bluberblasen.9684 Posted April 20, 2019 Share Posted April 20, 2019 Lightning Whip: The range of this skill has been reduced from 300 to 240.WHY ?Sword is melee.why do you NERF Lightning Whip that much ? We do not need a second melee, we already have sword. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Auburner.6945 Posted April 20, 2019 Share Posted April 20, 2019 Too broken, I was already hitting on the 1800 range soulbeast from SM roof. Poor soul, wasn't able to Kit'ten "pew pew pew pew". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emberheart.8426 Posted April 20, 2019 Share Posted April 20, 2019 Sometimes I don't know what they are thinking with these changes. Imo the only rational reason to reduce the range of lightning whip is that convergence is just such a good skill that they have to nerf lightning whip. Like maybe it is instant cast, which means that you can keep using lightning whip during the 1 sec delay. And maybe the damage that it does is very good while also applying fury and weakness. Maybe it has a short cooldown as well. Then a lightning whip range nerf may be somewhat justifiable. I do wish that something along those lines is the truth, but I doubt it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steki.1478 Posted April 20, 2019 Share Posted April 20, 2019 @Ganathar.4956 said:Sometimes I don't know what they are thinking with these changes. Imo the only rational reason to reduce the range of lightning whip is that convergence is just such a good skill that they have to nerf lightning whip. Like maybe it is instant cast, which means that you can keep using lightning whip during the 1 sec delay. And maybe the damage that it does is very good while also applying fury and weakness. Maybe it has a short cooldown as well. Then a lightning whip range nerf may be somewhat justifiable. I do wish that something along those lines is the truth, but I doubt it.I don't expect anything less that 1 second cast time and half second aftercast animation.Gotta keep ele balanced compared to other classes because it has 20 weapon skills. It does damage and gives a boon after all, it's already too strong.../s Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waisenpai.6028 Posted April 22, 2019 Share Posted April 22, 2019 Daggers used to be the DPS aoe hybrid damager for eles guess we can't have that anymore! ;)Great sell for the new spec for next expansion. You'll get a new sub-par weapon that can easily out perform dagger by a fraction. :) Win Win product placement. All ele's will scream they feel OP in theory until facing the other professions in wvw. You can taste the salty tears of contempt from me already, but that's same with sword, they scrap core traitlines and weaken damage before sword was released. Sword was such a sad bunny during beta weekend and it still is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xaylin.1860 Posted April 22, 2019 Share Posted April 22, 2019 They most likely did so to make Dragons Claw the go to 'long' range AA on Dagger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lonewolf Kai.3682 Posted April 22, 2019 Share Posted April 22, 2019 I thought that was what water was, other than healing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Auburner.6945 Posted April 22, 2019 Share Posted April 22, 2019 The patch was more of a nerf. With full healing power gear, healing power as main stat, the healing would go up on so-called buffed skills from 1700 to 2040 for Cone of Cold and 2800 to 3360 for Cleansing Wave, keep in mind that this is max heal power, which is completely useless, so on an actual build, the increase will barely be 50-75% of that, which won't even exceed 600-700 more healing. They calling that a buff.The patch is more of a nerf, Lightning Whip was the bread and butter for auto attacks, now it got a range nerf, and Sword is quite known for threading a needle trying to land a skill. The pierce on Fire aa is useless (138 damage with a 0.375 co-eff.), the damage is low compared to Air's which is 462 (1.62 co-eff.). The only thing that could be called a change is Earth 2, no idea for Earth 3, or Air 2, but it's more of locking ele more into shorter range if it's less than 300 range. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lahmia.2193 Posted April 22, 2019 Share Posted April 22, 2019 It makes no sense. The other range changes are "to make the range a standard multiple of 60" but Lightning whip already is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skyroar.2974 Posted April 22, 2019 Share Posted April 22, 2019 @"Auburner.6945" said:The patch was more of a nerf. With full healing power gear, healing power as main stat, the healing would go up on so-called buffed skills from 1700 to 2040 for Cone of Cold and 2800 to 3360 for Cleansing Wave, keep in mind that this is max heal power, which is completely useless, so on an actual build, the increase will barely be 50-75% of that, which won't even exceed 600-700 more healing. They calling that a buff.The patch is more of a nerf, Lightning Whip was the bread and butter for auto attacks, now it got a range nerf, and Sword is quite known for threading a needle trying to land a skill. The pierce on Fire aa is useless (138 damage with a 0.375 