Siren's Reef — Guild Wars 2 Forums

Siren's Reef

I don't have a problem with Siren's Reef, but I think the instability Social Awkwardness should be removed for the boss. Similar to slippery slope on Deepstone or Shattered laboratory, Social Awkwardness just makes the Siren's Reef fight artificially difficult. Either that or make the wind AOEless wide because there's just not enough space to stand. If someone gets blown off the fight is usually over. At the T4 level.

Comments

  • Agreed that SA does make the "green circle" mechanic extra difficult. Honestly I'm getting quite sick of Siren's Reef in general. Why does this 5 man dungeon need to be such a PITA?

    ANet, please shrink the size of the ghost spawn circles in the maze, reduce the number and frequency of add spawns during the boss fight, narrow the wind AOEs, enlarge the green circle.

  • Shade.8971Shade.8971 Member ✭✭

    Is it coincidence these threads pop up when SR is the daily with an annoying instability?

  • melandru.3876melandru.3876 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited April 28, 2019

    @Shade.8971 said:
    Is it coincidence these threads pop up when SR is the daily with an annoying instability?

    no, it is a great indicator to show which people have adapted yet, and which don't/can't

    the entire last fight is scripted

    • boss shifting (3 times) are scripted and will alwlays be the same (back, nose, mid that order)
    • adds will allways spawn at the same health % the quartermaster that you want to kill asap will allways spawn on the same side (north)
    • the winds that knock you, will allways spawn in the exact same pattern. so with basic movement you can prevent EVERY wind

    • red circle = bad circle, move to the corner of a ship and drop the flux bomb

    • green circle = good circle, stack together and you take no damage, while doing damage (boss takes no damage, only the adds do)

    it can't be any more clear

    and regarding sa, the circle is big enough to fit 5 players, the issue is players that feel the need to move constantly and push others away, or in winds
    that is not the fractal issue, but bad players stressing and causing more risks then there literally are

  • Zenith.7301Zenith.7301 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @melandru.3876 said:

    @Shade.8971 said:
    Is it coincidence these threads pop up when SR is the daily with an annoying instability?

    no, it is a great indicator to show which people have adapted yet, and which don't/can't

    the entire last fight is scripted

    • boss shifting (3 times) are scripted and will alwlays be the same (back, nose, mid that order)
    • adds will allways spawn at the same health % the quartermaster that you want to kill asap will allways spawn on the same side (north)
    • the winds that knock you, will allways spawn in the exact same pattern. so with basic movement you can prevent EVERY wind

    • red circle = bad circle, move to the corner of a ship and drop the flux bomb

    • green circle = good circle, stack together and you take no damage, while doing damage (boss takes no damage, only the adds do)

    it can't be any more clear

    and regarding sa, the circle is big enough to fit 5 players, the issue is players that feel the need to move constantly and push others away, or in winds
    that is not the fractal issue, but bad players stressing and causing more risks then there literally are

    SR is only "problematic" because it's a clear case of where bad DPS can wipe you. The fight is just significantly different when you can just pull and cleave down a boss compared to when your DPS is bad enough that you actually need to clean up add waves.

    The adds essentially serve as a soft enrage because at some point the chill stacking on the group adds up and gets people knocked off by winds when they run out of dodges while permachilled, and that's when the group starts falling apart.

    I can still say I have to lecture most groups about killing the quartermasters. Even groups that do CM's without any issue but somehow struggle with this last boss because they refuse to adapt utilities as well for reflection/condi cleanse.

    The only fix that needs to happen is for stability to actually work against the wind pushbacks.

  • @Zenith.7301 said:

    @melandru.3876 said:

    @Shade.8971 said:
    Is it coincidence these threads pop up when SR is the daily with an annoying instability?

    no, it is a great indicator to show which people have adapted yet, and which don't/can't

    the entire last fight is scripted

    • boss shifting (3 times) are scripted and will alwlays be the same (back, nose, mid that order)
    • adds will allways spawn at the same health % the quartermaster that you want to kill asap will allways spawn on the same side (north)
    • the winds that knock you, will allways spawn in the exact same pattern. so with basic movement you can prevent EVERY wind

    • red circle = bad circle, move to the corner of a ship and drop the flux bomb

    • green circle = good circle, stack together and you take no damage, while doing damage (boss takes no damage, only the adds do)

    it can't be any more clear

    and regarding sa, the circle is big enough to fit 5 players, the issue is players that feel the need to move constantly and push others away, or in winds
    that is not the fractal issue, but bad players stressing and causing more risks then there literally are

    SR is only "problematic" because it's a clear case of where bad DPS can wipe you. The fight is just significantly different when you can just pull and cleave down a boss compared to when your DPS is bad enough that you actually need to clean up add waves.

    The adds essentially serve as a soft enrage because at some point the chill stacking on the group adds up and gets people knocked off by winds when they run out of dodges while permachilled, and that's when the group starts falling apart.

    I can still say I have to lecture most groups about killing the quartermasters. Even groups that do CM's without any issue but somehow struggle with this last boss because they refuse to adapt utilities as well for reflection/condi cleanse.

    The only fix that needs to happen is for stability to actually work against the wind pushbacks.

    Yeah if stab at least worked for the wind pushbacks. That would be nice.

  • Zenith.7301Zenith.7301 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @MisterDapper.5984 said:

    @Zenith.7301 said:

    @melandru.3876 said:

    @Shade.8971 said:
    Is it coincidence these threads pop up when SR is the daily with an annoying instability?

    no, it is a great indicator to show which people have adapted yet, and which don't/can't

    the entire last fight is scripted

    • boss shifting (3 times) are scripted and will alwlays be the same (back, nose, mid that order)
    • adds will allways spawn at the same health % the quartermaster that you want to kill asap will allways spawn on the same side (north)
    • the winds that knock you, will allways spawn in the exact same pattern. so with basic movement you can prevent EVERY wind

    • red circle = bad circle, move to the corner of a ship and drop the flux bomb

    • green circle = good circle, stack together and you take no damage, while doing damage (boss takes no damage, only the adds do)

    it can't be any more clear

    and regarding sa, the circle is big enough to fit 5 players, the issue is players that feel the need to move constantly and push others away, or in winds
    that is not the fractal issue, but bad players stressing and causing more risks then there literally are

    SR is only "problematic" because it's a clear case of where bad DPS can wipe you. The fight is just significantly different when you can just pull and cleave down a boss compared to when your DPS is bad enough that you actually need to clean up add waves.

    The adds essentially serve as a soft enrage because at some point the chill stacking on the group adds up and gets people knocked off by winds when they run out of dodges while permachilled, and that's when the group starts falling apart.

    I can still say I have to lecture most groups about killing the quartermasters. Even groups that do CM's without any issue but somehow struggle with this last boss because they refuse to adapt utilities as well for reflection/condi cleanse.

    The only fix that needs to happen is for stability to actually work against the wind pushbacks.

    Yeah if stab at least worked for the wind pushbacks. That would be nice.

    Plus, the point I made about DPS, if they're slow enough to warrant cleaning mobs after every quartermaster, the group will likely get overwhelmed anyways.

    It's funny that the one fractal that's not a CM has a way closer DPS check than any of the CM's.

    Siren's Reef took a page from Deepstone as well, if adds are not dealt with or group DPS is not good enough, the fight gets significantly more unpleasant.

    By comparison, Twilight Oasis is a significantly better designed fractal with interesting boss mechanics that don't amount to DPS checks. So is Artsariv for that matter.

  • phs.6089phs.6089 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited April 30, 2019

    There is no DPS check. People struggle cus woa, suddenly(!!!!) you gotta pay attention to trash(this includes your party gets proper utilites to pull, boon reap) Too much work! Just focus boss! If you wipe, blame healer. One of this times it's gonna work.

