Discipline (more specifically, "Fast Hands")

Most of the warrior trait lines are pretty interchangeable depending on the situation. More damage? strength. More team support? Tactics. More sustain? Defense. More condi? Arms. No matter what kind of build you're running though things never feel right without Discipline because of Fast Hands. It's run so commonly that faster weapon swapping feels synonymous with warrior. Why is this not just included in the base warrior package by now?

If you run an elite specializations that's 2/3 of our trait lines taken up by "must haves". I propose that fast hands just be part of warrior independent of traits so that it feels more open to build variation. Not having it adversely affects the flow of the profession (at least for me). Discipline would still be a strong choice without fast hands but if I choose not to run it I don't want to feel punished for it by slowing down my gameplay. I would even be fine if they increased the recharge time a tiny bit to balance out it being base line.

Idea for fast hands replacement trait:

Reckless Draw:Swap weapons, 5% bonus damage on next attack.

EDIT:Open to ideas on the replacement skill :bleep_bloop:

Why is this not just included in the base warrior package by now?

What you just said is: this trait is so strong that it's pretty much a must-take no matter the circumstances. and your proposed ""solution"" to that is making it... An inherent passive for a warrior? Where the fuck is any sense in that?

And you're not "getting punished for picking it" just because you can't have every trait you want at the same time.

@"Sobx.1758" said:

Why is this not just included in the base warrior package by now?

• Thief has steal (similar to burst) AND no weapon cooldowns from initiative.
• Engineer has several toolbelt skills and toolkits available.
• Ranger has pet skills and pet swaps.
• Elementalist has 4 different skill bars to swap through with a 1.5 second CD between swapping (considering it's not one on a longer cd).
• Mesmer has 4 (some times 5) different shatter skills with ways to reset CD's
• Necro has shroud skills
• Rev has multiple legends to swap between along with weapons
• Guardian is kind of up the same ally as warrior, but it does have more utilities through it's virutes

Now, all warrior has is it's burst, weapon, and utility skills. I don't see how it's so over powered for them to be able to switch through their relativly small pool of skills 3 seconds faster than other professions. It doesn't affect their actual weapon ability cd's either.

And you're not "getting punished for picking it" just because you can't have every trait you want at the same time.

It changes the whole flow of the profession so it "feels" like a punishment not to have it. I'm not asking for every trait at the same time, just not to have to pick a whole trait line for what seems like it should just be a part of the profession design.

The theme of the Discipline Specialization does in fact revolve around the weapon swap as a combat function for Warrior. Its not only Fast Hands, but also Versatile Rage, Brawlers Recovery, and Versatile Power. All of them together promote the swap/burst play style that Warrior is known for.

If you are going to make Fast Hand baseline then whatever you replace it with needs to be in that theme but a lot more interesting than a boring damage buff. We are already getting some of that with the other weapon swap traits.

@Zexanima.7851 said:

@"Sobx.1758" said:

Why is this not just included in the base warrior package by now?

How am I being "snide"?

Lets compare to some other professions and how many skills they have to cycle through.

• Thief has steal (similar to burst) AND no weapon cooldowns from initiative.

Steal for the most part is an autdated garbage ability, useful for gapclosing and not really "similar to burst". The lack of cooldowns is just a change dynamic to make it more bursty and as you said it got replaced by initiative, not sure how it's relevant here.

• Engineer has several toolbelt skills and toolkits available.

I don't play engineer, can't talk for that.

• Ranger has pet skills and pet swaps.

I don't really play ranger, but if there's any problem with that class, I'm pretty sure it's not a pet swap, how is this relevant here?If it's so unfair and soi much stronger, go play ranger btw.

• Elementalist has 4 different skill bars to swap through with a 1.5 second CD between swapping (considering it's not one on a longer cd).

xD ok, go play elementalist and let me know how it goes.

• Mesmer has 4 (some times 5) different shatter skills with ways to reset CD's

Again, how is this relevant here?

• Necro has shroud skills

...how is this relevant here?

• Rev has multiple legends to swap between along with weapons

He doesnt have "multiple legends to swap between", he picks a build and then swap between 2 set legends. He's also being balanced around them, again: how is this relevant in any way here?

• Guardian is kind of up the same ally as warrior, but it does have more utilities through it's virutes

If it's "up the same ally but better" then why aren't you playing guardian?

