Plz nerf revenant

Teleport from behind the corner>take away huge chunk of hp from enemy that 3 shots if enemy doesnt use invulns(blocks dont help)>run behind a corner while spamming a tonn of dodges>rinse repeat.Most easy to play and most broken class in game all thanks to crazy dmg and surviviability, ability to safely rinse repeat that los'ing combo with absolutely no counterplay from enemies.

And no, thief is paper himself + hits like a wet noodle cos his dmg is non-existant after all those endless nerfs, easily blockable if he doesnt waste elite slot on a tiny duration stun, so don't even compare.

If you don't mind me asking, what is your elo? While rev does have a bit of excess damage atm, your issue does not seem to be related to game balance. Clearly you are not utilising terrain at all or watching the minimap. Watch when phase traversal is being used and time/bait your own cc.

@Syclantus.4621 said:If you don't mind me asking, what is your elo? While rev does have a bit of excess damage atm, your issue does not seem to be related to game balance. Clearly you are not utilising terrain at all or watching the minimap. Watch when phase traversal is being used and time/bait your own cc.

1650, so no, its not skill problem, its just being able to see imbalanced strategy that is pretty much a godmode. and yes i play rev sometimes too and its disgusting how broken that strategy is.

@Syclantus.4621 said:If you don't mind me asking, what is your elo? While rev does have a bit of excess damage atm, your issue does not seem to be related to game balance. Clearly you are not utilising terrain at all or watching the minimap. Watch when phase traversal is being used and time/bait your own cc.Class is broken? Its fine, just watch your minimap under microscope and ....terrain? Since when its stopped them?He should see it coming behind walls/los? Is every player is a psychic now?

@praqtos.9035 said:

@Syclantus.4621 said:If you don't mind me asking, what is your elo? While rev does have a bit of excess damage atm, your issue does not seem to be related to game balance. Clearly you are not utilising terrain at all or watching the minimap. Watch when phase traversal is being used and time/bait your own cc.Class is broken? Its fine, just watch your minimap under microscope and ....terrain? Since when its stopped them?He should see it coming behind walls/los? Is every player is a psychic now?

Well, you do have to constantly see the minimap and over time you do know the usual places from where the activate the teleport. And at P2 and above elo these are experienced players. And idk your point about terrain? Baiting phase traversal is quite common when your opponent doesn't realize it's a no port

@Syclantus.4621 said:

@praqtos.9035 said:

@Syclantus.4621 said:If you don't mind me asking, what is your elo? While rev does have a bit of excess damage atm, your issue does not seem to be related to game balance. Clearly you are not utilising terrain at all or watching the minimap. Watch when phase traversal is being used and time/bait your own cc.Class is broken? Its fine, just watch your minimap under microscope and ....terrain? Since when its stopped them?He should see it coming behind walls/los? Is every player is a psychic now?

And I do expect players to get punished for not paying attention to minimap. Your definition of "psychic" is people not having game sense

@Syclantus.4621 said:

@praqtos.9035 said:

@Syclantus.4621 said:If you don't mind me asking, what is your elo? While rev does have a bit of excess damage atm, your issue does not seem to be related to game balance. Clearly you are not utilising terrain at all or watching the minimap. Watch when phase traversal is being used and time/bait your own cc.Class is broken? Its fine, just watch your minimap under microscope and ....terrain? Since when its stopped them?He should see it coming behind walls/los? Is every player is a psychic now?

@praqtos.9035 said:

@Syclantus.4621 said:

@praqtos.9035 said:

@Syclantus.4621 said:If you don't mind me asking, what is your elo? While rev does have a bit of excess damage atm, your issue does not seem to be related to game balance. Clearly you are not utilising terrain at all or watching the minimap. Watch when phase traversal is being used and time/bait your own cc.Class is broken? Its fine, just watch your minimap under microscope and ....terrain? Since when its stopped them?He should see it coming behind walls/los? Is every player is a psychic now?

There's a thing called counter pressure you know.

@Syclantus.4621 said:

@praqtos.9035 said:

@Syclantus.4621 said:

@praqtos.9035 said:

@Syclantus.4621 said:If you don't mind me asking, what is your elo? While rev does have a bit of excess damage atm, your issue does not seem to be related to game balance. Clearly you are not utilising terrain at all or watching the minimap. Watch when phase traversal is being used and time/bait your own cc.Class is broken? Its fine, just watch your minimap under microscope and ....terrain? Since when its stopped them?He should see it coming behind walls/los? Is every player is a psychic now?

