Sic Em idea — Guild Wars 2 Forums

Sic Em idea

sephiroth.4217sephiroth.4217 Member ✭✭✭✭

Instead of 40/20% damage increase how about a 10% damage increase and pet sniffs out any stealth class in a 600 radius and applies revealed?

Not to brag, but I put together a puzzle in 4 days and the box said 2-4 years.
Please allow team queue with rewards again at our own discretion.
06210311 251521 121512

<13

Comments

  • Euthymias.7984Euthymias.7984 Member ✭✭✭
    edited May 8, 2019

    Functionally, its fine where it is. If the damage it grants is "too high" then just lower it to 30%.

  • DanAlcedo.3281DanAlcedo.3281 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 3, 2019

    It amuses me to see that there are actuall people who defend SicEm.

    Sic Em:

    • 1500 Range
    • Duration of 5s
    • 10% Dmg Multiplier
    • Reveal
    • 5s Superspeed
    • 30s Cooldown

    Would be more then ok.

  • TorQ.7041TorQ.7041 Member ✭✭✭
    edited May 3, 2019

    @DanAlcedo.3281 said:
    It amuses me to see that there are actuall people who defend SicEm.

    Sic Em:

    • 1500 Range
    • Duration of 5s
    • 10% Dmg Multiplier
    • Reveal
    • 5s Superspeed
    • 30s Cooldown

    Would be more then ok.

    You just have to dodge point blank and rapid fire..n that's really it. Lol. Is that so hard? U can also line of sight. Seriously. Is it so hard to watch ranger unload n move into line of sight so he wastes his skill?

    I am a warrior main and have never had any problems with it. I am more worried about an unblockable rev burst or chono shot from stealth.

  • canseemee.8645canseemee.8645 Member ✭✭

    ranger is trash ever since the they nerfed the 1v1 build, let them have the only thing they have left: farming noobs who cant LOS

  • TorQ.7041TorQ.7041 Member ✭✭✭
    edited May 3, 2019

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:
    Instead of 40/20% damage increase how about a 10% damage increase and pet sniffs out any stealth class in a 600 radius and applies revealed?

    How about keep it where it is. It's prefectly fine. U hear sic em. U dodge. It's easy and as simple as that.sic em literally translate to dodge now so he can't burst you. Just brain dead not to dodge it, when it's telegraphed and litterally shouts at you.

    N if u are going to say what if it's a +1 n u r out of dodges... Well that's part of the game. No different a rev porting on you and bursting or a chorno bursting you.

    I am not even a ranger main.

    This is just a healthy discussion and thought, you can put the nails away because there's no need for it here.

    No one is saying this or that as you implied, its not even an arguement so I wont even bother with the "butwhataboutism"..

    Please keep it friendly and civil, theres no need for the name calling.

    Sure. I re-phase. It's part of the game. You hear sic em. You dodge. It's as easy as that. That's the game mechanic.

    I am just tired of all these Nerf posts where people complain about a skill because they are dying to it. When it's pretty easy to avoid by learning the game.

    Nerfing all these skills basically dumbs down the game to a point where it's no longer fun.

    The part of the game I enjoy most is learning about the other class. Then countering them. I don't main ranger, I took time to make 1 learn it's skill and how it works and proceeded to beat them after doing that. Players who don't do this die to it then complain enough to want some nerfs.

    Like thief which has been nerfed to the ground because people don't watch map don't learn mechanics. Even to this day where thief hits like a wet noodle and dies in 2 hits. People are still crying op.

  • sephiroth.4217sephiroth.4217 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 3, 2019

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:
    Instead of 40/20% damage increase how about a 10% damage increase and pet sniffs out any stealth class in a 600 radius and applies revealed?

    How about keep it where it is. It's prefectly fine. U hear sic em. U dodge. It's easy and as simple as that.sic em literally translate to dodge now so he can't burst you. Just brain dead not to dodge it, when it's telegraphed and litterally shouts at you.

    N if u are going to say what if it's a +1 n u r out of dodges... Well that's part of the game. No different a rev porting on you and bursting or a chorno bursting you.

    I am not even a ranger main.

    This is just a healthy discussion and thought, you can put the nails away because there's no need for it here.

    No one is saying this or that as you implied, its not even an arguement so I wont even bother with the "butwhataboutism"..

    Please keep it friendly and civil, theres no need for the name calling.

    When did I name call? I anticipated what you might say and provided an explanation of my thoughts. I did not write any harsh language.

    I simple wrote how about keep it where it is. I am sorry you find some one who disagrees with you offensive? Lol

    Youre referring to everyone or anyone who thinks the skill might need a tuneup as "noob". This ruins any chance of a healthy discussion about the skill.

    You anticipated because your frame of mind is in the wrong place, this is just a healthy discussion, theres no arguement here.

    I am not offended, I would prefer the thread to stay civilised rather than cop a closure. Some maturity would be appreciated.

    Not to brag, but I put together a puzzle in 4 days and the box said 2-4 years.
    Please allow team queue with rewards again at our own discretion.
    06210311 251521 121512

  • TorQ.7041TorQ.7041 Member ✭✭✭
    edited May 3, 2019

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:
    Instead of 40/20% damage increase how about a 10% damage increase and pet sniffs out any stealth class in a 600 radius and applies revealed?

    How about keep it where it is. It's prefectly fine. U hear sic em. U dodge. It's easy and as simple as that.sic em literally translate to dodge now so he can't burst you. Just brain dead not to dodge it, when it's telegraphed and litterally shouts at you.

    N if u are going to say what if it's a +1 n u r out of dodges... Well that's part of the game. No different a rev porting on you and bursting or a chorno bursting you.

    I am not even a ranger main.

    This is just a healthy discussion and thought, you can put the nails away because there's no need for it here.

    No one is saying this or that as you implied, its not even an arguement so I wont even bother with the "butwhataboutism"..

    Please keep it friendly and civil, theres no need for the name calling.

    When did I name call? I anticipated what you might say and provided an explanation of my thoughts. I did not write any harsh language.

    I simple wrote how about keep it where it is. I am sorry you find some one who disagrees with you offensive? Lol

    Youre referring to everyone or anyone who thinks the skill might need a tuneup as "noob". This ruins any chance of a healthy discussion about the skill.

    You anticipated because your frame of mind is in the wrong place, this is just a healthy discussion, theres no arguement here.

    I am not offended, I would prefer the thread to stay civilised rather than cop a closure. Some maturity would be appreciated.

    Maybe you are right. I am just tired of reading everything has to be nerfed when I feel that it's pretty balanced right now.

    I apologise for the quick aggro.

  • sephiroth.4217sephiroth.4217 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:
    Instead of 40/20% damage increase how about a 10% damage increase and pet sniffs out any stealth class in a 600 radius and applies revealed?

    How about keep it where it is. It's prefectly fine. U hear sic em. U dodge. It's easy and as simple as that.sic em literally translate to dodge now so he can't burst you. Just brain dead not to dodge it, when it's telegraphed and litterally shouts at you.

    N if u are going to say what if it's a +1 n u r out of dodges... Well that's part of the game. No different a rev porting on you and bursting or a chorno bursting you.

    I am not even a ranger main.

    This is just a healthy discussion and thought, you can put the nails away because there's no need for it here.

    No one is saying this or that as you implied, its not even an arguement so I wont even bother with the "butwhataboutism"..

    Please keep it friendly and civil, theres no need for the name calling.

    When did I name call? I anticipated what you might say and provided an explanation of my thoughts. I did not write any harsh language.

    I simple wrote how about keep it where it is. I am sorry you find some one who disagrees with you offensive? Lol

    Youre referring to everyone or anyone who thinks the skill might need a tuneup as "noob". This ruins any chance of a healthy discussion about the skill.

    You anticipated because your frame of mind is in the wrong place, this is just a healthy discussion, theres no arguement here.

    I am not offended, I would prefer the thread to stay civilised rather than cop a closure. Some maturity would be appreciated.

    Maybe you are right. I am just tired of reading everything has to be nerfed when I feel that it's pretty balanced right now.

    I apologise for the quick aggro.

    No I understand, this is why I made the thread though.

    I feel after all the complaints Anet will nerf this skill into oblivion soon so I am trying to give an open window for a healthy discussion about the skill hence why my OP is sort of a nerf but also a buff.

    Not to brag, but I put together a puzzle in 4 days and the box said 2-4 years.
    Please allow team queue with rewards again at our own discretion.
    06210311 251521 121512

  • TorQ.7041TorQ.7041 Member ✭✭✭
    edited May 3, 2019

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:
    Instead of 40/20% damage increase how about a 10% damage increase and pet sniffs out any stealth class in a 600 radius and applies revealed?

    How about keep it where it is. It's prefectly fine. U hear sic em. U dodge. It's easy and as simple as that.sic em literally translate to dodge now so he can't burst you. Just brain dead not to dodge it, when it's telegraphed and litterally shouts at you.

    N if u are going to say what if it's a +1 n u r out of dodges... Well that's part of the game. No different a rev porting on you and bursting or a chorno bursting you.

    I am not even a ranger main.

    This is just a healthy discussion and thought, you can put the nails away because there's no need for it here.

    No one is saying this or that as you implied, its not even an arguement so I wont even bother with the "butwhataboutism"..

    Please keep it friendly and civil, theres no need for the name calling.

    When did I name call? I anticipated what you might say and provided an explanation of my thoughts. I did not write any harsh language.

    I simple wrote how about keep it where it is. I am sorry you find some one who disagrees with you offensive? Lol

    Youre referring to everyone or anyone who thinks the skill might need a tuneup as "noob". This ruins any chance of a healthy discussion about the skill.

    You anticipated because your frame of mind is in the wrong place, this is just a healthy discussion, theres no arguement here.

    I am not offended, I would prefer the thread to stay civilised rather than cop a closure. Some maturity would be appreciated.

    Maybe you are right. I am just tired of reading everything has to be nerfed when I feel that it's pretty balanced right now.

    I apologise for the quick aggro.

    No I understand, this is why I made the thread though.

    I feel after all the complaints Anet will nerf this skill into oblivion soon so I am trying to give an open window for a healthy discussion about the skill hence why my OP is sort of a nerf but also a buff.

    I also feel like I spent alot of time learning this game to get to plat. Had to play the majority of classes to understand the timing and animations. I would hate that skills get nerfed because people who don't bother to learn anything get mad that they die and complain over and over till a spec is basically useless.

    This is basically thief. The whole class has basically been deleted because of people complaining. Even now. When it's auto attack is 2k and a thief can die in 1-2 hits by almost every other class. People complain. It's incredible how this generation people want instant gratification. That they should be legendary in 1 season and if they are not. The gw2 match system is broke or profession skills are unbalanced.

  • sephiroth.4217sephiroth.4217 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 3, 2019

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:
    Instead of 40/20% damage increase how about a 10% damage increase and pet sniffs out any stealth class in a 600 radius and applies revealed?

    How about keep it where it is. It's prefectly fine. U hear sic em. U dodge. It's easy and as simple as that.sic em literally translate to dodge now so he can't burst you. Just brain dead not to dodge it, when it's telegraphed and litterally shouts at you.

    N if u are going to say what if it's a +1 n u r out of dodges... Well that's part of the game. No different a rev porting on you and bursting or a chorno bursting you.

    I am not even a ranger main.

    This is just a healthy discussion and thought, you can put the nails away because there's no need for it here.

    No one is saying this or that as you implied, its not even an arguement so I wont even bother with the "butwhataboutism"..

    Please keep it friendly and civil, theres no need for the name calling.

    When did I name call? I anticipated what you might say and provided an explanation of my thoughts. I did not write any harsh language.

    I simple wrote how about keep it where it is. I am sorry you find some one who disagrees with you offensive? Lol

    Youre referring to everyone or anyone who thinks the skill might need a tuneup as "noob". This ruins any chance of a healthy discussion about the skill.

    You anticipated because your frame of mind is in the wrong place, this is just a healthy discussion, theres no arguement here.