co-eff.), the damage is low compared to Air's which is 462 (1.62 co-eff.). The only thing that could be called a change is Earth 2, no idea for Earth 3, or Air 2, but it's more of locking ele more into shorter range if it's less than 300 range.Correct me if I'm wrong, but "base healing value" should affect all attributes equally, as it modifies the base value of the skill, and not its scaling value (as modified by healing power).Lightning Whip's new range will be consistent with the new #2 air skill, convergence, as both will share the same range. Dragon's Claw also hits 3 times, so it's 414 damage at 400 range vs L.Whip's 462 at 240 range (but does that value take into account both hits, or each one? I don't know that).AAs are slightly nerfed when it comes to tagging enemies, I agree. But if the patch is a nerf or buff is yet to be seen, as it entirely depends on how much damage will be dealt by Earthen Rush and Convergence. We know Ring of Earth got a 27.5% direct damage buff, but we don't know if the new skills will keep their previous (low) damage values or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Auburner.6945 Posted April 23, 2019 Share Posted April 23, 2019 @"DiogoSilva.7089" said:@"Auburner.6945" said:The patch was more of a nerf. With full healing power gear, healing power as main stat, the healing would go up on so-called buffed skills from 1700 to 2040 for Cone of Cold and 2800 to 3360 for Cleansing Wave, keep in mind that this is max heal power, which is completely useless, so on an actual build, the increase will barely be 50-75% of that, which won't even exceed 600-700 more healing. They calling that a buff.The patch is more of a nerf, Lightning Whip was the bread and butter for auto attacks, now it got a range nerf, and Sword is quite known for threading a needle trying to land a skill. The pierce on Fire aa is useless (138 damage with a 0.375 co-eff.), the damage is low compared to Air's which is 462 (1.62 co-eff.). The only thing that could be called a change is Earth 2, no idea for Earth 3, or Air 2, but it's more of locking ele more into shorter range if it's less than 300 range.Correct me if I'm wrong, but "base healing value" should affect all attributes equally, as it modifies the base value of the skill, and not its scaling value (as modified by healing power).Healing Power = Base value + Healing power (stats) * factor on the skill. On both skills, the overall healing increase combined doesn't surpass the 600 mark. Lightning Whip's new range will be consistent with the new #2 air skill, convergence, as both will share the same range. Dragon's Claw also hits 3 times, so it's 414 damage at 400 range vs L.Whip's 462 at 240 range (but does that value take into account both hits, or each one? I don't know that).That's why we should wait and see how Air #2 is going to be, it should replace the nerf. Dragon's Claw is just, not it, when you need to AA, mostly when on many cooldowns.AAs are slightly nerfed when it comes to tagging enemies, I agree. But if the patch is a nerf or buff is yet to be seen, as it entirely depends on how much damage will be dealt by Earthen Rush and Convergence. We know Ring of Earth got a 27.5% direct damage buff, but we don't know if the new skills will keep their previous (low) damage values or not.Agree with that, should wait for the new changes, but for the 20% and the nerf to Lightning Whip, it's more of a nerf from what's known already. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skyroar.2974 Posted April 23, 2019 Share Posted April 23, 2019 @Auburner.6945 said:@"DiogoSilva.7089" said:@Auburner.6945 said:The patch was more of a nerf. With full healing power gear, healing power as main stat, the healing would go up on so-called buffed skills from 1700 to 2040 for Cone of Cold and 2800 to 3360 for Cleansing Wave, keep in mind that this is max heal power, which is completely useless, so on an actual build, the increase will barely be 50-75% of that, which won't even exceed 600-700 more healing. They calling that a buff.The patch is more of a nerf, Lightning Whip was the bread and butter for auto attacks, now it got a range nerf, and Sword is quite known for threading a needle trying to land a skill. The pierce on Fire aa is useless (138 damage with a 0.375 co-eff.), the damage is low compared to Air's which is 462 (1.62 co-eff.). The only thing that could be called a change is Earth 2, no idea for Earth 3, or Air 2, but it's more of locking ele more into shorter range if it's less than 300 range.Correct me if I'm wrong, but "base healing value" should affect all attributes equally, as it modifies the base value of the skill, and not its scaling value (as modified by healing power).Healing Power = Base value + Healing power (stats) * factor on the skill. On both skills, the overall healing increase combined doesn't surpass the 600 mark.That "base value" is what is getting buffed, not the entire formula, looking at the way Anet worded it, so it should have no interaction with healing power at all.Cone of Cold:804 (+ 0.6 scaling) > 965 (+ 0.6 scaling)Cleansing Wave:1,302 (+ 1.0 scaling) > 1,562 (+ 1.0 scaling)Again, if I'm not being mislead by their words, that's only 160 and 260 extra points of healing to all builds, regardless