Now, all warrior has is it's burst, weapon, and utility skills. I don't see how it's so over powered for them to be able to switch through their relativly small pool of skills 3 seconds faster than other professions. It doesn't affect their actual weapon ability cd's either.

And you're not "getting punished for picking it" just because you can't have every trait you want at the same time.

Warrior can't pick a single trait from fourth spec in addition to using full 3 other specs for the exactly same reason no other class can do that.

No, you're totally not "asking for every trait at the same time", you're just asking for a trait that you deem "must pick over anything else" and then make it a classes passive, lmao. Strong delusions.

@"Zexanima.7851" said:Most of the warrior trait lines are pretty interchangeable depending on the situation. More damage? strength. More team support? Tactics. More sustain? Defense. More condi? Arms. No matter what kind of build you're running though things never feel right without Discipline because of Fast Hands. It's run so commonly that faster weapon swapping feels synonymous with warrior. Why is this not just included in the base warrior package by now?

If you run an elite specializations that's 2/3 of our trait lines taken up by "must haves". I propose that fast hands just be part of warrior independent of traits so that it feels more open to build variation. Not having it adversely affects the flow of the profession (at least for me). Discipline would still be a strong choice without fast hands but if I choose not to run it I don't want to feel punished for it by slowing down my gameplay. I would even be fine if they increased the recharge time a tiny bit to balance out it being base line.

Idea for fast hands replacement trait:

Reckless Draw:Swap weapons, 5% bonus damage on next attack.

We've been asking for baseline Fast Hands for years. Warrior was clearly designed with fast hands in mind. Funny thing is, Discipline is so good that even if Fast Hands was ripped out of the tree, made baseline, and replaced with nothing, Warriors would still probably take it almost 100% of the time. Being able to consistantly use burst skills is vital to the class. Sadly, I doubt we will ever see this change. Anet has had YEARS to do it and yet they refuse.

I'm just praying they can spend to time to rework Berserker and buff Defense... I love the Strength based builds but it would be nice if Defensive were still viable.

@sneakytails.5629 said:The theme of the Discipline Specialization does in fact revolve around the weapon swap as a combat function for Warrior. Its not only Fast Hands, but also Versatile Rage, Brawlers Recovery, and Versatile Power. All of them together promote the swap/burst play style that Warrior is known for.

If you are going to make Fast Hand baseline then whatever you replace it with needs to be in that theme but a lot more interesting than a boring damage buff. We are already getting some of that with the other weapon swap traits.

I'm open for ideas on the replacement.

@Sobx.1758 said:

@Zexanima.7851 said:

@Sobx.1758 said:

Why is this not just included in the base warrior package by now?

"lmao. Strong delusions.", "Where the kitten is any sense in that?", "your proposed ""solution"" "Definition of snide:

• derogatory or mocking in an indirect way.

Lets compare to some other professions and how many skills they have to cycle through.

• Thief has steal (similar to burst) AND no weapon cooldowns from initiative.

If you think steal is weak and outdated you've not been using steal right. The only thing weak about steal is that it misfires way too often.

• Engineer has several toolbelt skills and toolkits available.

I do so I can.

• Ranger has pet skills and pet swaps.

• Elementalist has 4 different skill bars to swap through with a 1.5 second CD between swapping (considering it's not one on a longer cd).

• Mesmer has 4 (some times 5) different shatter skills with ways to reset CD's

• Necro has shroud skills

• Rev has multiple legends to swap between along with weapons

• Guardian is kind of up the same ally as warrior, but it does have more utilities through it's virutes

Now, all warrior has is it's burst, weapon, and utility skills. I don't see how it's so over powered for them to be able to switch through their relativly small pool of skills 3 seconds faster than other professions. It doesn't affect their actual weapon ability cd's either.

And you're not "getting punished for picking it" just because you can't have every trait you want at the same time.

@Girth.9731 said:

@"Zexanima.7851" said:Most of the warrior trait lines are pretty interchangeable depending on the situation. More damage? strength. More team support? Tactics. More sustain? Defense. More condi? Arms. No matter what kind of build you're running though things never feel right without Discipline because of Fast Hands. It's run so commonly that faster weapon swapping feels synonymous with warrior. Why is this not just included in the base warrior package by now?

