Anet can we normalize soulbeast yet? - Page 2 — Guild Wars 2 Forums

Anet can we normalize soulbeast yet?

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  • shadowpass.4236shadowpass.4236 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 13, 2019

    @Snellibee.2761 said:

    @shadowpass.4236 said:

    @Snellibee.2761 said:

    @shadowpass.4236 said:

    @Snellibee.2761 said:

    @shadowpass.4236 said:

    @Snellibee.2761 said:

    @shadowpass.4236 said:

    @Snellibee.2761 said:

    @Miyu.8137 said:

    @Snellibee.2761 said:
    This is not the most popular build at all, the most popular build definetely uses longbow. Just watch Boyce's view in a recent AT on Jawgeous channel and you have the build I'm talking about. Extreme damage, high sustain and mobility

    Where is the high sustain coming from? I saw that AT and i believe he was running lbow/gs, we heal as one, sick em, quickening zephyr and one wolf pack, soulbeast, beastmastery, wilderness survival. Marauder or demolisher amu with eagle rune, smokescale and owl. This build has just one purpose and it's unblockable lbow burst damage every 60sec ( w/o OWP every 36sec). Damage is dealt in very short window of like 3sec and can do 25k dmg+- (on low/no defence enemies). If enemy manage to dodge you already do less then half of it. Releasing such burst makes you waste every single utility. If you are not aware, rev can melt you down in 2secs, same goes for war.

    Gotta low how ppl bring all the possitives of 5 diferent builds together and than claim how a class is super OP :D

    I never said this build is super OP? I just stated this is the most popular build. Also rev and warrior can't burst you in 2s unless you're afk. Rev's skills take too long to cast to even one shot anybody and warrior's skills are highly telegraphed so unless you get stunned without a stunbreak available or you have no reaction time these 2 classes will not kill you faster than you can react. Sic'em longbow soulbeast however is able to do just that.

    The cast times for a rev's sword 5 and 4 add up to exactly 2 seconds. Phase Transversal -> Shackling Wave -> Deathstrike is a 1800 range gap-closing combo that gives quickness, immobilizes the target, and does an extremely significant amount of damage to anyone in UNDER 2 seconds, regardless of their build/amulet. Not to mention that this rotation doesn't require Line of Sight to your target and can be used from a very safe distance off the screen.

    A Revenant is unable to do the combo "Phase Transversal -> Deathstrike -> Shackling Wave " because of the energy mechanic. Something everyone who don't play Rev seems to forget. Also this combo will not reach above 10k unless the Revenant has 25 stacks of might. And to reach this a Revenant must been in a fight to accumulate these stacks. Being in a fight will also most likely not have you have 55 energy to spare to do the combo you said Revenants can do.
    Regardless of their build or amulet? Brother, if a Revenant does not run Rune of Strength with Marauder/Demolisher amulet and all the traits specific for dps a Revenant will not even reach 7k with the combo you've described.
    Yes shadowstepping can be used from a very safe distance off the screen, but to do the actual damage a Revenant needs to be in front of the enemy's face and deal with all the aoe damage a teamfight or enemy can give. A longbow ranger is able to safely burst an enemy from 1800 range sitting on a no port spot whilst being in no danger of taking any damage whatsoever.

    It's very easy to spot when somebody hasn't played Revenant ever but somehow knows perfectly how to class behaves.

    lol...

    The combo is very easy to pull off in a fight. You can engage, disengage behind line of sight, wait a little for the energy required, and port back in with PT -> SW -> DS. It's one of the most common rotations you'll see revs use. Also, revenant has easy access to 25 might because of the two traits: Notoriety and Incensed Response. Which takes about all of 5 seconds to accumulate after entering combat.

    When I said, "Regardless of their build/amulet." I wasn't referring to the revenant...

    You seem to be having trouble with a variety of ranger builds. This thread was made to discuss the one-shot sic em soulbeast builds. These do NOT use longbow. If you're having an extreme amount of difficulty against longbow rangers, all you have to do is walk behind LoS and they can't hit you.

    I play every class, including rev, at high plat 3. Also, I've been giving you specific ways to deal with the issues you're having.

