to pose a challange. such an opponent will hardly ever run away.

Given the skill of a average WvW player If you only pick "challenging" fights you will end up fighting against the same 3-4 players all the time. Thats why i think people come to WvW seeking out duels.If people are not in their respective tag and they're bad they should be deadi mostly fight around objectives and dont really seek fights, while i dont elude reasonable fights. this usually deals with the awkward situation of both being on mounts and will go straight to a fight. i like mounts to avoid larger groups as they reduced other options to do so over the years, they may remove em if they gimme my stealth back on a viable solo build ;) .

Yeah you can avoid larger groups on a mount, but If you are fighting someone and still stuck in combat, a large group will come to you you'll end up most likely dead, maybe thiefs can manage to escape, other classes/builds....not so muchi think it just takes some time for roamers to adjust to mounts. before the mounts, if you were not on a heavily stealth using build, people engaged each other right away on sight 'kill it before it gets away' . right now you can abuse this mindset to kill plenty roamers. for example the other day i was on my core thief and there was a rev coming my way, i was riding towards him and didnt have in mind to elude the fight. the moment he got in range he used is shiro port and tried to oneshot my mount. i dodged that ofc and then proceeded to use every dodge/HP my mount has to drain him off energy and CDs, to show him that he was simply too aggressive. with no dodge left and 200 HP i dismounted myself to avoid the CC and had an easy kill.just use some 'trash skill' (low cooldown/resources) to show your interest in a fight and opponents posing a challange usually will dismount quickly. going about it too aggressively is just asking to abuse the mount to drain resources.I already adjusted my build, and i doubt im the only one who switched to a glass cannon to dismount people it will just be way more common in non-zerg buildsfights you need to force are hardly a challange, i mean maybe forcing the fight is a challange now but the fight itself is not.

If they are out to venture on there own then it is presumed that they are capable of fighting back.

This ^

so you DO go for easy fights, as you wont fight just the same 3-4 players.

@spectrito.8513 said:Which is distinct from ganking from my perspective, a ganker is a player who is looking for a
easy fight
against people who cant fight back. which IMO is the main difference between gankers and roamers.

I fight ANYONE who i come across which lately due to the new influx of newbies i hardly find someone worth fighting and believe me i dont really like stomping newbies i'd rather have a fight worth fighting.I just want to PvP in a open world and If i cant fight without HAVE to rely on teammates to succed in a fight(SPvP and zerging), im done with gw2.

its all good, just the roamers do feel offended too easily when they are called gankers. i mean i dont have an issue to just admit that most people i kill didnt have a chance to begin with. the threads lead to nowhere aslong as so many claim they only fight people that do have a chance and when you ask em, they actually do kill alot of helpless targets.

I dont mind being called a ganker, i was forced to turn into one in order to still enjoy the game when in bored of zerging or there's are no tags running.Thanks to Warclaw

then embrace being a ganker and defend your playstyle.

Which tends to detract from the actual message, that mounts by in large have destroyed small scale fights at least from what I can see. I wrote a story of my last bit of roaming I did with my friend, TLDR we logged out of GW2 and played Apex together and had a lot more fun, so much that we spent 5 hours doing it without realising.

correct, debating terminology instead of what actually bothers you will detract from it. thats why i said just accept that some may call it that way and focus more on the actual issues that bothers you. its getting a bit tiring to see the ever same threads : 'you are gankers', 'no we are not', 'you are gankers', 'no we are not' as that doesnt address any of the concerns you voice.if anet does think the mode wll be more successfull the route they go, then its a good change from their view. most changes will make some veterans quit and new people stay/return. its unfortunate if the game takes a turn were you are the one to quit yourself, so you can fight for your playstyle and convice people that it is a vital part of the mode or move on. in that regard it is probably good that you have alternatives that you enjoy.