    "There is always a lighthouse, there's always a man, there's always a city."

  • Eramonster.2718Eramonster.2718 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited April 30, 2019

    Have to admit the standard set to complete SR is high. Not impossible to complete but it require the players to know the mechanics. Eg. Players might get other fractals done with no/less experience but SR can prove to be a challenge. With certain instability as OP mentioned will set the bar higher. Even simple instability eg. Sugar Rush will speed up the Eye Traps and the Wind's tempo.

    To be fair, it's a pain dealing S.Awkwardness with any space constrained scenario(or majority/full melee in group). Can't stress how important not to get blown off the ship for the final part.

    Following that, SR T4 have 3 instabilities at play :lol:huzzah. The mobs spawned doesn't reset according to the Bosses set either, unlike its lower tiers (a feature?). Easier to just /gg after Crowe spawned than to deal with the mobs carried forward from her previous 4 cannon pre-event. Just need to deal with 5 minnions + Crowe after the reset, with no/less minnion to deal with till her first teleport.

    Edit : typos.

  • melandru.3876melandru.3876 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited April 30, 2019

    @Zenith.7301 said:

    @melandru.3876 said:

    @Shade.8971 said:
    Is it coincidence these threads pop up when SR is the daily with an annoying instability?

    no, it is a great indicator to show which people have adapted yet, and which don't/can't

    the entire last fight is scripted

    • boss shifting (3 times) are scripted and will alwlays be the same (back, nose, mid that order)
    • adds will allways spawn at the same health % the quartermaster that you want to kill asap will allways spawn on the same side (north)
    • the winds that knock you, will allways spawn in the exact same pattern. so with basic movement you can prevent EVERY wind

    • red circle = bad circle, move to the corner of a ship and drop the flux bomb

    • green circle = good circle, stack together and you take no damage, while doing damage (boss takes no damage, only the adds do)

    it can't be any more clear

    when your DPS is bad

    because they refuse to adapt utilities as well for reflection/condi cleanse.

    there i deleted all but the crucial in your post

    that's the result of meta-cattle. they see 1 build, they copy it (without mastering it) and they swear by it
    they refuse to make the sligtiest change as it "might" affect their max dps which they will never reach anyway, have you ever reached 33k dps in fractals? i haven't

    they prefer wiping, and complaining over improving.

  • Eramonster.2718Eramonster.2718 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited April 30, 2019

    @MisterDapper.5984 said:
    Yeah if stab at least worked for the wind pushbacks. That would be nice.

    Will help, but there's also a chance for an unfortunate event where the boon falls off and get blown off the ship :tongue:. Another nice addition I could think of is to give important AoE warning grounds a more distinguished colour. Had this experience of Skyhammer from Instability: Mists Convergence aimed on the ship. It had all other warning overwritten with its bright orange. The game needs more colour palette with it's visual warning. Not a solution but playing with Post Processing Low helps(there's only None, Low and High).
    Eg. Spellbreakers - Winds of Disenchantment will be transparent with "None", lightly toned with "Low", Solid with chance to block visuals with "High".

  • Zenith.7301Zenith.7301 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @phs.6089 said:
    There is no DPS check. People struggle cus woa, suddenly(!!!!) you gotta pay attention to trash(this includes your party gets proper utilites to pull, boon reap) Too much work! Just focus boss! If you wipe, blame healer. One of this times it's gonna work.

    I'm usually healer rev, so this hit close to home. People don't CC, facetank kitten they shouldn't during boon overload/frailty weeks, blame the healer.

    Warrior wasn't doing CC properly and then they turn to me and have the nerve to ask me as the rev to go beyond my staff 5 and use up all my energy as well for the ventari ult even though I'm not swapping legends yet or using the CC warband which guts Soulcleave uptime and eats into the limited energy I already have to both heal and give might and alacrity.

    More like, why don't you swap out your utilities, the ones you can customize and don't get a preset of that compose the majority of your healing/boon throughput, unlike revenant?

  • CptAurellian.9537CptAurellian.9537 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Zenith.7301 said:
    Plus, the point I made about DPS, if they're slow enough to warrant cleaning mobs after every quartermaster, the group will likely get overwhelmed anyways.

    It's funny that the one fractal that's not a CM has a way closer DPS check than any of the CM's.

    There is no real dps check at Crowe. If you don't have the dps or utility to kill her without taking care of the adds, just kill the adds. They spawn every 10% boss HP.

    Back to topic: I agree that SA should be disabled for this fractal. It's not as deadly as other kitten has been, but the combination of SA and the winds is something where others can (and usually will) screw you up even if you made no mistake on your own. Bad design.

    R.I.P. Build Templates, 15.10.2019

  • Turkeyspit.3965Turkeyspit.3965 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @MisterDapper.5984 said:
    Social Awkwardness just makes the Siren's Reef fight artificially difficult.

    Given that's the entire point of instabilities, I'd suggest your post does more to support rather than denounce the existence of SA in Siren's Reef.

    Crowe is just like Subject 6 - deliberate strategy is what is required for success rather than just brute force key smashing.

    Coincidentally the majority of groups that abandon TR do so at Subject 6, so I think we have a correlation.

  • @CptAurellian.9537 said:
    I agree that SA should be disabled for this fractal. It's not as deadly as other kitten has been, but the combination of SA and the winds is something where others can (and usually will) screw you up even if you made no mistake on your own. Bad design.

    @Turkeyspit.3965 said:

    @MisterDapper.5984 said:
    Social Awkwardness just makes the Siren's Reef fight artificially difficult.

    Given that's the entire point of instabilities, I'd suggest your post does more to support rather than denounce the existence of SA in Siren's Reef.

    Crowe is just like Subject 6 - deliberate strategy is what is required for success rather than just brute force key smashing.

    Coincidentally the majority of groups that abandon TR do so at Subject 6, so I think we have a correlation.

    I agree with @Turkeyspit.3965: part of the point of instabilities is to increase the difficulty so that strategy is sometimes important. I disagree with @CptAurellian.9537: fractals should sometimes be more than 5 people doing their own thing.
    Neither Subject 6 nor Captain Crowe are really that challenging, as long as people understand the mechanics. In both cases, high-enough DPS allows the team to ignore lots of the mechanics. For those teams with less (i.e. a lot of PUG teams), slow and steady gets the job done as long as everyone focuses on the high-risk targets. For S6, it's the veteran oozes (ideally with some sort of cleave to also get the baby oozes); for Crowe, it's the Elite Quartermaster.

    Hype is the path to the dark side. Hype leads to unfulfilled expectations. Disappointment leads to anger. Anger leads to disgust. Disgust leads to "oh, new shinies! I'm back!"

  • Turkeyspit.3965Turkeyspit.3965 Member ✭✭✭✭

    While only tangentially relevant, both Crowe and Subject 6 remind me of a boss from WoW's early days, Vexallus. (https://www.wowhead.com/npc=24744/vexallus)

    Longtime WoW vets may remember that heroic dungeon, which at the time was very brutal. This boss in particular required the 5 man group to throttle, and sometimes even completely stop DPS, in order to successfully defeat him. So many pugs I played with would ignore my suggestions, and just went full faceroll key smashing only to rapidly wipe. Usually after 2-3 wipes I would coyly ask if now we could do it "my way", which resulted in an easy boss kill. Many pugs would tell me that was the first time they had ever gotten past him. /shrug

  • melandru.3876melandru.3876 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Turkeyspit.3965 said:

    @MisterDapper.5984 said:
    Social Awkwardness just makes the Siren's Reef fight artificially difficult.