    1. If a ranger is running one-shot and you see him stealth... Walk away so he can't get into melee range.
    2. If a ranger is shooting at you with a longbow... Go behind line of sight.

    I find it extraordinarily tedious having to explain what I assume should be common knowledge to anyone who's spent even the slightest bit of time in sPvP. So please, educate yourself a little bit and read over my previous posts before you respond.

    It's also one of the most easy to avoid combo's a rev can do. Every competent player knows to dodge when a rev has shadowstepped to him, doing this will completely negate the whole burst because it's so predictable.
    FYI, barely anyone runs Incensed Response and instead uses Rapid Flow because of how precious swiftness is as a roamer and to have that little bit of healing for some sustain.
    I don't really have trouble with the Ranger builds I mentioned, I simply compared the ranger build with what rev is capable of and correcting you on some things.

    You don't seem to be as good and educated as you think you are. Should read some stuff yourself before telling others to.

    If you're 1v1ing a rev (which should never happen under normal circumstances), then yes, the combo is easy to avoid.

    ...

    Okay... I don't know how else to say this other than you're actually wrong about everything.

    Honestly even in a 1v1 you can reliably land Shackling Wave into Deathstrike if you time it after an evade frame. You realize you can cast Phase Transversal and WAIT for the person to evade before using SW and DS? The combo is fast enough that most players instinctively dodge once they see a rev pop up on their screen. If you played a little smarter, you could use that knowledge to your advantage and nail them with the big damage combo 98% of the time.

    Actually I just checked lol.... You can literally PT -> SW -> DS with the 50 base energy you have out of combat and still be left with 5 energy afterwards.

    No. You're wrong. The meta revenant build takes Incensed Response because you have permanent swiftness from Dragon Stance's Facet of Elements and if you need more movement speed while in Assassin Stance, you have super speed from Impossible Odds.

    Also, you have more than enough healing for a +1 role with Assassin's Annihilation (6120 healing every 20 seconds, slightly less than the 6520 a ranger would get using "We Heal As One!"). The extra 300 you get every 5 seconds with Rapid Flow is actually irrelevant. The regeneration boon alone would heal more than twice as much in the same period of time without any healing power.

    From the looks of it, I know your class better than you do. Like I said, educate yourself before you respond. Compare my rank to yours if you need more concrete proof.

    I mean lolz NA Theres isn't even one legendary player on the leaderboard says enough tbh about the average skill level in that region

    Hey look at that. You're wrong again LOL ~what a surprise~
    Currently, there are three legendary players on NA.

    Again, educate yourself before you respond.

    1. Less players on NA = less rating to go around.
    2. It's pretty hard to climb when you gain 2-6 rating per win and lose 20-40. To put it simply, (at high rankings) you can win ten times in a row, lose once, and end up at a lower rating than you started at.

    Also, do me a favor and check the season my screenshot is in.

    The solo-que-only restriction above 1600 was still in effect during Season 11. In other words, I achieved 1745 rating with no one else to rely on other than myself.

    To put it in perspective, you barely managed 1600 rating in a season where duo quing is allowed... lolz

    How am I supposed to educate myself if the picture you've shown to me shows NO legendary players. I play in EU thus have NO way to see the ranking in NA. Why don't you show an updated picture with your current ranking instead of an old picture? Are you not the same rank right now anymore?

    You try really hard to look smart but it's just not working. Also just because you managed to reach a certain rank a year ago doesn't mean that applies to you as of this moment. Lord Helseth won a tournament years ago but right as of this moment you can't even consider him Legendary.

    I'm actually lolling hard rn that you showed a picture of your rank from a year ago and act like that's your rank right now whilst trying to belittle my rank. From you other picture I can also see you're not in p3 so you're in the same division as I am. You look kinda dumb right now tbh.

    Dear gosh here we go again.

    The screenshot of my rating CLEARLY shows the date at the top as well as the season it was taken in. If you have "NO way to see the ranking in NA" then why did you just assume there were no legendary players currently? You were wrong again, just accept it.

    Four days ago, after 5+ months away from GW2, I logged on to que with a friend. However, she streams. So, if you really want to see an example of how I play, watch the last two minutes of the match from this vod from YayItsKate's stream.