    I am not offended, I would prefer the thread to stay civilised rather than cop a closure. Some maturity would be appreciated.

    Maybe you are right. I am just tired of reading everything has to be nerfed when I feel that it's pretty balanced right now.

    I apologise for the quick aggro.

    No I understand, this is why I made the thread though.

    I feel after all the complaints Anet will nerf this skill into oblivion soon so I am trying to give an open window for a healthy discussion about the skill hence why my OP is sort of a nerf but also a buff.

    I also feel like I spent alot of time learning this game to get to plat. Had to play the majority of classes to understand the timing and animations. I would hate that skills get nerfed because people who don't bother to learn anything get mad that they die and complain over and over till a spec is basically useless.

    This is basically thief. The whole class has basically been deleted because of people complaining. Even now. When it's auto attack is 2k and a thief can die in 1-2 hits by almost every other class. People complain. It's incredible how this generation people want instant gratification. That they should be legendary in 1 season and if they are not. The gw2 match system is broke or profession skills are unbalanced.

    Yes exactly like Thief in a way... If you read the forums you'll see that we agree with eachother - https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/75069/earth-overload-is-op-and-needs-nerf#latest

    I'll send you a pm.

    Not to brag, but I put together a puzzle in 4 days and the box said 2-4 years.
    Please allow team queue with rewards again at our own discretion.
    06210311 251521 121512

  • TorQ.7041TorQ.7041 Member ✭✭✭
    edited May 3, 2019

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:
    Instead of 40/20% damage increase how about a 10% damage increase and pet sniffs out any stealth class in a 600 radius and applies revealed?

    How about keep it where it is. It's prefectly fine. U hear sic em. U dodge. It's easy and as simple as that.sic em literally translate to dodge now so he can't burst you. Just brain dead not to dodge it, when it's telegraphed and litterally shouts at you.

    N if u are going to say what if it's a +1 n u r out of dodges... Well that's part of the game. No different a rev porting on you and bursting or a chorno bursting you.

    I am not even a ranger main.

    This is just a healthy discussion and thought, you can put the nails away because there's no need for it here.

    No one is saying this or that as you implied, its not even an arguement so I wont even bother with the "butwhataboutism"..

    Please keep it friendly and civil, theres no need for the name calling.

    When did I name call? I anticipated what you might say and provided an explanation of my thoughts. I did not write any harsh language.

    I simple wrote how about keep it where it is. I am sorry you find some one who disagrees with you offensive? Lol

    Youre referring to everyone or anyone who thinks the skill might need a tuneup as "noob". This ruins any chance of a healthy discussion about the skill.

    You anticipated because your frame of mind is in the wrong place, this is just a healthy discussion, theres no arguement here.

    I am not offended, I would prefer the thread to stay civilised rather than cop a closure. Some maturity would be appreciated.

    Maybe you are right. I am just tired of reading everything has to be nerfed when I feel that it's pretty balanced right now.

    I apologise for the quick aggro.

    No I understand, this is why I made the thread though.

    I feel after all the complaints Anet will nerf this skill into oblivion soon so I am trying to give an open window for a healthy discussion about the skill hence why my OP is sort of a nerf but also a buff.

    I also feel like I spent alot of time learning this game to get to plat. Had to play the majority of classes to understand the timing and animations. I would hate that skills get nerfed because people who don't bother to learn anything get mad that they die and complain over and over till a spec is basically useless.

    This is basically thief. The whole class has basically been deleted because of people complaining. Even now. When it's auto attack is 2k and a thief can die in 1-2 hits by almost every other class. People complain. It's incredible how this generation people want instant gratification. That they should be legendary in 1 season and if they are not. The gw2 match system is broke or profession skills are unbalanced.

    Yes exactly like Thief in a way... If you read the forums you'll see that we agree with eachother - https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/75069/earth-overload-is-op-and-needs-nerf#latest

    I'll send you a pm.

    Hah yeah I am quick to anger when I read about nerfs. Except for Condi mes last season. Even after playing it for a whole season I couldn't beat it with my other classes. Except prot holo. But I don't want to specifically play prot Holo just because I see a mirage. With the sceptor Nerf now I am finally ok to lose to a mirage.

    Unless it's power. Power mirage is totally ok. Dodge 1 shot. U can kill it.

  • If ppl really hate to die for sicem, You can delete the skill sicem... Then again, I want the revealed in all my pet skills f2 and merged f2... and if rangers feel their damage is subpar, distribute the damage across traits and weapon skill dmg coefficients.... Coz soulbeast still suffers sustained dps in raids and fractals

  • zoopop.5630zoopop.5630 Member ✭✭✭✭

    I personally don't have an issue with it at all but to a degree i feel like the skill does more then it really should over all. I think a 10% nerf would be fair and might even go unnoticed to be honest.

    I personally like seeing Ranger being full dps over some sort of tank like Boon beast. The game-play more engaging and fun to fight against, this is coming from an engi main who plays almost all spec possible during rank games. If we had to nerf or change anything i'll say Longbow Range should be brought down a tad bit over all.

  • Crystal Paladin.3871Crystal Paladin.3871 Member ✭✭✭
    edited May 3, 2019

    @zoopop.5630 said:
    I personally don't have an issue with it at all but to a degree i feel like the skill does more then it really should over all. I think a 10% nerf would be fair and might even go unnoticed to be honest.

    I personally like seeing Ranger being full dps over some sort of tank like Boon beast. The game-play more engaging and fun to fight against, this is coming from an engi main who plays almost all spec possible during rank games. If we had to nerf or change anything i'll say Longbow Range should be brought down a tad bit over all.

    Longbow arcing range is thematic and it really is fun based on few map terrain and playstyle(you can't find a sniping spot in every map suitable for the situation).... It'd really make it bland if nerfed... On the other hand, if community decides lb is op, they can tune down the autoattack dmg but it might be a big blow to few specific builds... I also notice (in twitch streams)pro ranger players have hard time surviving/dealing dmg against any other class after they used up their CDs for that specific lb burst and even when using lb burst, they couldn't down most classes even with zerky sicem and sotp and die even when trying to disengage... Idk may be it's just me with this perspective.... meta Boonbeast? seems its dead and buried... coz I notice ppl running multiple variations of multiple classes and I couldn't sense any tanky hard hitting soulbeasts anymore during my matches(unranked and ranked) maybe theyre hiding in the shadows of plat and legendary suns refuge :p waiting for the right time to strike

  • Stand The Wall.6987Stand The Wall.6987 Member ✭✭✭✭

    cap + damage modifiers at 50% in pvp/ wvw and we're golden. its not just sic em that's at fault here.

    you don't know till you know, ya know.

  • Eurantien.4632Eurantien.4632 Member ✭✭✭

    Just fyi, Sic em does not increase the speed of the soulbeast.

  • Eurantien.4632Eurantien.4632 Member ✭✭✭
    edited May 3, 2019

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:
    cap + damage modifiers at 50% in pvp/ wvw and we're golden. its not just sic em that's at fault here.

    This would gut marksmanship, the 2nd weakest trait line.

  • Stand The Wall.6987Stand The Wall.6987 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Eurantien.4632 said:

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:
    cap + damage modifiers at 50% in pvp/ wvw and we're golden. its not just sic em that's at fault here.

    This would gut marksmanship, the 2nd weakest trait line.

    lol. on burst builds its op.

    you don't know till you know, ya know.

  • Eurantien.4632Eurantien.4632 Member ✭✭✭

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:

    @Eurantien.4632 said:

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:
    cap + damage modifiers at 50% in pvp/ wvw and we're golden. its not just sic em that's at fault here.

    This would gut marksmanship, the 2nd weakest trait line.

    lol. on burst builds its op.

    Guess we have different balancing perspectives. At top tier, it's not OP. So imo it needs some slight buffs actually.

  • Euthymias.7984Euthymias.7984 Member ✭✭✭
    edited May 3, 2019

    @DanAlcedo.3281 said:
    It amuses me to see that there are actuall people who defend SicEm.

    Sic Em:

    • 1500 Range
    • Duration of 5s
    • 10% Dmg Multiplier
    • Reveal
    • 5s Superspeed
    • 30s Cooldown

    Would be more then ok.

    Probably wouldnt be worth slotting at that point. I'd probably use Griffon Stance or just pick up a better roaming damage dealing profession instead.

  • Nox.6785Nox.6785 Member ✭✭

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:
    Instead of 40/20% damage increase how about a 10% damage increase and pet sniffs out any stealth class in a 600 radius and applies revealed?

    How about keep it where it is. It's prefectly fine. U hear sic em. U dodge. It's easy and as simple as that.sic em literally translate to dodge now so he can't burst you. Just brain dead not to dodge it, when it's telegraphed and litterally shouts at you.

    N if u are going to say what if it's a +1 n u r out of dodges... Well that's part of the game. No different a rev porting on you and bursting or a chorno bursting you.

    I am not even a ranger main.

    This is just a healthy discussion and thought, you can put the nails away because there's no need for it here.

    No one is saying this or that as you implied, its not even an arguement so I wont even bother with the "butwhataboutism"..

    Please keep it friendly and civil, theres no need for the name calling.

    When did I name call? I anticipated what you might say and provided an explanation of my thoughts. I did not write any harsh language.

    I simple wrote how about keep it where it is. I am sorry you find some one who disagrees with you offensive? Lol

    Youre referring to everyone or anyone who thinks the skill might need a tuneup as "noob". This ruins any chance of a healthy discussion about the skill.

    You anticipated because your frame of mind is in the wrong place, this is just a healthy discussion, theres no arguement here.

    I am not offended, I would prefer the thread to stay civilised rather than cop a closure. Some maturity would be appreciated.

    Maybe you are right. I am just tired of reading everything has to be nerfed when I feel that it's pretty balanced right now.

    I apologise for the quick aggro.

    No I understand, this is why I made the thread though.

    I feel after all the complaints Anet will nerf this skill into oblivion soon so I am trying to give an open window for a healthy discussion about the skill hence why my OP is sort of a nerf but also a buff.

    I also feel like I spent alot of time learning this game to get to plat. Had to play the majority of classes to understand the timing and animations. I would hate that skills get nerfed because people who don't bother to learn anything get mad that they die and complain over and over till a spec is basically useless.

    This is basically thief. The whole class has basically been deleted because of people complaining. Even now. When it's auto attack is 2k and a thief can die in 1-2 hits by almost every other class. People complain. It's incredible how this generation people want instant gratification. That they should be legendary in 1 season and if they are not. The gw2 match system is broke or profession skills are unbalanced.

    Yes exactly like Thief in a way... If you read the forums you'll see that we agree with eachother - https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/75069/earth-overload-is-op-and-needs-nerf#latest

    I'll send you a pm.

    Hah yeah I am quick to anger when I read about nerfs. Except for Condi mes last season. Even after playing it for a whole season I couldn't beat it with my other classes. Except prot holo. But I don't want to specifically play prot Holo just because I see a mirage. With the sceptor Nerf now I am finally ok to lose to a mirage.

    Unless it's power. Power mirage is totally ok. Dodge 1 shot. U can kill it.

    So don't touch Sic Em but nerf Mirage? You're a special kind of special aren't ya.

  • TorQ.7041TorQ.7041 Member ✭✭✭

    @Nox.6785 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:
    Instead of 40/20% damage increase how about a 10% damage increase and pet sniffs out any stealth class in a 600 radius and applies revealed?

    How about keep it where it is. It's prefectly fine. U hear sic em. U dodge. It's easy and as simple as that.sic em literally translate to dodge now so he can't burst you. Just brain dead not to dodge it, when it's telegraphed and litterally shouts at you.

    N if u are going to say what if it's a +1 n u r out of dodges... Well that's part of the game. No different a rev porting on you and bursting or a chorno bursting you.

    I am not even a ranger main.

    This is just a healthy discussion and thought, you can put the nails away because there's no need for it here.

    No one is saying this or that as you implied, its not even an arguement so I wont even bother with the "butwhataboutism"..

    Please keep it friendly and civil, theres no need for the name calling.

