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Why are Abaddon statues so detailed?

Neo Mortem.3627Neo Mortem.3627 Member ✭✭

Of all the gods, only Abaddon's statues are in pristine condition. All the others are essentially blobs that are vague representations of them in my opinion. Why is that a forgotten/forbidden god such as Abaddon have better statues? Especially when he was supposed to be wiped off the map?

Comments

  • Cristalyan.5728Cristalyan.5728 Member ✭✭✭

    Maybe because he was (is?) the God of Knowledge and Secrets? Maybe he had the knowledge of a better statue crafting art and he shared it with his followers? Or maybe he, based on his knowledge, was able to read the future and selected the places where the statues were the most protected? Or maybe he is still alive, protecting the statues? Or maybe ANet intends to bring him back?

    Who knows? Maybe the God of Knowledge?

  • Konig Des Todes.2086Konig Des Todes.2086 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 7, 2019

    Because the statues of the other gods we often see are not Malchor's statues. While the one of Abaddon is Malchor's design. Statues that aren't the original Malchor's design is are interpretations and reinterpretations of the gods, not based on their actual appearance.

    You'd note that this statue of Dwayna is fairly detailed like the statue of Abaddon - that one is Malchor's original statue based off of Dwayna herself, and not interpretations and reinterpretations of her. Though that statue had been warped by Zhaitan's corruption.

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  • Genesis.8572Genesis.8572 Member ✭✭✭

    @Konig Des Todes.2086 said:
    You'd note that this statue of Dwayna is fairly detailed like the statue of Abaddon - that one is Malchor's original statue based off of Dwayna herself, and not interpretations and reinterpretations of her. Though that statue had been warped by Zhaitan's corruption.

    DWAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYNNNNNNNAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  • Aaron Ansari.1604Aaron Ansari.1604 Member ✭✭✭✭

    I'd also observe that we've only seen two or three Abaddon statues, and all of them were in extremely sheltered areas- a magically sealed cathedral at the bottom of the ocean, the Durmand Priory's secret vault (may be the same statue as the first), and a cavern sealed behind a cliff that's only accessible by sand portal. None of those are going to be subject to the wear and erosion of statues actually placed where worshipers can get at them.

    When we do see a statue that's been well-maintained, by contrast, they have about the same degree of detail to them. Divinity's Reach is the easiest spot for this- they're smaller than the largest Abaddon statue, and they're done in a style that covers everything below the waist, but facial features, distinguishing marks, and so on are still quite clearly picked out.

    R.I.P., Old Man of Auld Red Wharf. Gone but never forgotten.

  • Neo Mortem.3627Neo Mortem.3627 Member ✭✭
    edited May 7, 2019

    However, we've seen more. Don't forget Abaddon's Reliquary. There are Abaddon statues outside the circle, surrounding the vault. All the other statues outside aren't really detailed like Abaddon's are.

  • Konig Des Todes.2086Konig Des Todes.2086 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Aaron Ansari.1604 said:
    I'd also observe that we've only seen two or three Abaddon statues, and all of them were in extremely sheltered areas- a magically sealed cathedral at the bottom of the ocean, the Durmand Priory's secret vault (may be the same statue as the first), and a cavern sealed behind a cliff that's only accessible by sand portal. None of those are going to be subject to the wear and erosion of statues actually placed where worshipers can get at them.

    When we do see a statue that's been well-maintained, by contrast, they have about the same degree of detail to them. Divinity's Reach is the easiest spot for this- they're smaller than the largest Abaddon statue, and they're done in a style that covers everything below the waist, but facial features, distinguishing marks, and so on are still quite clearly picked out.

    ...Siren's Landing. There one at all four "resurrection shrines", a bunch surrounding the outside of his reliquary, and a bunch on the inside as well.

    The resurrection shrine does look a bit more broken down and is made of gold instead, but it's the same base model. Which I found fairly disappointing.

