Are we getting lazy?

Dears, don't shoot at me, but fact is that on the side exploring, discovering, farming and some other things like that, several changes (old and recent) over the years have turned such things always easier and faster for the player. For example - not limited to: No more WvW in world completion (old), WP close to towns appearing even if all under fog sparing exploring (old), the gliding (recent), the mounts (new), the booster to 80, the rare nodes no more rare (new), and so many other things... Aside of those changes, I also see all the threads in this forum, where players ask to nerf this or that, ask to have the Griffon able to use updrafts and leylines to go easier and faster through... It means there is a real demand for more comfort? There is also the new pack from Anet to buy all WPs and have them straight...It looks to me like there is a global tendency to want the "side" things of the game obtained fast with the less possible effort. Or do I see that wrong? I don't tell that it is bad or good. I just question: Is it really a concrete tendency now? What could it mean for the PvE content? If all is going fast, then we will need more often new pack?

What do you think? :)

Mounts and gliding are fine. Getting from point A to point B as fast as possible is often 75%+ of an MMO after one plays through it once.

As for all the waypoints, GW2 has always been a super-themepark MMO. PoF is somewhat refreshing in how players only receive a sparse smattering of waypoints per zone.

WvW completion was cancer because it was entirely dependent on getting a "good" match-up or being on at the right time of the day/week. Map completing was tedious enough without it having super RNG tied to it via the random tides of WvW.

As for "the content goes too quickly," it's not like any GW2 expansion or patch has ever released more than a week's worth of content at once.

This is what the gamers of today want.Gimmedats.

Exclusive content just for showing up and owning the game.That would be like me walking into Starbucks demanding they give me the Guat/Nic black apron blend exclusive 2009, just because I'm a customer.

You know what they would tell me?"Sorry, limited time. You had to be there"

I agree totally that "gimmedats" are a cancer that destroys games FAST!!!! This "need" usurps content, minimizes "storyline", and reduces "choice" to an afterthought.----------So, why play?? It that's your target audience--the game is deserving of a quick death!!

Some people want easy. Maybe because they're lazy, but also maybe because they're limited on time to play and want to get right to what they see as the fun parts of it all.

Others want epic. Our characters are the doers of great deeds, the ones that shake the world. And yet, we still often wind up kneeling in the dirt to harvest a bit of garlic and a dandelion.

Finally, there are those that want the game world to make more sense to them. They're the ones that want to turn to their gryphon and say "What do you mean you can't use updrafts? Okay, look. It's not that hard. We'll go over here, where there's some updrafts, and I'll show you how it works. We've trained other stuff, no reason we can't train for this, too. Right?"

(Gryphon: "I'll learn to use updrafts the day you learn to sit in a kittening chair, Dave.")

"Getting" lazy? Just lol. Not just limited to gaming, but in general, we've been "getting lazy" for years now.

I'm lazy, I want my rewards easy to forget about real life difficulties. And this is why I chose this game. I'm not going to tryhard over pixel items, wasting hours of my life farming single boss to get what I want. This is not a tryhard game and I'm happy with it.

For "us old gamers" as you try to present yourself, there are many other titles where your tryhard nature can be satisfied.

Since this game was always marketed as a casual / social MMO experience, I don't think Anet has done anything against their mission statement. Just because some things are different than YOU want doesn't mean it's inconsistent with the game design goals. And there are games out there that require much more time and hard work to "get stuff" that you "deserve" for "working real real hard"....

Also, a game needs to change and evolve to survive. All those things you listed brings people to the game. If you don't evolve the game, then it dies. How fun would this game be if there were hardly any other people in the world?

I keep hearing the theory that WvW was removed because of complaints. They removed it at the time that a new map was added. They were also taking about rotating between maps.

Can you imagine trying to get map completion, get partway through a map and it’s replaced by another map so you have to start over? . How about the people who hadn’t finished the WvW maps when they were replaced with the new Desert Borderlands and would have to start over? Keeping WvW in map completion causes problems with their wish to rotate between different maps and people who hadn’t finished the old maps and now have to redo the maps, having to do twice the work as everyone else.