@Crypto.7609 said:

@Syclantus.4621 said:Li> @praqtos.9035 said:

@Syclantus.4621 said:

@praqtos.9035 said:

@Syclantus.4621 said:

@praqtos.9035 said:

@Syclantus.4621 said:If you don't mind me asking, what is your elo? While rev does have a bit of excess damage atm, your issue does not seem to be related to game balance. Clearly you are not utilising terrain at all or watching the minimap. Watch when phase traversal is being used and time/bait your own cc.Class is broken? Its fine, just watch your minimap under microscope and ....terrain? Since when its stopped them?He should see it coming behind walls/los? Is every player is a psychic now?

Again I don't know why I'm being insulted when I've admitted rev damage is a bit overtuned(in my first post), double rev is OP (in my second post) and provided an example when double rev lost to a team without it. If you want another, check Jawgeous' video where he covers mirage played by Luana. They beat a team with triple rev in a legendary rated matchup with double warr , holo and mirage. You say the strategy has zero counterpressure yet I suggested how it is done in my previous post. I'm providing examples of when it's beaten yet instead of being told where I'm wrong, it's just insults.PS: I just saw your edit and yes, it needs organisation to beat a double rev comp which , I agree with you here, isn't really there in ranked. This is just bread and butter of ranked queues atm in the current matchmaking scenario.

@Syclantus.4621 said:

@Crypto.7609 said:

@Syclantus.4621 said:Li> @praqtos.9035 said:

@Syclantus.4621 said:

@praqtos.9035 said:

@Syclantus.4621 said:

@praqtos.9035 said:

@Syclantus.4621 said:If you don't mind me asking, what is your elo? While rev does have a bit of excess damage atm, your issue does not seem to be related to game balance. Clearly you are not utilising terrain at all or watching the minimap. Watch when phase traversal is being used and time/bait your own cc.Class is broken? Its fine, just watch your minimap under microscope and ....terrain? Since when its stopped them?He should see it coming behind walls/los? Is every player is a psychic now?

Even 1 rev with brains to use what i described is op, just go and try that on your own in ranked and u'll see. And i rly dont care about what kind of garbage players this competitive scene has, but i can bet its far less skilled than dota 2 one, so there's no point in me watching them fail with god-mode class on some streams simply cos they cant discover such strategy on their own.

@Crypto.7609 said:

@Syclantus.4621 said:

@Crypto.7609 said:

@Syclantus.4621 said:Li> @praqtos.9035 said:

@Syclantus.4621 said:

@praqtos.9035 said:

@Syclantus.4621 said:

@praqtos.9035 said:

@Syclantus.4621 said:If you don't mind me asking, what is your elo? While rev does have a bit of excess damage atm, your issue does not seem to be related to game balance. Clearly you are not utilising terrain at all or watching the minimap. Watch when phase traversal is being used and time/bait your own cc.Class is broken? Its fine, just watch your minimap under microscope and ....terrain? Since when its stopped them?He should see it coming behind walls/los? Is every player is a psychic now?

I really don't know why 1) you're just spewing out random insults 2) comparing this game with one that has a way, way larger population ( total and actively playing) which is also only PvP. It is possible to have a civil discussion about a game which I'm assuming is to be played for fun ( for most ). Majority of the population will not be good at playing rev because 1) energy management 2) it requires good map knowledge and game sense to use to its fullest extent 3) also requires good ping and low fps. If you believe that any one can just get the build and go straight into ranked, get a ton of kills and a lot of damage, you're very mistaken. There's a reason why rev is so popular in high elo because players know how to play it.

Fighting vs Rev turns me on. Fights vs more than one I just Timmeh. Yum yum, they hurt me tho bad. I like it.

@Syclantus.4621 said:

@praqtos.9035 said:

@Syclantus.4621 said:If you don't mind me asking, what is your elo? While rev does have a bit of excess damage atm, your issue does not seem to be related to game balance. Clearly you are not utilising terrain at all or watching the minimap. Watch when phase traversal is being used and time/bait your own cc.Class is broken? Its fine, just watch your minimap under microscope and ....terrain? Since when its stopped them?He should see it coming behind walls/los? Is every player is a psychic now?

You only see enemy players on the minimap when they're engaged in active combat with your team. And some maps like Skyhammer and Colosseum now the rev can blitz you from right behind line of sight with no or little opportunity to actually spot him.