    Given that's the entire point of instabilities, I'd suggest your post does more to support rather than denounce the existence of SA in Siren's Reef.

    Crowe is just like Subject 6 - deliberate strategy is what is required for success rather than just brute force key smashing.

    Coincidentally the majority of groups that abandon TR do so at Subject 6, so I think we have a correlation.

    "cc after block, then burst"

    reaper opens with shroud 5

    there goes the burst :p

  • Zenith.7301Zenith.7301 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @CptAurellian.9537 said:

    @Zenith.7301 said:
    Plus, the point I made about DPS, if they're slow enough to warrant cleaning mobs after every quartermaster, the group will likely get overwhelmed anyways.

    It's funny that the one fractal that's not a CM has a way closer DPS check than any of the CM's.

    There is no real dps check at Crowe. If you don't have the dps or utility to kill her without taking care of the adds, just kill the adds. They spawn every 10% boss HP.

    Back to topic: I agree that SA should be disabled for this fractal. It's not as deadly as other kitten has been, but the combination of SA and the winds is something where others can (and usually will) screw you up even if you made no mistake on your own. Bad design.

    If the group is even having trouble focusing the captain down alongside a pulled elite, what makes you think they will have the coordination and awareness to wait 10% hp on the boss and kill adds diligently instead of spawning too many adds that will wipe them anyways?

  • Miellyn.6847Miellyn.6847 Member ✭✭✭

    @MisterDapper.5984 said:

    @Zenith.7301 said:

    @melandru.3876 said:

    @Shade.8971 said:
    Is it coincidence these threads pop up when SR is the daily with an annoying instability?

    no, it is a great indicator to show which people have adapted yet, and which don't/can't

    the entire last fight is scripted

    • boss shifting (3 times) are scripted and will alwlays be the same (back, nose, mid that order)
    • adds will allways spawn at the same health % the quartermaster that you want to kill asap will allways spawn on the same side (north)
    • the winds that knock you, will allways spawn in the exact same pattern. so with basic movement you can prevent EVERY wind

    • red circle = bad circle, move to the corner of a ship and drop the flux bomb

    • green circle = good circle, stack together and you take no damage, while doing damage (boss takes no damage, only the adds do)

    it can't be any more clear

    and regarding sa, the circle is big enough to fit 5 players, the issue is players that feel the need to move constantly and push others away, or in winds
    that is not the fractal issue, but bad players stressing and causing more risks then there literally are

    SR is only "problematic" because it's a clear case of where bad DPS can wipe you. The fight is just significantly different when you can just pull and cleave down a boss compared to when your DPS is bad enough that you actually need to clean up add waves.

    The adds essentially serve as a soft enrage because at some point the chill stacking on the group adds up and gets people knocked off by winds when they run out of dodges while permachilled, and that's when the group starts falling apart.

    I can still say I have to lecture most groups about killing the quartermasters. Even groups that do CM's without any issue but somehow struggle with this last boss because they refuse to adapt utilities as well for reflection/condi cleanse.

    The only fix that needs to happen is for stability to actually work against the wind pushbacks.

    Yeah if stab at least worked for the wind pushbacks. That would be nice.

    No.
    People need to learn that not everything can be compensated by support and some things need to be done correctly in order to succeed. People just need to watch their positioning and by attention to their surrounding.

  • Zenith.7301Zenith.7301 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 2, 2019

    @Miellyn.6847 said:

    @MisterDapper.5984 said:

    @Zenith.7301 said:

    @melandru.3876 said:

    @Shade.8971 said:
    Is it coincidence these threads pop up when SR is the daily with an annoying instability?

    no, it is a great indicator to show which people have adapted yet, and which don't/can't

    the entire last fight is scripted

    • boss shifting (3 times) are scripted and will alwlays be the same (back, nose, mid that order)
    • adds will allways spawn at the same health % the quartermaster that you want to kill asap will allways spawn on the same side (north)
    • the winds that knock you, will allways spawn in the exact same pattern. so with basic movement you can prevent EVERY wind

    • red circle = bad circle, move to the corner of a ship and drop the flux bomb

    • green circle = good circle, stack together and you take no damage, while doing damage (boss takes no damage, only the adds do)

    it can't be any more clear

    and regarding sa, the circle is big enough to fit 5 players, the issue is players that feel the need to move constantly and push others away, or in winds
    that is not the fractal issue, but bad players stressing and causing more risks then there literally are

    SR is only "problematic" because it's a clear case of where bad DPS can wipe you. The fight is just significantly different when you can just pull and cleave down a boss compared to when your DPS is bad enough that you actually need to clean up add waves.

    The adds essentially serve as a soft enrage because at some point the chill stacking on the group adds up and gets people knocked off by winds when they run out of dodges while permachilled, and that's when the group starts falling apart.

    I can still say I have to lecture most groups about killing the quartermasters. Even groups that do CM's without any issue but somehow struggle with this last boss because they refuse to adapt utilities as well for reflection/condi cleanse.

    The only fix that needs to happen is for stability to actually work against the wind pushbacks.

    Yeah if stab at least worked for the wind pushbacks. That would be nice.

    No.
    People need to learn that not everything can be compensated by support and some things need to be done correctly in order to succeed. People just need to watch their positioning and by attention to their surrounding.

    This is a matter of consistency. It's pretty dumb to have exceptions to the rule. Either stability applies to all CC or it does not. There's no reason why stability should work on MAMA CM, Skorvald, Ensolyss, and Artsariv (you know, the freaking CHALLENGE MOTES) but it's totally not okay for it to work on Siren's Reef.

  • Miellyn.6847Miellyn.6847 Member ✭✭✭
    edited May 2, 2019

    @Zenith.7301 said:

    @Miellyn.6847 said:

    @MisterDapper.5984 said:

    @Zenith.7301 said:

    @melandru.3876 said:

    @Shade.8971 said:
    Is it coincidence these threads pop up when SR is the daily with an annoying instability?

    no, it is a great indicator to show which people have adapted yet, and which don't/can't

    the entire last fight is scripted

    • boss shifting (3 times) are scripted and will alwlays be the same (back, nose, mid that order)
    • adds will allways spawn at the same health % the quartermaster that you want to kill asap will allways spawn on the same side (north)
    • the winds that knock you, will allways spawn in the exact same pattern. so with basic movement you can prevent EVERY wind

    • red circle = bad circle, move to the corner of a ship and drop the flux bomb

    • green circle = good circle, stack together and you take no damage, while doing damage (boss takes no damage, only the adds do)

    it can't be any more clear

    and regarding sa, the circle is big enough to fit 5 players, the issue is players that feel the need to move constantly and push others away, or in winds
    that is not the fractal issue, but bad players stressing and causing more risks then there literally are

    SR is only "problematic" because it's a clear case of where bad DPS can wipe you. The fight is just significantly different when you can just pull and cleave down a boss compared to when your DPS is bad enough that you actually need to clean up add waves.

    The adds essentially serve as a soft enrage because at some point the chill stacking on the group adds up and gets people knocked off by winds when they run out of dodges while permachilled, and that's when the group starts falling apart.

    I can still say I have to lecture most groups about killing the quartermasters. Even groups that do CM's without any issue but somehow struggle with this last boss because they refuse to adapt utilities as well for reflection/condi cleanse.

    The only fix that needs to happen is for stability to actually work against the wind pushbacks.

    Yeah if stab at least worked for the wind pushbacks. That would be nice.

    No.
    People need to learn that not everything can be compensated by support and some things need to be done correctly in order to succeed. People just need to watch their positioning and by attention to their surrounding.