    When did I name call? I anticipated what you might say and provided an explanation of my thoughts. I did not write any harsh language.

    I simple wrote how about keep it where it is. I am sorry you find some one who disagrees with you offensive? Lol

    Youre referring to everyone or anyone who thinks the skill might need a tuneup as "noob". This ruins any chance of a healthy discussion about the skill.

    You anticipated because your frame of mind is in the wrong place, this is just a healthy discussion, theres no arguement here.

    I am not offended, I would prefer the thread to stay civilised rather than cop a closure. Some maturity would be appreciated.

    Maybe you are right. I am just tired of reading everything has to be nerfed when I feel that it's pretty balanced right now.

    I apologise for the quick aggro.

    No I understand, this is why I made the thread though.

    I feel after all the complaints Anet will nerf this skill into oblivion soon so I am trying to give an open window for a healthy discussion about the skill hence why my OP is sort of a nerf but also a buff.

    I also feel like I spent alot of time learning this game to get to plat. Had to play the majority of classes to understand the timing and animations. I would hate that skills get nerfed because people who don't bother to learn anything get mad that they die and complain over and over till a spec is basically useless.

    This is basically thief. The whole class has basically been deleted because of people complaining. Even now. When it's auto attack is 2k and a thief can die in 1-2 hits by almost every other class. People complain. It's incredible how this generation people want instant gratification. That they should be legendary in 1 season and if they are not. The gw2 match system is broke or profession skills are unbalanced.

    Yes exactly like Thief in a way... If you read the forums you'll see that we agree with eachother - https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/75069/earth-overload-is-op-and-needs-nerf#latest

    I'll send you a pm.

    Hah yeah I am quick to anger when I read about nerfs. Except for Condi mes last season. Even after playing it for a whole season I couldn't beat it with my other classes. Except prot holo. But I don't want to specifically play prot Holo just because I see a mirage. With the sceptor Nerf now I am finally ok to lose to a mirage.

    Unless it's power. Power mirage is totally ok. Dodge 1 shot. U can kill it.

    So don't touch Sic Em but nerf Mirage? You're a special kind of special aren't ya.

    Key words. "Last season". The ability to 1vX and be able to kill them thru passive Condi was too much. Now that axe and sceptor is balanced. I find it ok to lose to a mesmer

  • Quadox.7834Quadox.7834 Member ✭✭✭
    edited May 6, 2019

    @Eurantien.4632 said:

    @Nox.6785 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:
    Instead of 40/20% damage increase how about a 10% damage increase and pet sniffs out any stealth class in a 600 radius and applies revealed?

    How about keep it where it is. It's prefectly fine. U hear sic em. U dodge. It's easy and as simple as that.sic em literally translate to dodge now so he can't burst you. Just brain dead not to dodge it, when it's telegraphed and litterally shouts at you.

    N if u are going to say what if it's a +1 n u r out of dodges... Well that's part of the game. No different a rev porting on you and bursting or a chorno bursting you.

    I am not even a ranger main.

    This is just a healthy discussion and thought, you can put the nails away because there's no need for it here.

    No one is saying this or that as you implied, its not even an arguement so I wont even bother with the "butwhataboutism"..

    Please keep it friendly and civil, theres no need for the name calling.

    When did I name call? I anticipated what you might say and provided an explanation of my thoughts. I did not write any harsh language.

    I simple wrote how about keep it where it is. I am sorry you find some one who disagrees with you offensive? Lol

    Youre referring to everyone or anyone who thinks the skill might need a tuneup as "noob". This ruins any chance of a healthy discussion about the skill.

    You anticipated because your frame of mind is in the wrong place, this is just a healthy discussion, theres no arguement here.

    I am not offended, I would prefer the thread to stay civilised rather than cop a closure. Some maturity would be appreciated.

    Maybe you are right. I am just tired of reading everything has to be nerfed when I feel that it's pretty balanced right now.

    I apologise for the quick aggro.

    No I understand, this is why I made the thread though.

    I feel after all the complaints Anet will nerf this skill into oblivion soon so I am trying to give an open window for a healthy discussion about the skill hence why my OP is sort of a nerf but also a buff.

    I also feel like I spent alot of time learning this game to get to plat. Had to play the majority of classes to understand the timing and animations. I would hate that skills get nerfed because people who don't bother to learn anything get mad that they die and complain over and over till a spec is basically useless.

    This is basically thief. The whole class has basically been deleted because of people complaining. Even now. When it's auto attack is 2k and a thief can die in 1-2 hits by almost every other class. People complain. It's incredible how this generation people want instant gratification. That they should be legendary in 1 season and if they are not. The gw2 match system is broke or profession skills are unbalanced.

    Yes exactly like Thief in a way... If you read the forums you'll see that we agree with eachother - https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/75069/earth-overload-is-op-and-needs-nerf#latest

    I'll send you a pm.

    Hah yeah I am quick to anger when I read about nerfs. Except for Condi mes last season. Even after playing it for a whole season I couldn't beat it with my other classes. Except prot holo. But I don't want to specifically play prot Holo just because I see a mirage. With the sceptor Nerf now I am finally ok to lose to a mirage.

    Unless it's power. Power mirage is totally ok. Dodge 1 shot. U can kill it.

    So don't touch Sic Em but nerf Mirage? You're a special kind of special aren't ya.

    Just dissuading misinformation, power Mesmer is god tier near the skill ceiling, that's being said. Only one player plays it to that's level. That's an issue with this game.

    Mesmer stomps noobs but not for the same reasons it stomps top players. So it could be nerfed one way and not punish noobs so hard with mantra nerfs but still be god tier at top tier.

    Power ranger stomps noobs but isn't quite viable at top tier (well it kind of is now with sic em, but just barely). Which means nerfing it would most likely make it unviable... and it wouldn't still stomp noobs by design.

    When something stomps noobs and is viable at top tier it's easy to tone down, but when you have a negative slope for effectiveness vs skill level, then that's really hard to balance and this is where power ranger usually sits at.

    Power Ranger is god tier near the skill ceiling, that's being said. Only zero players plays it to that's level. That's an issue with this game.

    // Yanim

  • Eurantien.4632Eurantien.4632 Member ✭✭✭

    @Quadox.7834 said:

    @Eurantien.4632 said:

    @Nox.6785 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:
    Instead of 40/20% damage increase how about a 10% damage increase and pet sniffs out any stealth class in a 600 radius and applies revealed?

    How about keep it where it is. It's prefectly fine. U hear sic em. U dodge. It's easy and as simple as that.sic em literally translate to dodge now so he can't burst you. Just brain dead not to dodge it, when it's telegraphed and litterally shouts at you.

    N if u are going to say what if it's a +1 n u r out of dodges... Well that's part of the game. No different a rev porting on you and bursting or a chorno bursting you.

    I am not even a ranger main.

    This is just a healthy discussion and thought, you can put the nails away because there's no need for it here.

    No one is saying this or that as you implied, its not even an arguement so I wont even bother with the "butwhataboutism"..

    Please keep it friendly and civil, theres no need for the name calling.

    When did I name call? I anticipated what you might say and provided an explanation of my thoughts. I did not write any harsh language.

    I simple wrote how about keep it where it is. I am sorry you find some one who disagrees with you offensive? Lol

    Youre referring to everyone or anyone who thinks the skill might need a tuneup as "noob". This ruins any chance of a healthy discussion about the skill.

    You anticipated because your frame of mind is in the wrong place, this is just a healthy discussion, theres no arguement here.

    I am not offended, I would prefer the thread to stay civilised rather than cop a closure. Some maturity would be appreciated.

    Maybe you are right. I am just tired of reading everything has to be nerfed when I feel that it's pretty balanced right now.

    I apologise for the quick aggro.

    No I understand, this is why I made the thread though.

    I feel after all the complaints Anet will nerf this skill into oblivion soon so I am trying to give an open window for a healthy discussion about the skill hence why my OP is sort of a nerf but also a buff.

    I also feel like I spent alot of time learning this game to get to plat. Had to play the majority of classes to understand the timing and animations. I would hate that skills get nerfed because people who don't bother to learn anything get mad that they die and complain over and over till a spec is basically useless.

    This is basically thief. The whole class has basically been deleted because of people complaining. Even now. When it's auto attack is 2k and a thief can die in 1-2 hits by almost every other class. People complain. It's incredible how this generation people want instant gratification. That they should be legendary in 1 season and if they are not. The gw2 match system is broke or profession skills are unbalanced.

    Yes exactly like Thief in a way... If you read the forums you'll see that we agree with eachother - https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/75069/earth-overload-is-op-and-needs-nerf#latest

    I'll send you a pm.

    Hah yeah I am quick to anger when I read about nerfs. Except for Condi mes last season. Even after playing it for a whole season I couldn't beat it with my other classes. Except prot holo. But I don't want to specifically play prot Holo just because I see a mirage. With the sceptor Nerf now I am finally ok to lose to a mirage.

    Unless it's power. Power mirage is totally ok. Dodge 1 shot. U can kill it.

    So don't touch Sic Em but nerf Mirage? You're a special kind of special aren't ya.

    Just dissuading misinformation, power Mesmer is god tier near the skill ceiling, that's being said. Only one player plays it to that's level. That's an issue with this game.

    Mesmer stomps noobs but not for the same reasons it stomps top players. So it could be nerfed one way and not punish noobs so hard with mantra nerfs but still be god tier at top tier.

    Power ranger stomps noobs but isn't quite viable at top tier (well it kind of is now with sic em, but just barely). Which means nerfing it would most likely make it unviable... and it wouldn't still stomp noobs by design.

    When something stomps noobs and is viable at top tier it's easy to tone down, but when you have a negative slope for effectiveness vs skill level, then that's really hard to balance and this is where power ranger usually sits at.

    Power Ranger is god tier near the skill ceiling, that's being said. Only zero players plays it to that's level. That's an issue with this game.

    Burden of proof lies with you to prove that it's god tier.

  • Safandula.8723Safandula.8723 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:
    Instead of 40/20% damage increase how about a 10% damage increase and pet sniffs out any stealth class in a 600 radius and applies revealed?

    How about keep it where it is. It's prefectly fine. U hear sic em. U dodge. It's easy and as simple as that.sic em literally translate to dodge now so he can't burst you. Just brain dead not to dodge it, when it's telegraphed and litterally shouts at you.

    N if u are going to say what if it's a +1 n u r out of dodges... Well that's part of the game. No different a rev porting on you and bursting or a chorno bursting you.

    I am not even a ranger main.

    This is just a healthy discussion and thought, you can put the nails away because there's no need for it here.

    No one is saying this or that as you implied, its not even an arguement so I wont even bother with the "butwhataboutism"..

    Please keep it friendly and civil, theres no need for the name calling.

    When did I name call? I anticipated what you might say and provided an explanation of my thoughts. I did not write any harsh language.

    I simple wrote how about keep it where it is. I am sorry you find some one who disagrees with you offensive? Lol

    Youre referring to everyone or anyone who thinks the skill might need a tuneup as "noob". This ruins any chance of a healthy discussion about the skill.

    You anticipated because your frame of mind is in the wrong place, this is just a healthy discussion, theres no arguement here.

    I am not offended, I would prefer the thread to stay civilised rather than cop a closure. Some maturity would be appreciated.

    Maybe you are right. I am just tired of reading everything has to be nerfed when I feel that it's pretty balanced right now.

    I apologise for the quick aggro.

    Yea ur playing Warr, no doubt u don't feel like everything deals to much dmg. Idea of 40% dmg boost is so stupid, it's funny and sad at the same time, that u don't get the point.
    "I got 1000 toughness on breakstun, dmg in this game is fine!"

    Yea this skill needs some nerf at wvw. In pvp there is enough of Los to counter lb rangers. If u don't get mauled for 20k later

    make prepardness baseline plz

  • TorQ.7041TorQ.7041 Member ✭✭✭
    edited May 6, 2019

    @Safandula.8723 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:
    Instead of 40/20% damage increase how about a 10% damage increase and pet sniffs out any stealth class in a 600 radius and applies revealed?