    Then there's also the one hidden away in The Desolation.

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  • ThatOddOne.4387ThatOddOne.4387 Member ✭✭✭
    edited May 8, 2019

    Because they're game assets that were created after the other statues? :P

  • ugrakarma.9416ugrakarma.9416 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 9, 2019

    I revisited the special collections on the occasion of the craft Requiem Armor, and I also noticed the huge, detailed statue of Abbadon with a map of mists on the ceiling.

    It is an impressive sight and for a brief moment has led me to very crazy speculations.

    An interesting easter egg is that if you press M, you will notice that the map of Special Collections is mechanically in the Mists, same pvp "map hosting", no speculation here, i just imagine that it should be more difficult to dev put it in Tyria at the time.

    main pvp: Khel the Undead(power reaper).

  • Konig Des Todes.2086Konig Des Todes.2086 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @ugrakarma.9416 said:
    An interesting easter egg is that if you press M, you will notice that the map of Special Collections is mechanically in the Mists, same pvp "map hosting", no speculation here, i just imagine that it should be more difficult to dev put it in Tyria at the time.

    Fun fact: This wasn't always so. It was originally using the same world canvas as Tyria, and you could even properly see the Special Collections in the minimap. It began using the Mists' world canvas with All or Nothing, likely because of Glint's Trials being added and that being "in the Mists" or something.

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  • Eekasqueak.7850Eekasqueak.7850 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Well here's one way too look at it, after his fall the ensuing coverup probably didn't leave traces of most of his statues so the ones we -do- see likely weren't found at the time at all. The ones in Orr were at the bottom of the sea etc.

  • ChronoPinoyX.7923ChronoPinoyX.7923 Member ✭✭✭

    The main statues of Abaddon that we see are both in areas which are less likely to be seen by the general public as per the concept of Abaddon as the God of Secret and Knowledge, opposite to Kormir's Truth and Knowledge.

    The broken statues of the other gods are actually quite detailed in their own right but most of them were modelled to be broken, decaying and corrupted hence the lack of finer detailing whereas Abandon statues (at least the one in the Priory and inside Abaddon's Reliquary) were hidden from any real exposure to damage. The Priory statue was preserved by the Priory members and the Reliquary was pretty much sealed in a room where even the ocean waters couldn't go through when Orr sank under the ocean.

  • Konig Des Todes.2086Konig Des Todes.2086 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Eekasqueak.7850 said:
    Well here's one way too look at it, after his fall the ensuing coverup probably didn't leave traces of most of his statues so the ones we -do- see likely weren't found at the time at all. The ones in Orr were at the bottom of the sea etc.

    Orr wasn't sunk back during the Exodus, but shortly before the events of GW1.

    @ChronoPinoyX.7923 said:
    The broken statues of the other gods are actually quite detailed in their own right but most of them were modelled to be broken, decaying and corrupted hence the lack of finer detailing whereas Abandon statues (at least the one in the Priory and inside Abaddon's Reliquary) were hidden from any real exposure to damage. The Priory statue was preserved by the Priory members and the Reliquary was pretty much sealed in a room where even the ocean waters couldn't go through when Orr sank under the ocean.

    The Priory didn't exist until after the events of GW1 - nearly 1,100 years after knowledge of Abaddon's existence was destroyed - so they couldn't have kept it safe. And the one in the temple is technically sunken as well, as are the many outside Abaddon's Reliquary within Siren's Landing.

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  • ChronoPinoyX.7923ChronoPinoyX.7923 Member ✭✭✭

    @ChronoPinoyX.7923 said:
    The broken statues of the other gods are actually quite detailed in their own right but most of them were modelled to be broken, decaying and corrupted hence the lack of finer detailing whereas Abandon statues (at least the one in the Priory and inside Abaddon's Reliquary) were hidden from any real exposure to damage. The Priory statue was preserved by the Priory members and the Reliquary was pretty much sealed in a room where even the ocean waters couldn't go through when Orr sank under the ocean.