    This is a matter of consistency. It's pretty dumb to have exceptions to the rule. Either stability applies to all CC or it does not. There's no reason why stability should work on MAMA CM, Skorvald, Ensolyss, and Artsariv (you know, the freaking CHALLENGE MOTES) but it's totally not okay for it to work on Siren's Reef.

    It is consistent. Stability only works against CC that prevents using your abilities. The push doesn't stop any ability from functioning.

  • melandru.3876melandru.3876 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 2, 2019

    @Zenith.7301 said:

    @Miellyn.6847 said:

    @MisterDapper.5984 said:

    @Zenith.7301 said:

    @melandru.3876 said:

    @Shade.8971 said:
    Is it coincidence these threads pop up when SR is the daily with an annoying instability?

    no, it is a great indicator to show which people have adapted yet, and which don't/can't

    the entire last fight is scripted

    • boss shifting (3 times) are scripted and will alwlays be the same (back, nose, mid that order)
    • adds will allways spawn at the same health % the quartermaster that you want to kill asap will allways spawn on the same side (north)
    • the winds that knock you, will allways spawn in the exact same pattern. so with basic movement you can prevent EVERY wind

    • red circle = bad circle, move to the corner of a ship and drop the flux bomb

    • green circle = good circle, stack together and you take no damage, while doing damage (boss takes no damage, only the adds do)

    it can't be any more clear

    and regarding sa, the circle is big enough to fit 5 players, the issue is players that feel the need to move constantly and push others away, or in winds
    that is not the fractal issue, but bad players stressing and causing more risks then there literally are

    SR is only "problematic" because it's a clear case of where bad DPS can wipe you. The fight is just significantly different when you can just pull and cleave down a boss compared to when your DPS is bad enough that you actually need to clean up add waves.

    The adds essentially serve as a soft enrage because at some point the chill stacking on the group adds up and gets people knocked off by winds when they run out of dodges while permachilled, and that's when the group starts falling apart.

    I can still say I have to lecture most groups about killing the quartermasters. Even groups that do CM's without any issue but somehow struggle with this last boss because they refuse to adapt utilities as well for reflection/condi cleanse.

    The only fix that needs to happen is for stability to actually work against the wind pushbacks.

    Yeah if stab at least worked for the wind pushbacks. That would be nice.

    No.
    People need to learn that not everything can be compensated by support and some things need to be done correctly in order to succeed. People just need to watch their positioning and by attention to their surrounding.

    This is a matter of consistency. It's pretty dumb to have exceptions to the rule. Either stability applies to all CC or it does not. There's no reason why stability should work on MAMA CM, Skorvald, Ensolyss, and Artsariv (you know, the freaking CHALLENGE MOTES) but it's totally not okay for it to work on Siren's Reef.

    the wind is not a cc effect, so why would stability affect it?
    if you got blown off (everyone has at some point) you would have noticed that you can still use skills

    if you can still use skills, it means you are not disabled in any way

    if you are not disabled, there was nothing stability would have done to prevent it

    remember that other guy saying "People just need to watch their positioning and by attention to their surrounding."
    you did not pay enough attention

  • Turkeyspit.3965Turkeyspit.3965 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Zenith.7301 said:

    @CptAurellian.9537 said:

    @Zenith.7301 said:
    Plus, the point I made about DPS, if they're slow enough to warrant cleaning mobs after every quartermaster, the group will likely get overwhelmed anyways.

    It's funny that the one fractal that's not a CM has a way closer DPS check than any of the CM's.

    There is no real dps check at Crowe. If you don't have the dps or utility to kill her without taking care of the adds, just kill the adds. They spawn every 10% boss HP.

    Back to topic: I agree that SA should be disabled for this fractal. It's not as deadly as other kitten has been, but the combination of SA and the winds is something where others can (and usually will) screw you up even if you made no mistake on your own. Bad design.

    If the group is even having trouble focusing the captain down alongside a pulled elite, what makes you think they will have the coordination and awareness to wait 10% hp on the boss and kill adds diligently instead of spawning too many adds that will wipe them anyways?

    If the group is even having trouble focusing the captain down alongside a pulled elite, then what are they doing in T4 content?

  • Zenith.7301Zenith.7301 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 2, 2019

    @melandru.3876 said:

    @Zenith.7301 said:

    @Miellyn.6847 said:

    @MisterDapper.5984 said:

    @Zenith.7301 said:

    @melandru.3876 said:

    @Shade.8971 said:
    Is it coincidence these threads pop up when SR is the daily with an annoying instability?

    no, it is a great indicator to show which people have adapted yet, and which don't/can't

    the entire last fight is scripted

    • boss shifting (3 times) are scripted and will alwlays be the same (back, nose, mid that order)
    • adds will allways spawn at the same health % the quartermaster that you want to kill asap will allways spawn on the same side (north)
    • the winds that knock you, will allways spawn in the exact same pattern. so with basic movement you can prevent EVERY wind

    • red circle = bad circle, move to the corner of a ship and drop the flux bomb

    • green circle = good circle, stack together and you take no damage, while doing damage (boss takes no damage, only the adds do)

    it can't be any more clear

    and regarding sa, the circle is big enough to fit 5 players, the issue is players that feel the need to move constantly and push others away, or in winds
    that is not the fractal issue, but bad players stressing and causing more risks then there literally are

    SR is only "problematic" because it's a clear case of where bad DPS can wipe you. The fight is just significantly different when you can just pull and cleave down a boss compared to when your DPS is bad enough that you actually need to clean up add waves.

    The adds essentially serve as a soft enrage because at some point the chill stacking on the group adds up and gets people knocked off by winds when they run out of dodges while permachilled, and that's when the group starts falling apart.

    I can still say I have to lecture most groups about killing the quartermasters. Even groups that do CM's without any issue but somehow struggle with this last boss because they refuse to adapt utilities as well for reflection/condi cleanse.

    The only fix that needs to happen is for stability to actually work against the wind pushbacks.

    Yeah if stab at least worked for the wind pushbacks. That would be nice.

    No.
    People need to learn that not everything can be compensated by support and some things need to be done correctly in order to succeed. People just need to watch their positioning and by attention to their surrounding.

    This is a matter of consistency. It's pretty dumb to have exceptions to the rule. Either stability applies to all CC or it does not. There's no reason why stability should work on MAMA CM, Skorvald, Ensolyss, and Artsariv (you know, the freaking CHALLENGE MOTES) but it's totally not okay for it to work on Siren's Reef.

    the wind is not a cc effect, so why would stability affect it?
    if you got blown off (everyone has at some point) you would have noticed that you can still use skills

    if you can still use skills, it means you are not disabled in any way

    if you are not disabled, there was nothing stability would have done to prevent it

    remember that other guy saying "People just need to watch their positioning and by attention to their surrounding."
    you did not pay enough attention

    Or, when I got blown off with stability on it was because I thought it would work? Spare me the crappy condescension as if sidestepping some linear column made you particularly skilled in this game.

    People don't use stability in Artsariv or Skorvald or MAMA because they can't dodge the CC. They use it so their DPS skyrockets from not having to interrupt their burst to dodge the thing to begin with. It's part of using your toolset intelligently just as aegis has been used.

    But somehow using a less frequently available boon which you press a button for compared to pressing a button for more frequently available dodges makes some posters think they are superior players. Next you'll tell me condition cleanses or resistance are unnecessary because you should dodge them, too.