    How about keep it where it is. It's prefectly fine. U hear sic em. U dodge. It's easy and as simple as that.sic em literally translate to dodge now so he can't burst you. Just brain dead not to dodge it, when it's telegraphed and litterally shouts at you.

    N if u are going to say what if it's a +1 n u r out of dodges... Well that's part of the game. No different a rev porting on you and bursting or a chorno bursting you.

    I am not even a ranger main.

    This is just a healthy discussion and thought, you can put the nails away because there's no need for it here.

    No one is saying this or that as you implied, its not even an arguement so I wont even bother with the "butwhataboutism"..

    Please keep it friendly and civil, theres no need for the name calling.

    When did I name call? I anticipated what you might say and provided an explanation of my thoughts. I did not write any harsh language.

    I simple wrote how about keep it where it is. I am sorry you find some one who disagrees with you offensive? Lol

    Youre referring to everyone or anyone who thinks the skill might need a tuneup as "noob". This ruins any chance of a healthy discussion about the skill.

    You anticipated because your frame of mind is in the wrong place, this is just a healthy discussion, theres no arguement here.

    I am not offended, I would prefer the thread to stay civilised rather than cop a closure. Some maturity would be appreciated.

    Maybe you are right. I am just tired of reading everything has to be nerfed when I feel that it's pretty balanced right now.

    I apologise for the quick aggro.

    Yea ur playing Warr, no doubt u don't feel like everything deals to much dmg. Idea of 40% dmg boost is so stupid, it's funny and sad at the same time, that u don't get the point.
    "I got 1000 toughness on breakstun, dmg in this game is fine!"

    Yea this skill needs some nerf at wvw. In pvp there is enough of Los to counter lb rangers. If u don't get mauled for 20k later

    I don't just play warrior lol I transitioned from thief, I also play rev, Holo, scrapper guardian. I think u are a thief main if I remember from other posts. Yeah you have to be a right to be upset. That you die in 2 hits.

    I think while everyone else is pretty even. Thief is pretty underpowered. I only worry about thief when I get +1 n all my cool downs r gone. That looks to be the only role it has right now. But this doesnt change the fact that u can still pretty easily dodge sic em. I dodge it every time even on thief. And if I don't u just rfi and Port out.

  • Quadox.7834Quadox.7834 Member ✭✭✭

    @Eurantien.4632 said:

    @Quadox.7834 said:

    @Eurantien.4632 said:

    @Nox.6785 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:
    Instead of 40/20% damage increase how about a 10% damage increase and pet sniffs out any stealth class in a 600 radius and applies revealed?

    How about keep it where it is. It's prefectly fine. U hear sic em. U dodge. It's easy and as simple as that.sic em literally translate to dodge now so he can't burst you. Just brain dead not to dodge it, when it's telegraphed and litterally shouts at you.

    N if u are going to say what if it's a +1 n u r out of dodges... Well that's part of the game. No different a rev porting on you and bursting or a chorno bursting you.

    I am not even a ranger main.

    This is just a healthy discussion and thought, you can put the nails away because there's no need for it here.

    No one is saying this or that as you implied, its not even an arguement so I wont even bother with the "butwhataboutism"..

    Please keep it friendly and civil, theres no need for the name calling.

    When did I name call? I anticipated what you might say and provided an explanation of my thoughts. I did not write any harsh language.

    I simple wrote how about keep it where it is. I am sorry you find some one who disagrees with you offensive? Lol

    Youre referring to everyone or anyone who thinks the skill might need a tuneup as "noob". This ruins any chance of a healthy discussion about the skill.

    You anticipated because your frame of mind is in the wrong place, this is just a healthy discussion, theres no arguement here.

    I am not offended, I would prefer the thread to stay civilised rather than cop a closure. Some maturity would be appreciated.

    Maybe you are right. I am just tired of reading everything has to be nerfed when I feel that it's pretty balanced right now.

    I apologise for the quick aggro.

    No I understand, this is why I made the thread though.

    I feel after all the complaints Anet will nerf this skill into oblivion soon so I am trying to give an open window for a healthy discussion about the skill hence why my OP is sort of a nerf but also a buff.

    I also feel like I spent alot of time learning this game to get to plat. Had to play the majority of classes to understand the timing and animations. I would hate that skills get nerfed because people who don't bother to learn anything get mad that they die and complain over and over till a spec is basically useless.

    This is basically thief. The whole class has basically been deleted because of people complaining. Even now. When it's auto attack is 2k and a thief can die in 1-2 hits by almost every other class. People complain. It's incredible how this generation people want instant gratification. That they should be legendary in 1 season and if they are not. The gw2 match system is broke or profession skills are unbalanced.

    Yes exactly like Thief in a way... If you read the forums you'll see that we agree with eachother - https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/75069/earth-overload-is-op-and-needs-nerf#latest

    I'll send you a pm.

    Hah yeah I am quick to anger when I read about nerfs. Except for Condi mes last season. Even after playing it for a whole season I couldn't beat it with my other classes. Except prot holo. But I don't want to specifically play prot Holo just because I see a mirage. With the sceptor Nerf now I am finally ok to lose to a mirage.

    Unless it's power. Power mirage is totally ok. Dodge 1 shot. U can kill it.

    So don't touch Sic Em but nerf Mirage? You're a special kind of special aren't ya.

    Just dissuading misinformation, power Mesmer is god tier near the skill ceiling, that's being said. Only one player plays it to that's level. That's an issue with this game.

    Mesmer stomps noobs but not for the same reasons it stomps top players. So it could be nerfed one way and not punish noobs so hard with mantra nerfs but still be god tier at top tier.

    Power ranger stomps noobs but isn't quite viable at top tier (well it kind of is now with sic em, but just barely). Which means nerfing it would most likely make it unviable... and it wouldn't still stomp noobs by design.

    When something stomps noobs and is viable at top tier it's easy to tone down, but when you have a negative slope for effectiveness vs skill level, then that's really hard to balance and this is where power ranger usually sits at.

    Power Ranger is god tier near the skill ceiling, that's being said. Only zero players plays it to that's level. That's an issue with this game.

    Burden of proof lies with you to prove that it's god tier.

    Lol, where did you prove that power mesmer is god tier?

    // Yanim

  • Quadox.7834Quadox.7834 Member ✭✭✭

    @Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:
    Instead of 40/20% damage increase how about a 10% damage increase and pet sniffs out any stealth class in a 600 radius and applies revealed?

    How about keep it where it is. It's prefectly fine. U hear sic em. U dodge. It's easy and as simple as that.sic em literally translate to dodge now so he can't burst you. Just brain dead not to dodge it, when it's telegraphed and litterally shouts at you.

    N if u are going to say what if it's a +1 n u r out of dodges... Well that's part of the game. No different a rev porting on you and bursting or a chorno bursting you.

    I am not even a ranger main.

    This is just a healthy discussion and thought, you can put the nails away because there's no need for it here.

    No one is saying this or that as you implied, its not even an arguement so I wont even bother with the "butwhataboutism"..

    Please keep it friendly and civil, theres no need for the name calling.

    When did I name call? I anticipated what you might say and provided an explanation of my thoughts. I did not write any harsh language.

    I simple wrote how about keep it where it is. I am sorry you find some one who disagrees with you offensive? Lol

    Youre referring to everyone or anyone who thinks the skill might need a tuneup as "noob". This ruins any chance of a healthy discussion about the skill.

    You anticipated because your frame of mind is in the wrong place, this is just a healthy discussion, theres no arguement here.

    I am not offended, I would prefer the thread to stay civilised rather than cop a closure. Some maturity would be appreciated.

    Maybe you are right. I am just tired of reading everything has to be nerfed when I feel that it's pretty balanced right now.

    I apologise for the quick aggro.

    No I understand, this is why I made the thread though.

    I feel after all the complaints Anet will nerf this skill into oblivion soon so I am trying to give an open window for a healthy discussion about the skill hence why my OP is sort of a nerf but also a buff.

    I also feel like I spent alot of time learning this game to get to plat. Had to play the majority of classes to understand the timing and animations. I would hate that skills get nerfed because people who don't bother to learn anything get mad that they die and complain over and over till a spec is basically useless.

    This is basically thief. The whole class has basically been deleted because of people complaining. Even now. When it's auto attack is 2k and a thief can die in 1-2 hits by almost every other class. People complain. It's incredible how this generation people want instant gratification. That they should be legendary in 1 season and if they are not. The gw2 match system is broke or profession skills are unbalanced.

    That's because people in this forum have an incredibly difficult time distinguishing between what is "annoying" and what is actually "overpowered". A great example of this was Deadeye before the nerfs, back when DJ was unblockable, Scope was still 3s of stealth on roll, and the Rifle 4 bug was allowing Lead Attack stacking while out of combat. Deadeye before the nerf had only 2 players in NA who were even capable of playing it past a plat 2 level. It was the least represented class/spec in ranked past top plat 1, even lower than Dragonhunter, and on par with people messing around on Renegade. It had literally "Zero representation in monthly ATs" none, nothing, zilch, nada. Everything in the game countered Deadeye if it cared to go off node and chase it, so long as the player was wise enough to utilize LOS positions and not make himself a sitting duck. Things that hard countered & shut down DE were Core Guards, Dragonhunters, Heralds, All Mesmers, Other Thieves, Any Ranger with Sic Em, Holosmith Reveal, Spellbreaker Reveal. It is because virtually everything in the game countered DE directly, that only 2 people were maverick enough to play it past a plat 2 level. But see people are fickle, they are ignorant, and they are apathetic when things are explained to them. So rather than l2p vs. the DE, the large majority of the player base which hovers in the gold divisions, would develop this self chosen tunnel vision. They would only go to nodes, often rally botting to the mid node, never leave those nodes, and let the DEs free cast against them without ever sending anyone to neutralize it. And then come into the forums whining about how overpowered the DE is. The truth is that these people refused to alter their gameplay. They were fresh off an old HoT meta where there were no high powered ranged classes. LB/GS Power Rangers had been long dead, and LB Druids were light damage, utilizing the LB mostly for the extra stealth and knockback for decaps, not damage. They were years deep into a mentality of going to a node, standing on that node, and not worrying about high powered ranged. So when high powered ranged showed up in PoF with the DE and Sic Em Soulbeasts, the large majority of the player base "the gold divisions" pointed, screamed OP, started a bandwagon, and got a great class which was bringing new dynamic to our old game, nerfed completely out of any possible competitive viability, when in truth it was already weak to begin with and this is reflected in the ridiculously low representation it had in competitive environments.

    Now the same thing will happen to Rangers. The exact same demographic of players who cried wolf at the DE, are now crying wolf at Sic Em, with all of the wrong suggestions that will eviscerate all Ranger DPS options. I'd like to think that I've been a fairly unbiased forum user over the years in terms of balance discussions. Concerning this discussion, I can say that I have proposed nerfs & changes to Soulbeast DPS, including Sic Em, but these suggestions need to be thrown into the right places or Ranger is going to be pigeonholed as a Bunker. I'm warning everyone right now, that if Sic Em is improperly nerfed, It's going to lose its kill power that allows Ranger DPS viability in plat+ divisions. The ironic thing is that, even if we removed Sic Em from the game entirely, the very same players who complain about Soulbeast DPS now, would still be complaining about Soulbeast DPS because they are the players who don't chase ranged attackers, who refuse to LOS, who scream OP in the forums instead of considering what they are doing wrong and what they could be doing better. ALL of those players, would still die to a Ranger with a LB and they would still be in here complaining about how overpowered it is. Where does it end? Where is the true balance from their subjective opinion? Does the desired balance lie within ranged options dealing virtually no threatening damage? Maybe they feel that Longbows & Rifles should be removed from play entirely?

    One thing is certain from my point of view. Arenanet needs to be careful when listening to players who are unable to discern between when something is an annoying l2p issue, and when something is actually overpowered and overrepresented in the top 100 and good AT teams.