If you run an elite specializations that's 2/3 of our trait lines taken up by "must haves". I propose that fast hands just be part of warrior independent of traits so that it feels more open to build variation. Not having it adversely affects the flow of the profession (at least for me). Discipline would still be a strong choice without fast hands but if I choose not to run it I don't want to feel punished for it by slowing down my gameplay. I would even be fine if they increased the recharge time a tiny bit to balance out it being base line.

Idea for fast hands replacement trait:

Reckless Draw:Swap weapons, 5% bonus damage on next attack.

Got to keep pestering them. They may eventually change it or at the least give us a reason to why they can't/won't. I agree, Discipline is still really strong without Fast Hands and worth taking. I think it's just that trait in particular that cements it as a "must pick". If it was made baseline I could see myself replacing Discipline in some instances with something else.

@Sobx.1758

I blow my nose at you, good day sir.

@"Sobx.1758" said:

Why is this not just included in the base warrior package by now?

Do you play warrior? If yes, how many hours played do you have on it? Do you even understand how Fast Hands baseline would change warrior class? There are more cool things in Discipline traitline than just Fast Hands. If you don't know about them, why even coming here and commenting?

Fast Hands baseline would allow non-Discipline builds to be useful to play in all game modes (mostly PvP and WvW). Some people act like warrior would be overpowered without realizing that all Discipline traits would be missing.

So far, I haven't seen a single argument that would logically (and precisely) explain, how this change would make warrior broken. All most powerful meta warrior builds (in PvP/WvW and now even in PvE, after banner patch) use Discipline traitline.

@Zexanima.7851 said:

@Sobx.1758 said:

@Zexanima.7851 said:

@Sobx.1758 said:

Now, all warrior has is it's burst, weapon, and utility skills. I don't see how it's so over powered for them to be able to switch through their relativly small pool of skills 3 seconds faster than other professions. It doesn't affect their actual weapon ability cd's either.

And you're not "getting punished for picking it" just because you can't have every trait you want at the same time.

No, it's not. At least not in the sense you try to claim it is. If anything, that would put it in the queue for a nerf, not making it "an inherent class passive" like you want it to be. Just imagine unironically saying "THIS TRAIT IS SO STRONG THAT WE NEED TO MAKE IT AN INHERENT PASSIVE FOR EVERY BUILD SO IT HAS NO TRATE-OFFS ANYMORE", holy shit ;D

And no, that wouldn't be a "QoL change", it would be a "buff".Just like in previous posts, what you say is just illogical.

Here is my proposal for replacement of the OP's idea

The current version.

I can't see any situation where fast hands as baseline provides more openness to build variation as the OP claims. I mean, it doesn't even have that significant of an impact on builds to begin with ... it is a minor trait after all. Minor traits provide a 'feel of a theme'; they are hardly anything you can actually create a build around ... that's why you get them by default.

How can the OP claim not having it adversely affects the 'flow' ... I mean, at 5 seconds you almost get to face roll it. What build is so significantly impacted by a 5 second weapon swap that it affects the flow? What kind of flow do you get swapping and auto attacking? You can't even recharge your cooldowns on most weapon skills with that. The idea doesn't make much sense to me.

@cryorion.9532 said:

@"Sobx.1758" said:

Why is this not just included in the base warrior package by now?

Yes, I do.Also nice try, but I guess you should ask OP:

No matter what kind of build you're running though things never feel right without Discipline because of Fast Hands.

And if you don't see that giving a fast hands trait as an inherent class passive is a straight up buff to the whole class then I'm not sure what to tell you.Also so far I haven't seen a single argument for why it should be a passive for the whole class other than "it's so strong that I always pick it anyways!". If anything that's the argument to NOT make it a class passive and possibly nerf it to put it in lane with other traits. If you can't understand this simple concept then I'm not sure "why are you even coming here and commenting?"

It would be absolutely amazing if ANet can bake the Discipline line into baseline Warrior so I can run Strength/Defense/Discipline... and get Spellbreaker or Berserker in here at the same time.

Preferably, Versatile Rage + Warrior's Sprint + Fast Hands + Brawler's Recovery + Versatile Power + Burst Mastery.I absolutely hate it when I swap out of Discipline and lose these traits so naturally I should have these traits even if I do swap out!

