Please make raids 5 man — Guild Wars 2 Forums

Please make raids 5 man

There is a huge issue in getting into raids for most players. Raids have declining participation rates that will only get lower as more and more people make these things exclusive. People are very rude and disrespectful to others in raids.

Pro's:
-Easier to fill
-More people doing them
-As a single person,you contribute 20% to the groups performance instead of 10%
-Less people you have to "herd" as a leader

Con's:
-Slightly less interesting mechanics

There's really not many cons. The 10 man thing doesn't make raids feel more "epic" or "huge" or anything, it's just an arbitrary number that causes a much bigger barrier of entry for absolutely no reason.

The games combat does't even support raids, as boons started out at 5 people max. You've already started rebalancing entire specs and classes around giving boons to 10 people due to raids, instead of just making raids 5man.

Please re-examine raids player requirement and think of if the pro's outweigh the cons for 5 man vs10 man, anet.

Thank you.

<134

Comments

  • Shiyo.3578Shiyo.3578 Member ✭✭✭
    edited April 17, 2019

    @Ayrilana.1396 said:
    We already have 5-player content.

    That's like saying we already have core tyria zones so we don't need more open world...

  • Ayrilana.1396Ayrilana.1396 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Shiyo.3578 said:

    @Ayrilana.1396 said:
    We already have 5-player content.

    Yeah, and fractals have much higher participation rates than raids.

    As expected since they’re easier.

  • @Shiyo.3578 said:

    @Ayrilana.1396 said:
    We already have 5-player content.

    Yeah, and fractals have much higher participation rates than raids.

    And? Go play fractals then :D

  • Zexanima.7851Zexanima.7851 Member ✭✭✭

    I don't think that the number of players for raids needs to be changed. As others have stated there is already 5 man instanced content. However there has been a growing amount of toxicity in this game across all game modes compared to when I first started playing. I think that's what needs to be addressed. They could start by facilitating cooperation and diversity more. When it comes to raids the issue seems to be (at least to me) some people want to run a meta composition but others just want to have fun and play the profession they like.

    I get that raids are suppose to be hardcore content but no matter how you market it this is a game built around casual play. Having the 'meta' zone out entire professions or force people to play something they don't enjoy isn't good. A quick and dirty fix might be to give each profession a unique 10 man passive buff that doesn't stack that is only provided in raids. This would probably still result in some professions getting optimized out of the meta. Another solution could be to increase the reward per unique profession in the squad. Also, this presents its issues. None of these idea's I'm saying are best but I'm just trying to provide some ideas centered around what I think the issue is.

    No longer playing the game due to PvP being abandon.

  • Shiyo.3578Shiyo.3578 Member ✭✭✭

    @sigur.9453 said:
    I think you'd enjoy dungeons and fractals. Raids are clearly not your content. Sincerely a rude and disrespectful person.

    lol dude. I've done raids in this game and raided in other MMO's that are massively more difficult than this games raids will ever be and consistently cleared them in every game(including this).

    I don't like raids, but I think the current state of raids is incredibly unhealthy for this games player base.

  • Shiyo.3578Shiyo.3578 Member ✭✭✭
    edited April 17, 2019

    @Shiyo.3578 said:

    @sigur.9453 said:
    I think you'd enjoy dungeons and fractals. Raids are clearly not your content. Sincerely a rude and disrespectful person.

    lol dude. I've done raids in this game and raided in other MMO's that are massively more difficult than this games raids will ever be and consistently cleared them in every game(including this).
    I don't like raids, but I think the current state of raids is incredibly unhealthy for this games player base.

    @Illconceived Was Na.9781 said:

    This explains a lot about the OP's perspective on "challenging" and "group" content.

    wow man nice ad hoimem attacks really adding a lot to this conversation!

  • Safandula.8723Safandula.8723 Member ✭✭✭✭

    I prefer 5 man content, as u contribute more to the party, but we got fractals. (and dungeons kappa)

  • @Illconceived Was Na.9781 said:

    This explains a lot about the OP's perspective on "challenging" and "group" content.

    wow man nice ad hoimem attacks really adding a lot to this conversation!

    You stated specifically that you think that the raid team, dedicated to producing challenging group content, would be better suited to spend time on challenging individual nostalgia content. Taking your comment at face value, makes it easier to understand why you interpret the situation as "raids aren't popular" rather than as that you simply dislike how ANet views raids.

    "Face the facts. Then act on them. It's ...the only doctrine I have to offer you, & it's harder than you'd think, because I swear humans seem hardwired to do anything but. Face the facts. Don't pray, don't wish, ...FACE THE FACTS. THEN act." — Quellcrist Falconer

  • dodgerrule.8739dodgerrule.8739 Member ✭✭
    edited April 17, 2019

    Just have it to where raids difficulty scales to 5 players or more.