    Here is a realistic nerf to Sic Em:

    • The 2000 range needs to be more like 800 range or maybe even 600 but no lower. That 2000 range was designed for pet use when it runs across a map at someone. It was not intended for THE RANGER WITH THE LONGBOW to nuclear strike you from 1500+ range. If the range were lowered to 800ish, this would make the Ranger have to get significantly closer to the target before being able to land the burst. This provides much more counter play in terms of the Ranger having to enter a dangerous position, allowing opponents to be able to quickly get into range with gap closers or other mid range teleport options to be able to catch it and neutralize Sic Em bursting.
    • Sic Em as it stands requires no LOS. I can be behind a wall and reveal a Thief who is on a node, before walking around the wall to engage him. This is actually broken because the Thief has no ability to counter play the reveal before I walk around the wall and LB 4 > LB 2 it to death. And that's just one example of what makes Sic Em strong with no LOS requirement. Sic Em should require LOS to be able to activate, and should only be usable when you are within the range threshold. So if the range were nerfed to 800, the Ranger would need to get close with LOS to even use Sic Em. Again, this encourages the counter player for others that the Ranger has to have LOS and it has to be within a reasonable range for the opponent to be able to counter play the Sic Em, without having to travel through 1500 range of 6.5k LB 1 spams to even engage the Ranger.
    • ^ Those two changes will eliminate easy intermediate gold tier casual freecasting, which I imagine is what is pissing most people off. Those Rangers who aren't even good, but they're 20k nuking you from 1500+ range. My proposed changes will make a cut between good Rangers and bad Rangers. Good Rangers will still be able to utilize Sic Em, even though it will become more dangerous to do. Bad Rangers, will just die when they try to get within 800 range of a decent player. But it is important to note that Sic Em doesn't need a damage nerf. The problem was never the damage, it's the range on Sic Em nuking. Soulbeast damage is on par with things like Herald or Power Mes or Reaper or now Berserker or sometimes good Holos or even Guard Bursts or hell, even DPS Eles & DEs who play well. "Point being everything has big damage now." Here's something to think about: If a Holo could go into forge and somehow stand 1500+ range from you and smack you with every hit, it would feel like being hit with Sic Em. If a Reaper could do the same thing from 1500+ range and spin to win on your head with Reaper 4 or hit you with Reaper 5, it would feel like Sic Em Rapid Fire. If a Soulbeast had to engage you in melee to short mid range with Sic Em, it would feel like engaging a Holo or Reaper or Herald. The problem is not Sic Em DPS, it's the range and utility that it offers.

    You are pretending that only gOLd SCruBs wanted deadeye nerfed when even the best of the best such as sindrener wanted it. Stop lying.

    // Yanim

  • Faux Play.6104Faux Play.6104 Member ✭✭✭

    @Quadox.7834 said:

    @Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:
    Instead of 40/20% damage increase how about a 10% damage increase and pet sniffs out any stealth class in a 600 radius and applies revealed?

    How about keep it where it is. It's prefectly fine. U hear sic em. U dodge. It's easy and as simple as that.sic em literally translate to dodge now so he can't burst you. Just brain dead not to dodge it, when it's telegraphed and litterally shouts at you.

    N if u are going to say what if it's a +1 n u r out of dodges... Well that's part of the game. No different a rev porting on you and bursting or a chorno bursting you.

    I am not even a ranger main.

    This is just a healthy discussion and thought, you can put the nails away because there's no need for it here.

    No one is saying this or that as you implied, its not even an arguement so I wont even bother with the "butwhataboutism"..

    Please keep it friendly and civil, theres no need for the name calling.

    When did I name call? I anticipated what you might say and provided an explanation of my thoughts. I did not write any harsh language.

    I simple wrote how about keep it where it is. I am sorry you find some one who disagrees with you offensive? Lol

    Youre referring to everyone or anyone who thinks the skill might need a tuneup as "noob". This ruins any chance of a healthy discussion about the skill.

    You anticipated because your frame of mind is in the wrong place, this is just a healthy discussion, theres no arguement here.

    I am not offended, I would prefer the thread to stay civilised rather than cop a closure. Some maturity would be appreciated.

    Maybe you are right. I am just tired of reading everything has to be nerfed when I feel that it's pretty balanced right now.

    I apologise for the quick aggro.

    No I understand, this is why I made the thread though.

    I feel after all the complaints Anet will nerf this skill into oblivion soon so I am trying to give an open window for a healthy discussion about the skill hence why my OP is sort of a nerf but also a buff.

    I also feel like I spent alot of time learning this game to get to plat. Had to play the majority of classes to understand the timing and animations. I would hate that skills get nerfed because people who don't bother to learn anything get mad that they die and complain over and over till a spec is basically useless.

    This is basically thief. The whole class has basically been deleted because of people complaining. Even now. When it's auto attack is 2k and a thief can die in 1-2 hits by almost every other class. People complain. It's incredible how this generation people want instant gratification. That they should be legendary in 1 season and if they are not. The gw2 match system is broke or profession skills are unbalanced.

    That's because people in this forum have an incredibly difficult time distinguishing between what is "annoying" and what is actually "overpowered". A great example of this was Deadeye before the nerfs, back when DJ was unblockable, Scope was still 3s of stealth on roll, and the Rifle 4 bug was allowing Lead Attack stacking while out of combat. Deadeye before the nerf had only 2 players in NA who were even capable of playing it past a plat 2 level. It was the least represented class/spec in ranked past top plat 1, even lower than Dragonhunter, and on par with people messing around on Renegade. It had literally "Zero representation in monthly ATs" none, nothing, zilch, nada. Everything in the game countered Deadeye if it cared to go off node and chase it, so long as the player was wise enough to utilize LOS positions and not make himself a sitting duck. Things that hard countered & shut down DE were Core Guards, Dragonhunters, Heralds, All Mesmers, Other Thieves, Any Ranger with Sic Em, Holosmith Reveal, Spellbreaker Reveal. It is because virtually everything in the game countered DE directly, that only 2 people were maverick enough to play it past a plat 2 level. But see people are fickle, they are ignorant, and they are apathetic when things are explained to them. So rather than l2p vs. the DE, the large majority of the player base which hovers in the gold divisions, would develop this self chosen tunnel vision. They would only go to nodes, often rally botting to the mid node, never leave those nodes, and let the DEs free cast against them without ever sending anyone to neutralize it. And then come into the forums whining about how overpowered the DE is. The truth is that these people refused to alter their gameplay. They were fresh off an old HoT meta where there were no high powered ranged classes. LB/GS Power Rangers had been long dead, and LB Druids were light damage, utilizing the LB mostly for the extra stealth and knockback for decaps, not damage. They were years deep into a mentality of going to a node, standing on that node, and not worrying about high powered ranged. So when high powered ranged showed up in PoF with the DE and Sic Em Soulbeasts, the large majority of the player base "the gold divisions" pointed, screamed OP, started a bandwagon, and got a great class which was bringing new dynamic to our old game, nerfed completely out of any possible competitive viability, when in truth it was already weak to begin with and this is reflected in the ridiculously low representation it had in competitive environments.

    Now the same thing will happen to Rangers. The exact same demographic of players who cried wolf at the DE, are now crying wolf at Sic Em, with all of the wrong suggestions that will eviscerate all Ranger DPS options. I'd like to think that I've been a fairly unbiased forum user over the years in terms of balance discussions. Concerning this discussion, I can say that I have proposed nerfs & changes to Soulbeast DPS, including Sic Em, but these suggestions need to be thrown into the right places or Ranger is going to be pigeonholed as a Bunker. I'm warning everyone right now, that if Sic Em is improperly nerfed, It's going to lose its kill power that allows Ranger DPS viability in plat+ divisions. The ironic thing is that, even if we removed Sic Em from the game entirely, the very same players who complain about Soulbeast DPS now, would still be complaining about Soulbeast DPS because they are the players who don't chase ranged attackers, who refuse to LOS, who scream OP in the forums instead of considering what they are doing wrong and what they could be doing better. ALL of those players, would still die to a Ranger with a LB and they would still be in here complaining about how overpowered it is. Where does it end? Where is the true balance from their subjective opinion? Does the desired balance lie within ranged options dealing virtually no threatening damage? Maybe they feel that Longbows & Rifles should be removed from play entirely?

    One thing is certain from my point of view. Arenanet needs to be careful when listening to players who are unable to discern between when something is an annoying l2p issue, and when something is actually overpowered and overrepresented in the top 100 and good AT teams.

    Here is a realistic nerf to Sic Em:

    • The 2000 range needs to be more like 800 range or maybe even 600 but no lower. That 2000 range was designed for pet use when it runs across a map at someone. It was not intended for THE RANGER WITH THE LONGBOW to nuclear strike you from 1500+ range. If the range were lowered to 800ish, this would make the Ranger have to get significantly closer to the target before being able to land the burst. This provides much more counter play in terms of the Ranger having to enter a dangerous position, allowing opponents to be able to quickly get into range with gap closers or other mid range teleport options to be able to catch it and neutralize Sic Em bursting.
    • Sic Em as it stands requires no LOS. I can be behind a wall and reveal a Thief who is on a node, before walking around the wall to engage him. This is actually broken because the Thief has no ability to counter play the reveal before I walk around the wall and LB 4 > LB 2 it to death. And that's just one example of what makes Sic Em strong with no LOS requirement. Sic Em should require LOS to be able to activate, and should only be usable when you are within the range threshold. So if the range were nerfed to 800, the Ranger would need to get close with LOS to even use Sic Em. Again, this encourages the counter player for others that the Ranger has to have LOS and it has to be within a reasonable range for the opponent to be able to counter play the Sic Em, without having to travel through 1500 range of 6.5k LB 1 spams to even engage the Ranger.
    • ^ Those two changes will eliminate easy intermediate gold tier casual freecasting, which I imagine is what is pissing most people off. Those Rangers who aren't even good, but they're 20k nuking you from 1500+ range. My proposed changes will make a cut between good Rangers and bad Rangers. Good Rangers will still be able to utilize Sic Em, even though it will become more dangerous to do. Bad Rangers, will just die when they try to get within 800 range of a decent player. But it is important to note that Sic Em doesn't need a damage nerf. The problem was never the damage, it's the range on Sic Em nuking. Soulbeast damage is on par with things like Herald or Power Mes or Reaper or now Berserker or sometimes good Holos or even Guard Bursts or hell, even DPS Eles & DEs who play well. "Point being everything has big damage now." Here's something to think about: If a Holo could go into forge and somehow stand 1500+ range from you and smack you with every hit, it would feel like being hit with Sic Em. If a Reaper could do the same thing from 1500+ range and spin to win on your head with Reaper 4 or hit you with Reaper 5, it would feel like Sic Em Rapid Fire. If a Soulbeast had to engage you in melee to short mid range with Sic Em, it would feel like engaging a Holo or Reaper or Herald. The problem is not Sic Em DPS, it's the range and utility that it offers.

    You are pretending that only gOLd SCruBs wanted deadeye nerfed when even the best of the best such as sindrener wanted it. Stop lying.

    He probably wanted it neelrfed because he knew something was going to pay for the all the qq, and core thief can't afford to lose much.

  • Eurantien.4632Eurantien.4632 Member ✭✭✭

    @Quadox.7834 said:

    @Eurantien.4632 said:

    @Quadox.7834 said:

    @Eurantien.4632 said:

    @Nox.6785 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:
    Instead of 40/20% damage increase how about a 10% damage increase and pet sniffs out any stealth class in a 600 radius and applies revealed?

    How about keep it where it is. It's prefectly fine. U hear sic em. U dodge. It's easy and as simple as that.sic em literally translate to dodge now so he can't burst you. Just brain dead not to dodge it, when it's telegraphed and litterally shouts at you.

    N if u are going to say what if it's a +1 n u r out of dodges... Well that's part of the game. No different a rev porting on you and bursting or a chorno bursting you.

    I am not even a ranger main.

    This is just a healthy discussion and thought, you can put the nails away because there's no need for it here.