I don't think it's going to affect Warrior at all, Warrior feels so weak already and I lose my 1v1s half the time. Fix this, bake Discipline into baseline Warrior and Warrior will finally be able to win 1v2s and become meta in my eyes.

! Risen Farmer: Help! hahaha. He-eelp. Hahahaha.

@"Zexanima.7851" said:Most of the warrior trait lines are pretty interchangeable depending on the situation. More damage? strength. More team support? Tactics. More sustain? Defense. More condi? Arms. No matter what kind of build you're running though things never feel right without Discipline because of Fast Hands. It's run so commonly that faster weapon swapping feels synonymous with warrior. Why is this not just included in the base warrior package by now?

If you run an elite specializations that's 2/3 of our trait lines taken up by "must haves". I propose that fast hands just be part of warrior independent of traits so that it feels more open to build variation. Not having it adversely affects the flow of the profession (at least for me). Discipline would still be a strong choice without fast hands but if I choose not to run it I don't want to feel punished for it by slowing down my gameplay. I would even be fine if they increased the recharge time a tiny bit to balance out it being base line.

Idea for fast hands replacement trait:

Reckless Draw:Swap weapons, 5% bonus damage on next attack.

EDIT:Open to ideas on the replacement skill :bleep_bloop:

Reckless Draw I like that, not OP but incentivizes you to switch weapons

We really need baseline fast hands for build variety. And there really is little to no OP build that will happen if we do get baseline fast hands.

@"Sobx.1758" said:And if you don't see that giving a fast hands trait as an inherent class passive is a straight up buff to the whole class then I'm not sure what to tell you.Also so far I haven't seen a single argument for why it should be a passive for the whole class other than "it's so strong that I always pick it anyways!". If anything that's the argument to NOT make it a class passive and possibly nerf it to put it in lane with other traits. If you can't understand this simple concept then I'm not sure "why are you even coming here and commenting?"

Well, I just told you... but it seems you are unable to understand. Let me try again: the whole point of making Fast Hands baseline is to ONLY BUFF non-Discipline warrior builds to be more useful especially in PvP/WvW. Do you think that making FH baseline is... nerfing or fixing warrior? The change is obviously huge QoL for all non-Discipline builds. Discipline traitline then enhances weapon swapping to provide adrenaline, might, condi removal, etc on swap.

Again, your argument is so vague and didn't explain AT ALL, how FH would make warrior overpowered.If you play also warrior, then please tell me scenarios, situations and non-Disci builds/trait combinations that would be too strong, broken, etc.

@"Obtena.7952" said:Here is my proposal for replacement of the OP's idea

The current version.

I can't see any situation where fast hands as baseline provides more openness to build variation as the OP claims. I mean, it doesn't even have that significant of an impact on builds to begin with ... it is a minor trait after all. Minor traits provide a 'feel of a theme'; they are hardly anything you can actually create a build around ... that's why you get them by default.

How can the OP claim not having it adversely affects the 'flow' ... I mean, at 5 seconds you almost get to face roll it. What build is so significantly impacted by a 5 second weapon swap that it affects the flow? What kind of flow do you get swapping and auto attacking? You can't even recharge your cooldowns on most weapon skills with that. The idea doesn't make much sense to me.

Have you ever played non-Discipline warrior build in WvW or in PvP, where you need to swap weapons to adjust to situation as fast as possible?So exactly in those situations, making FH baseline would help A LOT. Some people seem to think that we pretend like this isn't a buff. Of course it is, it is buff, buff to all non-Discipline warrior builds which are underperforming compared to Discipline builds (especially in PvP/WvW).But there is always that one guy who comes and mentions Tactics Condi Banner Berserker and Tactics Banner Spellbreaker, which are situational builds at best now, only useful in raids/fractals, nowhere else. And that's it. WvW/PvP? 99% are all Discipline builds.

Let me tell you specific example of specific build: Dagger/Warhorn + Hammer boonbreaker with Strength, Tactics and Spellbreaker traitlines. When you are in fight, and you need to swap to dagger/warhorn for condi removal, you are stucked on that weaponset for 10 seconds and are unable to swap to hammer fast enough to start aoe CC-ing and mass removing boons. Same applies to other way around, when swapping to hammer and then getting condi bombed, you have to wait 10 seconds before doing so.Now you may ask why would anyone use such build when it obviously doesn't work that well, you can't adapt to immediate situations fast enough with 10 sec weapon CD as warrior. Here comes FH baseline where you can swap between weapons faster.