I wouldn't call it getting lazy. I would rather call it how to investment of time. MMO's in design have always favored part-time workers and college students. Overtime, the community has become more 9 to 5 workers. With that in mind if you were to play every day as full time worker i only get 2-3 hrs day to play. Anything that decrease the time to moving from point A to B , so i can get to the action and story is great for me

Ack! Why is the OP's font so large? Hurts my eyes.

I've seen posts declaring content 'too hard', as well as posts declaring content 'too easy'. I'm just it a delicate balancing act for the Devs, trying to please as many as possible.

@pah.4931 said:Since this game was always marketed as a casual / social MMO experience, I don't think Anet has done anything against their mission statement. Just because some things are different than YOU want doesn't mean it's inconsistent with the game design goals.

Huh, sorry, but just to correct: I said absolutely nothing about what I want or do not want. I am just talking about something I observe over the years and ask others how they think about it, because I find it very interesting. Nothing else.Now of course I can share my personal opinion about changes. Example: I found real great that they removed WvW from world completion. For me, world completion is a side activity that I always keep going. I did it already 16 times (out of which 3 at times wvw was in), and the 17th one is ongoing. I was soooo glad when wvw was kicked off! LOLHowever, I believe there is no point to give my opinion on each of the changes, because - and that I find it real good - all changes done by Anet allow to choose how we want to deal with.Me personally, generally, I like new stuff and always welcome with pleasure every new adds and changes. I take and enjoy what I find good, I find a way to cope with what I dislike. As easy as that.As for what I want hard or not, I believe I am like every other players: it is entirely depending on what I do love for activities and what I am good at. For example, I am a very good jumper. So, of course, I prefer when a JP is a bit harder, so that I have a challenge and that it is not over too fast. For example, for me, the one in Siren's Landing was a bit short to my taste. But it is no problem, because when I need some suffering, I go back to one in Ember Bay! LOL On the other hand, I do not like doing storylines, at which I am pretty bad. No problem! I wait that guildies - who do love that - take me in and that's how I cope with.So, as you can see, I am easy. I just find my way and very rarely complain about changes. I just adapt and keep getting max of fun at the game.Now I have really said about how I think so you can comment. ;-)

There is a fundamental difference between time consuming and challenging, you guys need to remember that. It can be short and challenging or easy but grindy. A lot of games chose the asian way, ie easy and time consuming, because the publisher refuses to pay for more new content. Be happy ANet has enough resources to push so much content they don't force you to farm the same boss over and over until you get that super rare ring of epicness. After having played all these F2P games for a while, trust me, the alternative is 10 times worse.

I, myself, am so lazy that I go to the grocery store every few days instead of going out and harvesting wild grains and hunting wild... uh... bologna for sandwiches, and I don't even pick or grind my own coffee beans (because to heck with all that grinding!) or do much of anything except put the pre-picked/pre-ground coffee in a coffee maker that I didn't make myself, with some water that I didn't go out and fetch from the river but got from the tap with a cool filter attached, with a splash of milk from some probably nameless cow whose udders I've never touched. Why would I do a bunch of (shudder) work in a game to get imaginary goodies for my imaginary people? I say let the imaginary people do all the imaginary work on their own time, while I'm watching Shameless. That's how it ought to be. "Hey, imaginary person! Quit fooling around trying to fight imaginary monsters and junk and get a real imaginary job so you can buy an imaginary golem to do all the imaginary boring, dull, tedious grinding for you!"

Meh. Back in the proverbial day I did map completion on two characters. That was enough of that. Most recently, I did the griffon thing and got the griffon. Parts of it weren't too terribly unfun. If it had been in the store for, say ten bucks -- can you say 'tempted'? I knew you could.

Simply keep WvW away from me. I don't like any forms of pvp and don't want to be forced to play it.

Some of the things listed were long requested QoL issues (WvW maps were a pain due to being stuck in the same matchup for months). Others come at a price - mounts came with dramatic reduction of number of WPs per map. It is also worth noting that ANet wants this game to be friendly toward new players. The bigger Tyria becomes, the more difficult it is for new player to catch up to more experienced ones. So shortcuts help there as well.