    No one is saying this or that as you implied, its not even an arguement so I wont even bother with the "butwhataboutism"..

    Please keep it friendly and civil, theres no need for the name calling.

    When did I name call? I anticipated what you might say and provided an explanation of my thoughts. I did not write any harsh language.

    I simple wrote how about keep it where it is. I am sorry you find some one who disagrees with you offensive? Lol

    Youre referring to everyone or anyone who thinks the skill might need a tuneup as "noob". This ruins any chance of a healthy discussion about the skill.

    You anticipated because your frame of mind is in the wrong place, this is just a healthy discussion, theres no arguement here.

    I am not offended, I would prefer the thread to stay civilised rather than cop a closure. Some maturity would be appreciated.

    Maybe you are right. I am just tired of reading everything has to be nerfed when I feel that it's pretty balanced right now.

    I apologise for the quick aggro.

    No I understand, this is why I made the thread though.

    I feel after all the complaints Anet will nerf this skill into oblivion soon so I am trying to give an open window for a healthy discussion about the skill hence why my OP is sort of a nerf but also a buff.

    I also feel like I spent alot of time learning this game to get to plat. Had to play the majority of classes to understand the timing and animations. I would hate that skills get nerfed because people who don't bother to learn anything get mad that they die and complain over and over till a spec is basically useless.

    This is basically thief. The whole class has basically been deleted because of people complaining. Even now. When it's auto attack is 2k and a thief can die in 1-2 hits by almost every other class. People complain. It's incredible how this generation people want instant gratification. That they should be legendary in 1 season and if they are not. The gw2 match system is broke or profession skills are unbalanced.

    Yes exactly like Thief in a way... If you read the forums you'll see that we agree with eachother - https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/75069/earth-overload-is-op-and-needs-nerf#latest

    I'll send you a pm.

    Hah yeah I am quick to anger when I read about nerfs. Except for Condi mes last season. Even after playing it for a whole season I couldn't beat it with my other classes. Except prot holo. But I don't want to specifically play prot Holo just because I see a mirage. With the sceptor Nerf now I am finally ok to lose to a mirage.

    Unless it's power. Power mirage is totally ok. Dodge 1 shot. U can kill it.

    So don't touch Sic Em but nerf Mirage? You're a special kind of special aren't ya.

    Just dissuading misinformation, power Mesmer is god tier near the skill ceiling, that's being said. Only one player plays it to that's level. That's an issue with this game.

    Mesmer stomps noobs but not for the same reasons it stomps top players. So it could be nerfed one way and not punish noobs so hard with mantra nerfs but still be god tier at top tier.

    Power ranger stomps noobs but isn't quite viable at top tier (well it kind of is now with sic em, but just barely). Which means nerfing it would most likely make it unviable... and it wouldn't still stomp noobs by design.

    When something stomps noobs and is viable at top tier it's easy to tone down, but when you have a negative slope for effectiveness vs skill level, then that's really hard to balance and this is where power ranger usually sits at.

    Power Ranger is god tier near the skill ceiling, that's being said. Only zero players plays it to that's level. That's an issue with this game.

    Burden of proof lies with you to prove that it's god tier.

    Lol, where did you prove that power mesmer is god tier?

    Zeromis is god tier.

  • Quadox.7834Quadox.7834 Member ✭✭✭
    edited May 6, 2019

    @Eurantien.4632 said:

    @Quadox.7834 said:

    @Eurantien.4632 said:

    @Quadox.7834 said:

    @Eurantien.4632 said:

    @Nox.6785 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:
    Instead of 40/20% damage increase how about a 10% damage increase and pet sniffs out any stealth class in a 600 radius and applies revealed?

    How about keep it where it is. It's prefectly fine. U hear sic em. U dodge. It's easy and as simple as that.sic em literally translate to dodge now so he can't burst you. Just brain dead not to dodge it, when it's telegraphed and litterally shouts at you.

    N if u are going to say what if it's a +1 n u r out of dodges... Well that's part of the game. No different a rev porting on you and bursting or a chorno bursting you.

    I am not even a ranger main.

    This is just a healthy discussion and thought, you can put the nails away because there's no need for it here.

    No one is saying this or that as you implied, its not even an arguement so I wont even bother with the "butwhataboutism"..

    Please keep it friendly and civil, theres no need for the name calling.

    When did I name call? I anticipated what you might say and provided an explanation of my thoughts. I did not write any harsh language.

    I simple wrote how about keep it where it is. I am sorry you find some one who disagrees with you offensive? Lol

    Youre referring to everyone or anyone who thinks the skill might need a tuneup as "noob". This ruins any chance of a healthy discussion about the skill.

    You anticipated because your frame of mind is in the wrong place, this is just a healthy discussion, theres no arguement here.

    I am not offended, I would prefer the thread to stay civilised rather than cop a closure. Some maturity would be appreciated.

    Maybe you are right. I am just tired of reading everything has to be nerfed when I feel that it's pretty balanced right now.

    I apologise for the quick aggro.

    No I understand, this is why I made the thread though.

    I feel after all the complaints Anet will nerf this skill into oblivion soon so I am trying to give an open window for a healthy discussion about the skill hence why my OP is sort of a nerf but also a buff.

    I also feel like I spent alot of time learning this game to get to plat. Had to play the majority of classes to understand the timing and animations. I would hate that skills get nerfed because people who don't bother to learn anything get mad that they die and complain over and over till a spec is basically useless.

    This is basically thief. The whole class has basically been deleted because of people complaining. Even now. When it's auto attack is 2k and a thief can die in 1-2 hits by almost every other class. People complain. It's incredible how this generation people want instant gratification. That they should be legendary in 1 season and if they are not. The gw2 match system is broke or profession skills are unbalanced.

    Yes exactly like Thief in a way... If you read the forums you'll see that we agree with eachother - https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/75069/earth-overload-is-op-and-needs-nerf#latest

    I'll send you a pm.

    Hah yeah I am quick to anger when I read about nerfs. Except for Condi mes last season. Even after playing it for a whole season I couldn't beat it with my other classes. Except prot holo. But I don't want to specifically play prot Holo just because I see a mirage. With the sceptor Nerf now I am finally ok to lose to a mirage.

    Unless it's power. Power mirage is totally ok. Dodge 1 shot. U can kill it.

    So don't touch Sic Em but nerf Mirage? You're a special kind of special aren't ya.

    Just dissuading misinformation, power Mesmer is god tier near the skill ceiling, that's being said. Only one player plays it to that's level. That's an issue with this game.

    Mesmer stomps noobs but not for the same reasons it stomps top players. So it could be nerfed one way and not punish noobs so hard with mantra nerfs but still be god tier at top tier.

    Power ranger stomps noobs but isn't quite viable at top tier (well it kind of is now with sic em, but just barely). Which means nerfing it would most likely make it unviable... and it wouldn't still stomp noobs by design.

    When something stomps noobs and is viable at top tier it's easy to tone down, but when you have a negative slope for effectiveness vs skill level, then that's really hard to balance and this is where power ranger usually sits at.

    Power Ranger is god tier near the skill ceiling, that's being said. Only zero players plays it to that's level. That's an issue with this game.

    Burden of proof lies with you to prove that it's god tier.

    Lol, where did you prove that power mesmer is god tier?

    Zeromis is god tier.

    Rom is god tier.

    // Yanim

  • Stand The Wall.6987Stand The Wall.6987 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 6, 2019

    @Trevor Boyer.6524 said:
    A great example of this was Deadeye before the nerfs, back when DJ was unblockable, Scope was still 3s of stealth on roll, and the Rifle 4 bug was allowing Lead Attack stacking while out of combat. Deadeye before the nerf had only 2 players in NA who were even capable of playing it past a plat 2 level.

    I think most of the complaints came from wvw roaming. also stealth on dodge is one of the worst mechanics to have ever entered the game.

    you don't know till you know, ya know.

  • TorQ.7041TorQ.7041 Member ✭✭✭
    edited May 6, 2019

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:

    @Trevor Boyer.6524 said:
    A great example of this was Deadeye before the nerfs, back when DJ was unblockable, Scope was still 3s of stealth on roll, and the Rifle 4 bug was allowing Lead Attack stacking while out of combat. Deadeye before the nerf had only 2 players in NA who were even capable of playing it past a plat 2 level.

    I think most of the complaints came from wvw roaming. also stealth on dodge is one of the worst mechanics to have ever entered the game.

    It's because the deadeye defenses they never thought about. They had to make this to make it surivivable. Now that they removed it it's a meme spec. They need to make skill 4 instant cast. So DE can stay for that second more. Get rid of kneel and make it like mesmer torch 4. a 1 time stealth. Make rifle range 1500.

    Right now sic em is just far superior in every single way. More hp, higher mobility, defense traits and skills , arguebly higher and faster dmg.

  • Eurantien.4632Eurantien.4632 Member ✭✭✭

    @Quadox.7834 said:

    @Eurantien.4632 said:

    @Quadox.7834 said:

    @Eurantien.4632 said:

    @Quadox.7834 said:

    @Eurantien.4632 said:

    @Nox.6785 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:
    Instead of 40/20% damage increase how about a 10% damage increase and pet sniffs out any stealth class in a 600 radius and applies revealed?

    How about keep it where it is. It's prefectly fine. U hear sic em. U dodge. It's easy and as simple as that.sic em literally translate to dodge now so he can't burst you. Just brain dead not to dodge it, when it's telegraphed and litterally shouts at you.

    N if u are going to say what if it's a +1 n u r out of dodges... Well that's part of the game. No different a rev porting on you and bursting or a chorno bursting you.

    I am not even a ranger main.

    This is just a healthy discussion and thought, you can put the nails away because there's no need for it here.

    No one is saying this or that as you implied, its not even an arguement so I wont even bother with the "butwhataboutism"..

    Please keep it friendly and civil, theres no need for the name calling.

    When did I name call? I anticipated what you might say and provided an explanation of my thoughts. I did not write any harsh language.

    I simple wrote how about keep it where it is. I am sorry you find some one who disagrees with you offensive? Lol

    Youre referring to everyone or anyone who thinks the skill might need a tuneup as "noob". This ruins any chance of a healthy discussion about the skill.

    You anticipated because your frame of mind is in the wrong place, this is just a healthy discussion, theres no arguement here.

    I am not offended, I would prefer the thread to stay civilised rather than cop a closure. Some maturity would be appreciated.

    Maybe you are right. I am just tired of reading everything has to be nerfed when I feel that it's pretty balanced right now.

    I apologise for the quick aggro.

    No I understand, this is why I made the thread though.

    I feel after all the complaints Anet will nerf this skill into oblivion soon so I am trying to give an open window for a healthy discussion about the skill hence why my OP is sort of a nerf but also a buff.

    I also feel like I spent alot of time learning this game to get to plat. Had to play the majority of classes to understand the timing and animations. I would hate that skills get nerfed because people who don't bother to learn anything get mad that they die and complain over and over till a spec is basically useless.

    This is basically thief. The whole class has basically been deleted because of people complaining. Even now. When it's auto attack is 2k and a thief can die in 1-2 hits by almost every other class. People complain. It's incredible how this generation people want instant gratification. That they should be legendary in 1 season and if they are not. The gw2 match system is broke or profession skills are unbalanced.

    Yes exactly like Thief in a way... If you read the forums you'll see that we agree with eachother - https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/75069/earth-overload-is-op-and-needs-nerf#latest

    I'll send you a pm.

    Hah yeah I am quick to anger when I read about nerfs. Except for Condi mes last season. Even after playing it for a whole season I couldn't beat it with my other classes. Except prot holo. But I don't want to specifically play prot Holo just because I see a mirage. With the sceptor Nerf now I am finally ok to lose to a mirage.

    Unless it's power. Power mirage is totally ok. Dodge 1 shot. U can kill it.

    So don't touch Sic Em but nerf Mirage? You're a special kind of special aren't ya.

    Just dissuading misinformation, power Mesmer is god tier near the skill ceiling, that's being said. Only one player plays it to that's level. That's an issue with this game.