Another short example, e.g. mace mainhand 2nd skill block, yes it has 10 seconds cooldown, but imagine if you swap to xy weapon and are stuck on it for 10 seconds, and you want to block something fast, 5 second wep CD is obviously better to adapt fast.Etc.

Now this fast adaptation is what makes people fear that warrior would be suddenly broken. Even though most people fight 99% of the time Discipline builds, so they already fight "fast adaptation" warriors.

I think it goes without saying that in situations where fast swapping would be good ... FH is good. It's simply not a valid reason to make it baseline. It's the whole point of taking a traitline that gives you benefits for a weapon swapping build.

The argument to make something baseline isn't that it would be better .. OFC it will be better. IF we want to maintain a meaningful set of choice then we can't just make everything that would make things better baseline. I also don't think that calling all non-Discipline warriors underperforming is a compelling reason to make FH baseline either. I find it hard to believe that having a 5 vs. 7 second weapon swap is THE thing that's holding back non-Discipline warriors. If anything, that's sort of an indication that FH is too strong and needs a nerf IMO.

I'm a PvE player only. While I'd also like to have fast hands as baseline, I'm not certain it would actually change anything for the 2 builds that I most commonly use. For power core, I already take the trait and trait line. For condi berserker, the skill and burst cool downs almost line up with the non-fast hands weapon swap already. I guess there are some times when I'd like to not be stuck on a weapon set, (especially bow when I want to melee) but whether fast hands was baseline or not I'm still trying to hit as many LB bursts as possible because that's where a lot of my damage is coming from.

@cryorion.9532 said:

@"Sobx.1758" said:And if you don't see that giving a fast hands trait as an inherent class passive is a straight up buff to the whole class then I'm not sure what to tell you.Also so far I haven't seen a single argument for why it should be a passive for the whole class other than "it's so strong that I always pick it anyways!". If anything that's the argument to NOT make it a class passive and possibly nerf it to put it in lane with other traits. If you can't understand this simple concept then I'm not sure "why are you even coming here and commenting?"

Well, I already told you, but it seems you are unable to underrstand simple balancing concepts. Let me try again, but this time try to focus REEEEAAAAALLY hard while you're reading this:Also so far I haven't seen a single argument for why it should be a passive for the whole class other than "it's so strong that I always pick it anyways!". If anything that's the argument to NOT make it a class passive and possibly nerf it to put it in lane with other traits.

Do you think that making FH baseline is... nerfing or fixing warrior? The change is obviously huge QoL for all non-Discipline builds

Where exactly did you see me writing anything like this? Seriously, wtf are you even talking about here? Be sure to point exactly where I said that making FH baseline is a nerf to warrior, because the whole point of the post you were answering to was me stating the opposite. That just blows my mind.And no, that's not a "QoL change", it's a big buff to all the specs and "QoL" isn't interchangable with a "buff", these are two different terms.

Again, your argument is so vague and didn't explain AT ALL, how FH would make warrior overpowered.If you play also warrior, then please tell me scenarios, situations and non-Disci builds/trait combinations that would be too strong, broken, etc.

Just keep reading other posts and I'm sure you can come up with the scenarios that miiiiiiiight help you understand. Then again, who knows.https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/comment/874680/#Comment_874680https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/comment/874782/#Comment_874782

LITERALLY any class would welcome a 5 sec weapon swap, because it gives you more options 'as needed' on a shorter cooldown without being locked out from a different set of 5 skills for twice as long. Pretending it's not a huge deal is just stupid and a bad lie. But that's exactly why you want it as an inherent passive skill for the class -because it's a huge deal. Keep pretending you don't know that, w/e.

edit:Oh and how good it is to see that someone else in this thread understands what he's talking about <3https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/comment/874696/#Comment_874696

@Obtena.7952 said:Here is my proposal for replacement of the OP's idea

The current version.

I can't see any situation where fast hands as baseline provides more openness to build variation as the OP claims. I mean, it doesn't even have that significant of an impact on builds to begin with ... it is a minor trait after all. Minor traits provide a 'feel of a theme'; they are hardly anything you can actually create a build around ... that's why you get them by default.