spectrito.8513 · March 17, 2019

@MUDse.7623 said:
@apharma.3741 said:
@MUDse.7623 said:
@spectrito.8513 said:
@MUDse.7623 said:
@spectrito.8513 said:
@Fat Disgrace.4275 said:
@MUDse.7623 said:
@spectrito.8513 said:Just to clarify :Ganker - is a player who wants to kills mostly ,unaware zergers who cant fight back.Roamer - is a player who mostly likes to pvp and runs around the map taking objectives in order to find a other people to fight.

can you clarify how you determine if a player 'can fight back' ?

the reason all these threads are going into 'you are all gankers' is that you guys claim, that you only seek challanging fights and not easy fights. but then you said you need tools to force the fight. now for me a challanging opponent needs the interest to fight me, a build to fight me and the experience to pose a challange. such an opponent will hardly ever run away.

Given the skill of a average WvW player If you only pick "challenging" fights you will end up fighting against the same 3-4 players all the time. Thats why i think people come to WvW seeking out duels.If people are not in their respective tag and they're bad they should be deadi mostly fight around objectives and dont really seek fights, while i dont elude reasonable fights. this usually deals with the awkward situation of both being on mounts and will go straight to a fight. i like mounts to avoid larger groups as they reduced other options to do so over the years, they may remove em if they gimme my stealth back on a viable solo build ;) .

Yeah you can avoid larger groups on a mount, but If you are fighting someone and still stuck in combat, a large group will come to you you'll end up most likely dead, maybe thiefs can manage to escape, other classes/builds....not so muchi think it just takes some time for roamers to adjust to mounts. before the mounts, if you were not on a heavily stealth using build, people engaged each other right away on sight 'kill it before it gets away' . right now you can abuse this mindset to kill plenty roamers. for example the other day i was on my core thief and there was a rev coming my way, i was riding towards him and didnt have in mind to elude the fight. the moment he got in range he used is shiro port and tried to oneshot my mount. i dodged that ofc and then proceeded to use every dodge/HP my mount has to drain him off energy and CDs, to show him that he was simply too aggressive. with no dodge left and 200 HP i dismounted myself to avoid the CC and had an easy kill.just use some 'trash skill' (low cooldown/resources) to show your interest in a fight and opponents posing a challange usually will dismount quickly. going about it too aggressively is just asking to abuse the mount to drain resources.I already adjusted my build, and i doubt im the only one who switched to a glass cannon to dismount people it will just be way more common in non-zerg buildsfights you need to force are hardly a challange, i mean maybe forcing the fight is a challange now but the fight itself is not.

If they are out to venture on there own then it is presumed that they are capable of fighting back.

This ^

so you DO go for easy fights, as you wont fight just the same 3-4 players.

@spectrito.8513 said:Which is distinct from ganking from my perspective, a ganker is a player who is looking for a
easy fight
against people who cant fight back. which IMO is the main difference between gankers and roamers.

I fight ANYONE who i come across which lately due to the new influx of newbies i hardly find someone worth fighting and believe me i dont really like stomping newbies i'd rather have a fight worth fighting.I just want to PvP in a open world and If i cant fight without HAVE to rely on teammates to succed in a fight(SPvP and zerging), im done with gw2.

its all good, just the roamers do feel offended too easily when they are called gankers. i mean i dont have an issue to just admit that most people i kill didnt have a chance to begin with. the threads lead to nowhere aslong as so many claim they only fight people that do have a chance and when you ask em, they actually do kill alot of helpless targets.

I think it comes down to intent more than anything. A group of roamers killing people coming back from respawn to help out the servers commander flipping a T3 structure that's been annoying them all day is in my book generally fine, they're doing what they can for the good of their server, but to a lot of zerglings looks like ganking.

Groups of 3-5 running around with high stealth constantly targeting smaller and solo players and running from an even fight? Yeah that's gankers.

that is ganking for you. if you ask different people you will get different answers as to what is ganking.so the result is that these threads all get lost into a debate what is ganking and what is not ganking in order to justify changes to the mount or turn them down.i think it would be easier to accept that many of the roaming encounters will be considerd ganking by some and go by how that is part of the mode and therefor you need changes. but right now in all these threads roamers back off rightaway when someone calls it ganking, that wont lead em far in this debate.