@ThenCameThree.4163 said:I wouldn't call it getting lazy. I would rather call it how to investment of time. MMO's in design have always favored part-time workers and college students. Overtime, the community has become more 9 to 5 workers. With that in mind if you were to play every day as full time worker i only get 2-3 hrs day to play. Anything that decrease the time to moving from point A to B , so i can get to the action and story is great for me

I play 2-3 hours a WEEK and I STILL still managed to get 7 precursors, holiday stuff, 8k lifetime gold, etc etc... Took me five years but I was still ABLE to get rewards I wanted.

Now I have really said about how I think so you can comment. ;-)

Ha! Fair enough. I think I inferred your opinions on the matter from the post.

I think Mounts in particular will cultivate bad habits. I wouldn't call it laziness, but ... maybe softness? Like air conditioning.

im kinda getting tired of seeing these posts on the forums over and over again ... different wording all making the same point.

NO ONE is making the player do anything. You can go from your home city all across Tyria and into HOT and POF without using any gliding/mounts/WP unlocks or boosters. Any thing you do from the time your character is created to the time you finish the current personal story in POF is entirely up to you. I think its time that players start taking responsibility for how they choose to play the game and stop criticizing those who run with all new content such as those listed above. Enough is enough already!

I think the main reason that all of these things are being added now is to make the game more accessible to new players. There is so much exploration and collecting to be done in this game, it is a pretty daunting task for someone just coming into the game and wanting to be able to join in with friends / guildies. It also makes playing an alt a much better experience in my opinion.

the tons of ppl with Aurora(the annoyest legend to make) makes me doubt it. For those crafted Aurora from scratch the PoF content is a cakewalk.

People are getting lazy in games as a whole not just here.

I've even seen selfishness or laziness arise from mounts within this game, before it was common to see other's res the dead specially if you see someone die right in front of you and even worse pulled agro into those not on mounts not even offer to help a poor soul and just let him die because u was on a mount and could get away, even if you didn't intend it, you could still help the poor soul (an experience I had lol) Luckily I had a res orb, I was on a new char just trying to open the map WPs was limited, was already in a hard battle here comes selfish mounter pulling even more mobs into the fray. Wasn't long and I ate dirt as mountee rides off into the sunset.This is one thing I promise in the future after I get PoF if I'm on a mount idc I intended an aggro pull or not I wont let you die without trying to help you out, be it I'm in a rush or not and if you do die, i promise I will at least res you. Just give me time to clear the mobs and if I die atleast you didn't die alone. lol

For the most part i don't play games in a lazy way. 9/10 times take the hard route, if by chance that 1 time happens probably because I'm just not in the mood to actually play it, in that case soon as I get done doing what I'm doing i usually log out.But yeah it is not just in GW2 I see it in couple of dif online games where playing the game is getting less and less important. I figure 10 years from now games will be playing themselves and people will be buying dlc/IM stuff for better visuals lol. In my case I will head back to 1984 Nintendo games.

@Palador.2170 said:Finally, there are those that want the game world to make more sense to them. They're the ones that want to turn to their gryphon and say "What do you mean you can't use updrafts? Okay, look. It's not that hard. We'll go over here, where there's some updrafts, and I'll show you how it works. We've trained other stuff, no reason we can't train for this, too. Right?"

(Gryphon: "I'll learn to use updrafts the day you learn to sit in a kittening chair, Dave.")Yup, this ^I am super weird about the game world making sense. It makes sense for griffons to be able to use updrafts. Perhaps not leylines, but defiantly updrafts.

Personally I don't really care what they put in the store to help new players get into the game. Or to help people with alts get around. I've finished map completion on a few characters and it was a pain. So I can see how it might remove some frustration for people. I don't really see it as laziness. Maybe map exploration is not their cup of tea. Either way, it's their choice to buy those items, and it doesn't really affect me. So I honestly don't care :pensive:

I'm not getting lazy, I won't use level 80 boosts or waypoint unlocks or any future short cuts (each to their own I suppose though).

Having taken WvW out of map completion was a god-send though. Not because of laziness, but because it was hard waiting for your server to take certain towers and stuff to get access to POIs and vistas, especially for lower populated servers. As for having one WP automatically unlocked in each of the entry level zones, that's only made the access to the maps a little easier, hardly cuts down the clock.

Many people are, especially those that wanted and bought those Free WP Packages. Some of us don't care to go the scenic route and possibly take part in some possible events before getting to where we need to get to. It's very disappointing thinking about how some people want to be spoon fed now.