You're probably right, it wouldn't increase build variation that much as Discipline is strong enough without it. I'm all for changes to make Discipline a less prevalent trait line for warrior builds, I think this is just a good first step. That 'feel for theme' that fast hands provides is used so often with warrior it doenst feel right without it.

How can the OP claim not having it adversely affects the 'flow' ... I mean, at 5 seconds you almost get to face roll it. What build is so significantly impacted by a 5 second weapon swap that it affects the flow? What kind of flow do you get swapping and auto attacking? You can't even recharge your cooldowns on most weapon skills with that. The idea doesn't make much sense to me.

It does affect the flow of the profession though. Put a few hundred hours in on a build that always uses fast hands (which is most builds) then go play a build without it. Having an increased CD on something you use that often doesnt feel good when playing the profession.

@stone cold.8609 said:I'm a PvE player only. While I'd also like to have fast hands as baseline, I'm not certain it would actually change anything for the 2 builds that I most commonly use. For power core, I already take the trait and trait line. For condi berserker, the skill and burst cool downs almost line up with the non-fast hands weapon swap already. I guess there are some times when I'd like to not be stuck on a weapon set, (especially bow when I want to melee) but whether fast hands was baseline or not I'm still trying to hit as many LB bursts as possible because that's where a lot of my damage is coming from.

The most prevalent scenario is I can think of myself is procing weapon sigils. Being able to clear a condi or switch to a heal-on-hit weapon set could be the difference between life and death some times.

@Zexanima.7851 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:Here is my proposal for replacement of the OP's idea

The current version.

I can't see any situation where fast hands as baseline provides more openness to build variation as the OP claims. I mean, it doesn't even have that significant of an impact on builds to begin with ... it is a minor trait after all. Minor traits provide a 'feel of a theme'; they are hardly anything you can actually create a build around ... that's why you get them by default.

You're probably right, it wouldn't increase build variation that much as Discipline is strong enough without it. I'm all for changes to make Discipline a less prevalent trait line for warrior builds, I think this is just a good first step. That 'feel for theme' that fast hands provides is used so often with warrior it doenst feel right without it.

How can the OP claim not having it adversely affects the 'flow' ... I mean, at 5 seconds you almost get to face roll it. What build is so significantly impacted by a 5 second weapon swap that it affects the flow? What kind of flow do you get swapping and auto attacking? You can't even recharge your cooldowns on most weapon skills with that. The idea doesn't make much sense to me.

These aren't reasons to make FH baseline. Of course if you play with FH for hundreds of hours then play a build that doesn't have it, it feels different. That goes without saying. I just don't see any reason to make it baseline for this reason. Simply put, you got used to something and it feels deficient when you don't have it. The fact is that non-Discipline builds are not deficient because they don't have FH.

@Obtena.7952 said:

@Zexanima.7851 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:Here is my proposal for replacement of the OP's idea

The current version.

I can't see any situation where fast hands as baseline provides more openness to build variation as the OP claims. I mean, it doesn't even have that significant of an impact on builds to begin with ... it is a minor trait after all. Minor traits provide a 'feel of a theme'; they are hardly anything you can actually create a build around ... that's why you get them by default.

You're probably right, it wouldn't increase build variation that much as Discipline is strong enough without it. I'm all for changes to make Discipline a less prevalent trait line for warrior builds, I think this is just a good first step. That 'feel for theme' that fast hands provides is used so often with warrior it doenst feel right without it.

How can the OP claim not having it adversely affects the 'flow' ... I mean, at 5 seconds you almost get to face roll it. What build is so significantly impacted by a 5 second weapon swap that it affects the flow? What kind of flow do you get swapping and auto attacking? You can't even recharge your cooldowns on most weapon skills with that. The idea doesn't make much sense to me.

It doesnt just feel different it feels worse, which is an important distinction. Non-Discipline builds ARE deficient though or else a vast majority of builds wouldn't need it. The only unique profession mechanic warrior has is a single burst skill per weapon where as most professions have multiple special skills or whole other sets of skills. As a weapons master profession it wouldn't be far fetched for part of their built in class mechanics to include weapon swapping. You havent really presented a reason not to do it other than "there is no reason to do it" but there is. Yes, it's a buff, but not a significant one. It wouldn't make warrior over perform, it would just make them more fluid.