    The Priory didn't exist until after the events of GW1 - nearly 1,100 years after knowledge of Abaddon's existence was destroyed - so they couldn't have kept it safe. And the one in the temple is technically sunken as well, as are the many outside Abaddon's Reliquary within Siren's Landing.

    Except Durmand's life was around the time when Abaddon was still active and the Durmand Priory did exist around this time but they weren't an established order. Durmand himself was there from Prophecies all the way to Nightfall when Abaddon was the most active, sharing the history of Tyria, Cantha and Elona so any information regarding Abaddon or any relics he and his followers would have found pre-Durmand Priory Order will have already been preserved by Durmand and his followers meaning that the statues in Durmand Priory will be something that Durmand and his followers will have either found and relocated, or they found and built the Durmand Priory around.

  • Konig Des Todes.2086Konig Des Todes.2086 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 9, 2019

    @ChronoPinoyX.7923 said:

    @ChronoPinoyX.7923 said:
    The broken statues of the other gods are actually quite detailed in their own right but most of them were modelled to be broken, decaying and corrupted hence the lack of finer detailing whereas Abandon statues (at least the one in the Priory and inside Abaddon's Reliquary) were hidden from any real exposure to damage. The Priory statue was preserved by the Priory members and the Reliquary was pretty much sealed in a room where even the ocean waters couldn't go through when Orr sank under the ocean.

    The Priory didn't exist until after the events of GW1 - nearly 1,100 years after knowledge of Abaddon's existence was destroyed - so they couldn't have kept it safe. And the one in the temple is technically sunken as well, as are the many outside Abaddon's Reliquary within Siren's Landing.

    Except Durmand's life was around the time when Abaddon was still active and the Durmand Priory did exist around this time but they weren't an established order. Durmand himself was there from Prophecies all the way to Nightfall when Abaddon was the most active, sharing the history of Tyria, Cantha and Elona so any information regarding Abaddon or any relics he and his followers would have found pre-Durmand Priory Order will have already been preserved by Durmand and his followers meaning that the statues in Durmand Priory will be something that Durmand and his followers will have either found and relocated, or they found and built the Durmand Priory around.

    You're mistaking the time when Abaddon was worshiped with the time when Abaddon was trying to break from his imprisonment. The only statues that originate from GW1's era would be those made by the Margonites, which looked drastically different from the ones seen in GW2 which originate from when Abaddon was worshiped.

    Abaddon_Shrine.jpg

    This is the statue design the Margonites erected. It was literally just his head on crab legs. There were no statues of Abaddon from GW1's time period created outside those made by the Margonites' return. The only other statue seen in GW1, which would similarly be from when Abaddon was worshiped still (aka before the Exodus), would be the remnants of this one Kormir found in Istan, which is similarly a very simplified appearance, much like the other statues of the gods, except far larger and obviously broken. This second statue, incidentally, answers OP's question a bit more: the detailed one was made by Malchor, other statues are far more simplistic in design but they were only seen in GW1 and haven't been remade for GW2.

    The statue that the Durmand Priory has is the same as Malchor's statue, which was underwater at the time (has been since the Exodus). It might even be the statue Malchor made, given that the first time we enter the Special Collections is roughly two years after the temple of Abaddon was discovered and explored, and the Special Collections at the time also housed Zhaitan's tail.

    EDIT: I kind of wish they recreated this simplistic statue for use rather than constantly reusing the same Abaddon statue. But I also wish they used the GW1 statues of the other gods more often than they end up doing because they look so much better imo. I especially wish they'd use them in areas where we saw statues in GW1 like the Chantry of Secrets or Reaper's Gate, rather than the circular version.