  • Miellyn.6847Miellyn.6847 Member ✭✭✭

    @Zenith.7301 said:

    @melandru.3876 said:

    @Zenith.7301 said:

    @Miellyn.6847 said:

    @MisterDapper.5984 said:

    @Zenith.7301 said:

    @melandru.3876 said:

    @Shade.8971 said:
    Is it coincidence these threads pop up when SR is the daily with an annoying instability?

    no, it is a great indicator to show which people have adapted yet, and which don't/can't

    the entire last fight is scripted

    • boss shifting (3 times) are scripted and will alwlays be the same (back, nose, mid that order)
    • adds will allways spawn at the same health % the quartermaster that you want to kill asap will allways spawn on the same side (north)
    • the winds that knock you, will allways spawn in the exact same pattern. so with basic movement you can prevent EVERY wind

    • red circle = bad circle, move to the corner of a ship and drop the flux bomb

    • green circle = good circle, stack together and you take no damage, while doing damage (boss takes no damage, only the adds do)

    it can't be any more clear

    and regarding sa, the circle is big enough to fit 5 players, the issue is players that feel the need to move constantly and push others away, or in winds
    that is not the fractal issue, but bad players stressing and causing more risks then there literally are

    SR is only "problematic" because it's a clear case of where bad DPS can wipe you. The fight is just significantly different when you can just pull and cleave down a boss compared to when your DPS is bad enough that you actually need to clean up add waves.

    The adds essentially serve as a soft enrage because at some point the chill stacking on the group adds up and gets people knocked off by winds when they run out of dodges while permachilled, and that's when the group starts falling apart.

    I can still say I have to lecture most groups about killing the quartermasters. Even groups that do CM's without any issue but somehow struggle with this last boss because they refuse to adapt utilities as well for reflection/condi cleanse.

    The only fix that needs to happen is for stability to actually work against the wind pushbacks.

    Yeah if stab at least worked for the wind pushbacks. That would be nice.

    No.
    People need to learn that not everything can be compensated by support and some things need to be done correctly in order to succeed. People just need to watch their positioning and by attention to their surrounding.

    This is a matter of consistency. It's pretty dumb to have exceptions to the rule. Either stability applies to all CC or it does not. There's no reason why stability should work on MAMA CM, Skorvald, Ensolyss, and Artsariv (you know, the freaking CHALLENGE MOTES) but it's totally not okay for it to work on Siren's Reef.

    the wind is not a cc effect, so why would stability affect it?
    if you got blown off (everyone has at some point) you would have noticed that you can still use skills

    if you can still use skills, it means you are not disabled in any way

    if you are not disabled, there was nothing stability would have done to prevent it

    remember that other guy saying "People just need to watch their positioning and by attention to their surrounding."
    you did not pay enough attention

    Or, when I got blown off with stability on it was because I thought it would work? Spare me the crappy condescension as if sidestepping some linear column made you particularly skilled in this game.

    It does not work on the whirlwind attacks at Sandbanners, Istan, Dhuum and not the winds in Deepstone. And you seriously thought it will work there?
    Knowing when skills work with examples from previous encounters are part of gaming skills.

    People don't use stability in Artsariv or Skorvald or MAMA because they can't dodge the CC. They use it so their DPS skyrockets from not having to interrupt their burst to dodge the thing to begin with. It's part of using your toolset intelligently just as aegis has been used.

    Yes. Using it intelligently also implies that you know when it works and when not. It never worked for all CC but things that prevent ability usage. It was completely obvious it won't work on the winds.

    But somehow using a less frequently available boon which you press a button for compared to pressing a button for more frequently available dodges makes some posters think they are superior players. Next you'll tell me condition cleanses or resistance are unnecessary because you should dodge them, too.

    You can sidestep them if you pay attention. Yes that is superior to dodging or trusting your support that he will carry you. You lose nothing with sidestepping.

  • melandru.3876melandru.3876 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Zenith.7301 said:

    @melandru.3876 said:

    @Zenith.7301 said:

    @Miellyn.6847 said:

    @MisterDapper.5984 said:

    @Zenith.7301 said:

    @melandru.3876 said:

    @Shade.8971 said:
    Is it coincidence these threads pop up when SR is the daily with an annoying instability?

    no, it is a great indicator to show which people have adapted yet, and which don't/can't

    the entire last fight is scripted

    • boss shifting (3 times) are scripted and will alwlays be the same (back, nose, mid that order)
    • adds will allways spawn at the same health % the quartermaster that you want to kill asap will allways spawn on the same side (north)
    • the winds that knock you, will allways spawn in the exact same pattern. so with basic movement you can prevent EVERY wind

    • red circle = bad circle, move to the corner of a ship and drop the flux bomb

    • green circle = good circle, stack together and you take no damage, while doing damage (boss takes no damage, only the adds do)

    it can't be any more clear

    and regarding sa, the circle is big enough to fit 5 players, the issue is players that feel the need to move constantly and push others away, or in winds
    that is not the fractal issue, but bad players stressing and causing more risks then there literally are

    SR is only "problematic" because it's a clear case of where bad DPS can wipe you. The fight is just significantly different when you can just pull and cleave down a boss compared to when your DPS is bad enough that you actually need to clean up add waves.

    The adds essentially serve as a soft enrage because at some point the chill stacking on the group adds up and gets people knocked off by winds when they run out of dodges while permachilled, and that's when the group starts falling apart.

    I can still say I have to lecture most groups about killing the quartermasters. Even groups that do CM's without any issue but somehow struggle with this last boss because they refuse to adapt utilities as well for reflection/condi cleanse.

    The only fix that needs to happen is for stability to actually work against the wind pushbacks.

    Yeah if stab at least worked for the wind pushbacks. That would be nice.

    No.
    People need to learn that not everything can be compensated by support and some things need to be done correctly in order to succeed. People just need to watch their positioning and by attention to their surrounding.

    This is a matter of consistency. It's pretty dumb to have exceptions to the rule. Either stability applies to all CC or it does not. There's no reason why stability should work on MAMA CM, Skorvald, Ensolyss, and Artsariv (you know, the freaking CHALLENGE MOTES) but it's totally not okay for it to work on Siren's Reef.

    the wind is not a cc effect, so why would stability affect it?
    if you got blown off (everyone has at some point) you would have noticed that you can still use skills

    if you can still use skills, it means you are not disabled in any way

    if you are not disabled, there was nothing stability would have done to prevent it

    remember that other guy saying "People just need to watch their positioning and by attention to their surrounding."
    you did not pay enough attention

    Or, when I got blown off with stability on it was because I thought it would work? Spare me the crappy condescension as if sidestepping some linear column made you particularly skilled in this game.

    People don't use stability in Artsariv or Skorvald or MAMA because they can't dodge the CC. They use it so their DPS skyrockets from not having to interrupt their burst to dodge the thing to begin with. It's part of using your toolset intelligently just as aegis has been used.

    But somehow using a less frequently available boon which you press a button for compared to pressing a button for more frequently available dodges makes some posters think they are superior players. Next you'll tell me condition cleanses or resistance are unnecessary because you should dodge them, too.

    why the salt?
    you were wrong, and you were corrected

    congratz a free tutotial for you

  • Zenith.7301Zenith.7301 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 3, 2019

    @melandru.3876 said:

    @Zenith.7301 said:

    @melandru.3876 said:

    @Zenith.7301 said:

    @Miellyn.6847 said:

    @MisterDapper.5984 said:

    @Zenith.7301 said:

    @melandru.3876 said:

    @Shade.8971 said:
    Is it coincidence these threads pop up when SR is the daily with an annoying instability?

    no, it is a great indicator to show which people have adapted yet, and which don't/can't

    the entire last fight is scripted

    • boss shifting (3 times) are scripted and will alwlays be the same (back, nose, mid that order)
    • adds will allways spawn at the same health % the quartermaster that you want to kill asap will allways spawn on the same side (north)
    • the winds that knock you, will allways spawn in the exact same pattern. so with basic movement you can prevent EVERY wind

    • red circle = bad circle, move to the corner of a ship and drop the flux bomb

    • green circle = good circle, stack together and you take no damage, while doing damage (boss takes no damage, only the adds do)

    it can't be any more clear

    and regarding sa, the circle is big enough to fit 5 players, the issue is players that feel the need to move constantly and push others away, or in winds
    that is not the fractal issue, but bad players stressing and causing more risks then there literally are

    SR is only "problematic" because it's a clear case of where bad DPS can wipe you. The fight is just significantly different when you can just pull and cleave down a boss compared to when your DPS is bad enough that you actually need to clean up add waves.