    Quick summary:

    1. At the timestamp I linked, I'm fighting a 1v2 at mid, kill them both, then rotate far where Kate is (so now you can see me on the screen)
    2. She's 1v1ing a Revenant off-node and I'm 1v2ing a Berserker and Soulbeast on the point.
    3. I down both the Berserker and Soulbeast in a 1v2.
    4. Kate goes down, gets stomped, and rallies them both.
    5. Our teammate rotated in and went down as well.
    6. I down the Soulbeast again, get the stomp, but our teammate didn't rally.
    7. I proceed to 1v3 their team for the next 30 seconds, down the Berserker again, and went down a second before we win the match.

    You've just been spreading misinformation after misinformation. All I've been doing is correcting you and supporting my arguments with links, facts, and screenshots. Even after months of not playing, I'm still able to win outnumbered fights easily. Imagine how I played a year ago when I actually cared enough to practice.

    If you're curious to see how I perform in other matches, I join Kate at this part of her stream. You can watch from there (listen to a bit of banter/where I mentioned I hadn't finished my placements yet), fast forward to different games, listen to the comms, or watch the map to see what I'm doing if we're not at the same node.

    Please don't call me dumb when you -an apparent rev main- didn't even know you could use Phase Transversal, Shackling Wave, and Deathstrike on a target from out of combat citing "energy issues" as the reason for it. I have a solid 1% of my games played on that class and I know more about it than you. That alone goes to show how severe your lack of knowledge is.

  • Mordayn.6198Mordayn.6198 Member ✭✭✭
    edited May 15, 2019

    Just gonna drop this video on here as it shows what's wrong with soulbeast tuning atm. Stacking percent modifiers from gs2 and sic em is just way too strong and broken in wvw and pvp. Couple that with the unblockable from warhorn and it's just a 1 shot from stealth king.

  • Trevor Boyer.6524Trevor Boyer.6524 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 15, 2019

    ^ That's more of a problem with no-downstate, and I agree that ANY high powered ranged is OP during no-downstate, it isn't just Ranger. We're talking Rifle Warriors, Deadeyes, Fresh Air Eles, Grenade Engis. The only difference between these classes and Ranger is that they actually have mechanisms to ball up and zerg effectively in wvw, Ranger does not. So you've got to understand that there is give & take while running the strongest ranged build in the game that is a single target burst only. It may feel overpowered when it is targeting you, but if you were to view this balance discussion from a macro 40 vs 40 point of view, instead of a micro 1v1 subjective point of view, do you really believe the Rangers are making more of an impact in the zerg vs. zerg than other classes?

    I'd also like to note that wvw is really not a good way to demonstrate the balance of anything. Generally these wvw videos feature play by someone who is 7 years deep into GW2, who has become an expert at their class. The videos are always the same, they show themselves in open field skirmish 1vXing the absolute kitten out of lesser players, god knows what builds & gear those players are even running or how long they've even played the game. Remember, there is no match making in wvw. That footage of open field skirmish is likely the equivalent of if I were to smurf into some silver tier matches or even g1 and start tearing everyone apart on a 1 Shot Soulbeast vs. opponents who completely lack the mechanical skill & experience to deal with me. I'd get no deaths and 25+ kills in a single game if the players didn't rage quit before mid match. But the truth is that in ranked or ATs against opponents of my similar rating, I can get completely neutralized and possibly instagibbed if something like a Herald starts riding me for the counter.

    There is no footage in that video whatsoever, that shows what happens if he were to come across a Spellbreaker like Vaans in a 1v1, that actually knows how to play his class, and is also benefitting from pve stated gears. Just pointing that one out. It's something to think about.

  • beatthedown.2651beatthedown.2651 Member ✭✭✭

    @Mordayn.6198 said:
    Just gonna drop this video on here as it shows what's wrong with soulbeast tuning atm. Stacking percent modifiers from gs2 and sic em is just way too strong and broken in wvw and pvp. Couple that with the unblockable from warhorn and it's just a 1 shot from stealth king.