    Fractals are the most fun content in the game dude.

  • Ayrilana.1396Ayrilana.1396 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @dodgerrule.8739 said:
    Just have it to where raids difficulty scales to 5 players or more.

    Fractals are the most fun content in the game dude.

    There are already fractals in this game for five players as you’ve indicated that you’re aware of their existence. Raids are meant for 10 players just like how fractals are meant for 5 players instead of 1.

  • sigur.9453sigur.9453 Member ✭✭✭

    @dodgerrule.8739 said:
    Just have it to where raids difficulty scales to 5 players or more.

    Fractals are the most fun content in the game dude.

    Ah, thx. I thought I liked raids more. Silly me.

  • The toxicity of raid groups is held within the people themselves only letting those with the best experience in. Those who want to get into raids simply cannot due to this reason.

  • Ayrilana.1396Ayrilana.1396 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited April 17, 2019

    @dodgerrule.8739 said:
    The toxicity of raid groups is held within the people themselves only letting those with the best experience in. Those who want to get into raids simply cannot due to this reason.

    That’s not toxicity. If that’s toxic behavior then every company that has jobs with requirements in order to be hired must be toxic.

    Those that want to get into raids can create their own groups with their own requirements (or lack of requirements).

  • dodgerrule.8739dodgerrule.8739 Member ✭✭
    edited April 17, 2019

    Except that there are no chances for people to learn even in training groups people exclude anyone

  • Ayrilana.1396Ayrilana.1396 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited April 17, 2019

    @dodgerrule.8739 said:
    Except that there are no chances for people to learn even in training groups people exclude anyone

    There are which have already been mentioned.

    1) Look for training groups
    2) Create your own
    3) Join one that doesn’t have experience requirements

  • Don’t try to change the topic that raids can’t sustain popularity as 10 man groups

  • If you use any Addons during raids that help it is against the rules.

  • melandru.3876melandru.3876 Member ✭✭✭

    @dodgerrule.8739 said:
    If you use any Addons during raids that help it is against the rules.

    what have addons to do with being able to join a (training) squad?

  • Ayrilana.1396Ayrilana.1396 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @dodgerrule.8739 said:
    Don’t try to change the topic that raids can’t sustain popularity as 10 man groups

    You haven’t shown that they cannot

  • Astralporing.1957Astralporing.1957 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited April 17, 2019

    @OP
    As much as i don't really like the fact Anet introduced challenging 10-man in the first place, i don't think that change would be a good idea now. There are a few cons you're not mentioning here. One is the unavoidable difficulty change. Either you keep individual difficulty the same, thus making the encounter easier, or, more likely, raiders would insist on retaining overall encounter difficulty, which would cause the individual difficulty to soar. The former i might agree with, but would probably make the intended target group of players unhappy. The latter on the other hand would end up actually lowering the pool of raiders even more, due to significantly raising the difficulty bar.
    Another con is the dev time used - redoing all encounters and changing mechanics to fit the 5-man groups is not trivial, and would likely require a lot of effort. Additionally, The change you ask for isn't really aimed at increasing the number of raiders, merely at making the life of the current raiders easier by requiring less players in a group. Thus, i don't think you can justify sinking a lot of effort that could be better used elsewhere, for a mode that already is suffering through population problems, when said effort can only slow the decline, but cannot help reverse it.

    Basically, too much effort for too little gain.

    The whole point of a social game is to play with the people you want to play with, not be forced to play with the people you don't.

  • Stand The Wall.6987Stand The Wall.6987 Member ✭✭✭✭

    allow it for both sizes? not a big deal. scale rewards accordingly.
    also, why are people saying "raids are for 10 ppl" like its an argument? this fact is known already ppl.

  • Shiyo.3578Shiyo.3578 Member ✭✭✭
    edited April 17, 2019

    @Ayrilana.1396 said:

    @dodgerrule.8739 said:
    Except that there are no chances for people to learn even in training groups people exclude anyone

    There are which have already been mentioned.

    1) Look for training groups
    2) Create your own
    3) Join one that doesn’t have experience requirements

    This is the only MMO on the planet with """""""""""""Training groups""""""""""""""".

    It's also the MMO with the easiest raids in the entire genre. Training groups are a sick joke and need to stop being suggested.

  • I think that if you change raids to 5-man very jigh percentahe of raiders would quit. I hope you relise that there are players that play raids and not fractals because they enjoy 10 man squads more.