Really what I want nerfed more than anything is elemental blast. You anticipate the rev coming, you do a jumping puzzle onto a no port. He fails the puzzle. And he can just drop a 10k pulsing AoE and force you off anyway even if he can't perform the JP.

@mortrialus.3062 said:

@Syclantus.4621 said:

@praqtos.9035 said:

@Syclantus.4621 said:If you don't mind me asking, what is your elo? While rev does have a bit of excess damage atm, your issue does not seem to be related to game balance. Clearly you are not utilising terrain at all or watching the minimap. Watch when phase traversal is being used and time/bait your own cc.Class is broken? Its fine, just watch your minimap under microscope and ....terrain? Since when its stopped them?He should see it coming behind walls/los? Is every player is a psychic now?

Yes the blast does ridiculous damage. Idk what multipliers work on it but it does a ton.

I agree on the (slight) excess of dmg output (tho only through just a few bursts, not really sustained unless he's sitting in your face auto-attacking with Sword/Sword) but the survivability isn't that great. Disengage potential is bad, condi cleanse is basically non-existent, heals are only effective when either getting bursted (Infuse Light) or counter pressuring (Enchanted Daggers) both of which can be outplayed with not too much effort, no real blocks unless on staff which leaves you even more vulnerable because you can't even counter-pressure properly.But I think it's not nearly as annoying as condi/perma daze mirage, bunker scrapper, Soulbeast or elixir holo. Firebrand+Scourge combo is also a much bigger issue than rev imo. Not that I don't see the problem with double rev burst but still. (I'd like to see everything tuned down a bit at the same time tbh)

Btw Guardian also has Judge's Intervention which is basically an even stronger version of Phase Traversal tbh. Instant cast (Phase Traversal has an obvious tell and can even be interrupted) while also apply burning and at the same range, so if you are complaining about Phase Traversal hitting you from behind a wall, this has to be nerfed as well. True, JI has a cooldown but it doesn't cripple the offensive capabilities of Guardian upon activation unlike Phase Traversal which costs 30 energy, leaving the Rev at less than half his energy after engage - and since the Rev probably just swapped legend to maintain Glint's boons as long as possible he wouldn't be able to refill by swapping to Glint.

Revs aren't particularly good in dueling/1vX, they are only op when they can freely hunt you down because they have a huge chase potential so don't let them fight you without counter pressure. They also suck hard into condi classes/comps, take that to your advantage. (Like if conditions aren't already broken anyways)Roll to fire weaver, burn guard, condi mirage, condi thief or scourge and you're good lol.

Sword offhand dmg needs a slight nerf. Rev is annoying when he +1 you but Rev is still one of the harder classes to play even when overperforming a little bit in terms of dmg (like everything in this game is overperforming in dmg atm)

I have said it multiple times in other threads already, but here we go again.

The issue with Rev dmg does not stem from any single skill alone."nerf rev offhand" therefor, would be curing a symptom instead of the cause of the issue.With the amounts of "steroids" Revs have, it's really not surprising that everything they do, does insane dmg...and not just some key abilities (=which would be the dream obviously).

As I see it, there are 3 major issues with Revenants:

1. Perma 20+ might (thats even 33% stronger) + perma fury
2. A LOT (!) of dmg multipliers
3. Ridiculously stacked skills (the kind that do ~4 different things on their lonesome).

ad 2.These are all the dmg mods that the current herald/shiro meta spec uses:Forceful Persistence (13%), Reinforced Potency (1% per boon), Vicious Laceration (9%), Targeted Destruction (makes vuln 50% stronger essentially), Ferocious Aggression (7%), Phase Traversal (10%), Burst of Strength (15%).On top of having ~800 extra power (from 20 might thats 33% stronger).Kinda nutty.

ad 3.Lets have a look at some of them:

Deathstrike (Sw #5): Gives Fury, Shadowsteps, Chills, Slows.Facet of Darkness (Glint): Perma Fury uptime (as long as its active), Blinds, 10 Vuln, Reveals, Breaks stun.Riposting Shadwos (Shiro): Evade, Removes movement impairing conditions, Fury, Breaks stuns, Refunds EndurancePhase Traversal (Shiro): Shadowsteps, Dmg modifier, Unblockable, Quickness

@Zenix.6198 said:As I see it, there are 3 major issues with Revenants:

1. Perma 20+ might (thats even 33% stronger) + perma fury
2. A LOT (!) of dmg multipliers
3. Ridiculously stacked skills (the kind that do ~4 different things on their lonesome).