    The adds essentially serve as a soft enrage because at some point the chill stacking on the group adds up and gets people knocked off by winds when they run out of dodges while permachilled, and that's when the group starts falling apart.

    I can still say I have to lecture most groups about killing the quartermasters. Even groups that do CM's without any issue but somehow struggle with this last boss because they refuse to adapt utilities as well for reflection/condi cleanse.

    The only fix that needs to happen is for stability to actually work against the wind pushbacks.

    Yeah if stab at least worked for the wind pushbacks. That would be nice.

    No.
    People need to learn that not everything can be compensated by support and some things need to be done correctly in order to succeed. People just need to watch their positioning and by attention to their surrounding.

    This is a matter of consistency. It's pretty dumb to have exceptions to the rule. Either stability applies to all CC or it does not. There's no reason why stability should work on MAMA CM, Skorvald, Ensolyss, and Artsariv (you know, the freaking CHALLENGE MOTES) but it's totally not okay for it to work on Siren's Reef.

    the wind is not a cc effect, so why would stability affect it?
    if you got blown off (everyone has at some point) you would have noticed that you can still use skills

    if you can still use skills, it means you are not disabled in any way

    if you are not disabled, there was nothing stability would have done to prevent it

    remember that other guy saying "People just need to watch their positioning and by attention to their surrounding."
    you did not pay enough attention

    Or, when I got blown off with stability on it was because I thought it would work? Spare me the crappy condescension as if sidestepping some linear column made you particularly skilled in this game.

    People don't use stability in Artsariv or Skorvald or MAMA because they can't dodge the CC. They use it so their DPS skyrockets from not having to interrupt their burst to dodge the thing to begin with. It's part of using your toolset intelligently just as aegis has been used.

    But somehow using a less frequently available boon which you press a button for compared to pressing a button for more frequently available dodges makes some posters think they are superior players. Next you'll tell me condition cleanses or resistance are unnecessary because you should dodge them, too.

    why the salt?
    you were wrong, and you were corrected

    congratz a free tutotial for you

    Merely annoyance with brats like you two who feel such a need to project wanting to be carried (the poster above you even assumes I'm not the support and want the support to carry me instead) onto any claim, because that's what bored forumites like you are wont to do in a game of gotcha lectures. Always waiting to take a swipe at people to solidify that spot on your high horse.

  • melandru.3876melandru.3876 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Zenith.7301 said:

    @melandru.3876 said:

    @Zenith.7301 said:

    @melandru.3876 said:

    @Zenith.7301 said:

    @Miellyn.6847 said:

    @MisterDapper.5984 said:

    @Zenith.7301 said:

    @melandru.3876 said:

    @Shade.8971 said:
    Is it coincidence these threads pop up when SR is the daily with an annoying instability?

    no, it is a great indicator to show which people have adapted yet, and which don't/can't

    the entire last fight is scripted

    • boss shifting (3 times) are scripted and will alwlays be the same (back, nose, mid that order)
    • adds will allways spawn at the same health % the quartermaster that you want to kill asap will allways spawn on the same side (north)
    • the winds that knock you, will allways spawn in the exact same pattern. so with basic movement you can prevent EVERY wind

    • red circle = bad circle, move to the corner of a ship and drop the flux bomb

    • green circle = good circle, stack together and you take no damage, while doing damage (boss takes no damage, only the adds do)

    it can't be any more clear

    and regarding sa, the circle is big enough to fit 5 players, the issue is players that feel the need to move constantly and push others away, or in winds
    that is not the fractal issue, but bad players stressing and causing more risks then there literally are

    SR is only "problematic" because it's a clear case of where bad DPS can wipe you. The fight is just significantly different when you can just pull and cleave down a boss compared to when your DPS is bad enough that you actually need to clean up add waves.

    The adds essentially serve as a soft enrage because at some point the chill stacking on the group adds up and gets people knocked off by winds when they run out of dodges while permachilled, and that's when the group starts falling apart.

    I can still say I have to lecture most groups about killing the quartermasters. Even groups that do CM's without any issue but somehow struggle with this last boss because they refuse to adapt utilities as well for reflection/condi cleanse.

    The only fix that needs to happen is for stability to actually work against the wind pushbacks.

    Yeah if stab at least worked for the wind pushbacks. That would be nice.

    No.
    People need to learn that not everything can be compensated by support and some things need to be done correctly in order to succeed. People just need to watch their positioning and by attention to their surrounding.

    This is a matter of consistency. It's pretty dumb to have exceptions to the rule. Either stability applies to all CC or it does not. There's no reason why stability should work on MAMA CM, Skorvald, Ensolyss, and Artsariv (you know, the freaking CHALLENGE MOTES) but it's totally not okay for it to work on Siren's Reef.

    the wind is not a cc effect, so why would stability affect it?
    if you got blown off (everyone has at some point) you would have noticed that you can still use skills

    if you can still use skills, it means you are not disabled in any way

    if you are not disabled, there was nothing stability would have done to prevent it

    remember that other guy saying "People just need to watch their positioning and by attention to their surrounding."
    you did not pay enough attention

    Or, when I got blown off with stability on it was because I thought it would work? Spare me the crappy condescension as if sidestepping some linear column made you particularly skilled in this game.

    People don't use stability in Artsariv or Skorvald or MAMA because they can't dodge the CC. They use it so their DPS skyrockets from not having to interrupt their burst to dodge the thing to begin with. It's part of using your toolset intelligently just as aegis has been used.

    But somehow using a less frequently available boon which you press a button for compared to pressing a button for more frequently available dodges makes some posters think they are superior players. Next you'll tell me condition cleanses or resistance are unnecessary because you should dodge them, too.

    why the salt?
    you were wrong, and you were corrected

    congratz a free tutotial for you

    Merely annoyance with brats like you two who feel such a need to project wanting to be carried (the poster above you even assumes I'm not the support and want the support to carry me instead) onto any claim, because that's what bored forumites like you are wont to do in a game of gotcha lectures. Always waiting to take a swipe at people to solidify that spot on your high horse.

    wait what?

    apparantly you only understand (or accept) your own words so here, catch them with your face

    @Zenith.7301 said:
    This is a matter of consistency. It's pretty dumb to have exceptions to the rule. Either stability applies to all CC or it does not. There's no reason why stability should work on MAMA CM, Skorvald, Ensolyss, and Artsariv (you know, the freaking CHALLENGE MOTES) but it's totally not okay for it to work on Siren's Reef.

    key words: "It's pretty dumb to have exceptions to the rule".
    so why would siren reef be an exception to the same wind effects like deepstone fractal?

    you are fighting your own words at this very point, then get salty

    i want to be carried?

    • i explained the mechanics in my very first post in this very same topic
    • i explain how the wind works to you, it's not a cc so no stability

    sounds like i know very well what is going around, doesn't it
    sounds like i don't need to be carried like you insist, (mind me showing where i want things to be simplified?)