    I never thought anyone could seriously paste this video in the pvp forums for an argument, but here we are. I feel defeated.

  • beatthedown.2651beatthedown.2651 Member ✭✭✭
    edited May 15, 2019

    @Mordayn.6198 said:
    Did you even watch the video. The fact that beast mode is allowing gs2 maul ability to give the player the Attack of Opportunity proc is just broken. You couple that with low CD unblockable, Sic Em dmg proc and Smokescale stealth you're getting a huge dps boost to single shot from stealth that is just way too overtuned. Not to mention allowing him to 1 shot ppl from the warclaw mount as well. Attack of Opportunity is a 25% damage increase and Sic Em is a 40% damage increase, effectively giving them a 65% damage increase on one shot then a sustained 40% for the duration of Sic Em.

    Have you ever played a pvp game? Is this really meta? You don't even know how damage calculation works in this game.

    Edit: to clarify, nerf sic em all you want. I could not care less about an inferior pvp build. But please for the love of god don't tell me this joke build is meta and everyone is playing it in higher rated games.

  • Shiyo.3578Shiyo.3578 Member ✭✭✭

    Anet is too busy buffing soulbeast literally every patch to care.

  • Psycoprophet.8107Psycoprophet.8107 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Well I think its telling that literally every third player I see in wvw is running a variant of sb sic em build considering how useful the build is for zerging lol

  • Mordayn.6198Mordayn.6198 Member ✭✭✭

    Just for good measure because the video i posted was from WvW. Here's a top ranked player using the soulbeast in Spvp.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=251&v=6P0OVZd8MWc

  • @Mordayn.6198 said:
    Sad to say but yes the "joke" build is meta. I've seen 1 shot soulbeast build running in at least gold 3 and platinum 1. It's also a very broken build they are running in wvw. What don't I understand about damage calculations. I clearly called out the issue is in beastmode greatsword 2 maul is giving a 25% dmg increase and sic em is giving a 40% dmg increase equaling a whopping 65% dmg increase for one shot that's unblockable due to low cd unblockables on the beastmode entry and warhorn 5. You can nay say the build all you want, but it's top end damage does way too much allowing for 1 shot's from stealth at range. Easily would be nerfed it was any other class.

    Actually, according to Trevor, damage multipliers are multiplicative, not additive, meaning they "stack" even higher than most people think:

    https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/comment/910700/#Comment_910700

    He's discussing the Eternal Coliseum buff in his example there, but the same principle applies, I believe. So the net damage increase from Maul + Sic 'Em is actually more than 25% + 40% = 65%.

  • Faux Play.6104Faux Play.6104 Member ✭✭✭

    @Mordayn.6198 said:
    Sad to say but yes the "joke" build is meta. I've seen 1 shot soulbeast build running in at least gold 3 and platinum 1. It's also a very broken build they are running in wvw. What don't I understand about damage calculations. I clearly called out the issue is in beastmode greatsword 2 maul is giving a 25% dmg increase and sic em is giving a 40% dmg increase equaling a whopping 65% dmg increase for one shot that's unblockable due to low cd unblockables on the beastmode entry and warhorn 5. You can nay say the build all you want, but it's top end damage does way too much allowing for 1 shot's from stealth at range. Easily would be nerfed it was any other class.

    How can a ranger run maul (greatsword), warhorn, and oneshot from range (longbow)? A dps soul beast is a good carry build if you are way better than the competition, but at even skill levels it is pretty average.

  • Solori.6025Solori.6025 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Twilight Tempest.7584 said:

    @Mordayn.6198 said:
    Sad to say but yes the "joke" build is meta. I've seen 1 shot soulbeast build running in at least gold 3 and platinum 1. It's also a very broken build they are running in wvw. What don't I understand about damage calculations. I clearly called out the issue is in beastmode greatsword 2 maul is giving a 25% dmg increase and sic em is giving a 40% dmg increase equaling a whopping 65% dmg increase for one shot that's unblockable due to low cd unblockables on the beastmode entry and warhorn 5. You can nay say the build all you want, but it's top end damage does way too much allowing for 1 shot's from stealth at range. Easily would be nerfed it was any other class.