Why is 20+ might uptime a problem on rev but nobody talks about it on spellbreaker? Deadeye can have absurd might uptime as well.Also the stacked skills thing is the same with say mesmer. Just go through their skills, you'll not find more than 1 skill on a weapon set that doesn't apply X amount of several different conditions + this + that. Probably other classes do have this "feature" too idk.

@Zenix.6198 said:ad 2.These are all the dmg mods that the current herald/shiro meta spec uses:Forceful Persistence (13%), Reinforced Potency (1% per boon), Vicious Laceration (9%), Targeted Destruction (makes vuln 50% stronger essentially), Ferocious Aggression (7%), Phase Traversal (10%), Burst of Strength (15%).On top of having ~800 extra power (from 20 might thats 33% stronger).Kinda nutty.

Kinda gives you an idea of how weak rev actually is huh? They have to dedicate their entire kit to damage output in order to burst hard, while specs like chrono/mirage, holo or soulbeast can also afford to invest into survivability and utility and still have a lot of burst.

@DoomNexus.5324 said:

@"Zenix.6198" said:As I see it, there are 3 major issues with Revenants:

1. Perma 20+ might (thats even 33% stronger) + perma fury
2. A LOT (!) of dmg multipliers
3. Ridiculously stacked skills (the kind that do ~4 different things on their lonesome).

@"Zenix.6198" said:ad 2.These are all the dmg mods that the current herald/shiro meta spec uses:Forceful Persistence (13%), Reinforced Potency (1% per boon), Vicious Laceration (9%), Targeted Destruction (makes vuln 50% stronger essentially), Ferocious Aggression (7%), Phase Traversal (10%), Burst of Strength (15%).On top of having ~800 extra power (from 20 might thats 33% stronger).Kinda nutty.

Not sure why you would assume, that I don't think this is an issue on other classes as well.I have already been very vocal on this in the past, so If you want to I can post some links where I express similar feelings towards specs like Spellbreaker and Holo as well.

But since this a rev-specific topic, I thought I'd keep it to rev only. So please spare me your "whatabout-ism".

Also, about the whole "rev has no defenses / is weak to condies"-meme.It's not like it doesnt have those. People just actively ignore them for the whole oneshot meme.Retribution and Malyx are pretty good when it comes to power and condi defenses respectively.But who needs defensive investment anyway, when Shiro (namely Reposting Shadows) is "good enough" for survivability already a d has been borderline broken since its release.

@Zenix.6198 said:

@DoomNexus.5324 said:

@Zenix.6198 said:As I see it, there are 3 major issues with Revenants:

1. Perma 20+ might (thats even 33% stronger) + perma fury
2. A LOT (!) of dmg multipliers
3. Ridiculously stacked skills (the kind that do ~4 different things on their lonesome).

@Zenix.6198 said:ad 2.These are all the dmg mods that the current herald/shiro meta spec uses:Forceful Persistence (13%), Reinforced Potency (1% per boon), Vicious Laceration (9%), Targeted Destruction (makes vuln 50% stronger essentially), Ferocious Aggression (7%), Phase Traversal (10%), Burst of Strength (15%).On top of having ~800 extra power (from 20 might thats 33% stronger).Kinda nutty.

@"DoomNexus.5324" said:Why is 20+ might uptime a problem on rev but nobody talks about it on spellbreaker? Deadeye can have absurd might uptime as well.

In fact it's a major issue for all professions. Most dps/defense issues in this game come from how easy it has become to self buff and the comic point is that ANet overload the necromancer with boon corruption in an attempt to "fix" these issues.

Anet treat the consequences not the root of the problem and players as well suggests mostly to "fix" the consequences, they seldom suggest to "fix" the root of the problem. Here it's the same, players identify rev burst as an issue and thus ask for it to do less damage without asking themself why it does to much damage or even trying to look at the roots of the issue.

Got to love how people ignore the main subject of the topic which is line of sight abusing combo of revs.

@Crypto.7609 said:Got to love how people ignore the main subject of the topic which is line of sight abusing combo of revs.

As someone else pointed out earlier, guardians have access to the exact same thing, so that's not your only issue with Revs, is it?

@Vithzerai.3291 said:

@Crypto.7609 said:Got to love how people ignore the main subject of the topic which is line of sight abusing combo of revs.

And thieves, and weavers, and mesmers.