of gear. It's mostly a slight buff to pvp elementalists who don't invest on healing power but still need decent base healing values to survive, without buffing too significantly elementalists who already invest on healing.So a current state pvp mender's tempest (dagger/ focus) or pvp mender's weaver (sword/ dagger) will get very little out of it (+160 and +520 healing respectively), but a hypothetical d/d build with arcana and, say, for example, marauder gear, will get +680 healing out of their water rotation. Not that this alone will suddenly make a build like that viable, but it's a step in that direction. Elementalists currently rely too much on healing power investment to be "good" in pvp, so buffing the base healing value (which affects all builds equally) without buffing the scaling value (which interacts with healing power) makes sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Auburner.6945 Posted April 23, 2019 Share Posted April 23, 2019 @"DiogoSilva.7089" said:@Auburner.6945 said:@"DiogoSilva.7089" said:@Auburner.6945 said:The patch was more of a nerf. With full healing power gear, healing power as main stat, the healing would go up on so-called buffed skills from 1700 to 2040 for Cone of Cold and 2800 to 3360 for Cleansing Wave, keep in mind that this is max heal power, which is completely useless, so on an actual build, the increase will barely be 50-75% of that, which won't even exceed 600-700 more healing. They calling that a buff.The patch is more of a nerf, Lightning Whip was the bread and butter for auto attacks, now it got a range nerf, and Sword is quite known for threading a needle trying to land a skill. The pierce on Fire aa is useless (138 damage with a 0.375 co-eff.), the damage is low compared to Air's which is 462 (1.62 co-eff.). The only thing that could be called a change is Earth 2, no idea for Earth 3, or Air 2, but it's more of locking ele more into shorter range if it's less than 300 range.Correct me if I'm wrong, but "base healing value" should affect all attributes equally, as it modifies the base value of the skill, and not its scaling value (as modified by healing power).Healing Power = Base value + Healing power (stats) * factor on the skill. On both skills, the overall healing increase combined doesn't surpass the 600 mark.That "base value" is what is getting buffed, not the entire formula, looking at the way Anet worded it, so it should have no interaction with healing power at all.Cone of Cold:804 (+ 0.6 scaling) > 965 (+ 0.6 scaling)Cleansing Wave:1,302 (+ 1.0 scaling) > 1,562 (+ 1.0 scaling)Again, if I'm not being mislead by their words, that's only 160 and 260 extra points of healing to all builds, regardless of gear. It's mostly a slight buff to pvp elementalists who don't invest on healing power but still need decent base healing values to survive, without buffing too significantly elementalists who already invest on healing.So a current state pvp mender's tempest (dagger/ focus) or pvp mender's weaver (sword/ dagger) will get very little out of it (+160 and +520 healing respectively), but a hypothetical d/d build with arcana and, say, for example, marauder gear, will get +680 healing out of their water rotation. Not that this alone will suddenly make a build like that viable, but it's a step in that direction. Elementalists currently rely too much on healing power investment to be "good" in pvp, so buffing the base healing value (which affects all builds equally) without buffing the scaling value (which interacts with healing power) makes sense.Not a buff though, not really. Healing for 420 more is nothing, especially when you can interrupt the first, and the second is used for cleansing. Not the change that will cause an amulet swap, or different gear for WvW. The nerf is quite significant though. The only hope is in Earth changes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jski.6180 Posted April 23, 2019 Share Posted April 23, 2019 Its the same animation as before so it will have a false hit hehe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Razor.6392 Posted April 23, 2019 Share Posted April 23, 2019 They murdered main hand dagger ele for no reason lmao BUT HEY FIRE AUTOATTACK CAN NOW PIERCE DOE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cgMatt.5162 Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 This change made the least sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MithranArkanere.8957 Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 The visuals only really matched the collision box on max size norn.Smallest size asura could hit you while it looked like it didn't. Reducing the range must be easier than fixing what makes skill visuals scale to character model. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
juno.1840 Posted May 6, 2019 Share Posted May 6, 2019 Pierce on fire 1 is not that useful because the range is short and the projectiles spread as they travel so less likely to hit one foe with more than one projectile.The only time fire 1 is decent damage is when all three projectiles hit same foe -- so point-blank range. Pierce doesn't make that better in any way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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