  • Zenith.7301Zenith.7301 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @melandru.3876 said:

    @Zenith.7301 said:

    @melandru.3876 said:

    @Zenith.7301 said:

    @melandru.3876 said:

    @Zenith.7301 said:

    @Miellyn.6847 said:

    @MisterDapper.5984 said:

    @Zenith.7301 said:

    @melandru.3876 said:

    @Shade.8971 said:
    Is it coincidence these threads pop up when SR is the daily with an annoying instability?

    no, it is a great indicator to show which people have adapted yet, and which don't/can't

    the entire last fight is scripted

    • boss shifting (3 times) are scripted and will alwlays be the same (back, nose, mid that order)
    • adds will allways spawn at the same health % the quartermaster that you want to kill asap will allways spawn on the same side (north)
    • the winds that knock you, will allways spawn in the exact same pattern. so with basic movement you can prevent EVERY wind

    • red circle = bad circle, move to the corner of a ship and drop the flux bomb

    • green circle = good circle, stack together and you take no damage, while doing damage (boss takes no damage, only the adds do)

    it can't be any more clear

    and regarding sa, the circle is big enough to fit 5 players, the issue is players that feel the need to move constantly and push others away, or in winds
    that is not the fractal issue, but bad players stressing and causing more risks then there literally are

    SR is only "problematic" because it's a clear case of where bad DPS can wipe you. The fight is just significantly different when you can just pull and cleave down a boss compared to when your DPS is bad enough that you actually need to clean up add waves.

    The adds essentially serve as a soft enrage because at some point the chill stacking on the group adds up and gets people knocked off by winds when they run out of dodges while permachilled, and that's when the group starts falling apart.

    I can still say I have to lecture most groups about killing the quartermasters. Even groups that do CM's without any issue but somehow struggle with this last boss because they refuse to adapt utilities as well for reflection/condi cleanse.

    The only fix that needs to happen is for stability to actually work against the wind pushbacks.

    Yeah if stab at least worked for the wind pushbacks. That would be nice.

    No.
    People need to learn that not everything can be compensated by support and some things need to be done correctly in order to succeed. People just need to watch their positioning and by attention to their surrounding.

    This is a matter of consistency. It's pretty dumb to have exceptions to the rule. Either stability applies to all CC or it does not. There's no reason why stability should work on MAMA CM, Skorvald, Ensolyss, and Artsariv (you know, the freaking CHALLENGE MOTES) but it's totally not okay for it to work on Siren's Reef.

    the wind is not a cc effect, so why would stability affect it?
    if you got blown off (everyone has at some point) you would have noticed that you can still use skills

    if you can still use skills, it means you are not disabled in any way

    if you are not disabled, there was nothing stability would have done to prevent it

    remember that other guy saying "People just need to watch their positioning and by attention to their surrounding."
    you did not pay enough attention

    Or, when I got blown off with stability on it was because I thought it would work? Spare me the crappy condescension as if sidestepping some linear column made you particularly skilled in this game.

    People don't use stability in Artsariv or Skorvald or MAMA because they can't dodge the CC. They use it so their DPS skyrockets from not having to interrupt their burst to dodge the thing to begin with. It's part of using your toolset intelligently just as aegis has been used.

    But somehow using a less frequently available boon which you press a button for compared to pressing a button for more frequently available dodges makes some posters think they are superior players. Next you'll tell me condition cleanses or resistance are unnecessary because you should dodge them, too.

    why the salt?
    you were wrong, and you were corrected

    congratz a free tutotial for you

    Merely annoyance with brats like you two who feel such a need to project wanting to be carried (the poster above you even assumes I'm not the support and want the support to carry me instead) onto any claim, because that's what bored forumites like you are wont to do in a game of gotcha lectures. Always waiting to take a swipe at people to solidify that spot on your high horse.

    wait what?

    apparantly you only understand (or accept) your own words so here, catch them with your face

    @Zenith.7301 said:
    This is a matter of consistency. It's pretty dumb to have exceptions to the rule. Either stability applies to all CC or it does not. There's no reason why stability should work on MAMA CM, Skorvald, Ensolyss, and Artsariv (you know, the freaking CHALLENGE MOTES) but it's totally not okay for it to work on Siren's Reef.

    key words: "It's pretty dumb to have exceptions to the rule".
    so why would siren reef be an exception to the same wind effects like deepstone fractal?

    you are fighting your own words at this very point, then get salty

    i want to be carried?

    • i explained the mechanics in my very first post in this very same topic
    • i explain how the wind works to you, it's not a cc so no stability

    sounds like i know very well what is going around, doesn't it
    sounds like i don't need to be carried like you insist, (mind me showing where i want things to be simplified?)

    I didn't say you wanted to be carried. I said the poster you referred to had turned a simple suggestion I made RIGHT AFTER SAYING the fractal was not overtuned and perfectly balanced that my suggestion was just a cry for wanting to get carried by my support (I'm usually the support, but the story doesn't matter to him because he's already cased me as a guy wanting to be carried by someone else).

  • melandru.3876melandru.3876 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Zenith.7301 said:

    @melandru.3876 said:

    @Zenith.7301 said:

    @melandru.3876 said:

    @Zenith.7301 said:

    @melandru.3876 said:

    @Zenith.7301 said:

    @Miellyn.6847 said:

    @MisterDapper.5984 said:

    @Zenith.7301 said:

    @melandru.3876 said:

    @Shade.8971 said:
    Is it coincidence these threads pop up when SR is the daily with an annoying instability?

    no, it is a great indicator to show which people have adapted yet, and which don't/can't

    the entire last fight is scripted

    • boss shifting (3 times) are scripted and will alwlays be the same (back, nose, mid that order)
    • adds will allways spawn at the same health % the quartermaster that you want to kill asap will allways spawn on the same side (north)
    • the winds that knock you, will allways spawn in the exact same pattern. so with basic movement you can prevent EVERY wind

    • red circle = bad circle, move to the corner of a ship and drop the flux bomb

    • green circle = good circle, stack together and you take no damage, while doing damage (boss takes no damage, only the adds do)

    it can't be any more clear

    and regarding sa, the circle is big enough to fit 5 players, the issue is players that feel the need to move constantly and push others away, or in winds
    that is not the fractal issue, but bad players stressing and causing more risks then there literally are

    SR is only "problematic" because it's a clear case of where bad DPS can wipe you. The fight is just significantly different when you can just pull and cleave down a boss compared to when your DPS is bad enough that you actually need to clean up add waves.

    The adds essentially serve as a soft enrage because at some point the chill stacking on the group adds up and gets people knocked off by winds when they run out of dodges while permachilled, and that's when the group starts falling apart.

    I can still say I have to lecture most groups about killing the quartermasters. Even groups that do CM's without any issue but somehow struggle with this last boss because they refuse to adapt utilities as well for reflection/condi cleanse.

    The only fix that needs to happen is for stability to actually work against the wind pushbacks.

    Yeah if stab at least worked for the wind pushbacks. That would be nice.

    No.
    People need to learn that not everything can be compensated by support and some things need to be done correctly in order to succeed. People just need to watch their positioning and by attention to their surrounding.

    This is a matter of consistency. It's pretty dumb to have exceptions to the rule. Either stability applies to all CC or it does not. There's no reason why stability should work on MAMA CM, Skorvald, Ensolyss, and Artsariv (you know, the freaking CHALLENGE MOTES) but it's totally not okay for it to work on Siren's Reef.

    the wind is not a cc effect, so why would stability affect it?
    if you got blown off (everyone has at some point) you would have noticed that you can still use skills

    if you can still use skills, it means you are not disabled in any way

    if you are not disabled, there was nothing stability would have done to prevent it

    remember that other guy saying "People just need to watch their positioning and by attention to their surrounding."
    you did not pay enough attention

    Or, when I got blown off with stability on it was because I thought it would work? Spare me the crappy condescension as if sidestepping some linear column made you particularly skilled in this game.