@spectrito.8513 said:
@MUDse.7623 said:
@spectrito.8513 said:
@MUDse.7623 said:
@spectrito.8513 said:
@Fat Disgrace.4275 said:
@MUDse.7623 said:
@spectrito.8513 said:Just to clarify :Ganker - is a player who wants to kills mostly ,unaware zergers who cant fight back.Roamer - is a player who mostly likes to pvp and runs around the map taking objectives in order to find a other people to fight.

can you clarify how you determine if a player 'can fight back' ?

the reason all these threads are going into 'you are all gankers' is that you guys claim, that you only seek challanging fights and not easy fights. but then you said you need tools to force the fight. now for me a challanging opponent needs the interest to fight me, a build to fight me and the experience to pose a challange. such an opponent will hardly ever run away.

Given the skill of a average WvW player If you only pick "challenging" fights you will end up fighting against the same 3-4 players all the time. Thats why i think people come to WvW seeking out duels.If people are not in their respective tag and they're bad they should be deadi mostly fight around objectives and dont really seek fights, while i dont elude reasonable fights. this usually deals with the awkward situation of both being on mounts and will go straight to a fight. i like mounts to avoid larger groups as they reduced other options to do so over the years, they may remove em if they gimme my stealth back on a viable solo build ;) .

Yeah you can avoid larger groups on a mount, but If you are fighting someone and still stuck in combat, a large group will come to you you'll end up most likely dead, maybe thiefs can manage to escape, other classes/builds....not so muchi think it just takes some time for roamers to adjust to mounts. before the mounts, if you were not on a heavily stealth using build, people engaged each other right away on sight 'kill it before it gets away' . right now you can abuse this mindset to kill plenty roamers. for example the other day i was on my core thief and there was a rev coming my way, i was riding towards him and didnt have in mind to elude the fight. the moment he got in range he used is shiro port and tried to oneshot my mount. i dodged that ofc and then proceeded to use every dodge/HP my mount has to drain him off energy and CDs, to show him that he was simply too aggressive. with no dodge left and 200 HP i dismounted myself to avoid the CC and had an easy kill.just use some 'trash skill' (low cooldown/resources) to show your interest in a fight and opponents posing a challange usually will dismount quickly. going about it too aggressively is just asking to abuse the mount to drain resources.I already adjusted my build, and i doubt im the only one who switched to a glass cannon to dismount people it will just be way more common in non-zerg buildsfights you need to force are hardly a challange, i mean maybe forcing the fight is a challange now but the fight itself is not.

If they are out to venture on there own then it is presumed that they are capable of fighting back.

This ^

so you DO go for easy fights, as you wont fight just the same 3-4 players.

@spectrito.8513 said:Which is distinct from ganking from my perspective, a ganker is a player who is looking for a
easy fight
against people who cant fight back. which IMO is the main difference between gankers and roamers.

I fight ANYONE who i come across which lately due to the new influx of newbies i hardly find someone worth fighting and believe me i dont really like stomping newbies i'd rather have a fight worth fighting.I just want to PvP in a open world and If i cant fight without HAVE to rely on teammates to succed in a fight(SPvP and zerging), im done with gw2.

its all good, just the roamers do feel offended too easily when they are called gankers. i mean i dont have an issue to just admit that most people i kill didnt have a chance to begin with. the threads lead to nowhere aslong as so many claim they only fight people that do have a chance and when you ask em, they actually do kill alot of helpless targets.

I dont mind being called a ganker, i was forced to turn into one in order to still enjoy the game when in bored of zerging or there's are no tags running.Thanks to Warclaw

then embrace being a ganker and defend your playstyle.

Im defending my playstyle, thats why the title of this thread is homeless roamersBefore i could join a zerg, a havoc or solo roam but now its just about blobs or ganking squads

Homeless roamers

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