    In my guild there is 500 players, some are inactive for more then 2 months (we clear those whenever space for new players is needed)
    Out of these 500 players 20 raid with our guild and another 15 raid oitside of the guild and those are the onse I know of. Thaf is 7 percent of players in our guild. There are some raiders there that doesnt do anything else in gw2 then raids, there are players that fullclears multiple times per week but there are also players that just started. I will ask in my guild how many out of these players would quit and how many of new players would join and post the results here but i know at least one would stop playing.

  • ButcherofMalakir.4067ButcherofMalakir.4067 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited April 18, 2019

    So far every raider that is online now said that they would leave raids. Still w8 for non raiders to answer but it is interesting that most active guild members are those raiders

    Edit1: Still all raiders against it and no nonraider reacted

  • I thought their new fractals already included several raid mechanics and it's already the direction they're taking?

    [RED] Crimson Sunspears...your small family guild since 2015.

  • Miellyn.6847Miellyn.6847 Member ✭✭✭

    @NICENIKESHOE.7128 said:
    I thought their new fractals already included several raid mechanics and it's already the direction they're taking?

    Can we please stop labeling mechanics you have to do instead of ignoring everything and just smash the boss as 'raid mechanics'? Only because people prefer facetanking everything and collecting their loot mechanics don't become magically more difficult when you have to execute them.

  • melandru.3876melandru.3876 Member ✭✭✭
    edited April 18, 2019

    and my post deleted again, gotta love them when they report every message that has a different opinion then theirs

    where are the 10 men fractals?

    not everything has to be tailored to the need and desires of the whiners, some content may be above them and be "challenging"

  • Cyninja.2954Cyninja.2954 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Astralporing.1957 said:

    @Cyninja.2954 said:

    @Shiyo.3578 said:

    @Ayrilana.1396 said:

    @dodgerrule.8739 said:
    Except that there are no chances for people to learn even in training groups people exclude anyone

    There are which have already been mentioned.

    1) Look for training groups
    2) Create your own
    3) Join one that doesn’t have experience requirements

    This is the only MMO on the planet with """""""""""""Training groups""""""""""""""".

    It's also the MMO with the easiest raids in the entire genre. Training groups are a sick joke and need to stop being suggested.

    Yes, this is also the only MMO on the planet where you can do the entire story, open world and general non challenging regular content by simply pressing 1.

    When you have this casual of a basic approach and 0 practice on how to play your class, then training groups become a necessity.

    Additionally, it's not like in other MMOs players don't train, or don't make training groups. They just don't make training guilds. And that has nothing to do with GW2 difficulty, but a lot with GW2 multiple guilds system. You simply don't create (or join) training guilds when players can only be in one guild at a time. Training groups however aren't so uncommon as @Shiyo.3578 seems to think.

    (in other words, it's not good to make such absolute statements like "the only MMO on the planet with X", if one doesn't really have any idea about the subject)

    Fully agreed.

  • melandru.3876melandru.3876 Member ✭✭✭

    @MUDse.7623 said:
    id prefer they add challanging/rewarding solo content, so that players will improve past the pressing 1 for openworld/story to have an easier time getting into challanging group content.

    they tried that with pof hero points (and some in hot) they can't even solo kill a hero point veteran

    first map, crystal oasis, daily shout-outs for the 3 hero points that you need to score a kill, that alone says it no

    core map (1-80) should have been what pof is open-world wise. hard, and unforgiving. once you get used to it, a walk in the park

  • Shiyo.3578Shiyo.3578 Member ✭✭✭
    edited April 18, 2019

    @Cyninja.2954 said:
    Yes, this is also the only MMO on the planet where you can do the entire story, open world and general non challenging regular content by simply pressing 1.

    When you have this casual of a basic approach and 0 practice on how to play your class, then training groups become a necessity.

    This MMO has the hardest open world on the market atm. Every other MMO I cannot die open world no matter what, it's very easy to die open world in this game.

    It also has the hardest solo story missions. I cannot fail or die in other MMO's solo story but I can easily die in this games against the bosses.

    """""""""""Training groups""""""""""" are absolutely not needed for ANY raid boss in this game. A basic normal human being will learn every bosses mechanics in 2 pulls MAX.

    Notice how there wasn't 5 man dungeon training groups and have never been fractal ones? Training groups are insulting to a normal video game/mmo player.

  • MithranArkanere.8957MithranArkanere.8957 Member ✭✭✭✭

    I would not be against a scaled down 'story mode' for raids that can be played in a smaller party size as easily as the Wintersday raid, and that has symbolic rewards with very tiny chances of getting tradable rewards, but no raid currency, account bound rewards, guild decorations or LI. So players with less skill or time to play the raids can check out the story in-game with their own characters.

    But raids were designed for parties of 10. They have been already sold to players as such. Such a change would have too much of a negative impact. And the reduced party size would basically mean they are no longer raids, but just more dungeons.

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