    Actually, according to Trevor, damage multipliers are multiplicative, not additive, meaning they "stack" even higher than most people think:

    https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/comment/910700/#Comment_910700

    He's discussing the Eternal Coliseum buff in his example there, but the same principle applies, I believe. So the net damage increase from Maul + Sic 'Em is actually more than 25% + 40% = 65%.

    Honestly if Sic'Em is going to stay at 40%. Why not just nerf all the traits that give percentile damage buffs throughout the class.

    Tingle my stingleberry

  • Kovu.7560Kovu.7560 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Solori.6025 said:

    @Twilight Tempest.7584 said:

    @Mordayn.6198 said:
    Sad to say but yes the "joke" build is meta. I've seen 1 shot soulbeast build running in at least gold 3 and platinum 1. It's also a very broken build they are running in wvw. What don't I understand about damage calculations. I clearly called out the issue is in beastmode greatsword 2 maul is giving a 25% dmg increase and sic em is giving a 40% dmg increase equaling a whopping 65% dmg increase for one shot that's unblockable due to low cd unblockables on the beastmode entry and warhorn 5. You can nay say the build all you want, but it's top end damage does way too much allowing for 1 shot's from stealth at range. Easily would be nerfed it was any other class.

    Actually, according to Trevor, damage multipliers are multiplicative, not additive, meaning they "stack" even higher than most people think:

    https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/comment/910700/#Comment_910700

    He's discussing the Eternal Coliseum buff in his example there, but the same principle applies, I believe. So the net damage increase from Maul + Sic 'Em is actually more than 25% + 40% = 65%.

    Honestly if Sic'Em is going to stay at 40%. Why not just nerf all the traits that give percentile damage buffs throughout the class.

    Or, maybe just nerf sic 'em on soulbeast instead of gutting the damage on druid and core ranger?

    ~ Kovu

    Ranger main before it was viable.
    Fort Aspenwood.

  • Kovu.7560Kovu.7560 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Solori.6025 said:

    @Kovu.7560 said:

    @Solori.6025 said:

    @Twilight Tempest.7584 said:

    @Mordayn.6198 said:
    Sad to say but yes the "joke" build is meta. I've seen 1 shot soulbeast build running in at least gold 3 and platinum 1. It's also a very broken build they are running in wvw. What don't I understand about damage calculations. I clearly called out the issue is in beastmode greatsword 2 maul is giving a 25% dmg increase and sic em is giving a 40% dmg increase equaling a whopping 65% dmg increase for one shot that's unblockable due to low cd unblockables on the beastmode entry and warhorn 5. You can nay say the build all you want, but it's top end damage does way too much allowing for 1 shot's from stealth at range. Easily would be nerfed it was any other class.

    Actually, according to Trevor, damage multipliers are multiplicative, not additive, meaning they "stack" even higher than most people think:

    https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/comment/910700/#Comment_910700

    He's discussing the Eternal Coliseum buff in his example there, but the same principle applies, I believe. So the net damage increase from Maul + Sic 'Em is actually more than 25% + 40% = 65%.

    Honestly if Sic'Em is going to stay at 40%. Why not just nerf all the traits that give percentile damage buffs throughout the class.

    Or, maybe just nerf sic 'em on soulbeast instead of gutting the damage on druid and core ranger?

    ~ Kovu

    ...You mean you wouldn't like to have your classes core traits messed up like everyone elses?

    You act like Ranger hasn't been touched over the years.
    And no, I don't want core ranger and druid's damage touched -- ranger already has some of the lowest coefficients in the game. (Supposedly to counterbalance pet damage. That's good for a laugh.)

    ~ Kovu

    Ranger main before it was viable.
    Fort Aspenwood.

  • FyzE.3472FyzE.3472 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

    @shadowpass.4236 said:
    If you're having an extreme amount of difficulty against longbow rangers, all you have to do is walk behind LoS and they can't hit you.

    And when the truth was revealed, the little boy grew up from g2 and became a p1 man on that day.

    As much as it SHOULD have been the case, we all know that that boy would just make up another excuse and continue whining and demanding nerfs for stuff he does not care to take even a bit of effort to play against.

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