    Mesmer stomps noobs but not for the same reasons it stomps top players. So it could be nerfed one way and not punish noobs so hard with mantra nerfs but still be god tier at top tier.

    Power ranger stomps noobs but isn't quite viable at top tier (well it kind of is now with sic em, but just barely). Which means nerfing it would most likely make it unviable... and it wouldn't still stomp noobs by design.

    When something stomps noobs and is viable at top tier it's easy to tone down, but when you have a negative slope for effectiveness vs skill level, then that's really hard to balance and this is where power ranger usually sits at.

    Power Ranger is god tier near the skill ceiling, that's being said. Only zero players plays it to that's level. That's an issue with this game.

    Burden of proof lies with you to prove that it's god tier.

    Lol, where did you prove that power mesmer is god tier?

    Zeromis is god tier.

    Rom is god tier.

    Well, clearly there is no reasoning with you. Soulbeast just flat out isn't god tier and doesn't have the capabilities to ever be that high. The kit is just not there.

  • Quadox.7834Quadox.7834 Member ✭✭✭
    edited May 7, 2019

    @Eurantien.4632 said:

    @Quadox.7834 said:

    @Eurantien.4632 said:

    @Quadox.7834 said:

    @Eurantien.4632 said:

    @Quadox.7834 said:

    @Eurantien.4632 said:

    @Nox.6785 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:
    Instead of 40/20% damage increase how about a 10% damage increase and pet sniffs out any stealth class in a 600 radius and applies revealed?

    How about keep it where it is. It's prefectly fine. U hear sic em. U dodge. It's easy and as simple as that.sic em literally translate to dodge now so he can't burst you. Just brain dead not to dodge it, when it's telegraphed and litterally shouts at you.

    N if u are going to say what if it's a +1 n u r out of dodges... Well that's part of the game. No different a rev porting on you and bursting or a chorno bursting you.

    I am not even a ranger main.

    This is just a healthy discussion and thought, you can put the nails away because there's no need for it here.

    No one is saying this or that as you implied, its not even an arguement so I wont even bother with the "butwhataboutism"..

    Please keep it friendly and civil, theres no need for the name calling.

    When did I name call? I anticipated what you might say and provided an explanation of my thoughts. I did not write any harsh language.

    I simple wrote how about keep it where it is. I am sorry you find some one who disagrees with you offensive? Lol

    Youre referring to everyone or anyone who thinks the skill might need a tuneup as "noob". This ruins any chance of a healthy discussion about the skill.

    You anticipated because your frame of mind is in the wrong place, this is just a healthy discussion, theres no arguement here.

    I am not offended, I would prefer the thread to stay civilised rather than cop a closure. Some maturity would be appreciated.

    Maybe you are right. I am just tired of reading everything has to be nerfed when I feel that it's pretty balanced right now.

    I apologise for the quick aggro.

    No I understand, this is why I made the thread though.

    I feel after all the complaints Anet will nerf this skill into oblivion soon so I am trying to give an open window for a healthy discussion about the skill hence why my OP is sort of a nerf but also a buff.

    I also feel like I spent alot of time learning this game to get to plat. Had to play the majority of classes to understand the timing and animations. I would hate that skills get nerfed because people who don't bother to learn anything get mad that they die and complain over and over till a spec is basically useless.

    This is basically thief. The whole class has basically been deleted because of people complaining. Even now. When it's auto attack is 2k and a thief can die in 1-2 hits by almost every other class. People complain. It's incredible how this generation people want instant gratification. That they should be legendary in 1 season and if they are not. The gw2 match system is broke or profession skills are unbalanced.

    Yes exactly like Thief in a way... If you read the forums you'll see that we agree with eachother - https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/75069/earth-overload-is-op-and-needs-nerf#latest

    I'll send you a pm.

    Hah yeah I am quick to anger when I read about nerfs. Except for Condi mes last season. Even after playing it for a whole season I couldn't beat it with my other classes. Except prot holo. But I don't want to specifically play prot Holo just because I see a mirage. With the sceptor Nerf now I am finally ok to lose to a mirage.

    Unless it's power. Power mirage is totally ok. Dodge 1 shot. U can kill it.

    So don't touch Sic Em but nerf Mirage? You're a special kind of special aren't ya.

    Just dissuading misinformation, power Mesmer is god tier near the skill ceiling, that's being said. Only one player plays it to that's level. That's an issue with this game.

    Mesmer stomps noobs but not for the same reasons it stomps top players. So it could be nerfed one way and not punish noobs so hard with mantra nerfs but still be god tier at top tier.

    Power ranger stomps noobs but isn't quite viable at top tier (well it kind of is now with sic em, but just barely). Which means nerfing it would most likely make it unviable... and it wouldn't still stomp noobs by design.

    When something stomps noobs and is viable at top tier it's easy to tone down, but when you have a negative slope for effectiveness vs skill level, then that's really hard to balance and this is where power ranger usually sits at.

    Power Ranger is god tier near the skill ceiling, that's being said. Only zero players plays it to that's level. That's an issue with this game.

    Burden of proof lies with you to prove that it's god tier.

    Lol, where did you prove that power mesmer is god tier?

    Zeromis is god tier.

    Rom is god tier.

    Well, clearly there is no reasoning with you. Soulbeast just flat out isn't god tier and doesn't have the capabilities to ever be that high. The kit is just not there.

    Asserting something, such as that power mirage is god tier and zeromis is god tier, is not reasoning.

    This exchange of ours is to display the double-standard in your demands for proof and placing the burden on me. All I have done is essentially copy your statements and pose them back at you. Alarm bells should go off in your mind when your own reasoning doesn't hold up to scrutiny from yourself.

    But I respect your opinion.

    // Yanim

  • Eurantien.4632Eurantien.4632 Member ✭✭✭

    @Quadox.7834 said:

    @Eurantien.4632 said:

    @Quadox.7834 said:

    @Eurantien.4632 said:

    @Quadox.7834 said:

    @Eurantien.4632 said:

    @Quadox.7834 said:

    @Eurantien.4632 said:

    @Nox.6785 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:
    Instead of 40/20% damage increase how about a 10% damage increase and pet sniffs out any stealth class in a 600 radius and applies revealed?

    How about keep it where it is. It's prefectly fine. U hear sic em. U dodge. It's easy and as simple as that.sic em literally translate to dodge now so he can't burst you. Just brain dead not to dodge it, when it's telegraphed and litterally shouts at you.

    N if u are going to say what if it's a +1 n u r out of dodges... Well that's part of the game. No different a rev porting on you and bursting or a chorno bursting you.

    I am not even a ranger main.

    This is just a healthy discussion and thought, you can put the nails away because there's no need for it here.

    No one is saying this or that as you implied, its not even an arguement so I wont even bother with the "butwhataboutism"..

    Please keep it friendly and civil, theres no need for the name calling.

    When did I name call? I anticipated what you might say and provided an explanation of my thoughts. I did not write any harsh language.

    I simple wrote how about keep it where it is. I am sorry you find some one who disagrees with you offensive? Lol

    Youre referring to everyone or anyone who thinks the skill might need a tuneup as "noob". This ruins any chance of a healthy discussion about the skill.

    You anticipated because your frame of mind is in the wrong place, this is just a healthy discussion, theres no arguement here.

    I am not offended, I would prefer the thread to stay civilised rather than cop a closure. Some maturity would be appreciated.

    Maybe you are right. I am just tired of reading everything has to be nerfed when I feel that it's pretty balanced right now.

    I apologise for the quick aggro.

    No I understand, this is why I made the thread though.

    I feel after all the complaints Anet will nerf this skill into oblivion soon so I am trying to give an open window for a healthy discussion about the skill hence why my OP is sort of a nerf but also a buff.

    I also feel like I spent alot of time learning this game to get to plat. Had to play the majority of classes to understand the timing and animations. I would hate that skills get nerfed because people who don't bother to learn anything get mad that they die and complain over and over till a spec is basically useless.

    This is basically thief. The whole class has basically been deleted because of people complaining. Even now. When it's auto attack is 2k and a thief can die in 1-2 hits by almost every other class. People complain. It's incredible how this generation people want instant gratification. That they should be legendary in 1 season and if they are not. The gw2 match system is broke or profession skills are unbalanced.

    Yes exactly like Thief in a way... If you read the forums you'll see that we agree with eachother - https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/75069/earth-overload-is-op-and-needs-nerf#latest

    I'll send you a pm.

    Hah yeah I am quick to anger when I read about nerfs. Except for Condi mes last season. Even after playing it for a whole season I couldn't beat it with my other classes. Except prot holo. But I don't want to specifically play prot Holo just because I see a mirage. With the sceptor Nerf now I am finally ok to lose to a mirage.

    Unless it's power. Power mirage is totally ok. Dodge 1 shot. U can kill it.

    So don't touch Sic Em but nerf Mirage? You're a special kind of special aren't ya.

    Just dissuading misinformation, power Mesmer is god tier near the skill ceiling, that's being said. Only one player plays it to that's level. That's an issue with this game.

    Mesmer stomps noobs but not for the same reasons it stomps top players. So it could be nerfed one way and not punish noobs so hard with mantra nerfs but still be god tier at top tier.

    Power ranger stomps noobs but isn't quite viable at top tier (well it kind of is now with sic em, but just barely). Which means nerfing it would most likely make it unviable... and it wouldn't still stomp noobs by design.

    When something stomps noobs and is viable at top tier it's easy to tone down, but when you have a negative slope for effectiveness vs skill level, then that's really hard to balance and this is where power ranger usually sits at.

    Power Ranger is god tier near the skill ceiling, that's being said. Only zero players plays it to that's level. That's an issue with this game.

    Burden of proof lies with you to prove that it's god tier.

    Lol, where did you prove that power mesmer is god tier?

    Zeromis is god tier.

    Rom is god tier.

    Well, clearly there is no reasoning with you. Soulbeast just flat out isn't god tier and doesn't have the capabilities to ever be that high. The kit is just not there.

    Asserting something, such as that power mirage is god tier and zeromis is god tier, is not reasoning.

    This exchange of ours is to display the double-standard in your demands for proof and placing the burden on me. All I have done is essentially copy your statements and pose them back at you. Alarm bells should go off in your mind when your own reasoning doesn't hold up to scrutiny from yourself.

    But I respect your opinion.

    Well, I can't beat you in words on the forum because although I am right and you are wrong, you could just say the same thing back.

    Unfortunately for you, Zeromis is actually god tier and thus shows power mesmer's potential of being god tier.

    Although, you can just say the opposite that you're right and I am wrong. You're problem is you're saying Rom is god tier and so is soulbeast. Which just is blatantly false. Soulbeast doens't have the kit to be god tier, and in terms of good soulbeasts, all the good soulbeasts are pretty much of the same skill level. None of which are god tier.

    If you could see this in game, I think you'd understand. Unfortunately there is no winning on the forums. You could claim that I'm not evaluating on an objective basis, but I am. Soulbeast just doesn't have the kit for Rom to be god tier - you even said yourself there is no one who plays ranger to that high a level. Power mesmer on the other hand does have the kit to be god tier - and there is a player who plays it to that level.

  • Quadox.7834Quadox.7834 Member ✭✭✭
    edited May 7, 2019

    @Eurantien.4632 said:

    @Quadox.7834 said:

    @Eurantien.4632 said:

    @Quadox.7834 said:

    @Eurantien.4632 said:

    @Quadox.7834 said:

    @Eurantien.4632 said:

    @Quadox.7834 said:

    @Eurantien.4632 said:

    @Nox.6785 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @TorQ.7041 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:
    Instead of 40/20% damage increase how about a 10% damage increase and pet sniffs out any stealth class in a 600 radius and applies revealed?

    How about keep it where it is. It's prefectly fine. U hear sic em. U dodge. It's easy and as simple as that.sic em literally translate to dodge now so he can't burst you. Just brain dead not to dodge it, when it's telegraphed and litterally shouts at you.