    People don't use stability in Artsariv or Skorvald or MAMA because they can't dodge the CC. They use it so their DPS skyrockets from not having to interrupt their burst to dodge the thing to begin with. It's part of using your toolset intelligently just as aegis has been used.

    But somehow using a less frequently available boon which you press a button for compared to pressing a button for more frequently available dodges makes some posters think they are superior players. Next you'll tell me condition cleanses or resistance are unnecessary because you should dodge them, too.

    why the salt?
    you were wrong, and you were corrected

    congratz a free tutotial for you

    Merely annoyance with brats like you two who feel such a need to project wanting to be carried (the poster above you even assumes I'm not the support and want the support to carry me instead) onto any claim, because that's what bored forumites like you are wont to do in a game of gotcha lectures. Always waiting to take a swipe at people to solidify that spot on your high horse.

    wait what?

    apparantly you only understand (or accept) your own words so here, catch them with your face

    @Zenith.7301 said:
    This is a matter of consistency. It's pretty dumb to have exceptions to the rule. Either stability applies to all CC or it does not. There's no reason why stability should work on MAMA CM, Skorvald, Ensolyss, and Artsariv (you know, the freaking CHALLENGE MOTES) but it's totally not okay for it to work on Siren's Reef.

    key words: "It's pretty dumb to have exceptions to the rule".
    so why would siren reef be an exception to the same wind effects like deepstone fractal?

    you are fighting your own words at this very point, then get salty

    i want to be carried?

    • i explained the mechanics in my very first post in this very same topic
    • i explain how the wind works to you, it's not a cc so no stability

    sounds like i know very well what is going around, doesn't it
    sounds like i don't need to be carried like you insist, (mind me showing where i want things to be simplified?)

    I didn't say you wanted to be carried. I said the poster you referred to had turned a simple suggestion I made RIGHT AFTER SAYING the fractal was not overtuned and perfectly balanced that my suggestion was just a cry for wanting to get carried by my support (I'm usually the support, but the story doesn't matter to him because he's already cased me as a guy wanting to be carried by someone else).

    ok i understand it now, but what do i have to do with that?

    all i saw was that you made a mistake on the winds (no stability) and just corrected it.
    never did i want to look elitist, or better

  • Miellyn.6847Miellyn.6847 Member ✭✭✭

    @Zenith.7301 said:

    @melandru.3876 said:

    @Zenith.7301 said:

    @melandru.3876 said:

    @Zenith.7301 said:

    @melandru.3876 said:

    @Zenith.7301 said:

    @Miellyn.6847 said:

    @MisterDapper.5984 said:

    @Zenith.7301 said:

    @melandru.3876 said:

    @Shade.8971 said:
    Is it coincidence these threads pop up when SR is the daily with an annoying instability?

    no, it is a great indicator to show which people have adapted yet, and which don't/can't

    the entire last fight is scripted

    • boss shifting (3 times) are scripted and will alwlays be the same (back, nose, mid that order)
    • adds will allways spawn at the same health % the quartermaster that you want to kill asap will allways spawn on the same side (north)
    • the winds that knock you, will allways spawn in the exact same pattern. so with basic movement you can prevent EVERY wind

    • red circle = bad circle, move to the corner of a ship and drop the flux bomb

    • green circle = good circle, stack together and you take no damage, while doing damage (boss takes no damage, only the adds do)

    it can't be any more clear

    and regarding sa, the circle is big enough to fit 5 players, the issue is players that feel the need to move constantly and push others away, or in winds
    that is not the fractal issue, but bad players stressing and causing more risks then there literally are

    SR is only "problematic" because it's a clear case of where bad DPS can wipe you. The fight is just significantly different when you can just pull and cleave down a boss compared to when your DPS is bad enough that you actually need to clean up add waves.

    The adds essentially serve as a soft enrage because at some point the chill stacking on the group adds up and gets people knocked off by winds when they run out of dodges while permachilled, and that's when the group starts falling apart.

    I can still say I have to lecture most groups about killing the quartermasters. Even groups that do CM's without any issue but somehow struggle with this last boss because they refuse to adapt utilities as well for reflection/condi cleanse.

    The only fix that needs to happen is for stability to actually work against the wind pushbacks.

    Yeah if stab at least worked for the wind pushbacks. That would be nice.

    No.
    People need to learn that not everything can be compensated by support and some things need to be done correctly in order to succeed. People just need to watch their positioning and by attention to their surrounding.

    This is a matter of consistency. It's pretty dumb to have exceptions to the rule. Either stability applies to all CC or it does not. There's no reason why stability should work on MAMA CM, Skorvald, Ensolyss, and Artsariv (you know, the freaking CHALLENGE MOTES) but it's totally not okay for it to work on Siren's Reef.

    the wind is not a cc effect, so why would stability affect it?
    if you got blown off (everyone has at some point) you would have noticed that you can still use skills

    if you can still use skills, it means you are not disabled in any way

    if you are not disabled, there was nothing stability would have done to prevent it

    remember that other guy saying "People just need to watch their positioning and by attention to their surrounding."
    you did not pay enough attention

    Or, when I got blown off with stability on it was because I thought it would work? Spare me the crappy condescension as if sidestepping some linear column made you particularly skilled in this game.

    People don't use stability in Artsariv or Skorvald or MAMA because they can't dodge the CC. They use it so their DPS skyrockets from not having to interrupt their burst to dodge the thing to begin with. It's part of using your toolset intelligently just as aegis has been used.

    But somehow using a less frequently available boon which you press a button for compared to pressing a button for more frequently available dodges makes some posters think they are superior players. Next you'll tell me condition cleanses or resistance are unnecessary because you should dodge them, too.

    why the salt?
    you were wrong, and you were corrected

    congratz a free tutotial for you

    Merely annoyance with brats like you two who feel such a need to project wanting to be carried (the poster above you even assumes I'm not the support and want the support to carry me instead) onto any claim, because that's what bored forumites like you are wont to do in a game of gotcha lectures. Always waiting to take a swipe at people to solidify that spot on your high horse.

    wait what?

    apparantly you only understand (or accept) your own words so here, catch them with your face

    @Zenith.7301 said:
    This is a matter of consistency. It's pretty dumb to have exceptions to the rule. Either stability applies to all CC or it does not. There's no reason why stability should work on MAMA CM, Skorvald, Ensolyss, and Artsariv (you know, the freaking CHALLENGE MOTES) but it's totally not okay for it to work on Siren's Reef.

    key words: "It's pretty dumb to have exceptions to the rule".
    so why would siren reef be an exception to the same wind effects like deepstone fractal?

    you are fighting your own words at this very point, then get salty

    i want to be carried?

    • i explained the mechanics in my very first post in this very same topic
    • i explain how the wind works to you, it's not a cc so no stability

    sounds like i know very well what is going around, doesn't it
    sounds like i don't need to be carried like you insist, (mind me showing where i want things to be simplified?)

    I didn't say you wanted to be carried. I said the poster you referred to had turned a simple suggestion I made RIGHT AFTER SAYING the fractal was not overtuned and perfectly balanced that my suggestion was just a cry for wanting to get carried by my support (I'm usually the support, but the story doesn't matter to him because he's already cased me as a guy wanting to be carried by someone else).

    This 'suggestion' pops up every week since the fractal got released with the same intention. Make another mechanic skipable so people don't have to bother with it.

    Also I never said that you wanted to be carried. Please learn to read and refer with names to people.
    The carry-comment was in conjunction with sidestepping and dodging and had nothing to do with your question.