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  • ChronoPinoyX.7923ChronoPinoyX.7923 Member ✭✭✭

    @Konig Des Todes.2086 said:

    @ChronoPinoyX.7923 said:

    @ChronoPinoyX.7923 said:
    The broken statues of the other gods are actually quite detailed in their own right but most of them were modelled to be broken, decaying and corrupted hence the lack of finer detailing whereas Abandon statues (at least the one in the Priory and inside Abaddon's Reliquary) were hidden from any real exposure to damage. The Priory statue was preserved by the Priory members and the Reliquary was pretty much sealed in a room where even the ocean waters couldn't go through when Orr sank under the ocean.

    The Priory didn't exist until after the events of GW1 - nearly 1,100 years after knowledge of Abaddon's existence was destroyed - so they couldn't have kept it safe. And the one in the temple is technically sunken as well, as are the many outside Abaddon's Reliquary within Siren's Landing.

    Except Durmand's life was around the time when Abaddon was still active and the Durmand Priory did exist around this time but they weren't an established order. Durmand himself was there from Prophecies all the way to Nightfall when Abaddon was the most active, sharing the history of Tyria, Cantha and Elona so any information regarding Abaddon or any relics he and his followers would have found pre-Durmand Priory Order will have already been preserved by Durmand and his followers meaning that the statues in Durmand Priory will be something that Durmand and his followers will have either found and relocated, or they found and built the Durmand Priory around.

    You're mistaking the time when Abaddon was worshiped with the time when Abaddon was trying to break from his imprisonment. The only statues that originate from GW1's era would be those made by the Margonites, which looked drastically different from the ones seen in GW2 which originate from when Abaddon was worshiped.

    Abaddon_Shrine.jpg

    This is the statue design the Margonites erected. It was literally just his head on crab legs. There were no statues of Abaddon from GW1's time period created outside those made by the Margonites' return. The only other statue seen in GW1, which would similarly be from when Abaddon was worshiped still (aka before the Exodus), would be the remnants of this one Kormir found in Istan, which is similarly a very simplified appearance, much like the other statues of the gods, except far larger and obviously broken. This second statue, incidentally, answers OP's question a bit more: the detailed one was made by Malchor, other statues are far more simplistic in design but they were only seen in GW1 and haven't been remade for GW2.

    The statue that the Durmand Priory has is the same as Malchor's statue, which was underwater at the time (has been since the Exodus). It might even be the statue Malchor made, given that the first time we enter the Special Collections is roughly two years after the temple of Abaddon was discovered and explored, and the Special Collections at the time also housed Zhaitan's tail.

    EDIT: I kind of wish they recreated this simplistic statue for use rather than constantly reusing the same Abaddon statue. But I also wish they used the GW1 statues of the other gods more often than they end up doing because they look so much better imo. I especially wish they'd use them in areas where we saw statues in GW1 like the Chantry of Secrets or Reaper's Gate, rather than the circular version.

    I think we're both getting confused here. The statue image you posted is not the statue I'm talking about. I'm talking about the statues inside and by Abaddon's Reliquary which are exactly the same as the one in Durmand Priory. Durmand was an explorer as well as a historian, hence why he has the the tomes that give us the history of the Shining Blade, Master Togo and Turai Ossa. If the case is that he has gone on an expedition with his followers to where Orr sank, they most likely have found Abaddon's Reliquary or Abaddon's Temple where they got the statue from because there's literally no other traces of the exact same statue elsewhere.

    And both the Reliquary and Temple have shown that Abaddon's statues remained extremely detailed and in tact and had little damage from the ocean even after Orr sank meaning it had been preserved in those locations even when it was under the ocean. If the Priory did indeed get the same statue from the lands of Orr where it is the only place it can be found, then that means they took that statue back to Durmand Priory (before it was an established order) and kept it preserved afterwards. Whether it was indeed Malchor's statue or not wouldn't matter because there's multiple versions of this particular statue littered all over Siren's Landing (especially the smaller ones where the trader NPCs are) meaning it could have been any statue of Abaddon that could be found in the lands of Orr.