    N if u are going to say what if it's a +1 n u r out of dodges... Well that's part of the game. No different a rev porting on you and bursting or a chorno bursting you.

    I am not even a ranger main.

    This is just a healthy discussion and thought, you can put the nails away because there's no need for it here.

    No one is saying this or that as you implied, its not even an arguement so I wont even bother with the "butwhataboutism"..

    Please keep it friendly and civil, theres no need for the name calling.

    When did I name call? I anticipated what you might say and provided an explanation of my thoughts. I did not write any harsh language.

    I simple wrote how about keep it where it is. I am sorry you find some one who disagrees with you offensive? Lol

    Youre referring to everyone or anyone who thinks the skill might need a tuneup as "noob". This ruins any chance of a healthy discussion about the skill.

    You anticipated because your frame of mind is in the wrong place, this is just a healthy discussion, theres no arguement here.

    I am not offended, I would prefer the thread to stay civilised rather than cop a closure. Some maturity would be appreciated.

    Maybe you are right. I am just tired of reading everything has to be nerfed when I feel that it's pretty balanced right now.

    I apologise for the quick aggro.

    No I understand, this is why I made the thread though.

    I feel after all the complaints Anet will nerf this skill into oblivion soon so I am trying to give an open window for a healthy discussion about the skill hence why my OP is sort of a nerf but also a buff.

    I also feel like I spent alot of time learning this game to get to plat. Had to play the majority of classes to understand the timing and animations. I would hate that skills get nerfed because people who don't bother to learn anything get mad that they die and complain over and over till a spec is basically useless.

    This is basically thief. The whole class has basically been deleted because of people complaining. Even now. When it's auto attack is 2k and a thief can die in 1-2 hits by almost every other class. People complain. It's incredible how this generation people want instant gratification. That they should be legendary in 1 season and if they are not. The gw2 match system is broke or profession skills are unbalanced.

    Yes exactly like Thief in a way... If you read the forums you'll see that we agree with eachother - https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/75069/earth-overload-is-op-and-needs-nerf#latest

    I'll send you a pm.

    Hah yeah I am quick to anger when I read about nerfs. Except for Condi mes last season. Even after playing it for a whole season I couldn't beat it with my other classes. Except prot holo. But I don't want to specifically play prot Holo just because I see a mirage. With the sceptor Nerf now I am finally ok to lose to a mirage.

    Unless it's power. Power mirage is totally ok. Dodge 1 shot. U can kill it.

    So don't touch Sic Em but nerf Mirage? You're a special kind of special aren't ya.

    Just dissuading misinformation, power Mesmer is god tier near the skill ceiling, that's being said. Only one player plays it to that's level. That's an issue with this game.

    Mesmer stomps noobs but not for the same reasons it stomps top players. So it could be nerfed one way and not punish noobs so hard with mantra nerfs but still be god tier at top tier.

    Power ranger stomps noobs but isn't quite viable at top tier (well it kind of is now with sic em, but just barely). Which means nerfing it would most likely make it unviable... and it wouldn't still stomp noobs by design.

    When something stomps noobs and is viable at top tier it's easy to tone down, but when you have a negative slope for effectiveness vs skill level, then that's really hard to balance and this is where power ranger usually sits at.

    Power Ranger is god tier near the skill ceiling, that's being said. Only zero players plays it to that's level. That's an issue with this game.

    Burden of proof lies with you to prove that it's god tier.

    Lol, where did you prove that power mesmer is god tier?

    Zeromis is god tier.

    Rom is god tier.

    Well, clearly there is no reasoning with you. Soulbeast just flat out isn't god tier and doesn't have the capabilities to ever be that high. The kit is just not there.

    Asserting something, such as that power mirage is god tier and zeromis is god tier, is not reasoning.

    This exchange of ours is to display the double-standard in your demands for proof and placing the burden on me. All I have done is essentially copy your statements and pose them back at you. Alarm bells should go off in your mind when your own reasoning doesn't hold up to scrutiny from yourself.

    But I respect your opinion.

    Well, I can't beat you in words on the forum because although I am right and you are wrong, you could just say the same thing back.

    Unfortunately for you, Zeromis is actually god tier and thus shows power mesmer's potential of being god tier.

    Although, you can just say the opposite that you're right and I am wrong. You're problem is you're saying Rom is god tier and so is soulbeast. Which just is blatantly false. Soulbeast doens't have the kit to be god tier, and in terms of good soulbeasts, all the good soulbeasts are pretty much of the same skill level. None of which are god tier.

    So if all the good soilbeasts are about the same skill level, below god tier, how do you know what the class is capable of at a god tier skill level? In your own words the best mesmer is of a higher level level than the best ranger. Logically, this means that his performance should also be better, no?

    If you could see this in game, I think you'd understand.

    I an on EU. I could see his streams and AT vods though.

    Unfortunately there is no winning on the forums. You could claim that I'm not evaluating on an objective basis, but I am.

    You are most likely evaluating and forming your opinion based on feelings in combination with past experiences. If it were purely objective reasoning you could just tell me the specific criteria your rating system is based on.

    But I don't demand that you should be completely objective because I don't think that's really possible when evaluating the performance of a build, sadly.

    Soulbeast just doesn't have the kit for Rom to be god tier - you even said yourself there is no one who plays ranger to that high a level.

    Nah don't get me wrong, I'm not convinced there is anyone who plays mesmer to that level (god tier). I don't yet know what you based that on.

    Even if we suppose that you are correct that zeromis is god tier and his performance is god tier, all you are saying is that god tier skill -> god tier performance. If the best rangers are of lower skill tier (by your own saying), then they should also have lower performance.

    Power mesmer on the other hand does have the kit to be god tier - and there is a player who plays it to that level.

    This would have been easier to grasp back in the day of portal+moa but nowadays I believe this needs specifying and clarifying.

    // Yanim

  • Ario.8964Ario.8964 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Make sic em not affect the player when they merge with their pet or change the skill to only give 10% damage to the ranger when they are merged while keeping the pet 40% increase outside of beastmode. Then fix damage modifiers in this game to work the same as damage reductions (multiplicative bonuses, not additive. This will help with the damage mod stacking problem we see everywhere in game) and boom you remove the 1 shot cancer but slb still gets a burst combo that actually works.

  • Trevor Boyer.6524Trevor Boyer.6524 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 7, 2019

    @Quadox.7834

    Ok, so here is what it's like for me when I read things that you say in forum threads:

    • Someone makes a statement with evidence & facts, and sometimes they drop very detailed explanations for the statement. Everything they are saying to support their subjective opinion makes sense, and I understand where they are coming from even if I don't agree with it.
    • You come in, and rather than respond with facts & evidence to support any actual claim that you could have made from your own subjective experience, you instead choose to use Lincoln Douglas styled debate tactics full of metaphysical & philosophical distractions in attempts to discredit the reputable statements of others.
    • And then I always wonder: "Is he going to actually make a statement with evidence for us to compare & contrast?" Forum users can't really have any productive discussions with you if you only ever argue but never make an evident statement of your own.

    Just a heads up. Also, what Eurantien is telling you is true. Any Ranger player in the top 50 or in a good AT team would tell you the exact same things concerning how Ranger currently sizes up in top tier play vs. other classes/builds.

    Ranger isn't as strong as people think it is. The problem we have with Ranger discussion is that the things that Ranger counters, it counters very hard, and those are the people who believe it is overpowered. Then you have the things that counter the Ranger, and they counter it so hard that those players believe Ranger isn't really a threat at all. With other classes, they may counter something just enough to where they should be winning or getting countered just enough to where they know they'll lose but they can still run. This is completely different for Ranger. Ranger gets to hard counter destroy some things, but get countered so hard by other things that they need to avoid those classes/builds entirely. <- It is this extreme variance in Counter vs. Get Countered, that makes Ranger balance discussion difficult to properly engage.

    Subsequently, all of the above ^ is the same problem the Deadeye had. For all of the weakness it had vs most of the classes, there were some things that it countered so hard, that it truly was unfair. If you were to look at the balance of Deadeye pre-patch in a macro way, Deadeye was weak overall concerning its ultimate impact in a game. But if you were look at the balance of Deadeye from the subjective point of view of something like a Necromancer, we can see how unfair and frustrating it must have felt to be a Necromancer and get farmed all game. This is the same kind of effect that Sic Em Soulbeasts have. They counter some things too hard, but get countered too hard by other things. But at the end of day, the people complaining and saying how OP it is, will be heard over anything else, and this is how classes get nerfed into the dirt.

    ^ Consider this before crying wolf

  • Zephoid.4263Zephoid.4263 Member ✭✭✭

    Then make ranger top teir play not revolve around OHK burst. Buff it in areas that improve its sustain to counteract the loss, but sic-em has to go.

    The ability to stack damage mods is absurd. Nothing else in the game comes close to buffing so much in a single skill. Guard just got their conditional 50% crit trait nerfed and no dps guard was remotely close to top teir. Now that Unblockable goes through Magnetic Aura and Poison Cloud, even counters to LB are getting nerfed. 'just dodge' 3s of attacks is completely absurd. Much the same as 'just los' when 2/3 of these maps have easy areas where there are almost no LOS areas without disengaging completely and giving up points. Fights aren't just 1v1. LOS and dodge aren't always available and shouldn't be required-or-die. Especially not from 1800 range.

    To top it off, i posted a screenshot a few weeks ago of a 26k GS Maul from stealth. At its worst, DJ could never do that and required a hell of a lot more setup.

  • Trevor Boyer.6524Trevor Boyer.6524 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 7, 2019

    @Zephoid.4263 said:
    Then make ranger top teir play not revolve around OHK burst. Buff it in areas that improve its sustain to counteract the loss, but sic-em has to go.

    The ability to stack damage mods is absurd. Nothing else in the game comes close to buffing so much in a single skill. Guard just got their conditional 50% crit trait nerfed and no dps guard was remotely close to top teir. Now that Unblockable goes through Magnetic Aura and Poison Cloud, even counters to LB are getting nerfed. 'just dodge' 3s of attacks is completely absurd. Much the same as 'just los' when 2/3 of these maps have easy areas where there are almost no LOS areas without disengaging completely and giving up points. Fights aren't just 1v1. LOS and dodge aren't always available and shouldn't be required-or-die. Especially not from 1800 range.

    To top it off, i posted a screenshot a few weeks ago of a 26k GS Maul from stealth. At its worst, DJ could never do that and required a hell of a lot more setup.

    There is a great misunderstanding of how difficult it is to set up and land a 26k GS Maul without the EC Sword Buff and how much risk vs. reward goes into that. There is also a great misunderstanding of how incredibly small the representation is of players who even run builds that could compare to that kind of damage. To my knowledge there is only one person in all of NA who even runs a build that could land a single strike 26k GS Maul without the EC Sword Buff, and that would be @Ovark.2514 The Harsh Master, and as much as I love his unique playstyle, it isn't a build that can carry, and it's terrible in competitive play. You compare DE damage as being low to the 26k Maul, but you've got to understand that where it was easy for the DE to stealth in and 1500 range DJ, Rifle 3, and then stealth away and setup to do it again, a Ranger who is actually glass cannon enough to land a 26k Maul in close range risks everything when attempting to do so. If the Maul/WI fails, the Ranger isn't getting away, and he's so glass cannon that quite seriously a single Magebane Tether proc from an experienced Spellbreaker usually means instant death. Just be careful when comparing playstyles that you've never mained.

    You guys need to start looking past numbers when deciding if something is balanced or not. Great example of what I mean here: Say there is a class that has the worst mobility in the game, no defensive skills whatsoever, but it can land a guaranteed unblockable 100k damage death strike once every 30s, but then it dies immediately if anything at all targets it, and I mean immediately. This may be annoying to have in a match and it may feel "OMG OVERPOWERED" but is it imbalanced? No it isn't. Every 30s it comes off respawns, downs one of your players and then it immediately gets downed by one of your players. Despite the tremendously large damage it possesses, when viewing its ultimate impact on the match, the class/build is balanced.

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