  • Konig Des Todes.2086Konig Des Todes.2086 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 10, 2019

    @ChronoPinoyX.7923 said:
    I think we're both getting confused here. The statue image you posted is not the statue I'm talking about. I'm talking about the statues inside and by Abaddon's Reliquary which are exactly the same as the one in Durmand Priory.

    I know what statue design you're talking about. I know who Durmand was and what he's known to have done. I've played the game.

    The statue in the Special Collections was unknown to history prior to the Pact's exploration of Orr. Such a statue did not exist in any place Durmand could reach. One was in an unknown, forgotten, temple which was discovered during the Personal Story:

    Trahearne: Scouts have discovered a sixth temple in Orr—a lost shrine to a fallen god, hidden underwater in the Strait of Malediction.
    https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Temple_of_the_Forgotten_God

    Meaning it was undiscovered by records of the Pact - including the Priory's. The rest, at the reliquaries, were in a place that was magically veiled so no one would or could venture there.

    (Trying to find where the dialogue was that said the area was hidden from mortals... will edit once I find it.

    EDIT: Okay, the wiki doesn't seem to have it - a handful of dialogues are missing it seems - or it's buried and I can't find it, but there's dialogue about there being a magical system that kept mortals from the reliquaries that was apparently broken with the rising of Orr and Zhaitan's consumption of magic.)

    It's unclear if Durmand was ever capable of making expeditions to Orr or not. But if they could, they would not have been able to find those two locations. My point is exactly that and the bold of what you said here:

    If the case is that he has gone on an expedition with his followers to where Orr sank, they most likely have found Abaddon's Reliquary or Abaddon's Temple where they got the statue from because there's literally no other traces of the exact same statue elsewhere.

    And besides all that, we see that there is no place where a statue is missing.

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  • Aaron Ansari.1604Aaron Ansari.1604 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Konig Des Todes.2086 said:

    @Aaron Ansari.1604 said:
    I'd also observe that we've only seen two or three Abaddon statues, and all of them were in extremely sheltered areas- a magically sealed cathedral at the bottom of the ocean, the Durmand Priory's secret vault (may be the same statue as the first), and a cavern sealed behind a cliff that's only accessible by sand portal. None of those are going to be subject to the wear and erosion of statues actually placed where worshipers can get at them.

    When we do see a statue that's been well-maintained, by contrast, they have about the same degree of detail to them. Divinity's Reach is the easiest spot for this- they're smaller than the largest Abaddon statue, and they're done in a style that covers everything below the waist, but facial features, distinguishing marks, and so on are still quite clearly picked out.

    ...Siren's Landing. There one at all four "resurrection shrines", a bunch surrounding the outside of his reliquary, and a bunch on the inside as well.

    The resurrection shrine does look a bit more broken down and is made of gold instead, but it's the same base model. Which I found fairly disappointing.

    Then there's also the one hidden away in The Desolation.

    I included the Desolation one, but I utterly forgot about Siren's Landing. That pretty well voids my first point.

    R.I.P., Old Man of Auld Red Wharf. Gone but never forgotten.

  • Konig Des Todes.2086Konig Des Todes.2086 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 12, 2019

    Found the/a line I was looking for while writing the previous post about Siren's Landing being hidden:

    Abaddon sent away. Gods wipe the records of him. Childish! Why so many Abaddon relics here if true? Is this even a parable? No mention of reliquaries in the history books. Gods hid it with a magical veil? Did they sink it too? But post-god maps show the region existed. May never know truth. Orr gets sunk, then rises. Veil shredded? Reliquaries revealed. Hehe. Abaddon, Keeper of Secrets, has the last word.

    https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Parables_of_the_Gods#A_Parable_of_Abaddon

    Which suggests that Durmand couldn't have gotten their statue of Abaddon from Siren's Landing, despite it being in such obvious locale (never liked the map, served same lore purpose as the vaults of Arah, and yet also retconned some map designs of Arah with the royal fleet).

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